# Progress on Deer Valley's New Sister Resort



## thetrailboss (Jun 10, 2021)

We've talked previously about this Project--Mayflower.  It is located BELOW Bald Mountain at Deer Valley, and BELOW Sultan Express.  It is in between U.S. 40 and Deer Valley Resort.

Apparently they are getting $250-260 million in bonds to "accelerate" construction.  In other words, it sounds like they ran out of money.  Apparently they have $170 million raised for other construction.  So in total they have about $430 million invested or to be invested so far. 

Of that, the money is being allocated as follows: "115 million to the moral welfare recreation conference hotel" and $53 million for other hotels. 

The apparent total for this project is $3.2 billion.  At least according to UN.  Consider the source.  That seems like an awful lot of money and really raises my antennae as to what is going on here.  To put it in perspective, we just built the new SLC Airport for $4 billion. 









						Mayflower Mountain Resort in Utah Receives $250 Million in Bonds to Ramp Up Construction
					

“The New York-based developer pursuing the project, Gary Barnett, flew in to attend the MIDA board meeting on Tuesday, telling officials he was ‘very, very confident’ the project …




					unofficialnetworks.com
				




The Park Record's Story (more credible):









						Mayflower Mountain Resort to receive up to $260 million in MIDA-approved bonds
					

The military authority overseeing the construction of the proposed Mayflower Mountain Resort has approved up to $260 million in bonds to help finance the project.




					www.parkrecord.com


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## thetrailboss (Jun 10, 2021)

One big reason for my suspicion.....



> One of the hotels will include 100 rooms dedicated to military personnel, a “military welfare recreation” facility that is the reason for MIDA’s involvement. The block of rooms is the latest plan to replace a small ski lodge near Snowbasin Resort that the U.S. Air Force used before the 2002 Olympics.
> 
> The former Hill Haus chateau has morphed into a multi-billion dollar resort that Barnett claims will be the first of its kind built in 40 years.


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## FBGM (Jun 10, 2021)

They did run out of money. This whole junk show was put in pause during Covid and I’d assume that’s where funding or money was lost.

This project is trash. They even came out and said a while ago they don’t care about the skiing and it’s more for hotels and real estate. Which makes sense because the skiing will be horrible. And the last thing that Jordenelle area needs is more hosing. Wasatch county don’t give a fuck, build more homes. Keep them coming. Who cares about where the water comes from or the traffic. That entire Jordenelle area is a cluster fuck. Oh, and I’m sure they will have “affordable housing” options. Here’s your 2 bed condo for $499k. It’s well under market value so it’s “affordable” 

I hope this project fails. Yes it will be a scar and cluster when sits empty and unfinished. But whatever. Fuck them.

Even on a good winter that base area will have 2 months of snow if that. Such horrible elevation and aspect.

Park City area might as well be Los Angles east. I usually flip the bird to anyone with a Cali plate these days.


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## thetrailboss (Jun 10, 2021)

FBGM said:


> They did run out of money. This whole junk show was put in pause during Covid and I’d assume that’s where funding or money was lost.
> 
> This project is trash. They even came out and said a while ago they don’t care about the skiing and it’s more for hotels and real estate. Which makes sense because the skiing will be horrible. And the last thing that Jordenelle area needs is more hosing. Wasatch county don’t give a fuck, build more homes. Keep them coming. Who cares about where the water comes from or the traffic. That entire Jordenelle area is a cluster fuck. Oh, and I’m sure they will have “affordable housing” options. Here’s your 2 bed condo for $499k. It’s well under market value so it’s “affordable”
> 
> ...


Tell me how you really feel.    

And I realized that Jesus turned water into wine; LDS Jesus turned an old ski chalet into a $3.2 billion real estate boondoggle.


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## thetrailboss (Jun 10, 2021)

....and their "assumption" that Deer Valley would just take this as part of their own resort is in and of itself the definition of 'assume' in that it makes an ass of u and me.


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## FBGM (Jun 10, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> Tell me how you really feel.
> 
> And I realized that Jesus turned water into wine; LDS Jesus turned an old ski chalet into a $3.2 billion real estate boondoggle.


LDS Jesus also said pray for rain? Obviously we are not praying enough….


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## thetrailboss (Jun 10, 2021)

FBGM said:


> LDS Jesus also said pray for rain? Obviously we are not praying enough….


Exactly.  Don't turn your lawn sprinklers off, or slow down the construction of new homes.  Just pray.


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## urungus (Jun 10, 2021)

FBGM said:


> the last thing that Jordenelle area needs is more hosing.



LOL


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## thetrailboss (Jun 10, 2021)

urungus said:


> LOL


I know.  Hosing and housing.


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## thetrailboss (Jun 10, 2021)

So....are any of you in the market for a house or unit at this wonderful development?


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## FBGM (Jun 11, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> So....are any of you in the market for a house or unit at this wonderful development?


If so, don’t plan on getting it or moving in for 2+ years at the earliest. But I’m sure you’ll have to pay upfront. Then more delays. Then the resort will go cheaper 11 maybe in 3-4 years. Then you are screwed. This place is a red flag


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## thetrailboss (Jun 11, 2021)

FBGM said:


> If so, don’t plan on getting it or moving in for 2+ years at the earliest. But I’m sure you’ll have to pay upfront. Then more delays. Then the resort will go cheaper 11 maybe in 3-4 years. Then you are screwed. This place is a red flag


What is Cheaper 11?  

It seems like a scam on multiple levels.  How a run down ski chalet gets turned into a $3.2 billion development is very interesting.  Obviously a lot of opportunists got involved here.  And the fact that Deer Valley does not want anything to do with this is a major red flag.


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## Zand (Jun 11, 2021)

When did Ariel Quiros move to Utah?


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## FBGM (Jun 11, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> What is Cheaper 11?
> 
> It seems like a scam on multiple levels.  How a run down ski chalet gets turned into a $3.2 billion development is very interesting.  Obviously a lot of opportunists got involved here.  And the fact that Deer Valley does not want anything to do with this is a major red flag.


At the rate we are going a wild fire might just take the place out before anything. Better get some lifts and equipment in first so the insurance check is higher.


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## JoeB-Z (Jun 11, 2021)

If we build it, they will come. What could go wrong? And they military is backing some of the bonds? Bond defaults are so ugly for those who thought their money was safe.


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## thetrailboss (Jun 11, 2021)

JoeB-Z said:


> If we build it, they will come. What could go wrong? And they military is backing some of the bonds? Bond defaults are so ugly for those who thought their money was safe.


It's not the military that is backing the bonds.  It is a "special service district" created about 20 years ago by the State.  If you read the PCR article you quickly realize that the development itself is going to provide the security--assuming it gets built.

And as to "build it and they will come", well, maybe.  PC is pretty built out already and DV is no longer the posh exclusive destination it once was.  It is IKONized.  IKON passholders ain't going to buy 7-figure homes in this development.  

