# Sugarloaf 2/13/2016



## Bumpsis (Feb 13, 2016)

Sugarloaf 2/13/2016
Summary: Great conditions, no lines, awesome day.

The weather people must scared the public again with all those reports of "brutal cold". OK, so it was not balmy today and face masks, good layers and a warming break were necessary. Best part: wind was not an issue and  no lines on this big ski holiday at The Loaf. 

Snow conditions: great, for the most part, on trails that received snowmaking and grooming treatments. Some steeper portions of such trails as White Nitro and Gondola Line were on the harder/slicker side, but most skied really well and we started at noon.
Good conditions stayed that way through the end of the day. On some runs dancing on the edges of the trails was the best option. Natural snow trails were a bit skinny on cover so you had to be careful but we did find some great mogul lines and good cover on Wedge. My all time favorite trail, Bubblecuffer had a bit too much vegetation sticking through the snow, but it was still fun. Based on what I saw on natural cover trails, we did not do any glades but it looked like the entrance to Bracketts was open.

For the record, the temperature at the base at noon was about 13 F and an the end of the day it dropped down to about 4 (as measured by my car's display). You could really feel the lower temps after 3 PM. Winds stayed the same.

I'm here for the whole week (kid's school vacation). Tomorrow is the day to stay off the mountain: low temps and big winds - not fun. Maybe we'll snowshoe up Burnt Mt. I hear that it may rain on Tuesday 
I'm glad we had today!


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## bigbog (Feb 14, 2016)

Tuesday should be interesting all right.  Hope Wednesday isn't all ice.


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## 180 (Feb 14, 2016)

The winds today were not too bad.  Did Bubble and Winters Way about 8 time total and called it a day. Wind did keep refreshing the left edge.


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## deadheadskier (Feb 14, 2016)

Try ducking into Max Headroom between Gondiline and Winters Way.  That was really good a couple weeks ago


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## 180 (Feb 14, 2016)

Woods were pretty beat up and sketchy, some serious ice under there from the rain a week ago.


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## Not Sure (Feb 14, 2016)

deadheadskier said:


> Try ducking into Max Headroom between Gondiline and Winters Way.  That was really good a couple weeks ago



Where is that? I see Stumpshot on the trail map but no Maxheadroom. I hit Gondiglade on the other side


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## deadheadskier (Feb 14, 2016)

Siliconebobsquarepants said:


> Where is that? I see Stumpshot on the trail map but no Maxheadroom. I hit Gondiglade on the other side



I guess that's the one.  

I don't know the glade names at Sugarloaf well.  I posted a picture after the summit and someone asked where it was.  I did a Google search and that's what came up on a map.

Maybe it was an old trail map?


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## deadheadskier (Feb 14, 2016)

http://sugarloaf2020.tumblr.com/post/59586245782/heres-a-good-look-at-the-newly-cut-glade-on-the


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## bdfreetuna (Feb 14, 2016)

Branding Axe is another nice one. I would have definitely spent half the day in Brackett.


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## Not Sure (Feb 14, 2016)

deadheadskier said:


> http://sugarloaf2020.tumblr.com/post/59586245782/heres-a-good-look-at-the-newly-cut-glade-on-the



Looks like they changed the name ? I dropped in off spillway cut 100' past Gondiline . This Glade looks like it's off the upper section? 

Online trail map doesn't have a Maxheadroom .


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## deadheadskier (Feb 15, 2016)

This was 25 feet prior to gondiline.


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## tnt1234 (Feb 15, 2016)

Is brackets basin open?  Web site says no, but maybe it's skiable?


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## bdfreetuna (Feb 15, 2016)

tnt1234 said:


> Is brackets basin open?  Web site says no, but maybe it's skiable?



Woods in Northern VT were easily skiable a month ago. Of course Brackett Basin is skiable. No idea why it's not open, probably wind and cold leaving some icy patches. That will recover very quickly. If you like technical and awesome skiing, go for it.

Besides that there are a huge amount of other glades, woods, cuts or whatever you want to call them both on and off map that will be even more easily skiable because they probably get some snowmaking blow-over too.


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## tnt1234 (Feb 15, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> Woods in Northern VT were easily skiable a month ago. Of course Brackett Basin is skiable. No idea why it's not open, probably wind and cold leaving some icy patches. That will recover very quickly. If you like technical and awesome skiing, go for it.
> 
> Besides that there are a huge amount of other glades, woods, cuts or whatever you want to call them both on and off map that will be even more easily skiable because they probably get some snowmaking blow-over too.



Nice - thanks.

Family trip to Sugarloaf end of march.  First time there.  Bracket's basin figured into our decision.  Been checking the website all season and they haven;t listed it as open yet, which I thought was strange.


