# SKIING/BOARDING:  Cannon's Opening Day, December 3, 2005



## thetrailboss (Sep 25, 2005)

SKI/BOARD:  Cannon Opening Day, November 25, 2005.  Trailboss will either be here or Sunapee.  :beer:  PM to join me and keep your fingers crossed for cold weather and snow!!!!  :beer:


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## riverc0il (Sep 25, 2005)

nice.  unless burke opens earlier than usual, i'll probably be there.


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## thetrailboss (Sep 25, 2005)

riverc0il said:
			
		

> nice.  unless burke opens earlier than usual, i'll probably be there.



That would be frickin' sweet....

I'm anticipating a December opening for Burke, partially considering that they DON'T have the new quad done yet...


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## riverc0il (Sep 25, 2005)

bearing in mind they don't need the sherburne quad open to open the mountain, i would be interested to see if burke tries to open sooner than usual to capitolize on the buzz.  as always, depends on the weather.  but weather pending, i would guess 12-3 or 12-10 for an opening day.

regardless, it's good to see cannon planning to open a week sooner than last year! :beer:


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## awf170 (Sep 30, 2005)

I might be there, it depends on whether i will be alouded to take the car and go by myself (there is no way my dad will go skiing with under 75% of the trails open)


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## ga2ski (Oct 1, 2005)

I'm blacked out on my ASC pass. Any deals at Cannon on opening day?


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## riverc0il (Oct 1, 2005)

it was $25 last year, which was an epic opening day.


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## Vortex (Oct 3, 2005)

ga2ski said:
			
		

> I'm blacked out on my ASC pass. Any deals at Cannon on opening day?


I might use one of bonus days from the Asc pass that weekend.


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## billski (Nov 5, 2005)

*$25*



			
				ga2ski said:
			
		

> I'm blacked out on my ASC pass. Any deals at Cannon on opening day?



I have coupons (for my club) for $25 Cannon tickets good anytime through 12/24.  I probably won't use them all, so write me privately and I will send you one if you mail me a SASE.

Bill


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## ga2ski (Nov 5, 2005)

*Re: $25*



			
				billski said:
			
		

> ga2ski said:
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Thanks for the offer I may take you up on a coupon but i won't be using it on the 25th as we are hosting Thanksgiving on Friday the 25th so I can ski at K on Thanksgiving.


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## zowi420 (Nov 17, 2005)

Not looking so good for the 25th at Cannon, nothing written in stone yet though.
Gonna fire up the guns on Saturday 11/19!


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## riverc0il (Nov 17, 2005)

from an email i received today from cannon:



> We are planning to open for the winter season on November 25th,


written in stone as much as can be for this time of year.  with colder temps and snow moving in, i'd say it's likely gonna be a go.


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## awf170 (Nov 17, 2005)

zowi420 said:
			
		

> Not looking so good for the 25th at Cannon, nothing written in stone yet though.
> Gonna fire up the guns on Saturday 11/19!



How could they not open by the 25th, It is going to be below freezing every night, and it is bearly going to get above freezing in the day.


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## zowi420 (Nov 18, 2005)

Hey whatever, as they say, don't shoot the messenger.  I've been counting down the days and minutes til opening day since April 11th!


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## thetrailboss (Nov 20, 2005)

Weather as of late and snow in the forecast makes this look good.  Very good.  I'm there on Friday if they open, part of Saturday, and maybe Sunday.  :beer:  PM to join in on the fun.


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## zowi420 (Nov 21, 2005)

Sometimes it's not just temps and weather;
Sometimes there are other considerations, like equipment and machinery, ya know?


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## salida (Nov 21, 2005)

riverc0il said:
			
		

> it was $25 last year, which was an epic opening day.



epic indeed, I might try to get up there for that day, especially if we do end up with fresh snow!!

Hopefully, they'll get an icy base to cover things tuesday, and then freshies thursday, creating the dec 4th conditions of last year


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## zowi420 (Nov 22, 2005)

It looks like it's official, Cannon will not be opening until Friday, December 2nd.


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## bvibert (Nov 22, 2005)

zowi420 said:
			
		

> It looks like it's official, Cannon will not be opening until Friday, December 2nd.



