# Balsams Wilderness



## billski (Nov 6, 2011)

The 2011-12 season pass app is online.    Hmmmm

Inquiring minds want to know... are we in action?

Waiting for a response to a little query....


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## billski (Nov 8, 2011)

A ring to the hotel today was greeted by a prompt answer.  It reveals:  The staff have been told to plan for a December 23rd Hotel opening "unless told otherwise"..  They also expect to have skiing this winter.  They are taking "tentative reservations".   I smell a cut rate deal coming IF they do open.  Pay homage to Ullr...


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## xwhaler (Nov 8, 2011)

Possible good news! Thanks for keeping this active. I'd love to do a wknd up there this season. They have partnered with Golf and Ski warehouse before on their rewards card and some nice package offerings have been presented.


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## steamboat1 (Nov 8, 2011)

It would be nice if the ski area opened. Always liked that place for a relaxed day skiing when in the area.


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## soulseller (Nov 10, 2011)

I just called for NYE reservations, she said they are hoping to be under new ownership and are taking tentative reservations right now, she also mentioned that they are nearing capacity.

Of course her computer was acting up and she had to take my number so I did not get a room or a price quote.


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## billski (Nov 10, 2011)

soulseller said:


> I just called for NYE reservations, she said they are hoping to be under new ownership and are taking tentative reservations right now, she also mentioned that they are nearing capacity.
> 
> Of course her computer was acting up and she had to take my number so I did not get a room or a price quote.



Something is fishy.  How could you be near capacity if the reservations are "tentative"?  

I wouldn't be making reservations at a place I didn't know would open or not.  I'd hold my cards and explore other options.  Definitely don't want to ruin a holiday vacation.  How long can Balsams wait?


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## soulseller (Nov 10, 2011)

billski said:


> Something is fishy.  How could you be near capacity if the reservations are "tentative"?
> 
> I wouldn't be making reservations at a place I didn't know would open or not.  I'd hold my cards and explore other options.  Definitely don't want to ruin a holiday vacation.  How long can Balsams wait?



I certainly will not be giving them a non refundable deposit or anything like that but i'm more then happy to throw my name on a list. If this falls through it will probably be another NYE at home, I'm fine with that.


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## billski (Nov 10, 2011)

soulseller said:


> I certainly will not be giving them a non refundable deposit or anything like that but i'm more then happy to throw my name on a list. If this falls through it will probably be another NYE at home, I'm fine with that.



I'm still skeptical.  You're going to dump a wad of change, and it's no small distance to travel. I can't imagine a lot of people want to make last minute choices.  IMO...


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## AdironRider (Nov 10, 2011)

billski said:


> I'm still skeptical.  You're going to dump a wad of change, and it's no small distance to travel. I can't imagine a lot of people want to make last minute choices.  IMO...



You would be wrong for the type of leisure traveler that stays at these types of places. Money is not an object to most of these people. Which is why you dont see these types of places really advertising to the common man like you and me all that much.


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## billski (Nov 10, 2011)

AdironRider said:


> You would be wrong for the type of leisure traveler that stays at these types of places. Money is not an object to most of these people. Which is why you dont see these types of places really advertising to the common man like you and me all that much.


I get the money part.  It's the schedule uncertainty /inconvenience it may cause  that I'm talking about.


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## abc (Nov 10, 2011)

billski said:


> I'm still skeptical.  You're going to dump a wad of change, and it's no small distance to travel. I can't imagine a lot of people want to make last minute choices.  IMO...


It's not last minute till Thanksgiving


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## AdironRider (Nov 11, 2011)

billski said:


> I get the money part.  It's the schedule uncertainty /inconvenience it may cause  that I'm talking about.



Five years ago you might have a point. These days people spend more impulsively when they are feeling flush. With the stock market, those sentiments are changing daily.


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## soulseller (Nov 14, 2011)

If anyone is interested here are my notes regarding NYE reservations:


minimum two night stay
518 or 558 per couple per night
the 558 is a little bigger, better view
include everything
snow shoeing
lift ticket
ice skating
dinner
breakfast
not booze
they add 18% gratuity for house keeping and dining room
so we can make tentative reservations with him
and when they are 100% they are open for the season
they will call us back for credit card information
and then charge you the down payment
also there is a 9% sales tax
on top of the 18% gratuity
there is a fireworks display
and men are required to wear jackets in the dining room
though ties are optional
so it would be about 1316 for two nights


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## Smellytele (Nov 14, 2011)

soulseller said:


> If anyone is interested here are my notes regarding NYE reservations:
> 
> 
> minimum two night stay
> ...



1316 for 2 nights ouch! Way to steep for me.


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## soulseller (Nov 14, 2011)

Smellytele said:


> 1316 for 2 nights ouch! Way to steep for me.



yeah its not cheap, would pay for my west coast trip this year easily.


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## AdironRider (Nov 14, 2011)

Once you see the spread they put out in the dining room it will blow your mind. 

That, and try and do all those things for two people daily anywhere else in ski country and see what the totals come up to. Try and do all those activities for under 250 bucks a piece daily. Three impressive squares a day (all you can eat), lift tickets, off hill activities, its actually not that bad for a lux vacation. 

For comparisons sake, our minimum room rate for those dates right now at my hotels is 750 per night, and thats just for a room key....


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## Smellytele (Nov 14, 2011)

AdironRider said:


> Once you see the spread they put out in the dining room it will blow your mind.
> 
> That, and try and do all those things for two people daily anywhere else in ski country and see what the totals come up to. Try and do all those activities for under 250 bucks a piece daily. Three impressive squares a day (all you can eat), lift tickets, off hill activities, its actually not that bad for a lux vacation.
> 
> For comparisons sake, our minimum room rate for those dates right now at my hotels is 750 per night, and thats just for a room key....



They don't call me smelly for nothing  I am not that high end.


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## SIKSKIER (Nov 15, 2011)

*Yikes.I hope your going for more than the skiing*

Wow,Just picked up my 2 season passes to Cannon last weekend and that came to less than $1100.Plus I got 2 anytime tickets worth $67 a piece and 2 tickets to Waterville at $73 a piece.Subtracting those I'm looking effectively at a little over $800 for 2 season Passes.$1300 for 2 days?Ouch is right.And its the Balsams terrain.


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## soulseller (Nov 15, 2011)

SIKSKIER said:


> Wow,Just picked my 2 season passes to Cannon last weekend and that came to less than $1100.Plus I got 2 anytime tickets worth $67 a piece and 2 tickets to Waterville at $73 a piece.Subtracting those I'm looking effectively at a little over $800 for 2 season Passes.$1300 for 2 days?Ouch is right.And its the Balsams terrain.



This is terrible logic top to bottom.

Yes it is expensive and no I don't think I'll be going but to call it $1300 for 2 days of skiing Balsams terrain is selling it well short.


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## deadheadskier (Nov 15, 2011)

$1300 is a lot of scratch, but it's not as much as you'd pay for ski/dine and stay at other luxury properties in New England.  Mount Washington Hotel is $760 per night and doesn't include the skiing.


Room 1	 Adults: 2     Children: 0
New Years Eve Celebration Package	 from $759.00 / night   [ + ]
Package Includes:
Luxurious accommodations, dinner each night (except New Years Eve) in the hotel's restaurant, breakfast each morning in the hotel's restaurant and admission to guest's choice of a New Years' Eve Celebration party, which includes dinner.


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## Smellytele (Nov 15, 2011)

deadheadskier said:


> $1300 is a lot of scratch, but it's not as much as you'd pay for ski/dine and stay at other luxury properties in New England.  Mount Washington Hotel is $760 per night and doesn't include the skiing.
> 
> 
> Room 1	 Adults: 2     Children: 0
> ...



Hence why I stay home during holidays


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## Black Phantom (Nov 15, 2011)

Smellytele said:


> Hence why I stay home during holidays



You don't ski?  NY's day is a great time to ski.  Usually one of the quietest of the season. Unless it is bitter cold, a great time to get first chair.

I find the vacation weeks to be rather calm actually. The blackouts are gone from the hill.  

NYE is amateur night. Great day of the year to stay sober. 8)


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## billski (Nov 15, 2011)

Black Phantom said:


> You don't ski?  NY's day is a great time to ski.  Usually one of the quietest of the season. Unless it is bitter cold, a great time to get first chair.
> 
> I find the vacation weeks to be rather calm actually. The blackouts are gone from the hill.
> 
> NYE is amateur night. Great day of the year to stay sober. 8)



on NYD I find the lifts all to myself in the morning.  Those with hangovers tend to show up from noon and ski like DUI  till about 2pm (good time for a break), then I have the place to myself.


