# Skiing Rag "Best Mtns in No. America"



## Smellytele (Aug 25, 2016)

Lucky I get this mag for free. It arrived today. I think they were trying to be funny with the Northeast section but it wasn't funny. The other sections maybe had 1 category that was funny, the NE one was mostly bashing ski areas in the NE. 
Also getting old and they have made the print abnormally small so they could get in more ads. One 1/4 to 1/2 page of text, 1/2 page of pictures, then at least 1 full page ad.


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## KustyTheKlown (Aug 25, 2016)

backcountry and powder are the only good ones. freeskier is ok.


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## Smellytele (Aug 26, 2016)

Didn't say I liked it. :lol: I never paid for it - it just comes free from going to the Boston Ski show.


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## skiberg (Aug 26, 2016)

I don't even subscribe to it anymore. They are just a shill for the advertisers. Who was #1in NA, Whistler?


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## Smellytele (Aug 26, 2016)

skiberg said:


> I don't even subscribe to it anymore. They are just a shill for the advertisers. Who was #1in NA, Whistler?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using AlpineZone


They broke it into sections of NA. So northern rockies, west coast, central rockies, So Rockies, NE maybe a couple of others.


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 26, 2016)

Smellytele said:


> Didn't say I liked it. :lol: I never paid for it - it just comes free from going to the Boston Ski show.



Hmm where's mine then? I don't usually get issues prior to the show.. although sometimes they toss me a couple issues back to back right after the show.

I will say they had a good article breaking down many of Cannon's secret stashes and sidecountry last year. I've never skied Cannon but feel better prepared to spend my time wisely when I do go.


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## BenedictGomez (Aug 26, 2016)

The worst part of these "Northeast Skiing" lists, is that it's typically very obvious that the writer was born and raised in the west and has never spent a day skiing east of the Mississippi in his/her life.

Sometimes the errors are so egregious it's embarrassingly obvious.


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## Smellytele (Aug 26, 2016)

While the others listed good things about places the NE part talked about best cluster Fuck - Saddleback. While calling Wildcat the best scenic they say but don't worry it is very tame. Of course there was some category bashing Burke and Jay. No mention of the cluster of Park City. There were others as well just don't have it in front of me right now.


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 26, 2016)

And yet forsaking the requisite mentions of small vertical, low snowfall totals and ice?


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## Jully (Aug 26, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> And yet forsaking the requisite mentions of small vertical, low snowfall totals and ice?



My favorite is how people talk and talk about ice.


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 26, 2016)

Jully said:


> My favorite is how people talk and talk about ice.



As if they are unaware that conditions such as boilerplate, death cookies, hard-pack, dust on crust, and re-freeze slush are far more prevalent anyway.

Less talk, more skiing ice.


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## thetrailboss (Aug 26, 2016)

Smellytele said:


> Lucky I get this mag for free. It arrived today. I think they were trying to be funny with the Northeast section but it wasn't funny. The other sections maybe had 1 category that was funny, the NE one was mostly bashing ski areas in the NE.
> Also getting old and they have made the print abnormally small so they could get in more ads. One 1/4 to 1/2 page of text, 1/2 page of pictures, then at least 1 full page ad.



Interesting.  I will have to see what they said.  I also love how they always insert a western ski resort ad in the "Northeast" section and how for a while now SKI runs the same articles as SKIING.  I think the latter has stopped.


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## dlague (Aug 26, 2016)

Jully said:


> My favorite is how people talk and talk about ice.





bdfreetuna said:


> As if they are unaware that conditions such as boilerplate, death cookies, hard-pack, dust on crust, and re-freeze slush are far more prevalent anyway.
> 
> Less talk, more skiing ice.





bdfreetuna said:


> And yet forsaking the requisite mentions of small vertical, low snowfall totals and ice?



You are talking about ice and I was at another forum and started laughing about someone's statement about early snow and ice



> Or even worse stick around just enough to complete ruin the integrity of the snow pack... but that always happens in Colorado anyways



They do not seem to have much knowledge of eastern skiing!


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## thetrailboss (Aug 26, 2016)

KustyTheKlown said:


> backcountry and powder are the only good ones. freeskier is ok.



Agreed.  Ski Journal is also good.  That said, ski mags this time of year is like pizza: even bad pizza is good.


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## 4aprice (Aug 26, 2016)

dlague said:


> They do not seem to have much knowledge of eastern skiing!



But in reality why should they?  Sorry. I still live in the east and will still deal with it but I'll take west over east every time.  Ice, bone chilling temps, rain or just cloudy ugly weather (NE at least 50% of the time) vs dry snow, comfortable temps, and sunshine (or nicely replenishing the snow when it storms).  Like the surfer,  you can surf on the east coast in the Atlantic but the real fanatic heads west to the Pacific.  I've skied NE and Europe too, but the promise land of skiing to me remains Colorado/Utah.

Alex

Lake Hopatcong, NJ


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## benski (Aug 26, 2016)

4aprice said:


> But in reality why should they?  Sorry. I still live in the east and will still deal with it but I'll take west over east every time.


But nobody is paying you to write about east cost ski areas.


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## cdskier (Aug 26, 2016)

The pathetic east coast coverage was a big reason I stopped subscribing to both Ski and Skiing several years ago. Years ago their east coast coverage used to be better it seemed.


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## 4aprice (Aug 26, 2016)

benski said:


> But nobody is paying you to write about east cost ski areas.



True.  Wasn't looking at it from the reviewing point of view.  I kind of reacted to people cheering on ice something I deal with here, not enjoy.  Last year left a real bitter taste to eastern skiing as face it, It Sucked.  I appreciate the challenge of skiing ice, I raced as a kid, and after 50 seasons of skiing I've seen enough ice and hard conditions,(Pocono Pavement and S^&T like that) I'm sick of them.  It gets harder and harder to leave each time I'm out there and I can't wait to get out of this hell hole, NJ.  I'm sure if we get good snow this year my attitude will change.  I am really happy with the selection of a pass I bought and look forward to weekends with the wife as empty nesters up in VT/NH.  I'm certainly not saying that I think eastern skiing sucks, (born and raised on it) but with family in the Salt Lake and Denver areas I plan on a lot more of touring between the two.   

Alex

Lake Hopatcong, NJ


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## dlague (Aug 26, 2016)

cdskier said:


> The pathetic east coast coverage was a big reason I stopped subscribing to both Ski and Skiing several years ago. Years ago their east coast coverage used to be better it seemed.



It was like that last year.  Started reading Eastern ski resort write ups and felt let down or disagreed with the writers remarks.

Have not seen this year's yet.


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## Jully (Aug 26, 2016)

4aprice said:


> True.  Wasn't looking at it from the reviewing point of view.  I kind of reacted to people cheering on ice something I deal with here, not enjoy.  Last year left a real bitter taste to eastern skiing as face it, It Sucked.  I appreciate the challenge of skiing ice, I raced as a kid, and after 50 seasons of skiing I've seen enough ice and hard conditions,(Pocono Pavement and S^&T like that) I'm sick of them.  It gets harder and harder to leave each time I'm out there and I can't wait to get out of this hell hole, NJ.  I'm sure if we get good snow this year my attitude will change.  I am really happy with the selection of a pass I bought and look forward to weekends with the wife as empty nesters up in VT/NH.  I'm certainly not saying that I think eastern skiing sucks, (born and raised on it) but with family in the Salt Lake and Denver areas I plan on a lot more of touring between the two.
> 
> Alex
> 
> Lake Hopatcong, NJ



I guess what irks me is that the reviews tend to leave out the aspects that are truly unique about eastern resorts instead of wannabe western resorts. It's clear the reviewers haven't skied at those resorts before a lot of the time. If it were an Eastern skier critiquing the resorts, then I'm fine with that! But at least know what you're talking about.


