# 2021-22 Season Passes



## deadheadskier (Feb 19, 2021)

Waterville just went on sale. $942 early bird.  I'm guessing this means the White Mountain Superpass price is going up next year.

I think last year it was $989


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## KustyTheKlown (Feb 19, 2021)

ikon base, magic sundays, and indy have done me right. i think it will be the exact same next year.


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## Smellytele (Feb 20, 2021)

deadheadskier said:


> Waterville just went on sale. $942 early bird.  I'm guessing this means the White Mountain Superpass price is going up next year.
> 
> I think last year it was $989


That price seems high in this day and age.


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## thebigo (Feb 20, 2021)

WV throws in a 12 and under pass at that price. For a family with two young kids, it is competitive. Effectively a family pass <$2k.


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## Newpylong (Feb 20, 2021)

Im still surprised people pay a grand to ski there..


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## abc (Feb 20, 2021)

Newpylong said:


> Im still surprised people pay a grand to ski there..


I'm almost surprise people ski there (regularly).


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## urungus (Feb 20, 2021)




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## thetrailboss (Feb 26, 2021)

Jay Peak just released this information:



> Within the next few days, we’ll be making our 2021+22 Jay Peak Season Passes available for purchase. The act of doing so helps us think of better, down-the-road days when we can welcome back new faces and get better looks at the ones presently under wraps. We wanted to share a few relevant points with you, so you are as informed as possible when Season Pass announcements start lighting up from every corner of the web.
> 
> 
> Most importantly, *we will be freezing our most discounted, Tier One rates* from this season. 2021+22 Tier One Jay Peak Season Pass products will be the exact same price as they were for the 2020+21 season and both US and Canadian guests have until June 30th, 2021 to purchase.
> ...


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## Edd (Feb 26, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> Jay Peak just released this information:


That’s pretty cool about pushing late. I’m sure Vail will announce Wildcat going to May any minute now


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## thetrailboss (Feb 26, 2021)

Edd said:


> That’s pretty cool about pushing late. I’m sure Vail will announce Wildcat going to May any minute now


Not very likely


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## cdskier (Mar 4, 2021)

Ikon goes on sale March 11th. Full Ikon is $999 (or $899 renewal). Ikon Base is $729 (649 renewal). They're including deferral and COVID closure protections again as well.

They also have a payment plan option now if people want...

Also includes spring access a the following resorts starting on the listed dates:

Big Bear Mountain ResortMarch 12, 2021SnowshoeMarch 12, 2021TremblantApril 5, 2021SolitudeApril 5, 2021SugarbushApril 5, 2021Mammoth MountainApril 12, 2021Squaw Valley Alpine MeadowsApril 12, 2021Winter ParkApril 12, 2021


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## thebigo (Mar 4, 2021)

Boyne: https://www.newenglandpass.com/

Lowest price valid through end of April with spring benefits.


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## ss20 (Mar 4, 2021)

cdskier said:


> Ikon goes on sale March 11th. Full Ikon is $999 (or $899 renewal). Ikon Base is $729 (649 renewal). They're including deferral and COVID closure protections again as well.
> 
> They also have a payment plan option now if people want...
> 
> ...



$30 increase in price for the Base, flat for the full Ikon.  I can't find any changes in access compared to last year.  

I find the spring skiing privileges super late.  Only SB here in the East and not til April 5...I find it very strange Stratton isn't on there given it is Alterra-owned.  They also have a hellova lot more uphill capacity that late in the season compared to SB.  What's SB usually running at that point?...Heaven's Gate, Super Bravo, Gatehouse, and Valley House?  Stratton's got the Gondola, Ursa, Amex, Tamarack, and could run the Snowbowl if they had too.


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## cdskier (Mar 4, 2021)

ss20 said:


> $30 increase in price for the Base, flat for the full Ikon.  I can't find any changes in access compared to last year.
> 
> I find the spring skiing privileges super late.  Only SB here in the East and not til April 5...I find it very strange Stratton isn't on there given it is Alterra-owned.  They also have a hellova lot more uphill capacity that late in the season compared to SB.  What's SB usually running at that point?...Heaven's Gate, Super Bravo, Gatehouse, and Valley House?  Stratton's got the Gondola, Ursa, Amex, Tamarack, and could run the Snowbowl if they had too.


To some degree, I think the late access makes sense given that they still need to limit capacity to a degree. Late March is when Quad pack holders from last year at SB can start using their quad packs again, so they may be expecting a lot of people to show up in late March via that and don't want to add more Ikon spring access during that time.

I thought the lack of spring access at Stratton was a bit odd though. Maybe Stratton has been hitting their capacity limits this year while SB has been below so they don't want to drive any more traffic to Stratton?


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## thetrailboss (Mar 4, 2021)

cdskier said:


> Ikon goes on sale March 11th. Full Ikon is $999 (or $899 renewal). Ikon Base is $729 (649 renewal). They're including deferral and COVID closure protections again as well.
> 
> They also have a payment plan option now if people want...
> 
> ...


That's weird as to spring access.  At that date, Solitude will likely be only open one week more, maybe two.

As to next season, Alterra changed access to Crystal to include blackouts on the IKON Base.  We heard horror stories about the crowds there in recent years.


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## slatham (Mar 4, 2021)

Re: Stratton - bet they plan to close after Easter break which ends Sunday April 4th. Maybe they do one more weekend but odds are no.

Re: No changes - Stratton and Sugarbush are unlimited (w/Blackout) on base pass next year. They were 5 days last year IIRC.


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## cdskier (Mar 4, 2021)

slatham said:


> Re: Stratton - bet they plan to close after Easter break which ends Sunday April 4th. Maybe they do one more weekend but odds are no.
> 
> Re: No changes - Stratton and Sugarbush are unlimited (w/Blackout) on base pass next year. They were 5 days last year IIRC.


Sugarbush and Stratton were both unlimited with Blackout this past year on Ikon base...


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## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Mar 4, 2021)

Bet we get an Epic announcement tomorrow, certainly before Ikon on sale in 7 days.

If I do Ikon it will definitely be the full pass as Windham is by far the closest option to me in NJ and I will surely use all 7 days there.


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## machski (Mar 4, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> That's weird as to spring access.  At that date, Solitude will likely be only open one week more, maybe two.
> 
> As to next season, Alterra changed access to Crystal to include blackouts on the IKON Base.  We heard horror stories about the crowds there in recent years.


Not just that, Ikon Base at Crystal is limited to 5 days access and blackouts.  Should trim crowding.


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## machski (Mar 4, 2021)

thebigo said:


> Boyne: https://www.newenglandpass.com/
> 
> Lowest price valid through end of April with spring benefits.


Spring benefits only apply to pay in full and at FULL prices (renewal discount won't apply if folks deferred and elect to ski this spring).


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## abc (Mar 4, 2021)

ss20 said:


> .I find it very strange Stratton isn't on there given it is Alterra-owned.  They also have a hellova lot more uphill capacity that late in the season compared to SB.  What's SB usually running at that point?...Heaven's Gate, Super Bravo, Gatehouse, and Valley House?  Stratton's got the Gondola, Ursa, Amex, Tamarack, and could run the Snowbowl if they had too.


Yep, that looks a bit strange. Seems almost all the other Altera owned mountains offers spring access but Stratton?


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## xlr8r (Mar 4, 2021)

Maybe Stratton is closing April 4th


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## cdskier (Mar 4, 2021)

abc said:


> Yep, that looks a bit strange. Seems almost all the other Altera owned mountains offers spring access but Stratton?


Not just Stratton...actually closer to almost half of the resorts owned by Alterra you don't get Spring access at. You only get spring access at 8 resorts total.


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## abc (Mar 4, 2021)

xlr8r said:


> Maybe Stratton is closing April 4th


Good guess. 



cdskier said:


> Not just Stratton...actually closer to almost half of the resorts owned by Alterra you don't get Spring access at. You only get spring access at 8 resorts total.


You're right. Copper isn't on it either. But Winter Park is. Maybe it's to funnel skiers to one mountain in each region? (though both Mammoth and Squaw are in the list)


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## cdskier (Mar 4, 2021)

abc said:


> Good guess.
> 
> 
> You're right. Copper isn't on it either. But Winter Park is. Maybe it's to funnel skiers to one mountain in each region? (though both Mammoth and Squaw are in the list)


Well at least for Copper (and Eldora), they're not owned by Alterra so that's a possible reason for no access there. However Blue, Steamboat, Crystal, June and Deer Valley are all owned by Alterra and there's no spring access at those either (Deer Valley is no surprise since even full Ikon only gets you limited access there).


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## KustyTheKlown (Mar 4, 2021)

stratton is off the spring access probably because its an utter shitshow every weekend. place is the pits. 

definitely renewing ikon base. it pays for itself with these two bigger trips i take each year, whether its out west or here at sugarbush. then the magic sunday and the indy for new england weekends. perfect. ~$1000 investment for about 50 days of skiing. $20/day. groovy.


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## LonghornSkier (Mar 4, 2021)

$619 for the NY SKI 3 as a 25 y/o (free skiing after 3/17 too) + an Indy Pass is gonna do the trick for me, I think.


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## abc (Mar 4, 2021)

cdskier said:


> Well at least for Copper (and Eldora), they're not owned by Alterra so that's a possible reason for no access there. However Blue, Steamboat, Crystal, June and Deer Valley are all owned by Alterra and there's no spring access at those either (Deer Valley is no surprise since even full Ikon only gets you limited access there).


Steamboat is limited access only also. So I don't expect it to be on the list. Who would want to blow their days at Steamboat in the spring? 

I didn't realize Copper isn't owned by Alterra. It's unlimited access so I assumed...



KustyTheKlown said:


> stratton is off the spring access probably because its an utter shitshow every weekend. place is the pits.


I kind of doubt the shitshow will continue into April though.


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## cdskier (Mar 4, 2021)

abc said:


> Steamboat is limited access only also. So I don't expect it to be on the list. Who would want to blow their days at Steamboat in the spring?
> 
> I didn't realize Copper isn't owned by Alterra. It's unlimited access so I assumed...


Steamboat is unlimited on full Ikon. It is only limited on base. And yes, Copper is actually owned by Powdr (same as Eldora).


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## smac75 (Mar 4, 2021)

Are you saying if we deferred this year and apply to next year's full Ikon we CAN ski this spring? I wonder if the same applies to SB only pass - we did that for one of my kids as it made more sense financially.


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## NYDB (Mar 4, 2021)

Full magic and ikon again ( bought with this years pass deferral $) for me and family.  Dealing with the kids school schedule forces full ikon instead of  Base.


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## NYDB (Mar 4, 2021)

smac75 said:


> Are you saying if we deferred this year and apply to next year's full Ikon we CAN ski this spring? I wonder if the same applies to SB only pass - we did that for one of my kids as it made more sense financially.


You can, you just have to wait until 4/18 when they credit the deferral money.  It's spelled out on ikon website


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## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Mar 4, 2021)

KustyTheKlown said:


> stratton is off the spring access probably because its an utter shitshow every weekend. place is the pits.
> 
> definitely renewing ikon base. it pays for itself with these two bigger trips i take each year, whether its out west or here at sugarbush. then the magic sunday and the indy for new england weekends. perfect. ~$1000 investment for about 50 days of skiing. $20/day. groovy.


As I am considering move from Epic to Ikon - How have crowds at Stratton compared to those at Mt Snow and Okemo? And is it just the Gondola or a subset of lifts or are they all bad?

Also considering ORDA - presume crowds better at Gore?

And what is Magic Sunday?


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## ss20 (Mar 4, 2021)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> As I am considering move from Epic to Ikon - How have crowds at Stratton compared to those at Mt Snow and Okemo? And is it just the Gondola or a subset of lifts or are they all bad?
> 
> Also considering ORDA - presume crowds better at Gore?
> 
> And what is Magic Subday?



Southern Vermont= bad any weekend, wherever.  And I love Magic but on a Sunday with good snow you should still plan on a 15-20 minute wait to get on Red.  

I've been spending more time at Stratton this year after a 3ish year break and it's hectic midweek.  Shooting Star is ski-on but that's the official lift-to-nowhere.  I couldn't imagine a weekend...I haven't done a weekend day at Stratton peak season since well before Ikon.


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## KustyTheKlown (Mar 4, 2021)

i dont ski mount snow or okemo so i dont know. i try to avoid stratton but I've been there for an early season powder day, and one other weekend day this year. its a mess at the main base, basically all day. getting onto the gondola or the whatever the fuck chair is a mess. ursa is basically always a mess. on the early season powder day i was scared of the ursa line from a covid perspective. snowbowl gets less of a line. 

magic sunday is magic mountains sundays only pass, blacked out holiday weekends, under $300. I've used it a lot. magic is on the way home. skiing magic til 1:30 allows me to be home by 6, which is great. and the skiing and the culture and the terrain and the everything about magic is worth giving them $289


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## KustyTheKlown (Mar 4, 2021)

ss20 said:


> Southern Vermont= bad any weekend, wherever.  And I love Magic but on a Sunday with good snow you should still plan on a 15-20 minute wait to get on Red.
> 
> I've been spending more time at Stratton this year after a 3ish year break and it's hectic midweek.  Shooting Star is ski-on but that's the official lift-to-nowhere.  I couldn't imagine a weekend...I haven't done a weekend day at Stratton peak season since well before Ikon.



its definitely a 15 minute wait at peak times on Sunday, but it is basically ski on from 8:30 to 10 or so. i also don't mind the wait there really. something about magic mellows me out, lets me take it fairly slow. they manage the line well and i don't feel covid wary of it. and i am glad for them to be busy and make money. that being said, this season has made clear that the black chair is more of a need than i previously thought


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## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Mar 4, 2021)

Thanks for the info. Does Magic Sunday pass also make you eligible for 30% discount on Indy Pass? Those two together could work real nice as Indy could give a couple of the Holiday Sundays at Magic, and doing Magic Sundays could slow using up other Indy days.


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## Tonyr (Mar 4, 2021)

The Mountain Collective was just offered today for existing pass holders. $479 for adults $129 for kids plus a 3rd day free at the resort of your choosing. Last year it was $469 for adults $99 for kids so the pass went up 50 bucks for me but still well worth it. We are going back out to Aspen in December and the 3 days from this pass alone will cover the cost and them some. Anywhere else that we ski during the season is gravey.


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## KustyTheKlown (Mar 4, 2021)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> Thanks for the info. Does Magic Sunday pass also make you eligible for 30% discount on Indy Pass? Those two together could work real nice as Indy could give a couple of the Holiday Sundays at Magic, and doing Magic Sundays could slow using up other Indy days.



no, i think the discount is only for full passholders, but the indy is so cheap for what it provides at full cost.

i used my indy days on MLK Monday, and this past Saturday while i was on my way up to vt for the long trip i'm currently on. worked out well. i have a 4pack from last year that went unused that becomes valid next week too. they let me roll it over to be used after march 14 (which is when they got shut down for covid last year), so if the snow stays good a couple of full magic spring weekends are in the cards.


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## abc (Mar 4, 2021)

NY DirtBag said:


> You can, you just have to wait until 4/18 when they credit the deferral money.  It's spelled out on ikon website


Yeah right, and 2 out of that 8 "spring access" resorts are closing that week or the following week!


thetrailboss said:


> That's weird as to spring access.  At that date, Solitude will likely be only open one week more, maybe two.


Yep! Solitude plan to close 4/18!

(Winter Park is showing they close April 25)


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## NYDB (Mar 5, 2021)

I agree it would be nice for Alterra to let us 'buy' on 3/11 and start spring skiing if you have already deferred.  I mean they already have our money and we did lose out on last spring.  Just apply the balance when we buy.  Kind of silly the way they have it setup. 

It actually says on the website that if you deferred your 20/21 pass and buy your 21/22 pass before 4/18 you lose your deferral credit.  I mean, come on.  That's a bit harsh.

However, If I can get vaccinated I might take a trip to CA end of april.  Mammoth and Squaw spring skiing would be a nice week.


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## abc (Mar 5, 2021)

NY DirtBag said:


> It actually says on the website that if you deferred your 20/21 pass and buy your 21/22 pass before 4/18 you lose your deferral credit. I mean, come on. That's a bit harsh.


Agree. It sounds cheap.


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## thetrailboss (Mar 5, 2021)

NY DirtBag said:


> I agree it would be nice for Alterra to let us 'buy' on 3/11 and start spring skiing if you have already deferred.  I mean they already have our money and we did lose out on last spring.  Just apply the balance when we buy.  Kind of silly the way they have it setup.
> 
> It actually says on the website that if you deferred your 20/21 pass and buy your 21/22 pass before 4/18 you lose your deferral credit.  I mean, come on.  That's a bit harsh.
> 
> However, If I can get vaccinated I might take a trip to CA end of april.  Mammoth and Squaw spring skiing would be a nice week.


Wow.  That is lame.  I guess I understand the point that, for accounting purposes, one's pass was "inactive" for this season so it is not a renewal as opposed to a new customer, but that seems really harsh.  It just goes to show that the ONLY concern Alterra has is ITS money.  Service is not important.  It's a race to the bottom.


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## thetrailboss (Mar 5, 2021)

abc said:


> Steamboat is limited access only also. So I don't expect it to be on the list. Who would want to blow their days at Steamboat in the spring?
> 
> I didn't realize Copper isn't owned by Alterra. It's unlimited access so I assumed...
> 
> ...


Wow.  I just reviewed the IKON page and you're right.  Copper is listed as unlimited.  That is really weird.  Did POWDR sell it to Alterra?  And, another POWDR Resort, Eldora, is also unlimited.  That is really weird.

I also see that Blue Mountain, ON is unlimited but it does not appear to be an Alterra owned resort.


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## jimmywilson69 (Mar 5, 2021)

maybe Powder is trying to draw in more business to complete with the primarily EPIC summit county.


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## Smellytele (Mar 5, 2021)

jimmywilson69 said:


> maybe Powder is trying to draw in more business to complete with the primarily EPIC summit county.


So are they getting a bigger piece of the kitty to be unlimited then? If not why do it?


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## jimmywilson69 (Mar 5, 2021)

lodging F&B?  I Don't know...  I've never skied Copper, so I can't speak to how crowded it is


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## thetrailboss (Mar 5, 2021)

Smellytele said:


> So are they getting a bigger piece of the kitty to be unlimited then? If not why do it?


Must be.  Despite all the issues with traffic in LCC, I was told that John Cumming "loves" IKON and is making money off of it.  I don't understand how it is working financially.  It would seem to me that compensation from IKON would be less than from a passholder to the mountain.  Apparently POWDR does not care about selling season passes.  That seems like a risk to me.


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## Smellytele (Mar 5, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> Must be.  Despite all the issues with traffic in LCC, I was told that John Cumming "loves" IKON and is making money off of it.  I don't understand how it is working financially.  It would seem to me that compensation from IKON would be less than from a passholder to the mountain.  Apparently POWDR does not care about selling season passes.  That seems like a risk to me.


But would an IKON pass holder buy a season pass to Snowbird or Alta? Someone buying a season pass to those places would still so this is added money unless they are losing season pass holders because of crowding issues.


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## thetrailboss (Mar 5, 2021)

Smellytele said:


> But would an IKON pass holder buy a season pass to Snowbird or Alta? Someone buying a season pass to those places would still so this is added money unless they are losing season pass holders because of crowding issues.


Losing passholders to IKON IS what is happening here in SLC.  That's because a fair number of folks who would normally buy a pass now buy IKON instead.  Which makes you wonder if even then the IKON is making up for that difference.  Apparently it must be.  I say that because I would presume that a passholder would be paying a higher amount to the ski area per skier day than someone who visits 5 or 7 days.


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## Smellytele (Mar 5, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> Losing passholders to IKON IS what is happening here in SLC.  That's because a fair number of folks who would normally buy a pass now buy IKON instead.  Which makes you wonder if even then the IKON is making up for that difference.  Apparently it must be.  I say that because I would presume that a passholder would be paying a higher amount to the ski area per skier day than someone who visits 5 or 7 days.


Is there actual numbers on this or is this what you perceive to be happening?


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## cdskier (Mar 5, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> Wow.  That is lame.  I guess I understand the point that, for accounting purposes, one's pass was "inactive" for this season so it is not a renewal as opposed to a new customer, but that seems really harsh.  It just goes to show that the ONLY concern Alterra has is ITS money.  Service is not important.  It's a race to the bottom.


I somewhat disagree. The rules were that you had until April 11th to choose to defer your pass this year if it was unused. I can understand therefore that they don't wan to allow you to start using a deferred pass prior to that point. They had to make a cut-off. Someone made an argument about losing spring access last year...well everyone did. So that is pretty irrelevant.



thetrailboss said:


> Wow.  I just reviewed the IKON page and you're right.  Copper is listed as unlimited.  That is really weird.  Did POWDR sell it to Alterra?  And, another POWDR Resort, Eldora, is also unlimited.  That is really weird.
> 
> I also see that Blue Mountain, ON is unlimited but it does not appear to be an Alterra owned resort.


Nope, Powdr didn't sell. I'd be interested in knowing the reason as well why they're unlimited. Both Copper and Eldora were unlimited this year as well, so it isn't a change.

As for Blue, it has been an Alterra owned resort since day 1 of Alterra.



thetrailboss said:


> Losing passholders to IKON IS what is happening here in SLC.  That's because a fair number of folks who would normally buy a pass now buy IKON instead.  Which makes you wonder if even then the IKON is making up for that difference.  Apparently it must be.  I say that because I would presume that a passholder would be paying a higher amount to the ski area per skier day than someone who visits 5 or 7 days.



If you have enough people with an unlimited Alta/Bird pass switching to Ikon where they only get 5/7 days, wouldn't that drive down crowds at Alta/Bird (or at least somewhat off-set any increase from Ikon people who weren't Alta/Bird passholders previously)?


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## icecoast1 (Mar 5, 2021)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> As I am considering move from Epic to Ikon - How have crowds at Stratton compared to those at Mt Snow and Okemo? And is it just the Gondola or a subset of lifts or are they all bad?
> 
> Also considering ORDA - presume crowds better at Gore?
> 
> And what is Magic Sunday?


