# Help With Skis



## camhabib (Jan 10, 2006)

I am a GS Racer.  I'm 5'11" and around 140 lbs.  My current ski is an Atomic GS:9 176cm.  I'm able to get a deal on a pair of brand new GS:11 Race Stock 190cm.  My question is, will 190 be too long for me?  I can feel on my current skis a lack of stability, the ski just chattering and sometimes getting out of control at high speeds.  I'm not the best racer but I'm good enough where something like a speed suit can really make a difference.  I don't have the ability to test out a pair of 190's for some time, and by then the deal will be void.  Any suggestions or comments would be greatly appreciated.


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## JimG. (Jan 10, 2006)

Wow, a tough question here. I'd be better able to help you if I could watch you ski. Do you feel the chattering is a function of your current ski or do you feel that it may be a result of your technique?

I'm not a big Atomic fan either, so I don't know their skis that well. But I do know that a 190cm ski for someone your height and weight seems long by today's standards.


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## camhabib (Jan 10, 2006)

I don't believe it’s from my technique.  I physically can't put any more pressure on my skis then I'm already putting.  I don't have the best form but I feel like if form was the problem, the ski would be chattering all the time.  One of the major problems that I have is just a lose of speed on the turn.  I’ll be turning and I can feel the tail and sometimes the tip kick out from underneath me, making me slide and lose speed.  I constantly feel when this happens that if I had a little more edge, it wouldn’t happen.  I also already ski on a 176 so its only an extra 24cm.


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## riverc0il (Jan 10, 2006)

yea, i think 190 would be too long for GS.  i raced college level in 99-00 and had 193s and i am 210 lbs and 6'1".  on today's equipment, i doubt i would have gone higher than 183-185 for GS.  i currently ski 178 recreationally.


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## skibum1321 (Jan 11, 2006)

> I also already ski on a 176 so its only an extra 24cm.


That is actually 14 cm longer.

190 cm is a lot of ski for you. Given your weight and height it seems really long. I used to ski on a 191 and I am 6'2" 180 lb. Those felt really long for me. I now have a pair of 181s and 178s, which feel right. I'm also not a racer so take it for what it's worth.


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## JimG. (Jan 11, 2006)

camhabib said:
			
		

> I don't believe it’s from my technique.  I physically can't put any more pressure on my skis then I'm already putting...One of the major problems that I have is just a lose of speed on the turn.  I’ll be turning and I can feel the tail and sometimes the tip kick out from underneath me, making me slide and lose speed.



I'm not a race coach, but I am an instructor and I have coached kids on race courses. Take what I'm saying with a grain of salt.

It's possible you're exerting too much edge pressure and that may be the reason your edges break free. Before switching skis, try backing off on the edge pressure a bit and try to increase your edge angles. It's possible you're not angulating at the hips enough, not getting inside the turn enough to get those edges up high enough to maintain your carve.

Just a thought before you spend money on new skis.


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## skidon (Jan 11, 2006)

Hey.  If you're 15 years old or older, a male,  and racing USSA/FIS sanctioned races, you must use skis that are at least 185 cm long and with a 21 meter turn radius for GS.  If you're none of the above, or even if you ARE the above, a 190cm GS11 is too long and too stiff for your size.  That'd be a good choice for Super G, maybe. Even if you had to use 185's, you'd go with a 185 (not a 190) in a softer-flexing model than the GS11.  I'm sure you don't have to comply with FIS rules, so a 175-180 in something with more guts than your GS9's would work better, and you can use a model that has a deeper-than-21 meter sidecut too.  That would help with your loss of speed in the turns.  Fact is, though, the turns are where ALL the speed gets lost.  Learning to ski a fast line and carve a clean, fast turn is the goal of all developing racers.  Keep at it - you'll get there (but not on 190 GS11's...)


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## camhabib (Jan 11, 2006)

Well I was kind of sure I was going to take the deal before posting here, but after hearing what everyone has to say, I'm not so sure any more.  I went to a local ski shop and took at look at the race stock, I didn't see much of a difference in flex ratings of the stock and production model of the GS:11.  I won't be doing any FIS races, so I don't really need to worry about their requirements.  Part of me thinks I could handle the length and the other half thinks that I'd just be out of control on them.


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## riverc0il (Jan 11, 2006)

have you ever skied on a ski 190 in length?  would make sense to me to try something that long out first before sinking money into what may or may not be a ski that fits your needs.