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 26, 2016)

I'm pretty grateful to live where I do. Easy access up 91 and 89. Adirondacks, NH, Maine, and Canada townships are all in play. And Berkshire East and Mt Snow real close by. A full spectrum of snow(ice) conditions that really make you appreciate the good days. I manage to make a lot of good days. Plenty of terrain to push my limits, true extreme skiing to be found either on- or just off-map at numerous resorts. Enough mountains that there's something for a variety of tastes. Tightest tree skiing found anywhere.

All other things equal I'd have a hard time moving anywhere else just for the skiing. Besides 1 hour north from where I am now. Where else in the world is there this much skiing for a weekend warrior?


edit: Uinta Detour Double IPA 9.5% ftw


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## Rikka (Aug 26, 2016)

I didn't find it funny either. It seemed like it was written by a 15 year old .


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## dlague (Aug 26, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> I'm pretty grateful to live where I do. Easy access up 91 and 89. Adirondacks, NH, Maine, and Canada townships are all in play. And Berkshire East and Mt Snow real close by. A full spectrum of snow(ice) conditions that really make you appreciate the good days. I manage to make a lot of good days. Plenty of terrain to push my limits, true extreme skiing to be found either on- or just off-map at numerous resorts. Enough mountains that there's something for a variety of tastes. Tightest tree skiing found anywhere.
> 
> All other things equal I'd have a hard time moving anywhere else just for the skiing. Besides 1 hour north from where I am now. Where else in the world is there this much skiing for a weekend warrior?
> 
> ...



New England does have a lot of options.  Used to live in NH with Pats Peak Gunstock and Ragged all within 45 minutes.  With just over 2hrs we had like 40 ski areas to choose from.  In Colorado there are something like 27 total but very spread out with a concentration around Summit County.  The only difference 6 ski areas in and around Dillon make up more acreage than all of New England.


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## snoseek (Aug 27, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> I'm pretty grateful to live where I do. Easy access up 91 and 89. Adirondacks, NH, Maine, and Canada townships are all in play. And Berkshire East and Mt Snow real close by. A full spectrum of snow(ice) conditions that really make you appreciate the good days. I manage to make a lot of good days. Plenty of terrain to push my limits, true extreme skiing to be found either on- or just off-map at numerous resorts. Enough mountains that there's something for a variety of tastes. Tightest tree skiing found anywhere.
> 
> All other things equal I'd have a hard time moving anywhere else just for the skiing. Besides 1 hour north from where I am now. Where else in the world is there this much skiing for a weekend warrior?
> 
> ...


Just for skiing?

Idk just about city like SLC, Reno or Denver would blow anywhere in Massachusetts out of the water for a weekend warrior lets be real here. 

With that said im skiing nh the next couple years and will find enjoyment, lots of it....but don't think for a minute I wouldn't rather be skiing west.


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 27, 2016)

Yeah just for skiing. I like narrow trails and mixed hardwood trees. Bowls and wide open stuff doesn't do much for me. Granted there are hugely impressive mountains out west... Bachelor, Big Sky, Jackson... and Colorado has definitely got it going on. Maybe if all Colorado were accessible like we have it here.


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 27, 2016)

I'm going to Tahoe this season but it's partially to visit family so I figure might as well ski 5 days at different places. They look like nice mountains and some with good woods skiing too.

I'll let you know after the 2nd week in March. Squaw Valley terrain for example does't even appeal to me so it's probably not making the 5-mountain cut.

I was gonna go to SLC last season but I was hardly that stoked so decided to save it. I really do want to ski Bachelor though.


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## deadheadskier (Aug 27, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> Squaw Valley terrain for example does't even appeal to me.



To each their own, but this might be the first time these words have ever been said.  

Not saying it's at the top of my list for Western mountains to try, but I'm sure I'd like it better than any area in the East.


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## Edd (Aug 27, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> I'll let you know after the 2nd week in March. Squaw Valley terrain for example does't even appeal to me.



It's not the go-to area for trees and it's a bit crowded (Northstar and Heavenly feel more crowded) but I consider Squaw mandatory for a first visit to Lake Tahoe.


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 27, 2016)

Tentative list is Heavenly(staying at the base).. Mt Rose(looks like nice chutes).. Sierra at Tahoe and Homewood(trees and trees) and Alpine Meadows (looks more fun and low key than Squaw to me).

Open to all suggestions but I've researched a lot.


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## snoseek (Aug 27, 2016)

If you like steep terrain rethink squaw.

You're into trees so I suggest sierra at tahoe and mott/killebrew and firebreak at heavenly. This is some of the best tree skiing I've ever had. Ill be missing tahoe this year big time....


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## jimk (Aug 27, 2016)

BDFREETUNA, I love your attitude.  Mountain loyalty is a beautiful thing and appreciating what you've got in life makes it all worthwhile.  I've skied all over the country and it's trite, but IT'S ALL GOOD.  (Maybe not if you happen to catch an all day soaker rain, or a windy day with -15 air temp??)  Don't know where you are going, but Tahoe has some great mtns with a really interesting snow-meets-desert feel to them.  I'm guessing you are going to North Lake Tahoe area??  Let me show you a few pics from there.  Skier in many pics is my son.

Alpine Meadows - backside of mtn, everything in this pic is within ski area boundaries, but you'd have to do a long hike to get to far hillside:






Squaw Valley - Granite Chief is a trail pod with steeps, cliffs, bumps, trees, groomers - you could spend the rest of your life skiing this one lift: 




more pics:  http://www.epicski.com/a/squaw-valley-alpine-meadows-a-pictorial

Sugar Bowl - Silver Belt trail is the gulch in the upper middle of photo, super interesting advanced terrain all around this part of the mtn (famed Palisades chutes are 1/4 mile to lookers right of this pic):




more pics http://www.epicski.com/a/sugar-bowl-ca-a-pictorial

Homewood is a small Tahoe afterthought that those from my part of the country would kill to have near us.  This is Quail Face area, THE best view of Lake Tahoe:




more pics http://www.epicski.com/a/homewood-ca-a-pictorial

It's kind of a pain to incorporate Mt. Bachelor in a ski trip to Tahoe because it's about eight hours drive north, but I did and it was an unforgettable scenic gem. this was taken on the amazing offpiste down the backside of Mt. B:




more pics http://www.epicski.com/a/mt-bachelor-a-pictorial

Oops, you posted while I was typing.  I'll look for some shots from Heavenly, S-A-T, Mt. Rose.  You should check out Kirkwood too if you're in SLT.  Listen to Snoseek, he's far more knowledgeable on Tahoe than me.  I just have some pics 8)


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 27, 2016)

Nice pics Jim! Read your Bachelor page too. I think Bend is in the cards for 2017/2018.

Jim we are staying at the base of Heavenly, which is one reason Heavenly is on the list. I do like the looks of their terrain too, seems like a bit of everything. I'll be skiing mid-week so hopefully crowds won't be so bad.

There are a few mountains that almost made the cut... Kirkwood would probably be next. And it would then knock out either Sierra-at-Tahoe or Homewood. Out of those 2 which is better?

