# No Conway: Cranmore, Wildcat, Black Dec 18, 2009



## billski (Dec 19, 2009)

The plan was to ski three resorts in the No. Conway Area for the bargain price of $3.30, $9 and $10 respectively

Cranmore turned out to be the pick of the day. Got there for the opening bell. Unbelievably, this was my first time there. Great place for never-evers and progressing intermediates. While the temperature was around nine degrees, no wind along with brilliant sunshine on this south facing mountain made the place quite enjoyable. While trail count was limited, the snowmaking was going in full tilt and what they made, they kept. Check out the snow quality:











Cranmore skiers generally seem to have mastered the advanced , level six skid turn. Mr. Schneider would be appalled if he saw such a thing. I saw more of that, than anything else. A very friendly, intimate place, casual, relaxed, kid-friendly, family abounding kind of place. 
Not many learners, but fairly competent blue-trail skiers were in the majority. A mix of a highspeed quad and some old croaker doubles combined to make for no lift lines.




The middle trail, the only black open, was furiously blasting away new snow











Cranmore did a damn good job cleaning up the mess left by the early-week warm-up. Trail count was very limited, but there were a lot of choices. Most trails only had a portion of it groomed, the remainder was essentially un-skiable crust, about one-eight inch on top. Due to lack of wind, whatever they made and loosened stayed where they put it. It wasn't scratchy at all. 

Cranmore is one of the most convenient places I've been to. Practically in the village, the walk from parking was easy, flat and convenient, as was the lodge siting - flat out to the lifts,plenty of space in front. The base is a cobble of buildings, all at the same level, and all work well for the small crowds. Because the Mt. faces south, the days seem warmer, and you can always find a sunny spot on the trail, any time of day.








I challenged Hannes to a race to the finish, but he was a non-starter





I'm crouching, but it's impossible to tell with the black and shadows, so I come off looking like a midget! :lol:

By 10 the crowds started to awaken, and by 11 it was time to move on.
Smellytele says he got to Cranmore midday and the line was all the way to town  and decided not to wait.  Guess I got the timing good on Cranmore (seems to be a lazy crowd), but flipped it when I got to Cat.  (See later).

So next, off to Black, where it turns out the "opening day" had been reduced to a platter-pull beginner run access day. Hmmm. The owner decided the trails were a bit too icy in the middle. Ten buck ticket offer now extended till today, Saturday Dec 19, when they promise they really, really offer lifts to the top. You can't get more local management than that. They are impervious to market forces, resistant to change, and only ready to deliver good slopes when they are ready. Bully for them! I only wished I had called ahead, but it was a pleasant diversion.

The scene at Black:





Lift Lines at Black:





All the skuttlebutt was that Wildcat was closed with 90mph winds. A quick call clarified the situation: all lifts turning except the quad. Onward. 
When I got there I knew something was amiss, but what? The skies were blue, the sun was shining, the lifts were turning. 1pm and many folks were leaving. Grabbed my Liftopia ticket; they actually had a huge stack of printouts at a dedicated desk. It literally took me under 1 minute to get my ticket. 
First run revealed why even a $9 ticket price was not worth it. The trails were windblown, scratchy and scraped off. 
The Wildcat ski/board style is to sideswipe those stopping to take photos of Mt Washington (me.) not bone to bone impact, but a bit too close, clothes brushing. This happened repeatedly throughout the day. Trail conditions sucked on the blues. With essentially no black trails open, I thought I would try a green trail. Amazingly, they were in just as bad a shape. I can't imagine beginners out there. A couple hardy souls doing their best, and I'm sure they'll be good skiers some day.

Smellytele says the AM was good at at Wildcat, save for a couple of trails that should have been closed.

I just could not enjoy it. About 2pm, the winds picked up substantially on the lower mountain just exacerbated the situation. 

When Wildcat has good conditions, they are very, very good. When they have bad conditions, it is very, very bad.

All in all, I skied 2 of the three trifecta, picked up a pin from Cranmore to complete my collection and had a bowl of amazingly good tomato basil pepper soup.

Afterward, I stopped back at the Ski Wheeler's club ski house in North Conway. Located down the road from Cranmore, this 120 year old building was formerly a hotel and sleeps 70. I was given a tour and duly impressed. Very cool place to crash.





http://www.skiwheelers.org/


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## billski (Dec 19, 2009)

*Photos of Mt. Washington*

MW from Wildcat:


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## riverc0il (Dec 19, 2009)

Nice report bill and good work on earning another pin for your hat! Bummer that Black did not have lift access and that the cat had poor conditions. Another fine adventure! Everytime I drive by Northeast Slopes en route to the MRV, I think that I will have to do a multi-day skiing adventure at some point.


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## polski (Dec 19, 2009)

Yes, a good read.

Old chairs like that red double at Cranmore warm my heart.



> When Wildcat has good conditions, they are very, very good. When they have bad conditions, it is very, very bad


Very true. I say the same of Cannon.


