# Shifting less...



## JD (May 14, 2009)

When I was starting to ride MTBs I read an article about shifting.  The Jist of it was that generally, people shifted too much.  It suggested riding your normal loop and trying to shift half as much.  When I tried it, I realized I was shifting way too much.  The shifts I eliminated forced me to anticipate more and accelerate sooner for short climbs or tech spots, and eliminated the need for downshifts in quite a few places I thought I needed to before.  It meant I was quicker back on the throttle and slowed down less then if i had relegated myslef to a lower gear at the beginning of the hill or rock garden....Give it a shot on your regular ride.


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## tjf67 (May 14, 2009)

I took two linkes out of my chain so I can shift a lot quicker.  I can't get onto the biggest rings at the same time but it is a rapid shift. 
The only time I am on the big ring anyways is when I am riding the road to the trails.


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## GrilledSteezeSandwich (May 14, 2009)

how many speeds do you guys have,,the last time I was on a mountain bike it was like a 18 speed and shifting was a real pain..


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## Greg (May 14, 2009)

JD said:


> When I was starting to ride MTBs I read an article about shifting.  The Jist of it was that generally, people shifted too much.  It suggested riding your normal loop and trying to shift half as much.  When I tried it, I realized I was shifting way too much.  The shifts I eliminated forced me to anticipate more and accelerate sooner for short climbs or tech spots, and eliminated the need for downshifts in quite a few places I thought I needed to before.  It meant I was quicker back on the throttle and slowed down less then if i had relegated myslef to a lower gear at the beginning of the hill or rock garden....Give it a shot on your regular ride.



This is great stuff! GREAT! :beer: I know I shift too much. I've been trying to smooth everything out this season.



GrilledSteezeSandwich said:


> how many speeds do you guys have,,the last time I was on a mountain bike it was like a 18 speed and shifting was a real pain..



Normally, my bike has 27 speed, but with the bash guard, it's really only 18. And you never use all of them since (1) there's a lot of crossover between gear combos that "feel" the same and (2) if on the small ring you go up too high in the rear, you can cross-chain which is not good for the drivetrain and causes some rub.

I generally probably use less than 10 gear combos. Mostly 2-1 (middle ring and largest rear cog). I have my front derailleur set so it doesn't rub much in that combo. I'll shift up through the cassette depending on whether I'm descending, but I don't think I really go much higher than 2-6 or 2-7. I'll drop onto the small ring from time to time on tricky climbs or when I totally run out of gas, but I won't even go higher than 1-3 or 1--4.


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## GrilledSteezeSandwich (May 14, 2009)

what is a bash guard and why does that take away 9 speeds?


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## Grassi21 (May 14, 2009)

GrilledSteezeSandwich said:


> what is a bash guard and why does that take away 9 speeds?



The bash guard replaces your largest ring.  So instead of 3 rings you have 2 thus eliminating some of your gear combos.

All this shifting is nonsense.  Everyone should be riding a single speed. ;-)


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## Greg (May 14, 2009)

GrilledSteezeSandwich said:


> what is a bash guard and why does that take away 9 speeds?



You remove the large chain ring up front and replace it with a bash guard which is a heavy gauge ring with no teeth and is only slightly bigger than the middle ring. Here's mine:







I've since dropped the front derailleur so it just clears the bash guard. It give you more clearance while protecting the middle ring which is where people ride most anyway. The big ring is only going for going really fast which you probably only do on fire road or uber buffed out singletrack. Northeast woods is very rocky, rooty and overall techy so the big ring is kinda useless. You just rarely get going fast enough to need it.


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## Talisman (May 14, 2009)

JD said:


> When I was starting to ride MTBs I read an article about shifting.  The Jist of it was that generally, people shifted too much.



Interesting concept.  I have noticed that rookie MT bikers don't anticipate shifting very well and taking anticipation further would be reduced shifting.

If you really want to cut back on shifting get a single speed.


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## Greg (May 14, 2009)

Talisman said:


> If you really want to cut back on shifting get a single speed.



What gear combo do most people aim to mimic on a SS?


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## GrilledSteezeSandwich (May 14, 2009)

Thanks for the explanation Greg..it seems like most M-Bikers make mods..do you have pegs in case you need to give someone with a flat a lift?


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## Greg (May 14, 2009)

GrilledSteezeSandwich said:


> Thanks for the explanation Greg..it seems like most M-Bikers make mods..do you have pegs in case you need to give someone with a flat a lift?



Anyone that gets a flat that doesn't have the gear or know-how to fix it deserves to walk out.


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## GrilledSteezeSandwich (May 14, 2009)

Greg said:


> Anyone that gets a flat that doesn't have the gear or know-how to fix it deserves to walk out.



so you always ride with a backpack with tools???  That is one of the things that has kept me from M-Biking as I don't like wearing a backback and am not handy..


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## Greg (May 14, 2009)

GrilledSteezeSandwich said:


> so you always ride with a backpack with tools???  That is one of the things that has kept me from M-Biking as I don't like wearing a backback and am not handy..



