# Best Dog Breed for New England Winters



## Danaxxmiller (Jan 6, 2009)

Any thoughts on the Best Dog bread for the New England Winters?


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## marcski (Jan 6, 2009)

I'm partial to Bernese Mtn. Dogs.


http://www.berner.org/


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## Swamp Dog (Jan 6, 2009)

Swamp Dog likes hers toasted?


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## Geoff (Jan 7, 2009)

Danaxxmiller said:


> Any thoughts on the Best Dog bread for the New England Winters?



A lot of dogs have problems with wheat.  You should probably go with gluten-free bread.

Something like this in the bread machine:
In the bread maker's container add:
3 large eggs
1 2/3 cup water
3 tablespoons corn oil
1 teaspoon vinegar 

In separate bowl:
¼ cup brown or white rice flour
1 cup tapioca flour
1 ½ cup corn flour
½ cup flaxseed flour
½ cup skim milk powder
3 tablespoons sugar
1 ½ teaspoons salt
2 ½ teaspoons xanthan gum

Add dry contents to wet and mix. With your finger make depression and add 2 ¼ teaspoons gluten-free yeast. Set bread maker for whole wheat select light and press go.


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## ctenidae (Jan 7, 2009)

I'm a little frightened, and a little impressed, that you had any idea what this thread was baout, Geoff.

I sure as hell didn't. Dog Bread? Dog Breath I'm familiar with, but not dog bread.


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## thetrailboss (Jan 7, 2009)

I fixed your title to read "dog breed" instead of "dog bread."  

I assume you want to discuss: 







And not:






Maybe I am wrong....


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## Grassi21 (Jan 7, 2009)

chihuahua? ;-)

i vote for the bernese mtn dog or st bernard...


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## deadheadskier (Jan 7, 2009)

If you want to ski wherever you want, whenever you want.....


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## Warp Daddy (Jan 7, 2009)

deadheadskier said:


> If you want to ski wherever you want, whenever you want.....



Well Played SIR !!

I totally agree


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## wa-loaf (Jan 7, 2009)

deadheadskier said:


> If you want to ski wherever you want, whenever you want.....



Is that your cat? It's a great pic, how'd the cat get out there?


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## deadheadskier (Jan 7, 2009)

wa-loaf said:


> Is that your cat? It's a great pic, how'd the cat get out there?



Nope, just a google cat.  Mine are indoors


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## ctenidae (Jan 7, 2009)

wa-loaf said:


> Is that your cat? It's a great pic, how'd the cat get out there?



Cats are light. You can toss them pretty far.

Dog BREED makes a lot more sense. Just remember, while there is a New England winter, there's also a summer.


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## MRGisevil (Jan 7, 2009)

You want to consider more than just winter given the climate here adjusts so much throughout the year. Getting a dog that does better in colder climates is going to give you a hard time in summer and vice versa. Shaving the dog in summer isn't always necessarily the best option either as for many breeds dog fur tends to work as an automatic heating and cooling system.

Get yourself an all arounder like a lab, golden, shephard, etc. Stay away from the "doodles" though- all the inbreeding is leading to a myriad of health/ social issues coupled with no attention span and a propensity for abandonement therefore.


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## hardline (Jan 7, 2009)

marcski said:


> I'm partial to Bernese Mtn. Dogs.
> 
> 
> http://www.berner.org/



i was actually looking at the bernese but im not going to get another dog till i have a kid.


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## Warp Daddy (Jan 7, 2009)

We had Labs  they Luved XC skiing with us -- Great family dog , relatively low maintenance -- sweet disposition


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## deadheadskier (Jan 7, 2009)

hardline said:


> i was actually looking at the bernese but im not going to get another dog till i have a kid.



I definitely dig the bernese as well, outside of the $12-1500.00 price tag most people I know who have them paid.  I do hope not to have another dog until I'm into family building mode. 

I had a great yellow lab for 9 years and was able to ski a lot while I had him because I lived near ski areas.  Now that I'm a day tripper traveling most days two hours one way to the slope, things would get a touch more difficult.  

The lady talks all the time about wanting a dog.  We also like to take off to Boston or wherever for a weekend on a whim and a dog would limit the ability to do that as well.

Knowing how much you like to go wake boarding on Cape Cod every weekend half the year even more than skiing Dana, that's something to consider as well.  Perhaps Greg will be cool with you bringing along your dog to stay at his .place.....until he craps in the house.

Dog ownership in my eyes is a MAJOR lifestyle commitment.


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## Grassi21 (Jan 7, 2009)

deadheadskier said:


> Dog ownership in my eyes is a MAJOR lifestyle commitment.



x one million

love my dogs.  but our son limits us less than the dogs do.  and it costs money to board the dogs as opposed to leaving them with grandparents.  my in-laws are so burnt on the dogs we barely bring them to the cape anymore.  :-(


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## hammer (Jan 7, 2009)

deadheadskier said:


> Dog ownership in my eyes is a MAJOR lifestyle commitment.


+1...typing this as my dog is pulling her blanket out of her crate.

I would not recommend a dachshund for winter...mine likes the snow but only when it's shallow.


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## severine (Jan 7, 2009)

deadheadskier said:


> Dog ownership in my eyes is a MAJOR lifestyle commitment.





Grassi21 said:


> x one million
> 
> love my dogs.  but our son limits us less than the dogs do.  and it costs money to board the dogs as opposed to leaving them with grandparents.  my in-laws are so burnt on the dogs we barely bring them to the cape anymore.  :-(


Yup. It's much easier for us to find someone to watch both our kids than to find anyone willing to even just come by and let our dog out or feed her. :???: I love my dog, but she comes with a lot of hassles, potty accidents, puking incidents, and other troubles... It's like having a perpetual 2 year old. Which is good in many ways... but not so conducive to a lifestyle of daytripping or just taking off whenever you want. We will not be replacing her once she has lived her life.


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## dmc (Jan 7, 2009)

deadheadskier said:


> If you want to ski wherever you want, whenever you want.....



Indeed.....  I love dogs so much... i can't have one...

My cats can be left for periods of time... they poop in a box inside so no need to let them out...  they won't gorge themselves on food so you can leave big dish out...

And they kill rodents for pleasure...


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## Warp Daddy (Jan 7, 2009)

dmc said:


> Indeed.....  I love dogs so much... i can't have one...
> 
> My cats can be left for periods of time... they poop in a box inside so no need to let them out...  they won't gorge themselves on food so you can leave big dish out...
> 
> And they kill rodents for pleasure...



 OH YEAH -- especially  the last part   they torture shit just for kiks


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## Grassi21 (Jan 7, 2009)

*Don't all dogs love Winter?*


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## cbcbd (Jan 7, 2009)

dmc said:


> Indeed.....  I love dogs so much... i can't have one...
> 
> My cats can be left for periods of time... they poop in a box inside so no need to let them out...  they won't gorge themselves on food so you can leave big dish out...
> 
> And they kill rodents for pleasure...


