# New Helmet Law - New York ?



## gmcunni (Jun 6, 2016)

According to NewYorkUpstate.com, the New York State Senate just passed a bill that would mandate helmet use at New York ski areas for anyone under the age of 14.


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## steamboat1 (Jun 6, 2016)

gmcunni said:


> According to NewYorkUpstate.com, the New York State Senate just passed a bill that would mandate helmet use at New York ski areas for anyone under the age of 14.


Well no one in my family is under 14 so who cares.


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## gmcunni (Jun 6, 2016)

steamboat1 said:


> Well no one in my family is under 14 so who cares.



and you don't ski in NY either


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## drjeff (Jun 6, 2016)

gmcunni said:


> According to NewYorkUpstate.com, the New York State Senate just passed a bill that would mandate helmet use at New York ski areas for anyone under the age of 14.



And I'm guessing as a fellow father with a daughter who sustained a concussion while skiing and helmeted, that you as well are as much in positive support of this law that the NYS Legislature apparently passed as I am! +1 (and thank god for helmets and daughters (and sons too!) who enjoy skiing!  )


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## cdskier (Jun 6, 2016)

steamboat1 said:


> Well no one in my family is under 14 so who cares.



This is a forum to talk about skiing related topics, isn't it?

Doesn't personally impact me either, but I'm perfectly ok with a topic bringing it up for discussion. Sounds like a perfectly good idea to make this a requirement in my book.


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## steamboat1 (Jun 6, 2016)

Just more Nanny state regulations. Everyone should be entitled to make their own decision regarding use of a helmet, not have it forced upon you.


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## JimG. (Jun 6, 2016)

A good law for young people under 14.


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## ss20 (Jun 6, 2016)

steamboat1 said:


> Just more Nanny state regulations. Everyone should be entitled to make their own decision regarding use of a helmet, not have it forced upon you.



I have to agree with Steamy here.  You'd be an idiot to not where a helmet, but you should have that choice.


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## benski (Jun 7, 2016)

I think a parent letting letting a 13 year old not wear a helmet is irresponsible since the kid likely does not understand the risks of not wearing one. It's more about requiring parents to be responsible than telling people how to make personal decisions. 

Sent from my iPhone using AlpineZone


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## deadheadskier (Jun 7, 2016)

benski said:


> I think a parent letting letting a 13 year old not wear a helmet is irresponsible since the kid likely does not understand the risks of not wearing one. It's more about requiring parents to be responsible than telling people how to make personal decisions.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using AlpineZone



+1

Even though many of us survived our childhoods and often much of adulthood without wearing helmets, I have no issue with requiring them for young people today.   The technology and comfort wasn't around back then. It's about making better choices and adopting to modern times.


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## cdskier (Jun 7, 2016)

benski said:


> I think a parent letting letting a 13 year old not wear a helmet is irresponsible since the kid likely does not understand the risks of not wearing one. It's more about requiring parents to be responsible than telling people how to make personal decisions.



Exactly. If this was a requirement for people of all ages, then I'd agree with ss and steamboat. Kids are not mature enough to be empowered to make the decision for themselves however. Some parents also may not be skiers and may not fully understand the risk either. This being a law also gives parents more "ammunition" for when their kids don't want to listen about wearing a helmet.


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## tree_skier (Jun 7, 2016)

of course then you need to mandate wearing it correctly also.


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## witch hobble (Jun 7, 2016)

It seems weird with this law that you become mature enough to make the decision for yourself at age 14, which I don't remember being my own most rational, mature age.


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## tree_skier (Jun 7, 2016)

I don't always wear a helmet but when i do.....

no wait a minute that was drink beer


my mistake


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## gmcunni (Jun 7, 2016)

witch hobble said:


> It seems weird with this law that you become mature enough to make the decision for yourself at age 14, which I don't remember being my own most rational, mature age.



if you click the link it mentioned that while the senate had passed the bill it still had to go the assembly for a vote and there was comment that they felt 14 was too young, that the law should be 18 and under.


personally i am a strong advocate for helmets but troubled that we have to enact laws requiring it.  won't be surprised to see resorts, rather than laws, requiring it soon as a requirement from their insurance carriers.