Also, as said, this terrain sucks for skiing.  No snow and too low.  The only thing going for it is being near Jordanelle Reservoir but that is getting overcrowded and water levels fluctuate so that beaches and boating are not too great (it is pretty low now).


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## mbedle (Jun 11, 2021)

I think an other issue is how is this place going to be tied into Dear Valley which is a skier only mountain. Snowboarders have no access to Dear Valley lifts??? I guess it might end up being the same as Snowbird and Alta. That leaves basically a 1,200 vertical mountain for snowboards, with skiers being able to access the Dear Valley upper terrain. Good luck with that...


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## jaytrem (Jun 11, 2021)

How much longer can that stupid snowboard ban last?  Was hoping Ikon would get rid of it even though it has no effect on me.


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## thetrailboss (Jun 11, 2021)

mbedle said:


> I think an other issue is how is this place going to be tied into Dear Valley which is a skier only mountain. Snowboarders have no access to Dear Valley lifts??? I guess it might end up being the same as Snowbird and Alta. That leaves basically a 1,200 vertical mountain for snowboards, with skiers being able to access the Dear Valley upper terrain. Good luck with that...


Well, the larger issue is that Deer Valley STILL has not agreed to assume control of the ski area portion of this resort.  I would think that this would have been one of the FIRST issues that would have been resolved because it is not sustainable on its own.  Think about Spanish Peaks at Big Sky--NOT enough terrain to be its own resort and eventually bought by Boyne.  

Now as to snowboarding, in my mind it seems inevitable.  Alterra is doing all this happy crap about diversity and trying to be all PC.  Well, having a skier only mountain at least arguably undercuts that message.  And it seems like Alterra has been mainstreaming DV anyway.  So I think that it will change.  

That will push a lot of the bigger home owners and richer families to jump ship.  A lot of them already have because it's NOT the same and it is too crowded.  So guess where they are going?  Hint: a former Deer Valley President is managing this new venture and at least one former DVR owner is behind this new upstart.  Still don't get it?  Well, it is getting two new lifts this year and some houses are starting to go up.  It is here:  https://wasatchpeaksranch.com/


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## FBGM (Jun 11, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> Well, the larger issue is that Deer Valley STILL has not agreed to assume control of the ski area portion of this resort.  I would think that this would have been one of the FIRST issues that would have been resolved because it is not sustainable on its own.  Think about Spanish Peaks at Big Sky--NOT enough terrain to be its own resort and eventually bought by Boyne.
> 
> Now as to snowboarding, in my mind it seems inevitable.  Alterra is doing all this happy crap about diversity and trying to be all PC.  Well, having a skier only mountain at least arguably undercuts that message.  And it seems like Alterra has been mainstreaming DV anyway.  So I think that it will change.
> 
> That will push a lot of the bigger home owners and richer families to jump ship.  A lot of them already have because it's NOT the same and it is too crowded.  So guess where they are going?  Hint: a former Deer Valley President is managing this new venture and at least one former DVR owner is behind this new upstart.  Still don't get it?  Well, it is getting two new lifts this year and some houses are starting to go up.  It is here:  https://wasatchpeaksranch.com/


You drive over by Morgan yet? Curious if construction is going. They are pretty tight lipped on what is actually happening. From what I’ve been told they are green lit and shot be going. Just haven’t ventured that direction in a while


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## thetrailboss (Jun 11, 2021)

FBGM said:


> You drive over by Morgan yet? Curious if construction is going. They are pretty tight lipped on what is actually happening. From what I’ve been told they are green lit and shot be going. Just haven’t ventured that direction in a while


Driven by twice in the last month--specifically to see what is going on.  I have not gotten any pics because the lighting was bad.  One can see the road is in place and that other infrastructure is going in.  Also one can see that they are grading some ski trails.  I've not been able to see any ski lift towers yet but I would imagine later this summer.  

Their website has no real information.  I knew that Bob Wheaton was their "President" but I recently read that Stern's kids are invested in this whole operation.  Basically it is Deer Valley II going in.  And the timing is very interesting--probably just long enough so any "non-compete" has now expired and also in response to Alterra going all IKON on Deer Valley.


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## machski (Jun 14, 2021)

Flew in and out of Heber City yesterday.  What a scar the new Mayflower resort is.  They had better have some damn good snowmaking, that low and southeastern exposure.


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## FBGM (Jun 14, 2021)

machski said:


> Flew in and out of Heber City yesterday.  What a scar the new Mayflower resort is.  They had better have some damn good snowmaking, that low and southeastern exposure.


Right?!?

I have no idea what their snowmaking capacity will be. And I’m guessing they are pulling from the Jordenelle which could get capped or limited at the rate we are going. Deer Valley gondola side is the same, but that’s just 2 trails for the gondola and rich peeps that side - and that stuff struggles to make it till closing….


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## thetrailboss (Jun 14, 2021)

FBGM said:


> Right?!?
> 
> I have no idea what their snowmaking capacity will be. And I’m guessing they are pulling from the Jordenelle which could get capped or limited at the rate we are going. Deer Valley gondola side is the same, but that’s just 2 trails for the gondola and rich peeps that side - and that stuff struggles to make it till closing….


I think if truth be told they have not yet resolved that.  They seem to think that any day now Deer Valley/Alterra is going to step in and take over the skiing portion of this project.  I would not be surprised if they just assume that it will plug into Deer Valley's system.

One thing that is interesting is that DV (or one of the realtors) used to have a 3-D model of the resort in Snow Park Lodge with all the real estate developments shown.  They used it for marketing.  THIS development was on it several years ago--albeit in a different configuration.  I also recall DVR once being involved in this development but over the last couple years they have not been involved (actually, after Alterra took it over I have not seen any mention of involvement in this project and media reports make it clear that DVR is NOT involved in this project).

I think that this is too late for the PC market, which is already pretty saturated.  As I said I don't see much of a market for this high-end stuff now that DV is IKON and Wasatch Peaks Ranch is starting to siphon that high end away.  As said the location sucks for skiing.  It seems more and more like someone is desperately trying to shoe-horn this into a place where there is no need and where it will not be viable.


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## thetrailboss (Jun 14, 2021)

And I have not seen this flashy promo video before--or if I have it has been a long time.  Some of the claims at the beginning as to size are just ridiculous and facially incorrect.






The video works...but you have to watch it on Vimeo.  And the similarities between this and the Jay/Burke EB-5 videos, with government officials openly endorsing this project, is spooky.  This seems too good to be true and probably is.


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## thetrailboss (Jun 14, 2021)

Well, they all smiled for the cameras last week:









						Mayflower’s Air Force hotel replacement, now part of a new ski resort, breaks ground
					

Officials broke ground Wednesday on the first hotel of the Mayflower Mountain Resort, which is to replace a U.S. Air Force recreation facility that was shuttered in the run-up to the 2002 Olympic Games.




					www.parkrecord.com
				




Interesting that the CURRENT Governor was not there.  That should tell you something,

And the "benefit" to those currently enlisted shrinks everyday:



> They were celebrating the beginning of construction of a U.S. Air Force “morale, welfare and recreation” facility, a block of 100 reserved rooms in a planned 442-room hotel at the base of what is planned to become the Mayflower Mountain Resort.
> 
> The reserved rooms will be offered at heavily discounted rates to members of the military. The hotel itself is planned to cost $390 million, cover nearly 5 acres and total 642,000 square feet.