Same boat. Would love to have a husky... man, just love those dogs. Even if I had a house, I just leave too often to activities where I would just have to leave the dog behind or tie him off to the trailhead... not cool.

Even a cat I'd love to have, especially since I work from home and would like the company... but still, I leave constantly for multiple days and don't think it's fair to an animal to leave it alone - I have seen the effects of emotional neglect on animals.


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## happyjack (Jan 7, 2009)

Warp Daddy said:


> We had Labs  they Luved XC skiing with us -- Great family dog , relatively low maintenance -- sweet disposition



x2

can't go wrong with labs...we're on our third.  their thick waterproof coats help them withstand the colder temps.  

teach them to be outdoor dogs when they are puppies and they can stay out overnight in freezing temps unless it gets extreme.  our dogs have always been house dogs, but my friends that hunt geese and ducks have dogs (labs and chessies) that stay outdoors year-round (they didn't want the dogs getting soft laying around on the couch inside! haha)

we do have a kennel in our backyard with a doghouse attached...i built the doghouse and wired it so i could put a low wattage heat bulb (like those used in reptile cages) in there for the rare times when we couldn't get someone to watch them but we wanted to do an overnighter.  just put some food in their dish before we left and they were fine until the next evening when we got home.

just make sure you buy from a recommended breeder...and someone that's breeding the disposition you want...i.e. family dogs vs. hunting dogs.


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## hammer (Jan 7, 2009)

happyjack said:


> just make sure you buy from a recommended breeder...and someone that's breeding the disposition you want...i.e. family dogs vs. hunting dogs.


Good recommendation for any breed...we got lucky with the breeder where we eventually got our dog, but we found out later that two of the places where we looked get some of their dogs from puppy mills.


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## deadheadskier (Jan 7, 2009)

Haven't seen or perhaps I missed anyone talking about adopting / rescuing.  Thousands of wonderful dogs get destroyed every year.  One of my cats was a shelter cat, got her at age two; the other a 'mutt' from an old lady in Stowe who's family owned the old Lodge just past the Matterhorn and up the hill on the left; forget the name, but it's the oldest lodge in town.  She was cute as pie, had owned it for over fifty years and said several dozen people called concerning her ad for kittens, but I sounded like I'd be the best care taker for them.  

Different breeds are certainly appealing, but I'll probably end up adopting when my dog ownership days return again someday.


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## Warp Daddy (Jan 7, 2009)

deadheadskier said:


> Haven't seen or perhaps I missed anyone talking about adopting / rescuing.  Thousands of wonderful dogs get destroyed every year.  One of my cats was a shelter cat, got her at age two; the other a 'mutt' from an old lady in Stowe who's family owned the old Lodge just past the Matterhorn and up the hill on the left; forget the name, but it's the oldest lodge in town.  She was cute as pie, had owned it for over fifty years and said several dozen people called concerning her ad for kittens, but I sounded like I'd be the best care taker for them.
> 
> Different breeds are certainly appealing, but I'll probably end up adopting when my dog ownership days return again someday.



+1  our new "dog" is a beautiful male cat that FOUND us 5 yrs ago. He's feaking great - my first cat 

This guy follows me around  like my dogs always did and is very friendly . My wife, a cat fancier tells me he's got some Norwegian Forest variety in him --  Big  Black  with a brownish ruff . He's about 17 lbs but very long  and 

did i say  WE LOVE THIS cat


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## dmc (Jan 7, 2009)

cbcbd said:


> Even a cat I'd love to have, especially since I work from home and would like the company... but still, I leave constantly for multiple days and don't think it's fair to an animal to leave it alone - I have seen the effects of emotional neglect on animals.



We left our cats for 6 days....  Someone checked on them 1 day..
Filled up the waterer(automatic) - piled up a bunch of food...  

We got home... They were pissed for a few minutes and got over it...

Go adopt a cat!!!

I don't pay for animals unless I'm going to eat them.,...


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## thetrailboss (Jan 7, 2009)

Now that the title has been fixed, I am glad to see that this thread has taken off.....


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## hardline (Jan 7, 2009)

ya D is right about cats adults are good for extended periods. i have an automatic cat feeder and waterer. the cat is good for a week. DHS is so right i see getting a dog like having a child.


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## campgottagopee (Jan 7, 2009)

X3 for the Lab's----I have 2 and can't begin to think of a better dog for family, companionship, hunting, and winter. Being the dog originated in Newfoundland and was trained to jump overboard in icy waters to retrieve fishermans nets I don't think a little snow is going to bother.


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## ctenidae (Jan 7, 2009)

campgottagopee said:


> X3 for the Lab's----I have 2 and can't begin to think of a better dog for family, companionship, hunting, and winter. Being the dog originated in Newfoundland and was trained to jump overboard in icy waters to retrieve fishermans nets I don't think a little snow is going to bother.



I have to be contrarion here, on two fronts. First, I don't like the housepet-bred labs. Just don't.

However, I really like labs that are bred as gun dogs. They just look and act different, more purposeful, less goofy.


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## campgottagopee (Jan 7, 2009)

ctenidae said:


> I have to be contrarion here, on two fronts. First, I don't like the housepet-bred labs. Just don't.
> 
> However, I really like labs that are bred as gun dogs. They just look and act different, more purposeful, less goofy.



So, your saying a Lab can't be a pet and a gun dog???? Also, how doeas a gun/hunting lab look any diff that one that doesn't hunt. I'll also say this---both of mine I hunt with--one is a friggin retard until you get him in the field, and the other is just plain calm all the time.


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## Geoff (Jan 7, 2009)

ctenidae said:


> I'm a little frightened, and a little impressed, that you had any idea what this thread was baout, Geoff.
> 
> I sure as hell didn't. Dog Bread? Dog Breath I'm familiar with, but not dog bread.



I knew what the thread was about but I decided to run with the "dog bread" thing.  I've known dogs with wheat allergies.  That brought me to gluten-free bread.  A quick google got me a recipe.

I somehow ended up with two cats.  She showed up with 2 cats.  She left without the cats.  I grew up with animals but I've never had pets in my adult life since I travel so much.  As people have said, you can leave cats with a food bowl loaded up, a bunch of water, and a spare litter box or two.  You can be gone a week and maybe have somebody come in once to scoop cat crap out of the boxes and make sure they haven't done an eating binge on the cat food.  They're pissed when you get home but get over it in about 5 minutes.

I think Huskies make poor pets.  They kill anything that moves.  If you have neighbors with farm animals, it can get expensive very quickly.  I've never seen a husky that coped well with a leash.  They take you for a drag.

I grew up with Golden Retrievers and various kinds of labs.  I think that if I had to get a dog, I'd opt for a full sized standard poodle.  They're smart.  They're athletic.  They don't shed.  If you're pissed at it, you can torture it with a Fi Fi hair doo so all the other dogs laugh at it.