Snoseek... I like steeps, but I much prefer steeps with trees. I actually get vertigo sometimes if it's really steep and there's no trees around. Not my favorite feeling and really screws me up. The more trees around the less chance of that happening no matter how steep it gets. Some kind of visual thing, I guess.

The other factor is that I'll be skiing with my wife so what's challenging for me could be very challenging for her.


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## jimk (Aug 27, 2016)

Got to ski Heavenly several days if you're staying right there.  It's real pretty, but can be busy.  Weekdays might help you with that.  SAT is famous for the trees, see here for pics:  http://www.epicski.com/t/116972/sierra-at-tahoe-1-10-13-powder-day
Kirkwood would be easier daytrip from SLT than Homewood.  Kirkwood is better and bigger than Homewood, except no pretty views of the Lake.
You will have a blast.  SLT is good for apres-ski for you and wife.


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## machski (Aug 27, 2016)

Re-think the now Squaw plan, especially if you are skiing with others of mixed abilities.  My wife and I stayed right at the Embassy by the Heavenly Gondola so skied majority there but drove up and did 2 days at Squaw.  When we go back we will stay at Squaw instead and skip Heavenly completely.  Mott and Kilbrew are fun and some challenge (Kilbrew more than Mott due to a bit better vert) but you will see they are isolated from other terrain.  When we split up, it was literally 45 minutes before we could meet back up.  Squaw, on the other hand, we could ride the same lift, I could go on way toward crazy steeps, she could go another way to a groomer (some off KT-22 and Silverado are still very steep but buffed) and meet at the bottom and ride back up together.  The only lift there not like that was Granite Chief.  Overall, Squaw kicked Heavenly's butt in my opinion.


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 27, 2016)

I think Mt Rose is the furthest from SLT and that's just about an hour. That's peanuts.

I think my wife could do Mott from what I've seen on YouTube. That and the chutes at Mt Rose. Maybe not the most difficult ways down, but one or another line in the general vicinity.

So, 5 days, here's how attached I am to each one..

Heavenly: 100%. Staying at the base plus I have the itch to ski it.
Sierra-at-Tahoe: 90%. I hear the trees are something special.
Alpine Meadows: 90%. I do want the "wide open bowl" experience and this looks as good as any.
Mt Rose: 70%. Looks really fun chutes to me but I could be swayed.
Homewood: 70%. Trees look good but I could be swayed.

So at the expense of Mt Rose / Homewood

I am hearing I should ski Squaw on of those days instead. I think Kirkwood would be the other obvious choice.

So, in theory:

Heavenly
Squaw
Kirkwood
Sierra-at-Tahoe
Alpine Meadows / Homewood (wild card day, depends on weather and what we feel like skiing)

Does that sound like a more proper Tahoe experience? I feel bad leaving out Mt Rose for some reason. There's always a chance due to convenience and the fact we're doing 5 days in a row that Heavenly will get 2 days and knock another one off the list.


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## Smellytele (Aug 27, 2016)

How did this turn into a Tahoe thread?


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## jimk (Aug 27, 2016)

Smellytele said:


> How did this turn into a Tahoe thread?



LOL.

My fault I think. 

Quickly - Tuna, how many ski days and what airport?  If 5 days and Reno, then since staying SLT maybe 2 or 3 at Heavenly, one each at SAT and Kirk, maybe one at Rose (coming or going to Reno)??  Save NLT ski areas for another time??

When I visited Bachelor, NLT and SLT I was on a 16 day trip and even then it was pretty hectic to pack them all in.


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## dlague (Aug 27, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> I'm going to Tahoe this season but it's partially to visit family so I figure might as well ski 5 days at different places. They look like nice mountains and some with good woods skiing too.
> 
> I'll let you know after the 2nd week in March. Squaw Valley terrain for example does't even appeal to me so it's probably not making the 5-mountain cut.
> 
> I was gonna go to SLC last season but I was hardly that stoked so decided to save it. I really do want to ski Bachelor though.



Sounds like me a few years ago!  Was anti western skiing and felt I had all I need in New England until we skied Banff.  Then we thought about it and decided that I should find a job in a ski destination state and Colorado was it.  Love it so far not just for skiing.  We have gotten into hiking, biking, fly fishing, and much more all with no bugs.  Oh and no humidity.



Edd said:


> It's not the go-to area for trees and it's a bit crowded (Northstar and Heavenly feel more crowded) but I consider Squaw mandatory for a first visit to Lake Tahoe.



Northstar and Heavenly are on our to do list due to out season pass.  Hope it is not too bad.


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 27, 2016)

dlague said:


> Sounds like me a few years ago!  Was anti western skiing and felt I had all I need in New England until we skied Banff.



I've already skied Sunshine Village and Lake Louise 

JimK... flying into Sacremento, I think. We have family moving there. So 2 days in Sacramento > 6-7 days in Tahoe (5 skiing) > 2 days back to Sacramento.


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## mriceyman (Aug 28, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> I've already skied Sunshine Village and Lake Louise
> 
> JimK... flying into Sacremento, I think. We have family moving there. So 2 days in Sacramento > 6-7 days in Tahoe (5 skiing) > 2 days back to Sacramento.



I think you should hit squaw but you will have alot of fun at heavenly. 


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## KustyTheKlown (Aug 28, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> Tentative list is Heavenly(staying at the base).. Mt Rose(looks like nice chutes).. Sierra at Tahoe and Homewood(trees and trees) and Alpine Meadows (looks more fun and low key than Squaw to me).
> 
> Open to all suggestions but I've researched a lot.



come on man. you go to tahoe, you ski squallywood. it's a mecca. it's shane. it's where this whole thing kind of took root in its modern form. 

and kirkwood is no slouch. 

sugarbowl is underrated. 

heavenly, sierra, homewood? you've chosen...poorly.


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## thetrailboss (Aug 28, 2016)

So back to the reviews.  Just skimmed through mine.  Wow.  It was like the writers thought they were doing Tweet articles--ridiculously short.  The Burke comment about powder days was nice...the other one was lame.  Not really of much use for folks.


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 28, 2016)

I got SKI and SKIING in the mail same day. SKI was at least worth looking at, if you could get past the 24-page Deer Valley ad. SKIING was an embarrassment unto itself.


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## thetrailboss (Aug 28, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> I got SKI and SKIING in the mail same day. SKI was at least worth looking at, if you could get past the 24-page Deer Valley ad. SKIING was an embarrassment unto itself.



Yeah if it wasn't for Deer Valley SKIING would have been gone a long time ago....


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## raisingarizona (Aug 28, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> Tightest tree skiing found anywhere.



That's a good thing?


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## raisingarizona (Aug 28, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> I'm going to Tahoe this season but it's partially to visit family so I figure might as well ski 5 days at different places. They look like nice mountains and some with good woods skiing too.
> 
> I'll let you know after the 2nd week in March. Squaw Valley terrain for example does't even appeal to me so it's probably not making the 5-mountain cut.
> 
> I was gonna go to SLC last season but I was hardly that stoked so decided to save it. I really do want to ski Bachelor though.



Ridiculous. Stop touching yourself.


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## dlague (Aug 29, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> Tightest tree skiing found anywhere.D





raisingarizona said:


> That's a good thing?



Right?  Did not catch that - Not a fan of bushwacking!  Although, I have skied some pretty dense woods here so far.



bdfreetuna said:


> I was gonna go to SLC last season but I was hardly that stoked so decided to save it.