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## midd (Nov 15, 2011)

Based on my last visit, I'd have a tough time calling the Balsams a true luxury property.  

Nicest thing I can say about the room is that it was spartan. Dinner one of the two nights was a buffet with too many crappy reheated pasta dishes/casseroles.  

Skiing was great though, but mainly due to a lack of crowds and untouched pow a few days after a storm.


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## Smellytele (Nov 15, 2011)

Black Phantom said:


> You don't ski?  NY's day is a great time to ski.  Usually one of the quietest of the season. Unless it is bitter cold, a great time to get first chair.
> 
> I find the vacation weeks to be rather calm actually. The blackouts are gone from the hill.
> 
> NYE is amateur night. Great day of the year to stay sober. 8)



It matters if there is good snow I will ski. This year I will wait until Monday most likely to ski. May take a few runs at the local hill on NYD. 

Places to stay during holidays are just usually too expensive for my taste and most ski discounts can't be used then. This year my family trip is planned for midweek end of FEB into March. Parts of NH has vaca that week unlike the rest of the east which has President's week off. 

Guys weekend this year will be St Patty's weekend


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## SIKSKIER (Nov 15, 2011)

soulseller said:


> This is terrible logic top to bottom.
> 
> Yes it is expensive and no I don't think I'll be going but to call it $1300 for 2 days of skiing Balsams terrain is selling it well short.



Call it what you want.I'll take my logic anyday than to drop $1300 for a two day _experience_.


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## Smellytele (Nov 15, 2011)

SIKSKIER said:


> Call it what you want.I'll take my logic anyday than to drop $1300 for an _experience_.



+1


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## Black Phantom (Nov 15, 2011)

Occupy The Balsam's!!!!


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## billski (Nov 15, 2011)

Smellytele said:


> They don't call me smelly for nothing  I am not that high end.



A picture tells all!  :lol:


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## AdironRider (Nov 15, 2011)

SIKSKIER said:


> Call it what you want.I'll take my logic anyday than to drop $1300 for a two day _experience_.



You sound like somone with a jealous streak. 

Different strokes for different folks. For the couple that likes to ski but isnt die hard, the Balsams is a great experience. 

Ive got a taste for the finer things in life, and 1300 is cheap for a luxury vacation all inclusive. This isnt the Best Western (and its probably not 4 Michelin stars or AAA 5 diamond either) but it is a very nice place with that old world charm. 

For someone like you who slaves away in a kitchen to ski all winter, not so much. Nothing wrong with either (and Id take your route as well if I didnt get free nights at any Four Seasons worldwide). That being said, having sampled the luxury travel set its pretty hard to go back to staying in dives with odd stains on the carpet. But thats just me.


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## soposkier (Nov 15, 2011)

AdironRider said:


> You sound like somone with a jealous streak.
> 
> Different strokes for different folks. For the couple that likes to ski but isnt die hard, the Balsams is a great experience.
> 
> ...



Not hammering your style or anything, everyone has there own price levels, but do you consider two nights really a luxury "vacation"?  Maybe a quick weekend getaway would be the more correct terms.


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## AdironRider (Nov 15, 2011)

Yeah, for a desitnation like that. I work in hospitality so I tend to just generalize terms. If it was a joint down the street not so much.


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## Cannonball (Nov 15, 2011)

soulseller said:


> and men are required to wear jackets in the dining room
> though ties are optional
> so it would be about 1316 for two nights



The money sounds reasonable.  But a jacket requirement.... I'm out.


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## snoseek (Nov 15, 2011)

The place needs updating IMO. I have seen and stayed in several of the rooms-they desperately need updating. The food and the activities are the draw for sure. I hope the culnary school stays a main focus here, its a key role in transforming young cooks into chefs. I hope whoever signs up for this returns the hotel to its former glory. Not gonna be cheap!


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## AdironRider (Nov 15, 2011)

snoseek said:


> The place needs updating IMO. I have seen and stayed in several of the rooms-they desperately need updating. The food and the activities are the draw for sure. I hope the culnary school stays a main focus here, its a key role in transforming young cooks into chefs. I hope whoever signs up for this returns the hotel to its former glory. Not gonna be cheap!



This is more just my opinion, but having worked in this industry, theres been a huge wash of updating done recently and pretty much all hotels now look exactly the same, and IMO are going to look super dated in 10 years time (kinda like 70's kitchens and bathrooms now). 

Not saying the Balsams doesnt need to be updated either, I just hope they dont ruin the character in the process. 

Did the Ocean Properties deal ever go through, or are they working with a different company now?


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## snoseek (Nov 15, 2011)

AdironRider said:


> This is more just my opinion, but having worked in this industry, theres been a huge wash of updating done recently and pretty much all hotels now look exactly the same, and IMO are going to look super dated in 10 years time (kinda like 70's kitchens and bathrooms now).
> 
> Not saying the Balsams doesnt need to be updated either, I just hope they dont ruin the character in the process.
> 
> Did the Ocean Properties deal ever go through, or are they working with a different company now?



I don't follow it really but maybe someone can post some info. 

I hear you on the updating-a fine balance between tradition and modernizing. A great deal of the guest are returning year after year. That is their bread and butter and they would be foolish to write that off, especially in Dixville Notch. There is room for improvment at the ski area also. They get the snow but the acerage is small. The hiking, biking, fishing ect.....are just amazing!


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## bigbog (Nov 15, 2011)

Cannonball said:


> The money sounds reasonable.  But a jacket requirement.... I'm out.



Agreed, that _IS_ pushing the showboat-thing a little....


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## deadheadskier (Nov 16, 2011)

AdironRider said:


> You sound like somone with a jealous streak.
> 
> Different strokes for different folks. For the couple that likes to ski but isnt die hard, the Balsams is a great experience.
> 
> ...



I hear where you're coming from; however, when's the last time you went to the Balsams?  It's pretty run down these days. It also looks like they have the same chef that I met two years ago. He would've been great in 1985.  In 2011?  not so much.   

Scroll down to look at the menu and tell me I'm wrong

http://thebalsams.com/dining_room


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## deadheadskier (Nov 16, 2011)

AdironRider said:


> This is more just my opinion, but having worked in this industry, theres been a huge wash of updating done recently and pretty much all hotels now look exactly the same, and IMO are going to look super dated in 10 years time (kinda like 70's kitchens and bathrooms now).
> 
> Not saying the Balsams doesnt need to be updated either, I just hope they dont ruin the character in the process.
> 
> Did the Ocean Properties deal ever go through, or are they working with a different company now?



Ocean Properties deal fell through, which is a shame.  They're real pros at rehabbing historic properties.  Though they do eff up the dining at some of them.  Ruined the fine dining restaurant at the Sagamore on Lake George and turned it into a family Italian American restaurant because they could make better profits at it.  As you know, all about the Benjamin in the hotel business, even with your organization.  Hell, the Four Seasons turned Aujourd’hui into a freaking banquet room when it was in the conversation for best fine dining restaurant in Boston for many years.


After that deal fell through, the Balsams was sold last I heard/read to a group of investors from Maine.  Here's what a quick google turned up.

http://www.berlindailysun.com/node/87168/18661


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## Smellytele (Nov 16, 2011)

deadheadskier said:


> Ocean Properties deal fell through, which is a shame.  They're real pros at rehabbing historic properties.  Though they do eff up the dining at some of them.  Ruined the fine dining restaurant at the Sagamore on Lake George and turned it into a family Italian American restaurant because they could make better profits at it.  As you know, all about the Benjamin in the hotel business, even with your organization.  Hell, the Four Seasons turned Aujourd’hui into a freaking banquet room when it was in the conversation for best fine dining restaurant in Boston for many years.
> 
> 
> After that deal fell through, the Balsams was sold last I heard/read to a group of investors from Maine.  Here's what a quick google turned up.
> ...



I thought the Maine investors fell through as well...


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## Smellytele (Nov 16, 2011)

Find 2 more couples and you could rent a whole mountain for yourselves for a day plus have $300 per couple left over.


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## SIKSKIER (Nov 16, 2011)

*No worries*



AdironRider said:


> You sound like somone with a jealous streak.



Not sure where that is coming from.Jealous of what?Dropping a 1300 spot for a weekend?To each his own.I splurge on many things that others might think is crazy.Just pointing out the value comparison is all I'm saying.If your implying I'm jealous for financial reasons your way off in that one.No worries here.


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## billski (Nov 27, 2011)

on Wilderness Nordic FB page:

"This time, "no news is good news" doesn't apply--still no news about the winter months for skiing, or staying in Dixville Notch..."

