# Burke Announces HSQ and Other Improvements



## Masskier (Sep 7, 2011)

BURKE MOUNTAIN INVESTS IN ON- AND OFF- MOUNTAIN EXPERIENCE FOR 2011-12 WINTER SEASON AS FIRST PHASE OF MULTI- YEAR IMPROVEMENT PLAN

New High-Speed Quad, 10 Acres of Expanded Terrain and Wind Turbine Sustain Genuine, Authentic Vermont Mountain Experience

            EAST BURKE, VERMONT (Sept. 7, 2011) – Reinforcing its commitment to provide skiers and riders with an authentic Vermont experience, Burke Mountain today announced a number of enhancements for the upcoming season as part of a multi- year improvement plan that will eventually include several low-density residential communities. Scheduled to open in mid December, Burke is adding a high- speed detachable quad and five new trails and glades for intermediates and experts, including a terrain park trail.  In addition, a wind tower, which started producing power at the end of August, will help offset approximately 15%-20% of the resort’s power needs with renewable energy.
The new “Mid Burke Express” lift, from Leitner-Poma North America, reaches the summit seven minutes faster than the existing Willoughby Quad. It gives skiers and riders faster access to the upper mountain’s terrain, making the entire mountain’s 2,011 feet of vertical accessible by high-speed quads. 
”Collectively, these on-mountain additions enrich the truly unique experience not found at any other Vermont resort,” said Tim McGuire, general manager and vice president of development.
“This is the first part of our plan to re-energize Burke. Over the next few months, we look forward to sharing our thoughts and additional plans with our friends in the greater Burke community. The new lift and additional terrain only add to the appeal of this very special place.” 
The wind tower, designed by Vermont based Northern Power Systems, is anticipated to produce about 300,000 kW hours per year (approximately the same amount consumed by the new lift annually). “This exemplifies our strong commitment to sensible operations while reducing Burke’s impacts on the environment.  In addition to the wind turbine, Burke has committed to a number of programs over the past several years including: resort wide recycling, composting of food waste, a green product purchase program, use of locally- grown foods, waste oil reuse, and ongoing internal energy audits and retrofits,” McGuire continued.
            The new trails and glades include:  Upper Lift Line (intermediate), Rerun (expert), Upper Power Line (expert), Lower Power Line (expert) and Jester (a terrain park trail).

About Burke Mountain: Located in the heart of Vermont’s Northeast Kingdom, Burke, with over 260 acres of skiing and riding, has an elevation of 3267 ft., over 2011 ft. of vertical, and 50 natural trails including over 110 acres of glades. As the primary training and race facility to over 50 ski Olympians, Burke is home to Burke Mountain Academy, an internationally acclaimed ski- focused boarding school offering a college preparatory curriculum, sending many students to compete in the Olympics and other national and international competitions.


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## from_the_NEK (Sep 7, 2011)

Finally!


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## billski (Sep 7, 2011)

:beer:


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## from_the_NEK (Sep 7, 2011)

Kinda lame with the trail naming (exceptions to Rerun and Jester).
And I guess that answers the question about the powerline being officially on the map. I wonder if that will include the "lowest" section that drops out onto the east bowl runout.


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## from_the_NEK (Sep 7, 2011)

Where was this press released?


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## thetrailboss (Sep 7, 2011)

Good news, but the worst-kept secret except for the new trails.  Nice.


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## thetrailboss (Sep 7, 2011)

Some more thoughts here.  We're pretty harsh critics, me included, but I think this was a missed opportunity.  Granted that there were problems and the timing was uncertain, but for the last six weeks or so it has been *pretty* clear to all locals and anyone who drove up there what was going on.  Sugarloaf and Mount Snow have been pushing their PR all summer for their new lifts and creating a buzz.  Now a lot of folks aren't paying attention to skiing, but Burke is an emerging four-season resort that all of the sudden has something going in the summer thanks to the wildly successful Kingdom Trails. They have had lift served skiing all summer.  Why not crossmarket to those folks and say, "hey, come up, go biking, visit us, and watch us grow?  Why not stop by and purchase some pre-season ski tickets?"  I bet it would have worked because a lot of serious bikers are skiers.  It would have been better than nothing.   

We've all watched many regimes come and go and they were all underfunded but equally as ambitious.  This is a serious move for Burke and shows that the ownership is very serious about this mountain.  Everyone, both inside and just outside the mountain, has confirmed that this ownership has some deep pockets and are in it for the long haul.  So I don't think that by putting out an earlier PR Campaign would have hurt them at all.


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## Nick (Sep 7, 2011)

Missed this earlier. I should get Burke to send me their press releases....


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## riverc0il (Sep 7, 2011)

thetrailboss said:


> Good news, but the worst-kept secret except for the new trails.  Nice.


Not really much for new trails, though, right? Liftline is a duh. Powerline was already there if not on the map. Not sure what Rerun is but I am sure I skied it, lol. Is Jester really a new trail or is that just a rename?


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## thetrailboss (Sep 7, 2011)

riverc0il said:


> Not really much for new trails, though, right? Liftline is a duh. Powerline was already there if not on the map. Not sure what Rerun is but I am sure I skied it, lol. Is Jester really a new trail or is that just a rename?


 
Good point.  They should have had Powerline named a long time ago....


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## Cannonball (Sep 7, 2011)

thetrailboss said:


> Good point.  They should have had Powerline named a long time ago....



But they must have done something with Powerline right?  I can't see an official open trail with a neck height cable running the length of it.


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## riverc0il (Sep 7, 2011)

Cannonball said:


> But they must have done something with Powerline right?  I can't see an official open trail with a neck height cable running the length of it.


Word on AZ was that the line got raised, as I recall?


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## thetrailboss (Sep 7, 2011)

riverc0il said:


> Word on AZ was that the line got raised, as I recall?


 
In line with the wind turbine work the power company replaced the power line.


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## Cannonball (Sep 7, 2011)

thetrailboss said:


> In line with the wind turbine work the power company replaced the power line.



Makes sense.  I'll miss it is a closed trail. But the fall line there is so sweet it'll still be a blast.


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## from_the_NEK (Sep 8, 2011)

riverc0il said:


> Not really much for new trails, though, right? Liftline is a duh. Powerline was already there if not on the map. Not sure what Rerun is but I am sure I skied it, lol. Is Jester really a new trail or is that just a rename?



Here's my take on the location of the new trails:

Upper Lift Line = The new lift line from the Summit terminal down to the last Toll Road (Deer Run) crossing above the top Poma station.

Rerun = the section of the new lift line from the top of the Poma down to the bottom (or what you can see from the mid-lodge). This was one of the names for the glade that was between Warren's Way and Doug's Drop.






Upper Power Line = East Bowl Traverse to Wilderness.

Lower Power Line = Powderhorm to the Pavilion (complete with two sketchy Deer Run crossings)

Jester = the newest lower mountain MTB trail turned mini terrain park for the winter? I'm not sure they can follow the MTB trail exactly since it weaves across several of the lower mountain ski trails. Woodcore's been on it with a bike  

http://forums.alpinezone.com/showthread.php?t=99514


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## frapcap (Sep 8, 2011)

LOVE this mountain. I usually go with some long-time locals who "skied it long before the trails were cut wide." As a result, they know a ton of the in, outs, nooks, and crannies. There are a ton of unnamed glades there (at least I didn't see a name. Also agree with everyone here- powerline should have been a run a while ago.


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## SIKSKIER (Sep 8, 2011)

Love that video.Looks like a fun no work ride except for braking.


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## from_the_NEK (Sep 8, 2011)

frapcap said:


> LOVE this mountain. I usually go with some long-time locals who "skied it long before the trails were cut wide." As a result, they know a ton of the in, outs, nooks, and crannies. There are a ton of unnamed glades there (at least I didn't see a name. Also agree with everyone here- powerline should have been a run a while ago.



The powerline was so low that I don't think they could make it an official run. I had to duck under the line in many places and it only got worse as the snow got deeper.
This summer the line was completely brushed out and the old poles (some of which were just untreated old delimbed logs) were removed and replaced with new taller real utility poles. Some of the old poles were apparently completely rotted off and were being held up by the tension of the power line :-D. As pointed out by Trailboss, the new poles were done to suppport the new power line that is connected to the wind tower. Last time I went to the summit of the Mtn in August the new poles were not set. Hopefully I will get up there this weekend and I will check it out (and take some pics).


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## thetrailboss (Sep 8, 2011)

from_the_NEK said:


> The powerline was so low that I don't think they could make it an official run. I had to duck under the line in many places and it only got worse as the snow got deeper.
> This summer the line was completely brushed out and the old poles (some of which were just untreated old delimbed logs) were removed and replaced with new taller real utility poles. Some of the old poles were apparently completely rotted off and were being held up by the tension of the power line :-D. As pointed out by Trailboss, the new poles were done to suppport the new power line that is connected to the wind tower. Last time I went to the summit of the Mtn in August the new poles were not set. Hopefully I will get up there this weekend and I will check it out (and take some pics).


 
And IIRC the line ROW was owned/leased by Lyndonville Electric, who might not have liked folks skiing underneath it for liability reasons.


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## Zand (Sep 8, 2011)

I actually kinda liked Powerline being off the map... always a better option for hitting the glades in the bowl than Sasquatch. The new liftline will be fun though... should be a longer steep pitch than Fox's and easier to open with less rocks.


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## Hado226 (Sep 8, 2011)

Hiked up Burke Saturday.  New poles are mostly set  (there is still one cache of poles side of the road), new conductors strung about half-way down from the top.