Not stoked for SLC - OK!


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 29, 2016)

Ain't for everybody I guess. I don't find myself "bushwacking" on skis very often :lol:

Don't get me wrong there's a lot of western mountains on my bucket list and I've enjoyed what time I've had in the rockies. But going back to my point, I wouldn't choose anywhere but upper New England to be my main ski zone. This could very well change and I could easily see spending a decade or two of my life in western locations.

I'm far from bored with what we got around here though.


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## deadheadskier (Aug 29, 2016)

I love living in New England and there's plenty of great stuff to ski.  The best season since I started in 83 was 2000-2001 by far. I got 100+ days in at Stowe that winter.  I won't kid myself and say the best of my lifetime comes close to what's available out West in a normal year. 

The vertical, acreage, quantity and quality of snow, weather are all vastly superior.  I do love New England skiing, but skiing certainly isn't my primary motivator for living in New England.


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## 4aprice (Aug 29, 2016)

deadheadskier said:


> I love living in New England and there's plenty of great stuff to ski.  The best season since I started in 83 was 2000-2001 by far. I got 100+ days in at Stowe that winter.  I won't kid myself and say the best of my lifetime comes close to what's available out West in a normal year.
> 
> The vertical, acreage, quantity and quality of snow, weather are all vastly superior.  I do love New England skiing, but skiing certainly isn't my primary motivator for living in New England.



Ok so I will bring up a question I asked in the past and was a little taken back by the responses.  Just A little back ground, 2011 was good skiing spring.  Spent a very memorable day (perfect mix of quality snow, weather and company) at Killington with some friends from the home mountain Camelback, a day where the entire mountain was in play.  At the end of the day one member of the group made the statement that he thought it had been "world class skiing" so I asked the question of the board "Is New England world class skiing?"  My own answer "yes" because I believe while not as big and snowy, New England offers fine skiing that has its own challanged and flavor, and takes skill to master. Its not the same as the Rockies, Alps, Sierra etc, but has its own niche that it fills.  

Alex

Lake Hopatcong, NJ


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## deadheadskier (Aug 29, 2016)

Sure, world class skiing is available in the East; just not as frequent as what's available out west.


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 29, 2016)

I've had days at Berkshire East that were "world class skiing".

But if you want to be serious about it I think Sugarloaf, Sugarbush/MRG, Stowe, Killington, Whiteface, Jay are pretty ser biz when it's full on / good conditions.

Above treeline / alpine skiing is more rare here. Technical hardwoods tree skiing is more rare in other places. It's all good. Beautiful country we live in with huge variety. You won't find something like Breckenridge out here and you won't find something like Saddleback or Smuggs out west. Totally different experience, we're lucky to live in such a vast country with all this snowy geography and opportunity.


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## dlague (Aug 29, 2016)

Don't get me wrong, I have skied New England all of my life and have enjoyed it 100%.  I have also skied the Alps where places were really wide open and enjoyed that too.  I skied in Southern CA which reminded me of New England. 

However, I have always wanted to live in CO - just like the vibe from hear say.  I have a job that can be located just about anywhere so I took advantage of it.  Not because I am bored with New England but more out of interest.  Now that I am in CO, I have hiked more than ever - no black flies, mosquitos, ticks etc.  Did not hike much for that reason back east. Also hardly any humidity, people are super friendly, views are crazy good, there is boat loads to do.  We have been more active than ever.  Even lost about 12 pounds,

Now, our family is all in NE and that is hard.  Do miss the ocean somewhat but like the west coast more which is a quick flight on the weekend.  New England has a denser resort distribution than most places in the US which provides great opportunity for beginners with so many feeder hills and the are plenty of other ski areas for everyone else.

From a skiing perspective there are trees to ski that equal that of New England IMO and I only have skied 4 places here and have a total of 16 days in.  I think the best is yet to come.  Having skied here I think the snow is far superior due to more natural.  Heck Loveland stops making snow in November so the base never gets messed up.  What I find lacking here are the sub 400 acre places.  Also limited routes to the ski areas can be an issue but the locals have strategies.

World class?  I think there are many in that category.  SL, SR, JP, Stowe, Sugarbush, Killington and while NH has it share of ski area they are not in the same class as Vermont.


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## steamboat1 (Aug 29, 2016)

It's all good.


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## jimk (Aug 29, 2016)

steamboat1 said:


> It's all good.



A good day at Wildcat will make you forget why you ever wanted to fly West to ski. The trail layout features a legit 2,000 vertical feet of varied terrain imparting a genuine big mountain feel with long runs, dispersed crowds, and scenery unparalleled in the East.

This photo was taken at Wildcat about five years ago.  If anybody recognizes this guy let me know.  He was a friendly stranger I met on the hill and he agreed to let me take his picture.   I thought he had a look that would make for a great photo.


----------



## Scruffy (Aug 29, 2016)

We, I guess we'd need to define World Class Skiing to come to some consensus. 

To me, WCS is more that the average snow consistency/depth/texture of a region.

I'd say that there are not all that many WCS regions in the world, and that the NE USA is one of them, for reasons other than simply the occasional pow day.

WCS regions:

Western Canada
NE USA
Rockies USA
West Coast USA
Chile South America
Alps: Germany, Austria, France, Italy, Switzerland
Japan
New Zealand 

These are places people from all over the world travel to to ski.


----------



## BenedictGomez (Aug 29, 2016)

raisingarizona said:


> That's a good thing?



Yes.


----------



## deadheadskier (Aug 30, 2016)

Regarding trees east vs. west. I've only skied Colorado out West, but several times and about half the resorts in the state.  The big difference I see is that much of the tree skiing available out west is natural tree skiing vs. virtually all tree skiing in New England requires human intervention to be passable. 

 Even the areas of Northern VT that have well spaced hardwoods, there's still a ton of pucker brush between the trees the resorts or locals clear in the off season.   Evergreen forests in the East? Fuggetaboutit.  No such thing as a "natural" evergreen glade in the East.  That's one of the reasons VT has better tree skiing than NH.  Not only does VT get more snow, but there's a lot more hardwood forests that are easy to develop into passable trees.  

Contrast that to Colorado where you've got places like Steamboat with perfectly spaced Aspens and many more areas with perfectly spaced evergreen trees.  I won't really say that one is better than the other, but for those who like the often tighter Eastern glades, that's only the case because they've been made by man.


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## deadheadskier (Aug 30, 2016)

These are what NH trees look like without human intervention. They're almost impossible to enjoyably walk through nevermind try and link turns on skis.


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## Smellytele (Aug 30, 2016)

The higher elevation of some NH Mnts above the hardwoods in the scraggly evergreens make them shitty. as dhs shows above (although that is a birch in the front)


----------



## Savemeasammy (Aug 30, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> I think Mt Rose is the furthest from SLT and that's just about an hour. That's peanuts.
> 
> I think my wife could do Mott from what I've seen on YouTube. That and the chutes at Mt Rose. Maybe not the most difficult ways down, but one or another line in the general vicinity.
> 
> ...



I lived in Incline Village, and never made the trip to Mt. Rose.  It just didn't seem worth it.  Homewood?  Really?  C'mon, Tuna....  If you ski north Lake Tahoe, and you want to be challenged, Squaw is a must.  Period.  I was a pass holder at Alpine, and you will find plenty of challenge there as well.  If you are staying in south Lake Tahoe, then Kirkwood is a must.