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## deadheadskier (Feb 15, 2016)

Tuna, 

You are really showing a complete lack of knowledge about Sugarloaf.  Many of us were there two weeks ago and Bracket needed two feet of heavy wet snow to open then.  Bracket has tons of stumps, rocks and downfall that requires a lot of snow to be safely skied by most.  I trust the judgment of Sugarloaf management much more than an individual out in the Berkshires who hasn't been there this year


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## tnt1234 (Feb 15, 2016)

deadheadskier said:


> Tuna,
> 
> You are really showing a complete lack of knowledge about Sugarloaf.  Many of us were there two weeks ago and Bracket needed two feet of heavy wet snow to open then.  Bracket has tons of stumps, rocks and downfall that requires a lot of snow to be safely skied by most.  I trust the judgment of Sugarloaf management much more than an individual out in the Berkshires who hasn't been there this year



Oh man...you just killed my buzz....

Oh well.  If it's not open by end of march, we'll have to try again.


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## deadheadskier (Feb 15, 2016)

I'm sure by end of March it will be open, but if it's not open today, there's good reason for it.  I've pouches it a couple of times before when closed and have always come out of there saying, "well, now I know why it's closed"


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## bdfreetuna (Feb 15, 2016)

deadheadskier said:


> Tuna,
> 
> You are really showing a complete lack of knowledge about Sugarloaf.  Many of us were there two weeks ago and Bracket needed two feet of heavy wet snow to open then.  Bracket has tons of stumps, rocks and downfall that requires a lot of snow to be safely skied by most.  I trust the judgment of Sugarloaf management much more than an individual out in the Berkshires who hasn't been there this year



Most is the key word. I did mention for technical skiers only. Last time I skied Brackett it was like 25% bare ground lots of exposed stuff, rocks and logs.

It's not for everyone; but "skiable", that's up to you. Most folks on here don't appreciate thin cover skiing. To me it adds to the fun and obstacles in the woods.

Wear a helmet either way.

And I find it hard to believe that Sugarloaf will have less snow by the weekend than Upper VT well over a month ago. Even with 2/3 as much snow in the woods it would be fine. "Experts only, with caution" of course.

From what I read of the AZ summit pretty much nobody even went into the woods so it's not like we have an accurate survey from recent weeks either.


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## deadheadskier (Feb 15, 2016)

Sugarloaf isn't MRG.  They need to be more cautious what they open. Different audience.

I do wear a helmet and I can promise you I am as capable and willing to ski thin cover terrain as yourself. I pouch stuff all the time, but I never make a judgment call for the mountain based upon what I'm capable of skiing 

You telling folks what should be open at Sugarloaf based on your experiences in VT a month ago isn't a good look.  It makes about as much sense as claiming you know how the skiing is right now at Mount Bohemia.


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## dlague (Feb 15, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> Woods in Northern VT were easily skiable a month ago. Of course Brackett Basin is skiable. No idea why it's not open, probably wind and cold leaving some icy patches. That will recover very quickly. If you like technical and awesome skiing, go for it.
> 
> Besides that there are a huge amount of other glades, woods, cuts or whatever you want to call them both on and off map that will be even more easily skiable because they probably get some snowmaking blow-over too.



I doubt it!  Those glades are not cleared of debris so skiing them with marginal snow is nuts!  For the summit, they were not open and according to ski patrol there was inadequate cover.  Since then we had r@!n and then a refreeze - yes we did get 8-12 inches of dry snow but that would not cover things well.

I think telling people that they are open when the mountain ops says they are not is irresponsible.


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## bdfreetuna (Feb 15, 2016)

Did I say they were open?

I said it would probably be technical but folks like myself and DHS might or might not go for it.

I keep track of Maine conditions as well. This isn't the only site that posts trip reports and I've seen plenty of Sugarloaf lately. People are saying there's plenty of snow and the groomers are fast and firm, a little ice here and there but plenty of base. Photos of the mountain look great. 10" of fresh February 9th and then it got windblown.

Obviously the reason Brackett is closed is #1 they aren't MRG and #2 it's probably got some ice in some spots. Poach it if you want. I'm pretty sure I never said "oh yeah it's epic in there". I said "skiable", for experts who like that stuff.

There's plenty of lines in Brackett that hardly even qualify as "expert" class woods. There are several easy ways down.

Can't wait to finish off this ski season with a series of epic ski reports and have y'all suck it up.

Pico Saturday. Please tell me how bad the woods are going to be so I can prove you wrong. Heck I might even do Berkshire East and take a bunch of woods pics


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## deadheadskier (Feb 15, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> No idea why it's not open.



This is what you said Tuna. You implied it should be open.