Lots of work to do before snow flies,


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## Telemechanic (Sep 8, 2011)

Burke is posting construction pictures on its facebook page, nothing exciting yet but hopefully more will come later.  The album seems to be public, non-fb memebers should be able to see.

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10150365374458023.411211.303348433022&type=1


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## from_the_NEK (Sep 8, 2011)

Telemechanic said:


> Burke is posting construction pictures on its facebook page, nothing exciting yet but hopefully more will come later.  The album seems to be public, non-fb memebers should be able to see.
> 
> https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10150365374458023.411211.303348433022&type=1



I just saw those. They are all older than the ones I took almost a month ago. But it is promising that they are getting the word out.


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## riverc0il (Sep 8, 2011)

I think the Power Line is one of the few lines at Burke I haven't skied yet. Unless local wood chucks have been busy these past two seasons creating even more woodsy goodness.


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## thetrailboss (Sep 9, 2011)

Just got this Email.  Confirms Jester is the same as the Kingdom Trails trail:



> Summer's winding down, and we're getting excited thinking about how soon winter will be here. Which leads to us getting nervous thinking about how soon winter will be here and how much work needs to be done. This seems truer this season than any in the recent past as we've been hard at work since the end of last season with some major mountain improvements.
> 
> Probably the most anticipated of our improvements is a brand-new, high-speed quad to the summit. Our newest lift, the Mid Burke Express is under construction and is targeted for a mid-December opening. So instead of 14 minutes on the Willoughby, you'll go from just below the Mid Burke Lodge to the summit in half the time, giving you more time on the snow instead of over it. Follow us on Facebook for updates, pictures and more about the new lift as construction continues.
> 
> ...


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## from_the_NEK (Sep 12, 2011)

Zand said:


> The new liftline will be fun though... should be a longer steep pitch than Fox's and easier to open with less rocks.



I went up this weekend to check out the progress (unfortunately, I haven't update the blog yet :roll. I hiked up the new line from the bottom of Doug's Drop to the top of the Poma. Unless they do something creative with the rock they blasted out for the lift tower bases, there are going to be quite a few rocks (some are rather large and pointy) in the lift line. It does have a better falline than Fox's Folly with only big headwall/roll partway down (also the location of a lift tower).
What this section of Rerun used to look like:


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## Zand (Sep 12, 2011)

Forgot that the blasting would turn up rocks in the trail. I always skied that glade earlier than any other glade on the mountain because there weren't many big rocks to hit but it makes sense that that won't really be the case now.


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## thetrailboss (Sep 12, 2011)

I think it is fair to say that those rocks will probably be removed at some point.


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## from_the_NEK (Sep 12, 2011)

thetrailboss said:


> I think it is fair to say that those rocks will probably be removed at some point.



I wouldn't count on it as it is very hard to get in there with equipment.


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## from_the_NEK (Sep 12, 2011)

Looking up the new Rerun trail from between two future lift towers:








Saturday was also a beautiful day for this:





There was a swarm of Hang-gliders and Parasailers over the mountain. One parasail had to easily have been up over 4000'.


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## jimmywilson69 (Sep 13, 2011)

from_the_NEK said:


> Looking up the new Rerun trail from between two future lift towers:



Those are not friends of my ski bases:-x:-x:-x:-x


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## from_the_NEK (Sep 13, 2011)

jimmywilson69 said:


> Those are not friends of my ski bases:-x:-x:-x:-x



Keep in mind this is immediately after blasting and the lift line is in a very raw state. I am willing to bet a lot of this rock is used to back fill the tower footings.Hopefully the crew tries to repile remaining rocks in a more ski base friendly fashion.


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## from_the_NEK (Sep 13, 2011)

I've also updated the blog. Can the title of this thread be changed to "Now official - Burke HSQ Updates"?


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## Smellytele (Sep 13, 2011)

I know I read it some where but what will become of the Willoughby Quad? Scrapped? moved over to east bowl?


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## thetrailboss (Sep 13, 2011)

Smellytele said:


> I know I read it some where but what will become of the Willoughby Quad? Scrapped? moved over to east bowl?


 
Staying in place for the immediate future.  BTW I was in downtown Rutland and on the side of a building next to the Price Chopper there was a giant mural of the Willoughby Quad with a single snowboarder on it.  Apparently this is a part of an art exhibit or something.  Interesting.


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## from_the_NEK (Sep 13, 2011)

Smellytele said:


> I know I read it some where but what will become of the Willoughby Quad? Scrapped? moved over to east bowl?



Currently, it is staying where it is and it will probably run on "busy" weekends. The rumor (and IMHO, what makes sense) is that it will be moved to East Bowl when that phase of "expansion" starts. I don't think they will need that much capacity over there, but it is probably cheaper/easier than buying a new lift.

Move process = 
1. Get the new lift line prepped and footings set.
2. Take chairs and haul rope down
3. Bring in Heli
4. Fly towers 1 by one to new resting places
5. Base and summit terminals moved by surface vehicles.
       a. The summit terminal would only have to move ~350 feet
6. Restring the rope and chairs

It would make for a rather fun double falline liftline trail


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## thetrailboss (Sep 13, 2011)

from_the_NEK said:


> Currently, it is staying where it is and it will probably run on "busy" weekends. The rumor (and IMHO, what makes sense) is that it will be moved to East Bowl when that phase of "expansion" starts. I don't think they will need that much capacity over there, but it is probably cheaper/easier than buying a new lift.
> 
> Move process =
> 1. Get the new lift line prepped and footings set.
> ...


 
I'm not sure it would be even moved or reused. A good number of the towers are from the original 1966 Willoughby Double, so they are now 45 years old. Assuming that they pass x-ray inspection for fatigue cracks and are deemed worthwhile, they will need to be modified for the new route. I was actually interested to learn, from the Ascutney debacle, from other folks that each lift is uniquely engineered for the terrain it covers. As we learned that any relocation and modification ends up being an expensive proposition. The rumor has always been that the old quad would be relocated. I just don't know if it is worth it now. 

A good case study I think would be the Middlebury Worth Mountain Double that was completely replaced in 2009 with a brand new lift, top to bottom. In that case the concrete foundations were giving way on this lift built in the 1960's, even after some rebuilding by CTEC in the 1980's. Sound familiar? The lift, and all components, were scrapped. I imagine the same foundation problems will eventually plague the Willoughby and the mountain will just take it down altogether. I'm not a lift engineer, so Telemechanic, please set us straight! :wink:

That said, the recent ownership, including Burke 2000, have done a good job maintaining it. Previous creditors...err...owners did not know WTF to do and caused problems.


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## from_the_NEK (Sep 13, 2011)

Zand said:


> I actually kinda liked Powerline being off the map... always a better option for hitting the glades in the bowl than Sasquatch. The new liftline will be fun though... should be a longer steep pitch than Fox's and easier to open with less rocks.



On a related note, Fox's Folly may no longer get scraped into oblivion as badly as it did now that it is no longer under the primary lift. This may result in cleaner, powderier lines there


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## from_the_NEK (Sep 13, 2011)

thetrailboss said:


> I'm not sure it would be even moved or reused. A good number of the towers are from the original 1966 Willoughby Double, so they are now 45 years old. Assuming that they pass x-ray inspection for fatigue cracks and are deemed worthwhile, they will need to be modified for the new route. I was actually interested to learn, from the Ascutney debacle, from other folks that each lift is uniquely engineered for the terrain it covers. As we learned that any relocation and modification ends up being an expensive proposition. The rumor has always been that the old quad would be relocated. I just don't know if it is worth it now.
> 
> A good case study I think would be the Middlebury Worth Mountain Double that was completely replaced in 2009 with a brand new lift, top to bottom. In that case the concrete foundations were giving way on this lift built in the 1960's, even after some rebuilding by CTEC in the 1980's. Sound familiar? The lift, and all components, were scrapped. I imagine the same foundation problems will eventually plague the Willoughby and the mountain will just take it down altogether. I'm not a lift engineer, so Telemechanic, please set us straight! :wink:
> 
> That said, the recent ownership, including Burke 2000, have done a good job maintaining it. Previous creditors...err...owners did not know WTF to do and caused problems.



The Ascutney lift line had a concave shape. Ascutney HSQ lift line Elevation profile:





Burke Mtn has a generally Convex shape.
Mid-Burke Express lift line Elevation profile:





Willoughby lift line Elevation profile:





East Bowl (proposed) lift line Elevation profile:





I totally believe that each lift is specifically engineered.  However, in the case of trying to re-use a lift with a completely different overall geometry is more difficult than re-using a lift that is pretty much exactly the same required length and has nearly the same geometry. Granted those towers are old and a couple may need to be replaced. A few of the sheaves sets may need to be redone/replaced as well.

I don't know much about the Middlebury Worth Mountain Double but i don't think that it is a good example of the overall picture here. You're talking about a 50 year old lift vs a 20 year old lift (other than the towers and footings). Obviously the concrete footings would not be re-used in the East Bowl. If the current Willoughby footings are becoming unstable, it would be in the mtns best interest to move the lift before it becomes a costly repair or complete decommissioning of the lift.


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## steamboat1 (Sep 14, 2011)

I'm not an engineer & don't know squat about the feasibility of moving lifts. I do however know of a few lifts that were moved from there original location to another location. I'm sure there are more examples that I either don't know or forgot about. Just off the top of my head.

*Original Killington Peak double chair was moved to & was the first chair installed in the Needles Eye area.