Sent from my iPad using AlpineZone mobile app


----------



## deadheadskier (Aug 30, 2016)

The Birch trees are typically the first species to come in when there's a hole in the canopy.  They'll survive to grow big like that if evergreens fill in to block the wind.  Wildcat screwed up cutting Mountain Jag glade by leaving pretty much only the Birch trees and they got crushed by wind. Hence why that area has been roped off for several years now.  

That photo was taken out near T Brook.  I took a walk through there this summer to see if there's any areas off the main river gully that might be skiable.  As you can tell by the picture, the answer is No.  When I got out of there my arms and legs looked like I got attacked by a bobcat.


----------



## Smellytele (Aug 30, 2016)

Savemeasammy said:


> I lived in Incline Village, and never made the trip to Mt. Rose.  It just didn't seem worth it.  Homewood?  Really?  C'mon, Tuna....  If you ski north Lake Tahoe, and you want to be challenged, Squaw is a must.  Period.  I was a pass holder at Alpine, and you will find plenty of challenge there as well.  If you are staying in south Lake Tahoe, then Kirkwood is a must.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using AlpineZone mobile app



mt. rose is good when the lower evals are raining


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## Edd (Aug 30, 2016)

To be clear, even though I'm pushing Squaw, Sierra and Homewood are both excellent ski areas, IMO. Sierra's trees should be seen, for sure.


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 30, 2016)

Not even 100% sure we're doing Tahoe now. My wife and I were talking last night, it's basically a $3000 trip (plus 1 week of RCI time share usage @ ~30,000 points).

Having not bought tickets yet we could still back out of the time share with no penalty. Considering our options. We could take half of that $ and save it and put the other half towards trips to SL/SB(if it opens), Mont-St-Anne & Le Massif, Stowe/Smuggs, Whiteface/Gore.. 

Indecision time.


----------



## Jully (Aug 30, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> Not even 100% sure we're doing Tahoe now. My wife and I were talking last night, it's basically a $3000 trip (plus 1 week of RCI time share usage @ ~30,000 points).
> 
> Having not bought tickets yet we could still back out of the time share with no penalty. Considering our options. We could take half of that $ and save it and put the other half towards trips to SL/SB(if it opens), Mont-St-Anne & Le Massif, Stowe/Smuggs, Whiteface/Gore..
> 
> Indecision time.



That's definitely the biggest detractor for any western trip for me as well. The trips I've taken have been great, but going back is just so hard to justify the expense.


----------



## dlague (Aug 30, 2016)

deadheadskier said:


> These are what NH trees look like without human intervention. They're almost impossible to enjoyably walk through nevermind try and link turns on skis.



That is what I call tight trees - no fun at all!


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 30, 2016)

It's a fine line between lots of fun and no fun at all

(bolton valley - lost girlz)


----------



## dlague (Aug 30, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> Not even 100% sure we're doing Tahoe now. My wife and I were talking last night, it's basically a $3000 trip (plus 1 week of RCI time share usage @ ~30,000 points).
> 
> Having not bought tickets yet we could still back out of the time share with no penalty. Considering our options. We could take half of that $ and save it and put the other half towards trips to SL/SB(if it opens), Mont-St-Anne & Le Massif, Stowe/Smuggs, Whiteface/Gore..
> 
> Indecision time.



Any trip to wherever that involves flights, lodging, food, rental car, etc. is definitely going to cost more than going local or even doing local weekend trips.  Our Banff trip was expensive IMO when we went to CO it was about half the cost of going to Banff.  But the skiing at both was much better than the Northeast IMO.  to each their own.


----------



## deadheadskier (Aug 30, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> It's a fine line between lots of fun and no fun at all
> 
> (bolton valley - lost girlz)
> 
> View attachment 20599



I guess if you prefer slow, very calculated turns and frequent stops to reassess your line than something like that would be fun. 

I prefer trees with more flow that allow you to let your skis run more. 

Those trees remind me of a shot off Polecat at Wildcat that ive skied a couple of times for variety, but IMO don't flow well. 

The first half of this video has the trees I'm talking about. (Not my video)

https://youtu.be/5orjRDdMIdY


----------



## bdfreetuna (Aug 30, 2016)

Ah yeah I have seen that video of the woods off Polecat. Haven't skied it (been a long time since Wildcat) but it kind of reminds me of something like Chinclip woods at Stowe.

Another good example of that kind of thing is Exterminator Woods at Mt Ellen or Busted at Pico (left of Poma Line)

And yeah that's basically my favorite type of skiing, stuff like that, and then when it opens up eventually you can get a lot more speed going.


----------



## jimk (Aug 30, 2016)

No doubt long distance ski travel is expensive, esp. airfares, motels and food.  I guess one of the ways I rationalize my ski travel is by trying to keep costs down on things I can control.  I usually brown bag my lunch even at super upscale resorts.  I don't hesitate to stay at hostels when they fit my itinerary.  I follow threads like skiing on the cheap for helpful deals.  And I watch out for foolish extravagence.

Back in 2005 I was riding the super slow chair Galaxy chair at Heavenly and had plenty of time to chat with a young gentleman from Florida who was riding the chair with me.  He was visiting Heavenly for 10 days of skiing. He had also made it clear that he'd come to gamble at the famous nearby casinos of Stateline, NV.  I finally asked him bluntly, “up or down?”  The answer wasn’t pretty.  He was down enough to fund about five additional ski trips to Heavenly.  I guess that is one of the hazards or joys of a Heavenly vacation, depending on whether - Luck Be A Lady Tonight.


----------



## deadheadskier (Aug 30, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


>



Too each their own, but I wouldn't  call the first five minutes of that even skiing. (Didn't watch beyond that)  Long stretches of just side slipping, tree hugging and occasionally a turn made. 

But if it's what you like, go for it.


----------



## bdfreetuna (Aug 30, 2016)

deadheadskier said:


> I guess if you prefer slow, very calculated turns and frequent stops to reassess your line than something like that would be fun.
> 
> I prefer trees with more flow that allow you to let your skis run more.



Not everyone can be this guy  :lol:  (Mt Ellen footage)


----------



## deadheadskier (Aug 30, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> Not everyone can be this guy  :lol:  (Mt Ellen footage)



Impressive skiing


----------



## 4aprice (Aug 30, 2016)

dlague said:


> Any trip to wherever that involves flights, lodging, food, rental car, etc. is definitely going to cost more than going local or even doing local weekend trips.  Our Banff trip was expensive IMO when we went to CO it was about half the cost of going to Banff.  But the skiing at both was much better than the Northeast IMO.  to each their own.



I have always found the trip out west to be worth the money spent.  Skiing wise you can't top it.  Another factor for me is the weather.  Its great skiing in nice weather then coming down the mountain (particularly in SLC,  but in Denver too) to even nicer weather. We've now set ourselves up to where our housing and transportation needs are set up in both cities saving us a bundle when we go out. Got my Max Pass tickets too.

Alex

Lake Hopatcong, NJ


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 30, 2016)

4aprice said:


> I have always found the trip out west to be worth the money spent.



Hope so. Wife says "Let's go to Tahoe!"

I'll take that as an affirmative and order our Ski Lake Tahoe 6-pack tickets in the next couple days.