Nov 17th.


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## billski (Dec 6, 2011)

*Historic Balsams Hotel Bought By NH Businessmen*

Historic Balsams Hotel Bought By NH Businessmen

Formal Announcement Expected Tomorrow

POSTED: 9:39 pm EST December 6, 2011
UPDATED: 9:44 pm EST December 6, 2011



Read more: http://www.wmur.com/news/29938336/detail.html#ixzz1foowGwMc

DIXVILLE NOTCH -- Dan Herbert and Dan Dagesse met with owners of the Balsams Grand Resort Hotel today in Concord to finalize their purchase of the historic hotel, according to a spokesman for the buyers.

They expect to formally announce the deal tomorrow morning.

Herbert, Dagesse and representatives of the Tillotson Corporation, the hotel's current owners, still need approval from a group of trustees before they can finalize the deal.

When asked about whether the new buyers would re-open the hotel, a spokesman said they are planning major renovations.

Dagesse owns the Berlin City Auto Group. Hebert owns a construction company in Colebrook.


Read more: http://www.wmur.com/news/29938336/detail.html#ixzz1fooUJs7a


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## Morwax (Dec 7, 2011)

That place is a GEM! Lets hope it gets the TLC it deserves. We would love to spend a weekend or two up there.
 More on the subject 
http://news.nhpr.org/post/balsams-resort-sold


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## snowmonster (Dec 7, 2011)

Great news that the sale of the resort is finally done.



billski said:


> When asked about whether the new buyers would re-open the hotel, a spokesman said they are planning major renovations.



I hope this doesn't mean that the ski area won't be opened this season. I wouldn't hold my breath for a hotel stay this season but, at least, run the ski area. The other thing I'm hoping for is that the new owners should honor old traditions -- like the bottle of maple syrup on the return visit!


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## billski (Dec 7, 2011)

source http://www.colebrookchronicle.com/

 In addition, the Chronicle has spoken with employees who had remained at the hotel following its seasonal closure in September and we were told that at 3:30 this afternoon, employees were contacted by Dan Hebert and told that the hotel would be closed indefinitely and that all keys were to be turned in; they were told that renovations would not begin until at least March and that in the meantime the property would remain shut down and not reopen for the winter season.

http://www.facebook.com/SaveTheBalsams

(Hebert and Dagesse) have already stated they will not sell any portion of the property for the Northern Pass.

 A significant portion of the land (almost 6,000 acres) will be conserved by the Forest Society, which keeps the land as-is in perpetuity. We will have a map showing the property that has been transferred to the two Dannys, as well as the portions that will be conserved. The sale includes all Tillotson Corp. properties in both Dixville Notch and Colebrook.

A Forest Society spokesman said that would prevent the Northern Pass project from using the land.
...
http://www.nhpr.org/post/balsams-resort-sold-23-million
Balsams Resort Sold For $2.3 Millio
The selling price was $2.3 million and a renovation of the property is expected to take about 18 months. During that time the hotel will remain closed.

Lots of very good detail here


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## snoseek (Dec 7, 2011)

2.3 mil? That's pretty cheap. Did I read that wrong or something?


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## Edd (Dec 7, 2011)

I've never been.  Anyone think it would be a good spot for skinning if the ski area is closed this year?


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## steamboat1 (Dec 8, 2011)

Edd said:


> I've never been.  Anyone think it would be a good spot for skinning if the ski area is closed this year?



Absolutely, it's a nice medium sized hill, nothing to steep but has some interesting terrain.


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## deadheadskier (Dec 8, 2011)

snoseek said:


> 2.3 mil? That's pretty cheap. Did I read that wrong or something?



Definitely a crazy low number, but I think for the place to be commercially viable, you would need to sink $15M into it easily.  That's just the hotel.  I have know idea what shape the ski area and golf course are in, but I have gotten a couple of tours of the hotel in the last five years during sales calls for work.  It's in pretty rough shape compared to its competition to the south in the Mountain View Grand Hotel and the Mount Washington Hotel.

I'd imagine those two hotels are the primary reason of the Balsams demise.  With the Mountain View reopening in 2002 following a 20M renovation and the Mount Washington going year round in 1999 and investing 60M since 2006 alone, the Balsams lacked compelling reasons for people to travel that much further for a lesser experience.

I know the Balsams was known for its food, but in today's age, a place in such a location would need to be over the top as a dining destination to get the Petrus Wine buying clientele of the world.  The uber rich.  The 'medium rich' folk are still going to go for the convenience of the Mountain View or Mount Washington. I'm talking top ten in the world dining destination. Think El Bulli or the French Laundry.    I linked their dining room menu earlier in the thread and it's pretty much a joke for 2011. You and I could put out much better food than what's on that menu.

If I were the owner of Balsams and was serious about making it a food destination, I'd throw the bank at Eric Ripert.  

It would suck for skiers, because I'm sure going so high brow would result in $100 lift tickets, but I really think a place in that location needs to go to that exclusive of a level to be economically viable.


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## midd (Dec 8, 2011)

with El Bulli closed, Chef Adria is available...

Does Rene Redzepi have the cache with american audiences  yet? 

For boondocks NH, it'd have to be a bleeding edge chef.  Ripert is great but bordering on Boulud/Jean-George V/Ducasse overexposure.  Can already go to multiple restaurants in multiple cities and eat at their restaurants.


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## deadheadskier (Dec 8, 2011)

midd said:


> with El Bulli closed, Chef Adria is available...
> 
> Does Rene Redzepi have the cache with american audiences  yet?
> 
> For boondocks NH, it'd have to be a bleeding edge chef.  Ripert is great but bordering on Boulud/Jean-George V/Ducasse overexposure.  Can already go to multiple restaurants in multiple cities and eat at their restaurants.



Did you happen to catch Adria when he spoke in at Harvard this past Sunday?

Don't think Rene does.

My suggestion of Ripert is 1st because I think you need a rock star Manhattan based chef at the Balsams.  Keller and Atchatz came to mind for certain, but they're not Northeast based.  I also thought of the other chefs you listed and somewhat rule them out for how old they are.  They're amazing, but lack the rock star quality of someone like Eric, Thomas or Grant because of their age.  Daniel and Alain would get my nod over Jean Georges a in heartbeat though.  JG has slored himself out much more than the others and has some hohum restaurants with his name on them.........Market in Boston without a doubt falls in that category.  It's a great restaurant, but hardly one of the ten best in Boston.  Perhaps not even one of the twenty best.  I can't imagine Eric, Daniel or Alain opening a restaurant in Boston and it not being in the top 5.

Rippert is mid 40s, likes exposure (regular on Bourdain show) has a rapid following of top Manhattan execs.  Makes perfect sense to me.


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## midd (Dec 8, 2011)

Achatz is the guy.  He'd be a huge draw.  The whole experiential dining thing would sell at a place like the balsams.


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## snowmonster (Dec 8, 2011)

Assuming that the Balsams goes after the high end of the market and positions itself by opening a gourmet destination restaurant, don't you think that that segment is already well-served by Stowe and Jay Peak?


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## thetrailboss (Dec 8, 2011)

Yeah, $2.3 million seems low.  Wonder if they are assuming debt or have lots of work to do to the place?  

http://www.wcax.com/story/16215921/balsams-grand-resort-off-the-market


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## billski (Dec 8, 2011)

thetrailboss said:


> Yeah, $2.3 million seems low.  Wonder if they are assuming debt or have lots of work to do to the place?
> 
> http://www.wcax.com/story/16215921/balsams-grand-resort-off-the-market



the Grand Hotel is held by a charitable trust.
The buyers only get to "own and operate a hotel and related amenities."


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## AdironRider (Dec 8, 2011)

2.3 million is about exactly what I would expect it to sell for in its current state. 

For examples sake, the Four Seasons Jackson Hole AND Four Seasons Palo Alto recently sold for 95 million in stock. This is the premier hotel in Silicon Valley and one of the top 5 resorts in North America mind you, and combined they are both worth less than 100 million. 

Given that the Balsams is dated, in need of serious reno's, and is not exactly killing it on the REVPAR, ADR, etc folds, 2.3 mil is the right price.


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## AdironRider (Dec 8, 2011)

To followup, I think Ripert, or any other celebrity chef, is a pipe dream really. But if he just wanted to put his name on the place and collect a check without ever showing up to the place, he might be down, not that much precedence for that though in their location. Vegas or up the hills outside of LA he would have done it already...


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## riverc0il (Dec 8, 2011)

snowmonster said:


> Assuming that the Balsams goes after the high end of the market and positions itself by opening a gourmet destination restaurant, don't you think that that segment is already well-served by Stowe and Jay Peak?


