# 21 and Older Pubs at Ski Areas During the Day?



## dlague (Dec 1, 2014)

This weekend while skiing at Cannon we discovered that our son (12) would not be able to eat with us in the Cannonball Pub - BECAUSE IT WAS AFTER 2:30.   BTW this is a Saturday only rule.  That seemed odd to me since the skiing day had not ended yet and there were plenty of families that might have wanted some pub grub and drinks.  Seems to me that this is a money losing proposition.  In all my years of skiing and having skied at many other ski areas, I must say that I have never heard of this before.  I can certainly see maybe a late night Apres Ski Party, maybe?  But not in the middle of the after noon!

Do any of you know where a similar practice takes place?  Is this a good idea or a bad idea?


----------



## Tin (Dec 1, 2014)

Weird. Before 8-9pm as long as they are accompanied by an adult I dont see the issue.


----------



## steamboat1 (Dec 1, 2014)

Most ski areas I've been to do not let children sit at the bar but sitting at a table with their parents is perfectly fine, especially when ordering food. The Mansfield lodge at Stowe has the bar in the middle of the base lodge & it's not roped off either. Seems like a bad idea to me & like you said they'll probably lose income because of their policy.


----------



## Puck it (Dec 1, 2014)

It is normal at Cannon. I think it has to do with the live music that they have on Saturdays if I remeber right from last year.  We had the same issue with our 19 yr old daughter last year.


----------



## dlague (Dec 1, 2014)

Puck it said:


> It is normal at Cannon. I think it has to do with the live music that they have on Saturdays if I remember right from last year.  We had the same issue with our 19 yr old daughter last year.



That is correct!  But that does not stop the problem and the music has nothing to do with it!  The staff of Cannonball Pub need to take responsibility too.  Whats to stop me from buying two beers then sitting in the area out side of the pub and hand one to my 19 year old after 2:30 (BTW I would not do that).  That same 19 year old who had access last year still access today irregardless.


----------



## steamboat1 (Dec 1, 2014)

Puck it said:


> It is normal at Cannon. I think it has to do with the live music that they have on Saturdays if I remeber right from last year.  *We had the same issue with our 19 yr old daughter last year.*


When I turned 18 that was the legal drinking age. I remember the first thing I did after picking up my draft card that day was go to a bar. This was the year they ended the draft. If you're old enough to join the service I can't see why you wouldn't be allowed to drink.


----------



## deadheadskier (Dec 1, 2014)

I would suggest writing management an email to get clarification on an odd policy.  Maybe its a NH state law not enforced at other places? The state does have some odd rules that most places do not enforce  such as no alcoholic beverages allowed on dance floors.  It could be the state and not Cannon mgmt.


----------



## xwhaler (Dec 1, 2014)

I experienced this last yr as well. My wife was in the lodge w/ our 1 yr old son while I did some runs with Savemeasammy. She tried grabbing lunch in Cannonball with him around 2. 
While the sign does say after 2:30 she was there at 2 and was told that because it was unlikely they would finish eating/paying the bill before 2:30 they were not allowed in. 
I wasn't too happy when I heard that but as mentioned I do think it only hurts their $


----------



## Tin (Dec 1, 2014)

steamboat1 said:


> When I turned 18 that was the legal drinking age. I remember the first thing I did after picking up my draft card that day was go to a bar. This was the year they ended the draft. If you're old enough to join the service I can't see why you wouldn't be allowed to drink.


----------



## steamboat1 (Dec 1, 2014)

Tin said:


>


If you can remember the year they ended the draft then you can guess my age. Far from being old.


----------



## Tin (Dec 1, 2014)

So you were 18 years old in 1973?


----------



## steamboat1 (Dec 1, 2014)

Tin said:


> So you were 18 years old in 1973?


Nope, registration for the draft ended a couple years later.


----------



## Smellytele (Dec 1, 2014)

steamboat1 said:


> Nope, registration for the draft ended a couple years later.



actually doesn't every 18 year old still need to register with selective services? Just the actual draft ended on Jan. 27, 1973.


----------



## steamboat1 (Dec 1, 2014)

Smellytele said:


> actually doesn't every 18 year old still need to register with selective services? Just the actual draft ended on Jan. 27, 1973.


That started two years after they ended the requirement of registering for the draft. There was a couple of year period when no registration was required.


----------



## Smellytele (Dec 1, 2014)

On March 29, 1975, President Ford  signed Proclamation 4360 (Terminating Registration Procedures Under  Military Selective Service Act), eliminating the registration  requirement for all 18–25 year old male citizens.[SUP][14][/SUP]
 On July 2, 1980, however, President Carter signed Proclamation 4771 (Registration Under the Military Selective Service Act) in response to the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan,[SUP][15][/SUP]  retroactively re-establishing the Selective Service registration  requirement for all 18–26 year old male citizens born on or after  January 1, 1960.[SUP][16][/SUP] Only men born between March 29, 1957, and December 31, 1959, were completely exempt from Selective Service registration.[SUP][17][/SUP]


----------



## jaytrem (Dec 1, 2014)

Cuzzins at Mount Snow had a similar rule, not sure if they still do.  Basically underage people had to be in by a similar time.  Once you were in they wouldn't kick you out.


----------



## steamboat1 (Dec 1, 2014)

Smellytele said:


> Only men born between March 29, 1957, and December 31, 1959, were completely exempt from Selective Service registration.[SUP][17][/SUP]


Like I said there was a couple of year period when no registration was required.


----------



## Smellytele (Dec 1, 2014)

steamboat1 said:


> Like I said there was a couple of year period when no registration was required.



right I was just showing you were correct


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Dec 1, 2014)

Come to Hunter... Let the kids sit at the bar...


----------



## drjeff (Dec 1, 2014)

jaytrem said:


> Cuzzins at Mount Snow had a similar rule, not sure if they still do.  Basically underage people had to be in by a similar time.  Once you were in they wouldn't kick you out.



They still have that policy on most Saturday's for Cuzzin's - kids can be in the bar area at anytime upstairs in the Station Taproom though - If its not busy, I even let my kids sit on a bar stool along the outer rail (not at the bar proper though) - then again the bartender's up in The Station know my kids on a 1st name basis and know that my kids like a long push on the sprite button of their soda gun!  lol


----------



## bobbutts (Dec 1, 2014)

You guys would enjoy La Quinta in Springfield MA.  They let babies in the bar at midnight.


