# Mount Snow 2009/2010



## Newpylong (Oct 11, 2009)

According to the Mount Snow passholders site, Mount Snow will be removing the age old, "upper, lower" trail designations for this season. Very interesting...


----------



## billski (Oct 11, 2009)

Newpylong said:


> According to the Mount Snow passholders site, Mount Snow will be removing the age old, "upper, lower" trail designations for this season. Very interesting...


 They've probably invented some new scheme which splits it into three so they can get their trail count up there with the bad boys :idea:


----------



## Glenn (Oct 12, 2009)

billski said:


> They've probably invented some new scheme which splits it into three so they can get their trail count up there with the bad boys :idea:



They're not big into trail count; they most report on percentage open or acreage. :wink:


Anyone notice the new trail maps? The woods ares areas aren't really marked or labeled.


----------



## drjeff (Oct 12, 2009)

billski said:


> They've probably invented some new scheme which splits it into three so they can get their trail count up there with the bad boys :idea:



Nope, the '09-10 trail count went DOWN from 101 to 80!  Has it's pro's and cons obviously.  Mid season - a good, honest thing IMHO - kind of like how Stowe USED to do it (1 trail is 1 trail reguardless of how many times it intersects with another).  

Early/Late season - can cause some issues, as when an upper section of a trail is open, the whole trail will be listed as open which I can see causing some confusion/angst.  Bottomline though is the PRIMARY stat that Mount Snow uses these days to report the volume of trails open is acreage, with the actually trail count be the secondary number.

Such a tough thing, trailcount/acreage/upper/lower/etc to come up with a system that is honest and easy for "Joe Q Public" to understand.


----------



## vlewis (Oct 12, 2009)

*Trail Count*

I'm glad that this topic is getting some conversation going.  We have changed a lot on our trail map this year and our new count is 80 trails.  We feel that this is a more accurate count of a trail actually being a trail.  The goal is transparency, when we report something you know its right.  We started this process last year by switching the way we report to acreage and percent open.  This is the next step in the process.  

Someone also noticed that our tree trails are no longer marked.  This year the trees are always open.  The reason for this is that, while we hand clear trees and brush in some tree sections, we do not maintain all tree terrain (we cannot groom or make snow in the trees) so marking them as a trail is not accurate.  Tree skiing/riding is for experts only and guests need to determine if conditions in the trees are suitable for them to handle. 

We're very excited for this winter and are hoping to start making some snow soon so keep and eye on our website.  

-Vinnie


----------



## Glenn (Oct 12, 2009)

Excellent info. Thanks Vinnie.  :beer:


----------



## billski (Oct 12, 2009)

vlewis said:


> The goal is transparency, when we report something you know its right.  We started this process last year by switching the way we report to acreage and percent open.  This is the next step in the process.
> ..
> Someone also noticed that our tree trails are no longer marked.  This year the trees are always open.  The reason for this is that, while we hand clear trees and brush in some tree sections, we do not maintain all tree terrain (we cannot groom or make snow in the trees) so marking them as a trail is not accurate.  Tree skiing/riding is for experts only and guests need to determine if conditions in the trees are suitable for them to handle.
> 
> -Vinnie



Vinnie, Thanks for responding.  This is clearly a breath of fresh "cold" air.  Very positive.

I've got mixed feelings about the woods marking.  There are woods and there are woods.  Experts and Experts.  While one may be an expert on the maintained trails, they can still be a rank amateur in the woods.  Ya gotta learn somewhere.  I would advocate toward a selected group of marked woods paths (let's call them "recommended routes.")  Not official trails, but something you can try and know you're not going to get into an interesting situation, like a 10 foot gully or snowmaking pipes that need to be scaled or coming out down the road from the resort.  I know many people unwilling to try woods for precisely that reason.  

Yeah, one could argue that you have to be game for that kind of stuff going into it, but I'm also looking at skier retention over time.  For some people like me, skiing on marked trails simply got boring.  Almost so boring that I didn't want to go back.  I couldn't find any powder, there were too many people, blah, blah, all the usual reasons.  I'd like to see each and every resort prosper, so I'm willing to give a little to get there.  There are plenty of stashes that will always remain that way.

I like to keep secrets as much as anyone, but I believe there should be some minimal number of places that woods-never-evers can try out, close to marked trails, so bailing out is easy.  At some resorts, there are woods on the map and woods off the map.   Keeps everyone happy.  It doesn't even have to be on the map, per say.  Could a note somewhere, "for those who want to try  woods skiing, we suggest going between trail x and y."