*Original Green Mountain Express at Mt. Ellen was moved to & became the North Ridge Express.Lift names may be wrong but I'm sure some know what I'm talking about.

*The replacement triple chair for the Green Mountain Express ( the one that only went as far as the bottom of the North Ridge Quad at Mt. Ellen) was moved to & replaced the upper poma on the south side of Sugarbush. 

SurgarLoaf re-installed the old Wifiltree fixed grip quad to the top ridge of the mountain. I think it's call Timberline lift now.

*Hunter Mountain is re-installing this year the old HSQ on the front face of the mountain over to the West Side after replacing the lift on the front side with a new six pack last year. They removed the 2 old slow double chairs that were on the West side

These are just a few examples & like I said I'm sure there are more.


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## threecy (Sep 14, 2011)

The Hall towers on the Willoughby Quad are only a dozen years older than the Hall towers reused on the Shelburne Express.  Presumably, the drive terminal, line equipment, and chairs on the Willoughby are from 1988.  Replacement towers can certainly be procured.

The lift could be reused for a similar vertical/run profile.  A slight increase in run can be compensated for by splicing in additional cable.  Engineers can allow for some customization in terms of the placement of towers (such as having areas that are high above the ground to allow for skier traffic and areas that are low to the ground for wind purposes).  Additional towers can be procured from boneyards or can be manufactured net new with new line equipment (such as, if there is a need for additional compression/depression sheave trains, etc.).

Regardless, the Willoughby Quad has value and will not be sold as scrap anytime soon.


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## thetrailboss (Sep 14, 2011)

So which trail is Jester?  The one beside Dashney Mile or the one that skirts along the outside of Bunker Hill?


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## from_the_NEK (Sep 14, 2011)

thetrailboss said:


> So which trail is Jester?  The one beside Dashney Mile or the one that skirts along the outside of Bunker Hill?



Jester, the MTB trail, is the one that skirts Bunker Hill.


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## Nick (Sep 14, 2011)

Some good updates today from Burke in the AZ Challenge results. --> http://skiing.alpinezone.com/articles/challenge/2011/response.htm?resort=burke


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## thetrailboss (Sep 14, 2011)

From the nek wins:  



> In the future it is our intention to relocate the Willoughby lift to the East Bowl area when that expansion occurs.


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## from_the_NEK (Sep 14, 2011)

Nick said:


> Some good updates today from Burke in the AZ Challenge results. --> http://skiing.alpinezone.com/articles/challenge/2011/response.htm?resort=burke



Awsome reponses! Thanks Tim M!

My mind has been put at ease


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## Nick (Sep 14, 2011)

Also, Tim = not a fan of seeded bumps :flame:


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## from_the_NEK (Sep 14, 2011)

Nick said:


> Also, Tim = not a fan of seeded bumps :flame:



Thats ok, I'm not really a fan either. I just figured it would be good for learning the basic technique.


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## from_the_NEK (Sep 15, 2011)

from_the_NEK said:


> Jester, the MTB trail, is the one that skirts Bunker Hill.



Then again maybe not...

http://www.flickr.com/photos/burkemountain/sets/72157627663782904/

Looks like a fun step-up


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## thetrailboss (Sep 15, 2011)

from_the_NEK said:


> Then again maybe not...
> 
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/burkemountain/sets/72157627663782904/
> 
> Looks like a fun step-up


 
OK.  It is the new trail that they were working on from the bottom of Bunker Hill to the unused portion of the liftline, just below Binney Lane.  Nice to see them using that area, albeit fairly flat and even uphill in some places.


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## SIKSKIER (Sep 15, 2011)

A little off track but i noticed Tim McGuire is the current GM from his posted e-mail.Does somebody know when Dick Andros left?


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## thetrailboss (Sep 15, 2011)

SIKSKIER said:


> A little off track but i noticed Tim McGuire is the current GM from his posted e-mail.Does somebody know when Dick Andros left?


 
I don't think he did.  I think he is the VP for Mountain Operations or something like that.  Ford Hubbard makes an appearance every once in a while as well.


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## SIKSKIER (Sep 15, 2011)

Thanks.I knew Dick from back when he ran Cannon and then Loon.Have only seen him once since he went to Burke.


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## from_the_NEK (Sep 19, 2011)

I wonder where the helicopter is this week?
I went up the the Mid-Lodge yesterday and these two tower footing forms had been moved over to what is left of the Mid-Burke parking lot. An "11" and "12" had been spray painted on them and they were rigged up with  harnesses that appeared to be for airlifting. Towers 11 and 12 are the ones on the steepest section of the lift line.







The footing for tower two and the basement walls of the timing building have been poured and backfilled.


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## thetrailboss (Sep 19, 2011)

from_the_NEK said:


> I wonder where the helicopter is this week?
> I went up the the Mid-Lodge yesterday and these two tower footing forms had been moved over to what is left of the Mid-Burke parking lot. An "11" and "12" had been spray painted on them and they were rigged up with harnesses that appeared to be for airlifting. Towers 11 and 12 are the ones on the steepest section of the lift line.
> 
> 
> ...


 
I saw the same two.  Thanks now I don't have to do a report!  :lol:


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## bobbutts (Sep 19, 2011)

from_the_NEK said:


> The Ascutney lift line had a concave shape. Ascutney HSQ lift line Elevation profile:



How did you make those images? good stuff


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## thetrailboss (Sep 19, 2011)

I also noted that they were excavating where Tower 4 will be, which is on the knoll where the Poma is.  They had also dug up the snowmaking lines in front of MidBurke and were getting ready to reroute them.


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## from_the_NEK (Sep 19, 2011)

thetrailboss said:


> I also noted that they were excavating where Tower 4 will be, which is on the knoll where the Poma is.  They had also dug up the snowmaking lines in front of MidBurke and were getting ready to reroute them.



They had new pipe in the trench yesterday.

The hole for tower four had a form all set and ready for concrete. Looks like 5 and 6 were ready too.

Pictures are still on the camera :smile:.


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## from_the_NEK (Sep 19, 2011)

I'm actually still trying to figure out the official tower numbering. I'm assuming it will go something like this with Tower 1 being close to the bottom terminal. Having the first tower be up by the Mid-Lodge seems like a pretty long first run (about 300 feet).


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## thetrailboss (Sep 19, 2011)

FWIW IIRC the tower beside MidBurke is #3.


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## from_the_NEK (Sep 19, 2011)

bobbutts said:


> How did you make those images? good stuff



If you have a saved line feature in Google Earth, you can right click on it an select "Show Elevation Profile". Although, I don't really trust the slope values is calculates.


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## from_the_NEK (Sep 19, 2011)

thetrailboss said:


> FWIW IIRC the tower beside MidBurke is #3.



If that is the case Could "Tower 1" be the sheave train that is attached to the base terminal or the base terminal itself?


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## thetrailboss (Sep 19, 2011)

from_the_NEK said:


> If that is the case Could "Tower 1" be the sheave train that is attached to the base terminal or the base terminal itself?


 
I think so.


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## threecy (Sep 19, 2011)

Sometimes the bridge/portal can be labelled as Tower 1.  In the case of the Sherburne Express, the first standalone tower is Tower 1.


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## from_the_NEK (Sep 20, 2011)

Just thought of something this evening I should have asked in the challenge?

Are the new lift and trails going to be on this year's trail map?

I think they will be since they don't send it out for printing until September (At least that was when it went out to print when I was on the cover a few years ago).


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## dennis (Sep 21, 2011)

from_the_NEK said:


> I wonder where the helicopter is this week?
> I went up the the Mid-Lodge yesterday and these two tower footing forms had been moved over to what is left of the Mid-Burke parking lot. An "11" and "12" had been spray painted on them and they were rigged up with harnesses that appeared to be for airlifting. Towers 11 and 12 are the ones on the steepest section of the lift line.


 
Mount Snow 19th and 20th, Burke the 21st


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## Masskier (Sep 21, 2011)

dennis said:


> Mount Snow 19th and 20th, Burke the 21st



At this moment the Helicopter is in the mid Burke parking lot waiting for the fog to lift.  Right on schedule.


----------



## thetrailboss (Sep 21, 2011)

So the chopper is moving forms and pouring concrete on some of the bases I take it?  Good to hear.  What about the terminal components?  I did not see them on Sunday.


----------



## from_the_NEK (Sep 21, 2011)

thetrailboss said:


> So the chopper is moving forms and pouring concrete on some of the bases I take it?  Good to hear.  What about the terminal components?  I did not see them on Sunday.



Burke's Facebook page said something about being ready for the helicoper. There are a couple of forms that need to be set by Heli first. Then I'm assuming they are going to use the Heli to transport concrete to all the footings between the Poma base and the toll road. There may even be a couple tower footings among the toll road crossings where the air transport of concrete makes sense as well.


----------



## psyflyer (Sep 21, 2011)

Masskier said:


> At this moment the Helicopter is in the mid Burke parking lot waiting for the fog to lift.  Right on schedule.



Chopper is in the air right now.  They are pouring cement on the upper parts.  Awesome to watch!


----------



## billski (Sep 21, 2011)

*da loaf*

With all this chatter about a new lift, why ain't nobody talkin' about Sugarloaf?
Or did I miss another thread?  Again.