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## camhabib (Jan 11, 2006)

When I was 12 I had a pair of 185 DH skis that I used for SG, so I have raced on the length before.  I had a pair of 175 GS skis at that time as well, but I thought they were too long.  I have since grown (now 17) some and can handle a little more length then I used to be able to.  I haven't used anything over a 180 in the past year so I don't have much to compare it to.  In the summer, as training for ski, I bike around 28 miles a day (road cycling), so I may be light but most of my muscle is in my legs.  My understanding, from people in the business, is that the length in a race stock doesn't matter as much as the length in a production.  Not sure how true that statement is, but that’s just what I've heard.


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## kbroderick (Jan 11, 2006)

Race stock skis are generally available in a narrower selection of lengths than production stock skis; it used to be that true race skis (i.e. World Cup Stock, often of a different shape and construction than anything mere mortals could get) were available in two (one men's, one women's) lengths, possibly one or two more if that.  A lot of ski companies have been reducing the gap between what mortals can get and what World Cup racers ski on, but I haven't been racing in long enough that I no longer know what the current status on that sort of stuff is.

If you're serious about racing, your coaches probably have a better idea of what's appropriate for you than anyone on this board would.

Regarding technique,



> I’ll be turning and I can feel the tail and sometimes the tip kick out from underneath me, making me slide and lose speed.



That sounds like either a technique problem or a tuning problem.  It could also be an alignment issue.

I'd suggest the following:
a) talk to your coaches
b) make sure your skis are tuned properly, with a consistent and reasonable edge bevel (probably something like 1 degree of base and 3 degrees of side, but consult with your coaches and/or Atomic rep to double-check)
c) make sure your alignment and boot fitting are spot-on (beginning with good footbeds from someone who knows what he or she is talking about, through shell fitting including cuff alignment and canting *which are different adjustments*)


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## camhabib (Jan 11, 2006)

I'll certainly check on the tuning of my skis.  I know they are sharpened at a 1 / 3 degree.  I'm not sure if they are sharpened the entire length of the blade as I have seen before on some skis the very front and back left somewhat unsharpened.  The boots are pretty much set.  I have a pair of Atomic Race:11 boots, I had the compression strap changed, spoiler in the back changed, foam injected into the lining to form to foot, and have had the canting adjusted.  Thanks for the advice.


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## serge (Jan 19, 2006)

Folks, I need some advice on ski length as well... 
I am 5'11" 165 lbs male.
I currently ski on Fischer RC4 SC Worlcup 160cm, which are great. But not stable enough at higher speeds... 
I am thinking of buying a pair of Fischer Race RC skis, which are in fact FIS non-legal GS skis (16m radius in 175cm, or close). 

My question is whether I shoud get either 170 or 175cm skis.
I am not a racer.

Thank you!


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## skidon (Jan 20, 2006)

Yo Serge, I've had a few beers and your question is a bit confusing.  Fischer makes a Worldcup RC ("Beer League" GS - ~16m radius) and a Race SC (Combi ski - 13m, softer).  There's no Race RC that I know of.  Assuming you're talking about the Worldcup RC, and you're keeping your Worldcup SC's, I'd go with the 175.  That's a ripping high-speed cruiser and decent all-round length, which will complement the best characteristics of your shorter skis.  Ouch, my head hurts from all that thinking.  Time for another beer...


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## serge (Jan 23, 2006)

Hey Skidon, 

Yes, these are the ones. Thanks for your reply... That's what I was thinking myself... My only concern is that I may be a bit too light for them at 165 lbs. 190-200 lbs folks are skiing 175cm, so I I had some doubts...


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## skidon (Jan 27, 2006)

(Sorry for not replying sooner...I just got back from Vegas, and now my head REALLY hurts...)  Anyway, that model in a 175 was designed to be raced on by elite-level female racers.  Your average World Cup racer chick, although not small, is definitely not 190-200 lbs.  World Cup (and any FIS-level) male racers  have to be on a 185.  Even though you're not a racer, I think you'd be fine on the 175, and it'd be distinctly different from your SC's.  That's just my opinion.  Besides, the difference between a 170 and 175 is about 2" - nothing to lose sleep over. Speaking of sleep, I need a nap...


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## skibum9995 (Jan 28, 2006)

serge said:
			
		

> Yes, these are the ones. Thanks for your reply... That's what I was thinking myself... My only concern is that I may be a bit too light for them at 165 lbs. 190-200 lbs folks are skiing 175cm, so I I had some doubts...


You will be happy with a 175. I'm 5'6" 135lbs and I'm skiing a 180 GS ski. I do ski pretty aggressivly but I don't think you'll have any trouble.


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## serge (Feb 1, 2006)

Thank you guys... Will go for 175cm, then...Speaking of racing...Where can I get some training or may be even get into some entry level racing? I live in Boston...


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