# Ski Sundown Mogul Clinic - 3/18/09



## Greg (Mar 18, 2009)

Good stuff today. Met up with our instructor, Ellen Shields around 3 pm. I'm trying to remember how the first few runs started. I think it was Ellen, Grassi, MR. evil and me. We picked up Brian, 180, MogulQueen, MrMagic, mondeo, and eventually johnnypoach towards the end. There were also several tag-alongs that joined in. I would be interested to know how they heard about the clinic. Lurkers perhaps?

Anyway, I'll let the others describe their personal experience, but basically Ellen worked evenly with everybody. You could tell she's done this quite a bit and was very pleasant, helpful and inspiring. The major focus for everyone was getting their vision up which translated into better extension which seemed to be the overall goal for most. However, she worked on some specifics with most everyone. Lots of progress was made by all and we practiced a few duels at the end of the session.

Anyway, I'll have more thoughts later, but I wanted to get the discussion started. Really great to see everyone make noticeable progress in a few short hours. We went right to 8 pm finishing with a few exercises in the lodge.

On an unrelated note, I was shocked at the amount of snow loss in one day. Startling actually. Closing tomorrow is warranted. I think there's enough snow to piece together a good product for Sunday, and perhaps the following weekend, but making April is going to be a little tough. But if anyone can pull it off, the mighty Sundown can; just might be a lot of threading the needle, which I love so I say bring it on!

Great experience today. Nice job everyone!


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## Grassi21 (Mar 18, 2009)

Great experience.  Thanks to Ellen for her time.  Lots of great tips.  I wish I could apply them all.  She did say it should feel weird.  And it did at times.  Very cool seeing the group grow during the session.  Wish I could have stayed for the duration.


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## Greg (Mar 18, 2009)

Grassi21 said:


> She did say it should feel weird.  And it did at times.



Ellen touched on a great approach and that is to almost exaggerate things. Getting us to focus on the reservoir was an example of that. I know it definitely got MR. evil to remove the focus from the bump he was approaching and relax. I think this afternoon was one of the first times he's ever really felt absorption because he wasn't expecting impact. Getting the vision up made Brian look like a totally new skier too.


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## gmcunni (Mar 18, 2009)

Greg said:


> Ellen touched on a great approach and that is to almost exaggerate things. Getting us to focus on *the reservoir* was an example of that.



what's "the reservoir"?


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## Greg (Mar 18, 2009)

gmcunni said:


> what's "the reservoir"?



The lake in the distance. Lake McDonough/Somerset Reservoir.


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## gmcunni (Mar 18, 2009)

Greg said:


> The lake in the distance. Lake McDonough/Somerset Reservoir.



 and here I'm thinking it was a part of a bump that i'd never heard of :dunce:

never mind...


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## Creakyknees (Mar 18, 2009)

Greg said:


> I think this afternoon was one of the first times he's ever really felt absorption because he wasn't expecting impact.



It's amazing if you describe something in a less barbarous matter how much it will help your skiing; such as absorption not impact, pole touch not pole plant, absorption not hit, flow not straight line, absorption not slam, stacked not lean, and many others. :grin:

Any photos or videos of the day?


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## bvibert (Mar 18, 2009)

What a totally awesome experience!  Thanks so much to Ellen for coming down and doing this!  WE had a very productive session with lots of good things to work on.  She covered a lot of ground in a short time, yet it never seemed overwhelming.

I was also really happy to see how impressed she was with Sundown and the mogul product that they put out.  This is someone who's been all over the world skiing moguls and she was genuinely impressed with our little local hill.  Just goes to show that they get it.  Sundown should be very proud of their accomplishments!

I had great fun today, and I hope that we can do it again sometime.  Hopefully Ellen comes down to watch the comp on Sunday, it's gonna be a lot of fun.


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## bvibert (Mar 18, 2009)

Creakyknees said:


> Any photos or videos of the day?



Way too busy learning stuff to be shooting any sort of media.


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## 2knees (Mar 18, 2009)

Greg said:


> I think there's enough snow to piece together a good product for Sunday,



i'm having a hard time responding to anything but this piece....

you think??????  it must be more then just the burnt out spots near the top.  

come on, chris will figure someway to fill it in.  Please tell me it'll happen!!!!


glad to hear it all went off ok.  i'm gonna be calling in the next day or so to siphon some of this stuff off you.


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## 180 (Mar 18, 2009)

2knees said:


> i'm having a hard time responding to anything but this piece....
> 
> you think??????  it must be more then just the burnt out spots near the top.
> 
> ...



Turn on the guns.  It will be cold enough.