The Lake Tahoe Six-Pack includes:
 • 1 ticket valid at Heavenly, Kirkwood or Mt. Rose–Ski Tahoe
 • 1 ticket valid at Heavenly or Sierra-at-Tahoe® Resort
 • 1 ticket valid at Sierra-at-Tahoe® Resort or Kirkwood
 • 1 ticket valid at Squaw Valley, Alpine Meadows or Mt. Rose–Ski Tahoe
 • 1 ticket valid at Squaw Valley or Northstar California
 • 1 ticket valid at Alpine Meadows or Northstar California

$887.95 for 2 6-packs

So based on these tickets we'll do Squaw Valley, Alpine Meadows, Mt. Rose, Kirkwood, Sierra-at-Tahoe, and Heavenly (with possibility of 2 days at Heavenly at the expense of either Kirkwood or S-a-T if we get lazy)

She also says don't worry we can ski all we want not including Tahoe


----------



## abc (Aug 30, 2016)

I thought Squaw "terrain doesn't even appeal" to you, why go there? :roll:

The same holds true for Alpine too. It's just a smaller version of Squaw.:evil:



> with possibility of 2 days at Heavenly at the expense of either Kirkwood or S-a-T if we get lazy)


Yeah right, Heavenly over Kirkwood.


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 30, 2016)

I'm going out there to visit family, figure we'd ski some new mountains while we're at it.

Staying at the base of Heavenly so I could see doing a double header there out of convenience.

This is all mid week too so I'm not really worried about crowds at Heavenly or where ever.


----------



## dlague (Aug 30, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> It's a fine line between lots of fun and no fun at all
> 
> (bolton valley - lost girlz)
> 
> View attachment 20599



I do not consider that tight trees.  That looks fun!  In fact I can show you some great lines at Keystone from Dercum Mountain and also from North Peak or off Chair 8 or Chair 1 at Loveland or on the backside of Cooper.  It is not all open bowls.


----------



## bdfreetuna (Aug 30, 2016)

dlague said:


> I do not consider that tight trees.  That looks fun!  In fact I can show you some great lines at Keystone from Dercum Mountain and also from North Peak or off Chair 8 or Chair 1 at Loveland or on the backside of Cooper.  It is not all open bowls.



Those mountains are definitely in the plan for once-we-have-kids and they're-old-enough-to-travel / ski.


----------



## 4aprice (Aug 30, 2016)

dlague said:


> I do not consider that tight trees.  That looks fun!  In fact I can show you some great lines at Keystone from Dercum Mountain and also from North Peak or off Chair 8 or Chair 1 at Loveland or on the backside of Cooper.  It is not all open bowls.



Did someone mention the trees at Copper?







How about Arapahoe?






or Brighton Utah.






Lots of fun in the western trees.

Alex


Lake Hopatcong, NJ


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 30, 2016)

Looks good to me. This was me as a young un skiing Lake Louise. It's been a while for me gettin' out there.


----------



## dlague (Aug 30, 2016)

deadheadskier said:


> Too each their own, but I wouldn't  call the first five minutes of that even skiing. (Didn't watch beyond that)  Long stretches of just side slipping, tree hugging and occasionally a turn made.
> 
> But if it's what you like, go for it.



Yup skiing single track following someone else's bushwhack while moving about 2 MPH.  That is not for me!  Not because I cannot - it is just not fun.  Get some snowshoes and trek through the woods and it is about the same.


----------



## raisingarizona (Aug 30, 2016)

deadheadskier said:


> Too each their own, but I wouldn't  call the first five minutes of that even skiing. (Didn't watch beyond that)  Long stretches of just side slipping, tree hugging and occasionally a turn made.
> 
> But if it's what you like, go for it.



After seeing this video I can see where freetuna is coming from. Yup, Squaw Valley sucks. Why bother with it when you can traverse for 10 minutes straight to get to a low angle tree run at your home mountain?

But I don't want to piss too much in  his bowl of Cheerios, if freetuna enjoys that then more power to him. I saw a couple cool spots for a safety meeting in there at least.


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 30, 2016)

I said Squaw Valley sucks? I think I said Squaw's open bowl terrain without trees doesn't appeal to me, speaking as someone who's never been there. I'm sure I will enjoy it very much if nothing else to enjoy a completely different experience. Trees generally add to the fun, and I do like schmearing and sliding my way down single track as fast as I can do it. But yeah I don't see myself having a bad time at all in Tahoe.

Either way I'll post a nice lengthy trip report after skiing 6 mountains in Tahoe, give you a chance to work on your reading comprehension :lol:


----------



## thetrailboss (Aug 30, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> I said Squaw Valley sucks? I think I said Squaw's open bowl terrain without trees doesn't appeal to me, speaking as someone who's never been there. I'm sure I will enjoy it very much if nothing else to enjoy a completely different experience. Trees generally add to the fun, and I do like schmearing and sliding my way down single track as fast as I can do it. But yeah I don't see myself having a bad time at all in Tahoe.
> 
> Either way I'll post a nice lengthy trip report after skiing 6 mountains in Tahoe, give you a chance to work on your reading comprehension :lol:



Squaw has a lot of good terrain....trees included.


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## raisingarizona (Aug 30, 2016)

thetrailboss said:


> Squaw has a lot of good terrain....trees included.



They have way too much flow to em though.


----------



## jimk (Aug 30, 2016)

Heidi's Rock, neat but open woodsy area at Squaw, steep too:


----------



## MadMadWorld (Aug 30, 2016)

Only posers go to Squaw. Head to Northstar for the gnar


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## MadMadWorld (Aug 30, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> Looks good to me. This was me as a young un skiing Lake Louise. It's been a while for me gettin' out there.
> 
> View attachment 20600



Everyone knows about Sunshine but Lake Louise is hands down the better mountain unless you grade your mountain based on the number of clients sporting Bogner. I liked Sunshine a lot but I wish I spent more time at LL.


----------



## KustyTheKlown (Aug 30, 2016)

4aprice said:


> I have always found the trip out west to be worth the money spent.  Skiing wise you can't top it.  Another factor for me is the weather.  Its great skiing in nice weather then coming down the mountain (particularly in SLC,  but in Denver too) to even nicer weather. We've now set ourselves up to where our housing and transportation needs are set up in both cities saving us a bundle when we go out. Got my Max Pass tickets too.
> 
> Alex
> 
> Lake Hopatcong, NJ



this. friends in tahoe, denver, and slc + max pass + credit card airline miles = a very affordable way to ski a ton of days out west.


----------



## KustyTheKlown (Aug 30, 2016)

dlague said:


> I do not consider that tight trees.  That looks fun!  In fact I can show you some great lines at Keystone from Dercum Mountain and also from North Peak or off Chair 8 or Chair 1 at Loveland or on the backside of Cooper.  It is not all open bowls.



copper has most excellent long steep glades off of the super bee towards the double chair


----------



## BenedictGomez (Aug 30, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> It's a fine line between lots of fun and no fun at all
> 
> (bolton valley - lost girlz)



I love stuff like that.  Only 5 more months (4 if lucky).



MadMadWorld said:


> Everyone knows about Sunshine but Lake Louise is hands down the better mountain unless you grade your mountain based on the number of clients sporting Bogner. I liked Sunshine a lot but I wish I spent more time at LL.



The back bowls at Lake Louise are fantastic.  I'm thinking about taking an Easter trip out there this year given the fact East is soooooooo late in 2017, I figure Banff area will probably have about the best snow in North America.


----------



## Not Sure (Aug 30, 2016)

BenedictGomez said:


> I love stuff like that.  Only 5 more months (4 if lucky).
> +1
> 
> 
> ...