Again, for those not in the know, the whole genesis of this development was that Snowbasin/the Olympics took over a small ski chalet that Hill Airforce Base personnel used.  In order to "pay them back," the MIDA was created--to give these enlisted personnel land that magically was not subject to any local tax or land use laws.  Apparently, they were going to "get" the base area at Park City/Canyons but that project failed so this land will do.  

So of course they can't do anything with that land so we now need a NY developer and $3.2 billion to build all this stuff that is unrelated to their "ski chalet" which now is in the form of "deeply discounted rooms" of a yet-to-be built hotel.  Yes, this sounds very easy to understand and so transparent.



> “Mr. Barnett’s vision for this area far surpasses the original vision,” Farrell said.



No shit, Sherlock. 



> What officials call the MWR hotel is a replacement for a former Air Force recreation facility at Snowbasin Resort that was closed in the run-up to the 2002 Olympics to make room for the downhill ski competition, according to Utah State Senator Jerry Stevenson.



Again, amazing how a ski chalet becomes a $3.2 billion project.  



> “If you’d have told me in 2002 that we could’ve moved that military facility into a project that has the amenities and the capacity of the project that Mr. Barnett is building, it would’ve made us all giggle,” Adams said.



Yes, this is sooo funny.  I am laughing as to this coincidence as well.


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## thetrailboss (Jun 14, 2021)

Local feedback is not too positive......





__ https://www.facebook.com/parkrecord/posts/4484562478242239


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## thetrailboss (Jun 14, 2021)

Tom Clyde: The biggest Wasatch Back development snafu that no one is talking about
					

How does a 1960s A-frame lodge on Forest Service land turn into a mega-development covering 8 square miles in Wasatch County? That’s an interesting story, and the answer is




					www.parkrecord.com


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## raisingarizona (Jun 20, 2021)

In ten years snowboarding will be allowed at DV and all of the PC area ski resorts will be connected.

in 20 years I bet the One Wasatch plan will be in motion. 

As long as there are lifts planned that can down load people from upper elevations the project makes sense, well except for that dang climate science. If the science is correct, almost no ski area development actually makes any sense but humans are extremely short sighted.


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## FBGM (Jun 21, 2021)

raisingarizona said:


> In ten years snowboarding will be allowed at DV and all of the PC area ski resorts will be connected.
> 
> in 20 years I bet the One Wasatch plan will be in motion.
> 
> As long as there are lifts planned that can down load people from upper elevations the project makes sense, well except for that dang climate science. If the science is correct, almost no ski area development actually makes any sense but humans are extremely short sighted.


In 20 years this new resort may be done. Drove by yesterday and it looked the same as 16 months ago. Good luck…


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## thetrailboss (Jun 21, 2021)

FBGM said:


> In 20 years this new resort may be done. Drove by yesterday and it looked the same as 16 months ago. Good luck…


Hey now that is $400 million of work there.


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## BenedictGomez (Jun 25, 2021)

The genesis of this project is clearly a scam, some intrepid reporter should investigate.

But what I want to know is, what the hell is the utility of this monstrosity?

 If you're vacationing in the area you want to be in Park City, not the wraparound void between Park City & Heber City.  Looking at a terrain map, the skiing would be mostly low-angle beginner and intermediate, and only useful to connect to Deer Valley.   And Park City isnt exactly a conference meca, sure they have some, but they seem to be smaller & mostly roll through The St. Regis Deer Valley, which has much better location & prestige.  Selling lots of condos?  Meh, not where I'd want to buy.  I think if I were a condo buyer I'd again, just buy in Park City or the myriad inventory at Canyons.   I dont get this project at all.


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## jimk (Jun 25, 2021)

I skied down to the bottom and rode the Jordanelle Gondi for the first time this winter.  Tons of mcmansions over there and nice views of the reservoir, but limited amount of snow and runs, many were cat-tracky.  Very much set up as a lift to serve real estate owners rather than a lift to access high interest ski terrain.  To develop more of that in the same area to serve more mcmansions that sit empty 90% of the time does seem unnecessary.

This photo was of a friend inside the Jordanelle Gondola, taken early April, 2021.  You can see how dry and dusty the terrain is looking up the gondi line.  It's also crisscrossed with little access roads.  I assume the new, nearby development would have about the same elevation and exposure.


We stopped to look at this mcmansion on the run down to the gondi.  Just what you need for a house full of tired, but well heeled skiers, that tall glass structure is an elevator.


View of the Jordanelle Reservoir at Deer Valley, heading to gondola base, Apr 2021, Deer Valley, UT


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## drjeff (Jun 25, 2021)

jimk said:


> I skied down to the bottom and rode the Jordanelle Gondi for the first time this winter.  Tons of mcmansions over there and nice views of the reservoir, but limited amount of snow and runs, many were cat-tracky.  Very much set up as a lift to serve real estate owners rather than a lift to access high interest ski terrain.  To develop more of that in the same area to serve more mcmansions that sit empty 90% of the time does seem unnecessary.
> 
> This photo was of a friend inside the Jordanelle Gondola, taken early April, 2021.  You can see how dry and dusty the terrain is looking up the gondi line.  It's also crisscrossed with little access roads.  I assume the new, nearby development would have about the same elevation and exposure.
> View attachment 51743
> ...


Always enjoyed ripping some GS turns down Jordanelle with the family when we've skied DV. Has some fun pitch to let the skis go a bit most of the way down until you get to that maybe 120 degree right hander maybe a 1/4 mile or so before you get to the gondola terminal.

My kids an I usually would have to wait for my wife to get to the bottom, as she certainly is guilty of some serious house gawking when we all would take that trail (and numerous others at DV!)


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## FBGM (Jun 25, 2021)

jimk said:


> I skied down to the bottom and rode the Jordanelle Gondi for the first time this winter.  Tons of mcmansions over there and nice views of the reservoir, but limited amount of snow and runs, many were cat-tracky.  Very much set up as a lift to serve real estate owners rather than a lift to access high interest ski terrain.  To develop more of that in the same area to serve more mcmansions that sit empty 90% of the time does seem unnecessary.
> 
> This photo was of a friend inside the Jordanelle Gondola, taken early April, 2021.  You can see how dry and dusty the terrain is looking up the gondi line.  It's also crisscrossed with little access roads.  I assume the new, nearby development would have about the same elevation and exposure.
> View attachment 51743
> ...


You’re right. The terrain and aspect of this new wack project is same aspect and lack of snow. The Jordenelle trail is not bad and view is good. That’s about it. If you’re on the lake or other side looking at the trail/development it looks like shit. But if you have a $15m second home there, the view out is great. But if I had a spare $15m owning or building in that development would not even cross my mind.