I was just there. It rained after. The 12" they got would not be enough to open it.  Looks like SL management agrees

That is all


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## Not Sure (Feb 15, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> Most is the key word. I did mention for technical skiers only. Last time I skied Brackett it was like 25% bare ground lots of exposed stuff, rocks and logs.
> 
> It's not for everyone; but "skiable", that's up to you. Most folks on here don't appreciate thin cover skiing. To me it adds to the fun and obstacles in the woods.
> 
> ...





Dude ...seriously when was your last eye exam ! Only woods that were being skied were next to trails with snowmaking blow over and they were barley skiable. I went past the entrance to Bracket and could see stumps sticking up


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## bdfreetuna (Feb 15, 2016)

^ If that's what you call "barely skiable" you need to learn to ski. Sorry but that looks pretty prime to me and I would run the zipper through that.

You're like hitting trees and moving like mollasses through there. Hopefully it was a fun challenge.

I feel like when people say "stumps" it's like from the Wizard of Oz. Lions, tigers, and bears, oh my!

You ski around trees, right (well, in most cases, apparently)? Ski around the stumps too.

I'm about to bust out the helmet cam again this season..


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## Not Sure (Feb 15, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> ^ If that's what you call "barely skiable" you need to learn to ski. Sorry but that looks pretty prime to me and I would run the zipper through that.
> 
> You're like hitting trees and moving like mollasses through there. Hopefully it was a fun challenge.
> 
> ...



Riding the chairlifts there were tons of snowsnakes barely below. Apparently you know more than the Sugarloaf staff if you say it should be open. 

Was my last run of the day and my legs were shot as I mentioned in my report. If you make it to 50+ well see how you do. Skinned up early on Saturday and skied bumps all day ,partied after, and skied most of Sunday after 1st tracks . Fun time all in all .....but just not safe to venture into wooded areas far from snowmaking .

If you post bad info people  will call you on it .....Nothing personal


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## bdfreetuna (Feb 15, 2016)

Not bad for 50, I'll give you that. My old man is 62 and you're a little better than him.

Again, I didn't say it should be open. Tiring responding to misquotes. I said it should be "skiable" for experts using caution. And I don't know why it's not open but now I realize it's probably a little windblown and icy in there.

I've hit some snow snakes this year; anyone who's been tree skiing has. Put your ski back on and keep moving. I understand the younger and maybe less easily breakable have less issue with this than older or more cautious (or less ambitious) skiers.

I got my bindings maxed out this year just because I'm tired of losing skis every time I hit a stick or something. (or fail to perfectly land a big terrain park jump)

I'll admit sometimes I assume 90% of posters here are fully healthy expert skiers with the same ambitions as mine. So keep in mind my advice is for people that see my trip reports and think "that looks like the good stuff!". Starting to realize there's only a handful of like-minded folks, at best, around here.

Too bad my wife from PR who's skied for just over 2 years doesn't come on here. She never complains, loves the hairy woods and skis everything I do and we high five each other afterwards. My old man isn't a fan of the thin cover because he thinks his 15 year old skis should last forever but he'll always have a good time in the woods unless it's ice or dirt.

I have updated my signature accordingly.



It's not for everybody but that's why we ski.


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## WWF-VT (Feb 15, 2016)

Experienced skier and low tide = broken leg.  Good luck to anyone risking the woods in VT, NH or ME these days;

http://freshiesmag.com/2016/02/12/rescue-in-the-notch-lack-of-snow/


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## tnt1234 (Feb 15, 2016)

Ouch, glad that guy is OK - relatively.  Could have been worse.


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## Not Sure (Feb 15, 2016)

<><> CAUTION: THIN COVER EXPERTS ONLY<><> Only take my advice if that sign makes you unable to resist skiing that trail.

Here's a Pilots saying thats relevant " There are Old Pilots and Bold Pilots , There are No Old Bold Pilots" 

Ski smart and live to ski another day , Zip lining a glade ......end up like this guy.


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## bdfreetuna (Feb 15, 2016)

I guess you've never watched a ski movie where everyone skis better and harder than anyone on this forum?

Or a Ski The East Unconventional Terrain competition at Magic or Castlerock, etc?

Thanks for the advice though. I still plan on becoming as good and technical a skier as I can possibly be before my body can't take it anymore.


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## Not Sure (Feb 15, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> I guess you've never watched a ski movie where everyone skis better and harder than anyone on this forum?
> 
> Or a Ski The East Unconventional Terrain competition at Magic or Castlerock, etc?
> 
> Thanks for the advice though. I still plan on becoming as good and technical a skier as I can possibly be before my body can't take it anymore.



I think you're missing the point, I don't believe anyone here challenged your skiing ability in any way . At least me anyway
I believe 95% of the people on this forum are experts with their own strengths and weaknesses. 

Just your judgment needs some tweaking. 