Where did you get that information?  Their website still indicates that they're shooting for the 25th??


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## riverc0il (Nov 22, 2005)

i think zowi might be referring to the latest news on cannon's homepage:



> Guns started last Friday, but have been quiet for the last few days due to temperatures that got into the 50's. It is snowing right now, but opening day is in doubt. Keep checking this site for the latest information about opening day.


though it is not official, saying opening day is in doubt three days away does not bode well.  i don't understand this at all. cannon is going to pick up a decent amount of snow in the next 48+ hours and snow making temps will be adequet for covering mid- to lower ravine per the normal opening procedure.  cannon has generally had a rather reserved snow making push since i have been skiing there but this is the pits if they can't make their opening day.  pending i see snow on cannon's slopes driving through the notch on thanksgiving, i might be up there on friday for earned turns any ways if the don't open.  i suspect the summit could do quite well with this storm, hopefully the lower slopes will do like wise.


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## awf170 (Nov 22, 2005)

riverc0il said:
			
		

> i think zowi might be referring to the latest news on cannon's homepage:
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theres a very simple explanation of why there not opening, and it only 2 words... state run

it does stink though, I was thinking about going up friday.   I would hike up but my parents sure wont.


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## bvibert (Nov 22, 2005)

riverc0il said:
			
		

> i think zowi might be referring to the latest news on cannon's homepage:
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Well it didn't say that when I posted.  The blurb under "Latest News" still said they were shooting for the 25th...


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## thetrailboss (Nov 22, 2005)

Zowi--so you're saying they are NOT opening???  :x  That would really PI$$ me off.


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## thetrailboss (Nov 22, 2005)

So let's hope for lots of snow, lots.  It is snowing hard in NNH right now...keep it going...and tomorrow is set to be cold.


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## riverc0il (Nov 23, 2005)

cannon is reporting that after 8" of snow and three days straight of snow making weather with 9" forecasted for base elevations on thanksgiving that they will not open on friday  turkeys!!!!  they are currently suggesting the potential for "limited" operations over the weekend.  if they can't open mid/lower ravine after three to four days of below freezing temps and what is likely to add up to at least 20", something is SERIOUSLY wrong.

in either case, i'll be at cannon this weekend open or not and skiing from the summit which definitely won't be lift serviced in either case.

:beer:

nice to see you at burke to Mr. Trailboss!


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## thetrailboss (Nov 24, 2005)

I saw that too....just lame.  :evil:  

Sunapee is going to beat them


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## salida (Nov 24, 2005)

I'll be there Saturday... lift or not!


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## thetrailboss (Nov 24, 2005)

And it gets *worse*.  I was trying not to laugh as I listened to the snow phone...absolutely pathetic.  "We're suffering from a temperature inversion right now...the south wind is lifting temps to 26 F on the mountain."  Puleease.  Anybody from this neck of the woods knows that the mountain has a NORTHERN exposure and the prevailing winds today in 'the Kingdom were from the NW with cold air and snow.  Are they SERIOUS?  

They get a foot of snow, plus what they had made, and THEY CAN'T open?  Or do they NOT want to open?  :-?  

It's tough guys...real tough...Sunapee is opening a day early because of this 'bad weather...' pretty bad when someone 50 miles south and almost 2000 feet shorter beats you.  

Argh.


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## salida (Nov 24, 2005)

I understand the frustration TB but like I said before I'll be there lift or not.  Definitely be there Saturday AM, prolly around 8, skining up from the peabody base, and I might be there tomorrow morning!

Drop a PM if anyone wants to join


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## riverc0il (Nov 25, 2005)

it is official, cannon is THE biggest winnie of a mountain in new england:



> Snowmaking is in progress, and Mother Nature has tried to help, but it has just not been quite enough to safely open this weekend. The mountain looks great from the bottom, but is just not ready to open. We plan to open for full time operation next Friday, December 2nd.


cannon could not have had more optimal weather during thanksgiving week for a thanksgiving weekend opening.  if cannon is not committed to this opening day, i strongtly suggest their management select a first weekend in december opening going forward.  there is NO excuse for this based on this week's weather.  15" in 72 hours and snow making temps for the majority of the week and they could not open one route down from the high speed quad?  pansies.

i will report back tomorrow on the accuracy of their statement that with mother nature's help, they could not open this weekend.  porter- i'll see you at peabody slopes bright and early.