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## BenedictGomez (Jun 26, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> So guess where they are going?  Hint: a former Deer Valley President is managing this new venture and at least one former DVR owner is behind this new upstart.  Still don't get it?  Well, it is getting two new lifts this year and some houses are starting to go up.  *It is here:  **https://wasatchpeaksranch.com/*



So I first learned of that project about 1.5 years ago, looked it up casually, seemed a pipedream, and didnt think much of it.  Fast forward to tonight, and holy flipping Spaceballs, that's a TEN MILE LONG ski area as planned (see my pic linked).  Is the entrance right off 84?

My curiosity is, if it really is only for the uber-rich, how can you run one of the largest ski properties on the planet with what I imagine is a small clientele?  Only thing I can think  of is you go with the Liberty National model & charge a $500,000 initiation fee and then like $30,000 per year, but what a waste if so.  The place would literally, not figuratively be empty.  Or maybe it wouldnt be so "exclusive" at all & they'll just charge $300 for lift tickets to keep the unwashed away.  Either way, I'm intrigued to learn about their business model.


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## mbedle (Jun 26, 2021)

BenedictGomez said:


> So I first learned of that project about 1.5 years ago, looked it up casually, seemed a pipedream, and didnt think much of it.  Fast forward to tonight, and holy flipping Spaceballs, that's a TEN MILE LONG ski area as planned (see my pic linked).  Is the entrance right off 84?
> 
> My curiosity is, if it really is only for the uber-rich, how can you run one of the largest ski properties on the planet with what I imagine is a small clientele?  Only thing I can think  of is you go with the Liberty National model & charge a $500,000 initiation fee and then like $30,000 per year, but what a waste if so.  The place would literally, not figuratively be empty.  Or maybe it wouldnt be so "exclusive" at all & they'll just charge $300 for lift tickets to keep the unwashed away.  Either way, I'm intrigued to learn about their business model.


It looks like there will be multiple entrances including off of 84 and out of Peterson. It also does not look like the skiing is planned across the entire Ridgeline.


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## BenedictGomez (Jun 26, 2021)

mbedle said:


> It also does not look like the skiing is planned across the entire Ridgeline.



I guess that would make sense then.  When I saw the map of their property & saw that it was all continuous mountain & that they were saying how it would be one of the biggest in N.A., I figured that they meant the whole thing.


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## FBGM (Jul 1, 2021)

M


BenedictGomez said:


> So I first learned of that project about 1.5 years ago, looked it up casually, seemed a pipedream, and didnt think much of it.  Fast forward to tonight, and holy flipping Spaceballs, that's a TEN MILE LONG ski area as planned (see my pic linked).  Is the entrance right off 84?
> 
> My curiosity is, if it really is only for the uber-rich, how can you run one of the largest ski properties on the planet with what I imagine is a small clientele?  Only thing I can think  of is you go with the Liberty National model & charge a $500,000 initiation fee and then like $30,000 per year, but what a waste if so.  The place would literally, not figuratively be empty.  Or maybe it wouldnt be so "exclusive" at all & they'll just charge $300 for lift tickets to keep the unwashed away.  Either way, I'm intrigued to learn about their business model.


ski area is not all that. Much smaller. They own all that stuff, but won’t ski develop it all


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## thetrailboss (Jul 30, 2021)

Construction continues on the hotel, but no progress on ski infrastructure that is "2-4 years" out supposedly.  









						Subdivision in Mayflower Resort Nears Final Approval
					

With one hotel already under construction, the first residential neighborhood in the Mayflower Mountain Resort, on the back side of Deer Valley Resort in…




					www.kpcw.org


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## BenedictGomez (Jul 31, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> Construction continues on the hotel, but *no progress on ski infrastructure that is "2-4 years" out supposedly. *



Aren't construction legalities your forte?   What do you think the odds are this ends up being a complete cluster**** of a spider web of lawsuits & a total mess?

Alternatively, could this thing be a trojan horse excuse just to get the 66 townhomes & 36 (I'm sure very nice & very expensive) homes built?  Those will 100% sell in this market & bring in a fortune.  I see somewhat unimpressive homes in Heber that were $400,000 a few years ago listing for $750,000 now.  And the expense for "hiking & biking trails already under construction" is totally minimal.  I just don't see the need for big hotels there, and I think it's a terrible place for a convention center.  But the fact the entire thing is under the auspicious promise of a ski resort, but yet there's no real info on said ski resort, makes this look like a gigantic scam to me.


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## FBGM (Aug 3, 2021)

BenedictGomez said:


> Aren't construction legalities your forte?   What do you think the odds are this ends up being a complete cluster**** of a spider web of lawsuits & a total mess?
> 
> Alternatively, could this thing be a trojan horse excuse just to get the 66 townhomes & 36 (I'm sure very nice & very expensive) homes built?  Those will 100% sell in this market & bring in a fortune.  I see somewhat unimpressive homes in Heber that were $400,000 a few years ago listing for $750,000 now.  And the expense for "hiking & biking trails already under construction" is totally minimal.  I just don't see the need for big hotels there, and I think it's a terrible place for a convention center.  But the fact the entire thing is under the auspicious promise of a ski resort, but yet there's no real info on said ski resort, makes this look like a gigantic scam to me.


100% will be a law suite unfinished clusterfuck.

passed it Saturday. Nothing is really being done. There’s something that resembles a foundation way over on the one side, maybe not even related to this project.

Wasatch Peaks ranch is full on. Lifts and shit going in. Good bud is working on it so I’ll see some pics soon.

in other news I’m so over Utah and the population boom. Starting to look at some outs. Where to next.


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## thetrailboss (Aug 6, 2021)

Extell Eyes Partnership With Deer Valley For Mayflower Resort
					

The developer of the Mayflower Mountain Resort said it could have skiers on the slopes in less than two years. Whether those slopes access Deer Valley




					www.kpcw.org


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## snoseek (Aug 6, 2021)

FBGM said:


> 100% will be a law suite unfinished clusterfuck.
> 
> passed it Saturday. Nothing is really being done. There’s something that resembles a foundation way over on the one side, maybe not even related to this project.
> 
> ...


Spokane or Sandpoint? It's really blown up there and I can see why you're over it


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## FBGM (Aug 6, 2021)

snoseek said:


> Spokane or Sandpoint? It's really blown up there and I can see why you're over it


To far away unless I have one of those kush work from home jobs. Need to get on that boat before it sails.

I barley ski anymore, or to the extent I did. I’d rather be somewhere where I can play golf most of the year and be closer to my parents as they are getting to that age where they are gonna need some help.

fucking adulting. Damn life. Damn Vail. Damn California.


----------



## snoseek (Aug 6, 2021)

FBGM said:


> To far away unless I have one of those kush work from home jobs. Need to get on that boat before it sails.
> 
> I barley ski anymore, or to the extent I did. I’d rather be somewhere where I can play golf most of the year and be closer to my parents as they are getting to that age where they are gonna need some help.
> 
> fucking adulting. Damn life. Damn Vail. Damn California.