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## riverc0il (Jan 7, 2009)

Danaxxmiller said:


> Any thoughts on the Best Dog bread for the New England Winters?


Depends what you want to do with the dog as any dog is fine for New England winters. But you wouldn't want a mini-poodle if you want to go snow shoeing. On the flip side, I noticed you live in Boston, so depending upon your living arrangement, you may not want a big dog or a very active one that needs 1-2 hours of outdoor activity a day, preferably off lease (such as our monster, I mean cute puppy, pictured to the left).

Also, as mentioned previously, some of the best "winter breeds" that thrive in the winter to HORRIBLE in the summer due to the heat and their thick coats. Hot and humid New England summers may not be kind to such dogs that are bread for alpine and Arctic conditions year round.

Bernese Mountain Dog was mentioned and definitely a striking beautiful dog that loves the winter. But on the flip side, like most giant breeds, the Bernese has a really short life span averaging only 6-9 years similar to a Newfoundland/Landseer, Saint Bernard, etc. which is even more important consideration if you rescue/adopt. Some people may be content with just a few years with a dog, all depends on your preferences.

Also consider shedding and grooming needs. Many good outdoor winter dogs are big shedders.

Almost any of the retriever breeds make excellent all around pets and do well in the winter while suffering no penalty for the summer (almost any of the gun dogs for that matter).

One benefit of adopting/rescueing is you can do so in the winter and see first hand what the dogs temperament to outdoor play in the snow is before you decide which dog you want.

If you go to a breeder, research a good one and avoid the puppy mills.


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## ctenidae (Jan 7, 2009)

campgottagopee said:


> So, your saying a Lab can't be a pet and a gun dog???? Also, how doeas a gun/hunting lab look any diff that one that doesn't hunt. I'll also say this---both of mine I hunt with--one is a friggin retard until you get him in the field, and the other is just plain calm all the time.



Not saying that at all- I just like the demeanor of the gun dogs as pets better than the pets as pets.

Gun dogs tend to be a little leaner, without the rolly-polly rotundness a lot of pet-quality Labs have. A lot of times their noses are a little shorter, and their foreheads a little higher.

I'm sure both of yours hunt- it's in teh blood- and I can totally see the retard-till-in-the-field angle. My old German Shorthair was a moron until you put him in the back of the truck or got him out to a field.He used to drive me nuts sometimes, wantong to go out if he was in and come in if he was out, so I'd just load him into the back of the truck and leave him for a couple of hours. I'd come let him out, and he'd be all excited , thinking he went somewhere.


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## riverc0il (Jan 7, 2009)

ctenidae said:


> Gun dogs tend to be a little leaner, without the rolly-polly rotundness a lot of pet-quality Labs have.


Most labs are rotund because they are over fed by owners that leave the ole roy out all day or don't exercise their dog. I have seen some pretty in shape labs before and they are beauties. A lot of bad breeding too due to the popularity of the dog, too.  I don't think that is a "pet quality" but rather bad breeding.


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## ctenidae (Jan 7, 2009)

riverc0il said:


> Most labs are rotund because they are over fed by owners that leave the ole roy out all day or don't exercise their dog. I have seen some pretty in shape labs before and they are beauties. A lot of bad breeding too due to the popularity of the dog, too.  I don't think that is a "pet quality" but rather bad breeding.



Yeah, I guess it's just that the breeding selection for dogs intending to be pet are different from those meant to be working- different concerns, standards, etc.


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## ctenidae (Jan 7, 2009)

Danaxxmiller said:


> Any thoughts on the Best Dog bread for the New England Winters?



I'm amazed no one has asked these yet- 

What kind of place do you live in? Southie has some not-so-dog-friendly parts.
What's your activity level? Do you run/bike/rollerblade? Can the dog come with you?
Do you have a yard?
How often are you home? How regular is your schedule? How regular can it be?
Roommates/spouse/kids?
a/s/l?


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## riverc0il (Jan 7, 2009)

ctenidae said:


> Yeah, I guess it's just that the breeding selection for dogs intending to be pet are different from those meant to be working- different concerns, standards, etc.


Yes and no. Yes, good breeders use different standards for pet quality versus working quality. But rotund is not a pet quality standard used by good breeders. That is a bad breeder characteristic rather than a pet quality characteristic.


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## Swamp Dog (Jan 7, 2009)

Geoff said:


> I knew what the thread was about but I decided to run with the "dog bread" thing.



yeah, that was way more fun.

Anyhow, I'm an Aussie fan.  She goes everywhere, and FAST!  Her thick double coat is perfect for winters too.  I don't know how this dog does it out on western ranches, would seem to me that heat would be a problem.

Snow Balls:







catching snow balls:






good without snow too:


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## mondeo (Jan 7, 2009)

ctenidae said:


> Cats are light. You can toss them pretty far.



You can punt them further.


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## Swamp Dog (Jan 7, 2009)

mondeo said:


> You can punt them further.



there are 101 things you can do with a cat, dead or alive. But this was about Dog Bread!


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## Danaxxmiller (Jan 8, 2009)

What you guys don't like dog bread??!?!!?!?! LOL whoops


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## ckofer (Jan 8, 2009)

A) Making your own gluten-free bread has some sound economics. The stuff at the store is $5 for a small loaf and not that great.

B) I have lived in New England nearly all of my life and have found that any dog that I have had seems to enjoy sleeping on the couch in the winter, regardless of the breed. So consider rescuing a dog from a shelter.


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## marcski (Jan 8, 2009)

ctenidae said:


> Gun dogs tend to be a little leaner, without the rolly-polly rotundness a lot of pet-quality Labs have.




My buddy has a beautiful yellow lab and she will out run any dog!  We take her mtn biking 4-5 x a week and she rocks.  When she hits her cruising speed....she lowers her ass as if it were a spoiler on a car.  

Like Rivercoil said, I think it has a lot to do with over-feeding and too little exercise....kind of like what's wrong with most kids in America!!  

However, another buddy has a gorgeous golden retriever who also comes with us when we mtn bike.  She is not as fast, needs a whole hell of a lot more water to drink.  But you should see her swim and dive into the reservoir.


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## deadheadskier (Jan 8, 2009)

marcski said:


> My buddy has a beautiful yellow lab and she will out run any dog!  We take her mtn biking 4-5 x a week and she rocks.  When she hits her cruising speed....she lowers her ass as if it were a spoiler on a car.
> 
> Like Rivercoil said, I think it has a lot to do with over-feeding and too little exercise....kind of like what's wrong with most kids in America!!
> 
> However, another buddy has a gorgeous golden retriever who also comes with us when we mtn bike.  She is not as fast, needs a whole hell of a lot more water to drink.  But you should see her swim and dive into the reservoir.