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## thetrailboss (Nov 25, 2005)

I was trying not to laugh again...it was really pitiful hearing the snow reporter today...



> Cannon is a real mountain...



Yeah, right :roll:  A foot of snow plus and you CAN'T open.


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## riverc0il (Nov 25, 2005)

in all fairness, it was a foot of light powdery snow which is horrible for base building and doesn't amount to much when compacted.  but it sure helps!  they certainly couldn't open trails with 12+" on natural powder snow as it would get skied off too quick.  i am most concerned that cannon couldn't blow enough snow this week to open one simple route down from the HSQ.  they just can't blame bad snow making temps... look at all the other open ski areas in new england this weekend!?  even WaWa in the much warmer state of MA opened today with more acrage than mid/low ravine.  the foot plus of snow only adds insult to injury.  i just wanted to clarify that no one is expecting cannon to open on 12" of light powder.  but it certainly didn't hurt potential snow making efforts that didn't happen.  now that i think about it, i didn't even see snow making clouds when i drove by on thursday morning or friday morning...


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## riverc0il (Nov 25, 2005)

hey, the thought just occured to me: cannon is the only ski area in new england with exception of burke and MRG that has either 4000' summit elevation or above and/or 2000' vertical gain that is not open.  mad river glen is understandable since they only have like 1 snow gun and open on natural snow and burke is still finishing up improvements to the mountain and has not begun to blow yet (these two areas have later set opening dates any ways.  so cannon is the only area with a 4000' summit or 2000' vertical with an opening day this weekend or prior that has not been able to open  sorry to hammer this one home but i am beyond baffled why my favorite mountain isn't spinning the quad tomorrow :-?


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## Zand (Nov 25, 2005)

> even WaWa in the much warmer state of MA opened today with more acrage than mid/low ravine.



Wawa opened on maybe 18 hours of snowmaking and about 4" of wet natural snow. There was not one bare spot on any open trail today, so it doesn't take much to fully cover a trail like mid-low Ravine to open. I don't understand some of those areas up north. Gunstock, Ragged, Bromley, Attitash, Wildcat all delaying their openings (some of them till next week) due to "weather", yet both Jiminy and Wawa are both open with outstanding early season conditions and Sunapee and Crotched, 2 southern NH areas with similar weather, are also open. Some areas with planned Black Friday openings need to really try for it if the weather is as good as it has been. 

Riverc0il, if you want to ski, drive south a couple hours and you can ski in great snow and warmer temps. Killington is looking like it wins the Thanksgiving Award this year. 60 trails already open, AMAZING. 

Also sad that Mohawk in CT is opening tomorrow. Unreal.


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## riverc0il (Nov 25, 2005)

> Riverc0il, if you want to ski, drive south a couple hours and you can ski in great snow and warmer temps. Killington is looking like it wins the Thanksgiving Award this year. 60 trails already open, AMAZING.


i wouldn't ski kmart past thanksgiving unless i had a free ticket.  and even then, only on a blackedout day or mid-week.  if i want to ski cannon tomorrow, i'll ski cannon tomorrow.  lifts or not  i didn't move up here just to drive back down south to go skiing  certainly not when over a foot of powder is sitting in my backyard


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## thetrailboss (Nov 25, 2005)

Hey Riv--how did Cannon look as you drove by yesterday?


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## awf170 (Nov 25, 2005)

Zand said:
			
		

> Riverc0il, if you want to ski, drive south a couple hours and you can ski in great snow and warmer temps. Killington is looking like it wins the Thanksgiving Award this year. 60 trails already open, AMAZING.



Hah, why would you drive south.  If I was going to go skiing(I'm not because I dont have insurance, I do have my license though)  I would of went to cannon.  I would rather hike up and ski then wait in like for an hour to ski one crappy icy run with 1,000 other people.



About Cannon, did this really suprise you guys.  Last year at wildcat me and my dad talked to someone who used to be a cannon snowmaking and quit because working for them is the most frustrating thing and he couldnt take it anymore.  I'm not sure but I think he nows works for wildcat.  Cannon is just known for doing stuff like this.  Atleast when they have $40 tickets this wasnt a big deal, but when there charging $54 atleast try to make a decent amount of snow.