Jay Peak is not serving the high end of the market. Alice's Table is nice but prices are extremely reasonable. Definitely not high end.


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## snoseek (Dec 8, 2011)

No matter what it will always be difficult to find properly trained quality help in that location. I doubt many real deal chefs in Boston are going to be to crazy about living in Errol and possibly trying to raise a family. Add to that the help often travels with them. A chef is nothing without his network of people he can trust. That would be a tough sell IMO


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## UVSHTSTRM (Dec 8, 2011)

When I look at the pictures of the hotel, it seems that part of the hotel is fairly new?  Was there an addition to the place?  Also the hotel seems to have a very impressive back drop....I would say more so then the Mount Washington, perhaps because I have been to the Mt Washington Valley a million times and Pinkham Notch nada.


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## riverc0il (Dec 8, 2011)

UVSHTSTRM said:


> When I look at the pictures of the hotel, it seems that part of the hotel is fairly new?  Was there an addition to the place?  Also the hotel seems to have a very impressive back drop....I would say more so then the Mount Washington, perhaps because I have been to the Mt Washington Valley a million times and Pinkham Notch nada.


The hotel is wicked old. Pictures certainly frame it very nicely. But up close and personal, the place looks run down from the outside. I drove around the property when I visited the ski area last year and I was really surprised at the condition of the property in general. I don't know what things look like inside but seems like that needs some work too.

The backdrop is nice but I wouldn't say more impressive than the Mount Washington. It's just different. You are a lot more connected and intimate with the environment at Balsams as opposed to being out in the open with a massive view at the Mount Washington.


----------



## AdironRider (Dec 9, 2011)

I think they should pull one of the up and comers from Portland, someone whos name is known in New England but not country wide like the NYC top chefs. 

I think the addition was built in the 80's or something like that. Thats eons in the hotel business. There are very few hotels of the caliber that the Balsams wants to be that can go decades without massive capital infusement. 

My hotel is not even ten years old and the total cost to build from the ground up has already been reinvested over again to keep it current, and thats just in the last eight years or so. 

The sucky end of the deal for these local NH owners now is they dont get any of the real estate. Noone buys hotels without the real estate, thats where you make your real money, is when you sell the property itself. The returns on running just a hotel are pretty weak otherwise, especially in the lux bis. Best Westerns are a different story.


----------



## deadheadskier (Dec 9, 2011)

Disagree on the up and comer from Portland suggestion.  Foodies don't really travel even to Portland for their food.  James Beard winner Rob Evans is only able to keep Hugo's open because of his pannini place, Duck Fat.  Go to Hugo's on a Tuesday night and they do like 25 covers.  Erik Dejarlais went out of business in under two years.  Steve Corry does okay with 555, but very few people outside of Portland have even heard of him.

You get someone with national star power like Eric or Grant and they really would only need to be on property 30 days a year or so.  They'd get top young talent looking to work there for a couple of years and then move on to the flagship restaurants in NYC or Chicago.  

I know people in Boston who fly out to Alinea for a Friday night dinner.  Those same people aren't going to drive up to basically Canada to eat Rob Evans food.


----------



## billski (Dec 9, 2011)

riverc0il said:


> Jay Peak is not serving the high end of the market. Alice's Table is nice but prices are extremely reasonable. Definitely not high end.



+1.  Even Mr. Cheap ate there.    That's where I draw the line.  I want a hot, hearty lunch.  Besides time spent preparing food (even PBJ) is time better spent on the slopes.  translation: I'm lazy.


----------



## AdironRider (Dec 9, 2011)

deadheadskier said:


> Disagree on the up and comer from Portland suggestion.  Foodies don't really travel even to Portland for their food.  James Beard winner Rob Evans is only able to keep Hugo's open because of his pannini place, Duck Fat.  Go to Hugo's on a Tuesday night and they do like 25 covers.  Erik Dejarlais went out of business in under two years.  Steve Corry does okay with 555, but very few people outside of Portland have even heard of him.
> 
> You get someone with national star power like Eric or Grant and they really would only need to be on property 30 days a year or so.  They'd get top young talent looking to work there for a couple of years and then move on to the flagship restaurants in NYC or Chicago.
> 
> I know people in Boston who fly out to Alinea for a Friday night dinner.  Those same people aren't going to drive up to basically Canada to eat Rob Evans food.



I hear you on the star power thing, it would defintely be a better draw. 

However, its going to cost probably a million just to get his name on the place, and thats probably a yearly thing. Our sister property in DC spends a crapton just to get Michael Mina on the sign. Not sure they could swing the cash and still hope to be profitable.


----------



## deadheadskier (Dec 9, 2011)

I was thinking more like 250K.  I know for a fact that Jo Ho gets 100K plus a percentage of profits for Brasserie Jo at the Colonade in Boston.  Having Grant design and lead the culinary program at the Balsams would cost a lot more, but I don't think 10 times more.


----------



## AdironRider (Dec 9, 2011)

It very well could be that low I suppose, but I think youd have to pay a premium to get someone to put their name on a place like the Balsams, compared to a place in downtown Boston. 

Ill have to check again and see what Mina charges us, I know its more than 100k + a percentage. Ill confirm with our ownership (which also owns that the DC property with his restaurant) and see if it shakes out.


----------



## billski (Dec 22, 2011)

*Northern Pass petitions NH Attorney General to reject part*

Friday, December 23, 2011
Northern Pass petitions NH Attorney General to reject part of Balsams deal

DIXVILLE NOTCH – Northern Pass filed a petition with the New Hampshire attorney general’s office Tuesday to reject a portion of the deal for The Balsams Grand Resort in Dixville Notch, which was sold by the Neil Tillotson Trust earlier this month.
Northern Pass and its subsidiary, Renewable Properties, Inc., asked that the agreement reached between the Tillotson Trust and the Society for the Protection of New Hampshire Forests be rejected for an abuse of discretion and lack of explanation, according to the petition filed Tuesday.
Northern Pass said Renewable Properties offered the Tillotson Trust $2.2 million for the land, but the trustees elected to sell it to the Society for the Protection of New Hampshire Forests for just $850,000.
...
“The crux of this matter is that the trustees, in bowing to what we know to be focused political and personal pressure in opposition to Northern Pass, have failed to carry out their fiduciary duties properly at the expense of an additional $2.2 million for the trust and the trust’s charitable beneficiaries,” wrote George Dana Bisbee, an attorney who drafted the petition filed Tuesday.
Northern Pass said it negotiated the rights to the right-of-way easement “in good faith” with the trustees, but the rights were instead included in the sale agreement with the Society for the Protection of New Hampshire Forests.

Source


----------



## riverc0il (Dec 23, 2011)

I heard about this yesterday on the radio. Quite a disgusting move by Northern Pass. I have been ambivalent about Northern Pass. The project has drawn a fair amount of local outrage around here due to considerations of views and property value decreases. The "green" folks most oppose it due to the views which I thought was hypocritical of environmentalists because the wires would be carrying green hydro energy. But even free market conservatives are against it because of property value decreases and also not wanting big towers in their back yards. It is a rare issue most agree on around here. All that said, I might have to move my position from ambivalent to against due to this move. This is heavy handed legal interference in a local issue. That just doesn't seem right.


----------



## billski (Dec 24, 2011)

By: The Associated Press | 12/23/11 6:01 PM
The Associated Press


AP CONCORD, N.H. — The attorney general's office has approved a land conservation deal to protect 5,800 acres around the Balsams Grand Resort Hotel, over the objections of the Northern Pass power project.

A Northern Pass subsidiary had offered $2.2 million for a right of way across just 24 acres in Dixville Notch, but the hotel's owners accepted an $850,000 offer from the Society for Protection of New Hampshire Forests instead. Northern Pass officials support the conservation effort, but argued the deal would block construction of transmission lines needed for their plan to build a $1.2 billion hydropower line from Canada.

On Friday, the attorney general's office the hotel owners acted within their authority as a charitable trust and approved the deal.

Read more at the Washington Examiner: http://washingtonexaminer.com/news/...serve-land-around-hotel/2031831#ixzz1hSXcfzr6


----------



## billski (Dec 25, 2011)

Northern Pass ups land bid
$3 million offered for Balsams plot
By Annmarie Timmins / Monitor staff
December 24, 2011

3Northern Pass officials have increased their offer for land around the Balsams Grand Resort Hotel to $3 million, even though the land's owners have already signed a deal with the Society for the Protection of New Hampshire Forests.