Labs are great like that.  The one I had was the Carl Lewis of dogs.  On deserted dirt back roads of VT he used to like to jog behind the car.  It was quite funny.  He'd be fairly calm driving on the pavement, but once we hit back roads he'd freak until you let him out.  Clocked him once going 32 mph  I think he just knew that when we were on those roads, we were typically going to do something fun like swimming or hiking.  At swimming holes he loved to huck off cliffs as high as 15 feet into the water.  And man could he jump.  I had a friend who was 6'5" and he'd hold a frisbee as high over his head as possible and Samson could still jump up and get it, probably got his nose over 8' up there and his hind legs over five feet off the ground. The dog was a solid 85 pounds of muscle his whole life.

Great dog.....I do miss him all the time, but I'm not ready to get back into the dog ownership again for reasons previously stated.


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## BLESS (Jan 8, 2009)

campgottagopee said:


> X3 for the Lab's----I have 2 and can't begin to think of a better dog for family, companionship, hunting, and winter. Being the dog originated in Newfoundland and was trained to jump overboard in icy waters to retrieve fishermans nets I don't think a little snow is going to bother.




AMEN.  Labs are the just the best imo.  I'm on my first but have been around dogs all my life.  But fyi, your gonna get from a dog what you give.....they all need lots of training & exercise if you want them to be the great dog you envision.  ESPECIALLY labs.


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## BLESS (Jan 8, 2009)

ctenidae said:


> I have to be contrarion here, on two fronts. First, I don't like the housepet-bred labs. Just don't.
> 
> However, I really like labs that are bred as gun dogs. They just look and act different, more purposeful, less goofy.



how can you not like any lab?  odd.


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## ctenidae (Jan 8, 2009)

riverc0il said:


> Yes and no. Yes, good breeders use different standards for pet quality versus working quality. But rotund is not a pet quality standard used by good breeders. *That is a bad breeder characteristic *rather than a pet quality characteristic.



Precisely.


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## campgottagopee (Jan 8, 2009)

ctenidae said:


> Not saying that at all- I just like the demeanor of the gun dogs as pets better than the pets as pets.
> 
> Gun dogs tend to be a little leaner, without the rolly-polly rotundness a lot of pet-quality Labs have. A lot of times their noses are a little shorter, and their foreheads a little higher.
> 
> I'm sure both of yours hunt- it's in teh blood- and I can totally see the retard-till-in-the-field angle. My old German Shorthair was a moron until you put him in the back of the truck or got him out to a field.He used to drive me nuts sometimes, wantong to go out if he was in and come in if he was out, so I'd just load him into the back of the truck and leave him for a couple of hours. I'd come let him out, and he'd be all excited , thinking he went somewhere.



What you are talking about is a English Lab (show dog) or American Lab (field dog). English bred are very muscular, "blocky" looking and the American is taller leaner. I have one of each simply because I prefer the bench or English breed and my wife prefers the American breed. They are both awesome dogs and are good at what they we're bred for---hunting and retrieving.






riverc0il said:


> Most labs are rotund because they are over fed by owners that leave the ole roy out all day or don't exercise their dog. I have seen some pretty in shape labs before and they are beauties. A lot of bad breeding too due to the popularity of the dog, too.  I don't think that is a "pet quality" but rather bad breeding.



TOTALLY agree with this statement--Labs will eat themselves to death if allowed. Not only over feeding, but also feeding poor quality kibble will attribute to an overweight lab. My male is 91lbs, my female is 70lbs. They each get fed 1 cup in the A.M. and 1 cup in the P.M.---my vet is very happy with their appreance---me too!!!! Most importantly is exercise, without it your lab will drive you CRAZY!!!!



ctenidae said:


> Yeah, I guess it's just that the breeding selection for dogs intending to be pet are different from those meant to be working- different concerns, standards, etc.





riverc0il said:


> Yes and no. Yes, good breeders use different standards for pet quality versus working quality. But rotund is not a pet quality standard used by good breeders. That is a bad breeder characteristic rather than a pet quality characteristic.



IMHO, there really is no such thing as "pet bred"---there are only 2 kinds of breeders----show breeders and field breeders both working to better the breed. "Pet Breeders" better known as back yard breeders friggin suck ass!!!!! They ruin the breed and produce pups that will have health issue down the road. A reputable breeder will produce a pup that comes will all kinds of clearance check and health guarantee---any money save in buyiong a BYB pup will be spent in vet bills....................hopefully Doc will see this thread and chime in----I'd like to get his take, I know he's a fan of the Lab himself.


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## campgottagopee (Jan 8, 2009)

BLESS said:


> AMEN.  Labs are the just the best imo.  I'm on my first but have been around dogs all my life.  But fyi, your gonna get from a dog what you give.....they all need lots of training & exercise if you want them to be the great dog you envision.  ESPECIALLY labs.



Ayeup--totally agree------tired lab is a happy lab


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## Marc (Jan 8, 2009)

As far as lab goes, there are two distinct families of the lab breed now a days.  One called "English" or show labs, and the other are know as field labs, American labs or working labs.  

Englsih/show labs are bred for looks only... the breeders are trying to get the "classic characterstics" of the lab breed as perfect as possible.  They tend to be blockier around the head and forequarters, they have thicker, usually shorter tails.  Shorter legs.  Body looks like a log.

Field labs generally have more variability in looks, they're typically bred for their trainability/insticits/intelligence/athleticism and demeanor.  These, IMHO, make better pets and companions, but they are often much more athletic and consequently need much more exercise.  Their intelligence also will sometimes translate into curiosity in the household if not properly trained and mentally stimulated.

If I were to buy a lab, I'd look for a breeder who's into hunting rather than one who touts the physical characteristics of their puppies and parents.  If you're buying from a family, check to find out what breeder they used and any info on the breeder you can find.

And remember... labs can shed almost year round, and they have an oily coat (for water repellency).  They can be known to be "mouthy" as well since they were originally bred along side Newfoundlands on the island from which their cousin breed (Newfies) take their name to retrieve fishing nets and gear in icy water.  They were bred to carry things in their mouth and have a strong inborn instinct to do so.

They have a thick tail too that's used as a rudder when they swim, and they can pretty much clear a coffee table in one wag and not even notice.


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## tjf67 (Jan 8, 2009)

*You should look into*

A springer spaniel.  I have one that is going on nine and still going strong.   He is a sport springer,I think that is it.  Hes been on 15 mile bike trips.  Ran so hard his pads were bleeding.  Been all over the high peaks.  Does not shed very much.  Lots of energy.  They tend to live a long time.

They swim, Hunt, run,  are small enough to sit on your lap but big enough to throw around.

AND THEY ARE THE BEST LOOKING DOG BAR NONE


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## campgottagopee (Jan 8, 2009)

Marc said:


> As far as lab goes, there are two distinct families of the lab breed now a days.  One called "English" or show labs, and the other are know as field labs, American labs or working labs.
> 
> *Englsih/show labs are bred for looks only*... the breeders are trying to get the "classic characterstics" of the lab breed as perfect as possible.  They tend to be blockier around the head and forequarters, they have thicker, usually shorter tails.  Shorter legs.  Body looks like a log.