----------



## Edd (Dec 1, 2014)

As a frequent bar patron I dislike kids in there, but it doesn't make a ton of business sense for Cannon to do that. The last thing ski areas need to do is ban kids from anything. They are the future skiers, and parents have enough hassles.


----------



## Brad J (Dec 1, 2014)

steamboat1 said:


> When I turned 18 that was the legal drinking age. I remember the first thing I did after picking up my draft card that day was go to a bar. This was the year they ended the draft. If you're old enough to join the service I can't see why you wouldn't be allowed to drink.



you must be very close in age to me 18 in 1972, did not register until I was 19 they were not very happy with me. scary


----------



## snoseek (Dec 1, 2014)

I'm ok with having a kid free zone, pubs are the perfect place. I like to cuss and talk shit when I drink, that's sorta what happens at bars. I have zero parenting experience but I can promise you if I did you wouldn't see them around a bunch of people drinking.

Do as you wish, just know that if someones slurring fbombs it sort of goes with the territory


----------



## skiur (Dec 2, 2014)

I have no problem with kids in bars, Its should be up to the parents if they want them in there, but dont give me a dirty look if I curse around your kid in a bar.  Most other places I watch my language if young kids are around but if you bring your kid in a bar and sit next to me I will curse at will, Cannon may feel they dont want kids in the bar because they take up seats that could otherwise be held by someone buying alcohol which costs much more the soda.


----------



## Edd (Dec 2, 2014)

skiur said:


> Cannon may feel they dont want kids in the bar because they take up seats that could otherwise be held by someone buying alcohol which costs much more the soda.



That's an interesting thought.


----------



## Bandit2941 (Dec 2, 2014)

snoseek pretty much nailed it.

I think it's a great rule and I wish more mountains would do it! What I find is that the parents with big groups of kids come in and take over tables in the bar and then eat their own food. So I don't have a place to sit and consume what I actually bought from the resort!


----------



## steamboat1 (Dec 2, 2014)

Bandit2941 said:


> snoseek pretty much nailed it.
> 
> I think it's a great rule and I wish more mountains would do it! What I find is that the parents with big groups of kids come in and take over tables in the bar and then eat their own food. So I don't have a place to sit and consume what I actually bought from the resort!


I'm not aware of any ski area pub that allows you to brown bag, especially if they serve food.


----------



## dlague (Dec 2, 2014)

snoseek said:


> I'm ok with having a kid free zone, pubs are the perfect place. I like to cuss and talk shit when I drink, that's sorta what happens at bars. I have zero parenting experience but I can promise you if I did you wouldn't see them around a bunch of people drinking.
> 
> Do as you wish, just know that if someones slurring fbombs it sort of goes with the territory





skiur said:


> I have no problem with kids in bars, Its should be up to the parents if they want them in there, but dont give me a dirty look if I curse around your kid in a bar.  Most other places I watch my language if young kids are around but if you bring your kid in a bar and sit next to me I will curse at will, Cannon may feel they dont want kids in the bar because they take up seats that could otherwise be held by someone buying alcohol which costs much more the soda.



Language around my kids is not a concern for me.  If the primary restaurant at the resort is doubling up as a bar there too - where are the options.  Pats Peak has the Sled Pub which is also their primary place for sit down lunch or dining as such is the Case of Cannon it is the Cannonball Pub, at Waterville it is T-bar, at Attitash it is Ptarmigan's Pub, at Wildcat it is Wildcat Pub all of which are the bar and restaurant, however Cannonball Pub is the only one with this restriction.  Personally it is their business so no big loss for me - in fact it is a gain since I will spend less.


----------



## dlague (Dec 2, 2014)

steamboat1 said:


> I'm not aware of any ski area pub that allows you to brown bag, especially if they serve food.



Well the K-1 Lodge I see people eating bagged lunches and well as people eating food bought from the resort at the MAHOGANY RIDGE BAR (never knew the name of it until now).  I think it works as a well blended environment.  Of course that bar seems to be self serve much of the time.  The bar at Mid Burke is like that to on a smaller scale.


----------



## Tin (Dec 2, 2014)

Pico has a brown bag area only and I have never had a problem with it at K.


----------



## Smellytele (Dec 2, 2014)

dlague said:


> Well the K-1 Lodge I see people eating bagged lunches and well as people eating food bought from the resort at the MAHOGANY RIDGE BAR (never knew the name of it until now).  I think it works as a well blended environment.  Of course that bar seems to be self serve much of the time.  The bar at Mid Burke is like that to on a smaller scale.


Do they have table service at the K-1 lodge?


----------



## dlague (Dec 2, 2014)

Smellytele said:


> Do they have table service at the K-1 lodge?



I have seen it when there are bands playing other than that no!  Regulars can state otherwise.


----------



## dlague (Dec 2, 2014)

Tin said:


> Pico has a brown bag area only and I have never had a problem with it at K.



That is what is nice brown bag and still get your beer or sit in the area where the bar is not and brown bag and BYOB.


----------



## Smellytele (Dec 2, 2014)

dlague said:


> I have seen it when there are bands playing other than that no!  Regulars can state otherwise.



Only for drinks not food.


----------



## bigbog (Dec 2, 2014)

Pretty bizarre...would hazard a guess that the owners must be pretty young.   One sometimes sees young business owners with EC(New England) educations(I'd _assume_) making pretty parochial business decisions...particularly where one could get some food there.


----------



## dlague (Dec 2, 2014)

Smellytele said:


> Only for drinks not food.



Yes


----------



## skiur (Dec 2, 2014)

Smellytele said:


> Do they have table service at the K-1 lodge?



no table service at K1 thats why you can bring cafeteria food or your own food into mahogony.  Used to have the superstar pub next to it (Thank you irene for knocking it down and giving us the u-bars) and you could not bring your own food in there.


----------



## SIKSKIER (Dec 2, 2014)

The Cannonball Pub can get very crowded on Saturday afternoon for happy hour.I think its more of a money thing.Drinks are a lot more profitable than food.I actually reluctantly skip HH because its way too crowded for me and can be a sauna with all the people.As far as bringing a beer outside the bar,that is not a problem as they sell beer in the cafeteria area.Their license covers that and the deck.


----------



## deadheadskier (Dec 2, 2014)

More ski area cafeterias should sell beer.  I'm typically a barfly, but if I'm just looking to grab a quick bite and a drink, I just assume grab a bottle of something decent with my cafeteria grub.  That way I'm not waiting for a bartender to serve me, bring the tab, cash me out etc.