Parente in utah?

Arizona sounds about right or even new Mexico.

My aging parents are a huge factor to me coming back to nh. I feel like I got some good years in out there and the itch is scratched. The skiing back here has been alot more fun than I imagined.


----------



## FBGM (Aug 6, 2021)

snoseek said:


> Parente in utah?
> 
> Arizona sounds about right or even new Mexico.
> 
> My aging parents are a huge factor to me coming back to nh. I feel like I got some good years in out there and the itch is scratched. The skiing back here has been alot more fun than I imagined.


Yup. Back east to the roots I imagine is what is gonna happen to me sooner then later. Like you, had my run in the prime years out here. Dump the real estate and buy like a king back east. And golf when the winters and lame.


----------



## BenedictGomez (Aug 6, 2021)

> Even though it’s right next to Deer Valley, Mayflower will be its own self-contained resort.



What a boondoggle this is, they needed the excuse of a "ski resort" to get this built under the obscure provision related to Snowbasin 2002 to build all these homes, condos, hotels, etc....., so they have to pretend it's a real ski resort, even if it's just 1 or 2 lifts serving crappy low-angle terrain.


----------



## thetrailboss (Aug 7, 2021)

BenedictGomez said:


> What a boondoggle this is, they needed the excuse of a "ski resort" to get this built under the obscure provision related to Snowbasin 2002 to build all these homes, condos, hotels, etc....., so they have to pretend it's a real ski resort, even if it's just 1 or 2 lifts serving crappy low-angle terrain.



In that last article it sounded like Deer Valley isn't biting in terms of operating this "ski area."  In fact, Deer Valley is moving ahead with their own parking garage and hotel project at Snow Park Lodge.


----------



## Tin Woodsman (Aug 7, 2021)

I can't speak to future lawsuits, but this project was ill-conceived from the start.  The terrain is low elevation, east facing and even further from the Wasatch spine than Deer Valley.  It's as if someone looked at Jordanelle and thought - "let's do that, only 3x bigger and with no guaranteed connection into the resort which is driving all of the value for prospective investors".  

Can someone give me the tl.dr version of the prospective legal shenanigans?


----------



## BenedictGomez (Aug 8, 2021)

Drove by this today, and it doesn't look all that much different than the last time I drove by almost 2.5 years ago when new roads or vehicle paths were put in.  Yes, there's much more work that's been done since then, but it still all looks to be earthworks, digging, grading, stone walls, etc.. No buildings are up or even construction framing etc...


----------



## FBGM (Aug 19, 2021)

Fancy new Wasatch peaks is coming along. Saw some pics of it the other day of trail cutting and lift lines getting cleared.

In other news my house almost burnt down Saturday in a forest fire. Then yesterday we all flooded and today we have snow.


----------



## thetrailboss (Aug 19, 2021)

FBGM said:


> Fancy new Wasatch peaks is coming along. Saw some pics of it the other day of trail cutting and lift lines getting cleared.
> 
> In other news my house almost burnt down Saturday in a forest fire. Then yesterday we all flooded and today we have snow.


Right.  I drove by WP a couple weeks ago.  Definite trails and liftlines are cut.  Too smoky for pictures.  Looks good.  

Meanwhile in Utah.....


----------



## BenedictGomez (Aug 20, 2021)

FBGM said:


> In other news *my house almost burnt down Saturday in a forest fire.*



You live somewhere up Parley's like Summit Park?

I took this picture of the smoke on Saturday as it was just getting started.  By late at night as it was growing, I was thinking it was even-money we'd have to evacuate.


----------



## FBGM (Aug 20, 2021)

BenedictGomez said:


> You live somewhere up Parley's like Summit Park?
> 
> I took this picture of the smoke on Saturday as it was just getting started.  By late at night as it was growing, I was thinking it was even-money we'd have to evacuate.



Yup Summit Park. Good times last weekend.


----------



## BenedictGomez (Aug 20, 2021)

FBGM said:


> View attachment 51825
> Yup Summit Park. Good times last weekend.



Thank god it turned out okay, the assets they tossed at that fire were astounding.  Besides out the window, I was watching it on flightradar24 & the number of airborne helicopters, light planes, tankers, and VLATs was crazy.  I heard something like 15 aircraft in total, besides all the ground vehicles and firefighters.


----------



## thetrailboss (Oct 13, 2021)

Update









						Mayflower Mountain Resort is anticipated to generate 4,000 daily visits
					

Officials recently announced they anticipate 4,000 daily visits or more to the Mayflower Mountain Resort. They are planning how to offset those impacts with employee housing and transit systems.




					www.parkrecord.com


----------



## Domeskier (Oct 14, 2021)

How long before twitter people make them change the name?


----------



## thetrailboss (Oct 14, 2021)

Domeskier said:


> How long before twitter people make them change the name?


I’m offended.  Aren’t you? 

I wonder if the employees will wear pilgrim hats….


----------



## BenedictGomez (Oct 15, 2021)

It just seems like an area without a cause.  They say 4,000 people per day?  I dunno, when I go to the Wasatch I wont be one of them.  I wont stay there either.  I dont get it.


----------



## raisingarizona (Oct 16, 2021)

BenedictGomez said:


> It just seems like an area without a cause.  They say 4,000 people per day?  I dunno, when I go to the Wasatch I wont be one of them.  I wont stay there either.  I dont get it.


It’s a real estate project. I imagine they want to connect somehow to park city and/or deer valley


----------



## FBGM (Oct 17, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> Update
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Gross


----------



## thetrailboss (Oct 17, 2021)

raisingarizona said:


> It’s a real estate project. I imagine they want to connect somehow to park city and/or deer valley


DV.  They are still “negotiating” with DV about connecting ski terrain and lifts.  That’s not a good sign that DV is not interested…


----------



## raisingarizona (Oct 17, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> DV.  They are still “negotiating” with DV about connecting ski terrain and lifts.  That’s not a good sign that DV is not interested…


I imagine it would have an effect on their exclusivity reputation or did that all go out the window when they joined epic, or is it Ikon? Whatever, the mega pass group they are part of.


----------



## thetrailboss (Oct 17, 2021)

raisingarizona said:


> I imagine it would have an effect on their exclusivity reputation or did that all go out the window when they joined epic, or is it Ikon? Whatever, the mega pass group they are part of.


That’s all but gone after Alterra bought it.  Compared to other resorts it is still a bit exclusive but it’s not the same DV experience that made it special.


----------



## jaytrem (Oct 17, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> DV.  They are still “negotiating” with DV about connecting ski terrain and lifts.  That’s not a good sign that DV is not interested…


I figure there is no reason for DV to sign an agreement yet.  Any early agreement solely helps Mayflower.  DVs job is to make sure they make the most $$$ possible on it.  As Mayflower gets closer to opening DV will hold more and more cards.


----------



## thetrailboss (Oct 18, 2021)

jaytrem said:


> I figure there is no reason for DV to sign an agreement yet.  Any early agreement solely helps Mayflower.  DVs job is to make sure they make the most $$$ possible on it.  As Mayflower gets closer to opening DV will hold more and more cards.