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## 2knees (Mar 18, 2009)

180 said:


> Turn on the guns.  It will be cold enough.



low 20's for friday and saturday night........


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## Greg (Mar 18, 2009)

bvibert said:


> I was also really happy to see how impressed she was with Sundown and the mogul product that they put out.  *This is someone who's been all over the world skiing moguls and she was genuinely impressed with our little local hill.*  Just goes to show that they get it.  Sundown should be very proud of their accomplishments!



It's becoming very apparent to me that any skier worth their salt is impressed with our little hill. And agreed, Sundown should be proud this season. What a 40th!



2knees said:


> i'm having a hard time responding to anything but this piece....
> 
> you think??????  it must be more then just the burnt out spots near the top.
> 
> ...



Okay. The "piece" part is a bit of an overreaction, but honestly, the snow loss in one day was staggering. I have no doubt that the mountain overall and the bumps will be in good shape for Sunday. Reopening next Friday, the 27th should be no problem especially with the snow from the big air to work with at the base. Making April 4/5? That is going to be tough, I think, but I'm still hopeful, and I'll be there for closing day, come hell or high water.


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## o3jeff (Mar 19, 2009)

Sounds like everyone got something out of the clinic. I knew I should of worked harder to get out of my evening plans.

So which one of you are going to win the comp now? Sounds like Greg wants to win more for the trophy than the bragging rights!


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## Greg (Mar 19, 2009)

o3jeff said:


> So which one of you are going to win the comp now? Sounds like Greg wants to win more for the trophy than the bragging rights!



Goal is to simply qualify at this point. After that, we'll see what happens. I'm pretty happy with how my skiing has come together lately so I'm going in more confident. Don't get me wrong, I don't have any misconceptions about placing all that high, but I hope to get in a duel; two would be nice. I think that depends on whether there are 32 qualifiers. But really, who knows what rippers are going to show up and totally own us...


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## Madroch (Mar 19, 2009)

180 said:


> Turn on the guns.  It will be cold enough.



+1....


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## 180 (Mar 19, 2009)

What an amazing night.  I am still buzzing.  Ellen is an amazing coach who can find and fix your issues regardless of ability.  I am working on getting her down on Sunday, but a better time would be when we can all just ski and hang out like the following weekend.

The mountain is not open at all next week?  The bumps will melt away.....


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## Greg (Mar 19, 2009)

180 said:


> The mountain is not open at all next week?  The bumps will melt away.....



Closing Monday through Thursday. Gotta ski them back in on Friday!


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## gmcunni (Mar 19, 2009)

Greg said:


> Closing Monday through Thursday. Gotta ski them back in on Friday!



i understand the need to close it just really depresses me.


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## 180 (Mar 19, 2009)

We are just getting going.  I need another afternoon session during the week.


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## bvibert (Mar 19, 2009)

180 said:


> We are just getting going.  I need another afternoon session during the week.



I know, it sucks.  Unfortunately it's the way it seems to go around here as the skier visits drop off during the week..


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## MR. evil (Mar 19, 2009)

I am not sure even where to begin. First off Ellen is a great instructor and a really cool person. I really hope we can get her back for another clinic next season.

Yesterday was one of those break through days for me. We have all heard people talk about A&E, and until yesterday I thought I knew what A&E was, but I didn't. Ellen was able to put thos ations into words that just clicked. It was also kind of weird how where you are looking impacts your skiing. As mentioned by others already, Ellen really focused on getting all of us to look far down the hill while skiing; it was the major theme of the session. At first this was really weird and even scary at times. I usually look about 3 to 5 bumps in front of my skis and can see my tips in my peripheral vision. Going from that to looking 50 to 100 feet or more down hill was quite the change and took the better part of the evening to get. But that one little change made a lot of other things start to fall into place. For instance one of my big problems is that I am too stiff in the bumps. It’s hard to imagine, but just changing where I look when skiing (down hill vs. at my tips) really helped me get much looser which helped everything else. What I realized is that when I ski looking at my tips and focusing at the next bump. I was actually bracing for that next bump and tensing up preparing for impact. By looking forward I couldn’t see or prepare for that next bump and my body just naturally absorbed the bump staying much looser in the process. By being looser I was able actually absorb and stay forward (aka out of the back seat) which made it possible to start to extend down the backside of the bumps and keep my skis in contact with the snow. That made it possible to control my speed better which allowed me to start skiing a more direct line. Like I said, a lot of little pieces of the puzzle started to fall into place last night. Now it’s just a matter of putting all of that into practice in my everyday skiing.