And Steve, saddlebacks summit is 4,120 ft and there vertical is 2,000 and there not opening until the 17th


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## Zand (Nov 25, 2005)

awf170 said:
			
		

> Hah, why would you drive south.  If I was going to go skiing(I'm not because I dont have insurance, I do have my license though)  I would of went to cannon.  I would rather hike up and ski then wait in like for an hour to ski one crappy icy run with 1,000 other people.



Name me one mountain that you could say that about today. Oh wait, you can't. Nearly every mountain open today had nice powder/packed powder and small crowds.


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## awf170 (Nov 25, 2005)

Zand said:
			
		

> Name me one mountain that you could say that about today. Oh wait, you can't. Nearly every mountain open today had nice powder/packed powder and small crowds.



That fact is though, at cannon you will have untracked powder, everywhere else you will have mostly groomed trails.  Dang I wish I could join porter and steve.


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## Zand (Nov 25, 2005)

Not a fact. Killington is grooming about 20 out of 60 trails. You're bound to find untracked powder there. The Loaf has 41 trails open, and I'm sure at least a few of them are untracked. Even Wawa had powder for a few runs today.

And BTW, groomed vs ungroomed is a lot different than your previous claim of hour long lift lines, sheet ice, and short crappy runs. :wink:


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## awf170 (Nov 25, 2005)

Zand said:
			
		

> Not a fact. Killington is grooming about 20 out of 60 trails. You're bound to find untracked powder there. The Loaf has 41 trails open, and I'm sure at least a few of them are untracked. Even Wawa had powder for a few runs today



yeah, but k-mart and sugarloaf sure are far.  And ya both those places looked awsome.  So i was kinda just referring to places with 5 trails open like crotched, sunapee, loon and waterville.


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## riverc0il (Nov 26, 2005)

awf170 said:
			
		

> About Cannon, did this really suprise you guys.


actually, yes.  cannon usually makes their set opening day when conditions allow.



			
				awf170 said:
			
		

> Cannon is just known for doing stuff like this.


pardon me?  site specifics of stuff that cannon is know for doing like this?



			
				awf170 said:
			
		

> Atleast when they have $40 tickets this wasnt a big deal, but when there charging $54 atleast try to make a decent amount of snow.


they haven't had $40 tickets for a long time now (unless you count the two fer days).  also, early season is only like $25 so that is a pretty misleading statement.  i think they owe it mostly to the pass holders considering what they charge.



			
				awf170 said:
			
		

> And Steve, saddlebacks summit is 4,120 ft and there vertical is 2,000 and there not opening until the 17th


damn, i didn't know saddleback was that big.  but they still fall into the burke and mrg camp of their opening date not having arrived yet.  cannon is the only one with those stats not to have either met their scheduled opening date or opened already.


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## riverc0il (Nov 26, 2005)

Zand said:
			
		

> Not a fact. Killington is grooming about 20 out of 60 trails. You're bound to find untracked powder there. The Loaf has 41 trails open, and I'm sure at least a few of them are untracked. Even Wawa had powder for a few runs today.


are you serious? :blink: do you know what untracked powder is?  untracked powder is completely natural snow with no previous tracks.  i won't even find that at cannon today.  i'll find copious amounts of powder and there is NO WAY killington has any powder or untracked powder left on any of their open trails.  not a chance, i'd bet my life on it.  powder at an open ski area gets trashed within a few hours, especially the bigger ski areas.  i've seen it enough times.  unless you go to a lesser known uncrowded area, you can count on skiing powder the day after the storm only inbounds, and likely not much past noon time that immediate day after.

trailboss, to answer your question, cannon looked like a million bucks when i drove by the other day.  i had trouble sleeping tonight just thinking about it.  will report back latter this afternoon.