I still ski hard , fast . Like bumps but after a major concussion in the 80's limit aerials . Bumps are my favorite and  still have knees. getting into a pissing match is not my thing. I was in one mogul completion at Camelback in the 80's and finished 4th out of 60 so I can get down the mountain albeit pizza . 

I did indeed watch the unconventional Magic vid. From reading the what's going on at Magic thread that seems like an normal day there lately .


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## tnt1234 (Feb 15, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> ^ If that's what you call "barely skiable" you need to learn to ski. Sorry but that looks pretty prime to me and I would run the zipper through that.
> 
> You're like hitting trees and moving like mollasses through there. Hopefully it was a fun challenge.
> 
> ...



For me, the issue with seeing stumps is, where are the stumps you can't see?

More an issue when there is fresh snow on top of a crappy base.  That is when you really have to worry.  If the snow is tracked out or heavy, and you'll be skiing on top of it, that's one thing, but when there is fresh snow, and a lame base, that is when you get into trouble.  When you can't see your boots for the snow, but there are a few stumps visible....doesn't really matter how good of a skier you are at that point. 

Anyway, think snow, and we won't have to worry....


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## wa-loaf (Feb 15, 2016)

DHS what do you keep in the pouch you keep mentioning?


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## steamboat1 (Feb 16, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> I guess you've never watched a ski movie where everyone skis better and harder than anyone on this forum?
> 
> Or a Ski The East Unconventional Terrain competition at Magic or Castlerock, etc?
> 
> Thanks for the advice though. I still plan on becoming as good and technical a skier as I can possibly be before my body can't take it anymore.



When I grow up I hope to be as good as you.


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## skiMEbike (Feb 18, 2016)

tnt1234 said:


> For me, the issue with seeing stumps is, where are the stumps you can't see?
> 
> More an issue when there is fresh snow on top of a crappy base.  That is when you really have to worry.  If the snow is tracked out or heavy, and you'll be skiing on top of it, that's one thing, but when there is fresh snow, and a lame base, that is when you get into trouble.  When you can't see your boots for the snow, but there are a few stumps visible....doesn't really matter how good of a skier you are at that point.
> 
> Anyway, think snow, and we won't have to worry....



Agree...Everyone has a different tolerance level on what is skiable & what is not, however I respect that others want to ski something I have no desire to ski.   For me, I am more likely to ski a glade with little snow pack if I am very familiar with the glade to know where/if there are hidden obstacles, the glade gets significant blow over man-made snow from nearby trails, and/or  the glade is relatively established (in other words not freshly cut like Brackett)…  So far at the Loaf I’ve only been in Gondi glade, Max, and Toke Road, as I feel that I can safely get through those based on my “standards” (I’d feel safe with Pipecleaner, but just haven’t made it there yet)*    With Brackett Basin & many other glades at the Loaf, I trust patrol’s assessment due to my tolerance levels.

I had an “unofficial off the record” chat with an off-duty Patroller at the Loaf the other day on this very topic…Basically, he said they will never announce a glade as “open” with these marginal conditions we’ve had this year, as it becomes a liability issue with the mountain.    He basically said as long as you are not ducking a rope (which there are not many roped off glades at the Loaf) , patrol has no issue with you skiing a “closed” glade & they are not going to be coming after your pass if you do…..So have at it if you desire, just know you are on your own & there will not be any sweeping of closed glades.

*Of course all this is based on conditions prior to Tuesday’s overnight storm.


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## bigbog (Feb 18, 2016)

This seems to be a year where one has to pick their way through the trees....  Spoiled by last winter..


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## tnt1234 (Feb 18, 2016)

skiMEbike said:


> Agree...Everyone has a different tolerance level on what is skiable & what is not, however I respect that others want to ski something I have no desire to ski.   For me, I am more likely to ski a glade with little snow pack if I am very familiar with the glade to know where/if there are hidden obstacles, the glade gets significant blow over man-made snow from nearby trails, and/or  the glade is relatively established (in other words not freshly cut like Brackett)…  So far at the Loaf I’ve only been in Gondi glade, Max, and Toke Road, as I feel that I can safely get through those based on my “standards” (I’d feel safe with Pipecleaner, but just haven’t made it there yet)*    With Brackett Basin & many other glades at the Loaf, I trust patrol’s assessment due to my tolerance levels.
> 
> I had an “unofficial off the record” chat with an off-duty Patroller at the Loaf the other day on this very topic…Basically, he said they will never announce a glade as “open” with these marginal conditions we’ve had this year, as it becomes a liability issue with the mountain.    He basically said as long as you are not ducking a rope (which there are not many roped off glades at the Loaf) , patrol has no issue with you skiing a “closed” glade & they are not going to be coming after your pass if you do…..So have at it if you desire, just know you are on your own & there will not be any sweeping of closed glades.
> 
> *Of course all this is based on conditions prior to Tuesday’s overnight storm.



Great info and thanks!


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