Well, you have to ride with a fair amount of water anyway, or you're not going to be riding too far. Drinking 50-70 oz of water is common for me on a 2-3 hour ride, and that's even if I hydrate well throughout the day. The most efficient way to carry water is a hydration pack which also has plenty of storage for the small amount of tools/replacement parts you should carry with you. Once riding, there are so many other things going on physically/mentally, that you don't even notice you're wearing it. I can't help you with the handiness thing.


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## GrilledSteezeSandwich (May 14, 2009)

Greg said:


> Well, you have to ride with a fair amount of water anyway, or you're not going to be riding too far. Drinking 50-70 oz of water is common for me on a 2-3 hour ride, and that's even if I hydrate well throughout the day. The most efficient way to carry water is a hydration pack which also has plenty of storage for the small amount of tools/replacement parts you should carry with you. Once riding, there are so many other things going on physically/mentally, that you don't even notice you're wearing it. I can't help you with the handiness thing.



right on..for some reason I was just thinking a water bottle in the bottle holder on the bike..anyway for now I've talked myself out of going the M-bike route...


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## Grassi21 (May 14, 2009)

GrilledSteezeSandwich said:


> right on..for some reason I was just thinking a water bottle in the bottle holder on the bike..anyway for now I've talked myself out of going the M-bike route...



go on a ride with root or something.  it is addictive.  plus there are plenty of opportunities for safety meetings.


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## bvibert (May 14, 2009)

This sounds like propaganda from a single speeder.


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## GrilledSteezeSandwich (May 14, 2009)

Grassi21 said:


> go on a ride with root or something.  it is addictive.  plus there are plenty of opportunities for safety meetings.



Gear would run over a grand I'm guessing..do you guys really wear special biking clothes or are cargo shorts and a polo shirt OK???  Sneakers OK?


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## Grassi21 (May 14, 2009)

GrilledSteezeSandwich said:


> Gear would run over a grand I'm guessing..do you guys really wear special biking clothes or are cargo shorts and a polo shirt OK???  Sneakers OK?



Wear whatever, *just get on a bike and see if you like it*.  I wish Greg and Brian snapped a pic of me on my first ride.  What a gaper...  To this day I don't wear real "MTB" gloves.  I wear and old pair of Neuman football receiver gloves.  I started out with sneakers.  I have upgraded those to some soft rubber skater type shoes.  I have a ton of Under Armour type gear from lacrosse and skiing.


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## Greg (May 14, 2009)

GrilledSteezeSandwich said:


> Gear would run over a grand I'm guessing..do you guys really wear special biking clothes or are cargo shorts and a polo shirt OK???  Sneakers OK?



Padded MTB shorts are almost a must. Not gay ass spandex bike shorts, but the regular looking ones with some padding. I guess you could get away with regular shorts to start out, but wear some tighty whities, not boxers, or your nuts are going to get tweaked. You're ass/taint area is also going to kill the first few rides.

Polo shirt? :blink: Cotton sucks, but I guess you could get away with a plain ole tee shirt. My riding shirts are Champion synthetic exercise shirt you can get at Target for 12 bucks. Sneakers are okay to start with. Don't wear the fancy Reebok kicks you normally wear to church on Sunday though. They're going to get wrecked (muddy, wet and smelly).


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## Greg (May 14, 2009)

Grassi21 said:


> I wish Greg and Brian snapped a pic of me on my first ride.  What a gaper...



It's the best I could come up with...


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## Grassi21 (May 14, 2009)

Greg said:


> It's the best I could come up with...



Look how far over my handlebars I am.  No wonder I bit the dust...


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## mondeo (May 14, 2009)

This thread is more fun when you replace the fs with ts.


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## RootDKJ (May 14, 2009)

Greg said:


> Anyone that gets a flat that doesn't have the gear or know-how to fix it deserves to walk out.


+1



GrilledSteezeSandwich said:


> so you always ride with a backpack with tools???  That is one of the things that has kept me from M-Biking as I don't like wearing a backback and am not handy..


I ride with a Camelbak bag.  When the temps are in the 90's you need a lot of water.  But I keep tools and spare inner tubes in my saddle bag.



Grassi21 said:


> go on a ride with root or something.  it is addictive.  plus there are plenty of opportunities for safety meetings.


+1  My favorite spot.  No hard climbs after this spot and some fun downhills and turns.  Scenery is nice as well.







GrilledSteezeSandwich said:


> Gear would run over a grand I'm guessing..do you guys really wear special biking clothes or are cargo shorts and a polo shirt OK???  Sneakers OK?


Try to see if you can find a cheap hardtail on Craigslist or ask Hurtmyknee if he has one to sell.  Post up a link and we'll let you know if we think it's a good deal.  Regular shirt and shorts are ok.  I wear a wicking t-shirt.  I use trail running sneakers when I ride.