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## MR. evil (Mar 19, 2009)

Greg said:


> Goal is to simply qualify at this point. After that, we'll see what happens. I'm pretty happy with how my skiing has come together lately so I'm going in more confident. Don't get me wrong, I don't have any misconceptions about placing all that high, but I hope to get in a duel; two would be nice. I think that depends on whether there are 32 qualifiers. But really, who knows what rippers are going to show up and totally own us...



If you keep skiing that you have the past several times I have been out with you, you will qualify easy. Like I said last night, you seem to be peaking this season right in time for the comp.


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## o3jeff (Mar 19, 2009)

Good stuff guys, you all should keep posting the tips you learned last night that really helped you for us fools that didn't make it.


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## bvibert (Mar 19, 2009)

o3jeff said:


> Good stuff guys, you all should keep posting the tips you learned last night that really helped you for us fools that didn't make it.



What would be the fun in that?  No more tips until _*after*_ the comp!


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## o3jeff (Mar 19, 2009)

bvibert said:


> What would be the fun in that?  No more tips until _*after*_ the comp!



We're not asking for tips on a dumper air(btw-was she able to help you perfect it?), just on skiing the bumps!


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## bvibert (Mar 19, 2009)

o3jeff said:


> We're not asking for tips on a dumper air(btw-was she able to help you perfect it?), just on skiing the bumps!



No, but she was able to perfectly describe how one ends up with a dumper air, she even had a different name for it.


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## Grassi21 (Mar 19, 2009)

MR. evil said:


> Yesterday was one of those break through days for me. We have all heard people talk about A&E, and until yesterday I thought I knew what A&E was, but I didn't. Ellen was able to put thos ations into words that just clicked. It was also kind of weird how where you are looking impacts your skiing. As mentioned by others already, Ellen really focused on getting all of us to look far down the hill while skiing; it was the major theme of the session. At first this was really weird and even scary at times. I usually look about 3 to 5 bumps in front of my skis and can see my tips in my peripheral vision. Going from that to looking 50 to 100 feet or more down hill was quite the change and took the better part of the evening to get. But that one little change made a lot of other things start to fall into place. For instance one of my big problems is that I am too stiff in the bumps. It’s hard to imagine, but just changing where I look when skiing (down hill vs. at my tips) really helped me get much looser which helped everything else. What I realized is that when I ski looking at my tips and focusing at the next bump. I was actually bracing for that next bump and tensing up preparing for impact. By looking forward I couldn’t see or prepare for that next bump and my body just naturally absorbed the bump staying much looser in the process. By being looser I was able actually absorb and stay forward (aka out of the back seat) which made it possible to start to extend down the backside of the bumps and keep my skis in contact with the snow. That made it possible to control my speed better which allowed me to start skiing a more direct line. Like I said, a lot of little pieces of the puzzle started to fall into place last night. Now it’s just a matter of putting all of that into practice in my everyday skiing.



Great summary.  I wish I could have stayed until the end.  I couldn't get over the fear of looking that far down the hill without blowing up or bailing.  I needs to practice!!!!!


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## Greg (Mar 19, 2009)

Grassi21 said:


> Great summary.  I wish I could have stayed until the end.  I couldn't get over the fear of looking that far down the hill without blowing up or bailing.  I needs to practice!!!!!



It's a good thing to practice on the flats. Don't blow off that stretch leading down to the bumps either. Use that time to get your vision up. I was doing that towards the end of the session instead of charging down to the top of the bumps and it really prepped me for what I knew Ellen was going to want from all of us and that's eyes up.


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## MR. evil (Mar 19, 2009)

Greg said:


> It's a good thing to practice on the flats. Don't blow off that stretch leading down to the bumps either. Use that time to get your vision up. I was doing that towards the end of the session instead of charging down to the top of the bumps and it really prepped me for what I knew Ellen was going to want from all of us and that's eyes up.



Great advice! I wasn't doing that until the very end of the night. Several times i think I heard you yelling at me to get my vision up on that section as I was charging down to the bumps


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## MR. evil (Mar 19, 2009)

Grassi21 said:


> Great summary.  I wish I could have stayed until the end.  I couldn't get over the fear of looking that far down the hill without blowing up or bailing.  I needs to practice!!!!!



I had to bail many times while working on this. I even blew up once while working on this in the money line. I was quite embarrassed; I lost a ski and kept sliding on my back about 4 or 5 bumps down hill. Ellen had to ski down to get my ski for me..


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## powhunter (Mar 19, 2009)

Sounds like a lot was learned!!  Talked to Jp over a few beers last night and he was talking about how Ellen was really focusing on skiing on the balls of your feet, also there were some conditioning drills...can anyone expand on that??

steveo


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## gmcunni (Mar 19, 2009)

this thread sucks. I'm so jealous!!