And that deal was approved by the state attorney general's office late Friday evening. Northern Pass wants the right to run high-voltage transmission lines across 24 acres of the 5,600-acre parcel for its proposed hydropower line from Canada. The trust that owns the land rejected the company's $2.2 million offer earlier this month and instead agreed to sell both the conservation rights and utility rights for the whole parcel to the forest society for much less - $850,000.

In his pitch Friday, Northern Pass President James Muntz told trust officials he was willing to pay both his initial $2.2 million offer for the power line easement plus the $850,000 the forest society is offering for the conservation easement "in the event" the pending deal fell through.

Thomas Deans, chairman of the Tillotson Corp., which owns the land, said Northern Pass's latest offer doesn't change anything. Nor does he expect the deal with the forest society to fall through, he said. "Right now we have a purchase-and-sales agreement with the (forest society)," he said. "We will put (Northern Pass's latest) offer aside and will work on accomplishing our agreement with the forest society."

Martin Murray, Northern Pass spokesman, said earlier this week that the Balsams property in Dixville Notch is not critical to the northern route officials are trying to site for the project. There is other land available, he said, but the property is the project's first choice.

Deans said the only way its deal with the forest society will fall through is if the society fails to raise the $850,000 it needs by Jan. 15, or if the state attorney general's office objects to the sale.

The state, which must sign off on the agreement because the land is held by a trust, granted that approval Friday evening.

In a letter to the trust's attorney, the attorney general's office recognized the difference in what Northern Pass offered for the land and what the trust has accepted from the forest society.

"The (land's owners) value the conservation restrictions alone at approximately $1.5 million," the letter said. "The fair market value of the right of way is at least $2.2 million. As such, under the agreement with the society, the (land's owners) would be transferring assets to the society worth more than $3.7 million for $850,000."

The letter continued, "The trustees have determined that a transfer to the society is consistent with the purpose and terms of the trust, and that it is in the best interest of the environment and economy of the North Country." The state approved that conclusion.

That's a blow to Northern Pass officials.

Earlier this week, they asked the state to reject the trust's deal with the forest society on the grounds that the trustees had a "fiduciary" duty to accept the highest bid. Murray said Northern Pass officials support the forest society's conservation plans but believe they should be allowed to buy the rights to run transmission lines across a small portion of that land.

The Neil Tillotson Trust's mission requires that trustees consider only projects that conserve the North County's natural resources and further economic development. "Our mission is not to sell for the highest price," Deans said. "Our mission is to do the right thing in the interests of the people of the North Country."

Jack Savage, spokesman for the forest society, learned of Northern Pass's new offer from a reporter on Friday. "(Northern Pass officials) seem to be curiously unclear that the negotiations are over," he said. "We have a contract and purchase-and-sales agreement that we fully intend to execute by Jan. 15." (next page »)


Northern Pass officials have increased their offer for land around the Balsams Grand Resort Hotel to $3 million, even though the land's owners have already signed a deal with the Society for the Protection of New Hampshire Forest.



He said Northern Pass's objections and "stunts" this week have actually helped the society's fundraising. "What's great about all of this is that in the nonprofit world, the end of the year is one of the most active times for giving." Savage said. "It's when people make choices about what organizations and projects they will support with tax-deductible donations. So, this is a perfect time for them to be doing this and to bring attention to this."

(Annmarie Timmins can be reached at 369-3323 or atimmins@cmonitor.com.)


----------



## Morwax (Dec 25, 2011)

*Wow*

THANK YOU Tillotson Trust and the Society for the Protection of New Hampshire Forests !!!
       Merry Christmas...
 Im now absolutely sure where I stand on Northern Pass :flame:


----------



## billski (Dec 31, 2011)

Posted on their Facebook page, 12/23/11

"Hello everyone. Thank you all for your kind words and wishes - and for your patience. As you might know, the Balsams was purchased earlier this month by Balsams View, LLC, a company created by Dan Dagesse and Dan Hebert, both from Colebrook. Balsams View is committed to restoring this magnificent resort - and in doing so - creating/restoring jobs for NH's North Country. To achieve these goals, we must close for renovations - but we are proud to announce that we will open for NH Primary voting - and preserve this longstanding tradition. More updates soon. Thank you and Happy New Year!"


----------



## snowmonster (Jan 4, 2012)

At least the Ballot Room will be open next week:

http://www.boston.com/news/politics...e_notch_looks_to_midnight_vote/?p1=News_links


----------



## billski (Jan 4, 2012)

snowmonster said:


> At least the Ballot Room will be open next week:
> 
> http://www.boston.com/news/politics...e_notch_looks_to_midnight_vote/?p1=News_links



Bring a heavy coat, boots and hat.  Might be kinda chilly in there.


----------



## Black Phantom (Jan 4, 2012)

billski said:


> Bring a heavy coat, boots and hat.  Might be kinda chilly in there.



snowmonster votes in NH?


----------



## billski (Jan 4, 2012)

Black Phantom said:


> snowmonster votes in NH?



Vote early, vote often.   8)

It always amazed me that in Mass. you do not have to show positive ID to vote. :roll:


----------



## Black Phantom (Jan 4, 2012)

billski said:


> Vote early, vote often.   8)
> 
> It always amazed me that in Mass. you do not have to show positive ID to vote. :roll:



NH isn't Illinois.


----------



## snowmonster (Jan 4, 2012)

^ Touche. I always associated that saying with Chicago.


----------



## Black Phantom (Jan 4, 2012)

snowmonster said:


> ^ Touche. I always associated that saying with Chicago.



And Dixville Notch ain't Chicago.


----------



## Angus (Jan 10, 2012)

still voted at the hotel last night

http://online.wsj.com/video/first-i...tch/1C8501A1-8ED4-48AA-A449-72DC115F862C.html


----------



## St. Bear (Jan 10, 2012)

They really need to put in a casino up there.  Damn legislators.


----------



## billski (Jan 10, 2012)

Black Phantom said:


> And Dixville Notch ain't Chicago.



I'm glad to see that Chicago looks better than DN. :wink:


----------



## billski (Jan 10, 2012)

St. Bear said:


> They really need to put in a casino up there.  Damn legislators.



Ski dorm would be better.


----------



## billski (Jan 16, 2012)

*Forest Society Raises Funds To Conserve Land Around Balsams Resort*

UPDATED: 12:41 pm EST January 15, 2012

DIXVILLE NOTCH, N.H. -- Acreage surrounding the New Hampshire hotel known for tallying the nation's earliest presidential votes is going to be protected.

The Forest Society says 1,500 donors contributed $850,000 to conserve the lands surrounding the historic Balsams Grand Resort Hotel in Dixville Notch. The fundraising deadline was Sunday.

The conservation group's president, Jane Difley, says the Forest Society had no inkling that the public interest in protecting the 5,800 acres around the hotel would be so strong. Contributions ranged from a few dollars to $150,000.

Source: http://www.wmur.com/news/30217722/detail.html#ixzz1jfk0u282

Incredible!


----------



## billski (Apr 10, 2012)

*New Balsams owner wants to bring jobs back to North Country*

STEWARTSTOWN, N.H. — One of the new owners of the Balsams Grand  Resort Hotel says his primary reason for buying it was to preserve jobs  in New Hampshire's North Country.
               Daniel Dagesse says the goal is to make the hotel  better than what it was and bring back 300 jobs. The Caledonian Record  reports (http://bit.ly/HHCvii) he spoke recently at the annual North Country Chamber of Commerce Meeting in Stewartstown.
             Dagesse and Daniel Hebert Jr. bought the Dixville Notch  resort in December. It has been closed since September. Plans are to  re-open with major renovations in July 2013.
               Some of the ideas up for consideration are the  construction of a second Hampshire House, in which people would have  ownership of condominiums; an indoor-outdoor pool; and new conference  space.
               ___
               Information from: The Caledonian-Record, http://www.caledonianrecord.com


----------



## billski (Apr 10, 2012)

*Restoration of The Balsams Grand Resort Hotel*

*
*

 			 			Posted on April 9, 2012, 10:07 am, by Tony, under News.


 Summit Engineering is excited to announce we have been selected to  provide structural engineering services for the renovation of The  Balsams Grand Resort Hotel.   Planned additions total nearly 80,000 SF
http://www.summitengineeringinc.com/news/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/Balsams5.jpgThe Balsams Grand Resort Hotel

 and include a new conference center, pool house, spa, entry/check in and new suites off the Hampshire House.


Source:  http://www.summitengineeringinc.com


----------



## AdironRider (Apr 10, 2012)

That is awesome. 

People like to rag on condotels, but they are a smart investment from a hotel ownership standpoint. 

Ill probably apply when they start hiring again.