----------



## thetrailboss (Dec 2, 2014)

dlague said:


> This weekend while skiing at Cannon we discovered that our son (12) would not be able to eat with us in the Cannonball Pub - BECAUSE IT WAS AFTER 2:30.   BTW this is a Saturday only rule.  That seemed odd to me since the skiing day had not ended yet and there were plenty of families that might have wanted some pub grub and drinks.  Seems to me that this is a money losing proposition.  In all my years of skiing and having skied at many other ski areas, I must say that I have never heard of this before.  I can certainly see maybe a late night Apres Ski Party, maybe?  But not in the middle of the after noon!
> 
> Do any of you know where a similar practice takes place?  Is this a good idea or a bad idea?



Maybe it's been said, but this could be an issue with their liquor license.  Some states (like Utah) do not allow those under 21 to be in bars.


----------



## Cannonball (Dec 2, 2014)

SIKSKIER said:


> The Cannonball Pub can get very crowded on Saturday afternoon for happy hour.I think its more of a money thing.Drinks are a lot more profitable than food.I actually reluctantly skip HH because its way too crowded for me and can be a sauna with all the people.As far as bringing a beer outside the bar,that is not a problem as they sell beer in the cafeteria area.Their license covers that and the deck.



^This.  
I've also been annoyed that I couldn't bring my nephews into the bar there at the end of the day.  But to consider it a bad business decision is missing the point.  It's not like there are empty stools in there.  It's packed!! They want to put people on those stools that are buying $7 beers and adult meals vs $2 cokes and chicken fingers.


----------



## dlague (Dec 2, 2014)

thetrailboss said:


> Maybe it's been said, but this could be an issue with their liquor license.  Some states (like Utah) do not allow those under 21 to be in bars.



In another post I mention several NH ski areas that do not have that rule and they have bands playing Apres Ski.  Thats ok Zoomer Bar it is!  Just have to find it! :beer:


----------



## Puck it (Dec 2, 2014)

dlague said:


> In another post I mention several NH ski areas that do not have that rule and they have bands playing Apres Ski. Thats ok Zoomer Bar it is! Just have to find it! :beer:




Just look for the White FJ.


----------



## buellski (Dec 2, 2014)

deadheadskier said:


> More ski area cafeterias should sell beer.



I agree. The Gatehouse Lodge at Sugarbush is a great example. It's nice to be able to grab some food and a bottle of beer!


----------



## dlague (Dec 2, 2014)

Puck it said:


> Just look for the White FJ.



Will do!


----------



## 603Skier (Dec 2, 2014)

I agree with bring your own and bag.  we usually BBQ in the lot.  But when its unbearable cold I fill multiple thermos up and sit right in the thick of it.  Man the lot usually always wins though.


----------



## dlague (Dec 3, 2014)

Out of curiosity - how many bring their own food and ADULT beverages and sit in the lodge and enjoy?  This past weekend, we premixed some Bloody Caesars and packed a few Harpoon and sat in the Northview Base Lodge.  While drinking my IPA my wife noticed the "No Alcohol" sign, but drank it anyhow.  The lunch break would take too much time following their rules!  I do not see it that often but I do see it which led me to say f' it!

On a warmer day the lot seems to be a way to go there - hence the Zoomer bar!


----------



## SkiFanE (Dec 3, 2014)

dlague said:


> Out of curiosity - how many bring their own food and ADULT beverages and sit in the lodge and enjoy?  This past weekend, we premixed some Bloody Caesars and packed a few Harpoon and sat in the Northview Base Lodge.  While drinking my IPA my wife noticed the "No Alcohol" sign, but drank it anyhow.  The lunch break would take too much time following their rules!  I do not see it that often but I do see it which led me to say f' it!
> 
> On a warmer day the lot seems to be a way to go there - hence the Zoomer bar!



I would never bring an adult beverage to a bar/lodge and drink it - that just sounds wrong.  I don't think it gives any regard to the business and what they provide you to eat/drink (warm location, clean table, chairs, rest rooms...).  Especially when I have a full tray of $20 lunch for kids and we can't find a place to sit with all the bag lunchers taking tables.  But yet you bought a lift ticket, so I'm not saying it's "wrong", just not what I'd do.  We bring lunch sometimes, buy sometimes...but we always end up buying a beer or snack for kids, husband has a mug...and since we're at our  home mountain 95% of the time - it all works out.  What REALLY bugs me are the groups that think they own a table all day long b/c some grandma/aunt/grandpa is not skiing and can hold it...some will lay out a tablecloth all day.  AND then they eat their own food.  There are no signs saying you are not welcome, no rules...BUT common courtesy should prevail when there are 20 tables for 100s of people and they're being hogs.  Some people are just assholes, no way to change that...I'll grab a side of the table and push cloth aside if needed, I can be an ass back


----------



## Smellytele (Dec 3, 2014)

SkiFanE said:


> I would never bring an adult beverage to a bar/lodge and drink it - that just sounds wrong.  I don't think it gives any regard to the business and what they provide you to eat/drink (warm location, clean table, chairs, rest rooms...).  Especially when I have a full tray of $20 lunch for kids and we can't find a place to sit with all the bag lunchers taking tables.  But yet you bought a lift ticket, so I'm not saying it's "wrong", just not what I'd do.  We bring lunch sometimes, buy sometimes...but we always end up buying a beer or snack for kids, husband has a mug...and since we're at our  home mountain 95% of the time - it all works out.  What REALLY bugs me are the groups that think they own a table all day long b/c some grandma/aunt/grandpa is not skiing and can hold it...some will lay out a tablecloth all day.  AND then they eat their own food.  There are no signs saying you are not welcome, no rules...BUT common courtesy should prevail when there are 20 tables for 100s of people and they're being hogs.  Some people are just assholes, no way to change that...I'll grab a side of the table and push cloth aside if needed, I can be an ass back



I have been to some ski areas where people bring crock pots and plug them in and leave them there all day...


----------



## Puck it (Dec 3, 2014)

Smellytele said:


> I have been to some ski areas where people bring crock pots and plug them in and leave them there all day...



Did you take a bowl?  Free food you know.


----------



## steamboat1 (Dec 3, 2014)

Smellytele said:


> I have been to some ski areas where people bring crock pots and plug them in and leave them there all day...


Very common in the lower level of the Pico base lodge.