True, but any lab (english or american) has the natural born instict to hunt/retrieve


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## ctenidae (Jan 8, 2009)

On the subject of Labs, I guess I'd say I prefer an Arkansas Lab to a Boston Lab.

German Shorthair Pointers are my favorite dog breed, overall. Loyal, willing, trainable, good medium range bird dogs, great energy but not "energetic." Maybe the two I've had were special (well, they were to me, anyway), but I like them a lot.


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## Marc (Jan 8, 2009)

campgottagopee said:


> True, but any lab (english or american) has the natural born instict to hunt/retrieve



Not saying they don't... all I'm saying that if you buy a dog bred for looks alone, the variability in personality means the trait a pet owner should be most concerned with (personality/temperment) is a crap shoot.  Better off avoiding them if you're not showing them, or planning on having them bred for profit.


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## campgottagopee (Jan 8, 2009)

Marc said:


> Not saying they don't... all I'm saying that if you buy a dog bred for looks alone, the variability in personality means the trait a pet owner should be most concerned with (personality/temperment) is a crap shoot.  Better off avoiding them if you're not showing them, or planning on having them bred for profit.



I really have to dissagree---tempermant is a HUGE factor in a show dog breed--any reputable breeder will tell you that from the get go wether show/field.


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## dmc (Jan 8, 2009)

I could never buy a dog or cat.... Too many out there that need home...


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## hammer (Jan 8, 2009)

campgottagopee said:


> TOTALLY agree with this statement--Labs will eat themselves to death if allowed.


I thought that was true for most dogs...



campgottagopee said:


> IMHO, there really is no such thing as "pet bred"---there are only 2 kinds of breeders----show breeders and field breeders both working to better the breed. "Pet Breeders" better known as back yard breeders friggin suck ass!!!!! They ruin the breed and produce pups that will have health issue down the road. A reputable breeder will produce a pup that comes will all kinds of clearance check and health guarantee---any money save in buying a BYB pup will be spent in vet bills....................hopefully Doc will see this thread and chime in----I'd like to get his take, I know he's a fan of the Lab himself


I'd like to know what others' take is on this as well...unless a dog just has an inherently dominant personality and is just plain hard to train, wouldn't a good trainer be able to make the dog behave the right way in a show ring?

The breeder that we purchased from does not sell dogs for show, but has a full health guarantee and a "no questions asked" return policy.  Since we bought our puppy, she did have one puppy from a different litter and parents returned for a health problem which was potentially genetic, and I know that she's going through the process of having all of her breeding dogs checked to make sure that they are OK.



dmc said:


> I could never buy a dog or cat.... Too many out there that need home...


I thought the same way until I started to look up rescues online and saw that in some cases the "donation" was almost as much as the purchase of a purebred puppy...

I'm sure that there are a lot of great rescues out there, but I would not look down on someone just because they decided to purchase a purebred dog...as long as they stay away from the pet stores and puppy mills.


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## Marc (Jan 8, 2009)

campgottagopee said:


> I really have to dissagree---tempermant is a HUGE factor in a show dog breed--any reputable breeder will tell you that from the get go wether show/field.



We may have to agree to disagree.  Temperament isn't ignored by show breeders, but it isn't priority.  A good handler/trainer that works with the dog several hours a day should be able train a dog to show quality behavior, so physical traits are still far more important.  My parents and several of their friends found this out through experience.  I'm still of the opinion the field types make much better pets overall than the show types do.


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## campgottagopee (Jan 8, 2009)

Marc said:


> We may have to agree to disagree.  Temperament isn't ignored by show breeders, but it isn't priority.  A good handler/trainer that works with the dog several hours a day should be able train a dog to show quality behavior, so physical traits are still far more important.  My parents and several of their friends found this out through experience.  I'm still of the opinion the field types make much better pets overall than the show types do.



Uhm, not really trying to split hairs but this is from the AKC----breed standards for the Labrador Retriever. Please note the last standard.
 Information on AKC Labrador Retriever Puppies

AKC MEET THE BREEDS®: Labrador Retriever
The gentle, intelligent and family-friendly Labrador Retriever from Canada continues to be the most popular breed in the United States, according to AKC® registration statistics. This versatile hunting breed comes in three colors – yellow, black and chocolate – and because of his aptitude to please his master they excel as guide dogs for the blind, as part of search-and-rescue teams or in narcotics detection with law enforcement.

A Look Back
Labrador Retrievers, originally from Newfoundland, were initially used in work alongside fisherman, helping to pull in nets and catch fish that escaped from fishing lines. After being crossed with Setters, Spaniels and other Retrievers, the Labrador Retriever honed its skills as a true retriever. From this point in the breed’s history, "Labs," as they are affectionately called, were bred primarily to perform as an efficient retriever of game, with a stable temperament suitable for a variety of activities beyond hunting.

 Right Breed for You?
An ideal sporting and family dog, the Labrador Retriever thrives as part of an active family or as a trusted hunting companion. A double-coated breed which sheds seasonally, regular grooming keeps his coat at its water-resistant best. Because of his even temperament and trainability millions of Americans own a Labrador Retriever as a pet. 

If you are considering purchasing a Labrador Retriever puppy, learn more here.

Sporting Group; AKC recognized in 1917 
Average size: from 55 to 75 pounds 
Outgoing and devoted companions; Water dog 
© The American Kennel Club, Inc. 






--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Labrador Retriever Breed Standard
Sporting Group
General Appearance
The Labrador Retriever is a strongly built, medium-sized, short-coupled, dog possessing a sound, athletic, well-balanced conformation that enables it to function as a retrieving gun dog; the substance and soundness to hunt waterfowl or upland game for long hours under difficult conditions; the character and quality to win in the show ring; and the temperament to be a family companion. Physical features and mental characteristics should denote a dog bred to perform as an efficient Retriever of game with a stable temperament suitable for a variety of pursuits beyond the hunting environment.

The most distinguishing characteristics of the Labrador Retriever are its short, dense, weather resistant coat; an "otter" tail; a clean-cut head with broad back skull and moderate stop; powerful jaws; and its "kind," friendly eyes, expressing character, intelligence and good temperament.

Above all, a Labrador Retriever must be well balanced, enabling it to move in the show ring or work in the field with little or no effort. The typical Labrador possesses style and quality without over refinement, and substance without lumber or cloddiness. The Labrador is bred primarily as a working gun dog; structure and soundness are of great importance.

Size, Proportion and Substance
Size--The height at the withers for a dog is 22½ to 24½ inches; for a bitch is 21½ to 23½ inches. Any variance greater than ½ inch above or below these heights is a disqualification. Approximate weight of dogs and bitches in working condition: dogs 65 to 80 pounds; bitches 55 to 70 pounds.