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## steamboat1 (Jun 7, 2016)

gmcunni said:


> if you click the link it mentioned that while the senate had passed the bill it still had to go the assembly for a vote and there was comment that they felt 14 was too young, that the law should be 18 and under.


New York already has a law requiring those 14 & under to wear a helmet while riding a bicycle. This law is shaped after that. You can drive a car at age 16 in NY. Should those drivers be required to wear a helmet till they are over 18?


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## dlague (Jun 7, 2016)

I am not sure how many kids below 14 do not wear a helmet.  Percentage wise the kids not wearing vs wearing has to be very low.  So the bill is not a big deal.  We had our kids wear helmets and as adults they continue to wear them.  We wear helmets as well so they think nothing of it.  I do see some young park rats with helmets but not buckled or tilted way back on their head, at that point it seems more like a fashion statement.


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## Jully (Jun 7, 2016)

gmcunni said:


> personally i am a strong advocate for helmets but troubled that we have to enact laws requiring it.  won't be surprised to see resorts, rather than laws, requiring it soon as a requirement from their insurance carriers.



I thought some resorts already did? Or was that just for resort employees when skiing?


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## Domeskier (Jun 7, 2016)

I wish there had been a helmet law back when I was a kid doing reckless things on bicycles.  Apparently you won't know until your dead whether those old head injuries and concussions are going to catch up with you.  It's a lot easier to wear a helmet when you're twelve if you and all your stupid friends are forced to.


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## steamboat1 (Jun 7, 2016)

Never see any ghetto kids wear helmets.

Hey that's it, free gov't helmets for everyone.


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## Edd (Jun 8, 2016)

steamboat1 said:


> Never see any ghetto kids wear helmets.
> 
> Hey that's it, free gov't helmets for everyone.



You're killing it with idiotic posts lately. Kudos.


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## Riverskier (Jun 8, 2016)

No problem with this. I won't get specific, as to avoid getting overly political, but I don't support ANY laws protecting me from myself. However, anyone can have kids... and I don't have a problem with laws aimed to protect them until they are 18.


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## skiNEwhere (Jun 8, 2016)

So I guess14 is the age the state assumes a normal kid can make reasonable, sound decisions on their own? Just seems kind of arbitrary


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## deadheadskier (Jun 8, 2016)

Maybe choosing 14 is about ease of enforcement at the ski areas.  At that age a ski resort employee can give someone a quick glance and make a reasonable determination that they're still a kid.   As opposed to say 18 when age becomes more difficult to determine by a quick glance.


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## BenedictGomez (Jun 8, 2016)

cdskier said:


> *If this was a requirement for people of all ages, then I'd agree with ss and steamboat.*



Then you agree with ss and steamboat, just not until 2021 or so when that law predictably goes into effect too.


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## Cornhead (Jun 8, 2016)

skiNEwhere said:


> So I guess14 is the age the state assumes a normal kid can make reasonable, sound decisions on their own? Just seems kind of arbitrary



View attachment 20325
This is what I was choosing at 14, probably should've been wearing a helmet.


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## Cornhead (Jun 8, 2016)

^


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## HowieT2 (Jun 8, 2016)

Riverskier said:


> No problem with this. I won't get specific, as to avoid getting overly political, but I don't support ANY laws protecting me from myself. However, anyone can have kids... and I don't have a problem with laws aimed to protect them until they are 18.