----------



## snoseek (Dec 3, 2014)

SkiFanE said:


> I would never bring an adult beverage to a bar/lodge and drink it - that just sounds wrong.  I don't think it gives any regard to the business and what they provide you to eat/drink (warm location, clean table, chairs, rest rooms...).  Especially when I have a full tray of $20 lunch for kids and we can't find a place to sit with all the bag lunchers taking tables.  But yet you bought a lift ticket, so I'm not saying it's "wrong", just not what I'd do.  We bring lunch sometimes, buy sometimes...but we always end up buying a beer or snack for kids, husband has a mug...and since we're at our  home mountain 95% of the time - it all works out.  What REALLY bugs me are the groups that think they own a table all day long b/c some grandma/aunt/grandpa is not skiing and can hold it...some will lay out a tablecloth all day.  AND then they eat their own food.  There are no signs saying you are not welcome, no rules...BUT common courtesy should prevail when there are 20 tables for 100s of people and they're being hogs.  Some people are just assholes, no way to change that...I'll grab a side of the table and push cloth aside if needed, I can be an ass back




I'm a firm believer every area needs to make adequate space complete with microwaves, hot water ect...for brown baggers and keep them away from areas where food/drinks are being sold. Simple concept, some areas do better than others at this. Loveland wins hands down


----------



## dlague (Dec 3, 2014)

SkiFanE said:


> I would never bring an adult beverage to a bar/lodge and drink it - that just sounds wrong.  I don't think it gives any regard to the business and what they provide you to eat/drink (warm location, clean table, chairs, rest rooms...).  Especially when I have a full tray of $20 lunch for kids and we can't find a place to sit with all the bag lunchers taking tables.  But yet you bought a lift ticket, so I'm not saying it's "wrong", just not what I'd do.  We bring lunch sometimes, buy sometimes...but we always end up buying a beer or snack for kids, husband has a mug...and since we're at our  home mountain 95% of the time - it all works out.  What REALLY bugs me are the groups that think they own a table all day long b/c some grandma/aunt/grandpa is not skiing and can hold it...some will lay out a tablecloth all day.  AND then they eat their own food.  There are no signs saying you are not welcome, no rules...BUT common courtesy should prevail when there are 20 tables for 100s of people and they're being hogs.  Some people are just assholes, no way to change that...I'll grab a side of the table and push cloth aside if needed, I can be an ass back



This past weekend, people were putting their boot bags all across a table while they were out skiing!  Where I see this happen often with non skiers is at Bretton Woods!



Smellytele said:


> I have been to some ski areas where people bring crock pots and plug them in and leave them there all day...



My sister-in-law did that one time we were skiing Ragged and there was a row of them not just hers!  I know another family that brings a hotdog steamer.  I stayed away from my sister-in-law and sat at a different table while we ate resort purchased food and drinks.  It just seemed weird.

BTW - this was the first time we brought our own adult beverages - were not sure if much would be open.  I do see quite a few people bringing their own which is due to the fact that few resorts have places where you can have a bagged lunch and order a drink/beer!  If I come in the lodge to eat, I want to have a beer and eat lunch - not have lunch then go have a beer.  I would never bring a bagged lunch into a place where you can order food likewise I would not bring my drinks into an area they sell beverages.

Ragged does a great job with that.  Huge area for people who bring their own food and they can order drinks from the bar and drink them there.  That does not seem to be an option in Northview or in Peabody.


----------



## Cannonball (Dec 3, 2014)

dlague said:


> Ragged does a great job with that.  Huge area for people who bring their own food and they can order drinks from the bar and drink them there.  That does not seem to be an option in Northview or in Peabody.



FYI it's "Notchview".  I frequently bring my own food to the Peabody lodge and/or deck and eat it with a beer bought from the cafeteria or bar or deck (they sell in all 3 places).  Notchview also sells beer (but prob isn't open yet).


----------



## steamboat1 (Dec 3, 2014)

I rarely drink beer during lunch. Makes me want to pee.


----------



## 603Skier (Dec 3, 2014)

steamboat1 said:


> I rarely drink beer during lunch. Makes me want to pee.



Yellow dotted mountains when I'm done lunch


----------



## drjeff (Dec 3, 2014)

Not sure about NH - but in some states there are liquor laws where you can't bring outside booze into a venue where its sold - can potentially create issues with their overall liquor license


----------



## VTKilarney (Dec 4, 2014)

skiur said:


> I have no problem with kids in bars, Its should be up to the parents if they want them in there, but dont give me a dirty look if I curse around your kid in a bar.  Most other places I watch my language if young kids are around but if you bring your kid in a bar and sit next to me I will curse at will, Cannon may feel they dont want kids in the bar because they take up seats that could otherwise be held by someone buying alcohol which costs much more the soda.


If there is only one restaurant at a ski area that allows families, and it has a bar, you should be respectful that it's a family restaurant and not your neighborhood pub.


----------



## Smellytele (Dec 4, 2014)

At the Peabody lodge they have tried to get the brown baggers into the basement which I can't stand sitting in a room that is like a cave. I remember when the bar was down stairs before they moved it into the middle of the lodge (before the addition). I hated that to.


----------



## skiur (Dec 4, 2014)

drjeff said:


> Not sure about NH - but in some states there are liquor laws where you can't bring outside booze into a venue where its sold - can potentially create issues with their overall liquor license



That is the case in VT, you can not bring outside alcohol into a bar.


----------



## deadheadskier (Dec 4, 2014)

skiur said:


> That is the case in VT, you can not bring outside alcohol into a bar.



mostly

Unless the law has changed, certain places do permit you to bring in your own bottle of wine and pay a corkage fee.


----------



## SIKSKIER (Dec 4, 2014)

Smellytele said:


> At the Peabody lodge they have tried to get the brown baggers into the basement which I can't stand sitting in a room that is like a cave. I remember when the bar was down stairs before they moved it into the middle of the lodge (before the addition). I hated that to.


The old Rathskeller lounge in the basement was the pits.The real problem I had with that is the paying customers were down in the dungeon while the brown baggers were upstairs with the great view of the mountain.Brown baggers should be downstairs and paying customers upstairs.Plus they greatly expanded the brown bag area downstairs and added microwave ovens and video games.


----------



## C-Rex (Dec 4, 2014)

I'd imagine they make much more profit from booze sales than from food.  Especially at the end of the day when most people have already eaten lunch.  They probably don't want kids taking up seats that drinking customers could be in.  If it's dead it doesn't make much business sense, but on a busy day I'd bet they up their sales with that policy.