_Back on topic for a sec..._I've done rides, just using the front derailer, so three speeds.  yeah it makes a difference but I was in better shape then.  I still need my granny gear to make some of the climbs.


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## GrilledSteezeSandwich (May 14, 2009)

Grassi21 said:


> Look how far over my handlebars I am.  No wonder I bit the dust...



ahahaha


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## JD (May 14, 2009)

bvibert said:


> This sounds like propaganda from a single speeder.



I would mark that article as the beginning of the transition to less gears and eventually one, but the final straw was how expensive the MTB drivetrail is to maintain if you ride alot..like everyday.  It got to the point that I was wondering why I was buying a new rear derailure every 2 months so I could shift 6 times over the course of a 4 hour ride.  

The next progression from 2 rings is getting sick of going to pedal and finding your chain has dropped off of the middle ring and is now dangling freely because you threw a backpedal thru a fast, rough downhill, and when you go to pedal there is no resistance and you smash you nuts on the stem.  It wasn't too many of those before I just lost the granny gear and went with a single 32t front ring with a bash guard on the the inside too.  Then the chain can't fall off.

Really, 32:32 (or a gear ratio of 1:1) is pretty light.  If Greg never goes beyond 1-3, then he's running like 22:28 maybe.  Maybe even 22:26.  32:32 almost feels the same...then you'll be running the 1 by 9 like all the cool kids.....and you'll shift less and build powerfull leg muscles, good for bumping.  Not skinny endurance muscles like skate skiiers have.


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## Grassi21 (May 15, 2009)

JD said:


> It got to the point that I was wondering why I was buying a new rear derailure every 2 months so I could shift 6 times over the course of a 4 hour ride.



After replacing my 1st derailure I was convinced.  I have an old bike that I turned into a SS.  Once I get my conditioning up to an acceptable point I would consider turning my Cannondale F5 into an SS.  If I ever go FS I would buy a frame and build it up as a SS.


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## Marc (May 15, 2009)

Greg said:


> Padded MTB shorts are almost a must. *Not gay ass spandex bike shorts, *but the regular looking ones with some padding.



Form < Function, my friend.  Tough, rip resistant baggies with liner is good for MTB, not so much for long miles on the road.

Of course, I've got a pretty nice ass, so I also don't mind people seeing me in the lycra.


/bet that was more than anyone wanted to know


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## Grassi21 (May 15, 2009)

Marc said:


> /bet that was more than anyone wanted to know



ding ding ding ding


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## GrilledSteezeSandwich (May 15, 2009)

spandex shorts make the biker..


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## bvibert (May 15, 2009)

JD said:


> I would mark that article as the beginning of the transition to less gears and eventually one, but the final straw was how expensive the MTB drivetrail is to maintain if you ride alot..like everyday.  It got to the point that I was wondering why I was buying a new rear derailure every 2 months so I could shift 6 times over the course of a 4 hour ride.
> 
> The next progression from 2 rings is getting sick of going to pedal and finding your chain has dropped off of the middle ring and is now dangling freely because you threw a backpedal thru a fast, rough downhill, and when you go to pedal there is no resistance and you smash you nuts on the stem.  It wasn't too many of those before I just lost the granny gear and went with a single 32t front ring with a bash guard on the the inside too.  Then the chain can't fall off.
> 
> Really, 32:32 (or a gear ratio of 1:1) is pretty light.  If Greg never goes beyond 1-3, then he's running like 22:28 maybe.  Maybe even 22:26.  32:32 almost feels the same...then you'll be running the 1 by 9 like all the cool kids.....and you'll shift less and build powerfull leg muscles, good for bumping.  Not skinny endurance muscles like skate skiiers have.



Some valid points.  I guess I've been lucky, relatively.  I've had some chain suck issues, but aside from that my drive train has been pretty trouble free.  Of course I don't ride everyday and I've only been riding for a few years.  I've never dropped a chain off the rings from back-pedaling, but I have had it shift down to smaller cogs on the cassette, which can be annoying.


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## Greg (May 18, 2009)

I tried to take note of it on Friday while riding a new area and found I was shifting all over the place. Easier to shift less when you know the trails.


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## bvibert (May 28, 2009)

I tried making note of my shifting the last few rides...  I came to the conclusion that I shift just as much as I want to, no more, no less.  Are there some times that I shift when it's not completely necessary, probably.  The gears are there to use, so why not use them when you feel it's needed?

I don't think I'll ever be cut out to be a SSer.


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## Grassi21 (May 28, 2009)

bvibert said:


> I tried making note of my shifting the last few rides...  I came to the conclusion that I shift just as much as I want to, no more, no less.  Are there some times that I shift when it's not completely necessary, probably.  The gears are there to use, so why not use them when you feel it's needed?
> 
> I don't think I'll ever be cut out to be a SSer.



I rode the ss and my cannondale this weekend.  ss is a great work out especially if there are a few climbs thrown in here and there.  but the geared bike is nice when you want to really fly.  ss feels like a fun change of pace.


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