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## severine (Dec 19, 2009)

Cool trip report! Sorry it didn't work out better, but it sounds like an interesting ski day.  That Ski Wheeler's club house looks really neat!


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## dropKickMurphy (Dec 19, 2009)

I was at Wildcat yesterday, also. First day of the season for me.

Took a few runs from the Tomcat lift in the morning. Basically, Cat Track to Middle Wildcat to Cheetah was the only route open from this lift. Conditions were pretty good for most of the morning.

The Bobcat lift turned out to be a much better choice. Less vert than Tomcat, but you had access to the same terrain, minus Cat Track/middle WC (which were, by noon, solid ice littered with gapers snapping photos of Mt Washington  ) It was easy to do a bunch of quick laps off Bobcat, as there was never a lift line.

Cheetah had a lot of ice at the entrance/upper portion, but some decent snow could be found on the sides of the trail.

Lower Catapult was better. Despite being the busiest trail on the mountain, a fair amount of decent snow remained well into the afternoon.

Best trail, for most of the day was Alley Cat. The "Thin cover/ungroomed" warning sign seemed to keep the crowds off this trail. A bit patchy in spots, but being more protected from the wind than the other open trails, it had the softest snow.

Far from prime conditions, but worth $9.00. 

Wildcat really needs a foot or 2 of snow. It looked to me like they haven't been making much snow (only a couple of spots appeared to have the guns blasting yesterday. From the portions of Lynx and Polecat that I could see, neither appeared to be close to ready. Those are WC's signature trails for lower to advanced intermediates, which make up the bulk of the Christmas holiday crowds.


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## billski (Dec 19, 2009)

good Wildcat followup DropKick....  From your report and mine, you would think we skied different areas or had very different skill sets, which I suppose could be.  However me thinks it highlights the fact that whatever good snow they have gets beat off so fast that it can't last an entire day.  
And with the snows hitting the flatlands this week, sending them northward, there is going to be a lot of whining and complaining if they head to NH.

Regarding the comp between Wildcat and Cannon: You do recognize what's common between them, right?

Regarding the lodge, it's absolutely enormous inside.  They have a monster commercial kitchen, the first floor is all public areas, with lots of different sitting rooms, fire places and funky old ancient bathrooms.  They have a huge eating area, a place for a band and dancing, pool table, bar.   It's interior is decorated as any good ski addict would do .  For a weekend project, the club members replaced 25+ windows.  This is so much different than a converted house.


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## polski (Dec 19, 2009)

billski said:


> Regarding the comp between Wildcat and Cannon: You do recognize what's common between them, right?


A quiz! I'm going to say higher elevation than anything else around. I remember in the late '80s renting a place in Bartlett with friends for a week in March. Our plan was to hit pretty much a different N Conway- or Ski93-area mountain each day. The day we arrived it absolutely _poured_ ... except at Wildcat and Cannon, which each got a foot and a half of snow. And so we spent all week alternating between Wildcat and Cannon -- epic spring skiing.

Also used to be that Wildcat like Cannon was a state-owned area, IIRC, but that wouldn't fundamentally have anything to do with conditions other than that grooming etc used to be a bit more primitive than the more modern "resorts."

Other than that, what, north-facing aspects? Though Wildcat is a bit more NW.


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## billski (Dec 19, 2009)

polski said:


> A quiz! I'm going to say higher elevation than anything else around. I remember in the late '80s renting a place in Bartlett with friends for a week in March. Our plan was to hit pretty much a different N Conway- or Ski93-area mountain each day. The day we arrived it absolutely _poured_ ... except at Wildcat and Cannon, which each got a foot and a half of snow. And so we spent all week alternating between Wildcat and Cannon -- epic spring skiing.
> 
> Also used to be that Wildcat like Cannon was a state-owned area, IIRC, but that wouldn't fundamentally have anything to do with conditions other than that grooming etc used to be a bit more primitive than the more modern "resorts."
> 
> Other than that, what, north-facing aspects? Though Wildcat is a bit more NW.


  To me it was the fact that they were state owned, which meant they didn't have to try as hard nor fund it as adequately.  I don't know what the cannon operating contract looks like, so I can't really comment more.  Steve probably knows.   Most areas are north facing, simply to extend the season, which is the primary reason areas like Bromley, Cranmore and Black close to dadgum early.


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## riverc0il (Dec 19, 2009)

Cannon is still state owned/operated. I never knew that Wildcat was state owned. The land is privately leased from the WMNF but the ski area is privately owned (it was put up for sale not to long ago but I don't think they found a buyer). Would be something that I just learned if it was once state owned as a ski area but I would like to so a reference on that.


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## katbennett (Dec 19, 2009)

Kat from Cranmore here. Bill, thanks for a super review from Friday. It was a lovely day here. Your photos are great. I'd like to chime in on your contest here -what do Cannon and Wildcat have in common. Were they both cut by the CCC? Wildcat is not owned or operated by the state, fyi. Also, are they both on Forest Service Land?