I don't have kids and I know it's a sensitive subject for parents, but the fact is that the world doesn't revolve around your kids.  I'd actually like to see more places have 21+ only bars or at least sections.  I like kids but I certainly don't like dealing with them all the time.  And some parents do a less than satisfactory job of managing their children.  I don't see a problem with having a place where adults can be adults without offending someone or their children.


----------



## dlague (Dec 4, 2014)

Cannonball said:


> FYI it's "Notchview".  I frequently bring my own food to the Peabody lodge and/or deck and eat it with a beer bought from the cafeteria or bar or deck (they sell in all 3 places).  Notchview also sells beer (but prob isn't open yet).



Notchview - yes stand corrected - newbie at Cannon.  Skiing with you last season there was my second time there ever.



Smellytele said:


> At the Peabody lodge they have tried to get the brown baggers into the basement which I can't stand sitting in a room that is like a cave. I remember when the bar was down stairs before they moved it into the middle of the lodge (before the addition). I hated that to.



There are three distinct areas in Peabody Lodge the Pub (restaurant right?), area outside the Pub which is the cafeteria where alcohol can be consumed but bagged food not allowed, and the "cave" where you can picnic (Cannon's term) but can not consume alcohol.  What about those who bring their lunch but also want a beer?  I guess there is the deck but that would suck on a really cold day or BYOB, camouflage it and sit in a picnic area.



skiur said:


> That is the case in VT, you can not bring outside alcohol into a bar.



Was not talking about bringing a beer into a bar.



C-Rex said:


> I'd imagine they make much more profit from booze sales than from food.  Especially at the end of the day when most people have already eaten lunch.  They probably don't want kids taking up seats that drinking customers could be in.  If it's dead it doesn't make much business sense, but on a busy day I'd bet they up their sales with that policy.
> 
> I don't have kids and I know it's a sensitive subject for parents, but the fact is that the world doesn't revolve around your kids.  I'd actually like to see more places have 21+ only bars or at least sections.  I like kids but I certainly don't like dealing with them all the time.  And some parents do a less than satisfactory job of managing their children.  I don't see a problem with having a place where adults can be adults without offending someone or their children.



This is not about "world revolving around kids", it is about shutting down the only real restaurant at a ski area during "Skiing hours" to families.  If I cannot sit down at a waited table at 2 pm at a ski area because I have some one under 21 with me - that's f'd up!  

Using Jay Peak as an example - if they want to make the Tower Bar 21+ after 2:30 - fine.  I can still go to Alice's Table, The Foundry, etc.

BTW, there is nothing you can say to my 12 year old that would offend him - he is the youngest of four boys and has heard plenty!


----------



## VTKilarney (Dec 4, 2014)

deadheadskier said:


> mostly
> 
> Unless the law has changed, certain places do permit you to bring in your own bottle of wine and pay a corkage fee.


Those places do not sell alcohol.  So you aren't bringing alcohol into a "bar".


----------



## VTKilarney (Dec 4, 2014)

C-Rex said:


> I don't have kids and I know it's a sensitive subject for parents, but the fact is that the world doesn't revolve around your kids.  I'd actually like to see more places have 21+ only bars or at least sections.  I like kids but I certainly don't like dealing with them all the time.  And some parents do a less than satisfactory job of managing their children.  I don't see a problem with having a place where adults can be adults without offending someone or their children.


For me it's pretty simple.  A family ski area should have proper space for families.  If they do, there is nothing wrong with having separate space that is for adults.  If adults are in the "family" space, they should be respectful of children.  Likewise, adults with children should be respectful of the fact that there may be places that are not appropriate for their children.  Their children aren't entitled to be everywhere - so long as they have _somewhere_ to go.


----------



## deadheadskier (Dec 4, 2014)

VTKilarney said:


> Those places do not sell alcohol.  So you aren't bringing alcohol into a "bar".



Wrong.  

I worked at more than a few restaurants in VT over the years that had full liquor licences and patrons were allowed to bring in their own bottle for a corkage fee.   It was usually a $10-$15 fee so that the restaurant recouped whatever profit they'd miss out on by not selling you their own bottle.


----------



## Puck it (Dec 4, 2014)

deadheadskier said:


> Wrong.
> 
> I worked at more than a few restaurants in VT over the years that had full liquor licences and patrons were allowed to bring in their own bottle for a corkage fee. It was usually a $10-$15 fee so that the restaurant recouped whatever profit they'd miss out on by not selling you their own bottle.




Most places allow this with the corking fee.


----------



## VTKilarney (Dec 4, 2014)

deadheadskier said:


> Wrong.
> 
> I worked at more than a few restaurants in VT over the years that had full liquor licences and patrons were allowed to bring in their own bottle for a corkage fee.   It was usually a $10-$15 fee so that the restaurant recouped whatever profit they'd miss out on by not selling you their own bottle.


Unless the regulations have changed, this was illegal.  Vermont's Liquor Control Boar's General Regulation #4 states:
_A licensee shall not possess or allow the consumption of malt, vinous beverages or spirituous liquors
other than those purchased on invoice from a bottler’s or wholesale dealer or on invoice from the
Vermont Liquor Control Board, or on invoice from a direct‐to‐retail shippers licensee._

Wine Spectator had an article about this, and specifically mentioned Vermont as a state that permits corkage only at establishments with no liquor license.  That is certainly consistent with the above regulation.


----------



## deadheadskier (Dec 4, 2014)

No idea what the loop hole is, but plenty of places allow outside wine bottles in with a corkage fee not just in VT, but all over New England.


----------



## deadheadskier (Dec 4, 2014)

IIRC in Vermont, it was a licensing add on - think it was referred to as a B&B license.


----------



## VTKilarney (Dec 4, 2014)

deadheadskier said:


> No idea what the loop hole is, but plenty of places allow outside wine bottles in with a corkage fee not just in VT, but all over New England.


Not trying to be a wise guy, but can you show me the website of a VT restaurant with a liquor license that states this is allowed?  I'm not aware of any loophole, but I'm always happy to be educated.


----------



## witch hobble (Dec 4, 2014)

Notchview > Peabody, imho


----------



## VTKilarney (Dec 4, 2014)

deadheadskier said:


> IIRC in Vermont, it was a licensing add on - think it was referred to as a B&B license.