The minimum height ranges set forth in the paragraph above shall not apply to dogs or bitches under twelve months of age.

Proportion--Short-coupled; length from the point of the shoulder to the point of the rump is equal to or slightly longer than the distance from the withers to the ground. Distance from the elbow to the ground should be equal to one half of the height at the withers. The brisket should extend to the elbows, but not perceptibly deeper. The body must be of sufficient length to permit a straight, free and efficient stride; but the dog should never appear low and long or tall and leggy in outline. Substance--Substance and bone proportionate to the overall dog. Light, "weedy" individuals are definitely incorrect; equally objectionable are cloddy lumbering specimens. Labrador Retrievers shall be shown in working condition well-muscled and without excess fat.

Head
Skull--The skull should be wide; well developed but without exaggeration. The skull and foreface should be on parallel planes and of approximately equal length. There should be a moderate stop--the brow slightly pronounced so that the skull is not absolutely in a straight line with the nose. The brow ridges aid in defining the stop. The head should be clean-cut and free from fleshy cheeks; the bony structure of the skull chiseled beneath the eye with no prominence in the cheek. The skull may show some median line; the occipital bone is not conspicuous in mature dogs. Lips should not be squared off or pendulous, but fall away in a curve toward the throat. A wedge-shape head, or a head long and narrow in muzzle and back skull is incorrect as are massive, cheeky heads. The jaws are powerful and free from snippiness-- the muzzle neither long and narrow nor short and stubby. Nose-- The nose should be wide and the nostrils well-developed. The nose should be black on black or yellow dogs, and brown on chocolates. Nose color fading to a lighter shade is not a fault. A thoroughly pink nose or one lacking in any pigment is a disqualification. Teeth--The teeth should be strong and regular with a scissors bite; the lower teeth just behind, but touching the inner side of the upper incisors. A level bite is acceptable, but not desirable. Undershot, overshot, or misaligned teeth are serious faults. Full dentition is preferred. Missing molars or pre-molars are serious faults. Ears--The ears should hang moderately close to the head, set rather far back, and somewhat low on the skull; slightly above eye level. Ears should not be large and heavy, but in proportion with the skull and reach to the inside of the eye when pulled forward. Eyes--Kind, friendly eyes imparting good temperament, intelligence and alertness are a hallmark of the breed. They should be of medium size, set well apart, and neither protruding nor deep set. Eye color should be brown in black and yellow Labradors, and brown or hazel in chocolates. Black, or yellow eyes give a harsh expression and are undesirable. Small eyes, set close together or round prominent eyes are not typical of the breed. Eye rims are black in black and yellow Labradors; and brown in chocolates. Eye rims without pigmentation is a disqualification.

Neck, Topline and Body
Neck--The neck should be of proper length to allow the dog to retrieve game easily. It should be muscular and free from throatiness. The neck should rise strongly from the shoulders with a moderate arch. A short, thick neck or a "ewe" neck is incorrect. Topline--The back is strong and the topline is level from the withers to the croup when standing or moving. However, the loin should show evidence of flexibility for athletic endeavor. Body--The Labrador should be short-coupled, with good spring of ribs tapering to a moderately wide chest. The Labrador should not be narrow chested; giving the appearance of hollowness between the front legs, nor should it have a wide spreading, bulldog-like front. Correct chest conformation will result in tapering between the front legs that allows unrestricted forelimb movement. Chest breadth that is either too wide or too narrow for efficient movement and stamina is incorrect. Slab-sided individuals are not typical of the breed; equally objectionable are rotund or barrel chested specimens. The underline is almost straight, with little or no tuck-up in mature animals. Loins should be short, wide and strong; extending to well developed, powerful hindquarters. When viewed from the side, the Labrador Retriever shows a well-developed, but not exaggerated forechest. Tail--The tail is a distinguishing feature of the breed. It should be very thick at the base, gradually tapering toward the tip, of medium length, and extending no longer than to the hock. The tail should be free from feathering and clothed thickly all around with the Labrador’s short, dense coat, thus having that peculiar rounded appearance that has been described as the "otter" tail. The tail should follow the topline in repose or when in motion. It may be carried gaily, but should not curl over the back. Extremely short tails or long thin tails are serious faults. The tail completes the balance of the Labrador by giving it a flowing line from the top of the head to the tip of the tail. Docking or otherwise altering the length or natural carriage of the tail is a disqualification.

Forequarters
Forequarters should be muscular, well coordinated and balanced with the hindquarters. Shoulders--The shoulders are well laid-back, long and sloping, forming an angle with the upper arm of approximately 90 degrees that permits the dog to move his forelegs in an easy manner with strong forward reach. Ideally, the length of the shoulder blade should equal the length of the upper arm. Straight shoulder blades, short upper arms or heavily muscled or loaded shoulders, all restricting free movement, are incorrect. Front Legs--When viewed from the front, the legs should be straight with good strong bone. Too much bone is as undesirable as too little bone, and short legged, heavy boned individuals are not typical of the breed. Viewed from the side, the elbows should be directly under the withers, and the front legs should be perpendicular to the ground and well under the body. The elbows should be close to the ribs without looseness. Tied-in elbows or being "out at the elbows" interfere with free movement and are serious faults. Pasterns should be strong and short and should slope slightly from the perpendicular line of the leg. Feet are strong and compact, with well-arched toes and well-developed pads. Dew claws may be removed. Splayed feet, hare feet, knuckling over, or feet turning in or out are serious faults. 

Hindquarters
The Labrador’s hindquarters are broad, muscular and well-developed from the hip to the hock with well-turned stifles and strong short hocks. Viewed from the rear, the hind legs are straight and parallel. Viewed from the side, the angulation of the rear legs is in balance with the front. The hind legs are strongly boned, muscled with moderate angulation at the stifle, and powerful, clearly defined thighs. The stifle is strong and there is no slippage of the patellae while in motion or when standing. The hock joints are strong, well let down and do not slip or hyper-extend while in motion or when standing. Angulation of both stifle and hock joint is such as to achieve the optimal balance of drive and traction. When standing the rear toes are only slightly behind the point of the rump. Over angulation produces a sloping topline not typical of the breed. Feet are strong and compact, with well-arched toes and well-developed pads. Cow-hocks, spread hocks, sickle hocks and over-angulation are serious structural defects and are to be faulted.

Coat
The coat is a distinctive feature of the Labrador Retriever. It should be short, straight and very dense, giving a fairly hard feeling to the hand. The Labrador should have a soft, weather-resistant undercoat that provides protection from water, cold and all types of ground cover. A slight wave down the back is permissible. Woolly coats, soft silky coats, and sparse slick coats are not typical of the breed, and should be severely penalized.