----------



## thetrailboss (Sep 21, 2011)

billski said:


> With all this chatter about a new lift, why ain't nobody talkin' about Sugarloaf?
> Or did I miss another thread? Again.


 
http://forums.alpinezone.com/showthread.php?t=91460


----------



## WoodCore (Sep 21, 2011)




----------



## SkiingInABlueDream (Sep 21, 2011)

billski said:


> With all this chatter about a new lift, why ain't nobody talkin' about Sugarloaf?
> Or did I miss another thread?  Again.



Cool picture. The 3 towers behind the bullwheel structure clearly indicate the lift will be a detachable. But the bare bullwheel itself, without the rest of the terminal built around it yet, kind of looks like the minimal summit terminals sometimes seen with fixed chairs. Cool picture...


----------



## UVSHTSTRM (Sep 21, 2011)

skifastr said:


> Cool picture. The 3 towers behind the bullwheel structure clearly indicate the lift will be a detachable. But the bare bullwheel itself, without the rest of the terminal built around it yet, kind of looks like the minimal summit terminals sometimes seen with fixed chairs. Cool picture...



It is not a detachable, it is a fixed chair.


----------



## SkiingInABlueDream (Sep 21, 2011)

UVSHTSTRM said:


> It is not a detachable, it is a fixed chair.



really?  Interesting. ok my bad. I still like the picture though.


----------



## from_the_NEK (Sep 21, 2011)

Stop messing up the Burke thread with this talk/pictures of Sugarloaf's "Slow Quad".  ;-)


----------



## SkiingInABlueDream (Sep 21, 2011)

What's the latest on Jay's Bonnie chair replacement?


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## from_the_NEK (Sep 22, 2011)

skifastr said:


> What's the latest on Jay's Bonnie chair replacement?



Next year is the word. 


Hey...wait a minute...


----------



## thetrailboss (Sep 22, 2011)

Back to Burke.  So any more helicopter shots?


----------



## thetrailboss (Sep 24, 2011)

A good article and picture of the work:  

http://caledonianrecord.com/main.asp?SectionID=180&SubSectionID=778&ArticleID=68218


----------



## riverc0il (Sep 24, 2011)

thetrailboss said:


> A good article and picture of the work:
> 
> http://caledonianrecord.com/main.asp?SectionID=180&SubSectionID=778&ArticleID=68218





> The resort has also cut five new trails and glades for intermediate and expert skiers including a terrain park trail.


Oops, not quite so good article. At least four of those trails were not "cut" but were already there and are just being added to the map. I don't count a lift install and then naming a new lift line as "cutting a new trail".

:-D


----------



## WoodCore (Sep 25, 2011)

Was up riding the Kingdom Trails this weekend and took a drive up top to see the progress on the new lift. Looks like most of the tower footings are in place and the forms for the summit/base terminals are awaiting some concrete. The lift line is manicured in places but other spots need some serious help. Lots of work to do and a limited time to get it done! Things might get a little tight if the weather does not cooperate! Here's some pictures!


----------



## thetrailboss (Sep 26, 2011)

Nice pics!  

LSC TV had this short newsclip, with Dick Andross and the helicopter pilot:  http://blip.tv/newslinc/construction-begins-on-hish-speed-lift-at-burke-5578350


----------



## from_the_NEK (Sep 26, 2011)

Sweet pics! Looks like you hit the summit on Sunday. I was up Friday afternoon and these forms hadn't been done yet. Hopefully they get all the concrete done soon so that they can backfill before the ground starts freezing/thawing.








> The lift line is manicured in places but other spots need some serious help.



The upper section of the life line (AKA "Upper Lift Line") is the intermediate section and it is nicely manicured. From the top of the Poma down is "Rerun" (Expert). It is rather "rough" in places :razz: .


----------



## Magog Fishy (Sep 26, 2011)

WoodCore said:


> Lots of work to do and a limited time to get it done! Things might get a little tight if the weather does not cooperate! Here's some pictures!
> [/img]



Nice pics! Yeah, looks like they have a ton of work to do in the next month (2 months max).


----------



## from_the_NEK (Sep 27, 2011)

Burke changed the main page background picture on their website to one that shows the wind turbine and the Willoughby Highlands in the background. However, it is a mirror image so the Mtns on either side of Lake Willoughby are backward :roll:. I can see why some one did it, since due to the layout of the website, the right side has a bunch of stuff in the way so the wind tower wouldn't have been very visible. However, IMO, it looks really silly.

Edit:Upon further browsing, I also thought the background picture for the subpages (a picture looking toward Franconia Notch) looked wierd as well. Sure enough, this one was also a mirror image! It isn't nearly as noticable as the one on the main page since the page content often covers up most of the picture but it is still ridiculous.


----------



## thetrailboss (Sep 27, 2011)

from_the_NEK said:


> Burke changed the background picture on their website to one that shows the wind turbine and the Willoughby Highlands in the background. However, it is a mirror image so the Mtns on either side of Lake Willoughby are backward :roll:. I can see why some one did it, since due to the layout of the website, the right side has a bunch of stuff in the way so the wind tower wouldn't have been very visible. However, IMO, it looks really silly.


 
That's what happens when you have someone from outside the area do your IT work.


----------



## tarponhead (Sep 27, 2011)

ok, admittedly stupid-lazy question; when looking at Franconia Notch, in what direction is Jay and Stowe  (which I should be able to see?). Just want to confidently point them out to my boys...
thx


----------



## thetrailboss (Sep 27, 2011)

tarponhead said:


> ok, admittedly stupid-lazy question; when looking at Franconia Notch, in what direction is Jay and Stowe (which I should be able to see?). Just want to confidently point them out to my boys...
> thx


 
You mean when looking at Willoughby Gap?  

If so, Jay Peak is just to the left.  The very upper part of Mount Mansfield is further down the ridge.  On a very clear day you can see Camel's Hump, MRG, and Sugarbush (both areas).  And if you know where to look and it is really, really clear, you can make out a little bit of Killington.  Burke was named by Native Americans to mean "mountain with the long view," or something like that.  You can see a loooooonnnnggggg ways in all directions.


----------



## Smellytele (Sep 27, 2011)

thetrailboss said:


> You mean when looking at Willoughby Gap?
> 
> If so, Jay Peak is just to the left.  The very upper part of Mount Mansfield is further down the ridge.  On a very clear day you can see Camel's Hump, MRG, and Sugarbush (both areas).  And if you know where to look and it is really, really clear, you can make out a little bit of Killington.  Burke was named by Native Americans to mean "mountain with the long view," or something like that.  You can see a loooooonnnnggggg ways in all directions.



I hope one day to be there when I can just see more than 5 miles. Been 3 times and it was either snowing or socked in.


----------



## from_the_NEK (Sep 28, 2011)

tarponhead said:


> ok, admittedly stupid-lazy question; when looking at Franconia Notch, in what direction is Jay and Stowe  (which I should be able to see?). Just want to confidently point them out to my boys...
> thx



If you are looking at Franconia Notch, you are looking Southeast and the Vermont mountains you listed are behind you. Note that you have to make the short hike (250 ft) over to the fire tower at the true summit to see Franconia Notch.

Here is a map view of mountains you can see from Burke. Keep in mind the majority of Burke's ski trails face Northwest toward Willoughby Gap.





Here is Willoughby Gap (here you can see Owl's Head in Quebec just peeking/peaking over Mt Pisgah's right shoulder):





As Trailboss mentioned Jay Peak is a little to the left of Willoughby Gap.
In this first picture it is the faint mtn on the left horizon:





And is now almost directly behind the hill covered in wind towers






Mt Mansfield will be the only mountain looking west that has a white top:


----------



## x10003q (Sep 28, 2011)

Smellytele said:


> I hope one day to be there when I can just see more than 5 miles. Been 3 times and it was either snowing or socked in.



It is funny to read this as I have the same experience at Burke.


----------



## tarponhead (Sep 28, 2011)

thetrailboss said:


> You mean when looking at Willoughby Gap?
> 
> If so, Jay Peak is just to the left.  The very upper part of Mount Mansfield is further down the ridge.  On a very clear day you can see Camel's Hump, MRG, and Sugarbush (both areas).  And if you know where to look and it is really, really clear, you can make out a little bit of Killington.  Burke was named by Native Americans to mean "mountain with the long view," or something like that.  You can see a loooooonnnnggggg ways in all directions.



Yes, Willoughby Gap. My (very) bad. Thank you. 

NEK, awesome pics! Very helpful


----------



## from_the_NEK (Sep 28, 2011)

Looks like more concrete has been flown in.


----------



## WoodCore (Oct 10, 2011)

Things are moving along on the lift install! Was up in the area over the weekend and the Leitner/Poma crew was out on the mountain working full bore over the holiday weekend! 

Here's some pictures.


----------



## from_the_NEK (Oct 11, 2011)

Things are progressing quickly up there. They put up a nicely produced new video with more concrete helicoptering.


----------



## from_the_NEK (Oct 11, 2011)

I've also been messing around in Google Earth with what Burke would look like at full lift buildout (assuming the West Bowl is built out 50 years from now ).
The Purple lines are exisiting lifts.
Green and white polygons are where I would put trails (ignore the skinny white one that cuts across the East Bowl lift, it's the current East Bowl runout trail)

The Red lines are lifts that haven't been built yet. From left to right they are:

East Bowl lift (planned) - 1400 ft vert

Mid-Burke Express (under construction) - 1565 ft vert

West Peak lift (theoretical) - 1565 ft vert (the top 700 ft avg 48% slope [compare to the top 700 ft section of the Castlerock liftline is 44% :grin:]).













----Discuss-----


----------



## jimmywilson69 (Oct 11, 2011)

You've got a lot of time to play around in google earth, don't you?:beer:

I've done some of these things myself, but not to the extent that you have.