Here is what the Beaver Pond Farm B&B says on their website:
_Our guest bar offers 24-hour access to fresh-brewed complimentary coffees and teas. We also have a guest refrigerator stocked with wine, beer, bottled water and soft drinks for purchase. To remain in compliance with our liquor license, we ask that you refrain from bringing in your own alcoholic beverages._


----------



## moresnow (Dec 4, 2014)

VTKilarney said:


> Unless the regulations have changed, this was illegal.  Vermont's Liquor Control Boar's General Regulation #4 states:
> _A licensee shall not possess or allow the consumption of malt, vinous beverages or spirituous liquors
> other than those purchased on invoice from a bottler’s or wholesale dealer or on invoice from the
> Vermont Liquor Control Board, or on invoice from a direct‐to‐retail shippers licensee._
> ...



Would mead be a loop hole? Or would that count as a vinous beverage? 

Either way it certainly would go against the spirit of the regulation.


----------



## VTKilarney (Dec 4, 2014)

moresnow said:


> Would mead be a loop hole? Or would that count as a vinous beverage?
> 
> Either way it certainly would go against the spirit of the regulation.


Mead appears to fall under the definition of "vinous beverage":

_Vinous beverages: all fermented beverages of any name or description manufactured or obtained for sale from the natural sugar content of fruits, or other agricultural product, containing sugar, the alcoholic content of which is not less than one percent nor more than 16 percent by volume at 60 degrees Fahrenheit, except that all vermouths shall be purchased and retailed by and through the Liquor Control Board as authorized in chapters 5 and 7 of this title._


----------



## deadheadskier (Dec 4, 2014)

I'm not going to go on some website policy search for you.  All I can tell you is I worked as a server, bartender, F&B manager etc. from 1995 until 2007.  Much of that time was in Vermont, but also in numerous other states.  Probably a dozen different establishments over that time.  It was never advertised, but almost all of them allowed outside wine to be brought in and opened for a corkage fee.   Mes Amis is the one place I recall in Stowe where we allowed it.  Maybe laws have changed, maybe laws were broken, but this is fairly common practice.


----------



## moresnow (Dec 4, 2014)

VTKilarney said:


> Mead appears to fall under the definition of "vinous beverage":
> 
> _Vinous beverages: all fermented beverages of any name or description manufactured or obtained for sale from the natural sugar content of fruits, or other agricultural product, containing sugar, the alcoholic content of which is not less than one percent nor more than 16 percent by volume at 60 degrees Fahrenheit, except that all vermouths shall be purchased and retailed by and through the Liquor Control Board as authorized in chapters 5 and 7 of this title._


They had to go and add "other agricultural product" to the regulation.  Figures.


----------



## VTKilarney (Dec 4, 2014)

deadheadskier said:


> I'm not going to go on some website policy search for you.  All I can tell you is I worked as a server, bartender, F&B manager etc. from 1995 until 2007.  Much of that time was in Vermont, but also in numerous other states.  Probably a dozen different establishments over that time.  It was never advertised, but almost all of them allowed outside wine to be brought in and opened for a corkage fee.   Mes Amis is the one place I recall in Stowe where we allowed it.  Maybe laws have changed, maybe laws were broken, but this is fairly common practice.


Respectfully, you would think that a F&B manager would know if alcohol was being served legally or illegally.  By every indication it appears to have been illegal.


----------



## deadheadskier (Dec 4, 2014)

Respectfully, I really don't feel like arguing with you anymore.  Corkage fees are common in licensed establishments across the country.   

Here's nh law http://www.nh.gov/liquor/corkagefee.shtml


----------



## VTKilarney (Dec 4, 2014)

deadheadskier said:


> Respectfully, I really don't feel like arguing with you anymore.  Corkage fees are common in licensed establishments across the country.
> 
> Here's nh law http://www.nh.gov/liquor/corkagefee.shtml


We were talking about Vermont until just now.


----------



## dlague (Dec 4, 2014)

VTKilarney said:


> We were talking about Vermont until just now.



I think the confusion was due to a NH person and a VT person talking about their respective states, but the discussion started with a ski area in NH?


----------



## VTKilarney (Dec 4, 2014)

dlague said:


> I think the confusion was due to a NH person and a VT person talking about their respective states, but the discussion started with a ski area in NH?


That could be.  I assumed we were speaking about Vermont because of comments like these:


skiur said:


> That is the case in VT, you can not bring outside alcohol into a bar.





deadheadskier said:


> Wrong.  I worked at more than a few restaurants in VT over the years that had full liquor licences and patrons were allowed to bring in their own bottle for a corkage fee.





deadheadskier said:


> IIRC in Vermont, it was a licensing add on - think it was referred to as a B&B license.



I did some asking around, and nobody can remember BYOB being legal in VT for licensed establishments.  Well... correction.  One person who posts here who worked as a server, bartender, F&B manager etc. in Vermont from 1995 until 2007 thought that it may have been legal through a "licensing add-on".  But that is it.


----------



## deadheadskier (Dec 4, 2014)

Jesus dude.  Get a grip


----------



## Smellytele (Dec 4, 2014)

deadheadskier said:


> Jesus dude.  Get a grip



+1


----------



## C-Rex (Dec 4, 2014)

dlague said:


> This is not about "world revolving around kids", it is about shutting down the only real restaurant at a ski area during "Skiing hours" to families. If I cannot sit down at a waited table at 2 pm at a ski area because I have some one under 21 with me - that's f'd up!
> 
> Using Jay Peak as an example - if they want to make the Tower Bar 21+ after 2:30 - fine. I can still go to Alice's Table, The Foundry, etc.
> 
> BTW, there is nothing you can say to my 12 year old that would offend him - he is the youngest of four boys and has heard plenty!



Fair enough. I've only been to Cannon once so I don't know much about it's eateries.  It would be messed up if the only place to eat had that policy.  And FWIW, just because you and your son aren't easily offended doesn't mean I can assume that no one is.  I'm not even a loud mouth like that so it's really not an issue for me.  However, I can appreciate an adults only environment in certain situations and don't think we should have to wait until after mountain hours to get it.  I think everyone can agree that it's nice to be able to get away from them when we want to.


----------



## dlague (Dec 4, 2014)

C-Rex said:


> Fair enough. I've only been to Cannon once so I don't know much about it's eateries.  It would be messed up if the only place to eat had that policy.  And FWIW, just because you and your son aren't easily offended doesn't mean I can assume that no one is.  I'm not even a loud mouth like that so it's really not an issue for me.  However, I can appreciate an adults only environment in certain situations and don't think we should have to wait until after mountain hours to get it.  I think everyone can agree that it's nice to be able to get away from them when we want to.



fair enough - some parents do not tolerate their kids being exposed to language and bad behavior, then again I know of several adults that do not appreciate it as well. 

