# 2015 Binding Discussion



## deadheadskier (Jul 11, 2015)

Anyone have experience with these?  I'm looking for new bindings for my Nordica Steadfast.  Something that keeps my boot close to the ski and has minimal impact on the skis flex.


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## mishka (Jul 11, 2015)

I have several older pivots.... Have no problem,  pivot/axial  relatively heavy binding iirc 1--2lb over marker grifons


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## deadheadskier (Jul 11, 2015)

Not too concerned about the weight.  The Steadfast is a really light ski.  

I'm mostly interested in snow feel / terrain feedback.  The Dukes leave something to be desired in that regard.


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## mishka (Jul 12, 2015)

On my skis I'm using pivot/axial and marker griffons. Can't say binding make any difference. imo you can't go wrong with either one
 I suggest demo version.  you thx  me later


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## deadheadskier (Jul 12, 2015)

We've been through this on the hill.  Not getting demo bindings.  :lol:


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## mishka (Jul 12, 2015)

I don't care lol  
maybe you don't know what you're missing:roll:

I simply trying to help you to get most performance out of your new skis


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## deadheadskier (Jul 12, 2015)

I'm not interested in position adjustment on the hill.  I prefer a neutral mount point position.

I am interested in high elasticit/retention and low stand height for maximum terrain feedback.

The Look Pivot / Rossi FKS is supposed to excel at both these characteristics.

That is why I am asking for feedback on them.


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## steamboat1 (Jul 12, 2015)

My Dynastar skis came with Look NX 12 bindings. I've been pretty happy with them. They're mounted on a one piece rack system, not sure if they all come this way. I don't know how much that affects the natural flex of my skis. I've got 2 1/2 seasons on them so far & haven't had any problems with them. Never had premature release with them but they did release when they were supposed to. I'm not a gear junkie or expert on the subject but like I said I've been happy with them


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## deadheadskier (Jul 12, 2015)

Thanks, but the Pivot is completely different technology from your bindings.  I'm looking for feedback specific to the Pivot or Rossi FKS.

Issues with prereleases, but still working well in twisting falls as the back turntable design is engineered to do.

Reviews around the internet suggest they are some of the best bindings on the market for off piste / tree skiing etc.  

I'd just like to hear feedback from anyone I might "know" (forum members) on this exact binding design.


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## dlague (Jul 13, 2015)

Never skied them - typically out of my price range so I generally ski the Look PX 12  however I do keep checking them out.

this vid does a decent job presenting them


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## deadheadskier (Jul 13, 2015)

Thanks for the video.  And yes, tough to get a good discount on the Pivots.


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## skiNEwhere (Jul 14, 2015)

Funny you mentioned pivots seeing as I just made a post on ES about this.... I was looking for a setup as well, and they practically cost more than the skis I'm mounting them on. Any idea what kind (12, 14, 16, etc...) you're leaning towards? I have dukes as well and agree the feedback is lacking. Don't think any AT setup can give you that.

I found an alright deal on pivots, this is with a 75mm brake though which is what I was specifically looking for. You can find some deals on backcounty.com as well, keep in mind though that if you find a deal, it's probably with an undesirable brake width like a 130. I looked into getting a different brake and they seem to be prohibitively expensive.


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## prsboogie (Jul 14, 2015)

https://www.google.com/shopping/pro...HVgAodLGwGTA&ei=1eOkVaScC4GrgwSs2JngBA#online


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## deadheadskier (Jul 14, 2015)

skiNEwhere said:


> Funny you mentioned pivots seeing as I just made a post on ES about this.... I was looking for a setup as well, and they practically cost more than the skis I'm mounting them on. Any idea what kind (12, 14, 16, etc...) you're leaning towards? I have dukes as well and agree the feedback is lacking. Don't think any AT setup can give you that.
> 
> I found an alright deal on pivots, this is with a 75mm brake though which is what I was specifically looking for. You can find some deals on backcounty.com as well, keep in mind though that if you find a deal, it's probably with an undesirable brake width like a 130. I looked into getting a different brake and they seem to be prohibitively expensive.