Stratton was the original weekend shitshow in Southern Vermont.  Now Mount Snow is just as bad.  

Magic can be pretty bad at times but tolerable.  Definitely the only place in SO. Vt I'd even consider going on the weekend.  Once they get new black going, that will be a total game changer too


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## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Mar 5, 2021)

icecoast1 said:


> Stratton was the original weekend shitshow in Southern Vermont.  Now Mount Snow is just as bad.
> 
> Magic can be pretty bad at times but tolerable.  Definitely the only place in SO. Vt I'd even consider going on the weekend.  Once they get new black going, that will be a total game changer too


Thanks - I can handle Mt Snow this year so not so concerned - just stay away from base. Plus lines will likely go down next year with less spacing of people on lifts.


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## thetrailboss (Mar 5, 2021)

cdskier said:


> Nope, Powdr didn't sell. I'd be interested in knowing the reason as well why they're unlimited. Both Copper and Eldora were unlimited this year as well, so it isn't a change.
> 
> As for Blue, it has been an Alterra owned resort since day 1 of Alterra.


Good to know.  I did not know anything about Blue.


cdskier said:


> If you have enough people with an unlimited Alta/Bird pass switching to Ikon where they only get 5/7 days, wouldn't that drive down crowds at Alta/Bird (or at least somewhat off-set any increase from Ikon people who weren't Alta/Bird passholders previously)?


One would think that but that's not what we are seeing on the ground.


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## thetrailboss (Mar 5, 2021)

Smellytele said:


> Is there actual numbers on this or is this what you perceive to be happening?


Alterra does not release numbers so we can't say.  That said, anecdotally that is what we are seeing and hearing.  I rode the lift with a long-time DV skier last weekend who said that the biggest change he had seen was that almost everyone who skis DV now is from SLC and has an IKON pass.


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## icecoast1 (Mar 5, 2021)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> Thanks - I can handle Mt Snow this year so not so concerned - just stay away from base. Plus lines will likely go down next year with less spacing of people on lifts.



It's probably going to get worse in terms of lines once travel restrictions ease a bit and more people go.   Chairs will start going up full again but that will be negated by the extra people, although you are probably better off staying there vs going to Stratton


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## machski (Mar 6, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> Wow.  I just reviewed the IKON page and you're right.  Copper is listed as unlimited.  That is really weird.  Did POWDR sell it to Alterra?  And, another POWDR Resort, Eldora, is also unlimited.  That is really weird.
> 
> I also see that Blue Mountain, ON is unlimited but it does not appear to be an Alterra owned resort.


Not really weird.  Alterra looked at their competition (Vail with Epic) in Colorado and realized with only Winter Park on the I-70 close in corridor that would be unlimited (Aspen was always planned as a higher end limited destination and I think still owned by Crowne more than it is Alterra and Steamboat is a bit too far to be considered I-70) they would need more.  So right off the bat, Eldora and Copper were unlimited on Ikon.  Alterra must have cut a deal with Powdr for that type of access, likely a higher revenue flow for that.  But without, I doubt Ikon would have had much interest from the Denver I-70 crowd compared to Epic.  And remember, A-Basin was on Epic and unlimited to boot when Ikon launched.


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## abc (Mar 6, 2021)

machski said:


> Not really weird.  Alterra looked at their competition (Vail with Epic) in Colorado and realized with only Winter Park on the I-70 close in corridor that would be unlimited (Aspen was always planned as a higher end limited destination and I think still owned by Crowne more than it is Alterra and Steamboat is a bit too far to be considered I-70) they would need more.  So right off the bat, Eldora and Copper were unlimited on Ikon.  Alterra must have cut a deal with Powdr for that type of access, likely a higher revenue flow for that.  But without, I doubt Ikon would have had much interest from the Denver I-70 crowd compared to Epic.  And remember, A-Basin was on Epic and unlimited to boot when Ikon launched.


Jeez! That's a really complicated and convoluted way of looking at the Colorado situation. 

The simple fact is, before Alterra came along, there used to be a Rocky Mountain Super Pass Plus, which includes unlimited access to Copper, WP, Eldora, with a 7 day access to Steamboat! Alterra simply took over that which formed the core of is Colorado portfolio.

How do I know? I used to be a RMSP+ holder for many years, until it was discontinued and replaced by IKON. Almost all of my ski buddies in Summit county also hold RMSP+ year after year too.


----------



## Okemo max guy (Mar 8, 2021)

Found this... I was hoping a bit cheaper. Hopefully know more soon and I hope it has IKON full pass opportunity on it


----------



## Tonyr (Mar 9, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> Must be.  Despite all the issues with traffic in LCC, I was told that John Cumming "loves" IKON and is making money off of it.  I don't understand how it is working financially.  It would seem to me that compensation from IKON would be less than from a passholder to the mountain.  Apparently POWDR does not care about selling season passes.  That seems like a risk to me.



I believe alot of revenue comes from hotel stays and dining. Snowbird owns everything on the resort so every dollar spent there benefits them which is why bet they love the crowds.


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## Smellytele (Mar 9, 2021)

Okemo max guy said:


> View attachment 50771Found this... I was hoping a bit cheaper. Hopefully know more soon and I hope it has IKON full pass opportunity on it


My whole family can ski a season for that price - then just Mtn bike on free trails.


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## urungus (Mar 9, 2021)

Smellytele said:


> My whole family can ski a season for that price - then just Mtn bike on free trails.



Hmm where is your family getting free lift-serviced mountain biking ?   Otherwise not really a valid comparison.  You could ski for free too if you “earn your turns”.  Also the Beast pass includes unlimited golf.


----------



## Smellytele (Mar 9, 2021)

urungus said:


> Hmm where is your family getting free lift-serviced mountain biking ?   Otherwise not really a valid comparison.  You could ski for free too if you “earn your turns”.  Also the Beast pass includes unlimited golf.


no lift service Mtn biking but I don't find that fun anyway. half the fun is making it up the hill. How many people actually do lift serve Mtn biking. the times I have tried it there seemed to be no more than 50 people doing it.


----------



## jimmywilson69 (Mar 9, 2021)

I think Killington is rather busy with their Bike Park in the summer. 

The 365 pass is geared towards people who are already using Killington year round (i.e. people who live or have 2nd homes there)


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## abc (Mar 9, 2021)

Smellytele said:


> no lift service Mtn biking but I don't find that fun anyway. half the fun is making it up the hill. How many people actually do lift serve Mtn biking. the times I have tried it there seemed to be no more than 50 people doing it.


You haven't been to Killington or Mt Snow in the summer then.


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## ss20 (Mar 9, 2021)

abc said:


> You haven't been to Killington or Mt Snow in the summer then.



Yeah K and Berkshire East have exploded.  K is running 3 high-speed lifts on the weekends to service riders.


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## jaytrem (Mar 9, 2021)

Mount Snow MTB is a lot quieter than in it's heyday.  Still a decent crowd though.


----------



## drjeff (Mar 9, 2021)

jaytrem said:


> Mount Snow MTB is a lot quieter than in it's heyday.  Still a decent crowd though.


I am curious to see how Vail may choose to operate the Mount Bike scene at Mount Snow going forward. It will likely give some perspective as to how close to "normal" they plan on operating the resort as a whole year round vs scaling back on some things


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## jimmywilson69 (Mar 9, 2021)

Besides whistler, does Vail run a MTB operation anywhere else?


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## Smellytele (Mar 9, 2021)

Only been to loon and SR. SR doesn’t even have it any more. Loon had stopped for a few years as well.


----------



## abc (Mar 9, 2021)

jimmywilson69 said:


> Besides whistler, does Vail run a MTB operation anywhere else?


Mount Snow?


----------



## jimmywilson69 (Mar 9, 2021)

right...  Technically they didn't run that last year.  Or did they?


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Mar 9, 2021)

jimmywilson69 said:


> right...  Technically they didn't run that last year.  Or did they?


I'd not hold it against anyone for not operating a leisure activity in 2020 especially in VT


----------



## ss20 (Mar 9, 2021)

Smellytele said:


> Only been to loon and SR. SR doesn’t even have it any more. Loon had stopped for a few years as well.



Okemo tried for a couple years and crashed and burned...I don't think it even lasted three years.  

Seems like you have to go full-out with the MTB and summer activities or it's not worth it.  But K is absolutely hopping in the summer now compared to 15 years ago.  The GM talks about it pretty often, one of his crowing achievements (even though Nyberg was there for the beginning of it iirc).


----------



## jaytrem (Mar 9, 2021)

Stratton just started lift served again recently (amex lift).  I assume they didn't run it in 2020.  Will be interesting to see if they give it a go again.  

A good percentage of the Southern places I was just at appear to have lift served.  Some fun looking stuff at Bryce...


----------



## NYDB (Mar 9, 2021)

^If you like to downhill MTB alot the beast 365 pass is a good deal.  Otherwise not so much.


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## skiur (Mar 9, 2021)

NY DirtBag said:


> ^If you like to downhill MTB alot the beast 365 pass is a good deal.  Otherwise not so much.


I mean it comes with a ikon base pass.  Even if you rarely use it in the summer it's still got a pretty good winter value.  And K has a lot more than mtb going on in the summer.


----------



## skimagic (Mar 9, 2021)

ss20 said:


> Okemo tried for a couple years and crashed and burned...I don't think it even lasted three years.


 Okemo has been actually building the bike park the last few years, and just put the new Trail off the top in for last season but covid canceled the season


----------



## sull1102 (Mar 9, 2021)

Loon has been building their new park out for a few years with Highland doing the work for them I believe. For now it's been running off of the Seven Brothers Triple, but part of the plan with the Kanc8 is to move the park over there and connect it back over to the Octagon base from the sounds of the Flight Path 2030 stuff. Highland MTB park has grown year after year and is a gem of a park with a great reputation.


----------



## mikec142 (Mar 9, 2021)

Gonna be full Ikon for me.  And $100 cheaper since it's not my first year.  I certainly have gotten my money's worth this season and hope to do so next season as well.


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Mar 10, 2021)

Think Vail is really going to hold off on announcing Epic pass pricing til after people starts purchasing their Ikon passes at midnight tonight?

Hard to see what possible business rationale there could be for that.


----------



## NYDB (Mar 10, 2021)

skiur said:


> I mean it comes with a ikon base pass.  Even if you rarely use it in the summer it's still got a pretty good winter value.  And K has a lot more than mtb going on in the summer.


What else?  

Golf? Course sucks

Scenic gondola rides?

Do they still have alpine slides at Pico?  My kids love those.


----------



## mikec142 (Mar 10, 2021)

Curious, why would I rush to buy my Ikon pass?  Last year I bought it in July.  Is there any advantage to buying it now?  I have the current pass so Spring skiing this year isn't an issue for me.


----------



## Killingtime (Mar 10, 2021)

NY DirtBag said:


> What else?
> 
> Golf? Course sucks
> 
> ...


There is a coaster now on Snowshed along with zip lines and some rope course type of thing that looks like a jungle gym gone wild. They call it an "adventure center". I don't know about last year but the summers there were getting pretty busy before covid.


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Mar 10, 2021)

mikec142 said:


> Curious, why would I rush to buy my Ikon pass?  Last year I bought it in July.  Is there any advantage to buying it now?  I have the current pass so Spring skiing this year isn't an issue for me.


They could raise price at some time (though they will likely provide warning when that nears) and the payment plan is available only for a limited time.


----------



## cdskier (Mar 10, 2021)

mikec142 said:


> Curious, why would I rush to buy my Ikon pass?  Last year I bought it in July.  Is there any advantage to buying it now?  I have the current pass so Spring skiing this year isn't an issue for me.



As long as you buy before the price increases and before any renewal discounts expire, I really see no need to rush. I don't recall exactly when that happened last year, but I do remember emails as the date approached warning of the cut-offs. I'll probably buy it in April just to get it out of the way and paid for.


----------



## skiur (Mar 10, 2021)

Killingtime said:


> There is a coaster now on Snowshed along with zip lines and some rope course type of thing that looks like a jungle gym gone wild. They call it an "adventure center". I don't know about last year but the summers there were getting pretty busy before covid.


Also have the summer nights concert series at the snowshed umbrella bar, the soaring eagle (not exactly sure what that is) trampoline jump, amazen maze, downpour derby (again not sure) water wars, jump tower, alpine tubing, kayaking and paddle board in snowshed pond and whatever the woodward wrecktangle is.


----------



## drjeff (Mar 10, 2021)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> Think Vail is really going to hold off on announcing Epic pass pricing til after people starts purchasing their Ikon passes at midnight tonight?
> 
> Hard to see what possible business rationale there could be for that.


I'm guessing that about 2PM this afternoon (noon at the Mothership in CO) that we see an announcement about next seasons Epic Pass products


----------



## 1dog (Mar 10, 2021)

drjeff said:


> I'm guessing that about 2PM this afternoon (noon at the Mothership in CO) that we see an announcement about next seasons Epic Pass products


Ikon announced as $999 for premium pass/$729 for base pass/$219, 5-12 yr old/ teen pass went up a bit too @$389

Looks like Quad pass ( at Sugarbush) will be replaced with a Session pass for 4 days anywhere Ikon accepted for $399. 
for $2K I can get my 10 yr old and myself a premium and base for a college-bound daughter and 4 days for her Mom. 

Son and I get in 20-30 days so thats $40-$60 a day for both of us. A very good deal in 2022. Deflation in my book.


----------



## 1dog (Mar 10, 2021)

$100 discount for renewal too-


----------



## jimmywilson69 (Mar 10, 2021)

drjeff said:


> I'm guessing that about 2PM this afternoon (noon at the Mothership in CO) that we see an announcement about next seasons Epic Pass products



no dice Dr J  

Katz must be out to a 4 martini lunch


----------



## drjeff (Mar 10, 2021)

jimmywilson69 said:


> no dice Dr J
> 
> Katz must be out to a 4 martini lunch


Must be an Epic lunch!


----------



## xlr8r (Mar 10, 2021)

The Indy Pass has made my choice difficult this off season.  This season I bought the Epic Northeast which was less than $500 with the Covid reimbursement, I and started the season expecting to ski exclusively at the NH Epic Mountains.  But Vail operations quickly became a disaster so I bought the Indy Pass to escape the Epic disfunction.  Since then I have spent more time at and have preferred the Indy Mountains than the Vail ones.  So next year I am definitely getting an Indy Pass, even if it doubles in price.  But I figure that will only cover me for 10-15 days next season when I typically get 20-25 days in a season.  I don't think Epic or Ikon is really worth it if I get less than 10 days on them.  Looks like I might go back to deal hunting next season to supplement the Indy, and just skip Epic and Ikon altogether.


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Mar 10, 2021)

xlr8r said:


> The Indy Pass has made my choice difficult this off season.  This season I bought the Epic Northeast which was less than $500 with the Covid reimbursement, I and started the season expecting to ski exclusively at the NH Epic Mountains.  But Vail operations quickly became a disaster so I bought the Indy Pass to escape the Epic disfunction.  Since then I have spent more time at and have preferred the Indy Mountains than the Vail ones.  So next year I am definitely getting an Indy Pass, even if it doubles in price.  But I figure that will only cover me for 10-15 days next season when I typically get 20-25 days in a season.  I don't think Epic or Ikon is really worth it if I get less than 10 days on them.  Looks like I might go back to deal hunting next season to supplement the Indy, and just skip Epic and Ikon altogether.


Will Indy let you buy more than one pass for yourself?


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## xlr8r (Mar 10, 2021)

No, that would be cheating the system anyway which I will not do.  

I think next season will be very interesting to see if the Epic and to a lesser extent Ikon backlash due to increase crowds continues in the East, or if everything goes back to usual post Covid.


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Mar 10, 2021)

So it is against the rules to do so?


----------



## chuckstah (Mar 10, 2021)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> Will Indy let you buy more than one pass for yourself?


Indy has made it clear an individual CAN purchase 2 passes. I may get one early, then a Spring pass.


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## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Mar 10, 2021)

chuckstah said:


> Indy has made it clear an individual CAN purchase 2 passes. I may get one early, then a Spring pass.


Thanks. Good to know that's an option.
Can't see how it's cheating the system if allowed.


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## Mum skier (Mar 10, 2021)

Jus got the Epic email 10 mins ago. No details, says information coming on 23 March


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## pauldotcom (Mar 10, 2021)

Me2 - says big news.. Hmmm.. Anyone hear rumors?


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## Smellytele (Mar 10, 2021)

chuckstah said:


> Indy has made it clear an individual CAN purchase 2 passes. I may get one early, then a Spring pass.


Wonder if they will have a spring pass next year as I think they did it this year because they added Waterville and Saddleback


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## chuckstah (Mar 10, 2021)

Smellytele said:


> Wonder if they will have a spring pass next year as I think they did it this year because they added Waterville and Saddleback


They had a spring pass last season as well, so probably?  But who knows.....


----------



## pauldotcom (Mar 10, 2021)

So, for $for about $450 you can buy 3 Indy passes and get 6 days at each resort?


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## chuckstah (Mar 10, 2021)

pauldotcom said:


> So, for $for about $450 you can buy 3 Indy passes and get 6 days at each resort?


Right now at spring pricing probably. I know you can get 2. Not sure about 3? Doug Fish will answer inquiries quickly.


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## pauldotcom (Mar 10, 2021)

Oh, $149 is spring price.. Gotcha.  What is normal price?


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## KustyTheKlown (Mar 10, 2021)

$199 but i wouldn't be at all surprised for it to be at least $100 more next season. proof of concept seems to have succeeded bigly


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## 2planks2coasts (Mar 10, 2021)

xlr8r said:


> The Indy Pass has made my choice difficult this off season.  This season I bought the Epic Northeast which was less than $500 with the Covid reimbursement, I and started the season expecting to ski exclusively at the NH Epic Mountains.  But Vail operations quickly became a disaster so I bought the Indy Pass to escape the Epic disfunction.  Since then I have spent more time at and have preferred the Indy Mountains than the Vail ones.  So next year I am definitely getting an Indy Pass, even if it doubles in price.  But I figure that will only cover me for 10-15 days next season when I typically get 20-25 days in a season.  I don't think Epic or Ikon is really worth it if I get less than 10 days on them.  Looks like I might go back to deal hunting next season to supplement the Indy, and just skip Epic and Ikon altogether.



Maybe consider adding a Ski Cooper pass to your Indy? It's usually very well priced at initial offer. That would bring you to 5 days at Black and add 3 at Dartmouth, Whaleback and little Mcintyre in NH as well as a bunch of NY and PA places. Out west it provides options in areas that Indy doesn't, particularly Colorado and Tahoe


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## pauldotcom (Mar 10, 2021)

Would love to see MRG on there! So, normally, can you buy 2 passes and use them?


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## abc (Mar 10, 2021)

But the Indy isn't a "season pass" per se. It's really more a pre-purchase pack of tickets. Is it not? (Same with MCP)


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## machski (Mar 10, 2021)

KustyTheKlown said:


> $199 but i wouldn't be at all surprised for it to be at least $100 more next season. proof of concept seems to have succeeded bigly


I read/heard somewhere it is definitely going to be more next year.  Almost has to with all the added areas on it.


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## 2planks2coasts (Mar 10, 2021)

abc said:


> But the Indy isn't a "season pass" per se. It's really more a pre-purchase pack of tickets. Is it not? (Same with MCP)


It's certainly possible to view it as a "season pass" in that it provides a seasons worth of skiing, even if only twice at each mountain.  This year in the NE, with the SB and Stratton off limits to many, the Ikon was functionally the same, but with 7 (or 5 for Ikon base) at each mountain.


----------



## abc (Mar 10, 2021)

2planks2coasts said:


> It's certainly possible to view it as a "season pass" in that it provides a seasons worth of skiing, even if only twice at each mountain.  This year in the NE, with the SB and Stratton off limits to many, the Ikon was functionally the same, but with 7 (or 5 for Ikon base) at each mountain.


You could also by 4-packs and "passes" like that from some of the mountains. Are those "season pass"?


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## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Mar 10, 2021)

I would not view it as a season pass but I think it is close enough that it warrants being discussed in this thread as a relevant option


----------



## 2planks2coasts (Mar 10, 2021)

abc said:


> You could also by 4-packs and "passes" like that from some of the mountains. Are those "season pass"?


If you buy enough of those to provide a seasons worth of skiing, sure.  Buying say 60 days of of 4 packs at any given mountain is likely to cost you far more than the 126 days of skiing you get by buying the IndyPass


----------



## cdskier (Mar 10, 2021)

2planks2coasts said:


> If you buy enough of those to provide a seasons worth of skiing, sure.  Buying say 60 days of of 4 packs at any given mountain is likely to cost you far more than the 126 days of skiing you get by buying the IndyPass



That's a rather silly comparison. First of all, if you were going to go for 60 days via 4 packs to one mountain, you're better off getting a real season pass to that mountain.

Secondly, how many people are using anywhere near the 126 days of potential skiing offered by the Indy Pass? Realistically most people are using it for a handful of resorts in a given region with maybe a trip or two to a couple resorts in another region in an ideal scenario (which still offers a great value). I don't see most people using more than maybe about 2 dozen days on the Indy Pass. That's still cheaper than 6 4 packs would be to ski that same number of days, but it really comes down to what resorts and how many days at each resort someone wants to ski. To me, the Indy Pass is not a true viable option as a stand-alone "season pass". It needs to be coupled with something else to realistically get a "season" worth of skiing (I define a season as 40+ days personally).


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Mar 10, 2021)

Indy Pass strikes me as closer to a national version of the Pocono Ski & Ride card I used to get each year before I started getting season passes. It gave 1 day at each of 6 PA mts (including 3-4 worth skiing), and I would buy a bunch of the cards every year.