----------



## from_the_NEK (Oct 11, 2011)

jimmywilson69 said:


> You've got a lot of time to play around in google earth, don't you?:beer:
> 
> I've done some of these things myself, but not to the extent that you have.



I like to mess around with it during my lunch breaks. What you see there probably took a total of 2 hours during various lunchs. :grin:


----------



## Masskier (Oct 12, 2011)

from_the_NEK said:


> Things are progressing quickly up there. They put up a nicely produced new video with more concrete helicoptering.



Thanks for the update


----------



## from_the_NEK (Oct 13, 2011)

Burke's Facebook page has pictures of the new lift components wiating for installation. Tower Tubes, and sheive assemblies 
I have to get up there to see what is going on (stupid garage building project).

Burke Facebook Pictures







I count 21 in the photo. However, I'm guessing the ones without a square end are tower extensions?


----------



## jimmywilson69 (Oct 13, 2011)

I like the green paint.  although that's just more maintenance down the road, yet cheaper than galvanized steel.

you are correct the round bases are for  "2-stage towers"


----------



## SkiingInABlueDream (Oct 13, 2011)

from_the_NEK said:


> ----Discuss-----



mmmkay. 

East Bowl lift 50 years from now sounds good to me. 

West Peak lift tomorrow sounds good to me.  
And your map now makes me wonder if there're good off-map lines over there.


----------



## from_the_NEK (Oct 13, 2011)

skifastr said:


> West Peak lift tomorrow sounds good to me.
> And your map now makes me wonder if there're good off-map lines over there.


----------



## SkiingInABlueDream (Oct 13, 2011)

:lol:


----------



## thetrailboss (Oct 13, 2011)

Another green lift?  Yikes....


----------



## from_the_NEK (Oct 13, 2011)

thetrailboss said:


> Another green lift?  Yikes....



What's wrong with uniformity?


----------



## thetrailboss (Oct 13, 2011)

from_the_NEK said:


> What's wrong with uniformity?


 
:lol: Well, John Deere green though? But then again, what am I saying?  Burke is getting a new HSQ to the Summit!!!!  It could have been BARNEY PURPLE and is still better than what was there!


----------



## riverc0il (Oct 13, 2011)

from_the_NEK said:


> I have to get up there to see what is going on (stupid garage building project).


Agreed! We need someone to take pictures of those towers with a real camera instead of a camera phone. :roll: That can't possibly be the correct hue of green on those towers. At least I hope not. Green is okay but that picture just doesn't look right...


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## AdironRider (Oct 13, 2011)

Who gives a damn what color the lift towers are?


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## from_the_NEK (Oct 14, 2011)

AdironRider said:


> Who gives a damn what color the lift towers are?



Well they could look like this :lol:


----------



## Masskier (Oct 19, 2011)

Any updates this week?


----------



## WoodCore (Oct 19, 2011)

They posted a movie on Facebook showing the pouring of the base terminal footing/pad.


----------



## from_the_NEK (Oct 19, 2011)

No updates but Google Earth is fun to play with :razz:


----------



## WoodCore (Oct 19, 2011)




----------



## Masskier (Oct 23, 2011)

Was up at Burke this weekend.  The lift is still on schedule to be operational by X'mas week.


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## psyflyer (Oct 24, 2011)

One of the towers has been erected.  Looks like just above the top of the poma and was erected without a chopper most likely using the toll road.  Looks great.


----------



## from_the_NEK (Oct 24, 2011)

psyflyer said:


> One of the towers has been erected.  Looks like just above the top of the poma and was erected without a chopper most likely using the toll road.  Looks great.



I would assume all of the towers from that point and up to the summit will be erected in such a manner. Easy work for a medium size crane and a couple 25 foot flatbed trucks.


----------



## from_the_NEK (Oct 25, 2011)

Looks like 3 towers up so far. Towers 2 (the first one out of the terminal) and 3 at the Mid-Burke base and tower 14 just across the toll road from the Poma top terminal.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/burkemountain/6277652023/in/photostream/


----------



## thetrailboss (Oct 25, 2011)

Great photos from Burke's Facebook page.  And great to see them working into the dark to get 'er done!


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## thetrailboss (Oct 25, 2011)

...and is it just me but why are those ladders so tall off the top of the cross arm?


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## from_the_NEK (Oct 25, 2011)

thetrailboss said:


> ...and is it just me but why are those ladders so tall off the top of the cross arm?



My thought is the extra tall ladder is temporary and used to disconnect the crane webbing. They will probably take the extension off and use it on other tower tops.


----------



## from_the_NEK (Oct 28, 2011)

Breaking News! I updated my blog


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## Zand (Nov 1, 2011)

Just took a ride to pick up my pass and then went up to mid-Burke to take some pics. Towers 2-4 are in and I could see quite a few up top as well. The tower tops as well as a few towers are in the overflow lot. Looks so different up there.


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## thetrailboss (Nov 1, 2011)

Thanks Zand!  Any pics to share?


----------



## Zand (Nov 1, 2011)

thetrailboss said:


> Thanks Zand!  Any pics to share?



I took a few... exceeded my AZ quota so couldn't post.


----------



## from_the_NEK (Nov 1, 2011)

Zand said:


> I took a few... exceeded my AZ quota so couldn't post.



Try loading one pic at a time. The upload tool doesn't work for multiple pics.

Or try creating your own photo sharing spot (e.g. Photobucket, Flicker, etc).


----------



## Telemechanic (Nov 1, 2011)

thetrailboss said:


> ...and is it just me but why are those ladders so tall off the top of the cross arm?



Those ladder sections will be connected to the tower ladder.  Having the ladder extend above the crossarm makes it safer and easier to step off onto the maintenance platform.  Doppelmayrs go above the arm too but not as high as the lifting frame.  I noticed Mt. Snow's new six also had ladder extensions lashed to the frame for airlift.


----------



## jimmywilson69 (Nov 2, 2011)

Telemechanic said:


> Those ladder sections will be connected to the tower ladder.  Having the ladder extend above the crossarm makes it safer and easier to step off onto the maintenance platform.  Doppelmayrs go above the arm too but not as high as the lifting frame.  I noticed Mt. Snow's new six also had ladder extensions lashed to the frame for airlift.



It is likely an OSHA thing, too.


----------



## psyflyer (Nov 9, 2011)

Chopper is in the air installing towers right now.  What a spectacle.


----------



## psyflyer (Nov 9, 2011)

Weather is perfect, warm, clear and no wind.  Pics...

Interestingly they started from the top and they are working their way down now.


----------



## Zand (Nov 9, 2011)

Great view from LSC of the helicopter. Exceeds my AZ limit for pics and don't have time to make a photobucket acct so that'll have to wait..


----------



## WoodCore (Nov 9, 2011)

Zand said:


> Great view from LSC of the helicopter. Exceeds my AZ limit for pics and don't have time to make a photobucket acct so that'll have to wait..



Try loading them one at a time.


----------



## from_the_NEK (Nov 9, 2011)

WoodCore said:


> Try loading them one at a time.



I tried to tell him that before...


----------



## drjeff (Nov 9, 2011)

psyflyer said:


> Weather is perfect, warm, clear and no wind.  Pics...
> 
> Interestingly they started from the top and they are working their way down now.



MUCH easier on the Leitner-Poma Installation crews to move downhill as the installation progresses than to climb uphill.  And if 1 crew is still finishing the final bolting in of the tower and crossbars on the one just installed, its not in the direct path way of the chopper as it brings the next tower assembly into place.  Remember, this process goes as quickly as possible since that chopper isn't cheap to rent!


----------



## Zand (Nov 9, 2011)

from_the_NEK said:


> I tried to tell him that before...



I only have 1 to load so that's not the problem lol

And BREAKING NEWS... the new lift is visible from the LSC campus.


----------



## from_the_NEK (Nov 9, 2011)

Zand said:


> I only have 1 to load so that's not the problem lol
> 
> And BREAKING NEWS... the new lift is visible from the LSC campus.



Weird, it works for me just fine (one at a time). Are you trying to attach to the post or upload to the gallery?

And I can see it from my house too :smile:


----------



## from_the_NEK (Nov 10, 2011)

Sweet pictures in Burke's Flicker gallery of the tower setting yesterday.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/burkemountain/sets/72157627972521825/


----------



## from_the_NEK (Nov 11, 2011)

News story (video) from the Lyndon State College news channel:

http://blip.tv/newslinc/burke-unveils-true-north-campaign-5704551


----------



## Masskier (Nov 11, 2011)

from_the_NEK said:


> News story (video) from the Lyndon State College news channel:
> 
> http://blip.tv/newslinc/burke-unveils-true-north-campaign-5704551



Thanks for the link.


----------



## thetrailboss (Nov 11, 2011)

They probably wanted to get up high done before snow and skiing began.....


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## Masskier (Nov 12, 2011)

Just came back from a hike up to mid Burke.  The  Cable, chairs, foot rests are stored onsite,  looking up from the base of the lift there is only 2 or 3 towers that are not complete yet.


----------



## from_the_NEK (Nov 14, 2011)

Masskier said:


> looking up from the base of the lift there is only 2 or 3 towers that are not complete yet.



I was up there on Saturday and it looked like all of the towers are all together and waiting for various cables and ropes to be strung from them. The base area is buzzing with activity as the base terminal was being worked on as well as utilities all around the mid-lodge. Looks like they may be running the power underground over to the Snowmaking pond area,


----------



## thetrailboss (Nov 14, 2011)

Looks good to me!  And btw the new lift has FOOTRESTS for the naysayers!