Same boat.  All the prices I'm seeing are more than what I paid for the Nordica Steadfast I'd be mounting them on.  I'm looking for the 95 break width as the Steadfast is 90mm underfoot.  I typically ski a 9.5-10 DIN, so I think I'd be fine with the 120.

The Rossi FKS are even more expensive despite being the exact same binding, but I like the color better.  :lol:

In the past, I have had good solid bindings last me longer than skis, but I'm not sure I want to spend $200+ on bindings.  I could go with a lesser priced binding like an Axial120, but I've owned them in the past, had release issues and broke them.  Doesn't seem worth it to save $100.


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## xwhaler (Jul 14, 2015)

Does having a wider toe piece hold any appeal for a wider waisted ski? I've been using the Rossi Axial ti 14 with great success over the last 8 yrs...they are all metal and have held up very well.

I'm thinking of the Axial for the Blizzards and maybe the Marker Griffons for the Steadfasts. It's difficult to tell how much of the binding is metal vs plastic though.

These below are the direct replacements for the bindings I have now..with an 80 mm brake and matching colors would be perfect for the Blizzards.
Like that they seem mostly all metal.

http://www.evo.com/outlet/alpine-sk...-120-mfx-ski-bindings-2014-solar-detail-1.jpg


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## deadheadskier (Jul 14, 2015)

Not sure.  I read the thread skiNEwhere posted on epicski and someone gave a good endorsement for the Salomon STH.  It appears that toe is a wide design as you describe..  I like the Salomon toe piece design better than Marker.  

The STH can be had for about $160.


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## wa-loaf (Jul 14, 2015)

deadheadskier said:


> Same boat.  All the prices I'm seeing are more than what I paid for the Nordica Steadfast I'd be mounting them on.  I'm looking for the 95 break width as the Steadfast is 90mm underfoot.  I typically ski a 9.5-10 DIN, so I think I'd be fine with the 120.
> 
> The Rossi FKS are even more expensive despite being the exact same binding, but I like the color better.  :lol:
> 
> In the past, I have had good solid bindings last me longer than skis, but I'm not sure I want to spend $200+ on bindings.  I could go with a lesser priced binding like an Axial120, but I've owned them in the past, had release issues and broke them.  Doesn't seem worth it to save $100.




These come in just under $200, brake might be too wide: http://www.levelninesports.com/Look-2015-Pivot-12-Ski-Bindings


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## deadheadskier (Jul 14, 2015)

Thanks. Tempting, but I wonder if I'll have issues with brake hang up when arcing over the 90mm Steadfast.   

Have you skied the Pivot Waloaf?  If so, thoughts?


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## xwhaler (Jul 14, 2015)

These also seem like a good setup for the Blizzards....$99 for the 78 which is probably not going to work and never sure about bending the brake.
So $144 which seems like a nice buy for what looks like a well made binding
http://www.levelninesports.com/Head-Gto-15-Ski-Bindings


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## wa-loaf (Jul 14, 2015)

deadheadskier said:


> Thanks. Tempting, but I wonder if I'll have issues with brake hang up when arcing over the 90mm Steadfast.
> 
> Have you skied the Pivot Waloaf?  If so, thoughts?



No, my most recent binding purchase was some Tyrolia attack 13s. They have a 95/97ish brake and I'm using them on Watea 84s and haven't had any hang-ups with the brakes.


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## Puck it (Jul 14, 2015)

deadheadskier said:


> Thanks. Tempting, but I wonder if I'll have issues with brake hang up when arcing over the 90mm Steadfast.
> 
> Have you skied the Pivot Waloaf?  If so, thoughts?



Call them and ask.  They are really helpful.