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## awf170 (Nov 26, 2005)

riverc0il said:
			
		

> awf170 said:
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Ya, I guess it was kinda suprising, but for reason I thought something like this would happen.



			
				riverc0il said:
			
		

> awf170 said:
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Nothing this bad.  But they have done things like this before.  Last year cannon did not make there opening, and I know it was because it was too warm. But about a week before thanksgiving when it was cold and everyone was making snow, cannon did not make any snow because they had to get their electric meters checked, and they could not use anymore electricity for snow making until that happened.  What I just said probably wont make sense because Im really bad at explaining it, but pretty much they made no snow because they could not spend anymore money.  Not really cannons fault, but still is something like that.  Maybe this years fail to open could be something like that where they dont have enough money to make a lot of snow.  Its probably just related to cannon not getting enough money from the state, and not the management.... What was my arguement again :lol: And like I said all of that probably make no sense.



			
				riverc0il said:
			
		

> damn, i didn't know saddleback was that big.  but they still fall into the burke and mrg camp of their opening date not having arrived yet.  cannon is the only one with those stats not to have either met their scheduled opening date or opened already.



Ya, saddleback is defiantly in that list with burke and MRG.  Probably even more leaning towards MRG and Magic, since burke is now a yuppie mountain with its HSQ :wink: 


And remember I still love Cannon, and I would really like to know what is truly going on at Cannon in why they did not open.  Because with this snow and cold, there has to be a serious reason(frozen guns, meter check again, or some other kind of screw up) why Cannon did not open.


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## riverc0il (Nov 26, 2005)

powder all day!  powder up high, powder down low, powder powder powder!  in cannon's defense, lower cannon and toss up seemed wind blown so i can understand why they didn't open this weekend.  NOT.  probably going down as a top five powder day of the year folks, no joke.  cannon had no excuse.  i'll follow up with more details and pics later.  man, i would be REALLY pissed off if i was a season pass holder!


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## thetrailboss (Nov 26, 2005)

awf170 said:
			
		

> Nothing this bad.  But they have done things like this before.  Last year cannon did not make there opening, and I know it was because it was too warm. But about a week before thanksgiving when it was cold and everyone was making snow, cannon did not make any snow because they had to get their electric meters checked, and they could not use anymore electricity for snow making until that happened.  What I just said probably wont make sense because Im really bad at explaining it, but pretty much they made no snow because they could not spend anymore money.  Not really cannons fault, but still is something like that.  Maybe this years fail to open could be something like that where they dont have enough money to make a lot of snow.  Its probably just related to cannon not getting enough money from the state, and not the management.... What was my arguement again :lol: And like I said all of that probably make no sense.



After this opening fiasco, I now find myself firmly in the 'lease Cannon to a ski resort operator' camp.  No excuse IMHO except NH was keeping up as the most miserly state in the country.  They could have opened but did not want to.  If anyone can correct me, speak now...

(btw Sunapee was EXCELLENT and is opening MORE terrain tomorrow...snowguns runnin' all day long...50 miles south and 2000 less feet, but hell, they can do it).


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## salida (Nov 26, 2005)

Part of me wants to complain about the delayed opening, but skinning up today I had more fun than had the place been open.  

I believe they are dragging their feet just for people like you Trailboss, they are trying to convince the public (and members of congress), falsely so, that the state is incapible of running a ski resort.  They are trying to off load it, and by slacking the state will easily vote to off load it, and then it wont be their problem.  Personally, I believe this is the reason that they are going slow this year (they have done pretty well in the past).  TB I would hope that you would reconsider, I know you have a Sunapee pass, but ever since Okemo took it over, I can't stand the place.  I feel like it lost its character, that they groomed the place flat, that ticket prices are twice what they used to be, and that on the weekend you have to park MILES away to get there.  Its just not the sunapee I feel in love with as a child.

I for one hope this doesn't happen to cannon.  I never want to see the place overly gentrified, and groomed to a tee, the appeal of the area is its flair for being old school, ungroomed, cold, and SNOWY.  I don't want condos and snowmaking, and early openings with 1000s of people.  I just want the same old cannon thats been going since the 30's.

-Porter


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## awf170 (Nov 26, 2005)

salida said:
			
		

> Part of me wants to complain about the delayed opening, but skinning up today I had more fun than had the place been open.
> 
> I believe they are dragging their feet just for people like you Trailboss, they are trying to convince the public (and members of congress), falsely so, that the state is incapible of running a ski resort.  They are trying to off load it, and by slacking the state will easily vote to off load it, and then it wont be their problem.  Personally, I believe this is the reason that they are going slow this year (they have done pretty well in the past).  TB I would hope that you would reconsider, I know you have a Sunapee pass, but ever since Okemo took it over, I can't stand the place.  I feel like it lost its character, that they groomed the place flat, that ticket prices are twice what they used to be, and that on the weekend you have to park MILES away to get there.  Its just not the sunapee I feel in love with as a child.
> 
> ...