I used to be of this mind set, specifically when I started driving and seat belt laws were coming in to effect.  I felt as you do, that its my body and I'll decide the risks I want to take.  I disagree now, though. no one used to wear seat belts.  now everyone does because of those laws.  countless lives have been saved in the process and at little to no cost.  why?because the law got everyone in the habit of reflexively putting the seat belt on. people make stupid irrational decisions or are just lazy.  The helmet doesnt only protect your head.  the individual is not the only one effected by the decision to not wear a helmet.  If a crash happens, ski patrol has to pick up the pieces of your skull.  EMT's have to tend your brain oozing out.  a heli crew has to fly to a hospital.  The mountain has to deal with your demise and possibly litigation to follow.  the whole sport suffers bad publicity when a skier is tragically killed.  
wearing a helmet is no big deal.  if one life is saved, one injury prevented, its worth it.


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## drjeff (Jun 8, 2016)

deadheadskier said:


> Maybe choosing 14 is about ease of enforcement at the ski areas.  At that age a ski resort employee can give someone a quick glance and make a reasonable determination that they're still a kid.   As opposed to say 18 when age becomes more difficult to determine by a quick glance.



There's a bunch of ski areas that use age 14 as the transition age from a "junior" ticket to a "young adult" ticket 

Would make a check easy if anyone with a "junior" ticket had to have a helmet on


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## steamboat1 (Jun 8, 2016)

Just another law that won't be enforced. Plenty of them on the books. Makes the political hacks feel like they've done something though.


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## HowieT2 (Jun 8, 2016)

steamboat1 said:


> Just another law that won't be enforced. Plenty of them on the books. Makes the political hacks feel like they've done something though.



These laws don't come out of nowhere.  I doubt some representative thought of this and pushed it through.  More likely the ski resorts and or helmet manufacturers are behind this.


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## cdskier (Jun 9, 2016)

HowieT2 said:


> These laws don't come out of nowhere.  I doubt some representative thought of this and pushed it through.  More likely the ski resorts and or helmet manufacturers are behind this.



Or a representative had a personal experience with a kid that got hurt not wearing a helmet. Could have just been a minor injury that simply served as a wake up call.


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## gmcunni (Jun 9, 2016)

in America...  kid who's parents don't put a helmet on his head gets hurt @ NY ski resort.  Parents sue state AND resort for negligence since they didn't stop the kid from skiing.

(NOTE - 





> Under the bill, the parents or guardian of a child caught skiing without a helmet could be fined $50, but law enforcement authorities could only issue a ticket if the violation occurs in the parents or guardian's presence.


 )


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## BenedictGomez (Jun 9, 2016)

steamboat1 said:


> *Just another law that won't be enforced. Plenty of them on the books. *Makes the political hacks feel like they've done something though.



Yup.  New York State troopers aren't going to be spending a lot of time patrolling Gore on skis looking for un-helmeted 12 year olds.


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## abc (Jun 9, 2016)

steamboat1 said:


> Well no one in my family is under 14 so who cares.





steamboat1 said:


> Just more Nanny state regulations. Everyone should be entitled to make their own decision regarding use of a helmet, not have it forced upon you.


Sounds like YOU care?


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## abc (Jun 9, 2016)

I happen to think it's a useful law. 

I disagree with those who said the law was aimed at punishing parents. Like kids on bike, they're not always within sight of their parents. 

Having it on the book allows resorts to enforce the helmet requirement (if they so wish, I believe some wish to). That would be helpful given how often kids of 10 and over ski with their friends rather than with their parents.


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## BenedictGomez (Jun 9, 2016)

abc said:


> *Having it on the book allows resorts to enforce the helmet requirement.*



No it doesn't, they could already do so if they wish.


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## Edd (Jun 9, 2016)

BenedictGomez said:


> No it doesn't, they could already do so if they wish.



Maybe ski area A would be gun shy about instituting a helmet requirement if ski area B up the road doesn't also. Competitive disadvantage. 

A law would level the field, at least within state lines.


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## Smellytele (Jun 9, 2016)

HowieT2 said:


> These laws don't come out of nowhere.  I doubt some representative thought of this and pushed it through.  More likely the ski resorts and or helmet manufacturers are behind this.