----------



## billski (Apr 11, 2012)

If done in an understated fashion, it is a good idea in my book.  I suspect there are only a few who can afford to make this a regular occurrence.  Finding a way to bring more folks back time and time again makes sense.  It's  long journey, which gives many pause, myself included.


----------



## billski (Apr 20, 2012)

*Renovation of Balsams Hotel to start this spring*

Conway Daily Sun
April 20, 2012

BERLIN — Demolition and renovation at the Balsams Grand Hotel will get under way this spring with the goal of reopening the grand resort in the summer of 2013.

Dan Hebert, one of the co-owners of Balsams View LLC, gave an overview of plans for the facility at last week's meeting of the Coos Planning Board.

Hebert said abatement of hazardous materials in the hotel is scheduled to get under way May 1 and take about three weeks. That will be followed by extensive demolition totaling about 400,000 square feet, including the former Tillotson rubber factor, boiler, and the wind whistle house. The demolition is expected to take two months.

The remaining 130,000 square feet of space will be completely renovated, and Hebert said about 80,000 square feet of new space will be added. When complete, he said the redesigned hotel should total about 206,000 square feet. The new space will include a conference center, spa, and pool house. The Dix House will be retained and there will be a 14-room tower added to the Hampshire House. The plans call for relocating Cold Spring Road and creating new parking.

Herbert said he and co-owner Dan Dagesse expect to start construction July 1 and open for business 12 months later.

More


----------



## drjeff (Apr 20, 2012)

billski said:


> Conway Daily Sun
> April 20, 2012
> 
> BERLIN — Demolition and renovation at the Balsams Grand Hotel will get under way this spring with the goal of reopening the grand resort in the summer of 2013.
> ...



Sounds like from that article that the vast majority of the demolition work will be pertaining to the now defunct rubber manufacturing factory that was on property near the hotel, not the hotel itself.


----------



## billski (Apr 20, 2012)

drjeff said:


> Sounds like from that article that the vast majority of the demolition work will be pertaining to the now defunct rubber manufacturing factory that was on property near the hotel, not the hotel itself.



where is the factory (I'm looking at google maps)?


----------



## billski (May 2, 2012)

*A big auction is being held Saturday, May 12*

Among the items up for auction are 300-plus complete bedroom sets, kitchen and baking equipment — and a biomass plant.

bedroom sets, antiques, dining equipment — and a 96-chair ski lift.


More Info at this thread


----------



## billski (May 5, 2012)

*Resort Redevelopment Plan Hits Roadblock*

Developers Say Setback Puts Balsams' Future In Jeopardy

POSTED: 12:18 am EDT May 4, 2012
UPDATED: 12:41 am EDT May 4, 2012


COLEBROOK, N.H. -- A sweeping redevelopment plan at the Balsams Grand Resort is on hold after an unexpected roadblock.
On Tuesday night, the Colebrook Planning Board approved a series of subdivisions of the resort property, but asked for more time on one parcel with a history of environmental contamination.
The developers said the setback puts the entire future of the Balsams in jeopardy, but the Planning Board said it can't allow the project to move forward without knowing what might be underground in the contaminated parcel of land.
...
In the last century, it was used as a landfill, and Board members said it also served as a dump site for liquid manufacturing waste from the former Tillotson rubber factory.
...
With the North Country's short construction season, resort owners said the delay is putting the entire resort's future at risk.

Read more: http://www.wmur.com/news/31007443/detail.html#ixzz1u0IkiMYT


----------



## AdironRider (May 7, 2012)

Hard not to get political, but this is the kinda crap that makes people think the government is retarded. 

This is the best thing to happen to the North Country in decades, and some bullshit study will hold it up.


----------



## billski (May 7, 2012)

Hey, most towns have some sort of dump that had to be capped sooner or later.  Lots of nasties from household garbage.  You don't stop town growth because of it.  Sequester it off.  I know, I'm trivializing this, but there is a lot at stake.  I'm sure the factory brought lots of money to the region too.


----------



## billski (May 8, 2012)

*This guy must have taken his whining lessons right here!*

*Balsams blunder: What's going on with the resort?*

   	 	Published May 7, 2012 at 3:00 am 	(Updated May 6, 2012) 

Are the new owners of the Balsams Grand Resort trying to annoy their  neighbors and customers? Judging by recent events, it would seem that  way.
...
The fourth was not rejected, the board just wanted a few more weeks to  gather information. That drew a sharp response from the Balsams' owners.  They might just have to scuttle the whole $12 million to $20 million  renovation, they said through a spokesman. That sounded a lot like a  threat.
...
They had to communicate that message through a spokesman because they  did not attend the planning board meeting at which the decision was  made. 

...
the way they are going about things is raising a lot of questions. They  might want to explain themselves before they generate more ill will. 

Source: Manchester Union Leader

_I wonder if this guy has ever lived in a remote village....:dunce:_


----------



## billski (May 15, 2012)

*Sold!  The Auction*



Cleared out in one day
Conway Daily Sun


----------



## drjeff (May 15, 2012)

The thing about the Balsams, is that it really was almost its own culture, and a culture that unless you've experienced 1st hand, it's tough to fully grasp.  I know there's some AZ folks who have been there in the winter (myself included) and it's possible to get a bit of what the special, oldtime, almost a bit eclectic vibe that the place has, but compared to what the summer experience was there, the winter one is minor.  My family courtesy of my grandparents, had 5 family summer reunions there, and some of it's distinct charm and ambience had to do not necessarily with what it had, but with what it didn't have.  No TV's in the rooms, no air conditioners, no wifi, just a setting that allowed one to relax, and if in the case of my family (and many other familes too) get to spend some quality time together.  Very often in the various sitting areas/pubs that they have in the main hotel, or down by the pool or even up at the Panorama Golf Course clubhouse, you'd talk to other people there and find out that this was their families 5th, 10th, 15th + trip back to The Balsams, almost always at the same week of the summer.  It was that type of place where even though on the outside it seemed to be lacking many modern ammenities we've all come to take for granted, it offered so much more than any modern hotel could.

Then with the reopening of the Mountain View Grand and the "modernizing" of The Mount Washington Hotel, and even to some extent places such as the Sagamore on Lake George in NY, the idea that you could still have a "classic" early 1900's "Grand" hotel, but tastefully add in modern features really started to appeal to more and more people, some of those at the expense of longtime Balsam's guests.

I sincerely hope the new owners of the Balsams and their plan works out, since it really is a special place.  At the same point I can totally see how especially with the locals there's a bunch of skepticism around them, since it's a HUGE change for an employer that when up and running is a MAJOR employer in that region.  I look forward to hopefully upon completion making the drive back upto the Notch and hearing the doorman say "Welcome Back!" as they open the door of my car and then handing me a small bottle of NH maple syrup as they do(or atleast the old owners did) for any returning guest upon their arrival


----------



## bobbutts (May 15, 2012)

billski said:


>



I like that they dub the youtube slideshow and unwatchable video footage "Indie Film"


----------



## billski (May 24, 2012)

*This is not Three Mile Island*

1:37	 AM WED MAY 23, 2012
Colebrook Planning Board Resolves Concern Over Balsams Tract
NH Public Radio

The Colebrook Planning Board Tuesday night removed what the new owners of the Balsams Grand Resort have said was an impediment to the redevelopment needed to allow hundreds of people to get back to work.
...
The issue was a 28-acre parcel the owners wanted separated from the rest of the property because for decades about two acres of it had been used as a dump.
...
That prompted the new owners, Dan Hebert and Dan Dagesse, to issue a news release complaining that the Planning Board was needlessly holding up renovation of the facility. 
...
...
But the Planning Board members said they were just trying to make sure they fulfilled their duty to protect the town.
...
“The data don’t suggest there is a huge problem here,” Warzocha said. “This is not Three-Mile Island.”
...
He said there is a ground-water quality violation but it is barely over the limit.
...
*The board voted unanimously to approve the subdivision contingent on another approval Thursday night by the Coos County Planning Board.
*


----------



## billski (May 24, 2012)

*Latex Manufacturing To Resume in North Country*

7:10	 PM MON MAY 21, 2012
NHPR

In some good news for the North Country an old family business is coming back to life.  NHPR’s Chris Jensen reports.

Starting in 1931 Neil Tillotson made his fortune manufacturing natural latex products including balloons and later gloves.

That allowed him to purchase the Balsams Grand Resort.

Tillotson died in 2001 and a  latex plant located near the resort closed in 2010.

But Tillotson’s son, Rick, purchased the equipment and recently bought a 103,000 square foot building in Colebrook.

He plans to use part of it to make latex products there and hopes to open later this year.