One would think that Mayflower would have its shit in order and get this deal done before actually building anything.  I guess not.


----------



## BenedictGomez (Oct 18, 2021)

raisingarizona said:


> *It’s a real estate project. *I imagine they want to connect somehow to park city and/or deer valley



Ehhh.... it seems like a boondoggle to me, disguised as a "real estate project" - even the way it keeps being written about in the media, all sorts of uncertainties, should's, might's, may's, likely's, etcetera. Shouldn't this all be hammered-out in professional detail long before the earth's scraped, concrete's poured, and rebar's going up?


----------



## thetrailboss (Oct 18, 2021)

BenedictGomez said:


> Ehhh.... it seems like a boondoggle to me, disguised as a "real estate project" - even the way it keeps being written about in the media, all sorts of uncertainties, should's, might's, may's, likely's, etcetera. Shouldn't this all be hammered-out in professional detail long before the earth's scraped, concrete's poured, and rebar's going up?


Right.  The more that happens, the clearer it becomes that something is not right.  Lots of crazy numbers thrown out there so far and very high expectations, but I get increasingly skeptical.


----------



## jaytrem (Oct 18, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> One would think that Mayflower would have its shit in order and get this deal done before actually building anything.  I guess not.


Ahh, it's Park City.  People there don't even bother to sign their sweetheart lease extensions.


----------



## thetrailboss (Oct 18, 2021)

jaytrem said:


> Ahh, it's Park City.  People there don't even bother to sign their sweetheart lease extensions.


 Yeah, that is one guy who is still trying to "show how great" of a businessman he is. Regardless, that will remain a case study in business and law school for many, many years to come.


----------



## thetrailboss (Nov 5, 2021)

The latest.  I still can’t take this seriously.









						Mayflower Resort's ski stats - TownLift, Park City News
					

WASATCH COUNTY, Utah. — Extell Development Company, based in New York,  currently has 13 active projects in New York and New Jersey and is the owner of Four Seasons Resort […]




					townlift.com


----------



## mbedle (Nov 6, 2021)

The quotes in that article were kind of odd. 3,200 feet of vertical??? I don't think so.


----------



## FBGM (Nov 6, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> The latest.  I still can’t take this seriously.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Still plenty of years to go bankrupt before completion


----------



## thetrailboss (Nov 6, 2021)

The latest.  I still can’t take this seriously.


mbedle said:


> The quotes in that article were kind of odd. 3,200 feet of vertical??? I don't think so.


Right?  That and the comment about the glades being “delish”.    The article was like something in a high school newspaper.

And anyone else find it fascinating that for all the talk and money supposedly invested that there are NO structures rising yet?  A lot of grading and moving dirt!


----------



## FBGM (Nov 6, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> The latest.  I still can’t take this seriously.
> 
> Right?  That and the comment about the glades being “delish”.    The article was like something in a high school newspaper.
> 
> And anyone else find it fascinating that for all the talk and money supposedly invested that there are NO structures rising yet?  A lot of grading and moving dirt!


I think it’s been 2+ years now of dirt moving and “utility” work. Yikes…

Also if I still lived there, that “local” lady that’s in charge. Id like to tell her what I think about her and this blunder to the area.


----------



## raisingarizona (Nov 7, 2021)

mbedle said:


> The quotes in that article were kind of odd. 3,200 feet of vertical??? I don't think so.


Did you watch the video? They are reaching REAL far with their claiming


----------



## ThatGuy (Nov 7, 2021)

raisingarizona said:


> Did you watch the video? They are reaching REAL far with their claiming


They must come from the Killington school of reporting vertical


----------



## raisingarizona (Nov 7, 2021)

ThatGuy said:


> They must come from the Killington school of reporting vertical


Bigger than Whistler/Blackcomb!!!!

Seriously, watch the video


----------



## FBGM (Nov 8, 2021)

I haven’t looked at a topo map in that area for a while, but 3,200’ very is probably close to accurate. It’s just a low base elevation, much lower then DV/PC base. Could be like 5,600’ base elevation with 8,800’ top. Plus or minus some there for that total vert. 

End result. This place sucks. Every part of it.


----------



## thetrailboss (Nov 8, 2021)

FBGM said:


> I haven’t looked at a topo map in that area for a while, but 3,200’ very is probably close to accurate. It’s just a low base elevation, much lower then DV/PC base. Could be like 5,600’ base elevation with 8,800’ top. Plus or minus some there for that total vert.
> 
> End result. This place sucks. Every part of it.


I think they are including the summit of Bald Mountain as their reference point.   So they are including DV's terrain.  I may be wrong.


----------



## Tin Woodsman (Nov 8, 2021)

FBGM said:


> I haven’t looked at a topo map in that area for a while, but 3,200’ very is probably close to accurate. It’s just a low base elevation, much lower then DV/PC base. Could be like 5,600’ base elevation with 8,800’ top. Plus or minus some there for that total vert.
> 
> End result. This place sucks. Every part of it.


If we are being as generous as possible, the lowest base elevation of Mayflower is 6400'.  With a claimed 3200' vert, that implies a top elevation of 9600', which is roughly the top of Empire Canyon.  As with just about everything else associated with this project, Extell is making a claim that isn't supported by facts on the ground - they have no operating agreement allowing Mayflower guests access to Deer Valley terrain/lifts.  

Even if/when they do, it will be a pleasant 4 lift journey to access said vertical, with no ability to ride back to the base w/o taking at least 2 lifts and long, boring cat tracks.  Where do I sign up??!!


----------



## thetrailboss (Nov 8, 2021)

Tin Woodsman said:


> If we are being as generous as possible, the lowest base elevation of Mayflower is 6400'.  With a claimed 3200' vert, that implies a top elevation of 9600', which is roughly the top of Empire Canyon.  As with just about everything else associated with this project, Extell is making a claim that isn't supported by facts on the ground - they have no operating agreement allowing Mayflower guests access to Deer Valley terrain/lifts.
> 
> Even if/when they do, it will be a pleasant 4 lift journey to access said vertical, with no ability to ride back to the base w/o taking at least 2 lifts and long, boring cat tracks.  Where do I sign up??!!


That's what they used--the summit of Empire Express.  Agreed that it really fudges the facts.


----------



## mbedle (Nov 8, 2021)

The do have an lease agreement with Deer Valley to allow guest at Mayflower to use Deer Valley ski terrain. Apparently, Mayflower owns land that both the mayflower and sultan lifts bases and lower trails are located. They stated that they renegotiated the leases with Deer Valley to allow mayflower guest to use their trails. Also, that last article in the park record shows buildings onsite. They must be further along with construction than just grading.


----------



## thetrailboss (Nov 8, 2021)

mbedle said:


> The do have an lease agreement with Deer Valley to allow guest at Mayflower to use Deer Valley ski terrain. Apparently, Mayflower owns land that both the mayflower and sultan lifts bases and lower trails are located. They stated that they renegotiated the leases with Deer Valley to allow mayflower guest to use their trails. Also, that last article in the park record shows buildings onsite. They must be further along with construction than just grading.