Insurance company lobby


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## steamboat1 (Jun 9, 2016)

NJ has had a ski helmet law since 2011, under 18. Both the CA Assembly & Senate passed a ski helmet law in 2011, it was vetoed by the Governor.


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## Highway Star (Jun 9, 2016)

gmcunni said:


> ......mandate helmet use at New York ski areas for anyone under the mental age of 14.



That's most of A-zone!!!


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## BenedictGomez (Jun 9, 2016)

steamboat1 said:


> NJ has had a ski helmet law since 2011, under 18.



Is there a way to look up how many tickets have been written in the 5 years?


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## cdskier (Jun 9, 2016)

BenedictGomez said:


> Is there a way to look up how many tickets have been written in the 5 years?



Call up the Vernon police dept and ask :razz:

Ideally the answer would be none if everyone simply complied.


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## loafer89 (Jun 9, 2016)

Not skiing related, but I love how here in Connecticut all people riding on a motorcycle over the age of 18 do not need a helmet, but I have to wear a seatbelt in my car surrounded by 4,00lbs of steel + airbags. That make a lot of sense to me, NOT.


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## skiNEwhere (Jun 10, 2016)

loafer89 said:


> Not skiing related, but I love how here in Connecticut all people riding on a motorcycle over the age of 18 do not need a helmet, but I have to wear a seatbelt in my car surrounded by 4,00lbs of steel + airbags. That make a lot of sense to me, NOT.



I've always found that to be quite ironic as well. Same deal in Colorado.


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## deadheadskier (Jun 10, 2016)

I think NH is the only state there's no seatbelt or helmet law.


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## skiNEwhere (Jun 10, 2016)

NH is definitely the only state that doesn't have a seatbelt law. Live free or die!


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## loafer89 (Jun 10, 2016)

skiNEwhere said:


> NH is definitely the only state that doesn't have a seatbelt law. Live free or die!



I noticed your location, have you summer skied on Saint Mary's Glacier?


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## skiNEwhere (Jun 10, 2016)

Yessir.  I'll likely be skiing it for the next few months. Absolutely terrible skiing, but it is skiing (think: sun cupped moguls). There's a TR floating around this site somewhere


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## BenedictGomez (Jun 10, 2016)

deadheadskier said:


> I think *NH is the only state there's no seatbelt or helmet law.*



Which is why untold thousands of New Hampshire citizens needlessly die on the highways and ski slopes each year.


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## deadheadskier (Jun 10, 2016)

BenedictGomez said:


> Which is why untold thousands of New Hampshire citizens needlessly die on the highways and ski slopes each year.



My comment was about cars and motorcycles; and yes, we have plenty of people dying in automotive and motorcycle accidents that probably would have survived had they taken proper safety precautions.   

As it's the start of bike week in Laconia I'm sure we will read about a few in the next ten days. There's been one already although it hasn't been revealed if the deceased was wearing a helmet. Given the vast majority of riders don't during bike week, I'm going to guess no.

In the medical field motorcyclists who ride without helmets are referred to as"organ donors." Same could be said of those who choose not to wear seatbelts.


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## Cornhead (Jun 10, 2016)

I read somewhere that a motorcycle helmet basically protects you as if the bike were stationary, it fell over, and you hit your head. If your head strikes anything while moving, it probably doesn't matter if you're wearing a helmet, or not. That being said, I don't think I'd ride without one. Grinding your face off on the pavement doesn't sound like fun either.


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## dlague (Jun 10, 2016)

loafer89 said:


> I noticed your location, have you summer skied on Saint Mary's Glacier?





skiNEwhere said:


> Yessir.  I'll likely be skiing it for the next few months. Absolutely terrible skiing, but it is skiing (think: sun cupped moguls). There's a TR floating around this site somewhere



Hmmmm - get's me thinking!  Just looked it up and it is not that far from CS.