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## 2planks2coasts (Mar 10, 2021)

cdskier said:


> That's a rather silly comparison. First of all, if you were going to go for 60 days via 4 packs to one mountain, you're better off getting a real season pass to that mountain.
> 
> Secondly, how many people are using anywhere near the 126 days of potential skiing offered by the Indy Pass? Realistically most people are using it for a handful of resorts in a given region with maybe a trip or two to a couple resorts in another region in an ideal scenario (which still offers a great value). I don't see most people using more than maybe about 2 dozen days on the Indy Pass. That's still cheaper than 6 4 packs would be to ski that same number of days, but it really comes down to what resorts and how many days at each resort someone wants to ski. To me, the Indy Pass is not a true viable option as a stand-alone "season pass". It needs to be coupled with something else to realistically get a "season" worth of skiing (I define a season as 40+ days personally).


Of course it's a silly comparison.  Buying that many 4 packs would likely cost more than that mountains season pass.  The IndyPass can indeed be a standalone pass for many people. I travel 6 months of the year for work.  Indy gets me far more skiing than a single mountain pass would.  Especially since you can buy two which puts you close to Ikon base territory ski day wise,(4 days vs 5) but is substantially cheaper. 

If you need your days to be at a single mountain, no, it obviously doesn't work.  For many, it does.


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Mar 10, 2021)

Seems to me the best way to use an Indy pass is in conjunction with an affordable one mountain pass (for me it would be Montage in PA if I were to do that). But with Montage being $399, it is doubtful that combo would beat price of Epic/Ikon by enough to make it worth spending lots of time going from NJ to resorts that are either real far, or at least further than some places I'd rather ski. Really only Magic, Jay and Cannon are places that seem worth the drives from Central NJ - and Jay and Cannon are real long drives.

Might use Shawnee too just cause it's so close. But it's not very thrilling Mt and I got bored of it the 2 years I took full advantage of their "kids ski free" policy


----------



## 2planks2coasts (Mar 11, 2021)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> Seems to me the best way to use an Indy pass is in conjunction with an affordable one mountain pass (for me it would be Montage in PA if I were to do that). But with Montage being $399, it is doubtful that combo would beat price of Epic/Ikon by enough to make it worth spending lots of time going from NJ to resorts that are either real far, or at least further than some places I'd rather ski. Really only Magic, Jay and Cannon are places that seem worth the drives from Central NJ - and Jay and Cannon are real long drives.
> 
> Might use Shawnee too just cause it's so close. But it's not very thrilling Mt and I got bored of it the 2 years I took full advantage of their "kids ski free" policy


The single mountain pass plus Indy combo seems to work for lots of folks.  If you have a season pass at a participating mountain, you can get an IndyPass at a pretty substantial discount.  I think it was $129 this year. Guessing $200ish for next season.


----------



## gladerider (Mar 11, 2021)

1dog said:


> $100 discount for renewal too-


do you know if the discount is for anyone who had a pass before or only for those who had the 20/21 pass? 
i had the 19/20 pass but didn't renew it for this season.


----------



## mikec142 (Mar 11, 2021)

gladerider said:


> do you know if the discount is for anyone who had a pass before or only for those who had the 20/21 pass?
> i had the 19/20 pass but didn't renew it for this season.


99% sure it's for 20/21 pass holders.


----------



## cdskier (Mar 11, 2021)

gladerider said:


> do you know if the discount is for anyone who had a pass before or only for those who had the 20/21 pass?
> i had the 19/20 pass but didn't renew it for this season.


From the wording on their website, it sounds like just current 20/21 Ikon passholders.


----------



## gladerider (Mar 11, 2021)

that's what i thought. thanks


----------



## KustyTheKlown (Mar 11, 2021)

did everyone just get an email from ikon about adventure assurance credits being in our accounts in April? i don't think i qualify under the program, and am wondering if every passholder got this email. my credit is prob $0? i don't remember if i picked sugarbush or all destinations.


----------



## mikec142 (Mar 11, 2021)

KustyTheKlown said:


> did everyone just get an email from ikon about adventure assurance credits being in our accounts in April? i don't think i qualify under the program, and am wondering if every passholder got this email. my credit is prob $0? i don't remember if i picked sugarbush or all destinations.


I just got that email.  I picked All Destinations.  I totally forgot about it.  I don't recall exactly how it's calculated.  But I thought it was something like this...assume 43 destinations and 100 days per place so 4300 ski days.  If 430 total ski days were not available that would be 10% and you'd get that in a credit.

I could easily be wrong as I have almost zero recollection of the math.  But either way, even if I get $1 I'd be pretty pumped as I'm already getting $100 discount over what I paid this year for renewing.


----------



## cdskier (Mar 11, 2021)

KustyTheKlown said:


> did everyone just get an email from ikon about adventure assurance credits being in our accounts in April? i don't think i qualify under the program, and am wondering if every passholder got this email. my credit is prob $0? i don't remember if i picked sugarbush or all destinations.


Nope...didn't get anything. If you picked all destinations though, then you should see a small credit. Wasn't Blue in Canada closed for a while due to all Ontario ski resorts being closed?

FWIW...I specifically chose Sugarbush so wouldn't qualify for anything related to the Blue closure.


----------



## jaytrem (Mar 11, 2021)

I got this even though I was not a Winter Park passholder.  I was Ikon for 19/20, but did not renew....


YOUR ADVENTURE ASSURANCE CREDIT IS ON THE WAY​Thank you for being a Winter Park Pass Holder. Your 20/21 Adventure Assurance election qualifies you for a credit towards the purchase of a 21/22 Winter Park Pass. Click here to find out the full details.

*Beginning April 19*, your Adventure Assurance credit will be deposited in 'My Account' and you can use your credit to renew your Winter Park Pass for the 21/22 season.​


----------



## KustyTheKlown (Mar 11, 2021)

cdskier said:


> Nope...didn't get anything. If you picked all destinations though, then you should see a small credit. Wasn't Blue in Canada closed for a while due to all Ontario ski resorts being closed?
> 
> FWIW...I specifically chose Sugarbush so wouldn't qualify for anything related to the Blue closure.



interesting. so i guess i chose all destinations, and the email only went out to people who will actually get some sort of credit.


----------



## jaytrem (Mar 11, 2021)

Looks like $50 off if you had Ikon in the past.  Just got this email...

*Ikon Pass is now on sale for the 21/22 season*. Because you owned an Ikon Pass in past seasons, you’ve been given an exclusive offer. Save up to $50 off every Ikon Pass you purchase for the 21/22 season.

Update: did a quick test, I qualify for $50 off the full, $40 off the base, $0 off the base plus.  The $0 off the base plus is a bit odd.


----------



## cdskier (Mar 11, 2021)

KustyTheKlown said:


> interesting. so i guess i chose all destinations, and the email only went out to people who will actually get some sort of credit.


So much for that...NOW I just got the e-mail so I guess they're sending them to everyone but just not all at once. At the bottom of the e-mail it does list what you chose for your coverage and mine lists Sugarbush as the destination. Therefore even though I got the e-mail, I expect to receive $0 (and that's fine with me).


----------



## NYDB (Mar 11, 2021)

Yeah I got the adventure assurance email and I deferred so.....


----------



## kendo (Mar 12, 2021)

Katz wants to sell lot of short-term passes. 

_"As he has for some time, Katz focused on the company’s various pass programs as a way to bring financial stability to a largely seasonal product. Katz said shorter-term passes can move people from spur-of-the-moment trips to more planned mountain adventures."_









						Vail Resorts reports losses in second quarter
					

While skier numbers have mostly held firm, other aspects of Vail Resorts’ skiing business have been hit hard so far this season.




					www.vaildaily.com


----------



## kendo (Mar 12, 2021)

I'm surprised Epic doesn't sell "FastPass" access like Disney and others.


----------



## jimmywilson69 (Mar 12, 2021)

you should delete that post immediately...


----------



## kendo (Mar 12, 2021)

jimmywilson69 said:


> you should delete that post immediately...


... thought that might get a reaction!

I'm sure they've considered what percentage of pass holders would pay a premium to ensure vacation or weekend access.


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## Smellytele (Mar 12, 2021)

kendo said:


> ... thought that might get a reaction!
> 
> I'm sure they've considered what percentage of pass holders would pay a premium to ensure vacation or weekend access.


Some areas do sell early access or grant it to season pass holders.


----------



## abc (Mar 12, 2021)

kendo said:


> ... thought that might get a reaction!
> 
> I'm sure they've considered what percentage of pass holders would pay a premium to ensure vacation or weekend access.


Given they sell far more limited passes than full passes, that would suggest demand for "premium" passes would be relatively low.

That said, I know someone who would buy it at an instant


----------



## KustyTheKlown (Mar 12, 2021)

"we lost money in Q2" > stock climbs 10% after-market. okkkkkk


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Mar 12, 2021)

abc said:


> Given they sell far more limited passes than full passes, that would suggest demand for "premium" passes would be relatively low.
> 
> That said, I know someone who would buy it at an instant


I think a lot of people who ski largely weekends / holidays due to job issues would pay extra for a pass that gave access to a VIP lift line. I wouldn't blink at spending an extra $100 per pass for our 3 passes for that. If I get in 40 days a year that is $2.50/day/person to spend at least an hour less standing in line.


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## 2planks2coasts (Mar 12, 2021)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> I think a lot of people who ski largely weekends / holidays due to job issues would pay extra for a pass that gave access to a VIP lift line. I wouldn't blink at spending an extra $100 per pass for our 3 passes for that. If I get in 40 days a year that is $2.50/day/person to spend at least an hour less standing in line.



You're correct. That's the problem though. As you say, "a lot" would pay for that access. A lot of people using the VIP line reduces its value significantly.


----------



## KustyTheKlown (Mar 12, 2021)

its also a pretty big turn off to the common folk who don't splurge. just add it to the pile of vail turn offs.


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## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Mar 12, 2021)

Blue Mt in PA has a VIP line for all their passholders. It used to help a lot but I understand with reduced chair capacity it has gotten swamped too and no longer that helpful.


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## abc (Mar 12, 2021)

2planks2coasts said:


> You're correct. That's the problem though. As you say, "a lot" would pay for that access. A lot of people using the VIP line reduces its value significantly.


But that's great for Vail. Offer a "premium pass" that cost extra. A good portion of the pass holders will gladly pony up the extra. But then, the VIP lines got just as long. Too late, Vail already got your money! 

Isn't that what the "reservation system" did? Some of the people who otherwise not buy a pass probably bought it because they want to be sure they get to ski at all.


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## Smellytele (Mar 12, 2021)

Someone mentioned Disney. Isn’t Disney fast pass free? and allows you to book times on rides not just by pass lines when you feel like it.


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## PAabe (Mar 12, 2021)

Fast lane at Hersheypark is infuriating and makes me wish I was at Knoebels every time I'm there fwiw.  Customers don't like being treated like plebs.  Even if financials make sense in the short term, does it turn off repeat business in the long term?  I assume people have done studies on this and assume it sadly makes sense for the places that do it.


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## jimmywilson69 (Mar 12, 2021)

when I went to Cedar Pointe I bought the cut the line priveldges.  I'd do it again too.  I'm not waiting in a 2 or 3 hour line to ride a roller coaster. 

I don't think that model works all that well with skiing though...   again maybe I'd buy it for a vacation  but so might everyone else!


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## Zermatt (Mar 12, 2021)

KustyTheKlown said:


> interesting. so i guess i chose all destinations, and the email only went out to people who will actually get some sort of credit.


I picked Stratton and got the email too. I don't recall them closing due to Covid unless their late opening counted somehow.


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## bizarrefaith (Mar 12, 2021)

2planks2coasts said:


> You're correct. That's the problem though. As you say, "a lot" would pay for that access. A lot of people using the VIP line reduces its value significantly.



The premium fee for line-cutting already exists in the form of private lessons at a lot of resorts. If they did a VIP line access type ticket product, no way it would be $100 extra a year or anything close to that.


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## bizarrefaith (Mar 12, 2021)

Smellytele said:


> Someone mentioned Disney. Isn’t Disney fast pass free? and allows you to book times on rides not just by pass lines when you feel like it.


Yeah the line cutting perk at Disney is the VIP tours, which are several hundred dollars _per hour, _with 6-7 hour minimums and do not include park tickets (which you still need). The single day cost of the line cutting experience at Disney is like $2K+.


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## Zermatt (Mar 12, 2021)

bizarrefaith said:


> The premium fee for line-cutting already exists in the form of private lessons at a lot of resorts. If they did a VIP line access type ticket product, no way it would be $100 extra a year or anything close to that.


VIP lines just piss people off. Even ski school cutting lines makes me mad. That product simply does not exist in Europe, probably because anybody can just cut the line.

I'm a bigger fan of early access. That seems like the better trade off. I paid for early access at Steamboat in February and timed it perfectly with an overnight snow storm.  Banged out a few great runs before the mountain opened them was in prime position to access the rest of the mountain when they dropped the ropes up high.


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## dblskifanatic (Mar 12, 2021)

My wife just pulled the trigger on A Basin Military Pass which includes dependents.  steep jump in price but worth it still  - went from $179 to $299 but are going to reduce the number of passes by 10%.  E/ven though we are now in Boston, we plan on making several trips out west.

Going to consider something local to NE but have not decided yet.


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## Zand (Mar 15, 2021)

Not sure if someone posted it already but just saw in an email that 21-22 Ragged passes are $359. I'm sticking with Ikon and Indy so no need for me to get that, but hell of a deal regardless.


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## drjeff (Mar 16, 2021)

bizarrefaith said:


> The premium fee for line-cutting already exists in the form of private lessons at a lot of resorts. If they did a VIP line access type ticket product, no way it would be $100 extra a year or anything close to that.



Agree 100%.  

The fee for coaching AND line cutting on most lifts at Mount Snow that my daughter gets to do with her race training is just over 2k per year, which is around triple to what her Epic pass cost.

If EPIC was to offer a "premium" pass with a "VIP" line, and I doubt they will, my hunch is the price point would be far closer to double what the non VIP lane Epic pass would be, and far greater than the $100 that was thrown into the mix in this thread.


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## ss20 (Mar 16, 2021)

iirc Killington tried offering a line-cutting pass and it only lasted a month or so before the backlash became too great and they nix'd it mid-season.


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## dblskifanatic (Mar 16, 2021)

ss20 said:


> iirc Killington tried offering a line-cutting pass and it only lasted a month or so before the backlash became too great and they nix'd it mid-season.


It was like $199 in addition to the pass price.  I would imagine that stopping something like that mid season would required some sort of refund.


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## Dickc (Mar 16, 2021)

ss20 said:


> iirc Killington tried offering a line-cutting pass and it only lasted a month or so before the backlash became too great and they nix'd it mid-season.


I believe about 2-3 years ago Sunday River tried much the same thing.,  If I recall correctly it lasted one day as the uproar was YUUUUUGGGGGEEE!


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## abc (Mar 16, 2021)

It just occurred to me the IKON spring benefit dates seem to be around the time when the Vail resorts planned closing dates. 

Or was those similar dates in years past?


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## jaytrem (Mar 16, 2021)

abc said:


> It just occurred to me the IKON spring benefit dates seem to be around the time when the Vail resorts planned closing dates.
> 
> Or was those similar dates in years past?


I think 2 years ago the pass was valid a little earlier then this year at most places.  Probably not covid related since that was the plan for last year before things got shut down.  Worked great for Squaw and Mammoth at the end of the 18/19 season.  I know I used it at Squaw on April 14, 2019, and I'm pretty sure it wasn't one of the first days possible.

Here we go, info from end of 18/19...

Spring skiing is available immediately after purchase at Big Bear Mountain Resort, Blue Mountain and Snowshoe. Spring skiing is available starting April 8, 2019 at Winter Park Resort, Squaw Valley Alpine Meadows, Mammoth Mountain, Crystal Mountain, Solitude and Tremblant.


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## dblskifanatic (Mar 16, 2021)

Zand said:


> Not sure if someone posted it already but just saw in an email that 21-22 Ragged passes are $359. I'm sticking with Ikon and Indy so no need for me to get that, but hell of a deal regardless.



It is a good deal but Ragged gets old quickly.  If I lived close to it.  That might make sense.  We used to live in Andover NH and we skied there all the time.


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## thetrailboss (Mar 16, 2021)

ss20 said:


> iirc Killington tried offering a line-cutting pass and it only lasted a month or so before the backlash became too great and they nix'd it mid-season.


That’s POWDR for you.


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## ss20 (Mar 16, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> That’s POWDR for you.



I mean...they DID resolve the issue...same with re-implementing May skiing at K, putting the South Ridge chair back, rolling back the scale/scope of the parking reservations (now only required on Saturday's).  

Honestly I hear mostly positive reviews about Powdr.  Yeah there's flaws but they're a pretty damn reliable company.  They totally 180'd at K the past decade and the mountain has new life.  Never heard anything bad about Copper, tons of investment there.  Doesn't Snowbird have like 5 new lifts in 15ish years?  Eldora is expanding or recently expanded iirc.


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## skiur (Mar 17, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> That’s POWDR for you.


Show me on the puppet where mr powdr touched you.


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## jimmywilson69 (Mar 17, 2021)




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## machski (Mar 18, 2021)

Storm Skiing Podcast seemed to indicate Vail may be shifting Epic passes to a subscription model like Killington's Beast365 pass (BTW, they added a Pico subscription pass that is cheaper, gives 4 any days at Killington and ALL of Killington's summer access but no Ikon Base for I think $80/month).  We should know soon on Epics but if they are altering the model, that is probably why they are delayed this year.


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## jimmywilson69 (Mar 18, 2021)

I really only think the subscription model works if you have good summer activities and live close enough to use them.


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## cdskier (Mar 18, 2021)

jimmywilson69 said:


> I really only think the subscription model works if you have good summer activities and live close enough to use them.



Agreed. I'm inclined to say it is a rather low percentage of skiers that also would take advantage of summer activities at the mountains on their ski pass.


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## PAabe (Mar 18, 2021)

I am not going to pay to go to a ski area to do anything in the summer when I can hike, bike, blade, and paddle right near my house for free


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## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Mar 18, 2021)

If Montage did a pass that was good for admission to their summer concert series I'd bite - once there are concerts again


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## KustyTheKlown (Mar 18, 2021)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> If Montage did a pass that was good for admission to their summer concert series I'd bite - once there are concerts again



beware camp bisco 

my favorite band hosts and plays 6 sets, but the rest of the line up and the crowd are AWFUL

peachfest, on the other hand, very chill all around, great hamband scene, allmans and dead derivatives all day. occasional troy anastasio appearances.


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## PAabe (Mar 18, 2021)

Yo if Montage by some miracle got on Indy Pass, Montage+Indy would be a killer eastern PA/NJ offering


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## ss20 (Mar 24, 2021)

*Epic Pass 2021-2022: All pass prices reduced by 20%*



			https://www.epicpass.com/pass-results/passes.aspx
		



Full Epic= $783
Epic Local- $583

Full Ikon- $999
Ikon Base- $729


Vail Resorts are going to be absolutely insane next year with this kind of pricing.  All the local prices are reduced 20% as well. $200 difference is gonna sway a lot of causal skiers from Ikon to Epic.


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## NYDB (Mar 24, 2021)

More fights at Carinthia!


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## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Mar 24, 2021)

Same prices as what they offered for 20-21 in light of minimum 20% credit offered to all who were renewing. From my perspective the only meaningful difference is they are capping Stowe days at 10 on local pass. Are they keeping reservation system?


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## jimmywilson69 (Mar 24, 2021)

they've said numerous times no reservations


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## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Mar 24, 2021)

Thanks - that will make it easier to go where the snow and weather is best which is a key feature of multi mt passes.  





jimmywilson69 said:


> they've said numerous times no reservations


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## Zermatt (Mar 24, 2021)

Ikon counters by raising pass prices by 20% to make skiing suck less?


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## LonghornSkier (Mar 24, 2021)

As others have pointed out (and as someone who works in consumer products), it's all about the "average retail price." Given the discounts that Vail gave out last season, I would guess that Vail is actually moving their ARP upward, ever so slightly.


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## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Mar 24, 2021)

LonghornSkier said:


> As others have pointed out (and as someone who works in consumer products), it's all about the "average retail price." Given the discounts that Vail gave out last season, I would guess that Vail is actually moving their ARP upward, ever so slightly.


Definitely true for renewers


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## SenorQuesadilla (Mar 24, 2021)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> Same prices as what they offered for 20-21 in light of minimum 20% credit offered to all who were renewing. From my perspective the only meaningful difference is they are capping Stowe days at 10 on local pass. Are they keeping reservation system?


You're seeing Stowe is capped at 10 days on Epic Local?


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## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Mar 24, 2021)

SenorQuesadilla said:


> You're seeing Stowe is capped at 10 days on Epic Local?


My mistake that is Epic Northeast


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## dblskifanatic (Mar 24, 2021)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> Same prices as what they offered for 20-21 in light of minimum 20% credit offered to all who were renewing. From my perspective the only meaningful difference is they are capping Stowe days at 10 on local pass. Are they keeping reservation system?


They are not keeping the reservation system!


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## thebigo (Mar 29, 2021)

Anyone know when the Ikon price goes up? Cannot find anything on their website.


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## cdskier (Mar 29, 2021)

thebigo said:


> Anyone know when the Ikon price goes up? Cannot find anything on their website.


I heard May 5th mentioned somewhere recently. Maybe it was the Storm Skiing podcast episode with Rusty? Although I haven't seen anything official in e-mail or on their website yet.


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## xwhaler (Mar 29, 2021)

Cannon NH Resident + Indy Passes for my family of 4 (2 adults, boys ages 8 and 5)


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## 2planks2coasts (Mar 29, 2021)

xwhaler said:


> Cannon NH Resident + Indy Passes for my family of 4 (2 adults, boys ages 8 and 5)



Mine will likely be something like this.  Right now torn between the Cannon NH resident and the Bold & Beautiful (weekdays at Cannon and Bretton Woods).  

B&B is cheaper and I mostly ski midweek anyway.  I make fun of Bretton Woods, but it's certainly a pleasant place to ski. It also has much nicer lodge facilities for my non-skiing partner to sit in and work/drink while I ski, assuming that's a thing again next season.

Cannon NH resident qualifies for the IndyPass discount and should I desire to brave the weekend crowds, the option is there.