Color
The Labrador Retriever coat colors are black, yellow and chocolate. Any other color or a combination of colors is a disqualification. A small white spot on the chest is permissible, but not desirable. White hairs from aging or scarring are not to be misinterpreted as brindling. Black--Blacks are all black. A black with brindle markings or a black with tan markings is a disqualification. Yellow--Yellows may range in color from fox-red to light cream, with variations in shading on the ears, back, and underparts of the dog. Chocolate--Chocolates can vary in shade from light to dark chocolate. Chocolate with brindle or tan markings is a disqualification.

Movement
Movement of the Labrador Retriever should be free and effortless. When watching a dog move toward oneself, there should be no sign of elbows out. Rather, the elbows should be held neatly to the body with the legs not too close together. Moving straight forward without pacing or weaving, the legs should form straight lines, with all parts moving in the same plane. Upon viewing the dog from the rear, one should have the impression that the hind legs move as nearly as possible in a parallel line with the front legs. The hocks should do their full share of the work, flexing well, giving the appearance of power and strength. When viewed from the side, the shoulders should move freely and effortlessly, and the foreleg should reach forward close to the ground with extension. A short, choppy movement or high knee action indicates a straight shoulder; paddling indicates long, weak pasterns; and a short, stilted rear gait indicates a straight rear assembly; all are serious faults. Movement faults interfering with performance including weaving; side-winding; crossing over; high knee action; paddling; and short, choppy movement, should be severely penalized.

*Temperament
True Labrador Retriever temperament is as much a hallmark of the breed as the "otter" tail. The ideal disposition is one of a kindly, outgoing, tractable nature; eager to please and non-aggressive towards man or animal. The Labrador has much that appeals to people; his gentle ways, intelligence and adaptability make him an ideal dog. Aggressiveness towards humans or other animals, or any evidence of shyness in an adult should be severely penalized. *

Disqualifications

Any deviation from the height prescribed in the Standard. 
A thoroughly pink nose or one lacking in any pigment. 
Eye rims without pigment. 
Docking or otherwise altering the length or natural carriage of the tail. 
Any other color or a combination of colors other than black, yellow or chocolate as described in the Standard. 
Approved February 12, 1994
Effective March 31, 1994 

Labrador Retriever Links
Colors and Markings |  Did You Know? |  History |  Photos


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## ctenidae (Jan 8, 2009)

Isn't that pretty much the temperment standard for most dogs? I mean, aside for Crazy Borneo Man Eaters or something.

And don't get me started on AKC breed standards and their effect on dog breeding. "Perfect" AKC German Shepherds are almost cruelty to animals.


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## campgottagopee (Jan 8, 2009)

ctenidae said:


> Isn't that pretty much the temperment standard for most dogs? I mean, aside for Crazy Borneo Man Eaters or something.
> 
> And don't get me started on AKC breed standards and their effect on dog breeding. "Perfect" AKC German Shepherds are almost cruelty to animals.



Don't know---I only know (very little) about Labs---Those standards are what a Labrador would be "graded" on during a show.


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## Dr Skimeister (Jan 8, 2009)

I get flack from breeder types all the time when I assert that the distinction between "field type" and "bench type" is nothing more than personal preference. The same applies to the personal preference one may have for black vs. yellow vs. chocolate.  Let me first state that I have never hunted anything more than a vacant parking spot. Conversations I've had over the years with Lab owners and breeders, as well as my own experience as a Lab owner for the last 23 years lead me to believe that the dog becomes what it's trained and encouraged to become. Actually, that statement applies to any dog of any breed or mixture thereof.

The selection made over hundreds of years has lead to Labs having a higher percentage body fat than most other breeds of dogs. With that knowledge, it's easy to understand why Labs will appear obese readily when caloric intake is in excess of caloric expenditure. The big jump in caloric intake that accompanies the inappropriate feeding of "people food" amplifies the problem.

Labs are great dogs. I can't see myself ever not having one for a pet. That's a personal preference that works for my lifestyle and family situation. The original poster for this thread should consider his/her living and family situation in narrowing down the choices for the dog he/she may get. Do yourself and whatever dog you decide to get a favor and do a lot more research on various breeds before you make your decision.
The idea of rescue from a shelter is a great one, but be sure you're aware of some of the hazards one could encounter with a dog that's been surrendered. And....be sure to get the dog spayed/neutered!!!


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## campgottagopee (Jan 8, 2009)

Dr Skimeister said:


> I get flack from breeder types all the time when I assert that the distinction between "field type" and "bench type" is nothing more than personal preference. The same applies to the personal preference one may have for black vs. yellow vs. chocolate.  Let me first state that I have never hunted anything more than a vacant parking spot. Conversations I've had over the years with Lab owners and breeders, as well as my own experience as a Lab owner for the last 23 years lead me to believe that the dog becomes what it's trained and encouraged to become. Actually, that statement applies to any dog of any breed or mixture thereof.
> 
> The selection made over hundreds of years has lead to Labs having a higher percentage body fat than most other breeds of dogs. With that knowledge, it's easy to understand why Labs will appear obese readily when caloric intake is in excess of caloric expenditure. The big jump in caloric intake that accompanies the inappropriate feeding of "people food" amplifies the problem.
> 
> Labs are great dogs. I can't see myself ever not having one for a pet. That's a personal preference that works for my lifestyle and family situation.* The original poster for this thread should consider his/her living and family situation in narrowing down the choices for the dog he/she may get. Do yourself and whatever dog you decide to get a favor and do a lot more research on various breeds before you make your decision.*The idea of rescue from a shelter is a great one, but be sure you're aware of some of the hazards one could encounter with a dog that's been surrendered. And....be sure to get the dog spayed/neutered!!!



That is VERY good advise Doc---if more people did that then maybe we wouoldn't have all these pets up for adoption. My cousins breed Labs so I knew what I was in for.


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## Marc (Jan 8, 2009)

campgottagopee said:


> Uhm, not really trying to split hairs but this is from the AKC----breed standards for the Labrador Retriever. Please note the last standard.
> Information on AKC Labrador Retriever Puppies
> s



It's cool.  I'm enjoying have a back and forth with you.  I don't get to do that often without it degenerating into name calling (I always seem to be the one getting called the name too...)

What I say to the AKC guidelines, which I am familiar with, is that breeders going for show quality know there's only so much a judge can discern about the disposition of a particular animal in a show setting.  So it's less of a concern for a dog bred solely to win in shows.  My parents first lab came from a very well known breeder and had very good lineage, with picture and AKC documents and ribbons from the shows the parents won, etc etc.

The dog, for a lab, could be miserable.  Now often a lab on its worse day is better than a lot of breeds on their best days, but regardless... it had an insatiable chewing habit.  Eventually had to be relegated to the garage where it ate the rubber door molding off my mom's Oldsmobile.... and when I say ate, I mean consumed it in its entirety in one night.

She was nippy too.  Nothing malicious, but lacked judgment.  And my parents probably share some blame, as they had two young children plus a puppy.  The puppy probably didn't get the training it should have.

My parents' friends went through a similar breeder with similar results.