Back bowls are great on "Blubird "days

Sunshine has the best snow if the area hasn't seen snow for a while.


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## snoseek (Aug 30, 2016)

Squaw, Kirkwood, Alpine, Sugarbowl and Rose. That's where id be skiing in that order. Heavenly is only good if you really know how to navigate it...you really need someone to show you around or else you'll likely spend your time traversing crowded groomers and getting short low angle tree shots. Its got some wicked sidecountry stuff but as a visitor you should steer clear IMO.

Sierra skis a little short. Homewood skis short. Both are local areas when they just want to escape the tourist for a day.

Rose skis a little short but has some righteous terrain, plus that drier snow.

Kirkwood if you like to hike, vert aint much but it has some ripping lines and sits high

Squaw/Alpine are IMO the best Tahoe has to offer despite weekend shitshow


----------



## dlague (Aug 30, 2016)

BenedictGomez said:


> I love stuff like that.  Only 5 more months (4 if lucky).
> 
> 
> 
> The back bowls at Lake Louise are fantastic.  I'm thinking about taking an Easter trip out there this year given the fact East is soooooooo late in 2017, I figure Banff area will probably have about the best snow in North America.



Back bowls are where it is at at LL for sure.


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 30, 2016)

I remember liking the Ptarmigan area at Lake Louise a lot. And also the woods under the Goat's Eye lift at Sunshine. Hell's Kitchen and that area.

Thanks for the tips snoseek. I don't think I can do Sugarbowl on the 6-ticket combo pass but 4/5 on your list plus a day at Sierra and a day at Heavenly.

I'm pretty obsessive with the pre-game research, YouTubing various runs referencing the map etc. I'll probably end up bringing maps pre-marked with stuff I want to definitely hit at some of the larger places so I don't waste a day. I'm sure I'll be happy to rip some groomers though during the span on 6 days in a row skiing some tough mountains.

Not looking to hike and I'm thinking maybe spend 2 days to get to know Heavenly better (we're staying a short walk from the base).  I could do 2 days of Heavenly if I skip Sierra, Mt Rose, or Kirkwood.


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## dlague (Aug 30, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> I remember liking the Ptarmigan area at Lake Louise a lot. And also the woods under the Goat's Eye lift at Sunshine. Hell's Kitchen and that area.
> 
> Thanks for the tips snoseek. I don't think I can do Sugarbowl on the 6-ticket combo pass but 4/5 on your list plus a day at Sierra and a day at Heavenly.
> 
> ...



Goats Eye has some great steep bump runs and the trees closer to the bottom are fun.

Anxious to here about your trip.  Hoping to get out there too!


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## snoseek (Aug 30, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> I remember liking the Ptarmigan area at Lake Louise a lot. And also the woods under the Goat's Eye lift at Sunshine. Hell's Kitchen and that area.
> 
> Thanks for the tips snoseek. I don't think I can do Sugarbowl on the 6-ticket combo pass but 4/5 on your list plus a day at Sierra and a day at Heavenly.
> 
> ...



Don't even think about skipping Kirkwood...seriously give me a map of both Kirkwood and Heavenly and a half hour and ill point you in a direction that should make for perfect days there.


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## deadheadskier (Aug 30, 2016)

I'd takes snoseeks advice. No amount of youtubing and trail map viewing can add up to a high ability local who has years of experience in the region.


----------



## bdfreetuna (Aug 30, 2016)

snoseek said:


> Don't even think about skipping Kirkwood...seriously give me a map of both Kirkwood and Heavenly and a half hour and ill point you in a direction that should make for perfect days there.



Kirkwood looks like a blast from the videos I don't see that one getting cut. It looks like a good amount of fun/challenge without a bunch of mandatory 30' cliff drops. (which is one of the main reasons I'm trying to study Squaw carefully lol)


----------



## bdfreetuna (Aug 30, 2016)

deadheadskier said:


> I'd takes snoseeks advice. No amount of youtubing and trail map viewing can add up to a high ability local who has years of experience in the region.



no doubt! I was hoping for some good advice tossing a preliminary game plan out there. I'm pretty stoked to have 6 days to do this and that my choices aren't really limited by this Ski Lake Tahoe 6-pass.

And hey if Tahoe kicks so much butt that I'd rather move there to ski I won't mind saying!


----------



## thetrailboss (Aug 30, 2016)

Tahoe is great.  I love visiting.  But there are downsides--it's really expensive, gets crowded, and the last few years have had bad drought.


----------



## snoseek (Aug 30, 2016)

thetrailboss said:


> Tahoe is great.  I love visiting.  But there are downsides--it's really expensive, gets crowded, and the last few years have had bad drought.


I was always a south lake guy which I know is sorta the ghetto but I wouldn't consider the south shore all that pricy. I've got friends that rent little one bedroom apts for 650....I rented the bottom floor of a pretty sweet house for 400 everything included (utilities, weed, food booze)....Yeah I had roomates but also a back yard/hot tub ect.....Rent is higher in southern nh that south lake I'm my experience.

Crowded....oh man the weekends can SUCK!

Last winter delivered....previous years were dry as hell.

Its a special place to me but when I go back west in a couple years after my latest grind Ill most likely go elsewhere as I just cant deal with the feast/famine cycle of the Sierra. Also its just too warm.


----------



## 4aprice (Aug 31, 2016)

snoseek said:


> I was always a south lake guy which I know is sorta the ghetto but I wouldn't consider the south shore all that pricy. I've got friends that rent little one bedroom apts for 650....I rented the bottom floor of a pretty sweet house for 400 everything included (utilities, weed, food booze)....Yeah I had roomates but also a back yard/hot tub ect.....Rent is higher in southern nh that south lake I'm my experience.
> 
> Crowded....oh man the weekends can SUCK!
> 
> ...



Going to miss the great reports from the west this year.  Your "Gems of the West" was one of the best things I ever read.  Does your last comment indicate that we may look forward to your presence in Colorado and Utah after your stint back east?

Alex

Lake Hopatcong, NJ


----------



## snoseek (Aug 31, 2016)

4aprice said:


> Going to miss the great reports from the west this year.  Your "Gems of the West" was one of the best things I ever read.  Does your last comment indicate that we may look forward to your presence in Colorado and Utah after your stint back east?
> 
> Alex
> 
> Lake Hopatcong, NJ



Probably either Utah or the western slope. Its gonna be a couple years though which surprisingly enough I'm ok with.


----------



## KustyTheKlown (Aug 31, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> Kirkwood looks like a blast from the videos I don't see that one getting cut. It looks like a good amount of fun/challenge without a bunch of mandatory 30' cliff drops. (which is one of the main reasons I'm trying to study Squaw carefully lol)



there is literally a book regarding the most serious lines at squaw. and if you haven't seen gnar you should probably do so.


----------



## machski (Aug 31, 2016)

4aprice said:


> Did someone mention the trees at Copper?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Those are trees?  Looks like wide open boulevards to me!


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## machski (Aug 31, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> Not looking to hike and I'm thinking maybe spend 2 days to get to know Heavenly better (we're staying a short walk from the base).  I could do 2 days of Heavenly if I skip Sierra, Mt Rose, or Kirkwood.



Hmm, you might be a bit disappointed then.  Most of Squaw doesn't require hiking but if Palisades and some of the lines off Granite Chief are in your plans, a little hiking is needed.
Depending on the snow at Heavenly, you may be able to just traverse out of Kilbrew or you may have to hike if depths are low (I had to do both my trip out.  Early week you could traverse but the sun killed that by weeks end).  The only way out of Kilbrew is the traverse into Mott to catch the chair there.