----------



## Zand (Nov 14, 2011)

thetrailboss said:


> Looks good to me!  And btw the new lift has FOOTRESTS for the naysayers!



Where were those the last 40 years? lol


----------



## from_the_NEK (Nov 23, 2011)

Burke updated their Flicker site with summit terminal pics.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/burkemountain/6389961547/


----------



## thetrailboss (Nov 23, 2011)

from_the_NEK said:


> Burke updated their Flicker site with summit terminal pics.
> 
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/burkemountain/6389961547/


 
That looks nice!  Anyone know if it will be a top drive lift?


----------



## Masskier (Nov 28, 2011)

thetrailboss said:


> That looks nice!  Anyone know if it will be a top drive lift?



Yes,  It is a top drive.


----------



## Boardguy (Dec 4, 2011)

Any of you local guys have an update on lift construction progress?


----------



## Masskier (Dec 5, 2011)

I know they are still on target to be operational by X'mas week.  Does anyone have any recent pictures?


----------



## from_the_NEK (Dec 5, 2011)

Burke had some new picts on their Facebook page last week.


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## andrec10 (Dec 5, 2011)

Now this is WAITING till the last minute!


----------



## thetrailboss (Dec 5, 2011)

andrec10 said:


> Now this is WAITING till the last minute!



Sounds like you weren't following this..Burke had originally planned on buying Ascutney's HSQ and reinstalling it.  The lift is still tied up in litigation, so this was plan B.  A better option IMHO.


----------



## andrec10 (Dec 5, 2011)

thetrailboss said:


> Sounds like you weren't following this..Burke had originally planned on buying Ascutney's HSQ and reinstalling it.  The lift is still tied up in litigation, so this was plan B.  A better option IMHO.



Sorry, did not see that! I agree, new is always better than used!


----------



## thetrailboss (Dec 5, 2011)

andrec10 said:


> Sorry, did not see that! I agree, new is always better than used!



No worries!  Like the cannon threads the Burke threads have gotten very long and hard to follow!


----------



## Telemechanic (Dec 5, 2011)

thetrailboss said:


> Burke had originally planned on buying Ascutney's HSQ and reinstalling it.  The lift is still tied up in litigation, so this was plan B.  A better option IMHO.



From industry sources I heard Burke backed out of buying Ascutney's quad because they would have had to pay for removal which would've been high because of the difficult terrain at the top terminal.  Ascutney used a helicopter to install the top of the lift because getting a crane to the summit was too difficult.


----------



## Newpylong (Dec 6, 2011)

Didn't the Ascutney lift have issues?


----------



## thetrailboss (Dec 6, 2011)

Newpylong said:


> Didn't the Ascutney lift have issues?


 
It was tied up in litigation...as to who owned it, if it was illegally transferred from the mountain to the old owners, etc. I also think that as it was the lift was not properly engineered up to state code because of a lack of sensors. The Plausteiners, in their infinite wisdom, opted to not spend the $$$ to get the issue fixed and as a result only ran the lift at a slower speed.

As to maintenance, it may have been maintained, may not. When you buy a resort that has been held by a creditor or bank, like a foreclosure sale you don't always know what you are getting. Previous creditors/banks that ran Burke had no idea what they were doing and sometimes cut corners or screwed up maintenance on the Willoughby Quad, leading to problems for future owners. Well the current ownership has got the bugs worked out and that lift runs well.

And as Telemechanic said the cost was getting too high for a used lift with lots of "?'s." Burke had a relationship with Poma/Leitner, who did the Sherburne Quad and may not have done much with Doppelmayr/CTEC since the last install by them was by CTEC in 1988. So maybe Poma gave them a deal that was so close in price to the reinstall that it just made sense to have a NEW lift, inside and out, rather than rolling the dice on a lift engineered for a different mountain and now over ten years old.

The Mid Burke Express looks like a really nice lift.  Nice carriers, wood paneling in the terminals, new towers, and foot rests (people complained about the Willoughby not having them).


----------



## from_the_NEK (Dec 6, 2011)

New pictures of the bottom terminal construction on Burke's Facebook page:

http://www.facebook.com/BurkeMtn?sk=wall#!/BurkeMtn?sk=wall


----------



## thetrailboss (Dec 6, 2011)

from_the_NEK said:


> New pictures of the bottom terminal construction on Burke's Facebook page:
> 
> http://www.facebook.com/BurkeMtn?sk=wall#!/BurkeMtn?sk=wall


 
Lucky for them that it has been a mild fall.  That is one good thing about this weather....


----------



## SIKSKIER (Dec 6, 2011)

*I'll blame it on Burke*

Now I see why were having this prolonged tropical weather.Winter is waiting for Burke to get this lift installed.Yup,Thanks a lot Burke.


----------



## thetrailboss (Dec 6, 2011)

SIKSKIER said:


> Now I see why were having this prolonged tropical weather.Winter is waiting for Burke to get this lift installed.Yup,Thanks a lot Burke.


 
:lol:


----------



## riverc0il (Dec 6, 2011)

Anyone else think they should have dropped the mid and just called it the Burke Express? 

Mid-Burke fans are probably going to throw a brick at me for that one. :lol: But it looks really dumb when spelled out on the terminals.


----------



## tarponhead (Dec 6, 2011)

riverc0il said:


> Anyone else think they should have dropped the mid and just called it the Burke Express?
> 
> Mid-Burke fans are probably going to throw a brick at me for that one. :lol: But it looks really dumb when spelled out on the terminals.



Why? Name is accurate.


----------



## from_the_NEK (Dec 6, 2011)

riverc0il said:


> Anyone else think they should have dropped the mid and just called it the Burke Express?
> 
> *Mid-Burke* fans are probably going to throw a brick at me for that one. :lol: But it looks really dumb when spelled out on the terminals.



They should have hyphenated it."MID" does look strange all by itself.


----------



## UVSHTSTRM (Dec 6, 2011)

Is it just me or is this lift taking forever to install?  Probably just me.


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## threecy (Dec 6, 2011)

UVSHTSTRM said:


> Is it just me or is this lift taking forever to install?  Probably just me.



They started it rather late, but the pace thereafter seems to be about normal since the pouring of concrete.

A lift that took forever to install was the 6-pack at Ragged.  I believe that one opened mid season.


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## from_the_NEK (Dec 6, 2011)

threecy said:


> They started it rather late, but the pace thereafter seems to be about normal since the pouring of concrete.
> 
> A lift that took forever to install was the 6-pack at Ragged.  I believe that one opened mid season.



Considering they placed the order to Lietner/Poma around the time other places were already having components of their new lifts delivered, I think Burke has kept to a pretty good timeline. The terminal components could have probably been set earlier but they were probably still being built in the factory and couldn't be shipped any sooner.


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## drjeff (Dec 6, 2011)

UVSHTSTRM said:


> Is it just me or is this lift taking forever to install?  Probably just me.



Since many of the folks from Leitner-Poma, and their sub contractors (the helicopter guys, etc) have also been installing the 6 Pack at Mount Snow,  I know that the infastructure damage from Irene caused a set back in the schedule of about 2 weeks.  And based on what stage of construction that lower terminal is at in those pictures and from how long it took Mount Snow to get from that stage to completion of the load testing and getting the lift certified by the state,  baring any unforseen complications, the Mid Burke Express will be spinning with folks in riding in the chairs for Christmas Week without any problems.  

On a side note,  just from an esthetic standpoint,  I think that the new L-P lifts look AWESOME!


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## from_the_NEK (Dec 9, 2011)

Pulling and spicing the rope today! Won't be long now.

 Burke Facebook album -


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## from_the_NEK (Dec 13, 2011)

Updates to home construction plans around the area adjacent to the new lift:

http://caledonianrecord.com/main.asp?SectionID=180&SubSectionID=778&ArticleID=71879

Approved Act250 Permit for model home (the Caledonian article seems to indicate there is an expanded version of this for the entire development):
http://www.anr.state.vt.us/site/cfm/act250/detail.cfm?ID=26047

BuildingElevations.pdf


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## Smellytele (Dec 13, 2011)

from_the_NEK said:


> Updates to home construction plans around the area adjacent to the new lift:
> 
> http://caledonianrecord.com/main.asp?SectionID=180&SubSectionID=778&ArticleID=71879
> 
> ...



500k homes - so much for the True North - There goes the neighborhood...


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## thetrailboss (Dec 13, 2011)

Smellytele said:


> 500k homes - so much for the True North - There goes the neighborhood...



What were you expecting?  They are selling $1 million timeshares at Stowe and Sugarbush.


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## from_the_NEK (Dec 13, 2011)

Smellytele said:


> 500k homes - so much for the True North - There goes the neighborhood...



Honestly, $500K for a 2000 sq ft (1000 sq ft Footprint x 2 stories) home right next to a summit lift is probably rather "affordable" by ski resort standards. Not that I have any idea what the current "standard" is :wink: .

Edit: Trailboss comes in with a "timeshare" standard. I know the Mountain Cabins at Stowe were selling for well over a million. Google isn't very good at getting me asking/selling prices at ski resorts.


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## thetrailboss (Dec 13, 2011)

from_the_NEK said:


> Honestly, $500K for a 2000 sq ft (1000 sq ft Footprint x 2 stories) home right next to a summit lift is probably rather "affordable" by ski resort standards. Not that I have any idea what the current "standard" is :wink: .