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## Puck it (Jul 14, 2015)

xwhaler said:


> These also seem like a good setup for the Blizzards....$99 for the 78 which is probably not going to work and never sure about bending the brake.
> So $144 which seems like a nice buy for what looks like a well made binding
> http://www.levelninesports.com/Head-Gto-15-Ski-Bindings




Go for the Free Flex for the carvers. Great binding.  For the Steadfast go for the MOJO


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## skiNEwhere (Jul 14, 2015)

*Look Pivot bindings*



prsboogie said:


> https://www.google.com/shopping/pro...HVgAodLGwGTA&ei=1eOkVaScC4GrgwSs2JngBA#online



Best. Review. Ever :lol:


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## xwhaler (Jul 14, 2015)

Puck it said:


> Go for the Free Flex for the carvers. Great binding.  For the Steadfast go for the MOJO



Those both look like very solid choices---all else being equal I'm probably choosing something where the color scheme matches the skis well haha...so looking for some orange for both skis


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## wa-loaf (Jul 14, 2015)

What's the difference between the Head GTO and Mojo? A 15 din binding for $99 (GTO) seems like a steal.


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## wa-loaf (Jul 14, 2015)

wa-loaf said:


> What's the difference between the Head GTO and Mojo? A 15 din binding for $99 (GTO) seems like a steal.



Nevermind, GTO has a carve plate.


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## deadheadskier (Jul 14, 2015)

http://www.sunandski.com/Salomon_ST...63842100.htm?gclid=CJiI45HE2sYCFUeRHwodvD0AiA


Pretty decent deal on the Salomon.


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## xwhaler (Jul 14, 2015)

How much is reasonable to expect brakes to bend? Would the 78 mm possibly work without much effort on an 80 waisted ski?
Ive read some manufacturers are looser with their width tolerance


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## Puck it (Jul 14, 2015)

xwhaler said:


> How much is reasonable to expect brakes to bend? Would the 78 mm possibly work without much effort on an 80 waisted ski?
> Ive read some manufacturers are looser with their width tolerance


You can bend that brake 2mm without a problem.  I have bent brakes 10mm to fit.


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## xwhaler (Jul 14, 2015)

Would I just be better getting the 88 and spending the extra $45 and not worrying about it? 
I'm not mounting these myself so need to make sure a local shop (likely Putnams in Portsmouth) will do this for me


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## Puck it (Jul 14, 2015)

xwhaler said:


> Would I just be better getting the 88 and spending the extra $45 and not worrying about it?
> I'm not mounting these myself so need to make sure a local shop (likely Putnams in Portsmouth) will do this for me


  They can bend them for you when they mount them. Stop by and ask them first though.  I would not waist the extra money.

And you are such a fashion whore for wanting the colors t match!!!!!


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## xwhaler (Jul 14, 2015)

Puck it said:


> And you are such a fashion whore for wanting the colors t match!!!!!


Look good, ski good (Dress for success!)


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## deadheadskier (Jul 14, 2015)

xwhaler said:


> Look good, ski good (Dress for success!)



+1 haha

I like the Rossi FKS black and white colors better than the Look blue and lime green.


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## skiNEwhere (Jul 14, 2015)

wa-loaf said:


> No, my most recent binding purchase was some Tyrolia attack 13s. They have a 95/97ish brake and I'm using them on Watea 84s and haven't had any hang-ups with the brakes.



I have a friend who bought some tyrolia's (forget what type) and he stated that they were the worst bindings he ever had. Just terrible durability. 

Here's another pic that a different friend took of one of the jackson hole instructors goofing around in tyrolia's. Notice anything wrong? You shouldn't be able to do this.....



So DHS if you were considering the tyrolia's as a backup, I'd do your homework on them.


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## deadheadskier (Jul 14, 2015)

Hadn't really considered them as my dad broke a couple pairs back in the day.  I suppose a poor design in the 90s shouldn't sway my opinion today, but that's always stuck with me.