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 31, 2016)

machski said:


> Hmm, you might be a bit disappointed then.  Most of Squaw doesn't require hiking but if Palisades and some of the lines off Granite Chief are in your plans, a little hiking is needed.
> Depending on the snow at Heavenly, you may be able to just traverse out of Kilbrew or you may have to hike if depths are low (I had to do both my trip out.  Early week you could traverse but the sun killed that by weeks end).  The only way out of Kilbrew is the traverse into Mott to catch the chair there.



I'm not sure if Palisades are in my plans.






I paid the price last year for air time. Banged up my knees, ended up wearing a brace to not end the season early. Screwed up my back as well. I def want to see about getting less banged up this season if possible.

10 feet is about as much as I like to drop into soft snow. Like that rock to the left of Red Line at Magic is about as big as I try to go. Also my wife will be with me and she's basically a brave intermediate, and I'm not going to ditch her to go do some famous line.

Seems like plenty of in-bounds & lift accessed terrain for challenge and variety considering it's a first visit anyway.


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## BenedictGomez (Aug 31, 2016)

machski said:


> *Those are trees?  Looks like wide open boulevards to me!*



It's always interesting how "tree skiing" means different things to different people.  To me it's relatively tight stuff that places like Jay Peak and Smuggler's Notch offers, to others it's more like intermediate cruising around widely spaced trees.


----------



## SkiFanE (Aug 31, 2016)

machski said:


> Those are trees?  Looks like wide open boulevards to me!



i went to Tahoe around 1994-5, so long ago I can't offer any helpful advice, memory is foggy. Except of the 3 ski areas we visited (Squaw, alpine meadows and Heavenly) we enjoyed Heavenly best. Got there 2 weeks after last snow, in Feb, so conditions at squaw seemed like what I'm used to in spring in East - sleep in and cement til 10.  THe snow banks were so huge, new sight for me - so it wasn't a snowless year - just nothing fresh. But heavenly seemed most fresh and less cement type.  

But my memories of heavenly - Mott/Killebrew canyon and massive refrigerator sized trees.  More open, but those trees were so different than eastern skiing I'm used to. Definitely got my heart pumping - but loved the place.  Can't remember much about squaw but the heavenly bowls (California side I believe) and Mott/Killebrew Are what stand out from that trip decades later.


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## jimk (Aug 31, 2016)

Love all the talk in this thread about Lake Louise and Sunshine.  Never been, but I might drive through that area in early March this winter.  Sadly was planning only one day at each on way to next destination (Whistler).  I could possibly add one day.  Which would you devote the extra day to?


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## dlague (Aug 31, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> I'm not sure if Palisades are in my plans.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Good for you!  So much focus is placed on extreme!  IMO it is fun sometimes but if you can enjoy all types of terrain and skiing, then there is more to do.  Many here, claim they are bored if the trees have no snow or bumps are not in great shape which is too bad.  I ski a lot with my wife and we like to mix it up.


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## dlague (Aug 31, 2016)

BenedictGomez said:


> It's always interesting how "tree skiing" means different things to different people.  To me it's relatively tight stuff that places like Jay Peak and Smuggler's Notch offers, to others it's more like intermediate cruising around widely spaced trees.



Even at Jay Peak Andres Paradise or Beaver Pond Meadow or Timbuktu I find to be relatively open glades/trees.  Then there is Kitz Woods (beginning) or trees around Tuckerman Chute that are much tighter and steeper.  

Now Cannon trees from the summit or the glades below Cannonball lift are real tight.


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 31, 2016)

Tree skiing is an umbrella term encompassing glades, manicured/cleared woods, and sidecountry/backcountry/bushwackery.

Although I'd say a trail that basically has a few trees here and there, like "The Glade" at Bromley, doesn't really qualify. To be tree skiing it should at least feel like you're in the woods.


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 31, 2016)

jimk said:


> Love all the talk in this thread about Lake Louise and Sunshine.  Never been, but I might drive through that area in early March this winter.  Sadly was planning only one day at each on way to next destination (Whistler).  I could possibly add one day.  Which would you devote the extra day to?



Tough call for me. I might do one of each and then see which I liked best for day 3.


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## dlague (Aug 31, 2016)

jimk said:


> Love all the talk in this thread about Lake Louise and Sunshine.  Never been, but I might drive through that area in early March this winter.  Sadly was planning only one day at each on way to next destination (Whistler).  I could possibly add one day.  Which would you devote the extra day to?



I liked Sunshine a bit more main because of Goats Eye and Look Out Mountain to skiers right.  Mount Standish has some playful drops but they are not long.  Lots of variety overall.  

The frontside of LL feels like skiing in NE - the backside is a whole different story - lots of bumps which can be fun too but I get beat up these days if that is all I do.


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## deadheadskier (Aug 31, 2016)

One thing that surprises me about Lake Louise is that they claim only 140" annual snowfall where as Sunshine claims 360". Does LL under report and SS over report or are these numbers pretty accurate?


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## dlague (Aug 31, 2016)

deadheadskier said:


> One thing that surprises me about Lake Louise is that they claim only 140" annual snowfall where as Sunshine claims 360". Does LL under report and SS over report or are these numbers pretty accurate?



Sunshine did seem to have more snow than LL by a long shot.  Not sure if SS is situated better but their top elevations are not much different.  Sunshine is better protected where snow comes over a ridge (upslope snow - kind of a Jay Cloud effect) compared to snow for LL comes across a valley.


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## Not Sure (Aug 31, 2016)

dlague said:


> Sunshine did seem to have more snow than LL by a long shot.  Not sure if SS is situated better but their top elevations are not much different.  Sunshine is better protected where snow come over a ridge (upslope snow) compared to snow for LL comes across a valley.



When I was there there was a "Chinook " wind . A wind blowing from the West off the pacific. The Chinook Arch as they call it was visible , basically a high lenticular cloud from horizon to horizon "Great Soaring condition" but that's another thread. Banff was in the 20's . Calgary was in the 40's .wind warms as it compress's droping out of the mountains.LL was almost bluebird , SV is back in the Mountains a little more , I thought it was a little higher elevation, we had a few squalls that left 4" each shot . I've never seen snowfall rates like that anywhere . I think SV benefits from the Chinook vs LL .


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## moresnow (Aug 31, 2016)

jimk said:


> Love all the talk in this thread about Lake Louise and Sunshine.  Never been, but I might drive through that area in early March this winter.  Sadly was planning only one day at each on way to next destination (Whistler).  I could possibly add one day.  Which would you devote the extra day to?



Keep driving and hit Kicking Horse and then Revy. Didnt get to Sunshine when I was out there, but KH and Revy were far more interesting than LL.


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## dlague (Aug 31, 2016)

moresnow said:


> Keep driving and hit Kicking Horse and then Revy. Didnt get to Sunshine when I was out there, but KH and Revy were far more interesting than LL.



We made it to Kicking Horse while at Banff.  The upper bowls are amazing.  They blow away SS or LL.  Only problem we had was the lower mountain did not have much snow but I did not care since we skied the bowls the whole time.  However, staying up top requires that you ski only one bowl of the three.  When you get ready to come down you can go off to skiers left.  If you choose to lap the Gondola you can ski the bowl to skiers right.  It is all good.


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