That was my point.  When you consider that the Bear Path units were "starting" at $1,000,050.00, you can see that these are affordable homes for what they are.  I'll defer to Mass skier to elaborate as to the BP Homes...IIRC the price has been reduced.  Most folks on AZ are not their market for this product anyway.


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## from_the_NEK (Dec 13, 2011)

thetrailboss said:


> Most folks on AZ are not their market for this product anyway.



How do you know I'm not? Maybe I want to live closer to the mountains. :wink:


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## thetrailboss (Dec 13, 2011)

from_the_NEK said:


> How do you know I'm not? Maybe I want to live closer to the mountains. :wink:



I misspoke.  I'm sure that with all the royalties you have been paid by the mountain for those photo shoots that you can buy two homes.  BTW I did not see you in the latest brochure....

:lol:


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## Smellytele (Dec 13, 2011)

They have been dissing on the other areas with their marketing then they do the same thing is what I am getting at. McSki Areas. Very contradictory. True (not) North


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## thetrailboss (Dec 13, 2011)

Smellytele said:


> They have been dissing on the other areas with their marketing then they do the same thing is what I am getting at. McSki Areas. Very contradictory. True (not) North



That's true to some extent, but a $500k ski home nearly slopeside is not a lot of money for that kind of product.


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## Smellytele (Dec 13, 2011)

thetrailboss said:


> That's true to some extent, but a $500k ski home nearly slopeside is not a lot of money for that kind of product.



I'll give you that but still the contradiction.


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## thetrailboss (Dec 13, 2011)

Smellytele said:


> I'll give you that but still the contradiction.



The "modular" part, yes indeed!


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## Masskier (Dec 13, 2011)

from_the_NEK said:


> Honestly, $500K for a 2000 sq ft (1000 sq ft Footprint x 2 stories) home right next to a summit lift is probably rather "affordable" by ski resort standards. Not that I have any idea what the current "standard" is :wink: .
> 
> Edit: Trailboss comes in with a "timeshare" standard. I know the Mountain Cabins at Stowe were selling for well over a million. Google isn't very good at getting me asking/selling prices at ski resorts.



Mountain cabins at Stowe ended up selling as high as 2.6 million.

The homes at mid Burke are a great value at $250 per SF.  At other ski areas a slope side/ lift side  location with a new energy efficient home sells in the 400-600 $ per SF area.  And the mid Burke location is far superior than most, when you take into consideration the view.


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## Masskier (Dec 13, 2011)

thetrailboss said:


> That was my point.  When you consider that the Bear Path units were "starting" at $1,000,050.00, you can see that these are affordable homes for what they are.  I'll defer to Mass skier to elaborate as to the BP Homes...IIRC the price has been reduced.  Most folks on AZ are not their market for this product anyway.



We have one built unit left for sale.  Its been reduced to $675k (interior townhome 2525 SF) or 267 per SF.  These units started at $759k.  The end units (3496 SF) started at $1050,000 or $300 per SF


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## from_the_NEK (Dec 13, 2011)

Smellytele said:


> They have been dissing on the other areas with their marketing then they do the same thing is what I am getting at. McSki Areas. Very contradictory. True (not) North



However, it is a FAR better senario than what the mountain was going to be turned into by Ginn. A few houses clustered around the bottom of the lift hardly qualifies as McResort development.


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## from_the_NEK (Dec 14, 2011)

The Chairs were all hung from the Haul Rope with care, in hopes that Ullr soon would be there.
Burke Facebook album







Now we need snow :idea:


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## kingdom-tele (Dec 15, 2011)

lift passed load testing.  maybe they can offer some nice scenic rides while we wait for snow.


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## thetrailboss (Dec 15, 2011)

That was fast!  Great news!


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## jimmywilson69 (Dec 15, 2011)

I think the guys at Poma need a round of applaus.  was this the fastest lift installation ever?  when did they actually start construction?


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## thetrailboss (Dec 15, 2011)

jimmywilson69 said:


> I think the guys at Poma need a round of applaus. was this the fastest lift installation ever? when did they actually start construction?


 
I agree.  They were really behind the eight ball on this one because, again, Burke intended on the purchase of Ascutney's lift.  I don't know if Poma would have been the crew that did the dismantling/reinstallation work, but the fact that they got a NEW lift to Burke on such short notice, did the install, and got it ready on December 15th is nothing short of amazing.  The lift looks really sharp.  

As to timing, Burke had been doing site work going back to May, but had not really gotten into gear until early August.  Poma was doing work in September, but not really doing much until later that month.  

I like Poma lifts.  They are comfortable and smooth.  Although lots of places out here in Utah I find have Doppelmayr CTEC lifts, which are also nice.


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## drjeff (Dec 15, 2011)

jimmywilson69 said:


> I think the guys at Poma need a round of applaus.  was this the fastest lift installation ever?  when did they actually start construction?



From having seen the Leitner-Poma guys work at Mount Snow this summer, with how they build a lift its almost seems like the longest portion is the site prep and concrete work.  The way that L-P ships the lift for install, once the parts arrive on site its not very long until the haul rope is hung and the chairs are spinning!  Just a really coool thing to watch how they go together!


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## xwhaler (Dec 15, 2011)

Lift looks real nice. 
I just booked a condo at Burke for my wife and I's 1st ever trip to the mtn. We are heading up the 2nd wknd in March. RSNE 2 for 1 tour that Saturday and vouchers for Sunday.
Having heard Burke compared to Saddleback in terms of terrain, vibe, crowds (lack of) etc. I'm really looking forward.

Burke is one of only 5 mtns in New England over 2k vert that I haven't yet skied so this should be a super trip.
Hoping the woods are still in good shape 2nd wknd in March--thinking they should be if winter ever gets going!


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## riverc0il (Dec 15, 2011)

xwhaler said:


> Having heard Burke compared to Saddleback in terms of terrain, vibe, crowds (lack of) etc. I'm really looking forward.


Definitely comparable. I like Burke a bit more than Saddleback. Both great low key mountains with good terrain and excellent vibe. Kennebago is a great area but skis a bit short.


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## MEtoVTSkier (Dec 16, 2011)

kingdom-tele said:


> lift passed load testing.  maybe they can offer some nice scenic rides while we wait for snow.



Not yet according to their Facebook page...



> *Burke Mountain Resort* Load Test Monday and Tuesday! Keep your fingers crossed and it should be open by Thrusday or FRiday!!!!
> 15 hours ago · Like


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## drjeff (Dec 16, 2011)

MEtoVTSkier said:


> Not yet according to their Facebook page...



FWIW load testing at Mount Snow for their new lift was a 3 or 4 day process by the time they put the lift through a miriad of scenarios to show that it was worthy.  On the outside it seemed to be quite a bit more involved than the re-certification load testing


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## thetrailboss (Dec 16, 2011)

I will be interested to hear how many new people go to Burke because of the lift.  I hope it does help business.


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## kingdom-tele (Dec 16, 2011)

MEtoVTSkier said:


> Not yet according to their Facebook page...



shold have said being load tested, my bad, nothing fell off so I jumped the gun I guess.

how's bick rock doing?


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## MEtoVTSkier (Dec 16, 2011)

kingdom-tele said:


> shold have said being load tested, my bad, nothing fell off so I jumped the gun I guess.
> 
> how's bick rock doing?



Nothing yet, they pushed opening off yet one more week...  They keep trying to get some man-made down, but Mother Nature isn't co-operating, even this far North. 

http://www.facebook.com/bigrock.ski.area

Hope this weather turns around soon, I really want to take a trip to Burke. Haven't been since the 80's, the next to last year the summit lift was a double I think.


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## riverc0il (Dec 18, 2011)

Just noticed that the snow report link on Burke's web site (very hard to find, BTW) goes to Snocountry.

W-T-F :blink:

They are too lazy to have their own snow report with more details than Snocountry's template can provide? How about a lift and trail report? Their old PDF was good but still lacking compared to other mountains. This is a SERIOUS step backwards, IMO.


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## thetrailboss (Dec 18, 2011)

riverc0il said:


> Just noticed that the snow report link on Burke's web site (very hard to find, BTW) goes to Snocountry.
> 
> W-T-F :blink:
> 
> They are too lazy to have their own snow report with more details than Snocountry's template can provide? How about a lift and trail report? Their old PDF was good but still lacking compared to other mountains. This is a SERIOUS step backwards, IMO.



Lame.  The PDF worked for me, assuming it was updated.  Snowbird has a lame snow report as well and I Emailed them about it last week.  Got an Email from the VP of Ops   He said they agreed and were working on it.  The next day they implemented part of what I had suggested.  But yeah, in this day and age, a reliable website is make it or break it for ski areas...especially one like Burke that needs to see more visits.


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## from_the_NEK (Dec 20, 2011)

More Load testing today:

Burke Facebook picture gallery  Some really cool pics in here if you like the inner workings of a lift.


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## from_the_NEK (Dec 20, 2011)

Got out this weekend for some pictures. I hope to update my blog tomorrow.

Pic from my house with the setting sun reflecting off of the shiney new towers and summit terminal:






[/IMG]

Looking up the line:


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## billski (Dec 20, 2011)

thetrailboss said:


> Most folks on AZ are not their market for this product anyway.



I would agree when it pertains to the vocal minority.  There are thousands of lurkers (I've conversed with many via PM) who look to the forum for sage wisdom but then plot their own course.