Still on the fence about renewing Ikon base as a third pass.  It's dirt cheap with both Nurse and renewal discounts, but I barely broke even on it this year.  VT being open next year does up the value proposition.


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## snoseek (Mar 29, 2021)

2planks2coasts said:


> Mine will likely be something like this.  Right now torn between the Cannon NH resident and the Bold & Beautiful (weekdays at Cannon and Bretton Woods).
> 
> B&B is cheaper and I mostly ski midweek anyway.  I make fun of Bretton Woods, but it's certainly a pleasant place to ski. It also has much nicer lodge facilities for my non-skiing partner to sit in and work/drink while I ski, assuming that's a thing again next season.
> 
> ...


Can the bold and beautiful pass qualify for an indy add on? I'd so that's tempting to me. I do like hero laps at bretton woods and the snow can get real nice there.


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## 2planks2coasts (Mar 29, 2021)

snoseek said:


> Can the bold and beautiful pass qualify for an indy add on? I'd so that's tempting to me. I do like hero laps at bretton woods and the snow can get real nice there.


I don't think so.  This year the text on the Indy website said a "full unlimited pass" was required for the discount.  That said , the indy discount was only $70 this season and the B&B is $116 cheaper than the NH resident unlimited.


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## Edd (Mar 29, 2021)

Crap, B&B is sounding good next year to me also. I’m all over the place with what I want for passes. Usually more decisive.


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## snoseek (Mar 29, 2021)

I do like to skiing cannon in the morning and BW in the afternoon. Sip a beer on the drive between the two as long as I'm under the limit lol.


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## thebigo (Mar 30, 2021)

Had settled on ragged and ikon base but the more i think about it, boyne blackout plus ragged works better. Kids will do seasonal program at Ragged. I can get two april school vacation weeks at SL. Several weekend days this april at SR, early season next year at SR. Can easily day trip loon all the snow days, teacher workshop days and midweek NH february vacation. Only thing you lose is k next may, I will worry about that then.

Boyne is more expensive than Ikon, especially the kid pass; if we have learned anything this year, you get what you pay for.


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## da-bum (Apr 1, 2021)

Did they have the 20% discount on EPIC pass last season?  I was awaiting for the early closure credit for the Peak pass and didn't start looking at passes until July (and couldn't purchase until Sept), so I don't know if there were super early purchase discounts.


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## thebigo (Apr 1, 2021)

They gave a credit based on number of days. It started at 20% and went up to something around 80% for unused passes. It was effectively a loyalty discount, this year they said screw loyalty and gave it to everyone.


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## snoseek (Apr 1, 2021)

hell they gave me 10 percent for this years pass and I had not help and epic in a few winters.


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## Edd (Apr 1, 2021)

snoseek said:


> hell they gave me 10 percent for this years pass and I had not help and epic in a few winters.


Yeah I got a bonkers discount that I still don’t understand. Veteran’s Pass cost something like $300 or so. Maybe less. I was a Peak pass holder the previous year making it more surprising.


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## snoseek (Apr 1, 2021)

Edd said:


> Yeah I got a bonkers discount that I still don’t understand. Veteran’s Pass cost something like $300 or so. Maybe less. I was a Peak pass holder the previous year making it more surprising.


At that price it would have been crazy to say no. Mine with the vet discount and 10 percent was a bit over 500 which was good enough to pull me back in


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## dblskifanatic (Apr 2, 2021)

snoseek said:


> At that price it would have been crazy to say no. Mine with the vet discount and 10 percent was a bit over 500 which was good enough to pull me back in



so they were kind of doing the same thing last year but 10% instead of 20% - well then overall Vail gave most renewals 20% and non renewals 10%  then the 20% for everyone is not that big of a deal except for the extra 100,000 extra people they pick up.


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## ThatGuy (Apr 3, 2021)

Seems the Indy Pass is going to have a price increase and even more ski areas added.

“While the Indy Pass is still just a blip on the national scene, we are making huge strides and will continue to add quality resorts in all regions of North America, grow our passholder base, and continue to offer the best multi-mountain pass value on the planet.

We hope you've enjoyed the ride and will continue to support us next season. We will announce our 2021-22 pricing and some exciting resort additions on April 27th and I promise you won't be disappointed. While we can't promise that prices won't increase a bit, we are doing everything we can to pack more value than expected into your Indy Pass.”


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## Zand (Apr 3, 2021)

Maybe they'll do a MC type thing where you can get an extra day at a resort of your choice?


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## PAabe (Apr 3, 2021)

For the "exciting resort additions," Money on MRG, Smuggs, and/or Plattekill? Maybe Sunlight or Cooper in CO?  Personally my fingers are crossed for another flatland place like Montage.

Awaiting the 27th with great interest


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## snoseek (Apr 3, 2021)

They can up the price a bit...especially if they got something like MRG or Smuggs.


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## sull1102 (Apr 4, 2021)

Indy Pass for $300 plus the Boyne pass for under $400 is a great combo. For Boston based folks you get Loon for day trips, SR for a couple longer multi day trips out of Boyne and then you get Waterville, Cannon, Pats Peak(if you have youngins) for day trips still and Jay Peak plus Saddleback for a possible weekend away. Admittedly, the Indy at $260 was a no brainer for me because I know I will find four days between just WV and Cannon for the $65 per day. Having been a Loon passholder this season it would have been nice to spice things up a bit for a day trip. At $300 the Indy is a hell of a lot harder because you kind of need to find that 5th day at say Jay Peak or Magic or Saddleback to make it worth it. Oh the first world struggles of a skier these days....


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## KustyTheKlown (Apr 5, 2021)

i would probably still buy indy, with no new resorts, up to $400ish

i used 2 magic, 2 bolton, 2 jay + 25% off 3rd day, 1 cannon, 1 berkshire east. and if not for the shitty abrupt end of season, i'd have used the second days at cannon and berkshire, and both saddleback. in that use case of 12 days, at $400 its $33 a day. still a great deal.

i could also see myself checking out catamount and greek peak if the situation were right for it.


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## Newpylong (Apr 6, 2021)

Despite a hefty jump, (but still being only at $349), we pulled the trigger on another year at Ragged a few hours from the deadline.

While still cheaper than the rest of the pack, they have gone up $10-20 per year, and up 17%+ this year since "Mission Affordable" (ie the $249 pass) was created 5 years ago. I suspect they are trying to find a price point where demand tapers off, which my hunch is a couple more hundred by the time it's all said and done. They put out one hell of a product this year so I suspect sales will be through the roof.

At some point we will likely punch out (almost did this year) as the break even goes up higher and we spend more time in Maine at Saddleback, etc.


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## dblskifanatic (Apr 6, 2021)

So I saw an ad on FB for WMSP.  I was surprised at the price of $1099.  We like Cannon, but not a fan of Cranmore or Waterville Valley but have not been there since they added Green Peak.  Bretton Woods is great for cruising but not a big fan of that either.  I used to get the Cannon pass for sub $300 so probably why I do not understand the pricing in todays mega pass world.


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## urungus (Apr 6, 2021)

dblskifanatic said:


> So I saw an ad on FB for WMSP.  I was surprised at the price of $1099.  We like Cannon, but not a fan of Cranmore or Waterville Valley but have not been there since they added Green Peak.  Bretton Woods is great for cruising but not a big fan of that either.  I used to get the Cannon pass for sub $300 so probably why I do not understand the pricing in todays mega pass world.



If you don’t like any of the other mountains, maybe a cheaper Cannon-only pass would be better for you.   But Cannon-only pass hasnt been $300 for several decades, according to https://www.newenglandskihistory.com/NewHampshire/cannonmtn.php


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## dblskifanatic (Apr 6, 2021)

urungus said:


> If you don’t like any of the other mountains, maybe a cheaper Cannon-only pass would be better for you.   But Cannon-only pass hasnt been $300 for several decades, according to https://www.newenglandskihistory.com/NewHampshire/cannonmtn.php



I used to get the Cannon NH Veterans pass which is still sub 300 by a dollar!  We already bought the Epic Pass.


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## machski (Apr 6, 2021)

Well, if you plan to go to Big Sky for 21-22 with your Ikon, Mountain Collective or Boyne NEP Gold or Platinum (or just buy day tickets) and intend to ski off the top of Lone Peak using the tram, bring your wallet.  It's not free or part of the vast majority of pass/ticket products at BS any longer:








						Season Pass Letter from Big Sky Resort
					

Read a message from Big Sky Resort General Manager, Troy Nedved, reflecting on this season and looking forward to the winter of 2021-22.




					bigskyresort.com
				




My guess is the $$ from this goes straight into the Tram Upgrade account.  Still, the stated goal is to make the tram line 30 minutes on average.  So I might pay $80 and still wind up with a 45 minute line?  That is nuts.


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## NYDB (Apr 6, 2021)

Or you could wind up in the clouds with a zero viz day or wind up with avi control 1/2 the day.    I guess details are still to come though so we'll see how it works out


----------



## Zand (Apr 6, 2021)

I guess doing the auto pay thing would be easy enough. I'd pay $20 to get up there with a shorter line. Definitely not $80 though...


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## machski (Apr 6, 2021)

Zand said:


> I guess doing the auto pay thing would be easy enough. I'd pay $20 to get up there with a shorter line. Definitely not $80 though...


If you do the autopay, it zings you as soon as you go through the Tram gate.  Not sure if they will be posting the day rate or if you just find out on your CC bill.


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## machski (Apr 6, 2021)

NY DirtBag said:


> Or you could wind up in the clouds with a zero viz day or wind up with avi control 1/2 the day.    I guess details are still to come though so we'll see how it works out


They said in the FAQ's if you ride it once and then it closes for the balance of the day (weather, avi control, mechanical), no refunds will be issued.


----------



## ss20 (Apr 6, 2021)

You guys know who skis next door out there don't you?

Bill Gates, Justin Timberlake, and the rest of the 1% who ski at Yellowstone Club will have no issue paying $80.  They'll get full trams and long lines still, except now they'll make an absolute killing on it.


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## Zermatt (Apr 7, 2021)

Big Sky will no longer allow tram access to Ikon pass holders. I suspect this trend will continue and erode the value of the pass. Jackson Hole and Snowbird are the next easy ones.


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## Edd (Apr 7, 2021)

Zermatt said:


> Big Sky will no longer allow tram access to Ikon pass holders. I suspect this trend will continue and erode the value of the pass. Jackson Hole and Snowbird are the next easy ones.


Can you source that, please?


----------



## cdskier (Apr 7, 2021)

Edd said:


> Can you source that, please?


The part about Big Sky no longer allowing tram access to Ikon pass holders is partially true and the link to the note from Big Sky is further up in this thread. I say partially true because they aren't targeting just Ikon holders. Mountain Collective, day ticket holders, and even the majority of Big Sky's own passholders would no longer have unlimited/free access to the tram either. Only their own highest level passholders get unlimited tram access. The 2nd level down gets 10 days of tram access. Everyone else can pay an additional fee as you go to access the tram.


----------



## Zermatt (Apr 7, 2021)

Edd said:


> Can you source that, please?


Unofficial Network


----------



## dblskifanatic (Apr 7, 2021)

Edd said:


> Can you source that, please?



From Big Sky web site

Starting Winter 2021-22, access to the Lone Peak Tram for lift tickets, Ikon & Mountain Collective passes, and most Big Sky Resort season passes will not be included. To access the Tram, an add-on product will be required. This initiative supports our goal of providing guests an elevated experience to the high-alpine terrain available and help alleviate wait times for the Tram.


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## Tonyr (Apr 7, 2021)

Big Sky and Jackson both need alternative lifts to the summit, waiting over an hour in line to ride a tram is ridiculous. I didn't even attempt to ride it at either place this year due to the lines. Jackson years ago had a lift to the summit then removed it once the new tram went in and I can't understand why they just didn't leave it.

On the other hand, I was told that Big Sky may install a larger tram car one day but they'll never add another lift to the summit. They want to keep the amount of people skiing the peak limited so this ploy may be around for a while. I think when they changed a majority of the trails up there a couple of years ago to triple blacks from doubles it was an attempt at cutting down the crowds but that obviously hasn't worked. Either way charging extra is a bad idea it's just going to piss customers off.

Snowbird does it right they have 2 lifts that get you to the peak in addition to the tram which is one of the reasons why we'll go back there next year instead.


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## machski (Apr 7, 2021)

If you have skied off the top of Lone Peak, then you know as it is now it can be boney as hell.  That peak is not broad at the top, funneling most down one or two narrow paths and it gets dry snow and a ton of wind that shifts the snow around drastically.  One year I was there, Otter Slide was completely bare the first two days and closed.  Day three I am on the early Tram and the op says Otter Slide is open, which blew my mind as no new snow had fallen.  I get up there and go over to it and low and behold, it is full of snow.  Skied it and it skied great.  I asked on the next ride as was told wind shifted and was strong overnight refilling the line.  I cannot imagine what the Peak conditions would be like with a substantial increase in traffic similar to what Snowbird can deposit at its summit.  

That said, I know a lift up Dakota to the top of Liberty Bowl terminating just below the Liberty fences has been talked about.  I could see that, usually it is solid coverage below the fencing.  For now I guess this is ok, will depend on Tram pack pricing when those come out in June.


----------



## Zermatt (Apr 7, 2021)

Tonyr said:


> Big Sky and Jackson both need alternative lifts to the summit, waiting over an hour in line to ride a tram is ridiculous. I didn't even attempt to ride it at either place this year due to the lines. Jackson years ago had a lift to the summit then removed it once the new tram went in and I can't understand why they just didn't leave it.
> 
> On the other hand, I was told that Big Sky may install a larger tram car one day but they'll never add another lift to the summit. They want to keep the amount of people skiing the peak limited so this ploy may be around for a while. I think when they changed a majority of the trails up there a couple of years ago to triple blacks from doubles it was an attempt at cutting down the crowds but that obviously hasn't worked. Either way charging extra is a bad idea it's just going to piss customers off.
> 
> Snowbird does it right they have 2 lifts that get you to the peak in addition to the tram which is one of the reasons why we'll go back there next year instead.


Wasn't the Jackson summit lift temporary while they installed the new tram (no tram for 2 seasons)?


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## Tonyr (Apr 7, 2021)

Zermatt said:


> Wasn't the Jackson summit lift temporary while they installed the new tram (no tram for 2 seasons)?


Yes, wish it would have stayed permanent though.


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## Tonyr (Apr 7, 2021)

machski said:


> If you have skied off the top of Lone Peak, then you know as it is now it can be boney as hell.  That peak is not broad at the top, funneling most down one or two narrow paths and it gets dry snow and a ton of wind that shifts the snow around drastically.  One year I was there, Otter Slide was completely bare the first two days and closed.  Day three I am on the early Tram and the op says Otter Slide is open, which blew my mind as no new snow had fallen.  I get up there and go over to it and low and behold, it is full of snow.  Skied it and it skied great.  I asked on the next ride as was told wind shifted and was strong overnight refilling the line.  I cannot imagine what the Peak conditions would be like with a substantial increase in traffic similar to what Snowbird can deposit at its summit.
> 
> That said, I know a lift up Dakota to the top of Liberty Bowl terminating just below the Liberty fences has been talked about.  I could see that, usually it is solid coverage below the fencing.  For now I guess this is ok, will depend on Tram pack pricing when those come out in June.


Unfortunately I didn't get a chance to ride the tram so I wouldn't know how conditions looked up there! It appears like more than anything increased traffic at the summit equals more liability for the resort. I'd still take a lift that gets you up the Liberty Bowl but is still below the summit.


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## slatham (Apr 7, 2021)

Here it comes, cheap season passes but if you want to ride say Mt Snow Blue Bird ya gotta pay up. 4 runner quad. Jay Tram.


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## Edd (Apr 8, 2021)

“Dang, I hate trams” is all I can think while reading these threads about long waits.


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## machski (Apr 8, 2021)

Edd said:


> “Dang, I hate trams” is all I can think while reading these threads about long waits.


Yes, but Lone Peak summit especially from the side the Tram climbs, really no option otherwise than a tram.


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## ss20 (Apr 8, 2021)

Edd said:


> “Dang, I hate trams” is all I can think while reading these threads about long waits.



So do I but I had an incredible day at Jay a couple years ago where the Flyer was down for snowmaking so they only ran the Tram on that side (midweek of course).  There was only an inch or two down from the night before but with so few people going up on the hill it was sweeeeeet.  And a rare chance to lap that summit terrain all day.  After an hour or so of skiing I was able to time my rides to correspond with the tram arriving/departing.  And I think I only had to wait a cycle (due to people in front of me) once or twice.


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## dblskifanatic (Apr 8, 2021)

ss20 said:


> So do I but I had an incredible day at Jay a couple years ago where the Flyer was down for snowmaking so they only ran the Tram on that side (midweek of course).  There was only an inch or two down from the night before but with so few people going up on the hill it was sweeeeeet.  And a rare chance to lap that summit terrain all day.  After an hour or so of skiing I was able to time my rides to correspond with the tram arriving/departing.  And I think I only had to wait a cycle (due to people in front of me) once or twice.



Well I have been on that same tram as winds started picking up.  On the ride just before you get into the top terminal it started moving a lot.  Then you look down and see the terrain being rocky and steep and you are fairly high up.   The car was full and people were panicking.  It was a scary moment.   Keep in mind, Jay Peak was my feeder hill so I was used to going up on the tram and have often.  But those Jay Peak winds .....


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## KustyTheKlown (Apr 8, 2021)

if you think it is rocky and steep beneath the jay peak tram, you haven't ridden the lone peak tram. that shit is fucked.


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## dblskifanatic (Apr 8, 2021)

KustyTheKlown said:


> if you think it is rocky and steep beneath the jay peak tram, you haven't ridden the lone peak tram. that shit is fucked.



No I have not!  I can imagine any tram on a western peak would be crazy below.  The Whistler Blackcomb tram must be crazy looking down as well.


----------



## jaytrem (Apr 8, 2021)

Has this been posted yet.  Was away all last week so not sure.  Anyway, how not to ski the Big Sky Tram...









						Watch: Skier Takes Slides For Life Down The Entire Big Couloir @ Big Sky Resort
					

Jerry Of The Day was sent some footage of a skier falling down the entire length of the Big @ Big Sky. “So my dad fell down the Big Couloir at Big Sky Resort. He is in the hospital with a bro…




					unofficialnetworks.com


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## KustyTheKlown (Apr 8, 2021)

dblskifanatic said:


> No I have not!  I can imagine any tram on a western peak would be crazy below.  The Whistler Blackcomb tram must be crazy looking down as well.


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## NYDB (Apr 8, 2021)

^When I was there last year they had a guy hanging off of cables in a safety harness at the top shoveling the tram entrances just below the top. 

No thank you!!


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## KustyTheKlown (Apr 8, 2021)

ya, and its so steep there arent even any towers, just two terminals'

look how small that one dude skiing the big c looks


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## Smellytele (Apr 8, 2021)

Try the aguille de midi tram in chamonix!


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## machski (Apr 8, 2021)

KustyTheKlown said:


> ya, and its so steep there arent even any towers, just two terminals'
> 
> look how small that one dude skiing the big c looks


Actually, any larger of a Tram and there would have been a support tower or two.  Thus the reason for the small boxes, biggest they could do with unsupported cables.  Can't imagine the cost to some how engineer a tower or two on that terrain.


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## Dickc (Apr 12, 2021)

Well, pulled the trigger on a Boyne NEP Silver.  For 65+, its a 50 dollar discount at $729.  Felt I kind of had to as daughter works for Sunday River, so to ski with her I need that pass, and Loon is just over two hours from home too, and she would happily meet me there on one of her days off.  I also went with the Epic Northeast Value pass.  At $359, that is a really cheap, but good value option.  Being on the Mass North Shore, there are reasonable number of nearby resorts to go ski with out driving three hours.  Sunapee, Crotched, just under two hours, and in the 2 plus hour range, Wildcat, Attitash, and Short of three hours by a few minutes is Okemo And Snow.  Might make one trip up to Stowe as I have not been there for 45 years, but not too sure of a 3.5 hour each way day trip.


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## Killingtime (Apr 12, 2021)

Dickc said:


> Well, pulled the trigger on a Boyne NEP Silver.  For 65+, its a 50 dollar discount at $729.  Felt I kind of had to as daughter works for Sunday River, so to ski with her I need that pass, and Loon is just over two hours from home too, and she would happily meet me there on one of her days off.  I also went with the Epic Northeast Value pass.  At $359, that is a really cheap, but good value option.  Being on the Mass North Shore, there are reasonable number of nearby resorts to go ski with out driving three hours.  Sunapee, Crotched, just under two hours, and in the 2 plus hour range, Wildcat, Attitash, and Short of three hours by a few minutes is Okemo And Snow.  Might make one trip up to Stowe as I have not been there for 45 years, but not too sure of a 3.5 hour each way day trip.


Cool. Just pulled the trigger on Epic Local. Gonna pair it with the Indy and do long weekends at resorts that are relatively close together. Attitash/Cannon   Mt Snow/Magic   Stowe/Bolton   Sunapee /Waterville. I got used to doing a lot of driving this year and it really wasn't that bad. Just can't drink too much the night before. Hopefully the Indy line-up doesn't change much.


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## dblskifanatic (Apr 13, 2021)

Killingtime said:


> Cool. Just pulled the trigger on Epic Local. Gonna pair it with the Indy and do long weekends at resorts that are relatively close together. Attitash/Cannon   Mt Snow/Magic   Stowe/Bolton   Sunapee /Waterville. I got used to doing a lot of driving this year and it really wasn't that bad. Just can't drink too much the night before. Hopefully the Indy line-up doesn't change much.



That is an interesting idea!  I never would have thought of that.  Now need to look into the Indy Pass.


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## KustyTheKlown (Apr 13, 2021)

combining indy with a major pass is the obvious move. avoid saturdays and holidays at the worst crowded places. have a pass with no blackout dates. mountains in the east are small, there is no need to ski the same place two days in a row, and there are so many indy/ikon pairs that just make sense (bolton + sugarbush, stratton + magic, cannon + loon, saddleback + sugarloaf, etc).