I get the escaping children concept and at resorts with multiple options that makes sense.  Hell, even I want to get away from my own kids sometimes.  Ski areas are odd places where many different groupings come together on common ground so most everything is a hybrid of adult groups, teenage groups, families, couples and individuals all over the resort.  Just not sure how many places actually offer "during ski day" 21+ locations.  Most resort offer a hybrid offering.  Cannonball Pub was the first experience where I have ever encountered a 21+ situation at a ski area and it caught me off guard because it is the only sit down, wait served restaurant.


----------



## VTKilarney (Dec 4, 2014)

deadheadskier said:


> Jesus dude.  Get a grip


So sensitive!  A simple "I don't know if it was legal, but I know lots of places did it" would have avoided this.


----------



## Smellytele (Dec 4, 2014)

to help out VTK. I did find some info such as "states with complex laws, Arizona, Delaware, Maine, Maryland,  Massachusetts, Rhode Island and Vermont permit corkage only at  establishments with no liquor license." from wine specator


----------



## SkiFanE (Dec 4, 2014)

dlague said:


> fair enough - some parents do not tolerate their kids being exposed to language and bad behavior, then again I know of several adults that do not appreciate it as well.
> 
> I get the escaping children concept and at resorts with multiple options that makes sense.  Hell, even I want to get away from my own kids sometimes.  Ski areas are odd places where many different groupings come together on common ground so most everything is a hybrid of adult groups, teenage groups, families, couples and individuals all over the resort.  Just not sure how many places actually offer "during ski day" 21+ locations.  Most resort offer a hybrid offering.  Cannonball Pub was the first experience where I have ever encountered a 21+ situation at a ski area and it caught me off guard because it is the only sit down, wait served restaurant.



Personally...the only places I've seen that limit to 21+ during daylight hours are usually hovels with a tiny dark window and in a bad part of town...so I guess I think it's weird someone would want to have a 21+ experience during daylight hours, at a recreational venue.  To each his own, but seems odd that it'd be an 'attraction'.  After 4-5:00 seems fine to me.  But I aslo can't get why anyone would want wait service at a ski area at 2pm either - I'm a skier, not a diner    Wait service at ski areas is always soooooooo effing slow and I'm always antsy to ski.

I like a beer at lunch, but I have kids.  The two are not exclusive.  Luckily we can enjoy kids and beer at same time.  Since one of my "kids" will be 19 soon, I don't think of her as a kid...just not able to legally drink.  But yet she would be relegated to the kiddy room...  I'm not arguing...but I just don't get the desire to be ensconced in an adult drinking environment in the middle of a ski day...myself - I'd rather take a can of beer up a lift and enjoy my peace that way.


----------



## JimG. (Dec 4, 2014)

Is this really important?

I think I'd rather drink with the kids than beat this dead horse.


----------



## deadheadskier (Dec 4, 2014)

VTKilarney said:


> So sensitive!  A simple "I don't know if it was legal, but I know lots of places did it" would have avoided this.



Ummmmmm......



deadheadskier said:


> I
> Maybe laws have changed, maybe laws were broken, but this is fairly common practice.


----------



## Hawkshot99 (Dec 4, 2014)

drjeff said:


> Not sure about NH - but in some states there are liquor laws where you can't bring outside booze into a venue where its sold - can potentially create issues with their overall liquor license



My buddy is the F&B Manager at a NH ski mtn. When he took over, the kiquor license was written in his name, so he is responsible for all alcohol on property.
He got into some problems with the ski patrol. At the end of the day many of them would drink quite heavy in their locker room. He needed this to stop, because if one of them drove home drunk and hurt someone he could be held liable for "allowing" it.
The patrollers were not happy because "they were always allowed in the past".


----------



## bobbutts (Dec 4, 2014)

I drink plenty at other times, but I just don't find it appealing during my ski day.  On a rare occasion I'll have one beer if it's an extended lunch break and lazy ski day with others, but I can take it or leave it for sure even then.  Most days I'm out there getting dehydrated and concentrating, it's a terrible time for alcohol.


----------



## AdironRider (Dec 4, 2014)

Telling patrollers not to drink apres. Yeah your buddy doesn't know how things operate round these parts. They already get paid shit, I think they can have a beer off the clock. 

Also, for Cannon specifically, they have limited space and its pretty notorious for families with kids to just post up all day and order just a plate of fries. 

For folks like me who want to have some brews after skiing till mid afternoon, I prefer not stepping over kids and families ski bags if not needed.


----------



## VTKilarney (Dec 4, 2014)

deadheadskier said:


> Ummmmmm......


Shit!  Now I'm the douche-bag!  Damn you and your quote button!


----------



## dlague (Dec 4, 2014)

SkiFanE said:


> Personally...the only places I've seen that limit to 21+ during daylight hours are usually hovels with a tiny dark window and in a bad part of town...so I guess I think it's weird someone would want to have a 21+ experience during daylight hours, at a recreational venue.  To each his own, but seems odd that it'd be an 'attraction'.  After 4-5:00 seems fine to me.  But I aslo can't get why anyone would want wait service at a ski area at 2pm either - I'm a skier, not a diner    Wait service at ski areas is always soooooooo effing slow and I'm always antsy to ski.
> 
> I like a beer at lunch, but I have kids.  The two are not exclusive.  Luckily we can enjoy kids and beer at same time.  Since one of my "kids" will be 19 soon, I don't think of her as a kid...just not able to legally drink.  But yet she would be relegated to the kiddy room...  I'm not arguing...but I just don't get the desire to be ensconced in an adult drinking environment in the middle of a ski day...myself - I'd rather take a can of beer up a lift and enjoy my peace that way.



I like the beer on the lift idea - obviously others do too based on the can spottings that are clearly visible in the spring with PBR generally leading the count.


----------



## dlague (Dec 4, 2014)

JimG. said:


> Is this really important?
> 
> I think I'd rather drink with the kids than beat this dead horse.



You are a moderator - does it really matter?  No fights in this thread, just pure discussion.


----------



## Cannonball (Dec 4, 2014)

I don't mind kids in the bar.  As long as they buy the first round.


----------



## dlague (Dec 4, 2014)

Cannonball said:


> I don't mind kids in the bar.  As long as they buy the first round.



Exactly make my kids pay out of their allowance.