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## skiNEwhere (Jul 14, 2015)

deadheadskier said:


> Hadn't really considered them as my dad broke a couple pairs back in the day.  I suppose a poor design in the 90s shouldn't sway my opinion today, but that's always stuck with me.



Threw ya a bone in ES. Might have some good suggestions pop up, some of those guys on there are total gear junkies.


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## Puck it (Jul 14, 2015)

I have broken Tryolia's and so has my son (Heads and Markers) but those were the binding that contained a lot of plastic.  I have never had any issues with their top of the line binders.  I would stay away from any manufacturer's binding with all plastic casing.  


BTW, you can step into any binding backwards.


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## wa-loaf (Jul 14, 2015)

skiNEwhere said:


> I have a friend who bought some tyrolia's (forget what type) and he stated that they were the worst bindings he ever had. Just terrible durability.



If you are buying at the higher end there may be some quirks that you like about certain bindings and hate about others, but in general they all work great these days. Never had a problem with any bindings including the 80's Tyrolia's (all metal versions!) I had.


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## marcski (Jul 14, 2015)

wa-loaf said:


> If you are buying at the higher end there may be some quirks that you like about certain bindings and hate about others, but in general they all work great these days. Never had a problem with any bindings including the 80's Tyrolia's (all metal versions!) I had.



+1.  After 40 plus years of skiing, I have never noticed any difference in feel between bindings (that were in working order) until I started to tele ski!


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## deadheadskier (Jul 14, 2015)

TBH honest, I haven't noticed much difference in performance (other than durability) either until the system bindings on My Fischer Motives and on my Marker Dukes.  Both really don't offer the same foot feel / terrain feedback as some of the old Salomons I skied or even the Rossi Axial series.   That's why I started looking at the Pivot design.


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## Puck it (Jul 14, 2015)

deadheadskier said:


> TBH honest, I haven't noticed much difference in performance (other than durability) either until the system bindings on My Fischer Motives and on my Marker Dukes.  Both really don't offer the same foot feel / terrain feedback as some of the old Salomons I skied or even the Rossi Axial series.   That's why I started looking at the Pivot design.


  You just want a flat binding with riser.  The Dukes and Barons have a different feel over flat bindings.  I noticed it when I switched from the Mojo's.  I feel the difference on the Ski Logiks with the Jesters


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## deadheadskier (Jul 14, 2015)

Don't want a riser.  Lower the stand height, the better for bumps.  If I was looking to maximize carving performance, I'd go for a riser.


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## wa-loaf (Jul 14, 2015)

Puck it said:


> You just want a flat binding with riser.  The Dukes and Barons have a different feel over flat bindings.  I noticed it when I switched from the Mojo's.  I feel the difference on the Ski Logiks with the Jesters



What he said, the Dukes have a lot going on between your boot and the skis. Just pick something up that gets you closer to the ski.


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## prsboogie (Jul 14, 2015)

skiNEwhere said:


> Best. Review. Ever :lol:
> 
> View attachment 17178



Ya I LOL, even had a tear!


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## prsboogie (Jul 14, 2015)

https://www.google.com/shopping/pro...HVgAodLGwGTA&ei=1eOkVaScC4GrgwSs2JngBA#online


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## Puck it (Jul 14, 2015)

deadheadskier said:


> Don't want a riser.  Lower the stand height, the better for bumps.  If I was looking to maximize carving performance, I'd go for a riser.


Sorry I meant no riser.


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## deadheadskier (Jul 14, 2015)

Pulled the trigger on the Salomon STH2 WTR13 w/ 100mm brake.  Not too wide for the Steadfast at 90mm, but a little wider should I need the room in a higher 90s ski someday.

$150 with free shipping

Good enough deal for me.


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## Not Sure (Jul 14, 2015)

Since your off subject of Look's , I've been thinking about going with some Dynafit or other Tech binding for AT , My biggest concern is pre release in no fall zone , I have dukes but the weight is a major drawback. 
Any of you guys gone from or to Tech's and if so , is my concern overrated?