I agree, even though I complain about cannon, it is way better than it being owned by some place like okemo, and have every run groomed to death and too much lift capicity like sunapee.  I never been to sunapee when it was state owned, but I imagine I would have liked it.  Now I hate everything about it(well except for sunrise glade, that rocks)


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## thetrailboss (Nov 27, 2005)

salida said:
			
		

> Part of me wants to complain about the delayed opening, but skinning up today I had more fun than had the place been open.
> 
> I believe they are dragging their feet just for people like you Trailboss, they are trying to convince the public (and members of congress), falsely so, that the state is incapible of running a ski resort.  They are trying to off load it, and by slacking the state will easily vote to off load it, and then it wont be their problem.  Personally, I believe this is the reason that they are going slow this year (they have done pretty well in the past).  TB I would hope that you would reconsider, I know you have a Sunapee pass, but ever since Okemo took it over, I can't stand the place.  I feel like it lost its character, that they groomed the place flat, that ticket prices are twice what they used to be, and that on the weekend you have to park MILES away to get there.  Its just not the sunapee I feel in love with as a child.
> 
> ...



Yeah, my one lone voice in this forum is going to move mountains (no pun intended) :lol:  How I wish... :wink:

My reservation to the leasing of Cannon is actually your very same concern, Salida, the gentrification of the place.  I hate that about other places.  I was wondering if the delayed opening was a ploy of some sort...

Can anyone provide us with some inside info about who makes the call(s) there?  Is it the NH Parks Dept (i.e. external)?  Internal management?  We had someone in here from Franconia...hope he/she comes back with some info...


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## thetrailboss (Nov 27, 2005)

Oh Salida...I forgot to mention...after we here at AZ take over Sugarbush, we're going to take over Cannon and you and Riv' are going to be the new co-managers of the place :lol:  

:wink:


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## riverc0il (Nov 27, 2005)

cannon vid 11/26/05

regarding the leasing arguement, i think this could only be true if someone from above cannon management was being tight with the pennies.  i doubt any one on cannon's current management team (except perhaps the top dog) would be interested in a leased operation.  personally, i would rather work for the state with cushy benefits than a big money hungry corporation.  plus, you know a lot of the folks at cannon would get replaced by better bean counters regardless if those bean counters know anything about skiing.

it would be an interesting conspiracy theory that someone up top held cannon back from opening to stir up people and get people to call for a leased operation.  quite a compelling psychological trick.  that's why i would really like to hear from cannon about the real reasons for not opening.  did they just make a bad call and not blow snow until friday when they could have?  snowmaking is a tough call sometimes and cannon is very conservative with trail openings, but they had more than enough snow, time, and temperatures to cover ravine top to bottom and then some for the weekend so i am not buying their current reasons for not opening.  again, i would REALLY love to hear the real reason(s) as i think we all would.


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## awf170 (Nov 27, 2005)

riverc0il said:
			
		

> cannon vid 11/26/05
> 
> regarding the leasing arguement, i think this could only be true if someone from above cannon management was being tight with the pennies.  i doubt any one on cannon's current management team (except perhaps the top dog) would be interested in a leased operation.  personally, i would rather work for the state with cushy benefits than a big money hungry corporation.  plus, you know a lot of the folks at cannon would get replaced by better bean counters regardless if those bean counters know anything about skiing.



Steve, there was enough snow to open atleast one trail already right?  I kinda understand them not wanting to keep making snow and open after seeing monday-thursdays forcast.  But if they already had enough snow made I think they should have done what wildcat did and just open saterday and sunday.


Oh ya, almost forgot to say something... that video rocks! 
How come you didnt do any front 5 runs, was the coverage not good enough or were you too tired after going to the summit?


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## salida (Nov 27, 2005)

awf,

The front five looked good, but the snow was arguably better in the hardscrabble area (that and the front five was way tracked up)...