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## machski (Apr 14, 2021)

Well, we went NEP Silvers and Epic Local.  Price of both is $200 or so LESS than NEP Platinum.  May add in Indy's too depending on it's price point.  Had to mix it up this year from Ikon stuff, especially since the Platinum NEP Ikon Base doesn't offer option to add Aspens/JHMR.


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## Edd (Apr 14, 2021)

machski said:


> Well, we went NEP Silvers and Epic Local.  Price of both is $200 or so LESS than NEP Platinum.  May add in Indy's too depending on it's price point.  Had to mix it up this year from Ikon stuff, especially since the Platinum NEP Ikon Base doesn't offer option to add Aspens/JHMR.


My impression of you is a SR/Loon guy, so I’m guessing the Ikon wouldn’t get it done for you. What’s your plan for the Epic Local?


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## machski (Apr 14, 2021)

Edd said:


> My impression of you is a SR/Loon guy, so I’m guessing the Ikon wouldn’t get it done for you. What’s your plan for the Epic Local?


Loon fills a need for close to home (Manchester NH area) but yes, SR is our prime.  Epic will use close to home at Crotched and Sunapee, probably toss in some Cat from SR condo (especially when blacked out on NEP silver), wife has never skied Okemo and Stowe so hit those a bit.  Plus, likely two western trips.  CO and hopefully Blackcomb/Whistler assuming border is open.

Probably would have stayed NEP Platinum if the included Ikon Base had Aspens on it.  But it doesn't, and that is where is want to go in that grouping.  So a bit of a change up this season (plus the wife has had it with teaching as a career, so midweek days are open for her now)


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## Pez (Apr 18, 2021)

Moving my season pass from Butternut to Berk East.  Little more expensive, but much more interesting terrain.  About the same distance from my house too.

Probablyu going to end up getting an epic NE pass again too.  it is what it is with that one


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## Killingtime (Apr 18, 2021)

Pez said:


> Moving my season pass from Butternut to Berk East.  Little more expensive, but much more interesting terrain.  About the same distance from my house too.
> 
> Probablyu going to end up getting an epic NE pass again too.  it is what it is with that one


Butternut is a cool little place that doesn't get a lot of attention but I agree, BE has the better terrain.


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## urungus (Apr 18, 2021)

Plus with your Berkshire East Pass, you can get the IndyPass add-on at a significant discount, this year is was $169 vs regular IndyPass price of $259.  Edit: Early bird pricing was $129 vs $199


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## mikec142 (Apr 19, 2021)

FYI...I received a $14.71 credit in my account for my Ikon Pass.  I elected the all resorts option.  I have to say that I'm pleased to get anything back as I certainly got my money's worth out of the IP this season.


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## cdskier (Apr 19, 2021)

mikec142 said:


> FYI...I received a $14.71 credit in my account for my Ikon Pass.  I elected the all resorts option.  I have to say that I'm pleased to get anything back as I certainly got my money's worth out of the IP this season.



You can thank Ontario for that credit!

No credit for me (I chose the Sugarbush only option), but I have 45 days on my pass so far so I definitely got my money's worth out of it. Just renewed my pass.


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## p_levert (Apr 19, 2021)

mikec142 said:


> FYI...I received a $14.71 credit in my account for my Ikon Pass.  I elected the all resorts option.  I have to say that I'm pleased to get anything back as I certainly got my money's worth out of the IP this season.





cdskier said:


> You can thank Ontario for that credit!
> 
> No credit for me (I chose the Sugarbush only option), but I have 45 days on my pass so far so I definitely got my money's worth out of it. Just renewed my pass.



Yes, thank you Doug Ford and Ontario!  I picked Blue Mountain as my favored destination, even though I had no intention of going there.  My credit is $297.00!!!  Woohoo!


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## abc (Apr 19, 2021)

urungus said:


> Plus with your Berkshire East Pass, you can get the IndyPass add-on at a significant discount, this year is was $169 vs regular IndyPass price of $259.  Edit: Early bird pricing was $129 vs $199


When do the early bird price typically expire?

With the Epic price drop, plus the rollover credit from 19/20 for me, it's a no-brainer to get it again for 21/22. But it's so dirt cheap that I'm contemplating picking up the Indy in addition (largely in the event of another Wildcat fiasco, as I typically go up there during Christmas-New Year time - mostly to cross country ski, but usually tack on some downhill days)


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## mikec142 (Apr 19, 2021)

p_levert said:


> Yes, thank you Doug Ford and Ontario!  I picked Blue Mountain as my favored destination, even though I had no intention of going there.  My credit is $297.00!!!  Woohoo!


That's awesome.  I remember you posting your logic around picking Blue.  Smart move.


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## KustyTheKlown (Apr 19, 2021)

i got $8 and also chose all destinations. i am a base pass, were you a full pass? only thing i can think of as to why we'd get different credits.


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## KustyTheKlown (Apr 19, 2021)

p_levert said:


> Yes, thank you Doug Ford and Ontario!  I picked Blue Mountain as my favored destination, even though I had no intention of going there.  My credit is $297.00!!!  Woohoo!



thats some dope strategic thinking you employed there. canada was always more likely to lock shit down.


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## mikec142 (Apr 19, 2021)

KustyTheKlown said:


> i got $8 and also chose all destinations. i am a base pass, were you a full pass? only thing i can think of as to why we'd get different credits.


Yes.  Full pass holder.


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## abc (Apr 19, 2021)

p_levert said:


> Yes, thank you Doug Ford and Ontario!  I picked Blue Mountain as my favored destination, even though I had no intention of going there.  My credit is $297.00!!!  Woohoo!


Did you not use the pass much then?


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## cdskier (Apr 19, 2021)

abc said:


> Did you not use the pass much then?



Ikon's "Adventure Assurance" program didn't matter how much you used the pass. It was based purely on providing pro-rated credit for any resort closures. Two people that made the same "Adventure Assurance" choices would get the same credit even if 1 person skied 100 days and the other skied 2 days.


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## p_levert (Apr 19, 2021)

abc said:


> Did you not use the pass much then?



Yeah, cdskier explained it.  As it turns out, I used my Ikon base pass 9 days, for a per day of $67 (before credit).  With the credit, the per day cost was cut in half, so $34 or so.  All good.


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## urungus (Apr 19, 2021)

abc said:


> When do the early bird price typically expire?
> 
> With the Epic price drop, plus the rollover credit from 19/20 for me, it's a no-brainer to get it again for 21/22. But it's so dirt cheap that I'm contemplating picking up the Indy in addition (largely in the event of another Wildcat fiasco, as I typically go up there during Christmas-New Year time - mostly to cross country ski, but usually tack on some downhill days)



Looks like last year the price for the regular (not add-on) IndyPass was introduced at $199, went to $229 at some point, then on Jan 1 increased to $259.   Next seasons pricing, new resorts, etc are due to be announced next week on April 27.


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## mlkrgr (Apr 19, 2021)

Wawa raised their prices up for next year's season pass, but will go on sale on May 3. Looks like the rates increased $25-$90 depending on pass type and the "weekender" option is now removed.
Next year's GPS prices:
$639 gold
$439 silver
$319 bronze.

Paid $254 for a bronze past season for buying it during the summer, but $319 is still not bad. Epic Northesast pass at $479 is very tempting as Crotched is only 10 minutes shorter (but 15 fewer miles) from my house. Plus, the fact that I can get to ski during Saturday days for less than the price of a gold pass at Wawa... which is the only time that I can ski with my GF as she wants to go during the day. Kinda feeling a little uneasy with how Vail dropped the ball and I like the second grooming at night at Wawa.


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## Smellytele (Apr 20, 2021)

mlkrgr said:


> Wawa raised their prices up for next year's season pass, but will go on sale on May 3. Looks like the rates increased $25-$90 depending on pass type and the "weekender" option is now removed.
> Next year's GPS prices:
> $639 gold
> $439 silver
> ...


They didn’t really drop the ball at the crotch.


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## mlkrgr (Apr 20, 2021)

Smellytele said:


> They didn’t really drop the ball at the crotch.


Good to know. After all, the thought of switching it up with Sunapee and then taking a couple trips to Stowe at a minimum is quite a consideration.


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## dblskifanatic (Apr 20, 2021)

mlkrgr said:


> Wawa raised their prices up for next year's season pass, but will go on sale on May 3. Looks like the rates increased $25-$90 depending on pass type and the "weekender" option is now removed.
> Next year's GPS prices:
> $639 gold
> $439 silver
> ...



What were the issues at Crotched?  From what I have heard things were pretty good there.


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## thetrailboss (Apr 20, 2021)

So Snowbird came out with their prices.  Benefits dropped and the price held pretty similar to last year.  One big thing--the passes that had an Ikon pass included now have it as an add-on at a relatively reasonable price but it is still an "upcharge".  Additionally, there are multiple disclosures as to the fact that if one opts to "defer" one's Snowbird pass then the Ikon Pass will be deactivated.  Additionally, it also states that the two both have to be active (you can't buy the Snowbird, cancel it, and keep the Ikon or vice versa).  The reason?  If you go onto Ikon's Facebook page you will see at least two reviewers who complained about how their "bonus Ikon Pass" did not work after they "got reimbursed" for their season pass.  In other words, folks bought a Snowbird Pass with the Ikon, activated the Ikon, and later canceled the Snowbird Pass.  As a result, this deactivated their Ikon pass.  I do seem to recall seeing something that one could not do that.


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## machski (Apr 21, 2021)

Schweitzer has joined the Ikon pass for next season.


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## 2planks2coasts (Apr 21, 2021)

machski said:


> Schweitzer has joined the Ikon pass for next season.


Nice little (yes, I know the mountain itself is huge!) addition, though the vibe there seems more Indy or Powder Alliance. The Ikon website list Schweitzer as a destination but still says "no access".  I imagine it'll be a 5 day base/ 7 day full Ikon resort.


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## skimagic (Apr 21, 2021)

2planks2coasts said:


> Nice little (yes, I know the mountain itself is huge!) addition, though the vibe there seems more Indy or Powder Alliance. The Ikon website list Schweitzer as a destination but still says "no access".  I imagine it'll be a 5 day base/ 7 day full Ikon resort.


 Ikon Pass holders will enjoy up to 7 days of access at Schweitzer and Ikon Base Pass holders will get 5 holiday-restricted days.  The partnership with Alterra replaces Schweitzer’s membership in the Powder Alliance reciprocal program, which brought the North Idaho mountain about 5,000 skiers per year over the last seven seasons. Schweitzer says it was the single most-redeemed destination in that alliance.


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## jimmywilson69 (Apr 21, 2021)

sounds like Ikon is paying more based on that decision


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## skimagic (Apr 21, 2021)

I assume the locals will be going nuts- Shwiez set up a FAQ page, to address the crowding.  its a great mountain with  good terrain and a nice open bowl.  A slightly smaller version of whitefish.   I was hoping to return someday but I'll stick with the Spokane indy spots for now to see if the extra 14 chairs on one lift will ease the crowd. .

FAQs
You’re just bringing more people to the mountain I already love and it’s going to get overcrowded!​The truth is that the area is growing whether we like it or not and our goal is to manage the growth at Schweitzer so the place, the feel and the vibe doesn’t change. Being a partner on the Ikon Pass just gives us the opportunity to invite our skier friends from other places to come enjoy Schweitzer too. And with the addition of the “Voyager Pass,” you can hit the road too and enjoy some world class mountains. It’s all about sharing the stoke. Independently.

The Ikon Pass *does NOT *offer unrestricted, unlimited access to Schweitzer. The Ikon Pass offers 7 days with no blackout dates and the Ikon Base Pass offers 5 days with some holiday blackout dates. The only pass that offers unlimited days at Schweitzer is a Schweitzer Season Pass.

*One way to look at it:* For 7 years, we were a part of the Powder Alliance and the most visited resort out of all 18 areas that were members. Powder Alliance generated about 5,000 visits across the season – that works out to an extra 40 people/day. On a mountain of our size, that number was easy to absorb. It will be very similar but given some improvements we plan to make, the redemption process at Guest Services will be much more streamlined.

As mentioned before, we know our area is growing. Spokane is growing, the Rathdrum Prairie is growing and Sandpoint is growing. That means more people on the mountain. We estimate that will see continued growth of about 5%-10% over the next couple of years. And we are going to work hard and make continued investments to help the mountain continue to absorb that growth.

Here are a few things we’re doing *THIS YEAR* to help:

We plan to spend over $250,000 to increase the capacity of the Stella Express by 15% (or 235 people/hour). This will be done by *adding an additional 14 chairs to the lift*.
We plan to spend almost $500,000 to upgrade our ticketing system to support Direct-To-Lift (DTL) tickets with RFID technology
We know it can get a little tight indoors at lunch, so we are going to expand our dining options. This includes the opening of Crow’s Bench, the new restaurant inside Humbird and we are excited to add an additional on-mountain food/beverage location at the “Chair 5 Saddle” – the saddle between the top of Stella and Down the Hatch.
*Parking is already limited, now it’s just gonna be worse!*

We plan to continue our expansion of the parking areas at the Fire Station and Roundabout lots. As mentioned above, this will increase parking by approximately 100 spots.
The new Humbird hotel has underground parking that will provide 50 additional spaces in the main lot for lodging guests.


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## 2planks2coasts (Apr 21, 2021)

skimagic said:


> I assume the locals will be going nuts- Shwiez set up a FAQ page, to address the crowding.  its a great mountain with  good terrain and a nice open bowl.  A slightly smaller version of whitefish.   I was hoping to return someday but I'll stick with the Spokane indy spots for now.
> 
> FAQs.......



That's interesting about them being the most visited Powder Alliance resort. Sugar Bowl left that group last year citing an imbalance in redemptions, with more people using PA benefits at Sugar Bowl than Sugar Bowl passholders using PA benefits elsewhere.   

I do think they're smoking something if they think IKON is  only going to bring them a similar number of skiers.


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## machski (Apr 21, 2021)

2planks2coasts said:


> That's interesting about them being the most visited Powder Alliance resort. Sugar Bowl left that group last year citing an imbalance in redemptions, with more people using PA benefits at Sugar Bowl than Sugar Bowl passholders using PA benefits elsewhere.
> 
> I do think they're smoking something if they think IKON is  only going to bring them a similar number of skiers.


IDK, Schweitzer isn't that easy to get to.  Other resorts that have become overcrowded have a much better road and air feed to them than Schweitzer has.  Granted it is under 2 hours driving from Spokane Airport.  But how many people outside of the PNW would relate that to Schweitzer?  And there are no other Ikon resorts real close driving wise.  5000 Ikon guests may be a bit short, but I would be shocked if in their first year on the pass they saw much North of 3X that.


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## cdskier (Apr 21, 2021)

jimmywilson69 said:


> sounds like Ikon is paying more based on that decision



If what we heard about Ikon's partner reimbursement model is correct and if Schweitzer got the same deal, then that "guaranteed $1M" that Ikon provides partners would absolutely be more than they could have made with 5000 skier visits from PA. To hit that amount with 5000 PA visits, they'd have to be paying $200/day which is double Schweitzer's own day ticket price and certainly not what they were getting from PA. Also if they got that same Ikon deal, then you'd have to think Ikon definitely expects to generate substantially more than 5K visits to Schweitzer.


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## 2planks2coasts (Apr 21, 2021)

cdskier said:


> If what we heard about Ikon's partner reimbursement model is correct and if Schweitzer got the same deal, then that "guaranteed $1M" that Ikon provides partners would absolutely be more than they could have made with 5000 skier visits from PA. To hit that amount with 5000 PA visits, they'd have to be paying $200/day which is double Schweitzer's own day ticket price and certainly not what they were getting from PA. Also if they got that same Ikon deal, then you'd have to think Ikon definitely expects to generate substantially more than 5K visits to Schweitzer.


IIRC, Powder Alliance redemptions don't bring an direct revenue at all. It's a reciprocal agreement mainly for marketing purposes.  In one of the podcasts for the IndyPass, Doug Fish talked about how those types of agreements could be supplanted by something like the Indy, which provides some revenue.


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## cdskier (Apr 21, 2021)

2planks2coasts said:


> IIRC, Powder Alliance redemptions don't bring an direct revenue at all. It's a reciprocal agreement mainly for marketing purposes.  In one of the podcasts for the IndyPass, Doug Fish talked about how those types of agreements could be supplanted by something like the Indy, which provides some revenue.


In that case, without a doubt Ikon is paying more  

Definitely seems like a no-brainer for Schweitzer based on that from a financial perspective even if Ikon gave them a different/smaller deal (as long as they believe they can address the concerns about how many Ikon visits they'll have).


----------



## thetrailboss (Apr 21, 2021)

cdskier said:


> If what we heard about Ikon's partner reimbursement model is correct and if Schweitzer got the same deal, then that "guaranteed $1M" that Ikon provides partners would absolutely be more than they could have made with 5000 skier visits from PA. To hit that amount with 5000 PA visits, they'd have to be paying $200/day which is double Schweitzer's own day ticket price and certainly not what they were getting from PA. Also if they got that same Ikon deal, then you'd have to think Ikon definitely expects to generate substantially more than 5K visits to Schweitzer.


So to be clear, I don't know if it is "guaranteed".  It is upfront $1 mill.  If it was "guaranteed" then every ski area would want in.  I would imagine that the resort has to hit visitor benchmarks to keep its $1 mill.


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## thetrailboss (Apr 21, 2021)

skimagic said:


> I assume the locals will be going nuts- Shwiez set up a FAQ page, to address the crowding.  its a great mountain with  good terrain and a nice open bowl.  A slightly smaller version of whitefish.   I was hoping to return someday but I'll stick with the Spokane indy spots for now to see if the extra 14 chairs on one lift will ease the crowd. .
> 
> FAQs
> You’re just bringing more people to the mountain I already love and it’s going to get overcrowded!​The truth is that the area is growing whether we like it or not and our goal is to manage the growth at Schweitzer so the place, the feel and the vibe doesn’t change. Being a partner on the Ikon Pass just gives us the opportunity to invite our skier friends from other places to come enjoy Schweitzer too. And with the addition of the “Voyager Pass,” you can hit the road too and enjoy some world class mountains. It’s all about sharing the stoke. Independently.
> ...


AMAZING that crowding is the concern with Ikon......

Jokes aside, Schweitzer is pretty damn remote.  We went to CDA last year and Schweitzer was STILL like 90 minutes north.  It is NOT easy to get to and nobody really lives nearby.  I would certainly expect more visits, but probably not the crowding issues we see in CO and UT.


----------



## Zermatt (Apr 22, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> AMAZING that crowding is the concern with Ikon......
> 
> Jokes aside, Schweitzer is pretty damn remote.  We went to CDA last year and Schweitzer was STILL like 90 minutes north.  It is NOT easy to get to and nobody really lives nearby.  I would certainly expect more visits, but probably not the crowding issues we see in CO and UT.


Couldn't you say the same about Jackson Hole, yet Ikon has brought in hoards of couch surfers and parking lot campers.

It may not be as close as Jackson is to SLC, but Seattle isn't that far and Spokane is an easy airport to fly into with mostly good weather.  Then it's an easy drive across the border to Red Mountain in BC.


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## jaytrem (Apr 22, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> AMAZING that crowding is the concern with Ikon......
> 
> Jokes aside, Schweitzer is pretty damn remote.  We went to CDA last year and Schweitzer was STILL like 90 minutes north.  It is NOT easy to get to and nobody really lives nearby.  I would certainly expect more visits, but probably not the crowding issues we see in CO and UT.



Worth the drive.  Was there on April 1st, a Thursday.  Forget about no lift lines, I think we had entire lifts to ourselves...


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## thetrailboss (Apr 22, 2021)

Zermatt said:


> Couldn't you say the same about Jackson Hole, yet Ikon has brought in hoards of couch surfers and parking lot campers.
> 
> It may not be as close as Jackson is to SLC, but Seattle isn't that far and Spokane is an easy airport to fly into with mostly good weather.  Then it's an easy drive across the border to Red Mountain in BC.


Well, we shall see what happens.


----------



## ss20 (Apr 22, 2021)

@thetrailboss 

Thoughts on Alta officially announcing going to paid parking reservations next winter?


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## Tonyr (Apr 22, 2021)

Zermatt said:


> Couldn't you say the same about Jackson Hole, yet Ikon has brought in hoards of couch surfers and parking lot campers.
> 
> It may not be as close as Jackson is to SLC, but Seattle isn't that far and Spokane is an easy airport to fly into with mostly good weather.  Then it's an easy drive across the border to Red Mountain in BC.


I don't know if Jackson is a fair comparison but Schweizer is definitely going to have bigger crowds next season.


ss20 said:


> @thetrailboss
> 
> Thoughts on Alta officially announcing going to paid parking reservations next winter?


I believe it's going to encourage more people to stay at Alta's hotels at the base. When we visited Snowbird this year our plan was to stay in SLC and drive to Snowbird everyday. When we found out that parking reservations were needed unless you stayed at one of the hotels at the Snowbird base we switched our reservation.


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## thetrailboss (Apr 22, 2021)

ss20 said:


> @thetrailboss
> 
> Thoughts on Alta officially announcing going to paid parking reservations next winter?


Huh?!


----------



## thetrailboss (Apr 22, 2021)

ss20 said:


> @thetrailboss
> 
> Thoughts on Alta officially announcing going to paid parking reservations next winter?


So this is news to me.  Here is what it says:



> WEEKEND & HOLIDAY PARKING RESERVATIONS​With the launch season passes for next winter, it's important to recognize the parking challenges highlighted this season at Alta. Thank you for your feedback and patience, we are working to implement a weekend & holiday paid parking reservation system in order to improve the Alta skiing experience and reduce canyon congestion. As a valued Alta season passholder you will receive weekend & holiday parking reservation benefits. *Parking Details Coming Soon...*




So it is for *non-season passholders.  *

We will see how this works.