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## deadheadskier (Jul 14, 2015)

I think I'll just change the title of the thread to 2015 binding discussion.   Maybe that will draw more folks in as opposed to a specific model like I had was asking about with the Look.  I liked the idea of the Pivot, but in the end I couldn't get behind the value proposition.

Good luck with getting good advice and some new AT bindings Bob!


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## Not Sure (Jul 14, 2015)

deadheadskier said:


> I think I'll just change the title of the thread to 2015 binding discussion.   Maybe that will draw more folks in as opposed to a specific model like I had was asking about with the Look.  I liked the idea of the Pivot, but in the end I couldn't get behind the value proposition.
> 
> Good luck with getting good advice and some new AT bindings Bob!



Yes Thanks  , I posted a question on T4T , It's been slow over there . My touring partner was new to Dynafits and apparently she did'nt lock down the toe for climbing and had a bunch of releases . So I guess my first impression of them was based on opperator error. 
I think I'll be moving the Dukes to the Steadfasts and maybe dynafits on my old ski's . AT stuff seams way over priced for what it is. A good deal on skis may turn out to be a unintended chain reaction.


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## skiNEwhere (Jul 15, 2015)

Puck it said:


> BTW, you can step into any binding backwards.



Not true.


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## bigbog (Jul 15, 2015)

Siliconebobsquarepants said:


> ............I think I'll be moving the Dukes to the Steadfasts and maybe dynafits on my old ski's . AT stuff seams way over priced for what it is. A good deal on skis may turn out to be a unintended chain reaction.



Haven't purchase but have tried stepping into both Dynafits and Marker F12s in a shop = really solid despite what Dynafits look like in a few pics.   The ultra-lightweight of the Dynafits were nice..but there are some other ATs, DIN 16 Beast..to choose from...etc.   The Markers were slightly higher than Solly's Guardian but were 0deg ramp which I really liked.....fwiw.


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## xwhaler (Jul 16, 2015)

xwhaler said:


> These also seem like a good setup for the Blizzards....$99 for the 78 which is probably not going to work and never sure about bending the brake.
> So $144 which seems like a nice buy for what looks like a well made binding
> http://www.levelninesports.com/Head-Gto-15-Ski-Bindings



Update: Bought these for the Blizzard Magnum Ti's---$107 shipped. Got a new hardpack setup on top notch gear (albeit a couple yrs older model, just change graphics) for $280. Hard to beat
Will now continue to look for bindings for the Steadfasts


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## deadheadskier (Jul 16, 2015)

Well done.


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## xwhaler (Jul 17, 2015)

wa-loaf said:


> No, my most recent binding purchase was some Tyrolia attack 13s. They have a 95/97ish brake and I'm using them on Watea 84s and haven't had any hang-ups with the brakes.



Wa-Loaf, can you share how much of the binding is metal/how durable they feel or have been in real life for you? This is likely the binding I end up with for the Steadfasts but just looking for a real-world review.

Most concerned about quality---I tend to not notice the subtle differences in bindings as much as maybe others do but want to pay for quality---I look for as much metal as I can at a reasonable cost knowing they will last longer than crap made with all plastic.


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## Puck it (Jul 17, 2015)

xwhaler said:


> Wa-Loaf, can you share how much of the binding is metal/how durable they feel or have been in real life for you? This is likely the binding I end up with for the Steadfasts but just looking for a real-world review.
> 
> Most concerned about quality---I tend to not notice the subtle differences in bindings as much as maybe others do but want to pay for quality---I look for as much metal as I can at a reasonable cost knowing they will last longer than crap made with all plastic.