----------



## JimG. (Dec 5, 2014)

dlague said:


> You are a moderator - does it really matter?  No fights in this thread, just pure discussion.



I guess. Although it did get a little heated regarding the corkage fees.

Perhaps better placed in the miscellaneous discussions thread.


----------



## C-Rex (Dec 5, 2014)

JimG. said:


> Is this really important?
> 
> I think I'd rather drink with the kids than beat this dead horse.



Ya know, the more I think about it, you're right.  It's just that I'd really like to be able to rant about how Santa and the Easter Bunny don't exist without ruining some kid's childhood, but I guess I could save it for a more age appropriate venue. :grin:


----------



## xwhaler (Dec 8, 2014)

Ok, so I have some recent knowledge to share on this topic. 
Was at Cannon on Saturday and walked into the pub with my 2 yr old son about 1:30. Told the hostess that I "knew the drill, be out by 2:30" with my son.
She smiled and said not to worry as they were not enforcing that rule today. So to me it is not any type of state law as much as they simply want to maximize their revenue from alcohol/food sales.
It was very quiet at Cannon on Saturday so if they had enforced it they would have lost business....saw some other kids in there.


----------



## Puck it (Dec 8, 2014)

xwhaler said:


> Ok, so I have some recent knowledge to share on this topic.
> Was at Cannon on Saturday and walked into the pub with my 2 yr old son about 1:30. Told the hostess that I "knew the drill, be out by 2:30" with my son.
> She smiled and said not to worry as they were not enforcing that rule today. So to me it is not any type of state law as much as they simply want to maximize their revenue from alcohol/food sales.
> It was very quiet at Cannon on Saturday so if they had enforced it they would have lost business....saw some other kids in there.



makes sense


----------



## deadheadskier (Dec 8, 2014)

I support my tax dollars going towards expanding the bar.  Its for the children.  :lol:


----------



## Riverskier (Dec 9, 2014)

I have never been to Cannon's pub, but if it is anything like the Foggy Goggle at Sunday River, or the pub at Saddleback, then this makes no sense to me. Yeah they are bars, but also popular family dining restaurants. I can only imagine that either one would see a huge drop in revenue if family's were not allowed to dine there. Generally speaking I have no problem with kids in pubs (except for seedy ones that don't even sell food, night clubs, etc.) but my only gripe is places that allow kids to sit at the bar itself. Families and adult drinkers can peacefully co-exist at most pubs, but the bar itself should be left for adult drinkers.


----------



## dlague (Dec 9, 2014)

xwhaler said:


> Ok, so I have some recent knowledge to share on this topic.
> Was at Cannon on Saturday and walked into the pub with my 2 yr old son about 1:30. Told the hostess that I "knew the drill, be out by 2:30" with my son.
> She smiled and said not to worry as they were not enforcing that rule today. So to me it is not any type of state law as much as they simply want to maximize their revenue from alcohol/food sales.
> It was very quiet at Cannon on Saturday so if they had enforced it they would have lost business....saw some other kids in there.



Based on the weather that day - yes if enforced they would have lost.  So that rule is like the weather if you do not like it in a given Saturday wait for the next - it might change.


----------



## JimG. (Dec 9, 2014)

dlague said:


> Based on the weather that day - yes if enforced they would have lost.  So that rule is like the weather if you do not like it in a given Saturday wait for the next - it might change.



Which is kind of stupid and insulting at the same time.


----------



## HD333 (Dec 9, 2014)

If the pubs around Okemo didn't allow kids I would save a lot of $$$. 

Kids in après ski bars is fine with me, even if I am not with my kids. It is usually a pretty chill atmosphere.  I want my kids exposed to that, I don't want them to live a sheltered life and then go bananas when they finally start drinking.  
I guess an establishment has the right to say no kids, but ultimately if a place is ok for kids or not should be up to the parents. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## dlague (Dec 9, 2014)

I think this is ironic (Events at Cannon):

So family fun night is - parents are in the bar and the kids are sent off doing their own stuff - that is not family IMO.

*Family Fun Night* - Every Saturday starting January 4th
3:00-6:00 Apres w/ live music & promos in the Cannonball Pub, *21+*
4:30-6:00 Movie for Kids in the Brookside Lodge
4:30-6:30 Huckerbrook open under the lights for $5
4:00-5:30 Rockstar Teen Game Zone


----------



## deadheadskier (Dec 9, 2014)

Many resorts do this.  Your teenage son wants to hang out with other teenagers more than mom and dad.


----------



## Smellytele (Dec 9, 2014)

deadheadskier said:


> Many resorts do this.  Your teenage son wants to hang out with other teenagers more than mom and dad.



Well if we are there as a family they do not want to hang with kids they don't know. If they have friends with them yes they want to hang with them.


----------



## JimG. (Dec 9, 2014)

Alot of parents don't want to leave their 5-12 year olds at the movies while they drink. 

I'm not a Cannon expert. Been there twice. But I recall the lodge/bar being woefully overcrowded and hot, so much so that my kids who were 11 and 9 at the time just wanted to get out of there. Sounds like Cannon needs to invest in some more lodge/food infrastructure.


----------



## deadheadskier (Dec 9, 2014)

They just expanded the lodge 4/5 years ago.


----------



## Puck it (Dec 9, 2014)

I have kids because I drink!

I drink because I have kids!


----------



## Cannonball (Dec 9, 2014)

dlague said:


> I think this is ironic (Events at Cannon):
> 
> So family fun night is - parents are in the bar and the kids are sent off doing their own stuff - that is not family IMO.
> 
> ...




I agree this is total crap.  It's not fair that I'm not allowed in the movie or the Rockstar Game Zone!  Friggin kids get everything,


----------



## dlague (Dec 9, 2014)

Cannonball said:


> I agree this is total crap.  It's not fair that I'm not allowed in the movie or the Rockstar Game Zone!  Friggin kids get everything,



Right?


----------



## Terry (Dec 9, 2014)

Puck it said:


> I have kids because I drink!
> 
> I drink because I have kids!



This is an awesome saying. I think I will add It to my profile!


----------



## Puck it (Dec 9, 2014)

Terry said:


> This is an awesome saying. I think I will add It to my profile!



My drinking has gone up too with both being adults and living at home. One done with college and saving money to move out and the still in and commuting. And plus boyfriend and girlfriend.


----------



## dlague (Dec 9, 2014)

We have three out of the house and trying to figure it out!  Why do they not listen to us and our limited wisdom?


----------