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## Greg (Mar 19, 2009)

BTW, Ellen replied to my Email thanking her last night and said she was indeed impressed with Sundown setting up a run like that. She also said she "had a ball" and would be honored to come back next year.


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## MR. evil (Mar 19, 2009)

Greg said:


> BTW, Ellen replied to my Email thanking her last night and said she was indeed impressed with Sundown setting up a run like that. She also said she "had a ball" and would be honored to come back next year.



She was so impressed with Gunny that she took a couple of pictures from the bottom of the trail with her phone and emailed it off to a bunch of her WC mogul skiing friends.


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## MR. evil (Mar 19, 2009)

Wired..... a little while ago I saw that 180 had responded to this thread, I clicked the link in the email to see his responce its not here.


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## 2knees (Mar 19, 2009)

bvibert said:


> No more tips until _*after*_ the comp!




so you'll fill me in after your qualifying run?  :razz:


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## bvibert (Mar 19, 2009)

MR. evil said:


> Wired..... a little while ago I saw that 180 had responded to this thread, I clicked the link in the email to see his responce its not here.



I guess he didn't want you to see his response, I'm not sure why but he deleted it.


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## bvibert (Mar 19, 2009)

2knees said:


> so you'll fill me in after your qualifying run?  :razz:



Yes, exactly!


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## Ellen Shields (Mar 19, 2009)

Hi You Guys!
I just joined the site, and I have been bragging about your hill to anyone who will listen to me! I think you should host a World Cup next season (may not be the steepest) but it is definetly the longest and most fun course ever!. US Team member Dave Babick does not stand a chance against you all.
I had a ball and thank you so much for the terrific feedback. I have gotten far from the coaching sector this year due to my other job. All of you insopired me, and made me realize how much fun the entire journey of the sport is. All of it, the comradirie, fitness, training, people, the jabbing-hee hee. It is all great. The friendships are the best part. In what sport can you know someone for only 4 hours and then ask if you can crash at their house??? Ha, Thanks to Jeanine and her husband for thier awesome hospitality. Thanks to you all, I slept about 20 straight hours after that course.
I wish you all the best this weekend, I will pray for the weather and the course to hold out. I have to travel for work and cannot make it. BOOOOOOOOOOOO
I welcome a return next season.  Sorry for the typos, I am a menace on the computer.
Cheers to all of you.
Ellie


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## Greg (Mar 19, 2009)

Ellen Shields said:


> Hi You Guys!
> I just joined the site, and I have been bragging about your hill to anyone who will listen to me! I think you should host a World Cup next season (may not be the steepest) but it is definetly the longest and most fun course ever!. US Team member Dave Babick does not stand a chance against you all.
> I had a ball and thank you so much for the terrific feedback. I have gotten far from the coaching sector this year due to my other job. All of you insopired me, and made me realize how much fun the entire journey of the sport is. All of it, the comradirie, fitness, training, people, the jabbing-hee hee. It is all great. The friendships are the best part. In what sport can you know someone for only 4 hours and then ask if you can crash at their house??? Ha, Thanks to Jeanine and her husband for thier awesome hospitality. Thanks to you all, I slept about 20 straight hours after that course.
> I wish you all the best this weekend, I will pray for the weather and the course to hold out. I have to travel for work and cannot make it. BOOOOOOOOOOOO
> ...



Noice! Welcome, Ellen. Stop by from time to time.


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## bvibert (Mar 19, 2009)

Nice to see you post Ellen!  Too bad you can't make it this weekend, you'll be missed.  I don't know about hosting a WC race at Sundown, but I'll be looking forward to your return next season.


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## 180 (Mar 20, 2009)

I've been really working on my vision everywhere.  Try it while you are at you computer.  Really helps your posture.


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## bvibert (Mar 20, 2009)

180 said:


> I've been really working on my vision everywhere.  Try it while you are at you computer.  Really helps your posture.



Good call, I was doing that yesterday, especially while walking around the factory.  However, when I just read this I was slouching heavily in my chair.  Thanks for the reminder!


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## o3jeff (Mar 20, 2009)

bvibert said:


> Good call, I was doing that yesterday, especially while walking around the factory.  However, when I just read this I was slouching heavily in my chair.  Thanks for the reminder!



What are you walking around with your nose up in the air:lol: How you going to find dropped money on the floor like that


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## bvibert (Mar 20, 2009)

o3jeff said:


> What are you walking around with your nose up in the air:lol: How you going to find dropped money on the floor like that



The people around here are way too frugal to be dropping money on the floor.


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