This is is a good price. Look similar to the Mojo's 12 that my son broke though. 

http://www.snowinn.com/ski-store/he...Jtb0ZTc9gN2l2vyrK1XbvaQSRpVrB9BF0kaAukP8P8HAQ


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## dlague (Jul 17, 2015)

I find the discussion here interesting.  I am a Look PX/ Rossignol Axial fan and never had a problem with them.  I have never really looked at bindings in a long term sort of way.  I replace skis about every four years of so and the bindings goo too.  I buy new bindings at the same time.  I have never really thought about them too much either outside of DIN settings, brake size and good reviews.  

Then again, I do not huck cliffs or go for huge air.


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## deadheadskier (Jul 17, 2015)

Elasticity should be a concern for you.  It's not just the DIN setting that keeps you from prereleasing or not releasing when you should.

I'll get ten years out of a decent binding.  So, I'd rather pay a bit more upfront and save on the lifetime cost of ownership.  

Maybe I was unlucky, but I've broken the Axial twice in the past. Once was the toe, once was the heel.  This was skiing in bumps, not groomers.  They were the 120 version, which is mostly plastic.  That's probably why


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## xwhaler (Jul 17, 2015)

It seems difficult to really get a sense from online how much metal vs plastic is in each binding.  Seems it would be an obvious selling point but one that is rarely highlighted.


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## deadheadskier (Jul 17, 2015)

I agree

I actually called Salomon about the bindings I bought.  The rep said a mix of metal and plastic.  Essentially provided zero insight to the construction.

Guess that's where it helps to buy from brick and mortar stores.


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## thetrailboss (Jul 18, 2015)

I have the higher end Tyrolia/Head bindings and love them.  They are mostly steel so I have not had any issues.  Pretty easy for me to get the heavier MoJo models at LevelNine at a low price.  Not sure how their new AT models are though.  I, too, was spooked initially by the problems that they had back in the day, but several retailers assured me back in 2002 and 2003 that those issues were long gone.  Since then I have had at least five pair with no problem at all.  I have some of their cheaper models too and I don't like too much plastic.  My recent ones have all been DIN 14, 15, or 16 and they are durable bindings.  

I've also had several different Marker models in the past and have liked them.  In my experience Marker is just really expensive.  

I also had, back in the day, an old Look Pivot binding and they looked and felt odd.  But they worked.


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## bigbog (Jul 19, 2015)

Owned a pair of FreeFlex(HEAD) ~4-5winters ago = the performance still has me thinking my ascents...  Wish they were made as a non-system...maybe wrapped in different name.


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## wa-loaf (Jul 20, 2015)

xwhaler said:


> Wa-Loaf, can you share how much of the binding is metal/how durable they feel or have been in real life for you? This is likely the binding I end up with for the Steadfasts but just looking for a real-world review.
> 
> Most concerned about quality---I tend to not notice the subtle differences in bindings as much as maybe others do but want to pay for quality---I look for as much metal as I can at a reasonable cost knowing they will last longer than crap made with all plastic.



They seem to be mostly plastic, but it feels like a denser version than in other bindings. I got a good deal on them, I think I paid $129. My Marker Griffons are also mostly plastic. I do look for metal in most cases, but not tied to it.


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## xwhaler (Jul 22, 2015)

Just pulled the trigger on these for the Steadfasts. PuckIt tells me they are mostly all metal and he hasn't broken any yet...knowing how he skis I trust that I won't break them either 

I don't need a 15 din binding but higher din bindings usually are more metal so the perceived quality is higher. At $99 shipped it was hard to say no.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/311373746758


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## dlague (Jul 22, 2015)

xwhaler said:


> Just pulled the trigger on these for the Steadfasts. PuckIt tells me they are mostly all metal and he hasn't broken any yet...knowing how he skis I trust that I won't break them either
> 
> I don't need a 15 din binding but higher din bindings usually are more metal so the perceived quality is higher. At $99 shipped it was hard to say no.
> 
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/311373746758



asogear often has good deals.  Bought a few things from them last year.  Should post that in the Summer Deals Thread.


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## ScottySkis (Jul 22, 2015)

Get a pair that work correctly.


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