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## Johnskiismore (Dec 19, 2009)

Really cool report Bill!


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## billski (Dec 19, 2009)

Hmm, 
I was thinking Wildcat was state-owned, so my mistake.  So let's see, at least in the 80s, it was my understanding Cannon, Sunapee and Gunstock were state-owned.  Is that what you know?


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## riverc0il (Dec 19, 2009)

billski said:


> Hmm,
> I was thinking Wildcat was state-owned, so my mistake.  So let's see, at least in the 80s, it was my understanding Cannon, Sunapee and Gunstock were state-owned.  Is that what you know?


Cannon and Sunapee are state owned with the latter being leased to the Meuller's company that operates Okemo. Gunstock is owned by the the county I think. Or some local agency at the least, definitely not the state. Cannon is the only state operated area in NH that I am aware of though the state owns the Sunapee land and leases it whereas Wildcat land is leased from the WMNF.


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## RootDKJ (Dec 19, 2009)

Awesome TR Billski!


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## snoseek (Dec 19, 2009)

Last I knew Gunstock was owned by Belknap County. 

Those pics of Cranmore remind me of my childhood, I used to love it there. It's actually a pretty cool little hill. I can ev en remember the old skimobiles or whatever they were. They were so slow!


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## billski (Dec 19, 2009)

katbennett said:


> Kat from Cranmore here. Bill, thanks for a super review from Friday. It was a lovely day here. Your photos are great. I'd like to chime in on your contest here -what do Cannon and Wildcat have in common. Were they both cut by the CCC? Wildcat is not owned or operated by the state, fyi. Also, are they both on Forest Service Land?




Well, the CCC is right; see my other post about CCC.  When I ski, I tend to observe lots of details.  
Another in common is that they both have retired means of uphill transport.  The Gondola at Wildcat the the old snowmobile at Cranmore.  Only at Wildcat, the gondi cars are still in the base building!

Another one is.... The Skimobile - Well, technically, it's in front of the Ski Museum at Cannon.  I still kick myself for never having ridden it it.


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## riverc0il (Dec 19, 2009)

billski said:


> Well, the CCC is right; see my other post about CCC.  When I ski, I tend to observe lots of details.
> Another in common is that they both have retired means of uphill transport.  The Gondola at Wildcat the the old snowmobile at Cranmore.  Only at Wildcat, the gondi cars are still in the base building!


The gondolas in the base building are likely the ones currently used on the HSQ line for summer tourism. I think the old ones were all sold off when they shut the gondi down. While both mountains got started through CCC trail work before the lifts were added, most current trails are not CCC cut and like Stowe the older CCC trails still in existence don't look much like they used to when they were first cut.


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## polski (Dec 19, 2009)

When I first skied there in the late '80s I was under the very strong impression Wildcat was state-owned -- or, more precisely, state-run, on federal land. I can't quickly find confirmation of this online; Wildcat's own history page doesn't mention it. I'm now very curious and will look into this Monday.


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## billski (Dec 19, 2009)

polski said:


> When I first skied there in the late '80s I was under the very strong impression Wildcat was state-owned -- or, more precisely, state-run, on federal land. I can't quickly find confirmation of this online; Wildcat's own history page doesn't mention it. I'm now very curious and will look into this Monday.


 
It seems as if it has been privately operated since the first lift was installed in 58.
Maybe it's low-key marketing gave impressions otherwise.

http://www.boston.com/travel/explor...r_50_years_its_still_quite_a_ride_at_wildcat/


 In 1986 Meadow Green-Wildcat Corporation ("Meadow Green") bought the assets of Wildcat Mountain Corporation ("Wildcat"), a ski resort operated on federal land at Pinkham Notch, New Hampshire. In October 1986 the Forest Service issued Meadow Green a new Term Special Use Permit, allowing it to use this federally owned land for twenty years in return for a fee.

http://cases.justia.com/us-court-of-appeals/F2/936/601/402274/

http://bulk.resource.org/courts.gov/c/F2/759/759.F2d.838.83-7573.84-7255.html


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## polski (Dec 23, 2009)

Yes, and I just spoke with someone at the New England Ski Museum who also said in no uncertain terms that only Cannon and Mount Sunapee have ever been state-owned/operated. Unlearn something wrong every day ...


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## billski (Dec 23, 2009)

polski said:


> Yes, and I just spoke with someone at the New England Ski Museum who also said in no uncertain terms that only Cannon and Mount Sunapee have ever been state-owned/operated. Unlearn something wrong every day ...


 Boy, you sure are the super sleuth, thanks.  I'll send all my mysteries to  you.   Steve usually has his facts right, I'm not suprised!


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## powpig2002 (Jan 19, 2010)

snoseeker, you say the ski mobiles were slow. iwas terrified of them. i go through n. c. village i still get sweaty palms. i always thought they were going at the speed of sound. iwas stuck on the polma lift to skiers left.


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