Thought it would be more fun to get a summit run in, than lapping the front five.

-Porter


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## thetrailboss (Dec 1, 2005)

Here we go again :roll:  



			
				Cannon said:
			
		

> Comments:  Thursday, December 1.
> 
> *Cooler air has arrived, but it is not yet cold enough to make snow. Forecasts call for cold air to move in early Friday, and there is a chance of some accumulating snow overnight tonight and Friday. Snowmaking will restart when we have appropriate conditions. We are still shooting for opening on Saturday, although it could be a bit late.* Check this site for the latest info on Opening day.
> Don't wait until then to pick up your season pass.


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## bvibert (Dec 1, 2005)

thetrailboss said:
			
		

> Here we go again :roll:
> 
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Gimme a break!  At least three areas in *CT* will be open this weekend...


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## riverc0il (Dec 1, 2005)

they might have had some melting since this past weekend, but not enough to ruin an opening bid for this weekend.  check out my report from last weekend to see just how much snow had been made on ravine!  likely the natural snow is gone on the lower 2/3's of the mountain, but that man made base was insanely deep and not something that could have gotten washed out these last three days.

doesn't much matter to me.  if we get enough snow, i'll hike saturday for powder.  if not, can day at stowe on sunday.  brian has an amazing great point about the number of CT areas open.  plus a few MA areas already opened last weekend.  it's time to stop blaiming the weather.


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## Greg (Dec 2, 2005)

They open tomorrow:

http://www.cannonmt.com/conditions.php


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## JimG. (Dec 2, 2005)

:lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol: 

You know, I think it's easier to guess exactly when someone's wife is going to give birth than it is to guess when ski resorts will open. Didn't Cannon just yesterday say they would probably not open tomorrow?


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## riverc0il (Dec 2, 2005)

iirc, they said a late opening was likely but they were pushing for saturday with no promises.  they definitely never said they were not opening for the weekend but were definitely not going to make friday.


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## zowi420 (Dec 3, 2005)

Yes, I was offended by the "two words:  State Run" comment, so I decided not to participate in the conversation.  And as for "cushy benefits", that's a joke.  The employees would probably be better off if Cannon was leased, however, most are against it for the reasons that were mentioned above.  Real skiers don't wear full length mink coats, ya know what I mean?  Cannon did not want to open, only to have to close again, they wanted to be able to stay open.  Yes, they do have to wait for the meter to be read, and yes, there was a compressor problem, and on Monday and Tuesday there was that 60 degree tropical rain that melted all the snow.  Another area ski resort spent $180,000 on snowmaking, only to have the rain wash it all away.  Who makes the decision of when to open?  They don't make snow if it is over thirty degrees, so, ultimately, it is up to Mother Nature!  It has nothing to do with getting money from the state, because Cannon is totally self-funded.
The good news is, Cannon opened today at 9:20, and it is going to be very cold all week!


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## thetrailboss (Dec 3, 2005)

zowi420 said:
			
		

> Yes, I was offended by the "two words:  State Run" comment, so I decided not to participate in the conversation.



While I understand, I think it would have been better for the entire community, who wanted info, if you had spoken your POV and participated rather than remaining silent.  JMHO. :-?



> And as for "cushy benefits", that's a joke.  The employees would probably be better off if Cannon was leased, however, most are against it for the reasons that were mentioned above.  Real skiers don't wear full length mink coats, ya know what I mean?



Yes, buuuuttttt real ski areas do open when they can and when customers are interested.  :wink:



> Cannon did not want to open, only to have to close again, they wanted to be able to stay open.  Yes, they do have to wait for the meter to be read, and yes, there was a compressor problem, and on Monday and Tuesday there was that 60 degree tropical rain that melted all the snow.  Another area ski resort spent $180,000 on snowmaking, only to have the rain wash it all away.  Who makes the decision of when to open?  They don't make snow if it is over thirty degrees, so, ultimately, it is up to Mother Nature!  It has nothing to do with getting money from the state, because Cannon is totally self-funded.