----------



## billski (Jun 7, 2012)

*Auction goods hit the streets*

Auction stuff is showing up on eBay
Prices seem a little outrageous.







$20 for this sign.  Seriously?


----------



## from_the_NEK (Jun 7, 2012)

Seriously, a laminated peice of paper that could be created in a word processing program in five minutes. I guess it does have the authentic staple holes in the top


----------



## bobbutts (Jun 7, 2012)

This seller has 0 feedback and insane prices.  I'm guessing they never sell or don't until the prices drop significantly.


----------



## snowmonster (Jun 7, 2012)

I'm always in the market for a tie. But, I'm not that attached to the Balsams to drop that much coin on that piece of silk.


----------



## billski (Jun 7, 2012)

Me thinks the seller has the notion that the affluent clientele will yearn for a memory of the past and pay any price.  Misguided rationale.
He probably picked them up for $10 a dozen.


----------



## billski (Sep 10, 2012)

*Balsams lawsuit ouster sought*

By KRISTI GAROFALO
Union Leader Correspondent 

DIXVILLE — A judge will hear motions next  week to dismiss a lawsuit blamed for further delaying efforts to finance  renovations to the Balsams Grand Hotel and Resort, which has been  closed since new owners took it over last December.

According to his blog,* Martin sued “to undo  (the) sale of New Hampshire's landmark hotel, The Balsams, which was  turned over to real estate speculators as part of a plan to destroy the  property.”*


----------



## bumpster (Dec 12, 2012)

*OPM Stock Options - Balsams View - Hurry*

Yeah okay, 

Janine's long lost second sister from a worn out illegal mailing list from 1984.

Spare me. The Union Leader no longer has any leadership components within it's soul. 

It isn't possible. 

It would first have to have a soul. 

Or some training other than a high school field trip to Middlebury. 

I'm sorry. 

Maybe it's just that I love Janeane Garofalo too much to appreciate the net worth of this, okay yeah sure fine whatever, journalism.

Meanwhile nobody asks why Andy Martin never went after the wind farm land grab, you silly lemmings.


----------



## billski (Mar 13, 2013)

The latest on Balsams.  Not much new to report
http://www.unionleader.com/article/20130219/NEWS02/130219084

"...But the $2.3 million purchase price looks  like small change next to the needed construction funding  Tranchemontagne pegs at "north of $30 million."
...
But they won't discuss their plans publicly  unless it can't be avoided, such as on the couple of occasions they've  been called on to provide answers at public hearings. On Feb. 26, they  or their representatives will meet with the Coos County Planning Board  to apply for a construction permit.
...
Right now, work at the site off Route 26 is  largely clearing away debris left by the demolition work that's been  necessary to prepare the site for construction.


----------



## ScottySkis (Mar 13, 2013)

billski said:


> The latest on Balsams.  Not much new to report
> http://www.unionleader.com/article/20130219/NEWS02/130219084
> 
> "...But the $2.3 million purchase price looks  like small change next to the needed construction funding  Tranchemontagne pegs at "north of $30 million."
> ...



Sorry Billski I know how much you love the place. Hopefully they get it back together soon.


----------



## billski (Mar 13, 2013)

For those with time on your hands, The Planning Board meeting (pdf)

pretty routine, boring stuff.


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## billski (Mar 13, 2013)

Scotty said:


> Sorry Billski I know how much you love the place. Hopefully they get it back together soon.



Not sure I understand your comment.  Lots of people love Magic for many of the same reasons.  I suspect there are those who never take the drive north.  Do we really need another NELSAP?


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## snowmonster (Mar 14, 2013)

I love the Balsams too and would hate to see it go. That hotel was a gem. As for the ski area, can't they operate it independently of the hotel? Do people earn their turns there?


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## ScottySkis (Mar 14, 2013)

billski said:


> Not sure I understand your comment.  Lots of people love Magic for many of the same reasons.  I suspect there are those who never take the drive north.  Do we really need another NELSAP?



I want to see them open, I thought they were closed, and I was about that and hope the are operating soon is all I meant


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## billski (Mar 27, 2013)

*More Details On Balsams Renovation And A Step Forward*

 
...
Originally the complex had about 400,000 square feet.
 Hebert said about 123,000 of that is being retained. About 80,000 square feet will be added.
...

​
Hebert says that a new biomass heating system will use wood from the  Balsams. It will cost $100,000 a year to heat the complex compared to $1  million a year before.

 Tuesday night the planning board gave its overall approval to the complex renovation even though the plans are incomplete.


 In  an unusual move the board agreed to have the plans scrutinized and  given final approval as they are completed, with reviews from experts  including the state fire marshal.


 That strategy solved a serious  problem for the owners who risked missing an April deadline to apply for  federal tax credits and could not do so without an okay from the  planning board.

...
Once construction begins the project is expected to take about 18 months to finish.

More plus project rendering


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## St. Bear (Mar 27, 2013)

NH keeps trying to pass gambling, the Balsams would be the perfect place for a casino.  Historic "name" hotel, area in need of jobs and economy, and year round activities.  Seems like a no-brainer to me.


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## billski (Oct 21, 2013)

*Union Leader Oct 13*

ERROL  — It’s been nearly two years since a pair of North Country businessmen  succeeded in buying the closed Balsams Grand Resort and Hotel in  Dixville Notch for $2.3 million, promising to restore the landmark  property and return the hotel and large dining room to their former  grandeur.

But The  Balsams remains shuttered, and the new owners’ May 2012 auction emptied  it of everything from dinner plates to ski-lift chairs. Some  pre-construction demolition has taken place, but owners Dan Hebert and  Dan Dagesse and the company they formed, *Balsams View LLC, seem no  closer to achieving their goal to return large-scale seasonal employment  to Coos County.*

Hebert  and Dagesse do not return phone calls and seldom talk publicly about  their plans unless required by the permitting process to do so.

...
“The Balsams never made money. It lost $5  million a year. Mr. Tillotson ran it as a hobby. It didn’t work  (financially) for 50 years, what makes them think it’ll work now?”

http://www.unionleader.com/article/20131014/NEWS02/131019657/0/SEARCH


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## canobie#1 (Oct 21, 2013)

That's too bad.  It would have been nice to see expansion and more advertising come from them.


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## thetrailboss (Oct 21, 2013)

Sad to see that it is still closed.


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## drjeff (Oct 21, 2013)

Need to get some EB-5 investment cash going there! The Balsams was such a great place the few times my family held a family reunion there!

Sent from my DROID RAZR using AlpineZone mobile app


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## Edd (Oct 21, 2013)

drjeff said:


> Need to get some EB-5 investment cash going there! The Balsams was such a great place the few times my family held a family reunion there!
> 
> Sent from my DROID RAZR using AlpineZone mobile app



In-ter-est-ing. I'm bummed I never made a point to go while it was open.


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## steamboat1 (Oct 21, 2013)

billski said:


> the new owners’ May 2012 auction emptied  it of everything from dinner plates *to ski-lift chairs*.


Shame to see it go. I've had several enjoyable day's there with my parents, brother & his family, my wife & daughter. A great family ski area. The mountain has some decent natural terrain & what they groomed was groomed to perfection. Overall a great experience & they actually got real snow to.


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## thetrailboss (Oct 21, 2013)

steamboat1 said:


> Shame to see it go. I've had several enjoyable day's there with my parents, brother & his family, my wife & daughter. A great family ski area. The mountain has some decent natural terrain & what they groomed was groomed to perfection. Overall a great experience & they actually got real snow to.


 
Well in all honesty that is misleading.  They sold some of the *old*​ chairs IIRC.  The lifts are fine...and relatively new.


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## snowmonster (Oct 22, 2013)

It's sad to see this play out. I don't have much confidence in what is going on up there. For my part, I am glad that I was able to experience the Balsams in all its skiing and dining glory. If you weren't able to experience the Balsams, this is what you missed:

http://forums.alpinezone.com/showth...y-12-and-13-2011?highlight=balsams+wilderness


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## legalskier (Oct 24, 2013)

_*"Northern Pass Flyover Video: Your Views at Risk

*__...AMC is conducting a new visual impact analysis of the half-mile range along the full Northern Pass corridor and we provide the following video series depicting the visual impact of proposed transmission towers along the 186-mile route."