By the way, I love the woods at Mt. Snow.  The only reason I quit doing them each day is because my ski partner had enough and wanted back on the groomers.  Otherwise I'd never come out.

Thanks again.

b


----------



## reefer (Oct 12, 2009)

vlewis said:


> I'm glad that this topic is getting some conversation going.  We have changed a lot on our trail map this year and our new count is 80 trails.  We feel that this is a more accurate count of a trail actually being a trail.  The goal is transparency, when we report something you know its right.  We started this process last year by switching the way we report to acreage and percent open.  This is the next step in the process.
> 
> Someone also noticed that our tree trails are no longer marked.  This year the trees are always open.  The reason for this is that, while we hand clear trees and brush in some tree sections, we do not maintain all tree terrain (we cannot groom or make snow in the trees) so marking them as a trail is not accurate.  Tree skiing/riding is for experts only and guests need to determine if conditions in the trees are suitable for them to handle.
> 
> ...




Thanks for the input Vinnie. 
Did they try to clear out some of the stuff that fell during the ice storm last year? Things were quite messy especially Sap Tapper and Fantastics?
Also, I know there are a few of us that would gladly come up and volunteer for a weekend to help clear things up - under mountain ops guidance of course, sort of what MRG does. Has this ever been considered?
I hope Mt. Snow stays in tune with the "tree skiing" boom that is going on throughout the Northeast at places like Whiteface, Sugarbush, and Saddleback to name a few.
It is definitely an attraction that keeps me coming to Mount Snow.
Keith


----------



## chrisrunsi (Oct 12, 2009)

+1 on loving the mt. snow woods. Had an epic day last year in late Feb early March. It was some sort of holiday week I think. Storm rolled in saturday night and got heavy as sunday continued. Most people headed home early to beat the worst of the storm but we stuck it out and had a good 12 inches of mainly untouched tree powder. Went down as one of my best days in the last couple years.


----------



## vlewis (Oct 12, 2009)

We do not plan on marking any sort of tree skiing area this year.  Our staff needs to communicate some of the options to our guests.  What I like about this is it gives us the opportunity to have a conversation about their skiing ability and direct them to a tree skiing area more suitable for their level.

I'm going to have to get back to you about what has been cleared out of the woods from the ice storm last December.  I'll get in touch with our mountain manager and let you know.  Thanks.

-Vinnie


----------



## reefer (Oct 12, 2009)

vlewis said:


> We do not plan on marking any sort of tree skiing area this year.  Our staff needs to communicate some of the options to our guests.  What I like about this is it gives us the opportunity to have a conversation about their skiing ability and direct them to a tree skiing area more suitable for their level.
> 
> I'm going to have to get back to you about what has been cleared out of the woods from the ice storm last December.  I'll get in touch with our mountain manager and let you know.  Thanks.
> 
> -Vinnie





Thanks again Vinnie. I love the "no-marking" part. 
The beginners can stay over at Carinthia. Claim Jumper is very visible form the high speed quad and a perfect spot for entry level woods skiers..........I believe this happens already! Same with the Boonies and Frontier on the main face. 
I don't mind the extra obstacles the ice storm dropped.......just taking away some good lines. Thought I would ask.


----------



## drjeff (Oct 12, 2009)

vlewis said:


> We do not plan on marking any sort of tree skiing area this year.  Our staff needs to communicate some of the options to our guests.  What I like about this is it gives us the opportunity to have a conversation about their skiing ability and direct them to a tree skiing area more suitable for their level.
> 
> I'm going to have to get back to you about what has been cleared out of the woods from the ice storm last December.  I'll get in touch with our mountain manager and let you know.  Thanks.
> 
> -Vinnie



Vinnie, if I bought you say a whole slew of beers, all season long, could I convince you NOT to have the staff recommend certain tree areas?   :lol: :beer:


----------



## vlewis (Oct 12, 2009)

drjeff said:


> Vinnie, if I bought you say a whole slew of beers, all season long, could I convince you NOT to have the staff recommend certain tree areas?   :lol: :beer:


Nice try!  I don't see that happening but Guinness is my favorite beer, feel free to buy me some any time just for being an all around great guy.


----------



## MommaBear (Oct 12, 2009)

vlewis said:


> This year the trees are always open.



I believe that was the policy last year as well.  Question that came up for us - if Olympic is roped off, can the Trials still be accessed without reprecussion?  From where we enter, we had to duck the rope quite a few times to get to them (since Olympic was closed so often).