----------



## Zand (Apr 23, 2021)

Tonyr said:


> I believe it's going to encourage more people to stay at Alta's hotels at the base. When we visited Snowbird this year our plan was to stay in SLC and drive to Snowbird everyday. When we found out that parking reservations were needed unless you stayed at one of the hotels at the Snowbird base we switched our reservation.


Both the BCC and LCC ski buses are free with season passes and Ikon passes. Then you dont have to deal with reservations or paying and you'll probably get dropped off much closer to the lifts than you'll park.


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## abc (Apr 23, 2021)

Zermatt said:


> Couldn't you say the same about Jackson Hole, yet Ikon has brought in hoards of couch surfers and parking lot campers.
> 
> It may not be as close as Jackson is to SLC, but Seattle isn't that far and Spokane is an easy airport to fly into with mostly good weather.  Then it's an easy drive across the border to Red Mountain in BC.





Tonyr said:


> I don't know if Jackson is a fair comparison but Schweizer is definitely going to have bigger crowds next season.


It's not comparable. Jackson is a truly "iconic" mountain. Just about everyone who has an IKON pass would WANT TO ski there. Schweizer not nearly the same. 

More over,  big herd of people fly to SLC to ski Alta-bird year after year already. Now they tack on Jackson in addition. Or many simply fly straight to JH. None of that is the case for Schweizer. 

I'm sure it'll bring in more skiers. That's after all the intent of joining Alterra, isn't it? Question really is will it bring in the herd of crowds!


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## skimagic (Apr 23, 2021)

abc said:


> It's not comparable. Jackson is a truly "iconic" mountain. Just about everyone who has an IKON pass would WANT TO ski there. Schweizer not nearly the same.
> 
> More over,  big herd of people fly to SLC to ski Alta-bird year after year already. Now they tack on Jackson in addition. Or many simply fly straight to JH. None of that is the case for Schweizer.
> 
> I'm sure it'll bring in more skiers. That's after all the intent of joining Alterra, isn't it? Question really is will it bring in the herd of crowds!



This is true, most folks from the east want to ski the best resorts in the country rather than a new, relatively unknown player.

A while back, we flew to Spokane for a Schweitzer/Fernie trip but on the way out (7+hr trip), we connected in SLC, and we thought, lets just  get off here and ski LCC/BCC again, why go further?  Overall it was a good trip since we also threw Castle Mtn in the mix.  But i wouldn't want to make that long haul again knowing we can just have a shorter flight to CO/UT and drive around to either the big resorts and small ones for a great ski experience.  A year later we chose a JH/GT road trip out of SLC over a possible Whitefish trip that used the close by glacier airport just because it was JH.


----------



## Dickc (Apr 24, 2021)

_The Indy Revolution marches on as three more mountains join the alliance._​







Keep an eye on your inbox this Tuesday for our first BIG announcement of the 21-22 season that is sure to rock your powder lovin' world. We'll also be announcing our pricing and on-sale date because the season starts in just 203 days!


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## p_levert (Apr 25, 2021)

Dickc said:


> ​
> ​
> _The Indy Revolution marches on as three more mountains join the alliance._​


I am not impressed by a 3 mountain addition.  I assume at least a few areas will drop out, right?  I was hoping for something big, but this looks like the status quo to me.

As things look today, I will go with Ikon Local and then buy a few restricted Epic Days so I can ski Stowe (or Okemo or Hunter).


----------



## Tonyr (Apr 25, 2021)

p_levert said:


> I am not impressed by a 3 mountain addition.  I assume at least a few areas will drop out, right?  I was hoping for something big, but this looks like the status quo to me.
> 
> As things look today, I will go with Ikon Local and then buy a few restricted Epic Days so I can ski Stowe (or Okemo or Hunter).


I read somewhere that the Indy Pass will have 73 resorts on it for next year. Maybe the 3 new mountains that this note is referring to are east coast additions? Or maybe what I read was complete BS! I guess we'll find out soon enough, they are announcing the new resorts and pricing on Tuesday.


----------



## Tonyr (Apr 25, 2021)

Tonyr said:


> I read somewhere that the Indy Pass will have 73 resorts on it for next year. Maybe the 3 new mountains that this note is referring to are east coast additions? Or maybe what I read was complete BS! I guess we'll find out soon enough, they are announcing the new resorts and pricing on Tuesday.


This note is on the Magic Mountain website, it references over ski 75 resorts for next year on the Indy Pass........


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## PAabe (Apr 25, 2021)

WNEP ski card maybe could be a a thing again next year but I guess that wouldn't drop until like november.  It could be a good localized alternative to Indy in PA/NY if Indy does not add more hills in that area, since Indy does not have the density in that area like it does in New England


----------



## Mum skier (Apr 25, 2021)

Can anyone comment on how bad Loon is on weekends? As a family with kids in school we can only ski weekends any way so bad is sort of a relative term!  So how “relatively bad” is Loon vs the other Boston day trip mountains.  We have been Epic pass for last 3 years and mostly ski Sunapee on Sundays. Despits the Vail hate for this year I would say they did as well as they could under the circumstance, at least all lifts ran and they policed the lines to make them fair.  But certainly longer lines and until later in the season than the previous years.  Loon is only 20 mins further and having Sunday River as an option for vacation weeks (rather than say Okemo or Snow) makes me wonder about switching to NE pass.  But Loon would be the regular weekend mountain and I read bad things about both weekend crowds and type of crowd.  
White Mountain pass seems too crazy expensive for what it is and misses a real destination resort.

So main question is how does Loon compare to Sunapee for crowds on weekends?


----------



## Smellytele (Apr 25, 2021)

Tonyr said:


> This note is on the Magic Mountain website, it references over ski 75 resorts for next year on the Indy Pass........
> 
> View attachment 51583


So with the math the indy pass would be 270 next season?


----------



## p_levert (Apr 25, 2021)

Freedom Pass is not dead yet:


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1386428961836527620
That's 1 more new ski area than Indy Pass!


----------



## Zermatt (Apr 25, 2021)

Tonyr said:


> I read somewhere that the Indy Pass will have 73 resorts on it for next year. Maybe the 3 new mountains that this note is referring to are east coast additions? Or maybe what I read was complete BS! I guess we'll find out soon enough, they are announcing the new resorts and pricing on Tuesday.


Indy Pass has a half dozen or so resorts. The rest are just ski areas, dozens of them are pure crap you never heard of before Indy Pass. Like somebody from New England is going to take a trip to Iowa to use their Indy days.


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## Naturalsnow (Apr 25, 2021)

If the distinction between a "resort" and a "ski area" is important to you, the Indy Pass is probably not the product for you.


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## urungus (Apr 25, 2021)

Mum skier said:


> Can anyone comment on how bad Loon is on weekends? ...  I read bad things about both weekend crowds and type of crowd.



What bad “type of crowd” shows up at Loon ?  The Boston equivalent of the knuckleheads starting fights in the Hunter / Mt Snow parking lot ?


----------



## Zand (Apr 25, 2021)

Mum skier said:


> Can anyone comment on how bad Loon is on weekends? As a family with kids in school we can only ski weekends any way so bad is sort of a relative term!  So how “relatively bad” is Loon vs the other Boston day trip mountains.  We have been Epic pass for last 3 years and mostly ski Sunapee on Sundays. Despits the Vail hate for this year I would say they did as well as they could under the circumstance, at least all lifts ran and they policed the lines to make them fair.  But certainly longer lines and until later in the season than the previous years.  Loon is only 20 mins further and having Sunday River as an option for vacation weeks (rather than say Okemo or Snow) makes me wonder about switching to NE pass.  But Loon would be the regular weekend mountain and I read bad things about both weekend crowds and type of crowd.
> White Mountain pass seems too crazy expensive for what it is and misses a real destination resort.
> 
> So main question is how does Loon compare to Sunapee for crowds on weekends?



Worst part about Loon is that the only real way out of the main base area is a 4-person Gondola. Has awful capacity and creates some biblical lines that are unavoidable if you accidently ski too low. The good thing is stuff like North Peak, East Basin, and South Peak aren't usually so bad, probably smaller lines than Sunapee. And the new Kanc-8 will be a game changer for sure, although I feel like that whole side of the mountain will be a total zoo.


----------



## Zand (Apr 25, 2021)

Zermatt said:


> Indy Pass has a half dozen or so resorts. The rest are just ski areas, dozens of them are pure crap you never heard of before Indy Pass. Like somebody from New England is going to take a trip to Iowa to use their Indy days.


Lol what?

Even if the pass goes up to $300...if 2 days each at Saddleback, Cannon, Jay, Bolton, and Magic (just to name the really good ones) among many other smaller but decent options in New England don't make the pass worth it without a "trip to Iowa", then IDK what to say other than this is the strangest take ever.


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## jaytrem (Apr 25, 2021)

Oddly enough Indy doesn't have a single area in Iowa.  If you want Iowa you need to go with the Cooper pass.


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## sull1102 (Apr 25, 2021)

Mum skier said:


> Can anyone comment on how bad Loon is on weekends? As a family with kids in school we can only ski weekends any way so bad is sort of a relative term!  So how “relatively bad” is Loon vs the other Boston day trip mountains.  We have been Epic pass for last 3 years and mostly ski Sunapee on Sundays. Despits the Vail hate for this year I would say they did as well as they could under the circumstance, at least all lifts ran and they policed the lines to make them fair.  But certainly longer lines and until later in the season than the previous years.  Loon is only 20 mins further and having Sunday River as an option for vacation weeks (rather than say Okemo or Snow) makes me wonder about switching to NE pass.  But Loon would be the regular weekend mountain and I read bad things about both weekend crowds and type of crowd.
> White Mountain pass seems too crazy expensive for what it is and misses a real destination resort.
> 
> So main question is how does Loon compare to Sunapee for crowds on weekends?


As a season pssholder you’ll quickly learn how to play the lines to maximize your day. The gondola line is brutal on weekends, not gonna lie. However, the Kanc8 is likely to attract a lot of attention next season and help the gondi line situation. As long as you ride the gondola a couple times in the morning and then hit North Peak and South Peak you’ll be good. South Peak never has a line, one of the most underused mtn pods out there despite being home to some awesome terrain and decent tree skiing for NH.

I must say, from what I heard from my Epic Pass friends at work and one friend that went to Sunapee then came to Loon with me a bunch, Boyne killed Vail this year. It sounds like Vail just tried to survive, but Loon was really doing well all year and was phenomenal from beginning to end. Sunday River same story, they even still had fireworks and such.


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## abc (Apr 26, 2021)

Does it even matter how “many” areas (or resorts) a pass has?

What’s the maximum number of mountains you ever ski in one season out of your mega pass???

I travel a lot. Still, I only covered 10, maybe 15 in a single season. So I really don’t care if my pass has 25 or 45 mountains. Makes little real difference to me. All I care are the mountains *I* want to ski! Rest are just meaningless numbers to me.


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## Smellytele (Apr 26, 2021)

abc said:


> Does it even matter how “many” areas (or resorts) a pass has?
> 
> What’s the maximum number of mountains you ever ski in one season out of your mega pass???
> 
> I travel a lot. Still, I only covered 10, maybe 15 in a single season. So I really don’t care if my pass has 25 or 45 mountains. Makes little real difference to me. All I care are the mountains *I* want to ski! Rest are just meaningless numbers to me.


But mega passes have unlimited days at least at some mountains and indy only has 2(+25% off day) at each one so your point is moot.


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## boston_e (Apr 26, 2021)

abc said:


> Does it even matter how “many” areas (or resorts) a pass has?
> 
> What’s the maximum number of mountains you ever ski in one season out of your mega pass???
> 
> I travel a lot. Still, I only covered 10, maybe 15 in a single season. So I really don’t care if my pass has 25 or 45 mountains. Makes little real difference to me. All I care are the mountains *I* want to ski! Rest are just meaningless numbers to me.


I agree, but the number of resorts probably helps them attract new customers who want to ski at a specific resort for part of the season.


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## abc (Apr 26, 2021)

boston_e said:


> I agree, but the number of resorts probably helps them attract new customers who want to ski at a specific resort for part of the season.


That’s kind of my point. It’s not the number of resorts, but which specific resort that really matter. 

That’s why Ikon is so wildly successful. Many of the mountain on that pass are mountains many people want to ski in the first place. 

(This also address Smelly’s concerns too)


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## thetrailboss (Apr 26, 2021)

p_levert said:


> Freedom Pass is not dead yet:
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1386428961836527620
> That's 1 more new ski area than Indy Pass!


Cherry Peak.  The resort who has not posted a Tweet at that account in over five years.


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## hub8 (Apr 27, 2021)

sull1102 said:


> As a season pssholder you’ll quickly learn how to play the lines to maximize your day. The gondola line is brutal on weekends, not gonna lie. However, the Kanc8 is likely to attract a lot of attention next season and help the gondi line situation. As long as you ride the gondola a couple times in the morning and then hit North Peak and South Peak you’ll be good. South Peak never has a line, one of the most underused mtn pods out there despite being home to some awesome terrain and decent tree skiing for NH.
> 
> I must say, from what I heard from my Epic Pass friends at work and one friend that went to Sunapee then came to Loon with me a bunch, Boyne killed Vail this year. It sounds like Vail just tried to survive, but Loon was really doing well all year and was phenomenal from beginning to end. Sunday River same story, they even still had fireworks and such.


Just want to chime in on South Peak.  We were at Loon for 3 days this season.  A sunny and icy/hard packed Friday afternoon, storm Saturday, Bluebird Sunday.  Bluebird Sunday had the longest line.  At least 10min starting around 10:15am.  Storm Saturday was about 5-10min, Friday afternoon was a few chairs.  Still the lines were better than North peak, or the east basin double.  Never skied down to gondola.  Canon had crazy wind that weekend.
Next year might be better, more people willing to pack chairs I hope.


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## Zand (Apr 27, 2021)

Just renewed both the Ikon and Indy. Ended up just getting the full Ikon this year...no blackout dates and I was already getting the Base Plus (for Jackson) which was only $100 less. I'll definitely use those 2 extra days at Killington anyway. Stuck with the regular Indy Pass even though there's more blackouts.


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## KustyTheKlown (Apr 27, 2021)

made the same purchases today. a sucker for e-mail marketing and impending price rises/limited early bird allotments

put both on payment plans because why not. nice that you can spread the payments over a credit card for the indy plan. ikon uses affirm, which is a loan, and requires direct debit from checking for that reason. fine with that.

got my magic sunday pass the day magic dropped passes. 

so i am fully pass'd with the exact same mix as this past season. 

addition of pow-mow to indy has me eyeballing a cottonwoods trip, perhaps against my better judgment. could also do a big utah/idaho/montana indy road trip. lots of driving tho.


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## xlr8r (Apr 27, 2021)

I am now stuck with what I should do.  

Epic - My relatives have a house in Bartlett NH so I have a free place to stay, but I don't like Wildcat, and Attitash was horribly run this year.  I am bored of Sunapee, never really liked Crotched, and Mount Snow, Okemo, Stowe are overcrowded.

Ikon - I like the Ikon mountains, but in order to ski on holiday periods it is pretty expensive.  Considering 2 or 3 weekends I will be away next season in Hawaii in March (poor me) I feel the need to maximize skiing holidays next season.  

Indy - The blackouts mean that the base pass is unfeasible, and only the + pass is worth considering.  At least I have $25 off for being a renewal passholder.  But I feel I will only get 8 or so days out it as it will be difficult for me to go to Saddleback or Jay.  Maybe I should book Jay for between Xmas and New Years and hope for the best.

Skiing on Epic and Indy this past season has made me change my strategy and going forward I want to focus on getting the best quality of skiing next year, not the most quantity.


----------



## skimagic (Apr 27, 2021)

Im getting the INDY as well as either a Bromley or NE EPIC midweek pass.  I'm  losing my tolerance for crowds so EPIC is probably a mistake given the 20 percent price rollback.   I'll most likely use INDY on weekends  and for either a POWMOW/Beaver/Pomerelle trip or Brundage/ Tamarack/ Soldier.   The Spokane INDY areas would be interesting but the weather is dank..


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## KustyTheKlown (Apr 27, 2021)

skimagic said:


> Im getting the INDY as well as either a Bromley or NE EPIC midweek pass.  I'm  losing my tolerance for crowds so EPIC is probably a mistake given the 20 percent price rollback.   I'll most likely use INDY on weekends  and for either a POWMOW/Beaver/Pomerelle trip or Brundage/ Tamarack/ Soldier.   The Spokane INDY areas would be interesting but the weather is dank..



lots of driving, but never too too much in one chunk. i know nothing of the roads but i suspect that passage between montana and idaho is sketch as fuck driving with no cell service


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## skimagic (Apr 27, 2021)

KustyTheKlown said:


> lots of driving, but never too too much in one chunk. i know nothing of the roads but i suspect that passage between montana and idaho is sketch as fuck driving with no cell service
> 
> View attachment 51597


That's a good plan, with a few  spr hotsprings around  to rejuvenate.   a few years ago we did base out of West Yellowstone to hit up Big Sky, that road was definitely sketch as it had windblown snow, a bunch of small storms, curves,  no guardrails and no cell service


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## KustyTheKlown (Apr 27, 2021)

i based out of west yellowstone for 4 days at big sky, it sucked. i got an airbnb in someones house in big sky the last two nights. too much driving. but super super cheap out of season hotels.


----------



## abc (Apr 27, 2021)

KustyTheKlown said:


> i based out of west yellowstone for 4 days at big sky, it sucked. i got an airbnb in someones house in big sky the last two nights. too much driving. but super super cheap out of season hotels.


My life is worth more than that! 

I drove that stretch 4 times now. The first time, I drove it in daylight. After seeing clearly what it's like, I made my subsequent plans for the other 3 drive in daylight too. 

To base out of west yellowstone means driving it after a day of skiing, probably in the dark (except in late spring). I wouldn't risk it. 

If I were strap for cash, I'd base out of Bozeman instead. At least from Bozeman, there's a bus (for something like a few bucks). I did that once. Ate breakfast while on the bus in the morning going there. Took a nap on the way back after skiing. 

Big Sky lodging is really expensive. But it's worth it.


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## Smellytele (Apr 27, 2021)

I bit and got IKON base for the wife and I before the increase. Now to start planning trips out west. As I mentioned youngest son will have free skiing at Copper but will also ski at abasin, winter park and maybe Steamboat.


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## thetrailboss (Apr 27, 2021)

KustyTheKlown said:


> lots of driving, but never too too much in one chunk. i know nothing of the roads but i suspect that passage between montana and idaho is sketch as fuck driving with no cell service
> 
> View attachment 51597


Ski Disco joined a multi mountain pass?


----------



## ss20 (Apr 27, 2021)

xlr8r said:


> I am now stuck with what I should do.
> 
> Epic - My relatives have a house in Bartlett NH so I have a free place to stay, but I don't like Wildcat, and Attitash was horribly run this year.  I am bored of Sunapee, never really liked Crotched, and Mount Snow, Okemo, Stowe are overcrowded.
> 
> ...




Is an Ikon base and an Indy+ cheaper than full ikon? That gives you holiday skiing and the most mountains.


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## ThatGuy (Apr 27, 2021)

ss20 said:


> Is an Ikon base and an Indy+ cheaper than full ikon? That gives you holiday skiing and the most mountains.


It’s around $100 more for the Indy combo.


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## KustyTheKlown (Apr 28, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> Ski Disco joined a multi mountain pass?



my mistake. dunno why i thought it was indy. prob my bozeman friend talking about it to me in general when I was dreaming up this big Montana Idaho utah loop


----------



## jaytrem (Apr 28, 2021)

KustyTheKlown said:


> my mistake. dunno why i thought it was indy. prob my bozeman friend talking about it to me in general when I was dreaming up this big Montana Idaho utah loop


Doesn't matter, you should go there anyway.


----------



## KustyTheKlown (Apr 28, 2021)

abc said:


> My life is worth more than that!
> 
> I drove that stretch 4 times now. The first time, I drove it in daylight. After seeing clearly what it's like, I made my subsequent plans for the other 3 drive in daylight too.
> 
> ...



yea, ive stayed in bozeman and have taken the bus for 2 days while awaiting the rest of my friends and then we moved into a sick slopeside house

the west yellowstone stay was kind of last minute. i had an xmas-ish trip to cottonwoods booked and there was no snow. waited as long as I could before pulling the trigger on a big sky audible. coming a long ways from the south, stopping at west yellowstone and staying in very cheap but decent lodging had an appeal.


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## abc (Apr 28, 2021)

KustyTheKlown said:


> yea, ive stayed in bozeman and have taken the bus for 2 days while awaiting the rest of my friends and then we moved into a sick slopeside house
> 
> the west yellowstone stay was kind of last minute. i had an xmas-ish trip to cottonwoods booked and there was no snow. waited as long as I could before pulling the trigger on a big sky audible. coming a long ways from the south, stopping at west yellowstone and staying in very cheap but decent lodging had an appeal.


I used to fantasized doing Big Sky the super dirt bag way: 

Flight into Bozeman
Get a one-way bus from airport straight to Big Sky (cost a bit more, something like $30)
Stash the luggage and go ski
Leave the ski at ski-check overnight at end of day (forgot the price, used to be only a few bucks)
Take the bus to downtown Bozeman, with non-ski luggage
Get the motel shuttle to pick up from bus station (even low end motels like Motel 6 offer that)

Bus back and forth from Bozeman to Big Sky for however many days of skiing (a few bucks each way)

Last day of skiing, take the bus straight from Big Sky to airport. (another bus fee)
Depending on the flight schedule, either fly off right away or bed down at an airport motel (free shuttle to airport usually) till the next morning

I never actually did it because I end up always combining Big Sky with Jackson. So a car was always needed.


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## Smellytele (Apr 28, 2021)

abc said:


> I used to fantasized doing Big Sky the super dirt bag way:
> 
> Flight into Bozeman
> Get a one-way bus from airport straight to Big Sky (cost a bit more, something like $30)
> ...


The super dirt bag thing is more like drive there in your 1990’s Ford ranger with a cap and sleep in the parking lot. Once you mention flying there dirt bag is not in the vocabulary.