Video: _http://www.outdoors.org/conservatio...pass&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=oct19video


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## thetrailboss (Oct 24, 2013)

legalskier said:


> _*"Northern Pass Flyover Video: Your Views at Risk
> 
> *__...AMC is conducting a new visual impact analysis of the half-mile range along the full Northern Pass corridor and we provide the following video series depicting the visual impact of proposed transmission towers along the 186-mile route."
> 
> Video: _http://www.outdoors.org/conservatio...pass&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=oct19video



Um, OK. Not sure what this has to do with Balsam's. Northern Pass is a controversial idea for NH generally.  That's a pretty bad film because it really doesn't show the real impact.  I was expecting them to photoshop in the actual towers and show a profile shot.  FWIW most of the line runs along an existing power ROW just with higher towers.  And I thought that HQ had agreed to bury some of the line.


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## billski (Oct 28, 2013)

I inquired today.   Here's the party line:  
_
"The hotel is expected to reopen sometime late in 2014.  The ski area will reopen once the hotel renovations are complete."_


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## thetrailboss (Oct 28, 2013)

Well are they actually doing any renovation work?  I'd think that they'd want to get back into business ASAP.


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## billski (Oct 28, 2013)

thetrailboss said:


> Well are they actually doing any renovation work?  I'd think that they'd want to get back into business ASAP.


  Let's go up on the weekend and check it out.  I'll drive!


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## dlague (Oct 28, 2013)

The company I work for provides power to the and they are using zero power relatively speaking!  I can't say more without getting trouble!


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## thetrailboss (Oct 28, 2013)

dlague said:


> The company I work for provides power to the and they are using zero power relatively speaking!  I can't say more without getting trouble!



I don't like the sound of that. Mr. Tillotson probably doesn't like it either....he's probably rolling in his grave.


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## snowmonster (Oct 29, 2013)

Would hate to see the Balsams NELSAPed but that seems to be the body language coming from Dixville Notch.


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## thetrailboss (Oct 29, 2013)

snowmonster said:


> Would hate to see the Balsams NELSAPed but that seems to be the body language coming from Dixville Notch.



I would think that someone would step in and take it over before that.


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## xwhaler (Oct 29, 2013)

thetrailboss said:


> I would think that someone would step in and take it over before that.



Is the fate of the ski mtn not tied directly to the resort though? I can't see a scenario where the mtn would be financially viable on it's own prior to the re-opening of the hotel.
Interesting that the former mtn manager of the Balsams is now running Whaleback---sort of an ironic twist.


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## thetrailboss (Oct 29, 2013)

xwhaler said:


> Is the fate of the ski mtn not tied directly to the resort though? I can't see a scenario where the mtn would be financially viable on it's own prior to the re-opening of the hotel.
> Interesting that the former mtn manager of the Balsams is now running Whaleback---sort of an ironic twist.



I wonder if that could happen.  I was just assuming that it would be tied with the hotel and that someone would save both.  But then again look at Big Squaw...community steps in and runs the ski area on a lease arrangement.  It would be great if they could do that here especially since it is so far north and the communities rely on it.  

As to the manager, he needed a job I imagine.  

And I am kicking myself for not going up there when I could have....for free on my Burke pass!


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## billski (Oct 29, 2013)

xwhaler said:


> Is the fate of the ski mtn not tied directly to the resort though? I can't see a scenario where the mtn would be financially viable on it's own prior to the re-opening of the hotel.
> Interesting that the former mtn manager of the Balsams is now running Whaleback---sort of an ironic twist.



From what I've heard, everyone has new jobs - they can't afford to sit around waiting for a comeback.  Agree, the ski area is only viable  with lodging nearby.  The only way to know if there is any construction is to go poke around.  Electric might not be a good measure if they are working in portions of the building at a time.   It's more probable they open a small subset of the operation.  Now, I'd take a condo timeshare there.  I think...


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## thetrailboss (Nov 14, 2013)

The latest:  http://caledonianrecord.com/main.asp?SectionID=180&SubSectionID=778&ArticleID=102559


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## Abubob (Nov 14, 2013)

> On Wednesday, Tranchemontagne said finding the equity partners still remains the focus.


I think that means they're still looking for someone to foot the bill.



> In May 2012, hundreds of pieces of Balsams history were auctioned off, including bedroom sets, kitchen equipment, antiques and collectibles and ski lift chairs.


I remember seeing this massive list online. I've heard that the place is completely gutted.


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## snoseek (Nov 14, 2013)

Abubob said:


> I think that means they're still looking for someone to foot the bill.
> 
> 
> I remember seeing this massive list online. I've heard that the place is completely gutted.


Jesus, There are some things with significant historic value! The voting area comes to mind.


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## thetrailboss (Dec 27, 2013)

Bump

Looks like they bit off more than they could chew....

http://caledonianrecord.com/main.asp?SectionID=180&SubSectionID=778&ArticleID=104572


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## billski (Dec 27, 2013)

I inquired twice, once this past October and then again this month.  The stock answer is that they will reopen at the end of calendar yer 2014.


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## steamboat1 (Dec 27, 2013)

I've never stayed in the Balsams hotel but skied the ski area many times. We usually stay in Lancaster which is centrally located to a few NH. ski areas. Balsams is about 40 min. north & Wildcat is 40 min. east. Cannon, Attitash, Bretton Woods & even Sunday River are not that much further a drive. Burke is in the area also but I never drove there from Lancaster. As I've mentioned earlier Balsams ski area is a great place to bring a family. Would hate to see it not re-open.


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## billski (Dec 27, 2013)

Based on my one day's skiing there, I'm pretty convinced Santa lives there.


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## AdironRider (Dec 27, 2013)

Im sure they are overwhelmed a bit, notably financially, but 2 years is not that long a time when you are completely redoing a hotel of that size and caliber. 

This would be a 3-4 year project for the hotel group I worked with previously. 

The whole article just screams whining to me, like they are owed the jobs. Short term thinking over long.


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## billski (Dec 27, 2013)

AdironRider said:


> The whole article just screams whining to me, like they are owed the jobs. Short term thinking over long.



Slow news day.:???:


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## thetrailboss (Dec 27, 2013)

AdironRider said:


> Im sure they are overwhelmed a bit, notably financially, but 2 years is not that long a time when you are completely redoing a hotel of that size and caliber.
> 
> This would be a 3-4 year project for the hotel group I worked with previously.
> 
> The whole article just screams whining to me, like they are owed the jobs. Short term thinking over long.



I think that context is important here--this is pretty much the ONLY major employer in that area. So the impact is huge.


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## AdironRider (Dec 27, 2013)

thetrailboss said:


> I think that context is important here--this is pretty much the ONLY major employer in that area. So the impact is huge.



Believe me, I get the context. 

Still doesn't change how I ultimately feel. These jobs aren't owed to people, and just opening as quick as possible is not the right way to go about things.


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## steamboat1 (Dec 28, 2013)

That whole area of NH is really picturesque. Big time snow mobile country, skiing not so much.


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## deadheadskier (Dec 28, 2013)

AdironRider said:


> Im sure they are overwhelmed a bit, notably financially, but 2 years is not that long a time when you are completely redoing a hotel of that size and caliber.
> 
> This would be a 3-4 year project for the hotel group I worked with previously.
> 
> The whole article just screams whining to me, like they are owed the jobs. Short term thinking over long.



Yeah, two years is nothing.  It took 6 years and $30M to Re-open the Wentworth ten years ago.   Granted, the Wentworth was in much worse shape than the Balsams having been vacant for 15 years, but the Balsams is a much bigger property that's not only trying to renovate, but also reduce it's size in half.  The proposed $35M project is probably several dollars short of what it would take to downsize and bring the resort back.


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## Smellytele (Dec 28, 2013)

I don't believe they have done any work on it for over a year since they tore down a few old industrial buildings on the property and sold off everything inside.


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## JDMRoma (Dec 28, 2013)

steamboat1 said:


> That whole area of NH is really picturesque. Big time snow mobile country, skiing not so much.



Yes Bigtime  Snowmobile country….Best riding in the State and you can head up to Pittsburg and into Maine quiet easily.
I didn't read the recent article but Did hear the locals were up tight over nothing being done for so long, like who ever bought it was bailing on it and it wouldn't return to its Beautiful self. I stayed there over the summer before it shut down…everyone was all f'd up over it closing…too bad they let it go so long without doing any improvements. Such a Historic Hotel, and the most Beautiful grounds Ive ever seen


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## deadheadskier (Dec 28, 2013)

JDMRoma said:


> …too bad they let it go so long without doing any improvements.



I believe the reason for that is that the family that owned it prior never made a profit.  It continuously ran in the red for decades.


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## snoseek (Dec 29, 2013)

The family that owned it also owned a rubber factory that was attached.....and yes it was weird. The smell on a hot summer day was brutal! I wonder if the rubber factory helped fund things overall? The place needs some serious love for sure.


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