----------



## Glenn (Oct 12, 2009)

First in line for any "handouts" for firewood...err "blowdowns" that come out of said tree areas.  :beer:


----------



## drjeff (Oct 12, 2009)

vlewis said:


> Nice try!  I don't see that happening but Guinness is my favorite beer, feel free to buy me some any time just for being an all around great guy.



Consider it a done deal then at some point this season, I'll pretend to be Irish for a little while in Cuzzins!


----------



## billski (Oct 13, 2009)

vlewis said:


> We do not plan on marking any sort of tree skiing area this year. Our staff needs to communicate some of the options to our guests. What I like about this is it gives us the opportunity to have a conversation about their skiing ability and direct them to a tree skiing area more suitable for their level.
> 
> -Vinnie


 
Perfect!


----------



## billski (Oct 13, 2009)

MommaBear said:


> I believe that was the policy last year as well. Question that came up for us - if Olympic is roped off, can the Trials still be accessed without reprecussion? From where we enter, we had to duck the rope quite a few times to get to them (since Olympic was closed so often).


 
I always find it's beneficial to talk to patrol, since they love skiing too, and are fairly reasonable about it at most resorts. At one unnamed area, the top of a glade access was roped off at the top because it was an ice cliff, but an unmarked cut-in slightly below the ledges led to simply delightful goods and was perfectly fine with patrol. Every patrol seems to have a slightly different philosophy, and one day it's good another day its verbotten. It's good to be in the know.


----------



## vlewis (Oct 13, 2009)

reefer said:


> Thanks for the input Vinnie.
> Did they try to clear out some of the stuff that fell during the ice storm last year? Things were quite messy especially Sap Tapper and Fantastics?
> Also, I know there are a few of us that would gladly come up and volunteer for a weekend to help clear things up - under mountain ops guidance of course, sort of what MRG does. Has this ever been considered?
> I hope Mt. Snow stays in tune with the "tree skiing" boom that is going on throughout the Northeast at places like Whiteface, Sugarbush, and Saddleback to name a few.
> ...



I spoke with our mountain manager about clearing out some of the fallen brush from the ice storm, here is what he told me:

We have been knocking down  the deadfall. We are also sending in the hand mowing crew on our usual rotation- Every 2-3 years a tree skiing area gets cut with a brush saw, depending on undergrowth.


----------



## reefer (Oct 13, 2009)

vlewis said:


> I spoke with our mountain manager about clearing out some of the fallen brush from the ice storm, here is what he told me:
> 
> We have been knocking down  the deadfall. We are also sending in the hand mowing crew on our usual rotation- Every 2-3 years a tree skiing area gets cut with a brush saw, depending on undergrowth.




Thanks again. Hopefully I'll have a trip report sooner than later...................last couple of years the woods have been great even before Christmas. Those previous picks are from 12/21/08!
I'll let you know when I'm coming up so I can buy you a Guinness too. You'll have to bar hop because unlike drjeff, I'm more of a mellow Timberhouse guy - hanging out with Leo and Alice.......................


----------



## RootDKJ (Oct 13, 2009)

Wow...truth in advertising.

I haven't been to Mt Snow since I was a kid, but I have a feeling I'll be there this year at some point.


----------



## Beetlenut (Oct 13, 2009)

MommaBear said:


> ... Question that came up for us - if Olympic is roped off, can the Trials still be accessed without reprecussion? From where we enter, we had to duck the rope quite a few times to get to them (since Olympic was closed so often).


 
+1 I would like to hear an answer to this one too!


----------



## vlewis (Oct 13, 2009)

reefer said:


> Thanks again. Hopefully I'll have a trip report sooner than later...................last couple of years the woods have been great even before Christmas. Those previous picks are from 12/21/08!
> I'll let you know when I'm coming up so I can buy you a Guinness too. You'll have to bar hop because unlike drjeff, I'm more of a mellow Timberhouse guy - hanging out with Leo and Alice.......................



You got a deal.  I hope to get out there and enjoy some of those trees with you as well as the Guinness!


----------



## vlewis (Oct 13, 2009)

MommaBear said:


> I believe that was the policy last year as well.  Question that came up for us - if Olympic is roped off, can the Trials still be accessed without reprecussion?  From where we enter, we had to duck the rope quite a few times to get to them (since Olympic was closed so often).



While the trees are always open if the trail to get to that section is closed it is not accessible and it’s not okay to duck the rope.  Sorry you will just have to wait for Olympic to open up.