This is the kind of info we really need in here...we need to know what the situation is before we comment.  :wink:  

The simple solution, at a certain level, is to adopt what Jay does and that is to open ONLY ON WEEKENDS during early and late season and cut the losses.  While you said 'all the snow disappeared,' Sunapee, further south, had MORE rain and warmer temps and today their snow was still there.  :-?  I'm a passholder who was counting on Cannon to open when they said they would...instead I drive 50+ miles south to another place?  



> The good news is, Cannon opened today at 9:20, and it is going to be very cold all week!



Yes, I agree :beer:


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## riverc0il (Dec 3, 2005)

great post zowi420.  i we could have gotten that info from cannon directly instead of having to rely on employees or folks close to operations in some way generously offering inside info regarding why decisions are being made.  i fully understand and appreciate the fact that a mountain chooses not to open.  the spin factor bothers me though.


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## JimG. (Dec 5, 2005)

thetrailboss said:
			
		

> zowi420 said:
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Yes, I agree with trailboss...we all lose out the way it played out.

I fully understand your feelings though; I don't like it when folks take shots at my home hill either.


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## thetrailboss (Dec 5, 2005)

JimG. said:
			
		

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If I remained silent every time someone challenged me or my thoughts, then we'd all lose out on the info that I learn from my contacts and can help others.  

By remaining silent, a self-fulfilling prophecy was created in that hard feelings and more bad comments came out.  The intervention of, "listen, x,y,z is happening up here," would have turned opinions and thoughts around.  Fans would be more understanding and the discussion would have shifted.  This is the power of information.  In this case, there was deliberate silence and then a condemnation of opinions that others said.  The kicker is that this was completely preventable.  This post was made long in advance of the "state run comment" and was not responded to:  



			
				bvibert said:
			
		

> zowi420 said:
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I don't think blaming critics is appropriate when info was not provided when asked.  Ignorance is not bliss. 

Our strength here in AZ is that we are open and that local people provide information as to what is really happen.  This is not a place of 'resort bashers' nor industry suck-ups, just pure skiers and riders who want real info.  No spin, no rumors, just the real deal.     

We're a friendly bunch in here and we're interested in our mountains. Sometimes we can be too passionate, but we're loyal.  In similar situations, I hope that others speak up to at least a moderator via PM rather than creating a worse situation for everyone by remaining silent.


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## salida (Dec 5, 2005)

thetrailboss said:
			
		

> Sometimes we can be too passionate, but we're loyal.



TB I totally agree with this, and I think it is sometimes where the precieved animosity comes from.  However, it is really just the passion of the skiers and riders on this board, mistaken as hard feelings.

-Porter


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## JimG. (Dec 5, 2005)

salida said:
			
		

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Yup, that passion can play out as antagonism sometimes too, but it isn't meant that way. 

Makes one realize how important non-verbal ques like facial expression and body language are. You really miss that in the "written only" environment.


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## zowi420 (Dec 6, 2005)

bvibert said:
			
		

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I don't think blaming critics is appropriate when info was not provided when asked.  Ignorance is not bliss. 

.

As indicated previously, I am low-tech and did not have an opportunity to answer that in a timely manner.  Sorry!  I also did not want to jeapordize my cushy job, ha ha ha, and now I've angered the Moderators!  Blissful, that's me; see, I don't even know how to answer multiple quotes, so please forgive me for doing it this way........


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## zowi420 (Dec 6, 2005)

riverc0il said:
			
		

> great post zowi420.



THANKS STEVE!


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## zowi420 (Dec 6, 2005)

JimG. said:
			
		

> Yup, that passion can play out as antagonism sometimes too, but it isn't meant that way.
> 
> Makes one realize how important non-verbal ques like facial expression and body language are. You really miss that in the "written only" environment.



I've no hard feelings and hope no one else does either.  We should all get together sometime.


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## salida (Dec 6, 2005)

I concur, I might be up there on Sunday, remains to be seen...  See what kind of flakes fly I guess.

-Porter


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## bvibert (Dec 6, 2005)

zowi420 said:
			
		

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I wasn't blaming anyone for anything, I was simply curious as to where you had gotten that info.  You certainly didn't anger this moderator...


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## JimG. (Dec 6, 2005)

zowi420 said:
			
		

> I've no hard feelings and hope no one else does either.  We should all get together sometime.



None here...still planning on a Cannon trip sometime in Feb/Mar.


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