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## abc (Apr 28, 2021)

Smellytele said:


> The super dirt bag thing is more like drive there in your 1990’s Ford ranger with a cap and sleep in the parking lot. Once you mention flying there dirt bag is not in the vocabulary.


No, that's only true when you have no job and can afford the time.

Otherwise, it cost a lot more with the wage lost for the days spent driving. 

And then, there's the gas cost.


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## Smellytele (Apr 28, 2021)

abc said:


> No, that's only true when you have no job and can afford the time.
> 
> Otherwise, it cost a lot more with the wage lost for the days spent driving.


Leave Friday get there by Sunday ski all week leave Friday morning home by sunday. 6 days of vacation. We are talking dirt bag not privileged rich who dreams of being a dirt bag.


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## abc (Apr 28, 2021)

Smellytele said:


> Leave Friday get there by Sunday ski all week leave Friday morning home by sunday. 6 days of vacation. We are talking dirt bag not privileged rich who dreams of being a dirt bag.


You've used 6 working days to only ski 5 days! How much does that cost in lost wages? Go ahead and use minimum wage...

Many times, being cheap actually cost more. Some of those "privileged rich" got to be such because they can figure that out.


----------



## thetrailboss (Apr 28, 2021)

KustyTheKlown said:


> my mistake. dunno why i thought it was indy. prob my bozeman friend talking about it to me in general when I was dreaming up this big Montana Idaho utah loop


OK.  Still worth a visit.  Day tickets are like $50.00.  It is more than meets the eye.


----------



## KustyTheKlown (Apr 28, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> OK.  Still worth a visit.  Day tickets are like $50.00.  It is more than meets the eye.



cool, thats the plan for the big trip next season. know anything about the drive from missoula to the idaho ski areas? looks like it may be very sketchy and remote.


----------



## jaytrem (Apr 28, 2021)

KustyTheKlown said:


> cool, thats the plan for the big trip next season. know anything about the drive from missoula to the idaho ski areas? looks like it may be very sketchy and remote.


Easy ride to Lost Trail and a bunch of MT areas (Snowbowl, Maverick, Discovery, Great Divide, Whitefish, Blacktail, Lookout.  If you're looking to get to Brundage/Tamarack/Soldier/Bogus, Boise would be a much better choice.  So many fun areas out there, you're probably better off gong to ones that are closer to each other even if you have to buy day tix (hopefully discounted).  Will be interesting to see if Liftopia can make a bit of a come back next year.  They had a LOT less tickets available this year, but I still purchased 5 from them.


----------



## thetrailboss (Apr 29, 2021)

KustyTheKlown said:


> cool, thats the plan for the big trip next season. know anything about the drive from missoula to the idaho ski areas? looks like it may be very sketchy and remote.


The drive from Disco to Missoula is not bad--about an hour.  From Missoula south, no idea, but you are right that it is the MIDDLE of nowhere.  A friend skied Lost Trail Powder Mountain and loved it.


----------



## skef (Apr 29, 2021)

Hadn't seen this before today: Ikon "first tracks" benefit. I assume that's something like an hour before the general public?


----------



## JimG. (Apr 29, 2021)

Smellytele said:


> We are talking dirt bag not privileged rich who dreams of being a dirt bag.


Really! The only jobs a dirt bag would have is waiting tables or tuning skis. A real dirt bag has no visible means of support.


----------



## drjeff (Apr 30, 2021)

skef said:


> Hadn't seen this before today: Ikon "first tracks" benefit. I assume that's something like an hour before the general public?


Still the exact details to be worked out.  But it's only 1 day in the month of Jan, Feb, and March, at resorts owned by Alterra, not IKON partner resorts owned by other companies, and they will designate ahead of time as which days those will be. And no time duration for how much earlier than general public 1st chair access has been stated based on the released info put out thus far. And it seems to infer that it will just be certain lift(s) and/or specific parts of the mountain opening up early, not the entire mountain


----------



## KustyTheKlown (Apr 30, 2021)

ya, super bravo opening an extra 30 minutes early for ikon holders on one likely weekday per month in prime of season. a nice gesture, but doesn't move the needle on anyone's pass purchase


----------



## p_levert (Apr 30, 2021)

Vail is now listing prices for their 1-7 day restricted passes.  The prices are reasonable.  If you accept the holiday blackout (11 total days) and go with limited resort selection (excludes Vail/Beav/Breck/Whistler/PC and partners) the cost ranges from $57/day to $67/day.  I consider this a great way to scoop up some tickets for Stowe or Hunter or Okemo.  Also works at Keystone and CB in Colorado and *all* of the Tahoe resorts.  Really, what's not to like?  I am going to buy a few of these to go with my Ikon base pass.



			https://www.epicpass.com/passes/epic-day-pass.aspx


----------



## cdskier (Apr 30, 2021)

KustyTheKlown said:


> ya, super bravo opening an extra 30 minutes early for ikon holders on one likely weekday per month in prime of season. a nice gesture, but doesn't move the needle on anyone's pass purchase


Honestly even if it was a weekend day I don't see it making that much difference for the most part. I'm regularly there around 8am on weekends and there really aren't that many people generally speaking for the first hour many days (with the exception of a powder day). And if most of the people that are regularly there early like me are pass-holders anyway, then it is still mostly the same group of people that just get to start a little earlier.


----------



## Edd (May 1, 2021)

Epic Veterans pass purchased. Probably going to get a cheap pass to cover BW too. Looking forward to hitting the VT spots next year.


----------



## Razor (May 2, 2021)

As a senior, how can you beat the Epic Northeast Midweek pass for $270?  Sure, there are a few holiday blackouts and you're limited to 5 days at Stowe, but if you're a midweek skier, you don't want to do holidays and weekends anyway.


----------



## Zand (May 3, 2021)

Limited amount of Wachusett passes went on sale today and created a total bum rush to the site, so good luck getting one if you want one.

If they ever restore night skiing hours to what they used to be, I'd consider getting a pass again but raising prices and reducing hours doesn't sit well with me.


----------



## thetrailboss (May 4, 2021)

𝟐𝟎𝟐𝟏-𝟐𝟐 𝐀𝐋𝐓𝐀 𝐒𝐄𝐀𝐒𝐎𝐍 𝐏𝐀𝐒𝐒𝐄𝐒 𝐀𝐑𝐄 𝐎𝐍 𝐒𝐀𝐋𝐄 𝐍𝐎𝐖--> www.alta.com/tickets-and-passes
𝐑𝐞𝐬𝐭𝐨𝐫𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐀𝐥𝐭𝐚'𝐬 𝐖𝐞𝐞𝐤𝐞𝐧𝐝 & 𝐇𝐨𝐥𝐢𝐝𝐚𝐲 𝐒𝐤𝐢𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐄𝐱𝐩𝐞𝐫𝐢𝐞𝐧𝐜𝐞
Mainly unchanged for 83 winters, skiing at Alta still delivers deep snowfall, sweeping mountain views and a laid-back vibe that generations of skiers fondly recall. What has changed is the weekend and holiday skiing experience at Alta. And while we can't go back in time, we are making changes to manage skier demand to preserve the Alta skiing experience going forward. Implementing a paid parking reservation system on weekends & holidays is a step in that direction.
𝐖𝐡𝐲 𝐰𝐞𝐞𝐤𝐞𝐧𝐝 & 𝐡𝐨𝐥𝐢𝐝𝐚𝐲 𝐩𝐚𝐢𝐝 𝐩𝐚𝐫𝐤𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐫𝐞𝐬𝐞𝐫𝐯𝐚𝐭𝐢𝐨𝐧𝐬?
• Provides Alta skiers the assurance that there will be a parking space before driving up the canyon
• Eases early morning traffic congestion
• Alta skiers will no longer need to arrive hours before first chair to secure a parking spot
• Manage the ski experience by limiting the number of skiers to available terrain & lift capacity
𝐀𝐥𝐭𝐚 𝐩𝐚𝐬𝐬𝐡𝐨𝐥𝐝𝐞𝐫𝐬 𝐡𝐚𝐯𝐞 𝐚𝐜𝐜𝐞𝐬𝐬 𝐭𝐨 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐟𝐨𝐥𝐥𝐨𝐰𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐩𝐞𝐫𝐤𝐬:
• Free weekend & holiday parking reservations for qualifying Alta passholders
• New Family & Friends benefits
• 50% off day tickets at 26 partner resorts
• $269 Ikon Base Pass add-on
𝐏𝐞𝐚𝐜𝐞-𝐨𝐟-𝐌𝐢𝐧𝐝 𝐏𝐮𝐫𝐜𝐡𝐚𝐬𝐢𝐧𝐠
Peace-of-Mind purchasing means that Alta will provide a full refund, no questions asked, for unused 2021-22 Season Passes until December 1st, 2021. Refunds will be compensated at the dollar amount paid.
𝐒𝐞𝐚𝐬𝐨𝐧 𝐏𝐚𝐬𝐬 𝐅𝐀𝐐𝐬: www.alta.com/tickets-and-passes/season-pass-faqs
𝐒𝐞𝐚𝐬𝐨𝐧 𝐏𝐚𝐬𝐬 𝐁𝐞𝐧𝐞𝐟𝐢𝐭𝐬: www.alta.com/tickets-and-passes/benefits
𝐏𝐚𝐫𝐤𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐑𝐞𝐬𝐞𝐫𝐯𝐚𝐭𝐢𝐨𝐧𝐬: www.alta.com/parking-reservations


----------



## thetrailboss (May 4, 2021)

$25 per day for parking reservations at Alta.  $10 for those buying a ticket.  Let the screaming begin.


----------



## snoseek (May 4, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> $25 per day for parking reservations at Alta.  $10 for those buying a ticket.  Let the screaming begin.


If im reading right passholders dont have to pay? If so this is the way.


----------



## p_levert (May 4, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> 𝟐𝟎𝟐𝟏-𝟐𝟐 𝐀𝐋𝐓𝐀 𝐒𝐄𝐀𝐒𝐎𝐍 𝐏𝐀𝐒𝐒𝐄𝐒 𝐀𝐑𝐄 𝐎𝐍 𝐒𝐀𝐋𝐄 𝐍𝐎𝐖--> www.alta.com/tickets-and-passes
> 𝐑𝐞𝐬𝐭𝐨𝐫𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐀𝐥𝐭𝐚'𝐬 𝐖𝐞𝐞𝐤𝐞𝐧𝐝 & 𝐇𝐨𝐥𝐢𝐝𝐚𝐲 𝐒𝐤𝐢𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐄𝐱𝐩𝐞𝐫𝐢𝐞𝐧𝐜𝐞
> Mainly unchanged for 83 winters, skiing at Alta still delivers deep snowfall, sweeping mountain views and a laid-back vibe that generations of skiers fondly recall. What has changed is the weekend and holiday skiing experience at Alta. And while we can't go back in time, we are making changes to manage skier demand to preserve the Alta skiing experience going forward. Implementing a paid parking reservation system on weekends & holidays is a step in that direction.
> 𝐖𝐡𝐲 𝐰𝐞𝐞𝐤𝐞𝐧𝐝 & 𝐡𝐨𝐥𝐢𝐝𝐚𝐲 𝐩𝐚𝐢𝐝 𝐩𝐚𝐫𝐤𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐫𝐞𝐬𝐞𝐫𝐯𝐚𝐭𝐢𝐨𝐧𝐬?
> ...



The email suggests that the weekends are a problem and then everything is great during the week.  I dunno, Alta is decently crowded all week long, including some waiting at the lifts.


----------



## snoseek (May 4, 2021)

p_levert said:


> The email suggests that the weekends are a problem and then everything is great during the week.  I dunno, Alta is decently crowded all week long, including some waiting at the lifts.


True, weekday pow days can get busy as hell. Lot of population close by that can cherry pick days. This is where the ikon hate comes from...its local alot of the time with that pass that create the surge


----------



## thetrailboss (May 4, 2021)

snoseek said:


> If im reading right passholders dont have to pay? If so this is the way.


As an Alta-Bird passholder, I will believe it when I see it.........


----------



## thetrailboss (May 4, 2021)

snoseek said:


> True, weekday pow days can get busy as hell. Lot of population close by that can cherry pick days. This is where the ikon hate comes from...its local alot of the time with that pass that create the surge


Bingo.


----------



## thetrailboss (May 4, 2021)

p_levert said:


> The email suggests that the weekends are a problem and then everything is great during the week.  I dunno, Alta is decently crowded all week long, including some waiting at the lifts.


If someone told me five years ago that Alta would be the "sell-out" that it is now with crowd problems I would have laughed.  I can't believe how much it has changed.


----------



## drjeff (May 4, 2021)

IKON's purchase platforms are a total failure this evening as their earliest deadline is only hours away....

Sounds like Rusty Gregory needs to take a page from Rob Katz's apology playbook and own up to the short comings of his companies online and phone shortcomings during peak demand times...


----------



## thetrailboss (May 4, 2021)

drjeff said:


> IKON's purchase platforms are a total failure this evening as their earliest deadline is only hours away....
> 
> Sounds like Rusty Gregory needs to take a page from Rob Katz's apology playbook and own up to the short comings of his companies online and phone shortcomings during peak demand times...


Good luck with that.


----------



## urungus (May 18, 2021)

Finally received email from Epic today, $729 credit for not using my Epic Local pass this season despite having made reservations at Mt Snow.   Because of the new 20% discount, I was able to upgrade to full unrestricted Epic pass for next season for $53.  Not bad.  Will probably not renew after that unless there is a huge improvement in their East Coast operations.


----------



## Dickc (May 25, 2021)

​

​
INDY PASS​





​
​
*Purchase by May 31 for just $46.50/month*​
Purchase your Indy Pass by May 31 and take advantage of our easy six-payment, interest-free layaway plan. Just $46.50* down and $46.50 per month for five months gets you an adult pass and you'll be on the snow as early as November 16th!
*Does not include 3% service charge for pass processing. See indyskipass.com/pricing for payment plan details.​




​
*Adults $279 • Kids $119 • No Blackouts $379*​



​
*Buy Now. Pay Later!*​



​
​


----------



## thebigo (May 28, 2021)

Had forgotten about the Freedom pass but apparently it is still around and free with a whaleback pass. The whaleback pass is a stupid cheap $180 for adults and $75 for kids. Freedom pass includes Sunlight and Cooper; make for a good Xmas week tour of CO with a couple days at Powderhorn mixed in. They also throw in a season tune at golf and ski; dont know if the tune is valid in Greenland or only Lebanon. Just need to convince the wife that the eight year old and I need a third pass for next year.


----------



## dblskifanatic (Jun 2, 2021)

thebigo said:


> Had forgotten about the Freedom pass but apparently it is still around and free with a whaleback pass. The whaleback pass is a stupid cheap $180 for adults and $75 for kids. Freedom pass includes Sunlight and Cooper; make for a good Xmas week tour of CO with a couple days at Powderhorn mixed in. They also throw in a season tune at golf and ski; dont know if the tune is valid in Greenland or only Lebanon. Just need to convince the wife that the eight year old and I need a third pass for next year.



Not sure I would travel to CO for those three at the end of December unless there was lots of snow in December but the past few years have not been that nice. Powderhorn would be good for a couple days.  Sunlight for a day - lifts are really slow.  and Ski Cooper - Tennessee Pass trails will not be open by the end of December so the remaining trails are fine for just skiing.  Either way a trip out to CO for those three is not worth it IMO - as an add on day for a bigger trip then sure but the GEM Cards works.

Overall, technical terrain at these three will likely be closed around the end of December so at best you are there to just ski them.  A better bet would be mid February to early March.  Sunlight and Powderhorn are tough since they do not get bombed with snow.  I have skied both several times and it is hit or miss.  Great for powder chasing if you are local.

Also with the GEMS Card from Ski Colorado two people can ski 2 days at all three for less money than buying the Whaleback pass.  If you plan on skiing Whaleback many times then that is a different issue.


----------



## p_levert (Jun 15, 2021)

Freedom Pass just added a member: https://skifreedompass.com

The page shows 13 resorts, used to be 12.  Except I'm not sure which resort was added.  Was it Cherry Peak?  Red River?


----------



## thebigo (Jun 15, 2021)

Fairly certain Cherry Peak is the addition. Which, while I would love to ski, is nowhere near any of the other freedom areas.


----------



## p_levert (Jun 15, 2021)

thebigo said:


> Fairly certain Cherry Peak is the addition. Which, while I would love to ski, is nowhere near any of the other freedom areas.



Well, of course, that's what the Freedom Pass is.  Fantastic deal, except that it's really, really hard to use.


----------



## thetrailboss (Jun 15, 2021)

thebigo said:


> Fairly certain Cherry Peak is the addition. Which, while I would love to ski, is nowhere near any of the other freedom areas.


You're not missing much.


----------



## p_levert (Jun 15, 2021)

thetrailboss said:


> You're not missing much.



I rather imagine that Cherry Peak is substantially more interesting than Yawgoo and Mont du Lac, at around 200 ft vert for both of them.  And Cherry Peak is not so far from SLC, so its not the laggard in the Freedom group.


----------



## Dickc (Jun 15, 2021)

p_levert said:


> I rather imagine that Cherry Peak is substantially more interesting than Yawgoo and Mont du Lac, at around 200 ft vert for both of them.  And Cherry Peak is not so far from SLC, so its not the laggard in the Freedom group.


Don'r forger McIntyre in Manchester, NH, another whopping 200 footer!


----------



## dblskifanatic (Jun 15, 2021)

Dickc said:


> Don'r forger McIntyre in Manchester, NH, another whopping 200 footer!



Or Lost Valley at 240 ft.  Chery Creek does seem interesting enough but not the destination resort compared to others in UT.  At least it has 400 AC and Eagle Point also in UT at 4 hours away has 650 AC.

Ski Cooper in Sunlight in CO are decent enough but also far enough apart


----------



## p_levert (Jun 15, 2021)

So what's the best way to play the Freedom Pass?  I believe that Mont du Lac pass in Wisconsin is only around $100, but I believe that you have to pick up the pass in person, so a non-starter.  Yawgoo is cheap, but they have closed season pass sales.  Whaleback is $180 (adult and senior) and they will mail the pass to you.  Is that the best deal?


----------



## thebigo (Jun 15, 2021)

p_levert said:


> So what's the best way to play the Freedom Pass?  I believe that Mont du Lac pass in Wisconsin is only around $100, but I believe that you have to pick up the pass in person, so a non-starter.  Yawgoo is cheap, but they have closed season pass sales.  Whaleback is $180 (adult and senior) and they will mail the pass to you.  Is that the best deal?


Take a look at the cooper pass before committing to Freedom, it is basically freedom but forty plus mountains. No idea if you have to pick it up in person. There is an AZ member that works at Cooper, you could PM if interested.









						Season Passes | Cooper | Chicago Ridge
					






					www.skicooper.com


----------



## p_levert (Jun 15, 2021)

thebigo said:


> Take a look at the cooper pass before committing to Freedom, it is basically freedom but forty plus mountains. No idea if you have to pick it up in person. There is an AZ member that works at Cooper, you could PM if interested.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Funny that you mention Cooper, as they just posted their 2021/22 price for the first time: https://www.skicooper.com/season-passes/

Dang, that's a lot of mountains for $249!  Haha, even includes Yawgoo, Lost V and Mont du Lac!


----------



## KustyTheKlown (Jun 15, 2021)

that shit is tempting to grab some colorado indy resorts, 3 plattekill days, and a reason to go back to PowMow


----------



## Smellytele (Jun 15, 2021)

p_levert said:


> Funny that you mention Cooper, as they just posted their 2021/22 price for the first time: https://www.skicooper.com/season-passes/
> 
> Dang, that's a lot of mountains for $249!  Haha, even includes Yawgoo, Lost V and Mont du Lac!


I’ll be out in Leadville in august if you need me to pick up a pass for you.


----------



## dblskifanatic (Jun 16, 2021)

thebigo said:


> Take a look at the cooper pass before committing to Freedom, it is basically freedom but forty plus mountains. No idea if you have to pick it up in person. There is an AZ member that works at Cooper, you could PM if interested.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



That is interesting, it is the freedom pass with a lot more.  We almost bit on that one last summer.  We use a GEMS card which gave us the other CO ski areas and more but at least this approach you can do Cherry Creek and Powder in the same trip and throw in a day or two at a destination resort and have a good UT based trip.

Dartmouth Skiway is not a bad little add in this case either.  Been there a few times and it is fun to tool around there.


----------



## 2planks2coasts (Jun 16, 2021)

p_levert said:


> Funny that you mention Cooper, as they just posted their 2021/22 price for the first time: https://www.skicooper.com/season-passes/
> 
> Dang, that's a lot of mountains for $249!  Haha, even includes Yawgoo, Lost V and Mont du Lac!



It's $299 unless you're renewing.  Cooper continues to be a sweet pass option.  Lots of mountains.  Notably, the MCP resorts aren't on the list this year. Am I wrong that they were last season?


----------



## BushMogulMaster (Jun 16, 2021)

@2planks2coasts - correct, no MCP partners this season.

Happy to answer any other Cooper questions via PM.


----------



## p_levert (Jun 16, 2021)

And Indy Pass punches back with 2 new areas next week: 



__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1405292752242462720


----------



## thebigo (Jun 16, 2021)

p_levert said:


> And Indy Pass punches back with 2 new areas next week:
> 
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1405292752242462720


Hoping for burke.


----------



## Smellytele (Jun 16, 2021)

thebigo said:


> Hoping for burke.


They did say they were pretty much down in the northeast but ya never know


----------



## p_levert (Jun 21, 2021)

Stu Winchester with the exclusive:


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1406962089080537089
I assume these are a couple of podunk NE areas.  There is not even a mention of this at indyskipass.com, so how good could these places be?


----------



## p_levert (Jun 22, 2021)

Eagle Point in Utah and Sundown in Iowa.  Eagle Point is a worthy addition, not too far from Vegas.  Sundown is fine if you live in Iowa.  Better quality additions than I expected.