----------



## tylerjames (Oct 13, 2009)

Mount Snow just launched a new website check it out.


----------



## Glenn (Oct 13, 2009)

tylerjames said:


> Mount Snow just launched a new website check it out.



Cool! They seem to have been updating the overall look every so often as of the past year or so.


----------



## MommaBear (Oct 13, 2009)

vlewis said:


> While the trees are always open if the trail to get to that section is closed it is not accessible and it’s not okay to duck the rope.  Sorry you will just have to wait for Olympic to open up.



Well then, if the trees are always open, I guess our mission for this year is to start looking for other access points.  Thanks!  .    :wink:


----------



## Beetlenut (Oct 13, 2009)

MommaBear said:


> Well then, if the trees are always open, I guess our mission for this year is to start looking for other access points.  Thanks!  .    :wink:



Have to find a way into the Trials above Olympic through the woods. I'm sure it's doable. Silly rules!!


----------



## billski (Oct 13, 2009)

MommaBear said:


> Well then, if the trees are always open, I guess our mission for this year is to start looking for other access points. Thanks! . :wink:


 
ba-da bing!   you nailed it.


----------



## Zand (Oct 13, 2009)

I think I've ducked the Olympic rope more than any other rope... just for the Trials. Did it Easter weekend last year... Trials were almost midwinter conditions yet Olympic required walking...


----------



## tylerjames (Oct 14, 2009)

Mount Snow is making SNOW tonight!
(sorry for the large picture)


----------



## drjeff (Oct 14, 2009)

Saturday - Launch Pad - let the games begin!


----------



## RootDKJ (Oct 14, 2009)

tylerjames said:


> Mount Snow is making SNOW tonight!
> (sorry for the large picture)


That picture is fv(king awesome!!!:beer:


----------



## Glenn (Oct 15, 2009)

Woohoo!!!!!! I may have to head over this weekend!


----------



## Greg (Oct 15, 2009)

Running the lift too:

http://news.alpinezone.com/65058/


----------



## Glenn (Oct 15, 2009)

Greg said:


> Running the lift too:
> 
> http://news.alpinezone.com/65058/



Outstanding!!!


----------



## bvibert (Oct 15, 2009)

Greg said:


> Running the lift too:
> 
> http://news.alpinezone.com/65058/



Cool!  If I were closer I'd definitely head up for some turns.


----------



## drjeff (Oct 15, 2009)

bvibert said:


> Cool!  If I were closer I'd definitely head up for some turns.



*Some* turns are the key word.  Just the beginner hill and its lift that has only 15 chairs on the entire line (trust me the only way I know the exact number of chairs on that lift is from my kids lapping it incessently before and after their lessons  )  Lift served, yes, some features set up, yes. Donations to the food pantry accepted in lieu of $$ for a lift ticket - yes.  Very cool - yes!!  It's amazing what 9 Fan Guns and not a lot of hours of cold air can do!


----------



## vcunning (Oct 15, 2009)

And here is what the beginners hill looks like from Mount Snow's web cam (which MS kindly repointed at DrJeff's request).


----------



## bvibert (Oct 15, 2009)

drjeff said:


> *Some* turns are the key word.  Just the beginner hill and its lift that has only 15 chairs on the entire line (trust me the only way I know the exact number of chairs on that lift is from my kids lapping it incessently before and after their lessons  )  Lift served, yes, some features set up, yes. Donations to the food pantry accepted in lieu of $$ for a lift ticket - yes.  Very cool - yes!!  It's amazing what 9 Fan Guns and not a lot of hours of cold air can do!



I fully understand that, otherwise I'd be driving up from CT just to hit it...

Despite that it's the bunny hill it's still really good stoke for area skiers and it gets people thinking about skiing.  Donating all the proceeds to the food pantry really tops it off IMHO. :beer:


----------



## drjeff (Oct 15, 2009)

bvibert said:


> I fully understand that, otherwise I'd be driving up from CT just to hit it...
> 
> Despite that it's the bunny hill it's still really good stoke for area skiers and it gets people thinking about skiing.  Donating all the proceeds to the food pantry really tops it off IMHO. :beer:



Not that I'm biased or anything  , but Mount Snow just gets it!


----------



## Glenn (Oct 15, 2009)

Deerfield Valley Chamber of Commerce just sent an e-mail out about Mt. Snow.  8)


----------



## vcunning (Oct 15, 2009)

Glenn said:


> Deerfield Valley Chamber of Commerce just sent an e-mail out about Mt. Snow.  8)



Available for viewing here. 