I just looked again and I see the labels for buildings but no buildings.  The start of foundations--maybe.


----------



## mbedle (Nov 8, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> I just looked again and I see the labels for buildings but no buildings.  The start of foundations--maybe.


You are right, I was looking at the second picture in the article and it shows the employee housing they are building up near the Jordanelle lift.


----------



## thetrailboss (Nov 8, 2021)

mbedle said:


> You are right, I was looking at the second picture in the article and it shows the employee housing they are building up near the Jordanelle lift.


OK.  I thought I missed something.  Looks like they might have had some environmental cleanup to do from the old mines.  I see mention of a soil cap.  Maybe that is in part why there is so much earth work?


----------



## mbedle (Nov 8, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> OK.  I thought I missed something.  Looks like they might have had some environmental cleanup to do from the old mines.  I see mention of a soil cap.  Maybe that is in part why there is so much earth work?


Correct again, just looked online and the large earthwork is in part to cleanup about 433 acres contaminated from the old mayflower mine site (heavy metals and petroleum). The total area of the cleanup project encompasses 2,276 acres. Based on the DEQ's database, the owners where accepted into the voluntary cleanup program in July 2017, which was amended in June 2020 when they discovered additional impacts on the property.


----------



## mbedle (Nov 8, 2021)

Pic of the tailings piles capping that took place this year.


----------



## mbedle (Nov 8, 2021)

Forgot that attachment.


----------



## mbedle (Nov 8, 2021)

Hollow shit, this property has been in the makings since 1977.


----------



## Tin Woodsman (Nov 8, 2021)

mbedle said:


> The do have an lease agreement with Deer Valley to allow guest at Mayflower to use Deer Valley ski terrain. Apparently, Mayflower owns land that both the mayflower and sultan lifts bases and lower trails are located. They stated that they renegotiated the leases with Deer Valley to allow mayflower guest to use their trails. Also, that last article in the park record shows buildings onsite. They must be further along with construction than just grading.



OK - I hadn't seen news of the lease/access agreement.  It's still playing a little fast and loose with the wording, and doesn't change the facts on the ground w/r/t the hassle of actually trying to get out and enjoy that 3200' vert.


----------



## mbedle (Nov 8, 2021)

Tin Woodsman said:


> OK - I hadn't seen news of the lease/access agreement.  It's still playing a little fast and loose with the wording, and doesn't change the facts on the ground w/r/t the hassle of actually trying to get out and enjoy that 3200' vert.


I agree 100 percent. But  with the agreement, skier may have around 2k in vertical with two lifts (although the terrain kind of sucks for that). The mix of snowboarding allowed and not allowed also kind of messes that up, unless maybe Deer valley agreed to snowboarders on the mayflower lift.


----------



## thetrailboss (Nov 8, 2021)

mbedle said:


> The do have an lease agreement with Deer Valley to allow guest at Mayflower to use Deer Valley ski terrain. Apparently, Mayflower owns land that both the mayflower and sultan lifts bases and lower trails are located. They stated that they renegotiated the leases with Deer Valley to allow mayflower guest to use their trails. Also, that last article in the park record shows buildings onsite. They must be further along with construction than just grading.


Where did you see that they had struck a deal?  My understanding was that they had not as of yet.


----------



## raisingarizona (Nov 8, 2021)

mbedle said:


> The do have an lease agreement with Deer Valley to allow guest at Mayflower to use Deer Valley ski terrain. Apparently, Mayflower owns land that both the mayflower and sultan lifts bases and lower trails are located. They stated that they renegotiated the leases with Deer Valley to allow mayflower guest to use their trails. Also, that last article in the park record shows buildings onsite. They must be further along with construction than just grading.


After posting in this thread I thought about the claims and how there’s gotta be something planned and agreed upon. I mean, if there wasn’t these developers would be walking themselves right into some serious legal problems.


----------



## mbedle (Nov 9, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> Where did you see that they had struck a deal?  My understanding was that they had not as of yet.


I think it is at the 5:50 mark on the promotional video. 









						Mayflower Resort's ski stats - TownLift, Park City News
					

WASATCH COUNTY, Utah. — Extell Development Company, based in New York,  currently has 13 active projects in New York and New Jersey and is the owner of Four Seasons Resort […]




					townlift.com


----------



## thetrailboss (Nov 9, 2021)

mbedle said:


> I think it is at the 5:50 mark on the promotional video.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


OK.  So I see what you are saying.  I think the devil is in the details.  What she says is that Mayflower guests will have direct access to Sultan and Mayflower lifts.  So they can ski from the top of Bald Mountain down.  What may not be resolved is if they can access DV in general on the same ticket.  I know that was in question.  Since Extell is not a ski resort operator they may not understand the difference between giving guests full access and giving them only access to two DV lifts.  Maybe I am reading into it too much, but DV has not said anything about this whole Mayflower project.  At least anything from what I have seen so far.  

I also know that Mayflower wanted DV to run its ski infrastructure as if it was part of DV and have a seamless experience.  That part of the deal is not resolved and DV does not seem interested.

I would imagine that they will be able to give guests access to DV in general at some point but it will require a fee.  Right now it sounds like it is similar to what folks at Moonlight Basin or Spanish Peaks once had at Big Sky--not necessarily a seamless experience but close to it.


----------



## BenedictGomez (Nov 10, 2021)

raisingarizona said:


> After posting in this thread I thought about the claims and how there’s gotta be something planned and agreed upon. I mean, if there wasn’t these developers would be walking themselves right into some serious legal problems.



In the construction industry, done the bad actors typically operate with a, _"just get it built and deal with the consequences later" _motto?


----------



## BenedictGomez (Nov 10, 2021)

> _One gondola and *18 chairlifts are in the plan*_



Well that part's clearly BS, there's no way they're building EIGHTEEN lifts in that (relatively) little area.


----------



## tumbler (Nov 10, 2021)

BenedictGomez said:


> In the construction industry, done the bad actors typically operate with a, _"just get it built and deal with the consequences later" _motto?


Harder to do nowadays and nearly impossible if there is financing.  No bank or entity is going to finance without doing serious due diligence.


----------



## jaytrem (Nov 10, 2021)

BenedictGomez said:


> Well that part's clearly BS, there's no way they're building EIGHTEEN lifts in that (relatively) little area.











						Afton Alps Trail Map | Afton Alps Resort
					






					www.aftonalps.com


----------



## x10003q (Nov 10, 2021)

The questions and vague nature of the connections to DV are somehow related to the Military Installation Development Authority (MIDA) for Military Conference Hotel. This hotel has somehow made this out of place development move forward. Maybe, between tax benefits/MIDA financing, this resort has become financially viable.





						About MIDA | Mayflower Resort
					






					www.extellutah.com


----------



## thetrailboss (Nov 10, 2021)

tumbler said:


> Harder to do nowadays and nearly impossible if there is financing.  No bank or entity is going to finance without doing serious due diligence.