----------



## dblskifanatic (Jun 22, 2021)

p_levert said:


> Eagle Point in Utah and Sundown in Iowa.  Eagle Point is a worthy addition, not too far from Vegas.  Sundown is fine if you live in Iowa.  Better quality additions than I expected.



Was that added this week?  because I posted about Eagle Point on June 15th and they were already listed on the Indy Pass site.



> Chery Creek does seem interesting enough but not the destination resort compared to others in UT. At least it has 400 AC and Eagle Point also in UT at 4 hours away has 650 AC.



Edit: I found a report and it does mention Eagle Point as an add.


----------



## xlr8r (Jul 8, 2021)

New England Passes are for sale once again.  Also the Ticket Packs for Loon, Sunday River, and Sugarloaf are now available.  I picked up a unrestricted New England 5 day pack to supplement my Indy Pass.


----------



## dblskifanatic (Jul 12, 2021)

Interesting article that speaks to the Indy Pass and hitting up non mega pass resorts!









						How to Find Places to Snowboard
					

Social media is full of "where do I go snowboard?" Stop asking Facebook to find places and follow our keyboard warrior suggestions instead.




					www.agnarchy.com
				




Good article but using the Indy Pass to plan a trip? Don't think so. If you have the Indy Pass paired up with Ikon or Epic then you have the option to hit a non mega pass resort. That makes sense. We did that with the GEMS Card in Colorado. 

The Indy Pass - their ski areas are spread out like Mountain Collective - very few places can you hit multiple resorts in a week long trip. For day tripping in the east it works pretty well combined with Ikon or Epic.


----------



## 2planks2coasts (Jul 12, 2021)

dblskifanatic said:


> Interesting article that speaks to the Indy Pass and hitting up non mega pass resorts!
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Not sure what map you're looking at, but WA/ID Indy resorts are perfect for weeklong trips.  Fly into SEA then two days at White Pass followed by an evening drive then two days at Mission Ridge,  drive the next day to Silver or 49 North for the final two days. Fly out of GEG.  Probably a dozen variants of the above are possible in WA/ID.  The northeast is even easier.


----------



## abc (Jul 12, 2021)

dblskifanatic said:


> The Indy Pass - their ski areas are spread out like Mountain Collective - very few places can you hit multiple resorts in a week long trip.


Before Ikon, I used Mountain Collective to do week long trip. I think I did TWO of them in one year!


----------



## dblskifanatic (Jul 12, 2021)

2planks2coasts said:


> Not sure what map you're looking at, but WA/ID Indy resorts are perfect for weeklong trips.  Fly into SEA then two days at White Pass followed by an evening drive then two days at Mission Ridge,  drive the next day to Silver or 49 North for the final two days. Fly out of GEG.  Probably a dozen variants of the above are possible in WA/ID.  The northeast is even easier.



I get what you are selling but there are some 4 hour drives in between and plenty of terrain if you do not mind driving.  There is a potential for that in Utah as well.


----------



## abc (Jul 12, 2021)

2planks2coasts said:


> Not sure what map you're looking at, but WA/ID Indy resorts are perfect for weeklong trips.  Fly into SEA then two days at White Pass followed by an evening drive then two days at Mission Ridge,  drive the next day to Silver or 49 North for the final two days. Fly out of GEG.  Probably a dozen variants of the above are possible in WA/ID.  The northeast is even easier.





dblskifanatic said:


> I get what you are selling but there are some 4 hour drives in between and plenty of terrain if you do not mind driving.  There is a potential for that in Utah as well.


Having done similar on Mountain Collectives, I would say the length of the 4 hrs drive isn't a problem. 

However, Indy pass doesn't have the 50% off option as MC pass has. So you're stuck with the exact 2 days in each mountain. You lose the flexibility of staying longer or moving on earlier if the weather pattern so dictates. 

That's where IKON shines. With 5 days, you don't feel strongly about "wasting" a day if condition doesn't warrant staying any more. And you have more rooms to plan your stay to straddle an incoming storm to maximize your potential for powder


----------



## Smellytele (Jul 12, 2021)

abc said:


> Having done similar on Mountain Collectives, I would say the length of the 4 hrs drive isn't a problem.
> 
> However, Indy pass doesn't have the 50% off option as MC pass has. So you're stuck with the exact 2 days in each mountain. You lose the flexibility of staying longer or moving on earlier if the weather pattern so dictates.
> 
> That's where IKON shines. With 5 days, you don't feel strongly about "wasting" a day if condition doesn't warrant staying any more. And you have more rooms to plan your stay to straddle an incoming storm to maximize your potential for powder


Indy does have a 3rd at a discount


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## dblskifanatic (Jul 13, 2021)

Smellytele said:


> Indy does have a 3rd at a discount


you can purchase a third ticket at each resort for 25% off the daily rate


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## abc (Jul 13, 2021)

dblskifanatic said:


> You did a western trip in 2018 or so where you traveled all around, right (took a hiatus from work)?  If so you are familiar with the drives.


My "road trip season" was done with 2 passes, Epic Local and Mountain Collective.

But the year prior, I did 2 separate trips on Mountain Collective alone. I strategically pick 2 "clusters" of resorts on the MC pass and made 2 week long trip out of it (also, my "week long trip" is often 9-10 days)

Truth be told, moving base every 2 days with a 4 hr drives is pretty exhausting. Though that's when the 50% off on additional days came in handy. I planned longer stay on some resorts, just to take a break from the constant packing and unpacking!

I mostly leave a couple hour early on the last day, "moving day", so I could get on the road when there's still some daylight left. Driving on lonely roads of the west well into the night isn't for the faint of heart, which I wasn't. Still, I had to drive into the darkness, though at a more "reasonable" hour such as 7/8 pm.

Some resorts, I stayed only 2 days. With the 2nd day a shorter one, a "shortened" 2 day stay really doesn't do justice to many of the resorts. That's why I stayed additional days in some.

I also had to take into account of incoming storms to alter my "moving day" accordingly. The last thing I need is to turn those 4 hr drives into 6-8 hr drives by driving through storms! Do you know many western states stop plowing after 5pm? 

"Change of plan is part of the plan", as one TV add puts it. 

It can be done. It can be fun. But it's not for everyone.


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## Hawk (Jul 13, 2021)

I'm sorry, I can't understand doing trips like that at all.  At lease if it is not like a sabbatical for a month or more.   If you add up all the time packing, unpacking, traveling, not to mention the time lost not know your surroundings and looking for stuff, your wasting so much of your vacation.  I could see doing camper trips over a longer duration when you have all your stuff organized.  But I am the anti you when it comes to my experience I guess.  I pick a place and stay there and maybe a day trip to another place.  I think my only exception will be my Revi - Kicking Horse vacation in the near future.  I actually like European skiing for bigger adventure where the places are so big it is like skiing many different places but the lifts or busses always get you back to your place.  Half of the fun on the skiing vacation is that you can kick back and not worry about always going 100mph to then next destination.  Just a different mind set I guess.


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## 2planks2coasts (Jul 13, 2021)

Hawk said:


> I'm sorry, I can't understand doing trips like that at all.  At lease if it is not like a sabbatical for a month or more.   If you add up all the time packing, unpacking, traveling, not to mention the time lost not know your surroundings and looking for stuff, your wasting so much of your vacation.  I could see doing camper trips over a longer duration when you have all your stuff organized.  But I am the anti you when it comes to my experience I guess.  I pick a place and stay there and maybe a day trip to another place.  I think my only exception will be my Revi - Kicking Horse vacation in the near future.  I actually like European skiing for bigger adventure where the places are so big it is like skiing many different places but the lifts or busses always get you back to your place.  Half of the fun on the skiing vacation is that you can kick back and not worry about always going 100mph to then next destination.  Just a different mind set I guess.



There's a place, time, and market for both.   With my work having me in random different cities every day, I'm used to never really unpacking and being out of the hotel room in minutes.  I love the two week 10 mountain Grand Tour of the American West.

I also like to settle down in one place and ski locally for a week. I have a timeshare in St. Johann, Austria that is ideal for this.  It's too bad that Cooper lost their MCP partners because a week based in Ogden hitting PowMow, Nordic Valley and Snowbasin (off pass) was the highlight of my 2019 season.

I"ll often use the former type of trip to determine what mountains I should do the latter at.


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## Hawk (Jul 13, 2021)

Ah, Kitzbuhel and the surrounding area.  We almost did that and ended up in St Anton because a friend got us a 2nd story walk up right in town 100 yrds from the lift.  Great trip.  The Austrians are complete animals.  Ski all day, drink til Dark and ski down in the dark.  I saw more people stumbling around in ski boots at 11:00 at night.
I really want to go to Kitsbuhel though.  Is it best to stay in St Johann?


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## abc (Jul 13, 2021)

Hawk said:


> I pick a place and stay there


But how do you "pick" without going there and seeing it first hand?

(I know, I know, that's what this forum is supposed to be...)



2planks2coasts said:


> I"ll often use the former type of trip to determine what mountains I should do the latter at.


That being the point of the "2 days in each mountain" tour!

Some mountains I never return, however famous it is (Sun Valley fit that. It's not my kind of terrain). Others got put into a list of priority for future long visits.


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## dblskifanatic (Jul 13, 2021)

abc said:


> My "road trip season" was done with 2 passes, Epic Local and Mountain Collective.
> 
> But the year prior, I did 2 separate trips on Mountain Collective alone. I strategically pick 2 "clusters" of resorts on the MC pass and made 2 week long trip out of it (also, my "week long trip" is often 9-10 days)
> 
> ...


Remember reading your posts and thought to myself - not sure if I could do that.  Yet when I lived in Colorado, my wife and I day tripped 1.5 -2.5 hours one way whih amount to a lot of driving per day of skiing.

Good on you that you did it - sounded like lots of planning and work.


We plan on going back to Colorado or Utah and are hoping to be closer to the resorts.


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## abc (Jul 13, 2021)

dblskifanatic said:


> Good on you that you did it - sounded like lots of planning and work.


Actually, it wasn't all that much "planning". I simply "plan" to be flexible. 

(For example, I don't pre-book hotel, at least not the kind that's non-refundable. I mostly staying "in town" instead of on mountain. It's usually not a problem finding lodging away from the slopes. Also, having sufficient fund makes that a lot easier. I found typically budget motels tend to sell out fastest. So occasionally, I 'have to' live it large!  )


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## 2planks2coasts (Jul 13, 2021)

Hawk said:


> Ah, Kitzbuhel and the surrounding area.  We almost did that and ended up in St Anton because a friend got us a 2nd story walk up right in town 100 yrds from the lift.  Great trip.  The Austrians are complete animals.  Ski all day, drink til Dark and ski down in the dark.  I saw more people stumbling around in ski boots at 11:00 at night.
> I really want to go to Kitsbuhel though.  Is it best to stay in St Johann?


Apologies, I should have specified which Sankt Johann my place is in. Kitzbuhel is near Sankt Johann in Tirol.  Mine is in Sankt Johann Im Pongau, closer to Salzburg. It's in the giant Ski Amade circuit including Alpendorf, Wagrain, Flachau, Dachstein, etc. Mostly intermediate terrain.

Otherwise, it's pretty similar, eat, drink, ski, repeat. Only adding sleep when absolutely necessary.


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## Dickc (Jul 13, 2021)

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## dblskifanatic (Jul 14, 2021)

Dickc said:


> ​
> ​
> ​
> ​
> ...



A lot depends on how much your daily average is for a day of skiing.  The first is about $78 per day which high in my book and the second is more palatable at $60 but even that is high.  Yet that pricing is better than Epic 5 day pass or the Ikon Session 4 day and close to being in line Copper.  I never really saw the value in 4 or 5 day passes except for Loveland where the average daily rate was between $29 and $37 over the past 5 years.  With my Epic pass I can get the daily average really low.  Heck my Epic Veteran this year was only about $60 more than the Unlimited 5 day and my A Basin is cheaper than either choice.


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## Hawk (Jul 14, 2021)

abc said:


> But how do you "pick" without going there and seeing it first hand?
> 
> (I know, I know, that's what this forum is supposed to be...)


I have been to most of the largest and best mountains out west except for Taos, Crested Butte and Oregon.  I have been all through Colorado, Utah, Wyoming, Montana, Washington and California so I know where I like. Actually I do a tremendous amount of research on line and networking at Sugarbush.  One of benefits of being a long time Sugarbush skier is that I know most everybody that is a regular.  There is a ton of long time older skiers that have been pretty much everywhere.   a couple of sit downs with a beer or two and I know most of what I need.  Some even have real-estate holdings at other mountain's out west.   Most of my stays are from direct recommendations from people I know.  I also read all the reviews on Vacasa, Trip advisor and such as well as forums like this.  I also read all the reviews from forums and news outlets about restaurants, shops and the do's and don'ts.

Lastly I go on google maps and street view and spend some time moving around virtually so I get the lay of the land before I get there so I know exactly how to get to the place, where the closest bars and restaurants and the closest supermarket/liquor/Beer outlet is.

The skiing is usually the biggest adventure but that is the fun.  I get a good enough idea from forums and friends to figure it out.


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## abc (Jul 14, 2021)

Hawk said:


> I have been to most of the largest and best mountains out west except for Taos, Crested Butte and Oregon.  I have been all through Colorado, Utah, Wyoming, Montana, Washington and California so I know where I like. Actually I do a tremendous amount of research on line and networking at Sugarbush.  One of benefits of being a long time Sugarbush skier is that I know most everybody that is a regular.  There is a ton of long time older skiers that have been pretty much everywhere.   a couple of sit downs with a beer or two and I know most of what I need.  Some even have real-estate holdings at other mountain's out west.   Most of my stays are from direct recommendations from people I know.  I also read all the reviews on Vacasa, Trip advisor and such as well as forums like this.  I also read all the reviews from forums and news outlets about restaurants, shops and the do's and don'ts.
> 
> Lastly I go on google maps and street view and spend some time moving around virtually so I get the lay of the land before I get there so I know exactly how to get to the place, where the closest bars and restaurants and the closest supermarket/liquor/Beer outlet is.
> 
> The skiing is usually the biggest adventure but that is the fun.  I get a good enough idea from forums and friends to figure it out.


So a quick spin of 2 days each to 3-4 resorts is no less valid way of "research"! 

With the bonus of getting a whole lot of skiing in.


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## Hawk (Jul 14, 2021)

No one said it was not a way to do research.  All I was saying was I would never travel that way.  Pack, Unpack, ski, pack, drive, unpack ski, ON and ON.  While you are doing that, I am drinking in the bar meeting interesting people, going ski mobiling at night, hot tub and not driving, packing and unpacking.  That is all I am saying.  Don't get me wrong.  I have done that on several vacations and said I will never do that again.  You are more like my 24 yo nephew.  He has to cram in everything.  Never again.  Actually with my job I can't really take weeks to go on an extended vacation.  Maybe in a few years in retirement I will take on a vacation more like that but a for a month so the stays are longer.


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## p_levert (Jul 14, 2021)

Hawk said:


> No one said it was not a way to do research.  All I was saying was I would never travel that way.  Pack, Unpack, ski, pack, drive, unpack ski, ON and ON.  While you are doing that, I am drinking in the bar meeting interesting people, going ski mobiling at night, hot tub and not driving, packing and unpacking.  That is all I am saying.  Don't get me wrong.  I have done that on several vacations and said I will never do that again.  You are more like my 24 yo nephew.  He has to cram in everything.  Never again.  Actually with my job I can't really take weeks to go on an extended vacation.  Maybe in a few years in retirement I will take on a vacation more like that but a for a month so the stays are longer.


Well I'm in the abc camp.  It's a lot of fun to go exploring in the American West.  Yeah, it can be tiring but it's also rewarding.  I think it's probably easier to do if you are by yourself because you don't have to put up with the complainers in the car.


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## jaytrem (Jul 14, 2021)

p_levert said:


> I think it's probably easier to do if you are by yourself because you don't have to put up with the complainers in the car.



Just gotta be selective with who you bring along.  No matter how crazy a plan I come up with, both my kids and 2 best ski buddies are happy to come along.  Been doing it so long I wouldn't know what to do with myself if we just stayed in one place.  Started taking the kids on "safari" type trips when they were 5.  Luckily they don't know any better!


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## machski (Jul 14, 2021)

Boyne sold out of the New England 5 day passes today, at the lowest pricing anyway.  Who knows what #s they were offering, but that was fast for a 5 ticket pass.


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## Mum skier (Jul 14, 2021)

machski said:


> Boyne sold out of the New England 5 day passes today, at the lowest pricing anyway.  Who knows what #s they were offering, but that was fast for a 5 ticket pass.


Yes, just went to buy ours after getting home from work, credit card all ready in my hand, and all gone!  Seems like I have until September to decide whether to do the Maine 4 day ( which I did last year) so will wait and see if the New England option come back late in the summer. Thought they were kidding with their 90% sold message!


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## ss20 (Jul 14, 2021)

p_levert said:


> Well I'm in the abc camp.  It's a lot of fun to go exploring in the American West.  Yeah, it can be tiring but it's also rewarding.  I think it's probably easier to do if you are by yourself because you don't have to put up with the complainers in the car.



Same with me.  Get time off, start driving.  I did a 4 week roadtrip out west in late November/December and a 10 day New England trip in March and early April.  I had an idea of where I was going to go when I left the house.


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## 2planks2coasts (Jul 14, 2021)

Indy to announce 4 new ski areas on Tuesday 29 July per Storm Skiing Blog.


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## abc (Jul 14, 2021)

Hawk said:


> While you are doing that, I am drinking in the bar meeting interesting people, going ski mobiling at night, hot tub and not driving, packing and unpacking.


Everyone's situation is different.

I can't drink (due to some genetic limitation  ). So there's not a whole lot of "meeting interesting people" in the bar happening for me.

Still, even with only 2 days in each resort, there's still one night that I wasn't moving. So if I were so inclined, I could theoretically go "meet interesting people" 1 day in each place! (keep in mind I was the one who raised the objection that 2 days in one resort are too short, 3-4 would be more my style)

Yes, there's hot tubing, which is usually how I met people instead of at the watering hole. That I do on days I'm not moving. But for the most part, evening for me are just hot tub, dinner and early to bed. In fact, my main objection of the constant moving is it cuts into my "early to bed" routine.



p_levert said:


> Well I'm in the abc camp.  It's a lot of fun to go exploring in the American West.  Yeah, it can be tiring but it's also rewarding.


"It can be done. It can be fun. But it aren't for everyone"


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## Geoff (Jul 15, 2021)

Hawk said:


> Ah, Kitzbuhel and the surrounding area.  We almost did that and ended up in St Anton because a friend got us a 2nd story walk up right in town 100 yrds from the lift.  Great trip.  The Austrians are complete animals.  Ski all day, drink til Dark and ski down in the dark.  I saw more people stumbling around in ski boots at 11:00 at night.
> I really want to go to Kitsbuhel though.  Is it best to stay in St Johann?


Err.  Those are usually Germans in the bars at midnight wearing ski boots, not Austrians.   It’s like seeing people doing bar crawls at Mount Snow and saying “those Vermonters are real animals”.  

I’ve skied Kitzbuhel a few times when I was working in Munich.  It’s lower elevation and doesn’t have reliable natural snow.  I can ski man made groomers in New England.  I wouldn’t pick it months in advance for a week trip.


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## Hawk (Jul 15, 2021)

I disagree. My experience came from hanging around with our guide and his friends and listening to the stories.  He was the one pointing out Austrians, who they were and how hardy they were.  Then I saw the same people later.

You need to go on trips with me.  It always snows where ever I go.  I am a good luck charm.  I think I have been blanked out on maybe one or two trips in the last 30 years..  Most recently it was Squaw visiting friends that live there and I would have gone anyways. I'm going back to Austria soon for an extended stay so maybe I will rent a car and go from place to place.  ;-)


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## Hawk (Jul 15, 2021)

abc said:


> Everyone's situation is different.
> 
> I can't drink (due to some genetic limitation  ). So there's not a whole lot of "meeting interesting people" in the bar happening for me.
> 
> ...


Fair enough.  I will agree that it's not for everyone.  I guess the main thing is having fun and if you are having fun then it is good.


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## jimmywilson69 (Jul 15, 2021)

^^^^^

This


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## abc (Jul 15, 2021)

Hawk said:


> Fair enough.  I will agree that it's not for everyone.  I guess the main thing is having fun and if you are having fun then it is good.


It’s hard NOT to have fun when there’s snow to ski on!  

Some people seek out heart-in-stomach gnarly terrain, others look for quiet and peace in the forest etc… But the main reason most of us go out west is for the consistent snow coverage. (if we luck out with powder, that’s just the icing on the cake). So the specific mountain or terrain or lines aren’t always the most important thing. 

For many here, they’ve been skiing a good portion of their life. They’ve been to many of the “better known” resorts, some more than once. It’s worth to them to explore some of the ”rest” of the offerings from time to time! So a road trip is not just for those young and inexperienced in the ski travel. 

For me, I love travel. To see new places, or see places in new light. So I also visit ski country in summer. The moving around serves not just to check out ski mountains, but also the surrounding towns and villages too. (This summer, I visited Colorado for the first time IN SUMMER! I was blown away by the beauty when the snow is gone)


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## dblskifanatic (Jul 15, 2021)

abc said:


> It’s hard NOT to have fun when there’s snow to ski on!
> 
> Some people seek out heart-in-stomach gnarly terrain, others look for quiet and peace in the forest etc… But the main reason most of us go out west is for the consistent snow coverage. (if we luck out with powder, that’s just the icing on the cake). So the specific mountain or terrain or lines aren’t always the most important thing.
> 
> ...



Now that our kids our out of the house and on their own, my wife and I are doing just that.  We have done A Basin, Vail, Steamboat and Winter Park in one trip staying at different locations.  Last fall we did a non skiing trip that took us through Gunnison (Black Canyon) to Telluride to Arizona to Durango, Silverton and Ouray (Million Dollar Highway) then to Taos and Sante Fe which included our dogs - they never complained.  Some times we switch hotels other times we try to find something centrally located that may require a bit of a drive.  Just make it an adventure.


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## dblskifanatic (Aug 16, 2021)

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