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## drjeff (Dec 21, 2011)

from_the_NEK said:


> Looking up the line:



I just LOVE the look of the wood paneling on the "underside" of the drive terminals that Leitner-Poma did with their 2 VT installs this year!


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## thetrailboss (Dec 21, 2011)

drjeff said:


> I just LOVE the look of the wood paneling on the "underside" of the drive terminals that Leitner-Poma did with their 2 VT installs this year!



+ 1.  Very classy.


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## nekgirl (Dec 21, 2011)

riverc0il said:


> Just noticed that the snow report link on Burke's web site (very hard to find, BTW) goes to Snocountry.
> 
> W-T-F :blink:
> 
> They are too lazy to have their own snow report with more details than Snocountry's template can provide? How about a lift and trail report? Their old PDF was good but still lacking compared to other mountains. This is a SERIOUS step backwards, IMO.



Hello Rivercoil, 
please bear with us as we work through a few technical issues.  We have done a lot of improvements to our website, our shopping cart, emails, and other creative for this winter, and all with a  small team of excellent people.  and as I am sure you are well aware, with any growth, there are growing pains.   We apologize for your disappointment in our snow report link.  We still take pride in our snow reporting proceedures, honesty in snow reporting, and timliness of reporting in the AM.   if you would like daily morning updates, our email snow report which you can sign up for through our newsletter link, is the very first priority in the morning and gets sent out first thing, before anything gets updated.   Then, snocountry is second.    Just curuous, what does snocountry not have that you would like to see on a snow report?   We appreciate all input, so thanks for posting!   

Hannah Collins 
Burke Mountain Marketing
(nekgirl)


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## from_the_NEK (Dec 21, 2011)

Thanks for the response Hannah. A snow report with a trail by trail breakdown would be good. Currently, I cannot see what trails are open or closed on the trail map (I can on some computers but not on others). 

BTW,
I updated my blog with some pics of the lift from last Saturday. Hopefully I'll have some from the summit on Friday.


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## riverc0il (Dec 21, 2011)

Thanks for jumping in, Hannah! As from_the_NEK noted, a trail by trail and lift by lift report would be great. Almost all mountains have their own snow report page with these items. Most include trail conditions (groomed, snowmaking online, bumps, etc.). The old PDF snow report used to have these things as I recall. Also, it is always nice to have daily comments on the snow reports. 

My opinion here but Snocountry sucks. I've never seen a ski area web site snow report that didn't do it better than Snocountry.


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## oldtimer (Dec 21, 2011)

*Thanks Hannah*

Thanks for checking in.  I am with the others-   the old PDF was indeed better than the SnoCountry format.   

ALSO-  congrats to the entire Burke and Poma crew-   load test passed today and the lift is ready for use.

merry Christmas and I cannot wait to give it a whirl-


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## riverc0il (Dec 21, 2011)

from_the_NEK said:


> BTW,
> I updated my blog with some pics of the lift from last Saturday. Hopefully I'll have some from the summit on Friday.


Nice pics! Can't wait to ride that lift!


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## from_the_NEK (Dec 21, 2011)

It looks like the new lift lline (Rerun) is going to be fun too.


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## tarponhead (Dec 21, 2011)

from_the_NEK said:


> It looks like the new lift lline (Rerun) is going to be fun too.



You thinking it will be another fox's folly in character? Looks like less ledges though but hard to tell without more snow cover.


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## thetrailboss (Dec 21, 2011)

What is up with the platforms/decks I see in the field?


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## from_the_NEK (Dec 22, 2011)

thetrailboss said:


> What is up with the platforms/decks I see in the field?



Don't need Act250 approval to put up decks to show off location to potential buyers.

Burke Mtn - Camber Heights


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## from_the_NEK (Dec 22, 2011)

tarponhead said:


> You thinking it will be another fox's folly in character? Looks like less ledges though but hard to tell without more snow cover.



I think it will have its own character. It looks to be wider than Fox's and maybe even rockier.


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## oldtimer (Dec 23, 2011)

*Snow report*

Hannah-

today is the classic example of why SnoCountry is not OK.  We all know the weather has been incredibly challenging and the Burke team has been working really hard to get as much open as possible.  AND by watching what trails are open from one day to the next those of us who know the mountain can see how well that is going.  SnoCountry says 5 trails open.   WHAT 5 trails?

What is much more helpful with the old trail by trail report is to see the trend in terms of trails.   When we see the top part of Willoughby to lower training hill and the notes say they are blowing on lower foxes and Willoughby, we have a good idea what the next weekend or couple of days will bring in terms of terrain-  even if the notes do not spell out exactly what will be open when, we can make some educated guesses.

FWIW-   and Merry Christmas


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## psyflyer (Dec 23, 2011)

nekgirl said:


> Hello Rivercoil,
> please bear with us as we work through a few technical issues.  We have done a lot of improvements to our website, our shopping cart, emails, and other creative for this winter, and all with a  small team of excellent people.  and as I am sure you are well aware, with any growth, there are growing pains.   We apologize for your disappointment in our snow report link.  We still take pride in our snow reporting proceedures, honesty in snow reporting, and timliness of reporting in the AM.   if you would like daily morning updates, our email snow report which you can sign up for through our newsletter link, is the very first priority in the morning and gets sent out first thing, before anything gets updated.   Then, snocountry is second.    Just curuous, what does snocountry not have that you would like to see on a snow report?   We appreciate all input, so thanks for posting!
> 
> Hannah Collins
> ...



I liked the old pdf style on the former website which although not super technological it was great, detailed and frankly all I needed.  Although I am admittedly computer challenged I still do no know where the current snow report is or how to access this "snowcountry" report on your new website for example.   Either way pretty stoked we got 3-4 inches, seems pretty heavy stuff but I'll take it.


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## Telemechanic (Dec 23, 2011)

*to NEK Girl / Hannah*

Hannah

It took me a while to find the "Snow Report" and "Trail Map" links at the top of home page because the white characters don't show up well against any light colored background.  

The Trail Map's list of trails with their status (open / closed, snowmaking and grooming) contains everything I was looking for at a glance except new snow and base depth.

I use Snocountry for comparing open acreage (early season) and new snow but I've always gone to the area websites for more detail like the list of open trails.


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## thetrailboss (Dec 23, 2011)

I think what I like about the PDF and what has been done is that it is very detailed, specific, and is exactly what folks at the mountain are seeing.  In this day and age, more information is better.  It means more to folks to know exactly what trails are open, what specifically was groomed, what has seen snowmaking, and exact temps/weather/etc.  It is also great to get a no-bull narrative from someone about what is happening on the mountain...and that means up top too.  I'd like to see more pics and info from the upper mountain rather than someone stepping out onto the J-Bar slope and taking a picture.  It's hard when there is so much to do and so few people, but now with the new lift, show off the real goods at Burke.  

A mere summary on SnoCountry means little if anything to me.  40 trails open at one place is not the same as another.  I don't know what specific runs have been groomed (e.g. East Bowl groomed is completely different than when it is not, and some folks might be tempted to come up if they see it is one way or the other).  Also SnoCountry's info can be stale for some mountains.  

The interactive trail map is nice, but if it is going to reflect conditions, please keep it up to date.  There's nothing worse than a fancy interactive trail condition map that is not updated.....


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## Edd (Dec 23, 2011)

thetrailboss said:


> There's nothing worse than a fancy interactive trail condition map that is not updated.....



Quoted for truth...


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## psyflyer (Dec 24, 2011)

Word on the street is that today the new lift is spinning after lunch.  They will start with the willoughby in the morning and then move onto the new one.  This was the plan yesterday.  

Yesterday the riding was pretty good with that 3 inches or so of heavy, catchy snow which went well over the WROD.  The mt was open T2B, I even poached lower willoughby which was closed and with grass poking through the powder but rode excellent and never scraped the board once.  Its amazing how much of a difference three inches is to the overall riding experience.  Last night got down close to zero degrees so I expect today to be absolutely bomb-proof and not good.  Hopefully we get some more pow soon and life will be happy again.


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## thetrailboss (Dec 24, 2011)

I hope that they can get another route off the top open.  I see they are going to Dipper's next.  Did they regrade the upper part this summer?


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## from_the_NEK (Dec 24, 2011)

The new lift is sweet! I was on chair 6 or 7 when they opened it up at noon. There was barely a line at the launch. Then there was NO line the rest of the day. Of course it was just a single run off the summit and it was cold but it was fun. It was such a speed difference even though they were only running it at 3/4 speed (They have to slowly phase in the top speed of 1000+ ft/sec). At today's 750-800 ft/sec, the new lift is soooo much faster than the Willoughby quad and you were actually passing people riding the Poma! Report and pictures once I'm done with Chrismas stuff.


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## Masskier (Dec 26, 2011)

Today's paper

http://caledonianrecord.com/main.asp?SectionID=180&SubSectionID=778&ArticleID=72484


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## thetrailboss (Apr 24, 2012)

Bump.  Burke got its Act 250 Approval for the next phase of development, which is the 32-lot subdivision at MidBurke and other work:  

http://caledonianrecord.com/main.asp?SectionID=180&SubSectionID=778&ArticleID=77757



> [FONT=Verdana, Times New Roman, Times, Serif]*BURKE MOUNTAIN: Phase One Development Gets Act 250 OK*[/FONT]
> [FONT=Verdana, Times New Roman, Times, Serif]*Amy Ash Nixon*[/FONT]
> [FONT=Verdana, Times New Roman, Times, Serif]*Staff Writer*[/FONT]
> 
> ...


[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Times New Roman, Times, Serif]
[/FONT]


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