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## loafer89 (Jun 10, 2016)

skiNEwhere said:


> Yessir.  I'll likely be skiing it for the next few months. Absolutely terrible skiing, but it is skiing (think: sun cupped moguls). There's a TR floating around this site somewhere




I looks more like a snowfield than a glacier, especially near the end of the summer melt season. Have you skied any other glaciers I Colorado like Taylor Glacier?


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## loafer89 (Jun 10, 2016)

I wear my seatbelt religiously even for short trips down the street. It just irk's me that there is no law for folks on bikes to wear helmets past age 18 in Connecticut.


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## Smellytele (Jun 10, 2016)

skiNEwhere said:


> NH is definitely the only state that doesn't have a seatbelt law. Live free or die!



under 18 you have to use one in NH


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## BenedictGomez (Jun 10, 2016)

deadheadskier said:


> *In the medical field motorcyclists are referred to as"organ donors."*



Close, but I fixed it for you.



loafer89 said:


> *I wear my seatbelt religiously even for short trips down the street.*



As do I, and I bet you didn't need a "law" to require you to do so.  I dont.


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## BenedictGomez (Jun 10, 2016)

Cornhead said:


> I read somewhere that a motorcycle helmet basically protects you as if the bike were stationary, it fell over, and you hit your head.* If your head strikes anything while moving, it probably doesn't matter if you're wearing a helmet, or not. *That being said, I don't think I'd ride without one. Grinding your face off on the pavement doesn't sound like fun either.



It appears you're right....



> *Helmets are estimated to be 37 percent effective in preventing fatal injuries for motorcycle riders*



That said, it's better to have a 37% chance at survival than no chance at survival. lol

http://www.iii.org/issue-update/motorcycle-crashes


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## Cornhead (Jun 10, 2016)

BenedictGomez said:


> It appears you're right....
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Ha, same 37% less likelyhood of fatal crashes for bikes with antilock brakes. I always thought ABS seems more useful on a bike than a car, you don't loose control, at least as much control, or go over your front wheels, if you lock up your brakes in a car. 

I've never had a motorcycle with ABS, but I know it'd be a big plus to be able to grab the brakes hard and maintain control. I was warned by the local Harley dealership to be careful with the 96 Buell Lighting I bought used, they said people were flipping them over when they first came out, 6 piston caliper in the front. Guess you'd be glad you had a helmet on then.


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## abc (Jun 10, 2016)

37% is very significant. Whether it ends up putting you in a vegetated state instead of in the grave is not clear though. 



Cornhead said:


> That being said, I don't think I'd ride without one. Grinding your face off on the pavement doesn't sound like fun either.


I've had proved that scenario a couple times (bicycle, not motor) to be able to say I'm keeping my lid on my head. 

Badly scratched glasses, badly scratched and partially crushed helmet. Relatively minor facial laceration and intact nose/teeth.   

Don't need a law though. I'm doing it on my own. I prefer others ADULTS be allowed to make their own choice.


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## BenedictGomez (Jun 10, 2016)

abc said:


> *37% is very significant. Whether it ends up putting you in a vegetated state instead of in the grave is not clear though. *



Way to see the silver lining.  Good point though.


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## yeggous (Jun 10, 2016)

deadheadskier said:


> As opposed to say 18 when age becomes more difficult to determine by a quick glance.



You said it. Jail bait will be the death of me.


Sent from my iPhone using AlpineZone mobile app


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## deadheadskier (Jun 10, 2016)

Ha!


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## Funky_Catskills (Jun 13, 2016)

DonorCycles


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## gmcunni (Jun 15, 2016)

> A bill that would require children 14 and under to wear helmets when skiing or snowboarding in the state of New York failed to move in the Assembly Tuesday morning after it passed by the state Senate last week


Read more at http://www.powder.com/stories/news/...uired-by-law-in-new-york/#8ki3kXLSDBZuxs4u.99


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