I don't think this is being done with traditional financing.  I don't think any banks are significantly involved.  I think it is just Extell with lots of incentives from the State.

And it is clear that Extell has NO experience in the ski industry.


----------



## thetrailboss (Nov 10, 2021)

x10003q said:


> The questions and vague nature of the connections to DV are somehow related to the Military Installation Development Authority (MIDA) for Military Conference Hotel. This hotel has somehow made this out of place development move forward. Maybe, between tax benefits/MIDA financing, this resort has become financially viable.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Exactly.


----------



## mbedle (Nov 10, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> OK.  So I see what you are saying.  I think the devil is in the details.  What she says is that Mayflower guests will have direct access to Sultan and Mayflower lifts.  So they can ski from the top of Bald Mountain down.  What may not be resolved is if they can access DV in general on the same ticket.  I know that was in question.  Since Extell is not a ski resort operator they may not understand the difference between giving guests full access and giving them only access to two DV lifts.  Maybe I am reading into it too much, but DV has not said anything about this whole Mayflower project.  At least anything from what I have seen so far.
> 
> I also know that Mayflower wanted DV to run its ski infrastructure as if it was part of DV and have a seamless experience.  That part of the deal is not resolved and DV does not seem interested.
> 
> I would imagine that they will be able to give guests access to DV in general at some point but it will require a fee.  Right now it sounds like it is similar to what folks at Moonlight Basin or Spanish Peaks once had at Big Sky--not necessarily a seamless experience but close to it.


You're not reading into it too much, I agree that the access may be limited to just those two lifts. It was also interesting to note that they own the sub-peak of Bald Mountain (which is about the same height as Bald Mountain). There is some good terrain over there that they might be able to develop.


----------



## Smellytele (Nov 11, 2021)

jaytrem said:


> Afton Alps Trail Map | Afton Alps Resort
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That is basically a lift per trail??? Crazy!


----------



## BenedictGomez (Nov 11, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> And it is clear that Extell has NO experience in the ski industry.



Not a lot of ski resorts in Manhattan.


----------



## BenedictGomez (Nov 11, 2021)

Smellytele said:


> That is basically a lift per trail??? Crazy!


Never seen that.  Dont understand it.


----------



## Tin Woodsman (Nov 15, 2021)

mbedle said:


> You're not reading into it too much, I agree that the access may be limited to just those two lifts. It was also interesting to note that they own the sub-peak of Bald Mountain (which is about the same height as Bald Mountain). There is some good terrain over there that they might be able to develop.


Perhaps, but none of their development plans (at least none of these released to the public) include terrain on that peak.  Looks like everything tops out around 8200' at best.  And of course the complication with access for snowboarders represents a huge difference between this situation and that of Moonlight Basin/Big Sky.   Good luck getting Mayflower successfully off the ground with a skiers-only policy if you want to connect with the better/higher Deer Valley terrain.


----------



## mbedle (Nov 15, 2021)

Tin Woodsman said:


> Perhaps, but none of their development plans (at least none of these released to the public) include terrain on that peak.  Looks like everything tops out around 8200' at best.  And of course the complication with access for snowboarders represents a huge difference between this situation and that of Moonlight Basin/Big Sky.   Good luck getting Mayflower successfully off the ground with a skiers-only policy if you want to connect with the better/higher Deer Valley terrain.


True, have not seen any plans for lifts over on that part of the property. However, they aquired a lot of the parcels over there recently, so maybe its being thought of for future potential. As far as the snowboarding policy, maybe!!!!!!! they got Deer Valley to agree to allow snowboarding off of those two lifts. Can put a lot of pressure on a resort when you own the land that some of their best terrain is located.


----------



## Tin Woodsman (Nov 15, 2021)

mbedle said:


> True, have not seen any plans for lifts over on that part of the property. However, they aquired a lot of the parcels over there recently, so maybe its being thought of for future potential. As far as the snowboarding policy, maybe!!!!!!! they got Deer Valley to agree to allow snowboarding off of those two lifts. Can put a lot of pressure on a resort when you own the land that some of their best terrain is located.


Super interesting.  This would be big news to the DV community even if just for those 2 lifts, so I'm intrigued to see how this plays out and is messaged.


----------



## thetrailboss (Nov 30, 2021)

In related news…very odd timing.









						Deer Valley president departs, just days before start of ski season
					

The president of Deer Valley Resort left the organization on Monday, the resort said, a departure that occurred just days before Deer Valley is scheduled to open for the ski season.




					www.parkrecord.com


----------



## thetrailboss (Dec 30, 2021)

Bump.  This place has competition.  The buildings will be named after Edgar and Polly Stern and start at $2.25 mill per unit.









						Welcome to Founders Place
					

A private ski-in, ski-out luxury condominium community nestled in the Deer Crest neighborhood at Deer Valley® in Park City Utah. Breaking ground in ’22.




					foundersplace.com


----------



## FBGM (Dec 31, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> Bump.  This place has competition.  The buildings will be named after Edgar and Polly Stern and start at $2.25 mill per unit.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Gross


----------



## thetrailboss (Feb 2, 2022)

Bump.  

Was at Deer Valley this weekend.  One can see that trails are being cut for this project.  I will post the pictures I got.


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## pinion247 (Feb 2, 2022)

"See the trails" from 40? Or can you see also from on-mountain (like Mayflower area)? This has been such a long drawn out thing that I almost never expected to see anything real come of it.


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## thetrailboss (Feb 2, 2022)

pinion247 said:


> "See the trails" from 40? Or can you see also from on-mountain (like Mayflower area)? This has been such a long drawn out thing that I almost never expected to see anything real come of it.


From Jordanelle Gondola.  Limited view admittedly. 

From Mayflower one can see a switchback service road that now traverses the ridgeline just adjacent to the Mayflower Triple.


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## FBGM (Feb 2, 2022)

Get over to other side of Jordenelle up in Garff Ranch that ridge line and you might get the full on view. Could be neat to see


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## FBGM (Mar 5, 2022)

Most recent NSAA magazine had a small blurb on this place. Kept it super vague. 

Any more news? How’s the build coming? 

My PC home goes on market next week so I guess I’m officially not a resident and done and gone.


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## FBGM (May 22, 2022)

Currently trying to burn down. Gonna be a long year out there. Glad im gone.


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## thetrailboss (May 22, 2022)

FBGM said:


> Currently trying to burn down. Gonna be a long year out there. Glad im gone.


You’re talking about this I imagine…..









						Crews gain 30% containment on Flat Line Fire near Park City
					

The Flat Line Fire was sparked Sunday afternoon along U.S. Highway 189/40 between Jordanelle Reservoir and Heber City.




					www.fox13now.com


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## FBGM (May 23, 2022)

Yeah. Looks like it’s just south of the new ski area. 


thetrailboss said:


> You’re talking about this I imagine…..
> 
> https://www.fox13now.com/news/local-news/brush-fire-burning-between-heber-and-park-city[/URL


http://


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