My parents second lab came from another well know, reputable breeder.  This one was well known in the area for breeding hunting dogs.  Came highly recommended by a state trooper we know who is an avid hunter and lab owner.  All his dogs had none of the typical lab issues (skin problems, bad hips, etc).

They bought a yellow puppy from this breeder.  The bitch's tail came to below its hocks when relaxed... it curled like a candy cane when alert.  She has a slender head, a slender body... dark markings around the ears, light on the shoulders.  She has a "dudley" nose and eyes.  All undesirable show characteristics but turned out to be the best pet they'd ever owned.  Anecdotal, yes, but telling at the same time, I think.

And don't take that like I'm trying to say all show dogs will have a worse demeanor, all I'm saying is there is more variation for the reasons I've listed.


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## hammer (Jan 8, 2009)

Does anyone here like smaller dogs?  Seems like they aren't too popular with many AZers...

FWIW, my neighborhood is full of Labs and Golden Retrievers...my guess is that they are perceived as being easier to take care of.


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## campgottagopee (Jan 8, 2009)

Marc said:


> It's cool.  I'm enjoying have a back and forth with you.  I don't get to do that often without it degenerating into name calling (I always seem to be the one getting called the name too...)
> 
> What I say to the AKC guidelines, which I am familiar with, is that breeders going for show quality know there's only so much a judge can discern about the disposition of a particular animal in a show setting.  So it's less of a concern for a dog bred solely to win in shows.  My parents first lab came from a very well known breeder and had very good lineage, with picture and AKC documents and ribbons from the shows the parents won, etc etc.
> 
> ...



No name calling here----Honestly I think you could find any lab have those same issues you described in your first lab, afterall they are dogs--right??? It's like the good Doc said, "It's a personal choice", and that's why we have 2. My cousins breed bench/english dogs that are incredible hunters. That's the look I like so that's why we have Bode---the dude's a bull in a china shop until he's in the field. Then there's Pica (short for Picaboo Street), she's my wifes---field/american, that's the look she likes, also a good hunter. Don't EVER tell my wife this, but truth be told Pica is a better hunter than Bode. Oh, and she's a Dudley too----in part that's why we got her. My wife fell in love w/ her in about 2 seconds, and obviously the $$$$ was better due to the Dudley....still don't get that other than it can't be shown, whatever, she hunts her little ass off. Guess it all boils down to whatever trips your trigger.


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## campgottagopee (Jan 8, 2009)

hammer said:


> Does anyone here like smaller dogs?



NO :razz:


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## Marc (Jan 8, 2009)

campgottagopee said:


> NO :razz:



Serial.  We can agree on that.  :dunce:


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## campgottagopee (Jan 8, 2009)

Marc said:


> Serial.  We can agree on that.  :dunce:



Now you're talkin---plus we know tractors are cool!!!!!


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## ctenidae (Jan 8, 2009)

One of the realtors I know in Boston rates neighborhoods by the dogs that are there.
The ranking goes from pit bulls (not the nicest places to buy a home) to small fluffy dogs (up and coming, revitalizing) to golden retrievers (couples, 2.4 kids,etc)


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## campgottagopee (Jan 8, 2009)

ctenidae said:


> One of the realtors I know in Boston rates neighborhoods by the dogs that are there.
> The ranking goes from pit bulls (not the nicest places to buy a home) to small fluffy dogs (up and coming, revitalizing) to golden retrievers (couples, 2.4 kids,etc)



That's crap---Pits get a bad rap and fluffy dogs are for people who don't ski :argue:


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## ctenidae (Jan 8, 2009)

campgottagopee said:


> That's crap---Pits get a bad rap and fluffy dogs are for people who don't ski :argue:



I think it relates more to the socioeconomic status of the neighborhood, then the overall sexual orientation, then the socioeconomic status and overall sexual orientation.

But yes, pits get a bad rap (owner's fault), and fluffy dog owners don't ski.


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## tjf67 (Jan 8, 2009)

Marc said:


> It's cool.  I'm enjoying have a back and forth with you.  I don't get to do that often without it degenerating into name calling (I always seem to be the one getting called the name too...)
> 
> What I say to the AKC guidelines, which I am familiar with, is that breeders going for show quality know there's only so much a judge can discern about the disposition of a particular animal in a show setting.  So it's less of a concern for a dog bred solely to win in shows.  My parents first lab came from a very well known breeder and had very good lineage, with picture and AKC documents and ribbons from the shows the parents won, etc etc.
> 
> ...



yeah OK


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## tjf67 (Jan 8, 2009)

Dr Skimeister said:


> I get flack from breeder types all the time when I assert that the distinction between "field type" and "bench type" is nothing more than personal preference. The same applies to the personal preference one may have for black vs. yellow vs. chocolate.  Let me first state that I have never hunted anything more than a vacant parking spot. Conversations I've had over the years with Lab owners and breeders, as well as my own experience as a Lab owner for the last 23 years lead me to believe that the dog becomes what it's trained and encouraged to become. Actually, that statement applies to any dog of any breed or mixture thereof.
> 
> The selection made over hundreds of years has lead to Labs having a higher percentage body fat than most other breeds of dogs. With that knowledge, it's easy to understand why Labs will appear obese readily when caloric intake is in excess of caloric expenditure. The big jump in caloric intake that accompanies the inappropriate feeding of "people food" amplifies the problem.
> 
> ...




But doc  some dogs are just retarded and you have to recognize it and deal with it.  You can train and encourage your dog as good as anyone, If there is something wrong uptstairs you have to do something different


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## Dr Skimeister (Jan 9, 2009)

hammer said:


> Does anyone here like smaller dogs?  Seems like they aren't too popular with many AZers...
> 
> FWIW, my neighborhood is full of Labs and Golden Retrievers...my guess is that they are perceived as being easier to take care of.



In addition to my 6+ year old chocolate Lab, I have an 18+ year old Toy Fox Terrier.


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## BLESS (Jan 9, 2009)

this is my girl.


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## BLESS (Jan 9, 2009)

and a couple more obligatory puppy shots.


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## Dr Skimeister (Jan 9, 2009)

This is "Schnook" when he was 6 weeks....

His given name is actually Dylan, but as his personallity became more apparent, he was called "Schnook"


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## campgottagopee (Jan 9, 2009)

Here's my 2---Bode choc, and Pica yeller


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## campgottagopee (Jan 9, 2009)

bless said:


> and a couple more obligatory puppy shots.





dr skimeister said:


> this is "schnook" when he was 6 weeks....
> 
> His given name is actually dylan, but as his personallity became more apparent, he was called "schnook"



handsome!!!!!


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## Nick (Dec 14, 2011)

I <3 my 2 labs


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## ctenidae (Dec 14, 2011)

Swamp Dog said:


> Swamp Dog likes hers toasted?



Zing!
/golf clap
//well played

///just saw how old the thread is


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