Of course, the press release is from Vinnie who love Guinness, so one can only guess what state of mind he was in when he posted it.


----------



## Rambo (Oct 15, 2009)

Interesting indeed:


----------



## jaywbigred (Oct 15, 2009)

Rambo said:


> Interesting indeed:




Wow, where'd you get that?

Anyone else having trouble with Mt. Snow's new website? Also, it seems like a downgrade from the prior one....


----------



## Rambo (Oct 15, 2009)

jaywbigred said:


> Wow, where'd you get that?
> 
> Anyone else having trouble with Mt. Snow's new website? Also, it seems like a downgrade from the prior one....



From Mt. Snow's website. Bottom left corner under media gallery. Here are 2 more pics:


----------



## drjeff (Oct 15, 2009)

Rambo said:


> From Mt. Snow's website. Bottom left corner under media gallery. Here are 2 more pics:



Ken Gaitor, the grinning guy in the top photo, and one of the guru's behind Carinthia, looks mighty happy to have some snow to play with!  I'm guessing that he's really hoping for another good night or two of fan gun production so he can hop in his Pisten Bully and play in the snow, rather than just using human power to set up the features for Saturday's rail jam!


----------



## Rambo (Oct 15, 2009)

Mount Snow promo vid:

http://vimeo.com/7086395


----------



## Glenn (Oct 16, 2009)

Rambo said:


> Mount Snow promo vid:
> 
> http://vimeo.com/7086395



Nice find! 

Great pic of Gaitor! I'd say he's just as excited as we all are.


----------



## drjeff (Oct 16, 2009)

Glenn said:


> Nice find!
> 
> Great pic of Gaitor! I'd say he's just as excited as we all are.



Can't wait for the AM update, based on random webcam look ins last night, and seeing the glorious lights of the fan guns on, I'm guessing they had another decent night of production! 

FYI, in having their webcam up this AM, the Fan Guns ran until about 10AM


----------



## Glenn (Oct 16, 2009)

I'd love to make it over there this weekend. But we're not heading up until Saturday AM...and I have a ton of stuff to do around the house.


----------



## Newpylong (Oct 16, 2009)

Why do you think they put effort into a beginner trail? never made sense to me...


----------



## SKIQUATTRO (Oct 16, 2009)

growing up in CT, MT Snow was our home mtn, only 2 hrs away, I remember the outdoor pool and the lift with the bug-eye'd shield that closed around you.....went back about 4 years ago (2x in one season) and was put off both times, havent been back nor do we have plans too...maybe the new mgmt turned things around....


----------



## Newpylong (Oct 16, 2009)

SKIQUATTRO said:


> growing up in CT, MT Snow was our home mtn, only 2 hrs away, I remember the outdoor pool and the lift with the bug-eye'd shield that closed around you.....went back about 4 years ago (2x in one season) and was put off both times, havent been back nor do we have plans too...maybe the new mgmt turned things around....



Did any ASC mountains ever not put people off?

If you're not looking for any couloirs (ha), Mount Snow pretty much has something for everyone and I think it would be tough to be turned off nowadays.


----------



## drjeff (Oct 16, 2009)

Newpylong said:


> Why do you think they put effort into a beginner trail? never made sense to me...





It's really quite simple.  A very large portion of one of their target markets now is the park/pipe crew.  It doesn't take a lot of time/effort to show off the power of the fan guns in weather like this to make enough to get a small park open which they can pretty much guarentee will be filled with lots of folks hitting the features this weekend.  Great PR.  Gets the internet buzz going both for the in a few weeks "real opening" parks crowd, AND gets the non parks crowd excited about the fan gun firepower to come hopefully in the next 10 days or so!  

I'm quite sure that even if it is just on launch pad with some park features, the revenue they'll generate from the buzz of being able to say open for lift served on October 17th in the coming weeks will more than offset the cost of making the snow.


----------



## RootDKJ (Oct 16, 2009)

Newpylong said:


> Why do you think they put effort into a beginner trail? never made sense to me...


Is the bar going to be open?


----------



## Glenn (Oct 19, 2009)

Did anyone venture over there this weekend?


----------



## drjeff (Oct 19, 2009)

Glenn said:


> Did anyone venture over there this weekend?



Apparently close to 1000 did,  however I'm not sure if anyone from AZ was part of the adolescent rail fest!

Over $5000 in cash and lots of cans of food raised for the Deerfield Valley Food pantry!  Great job!


----------



## Glenn (Oct 19, 2009)

I read over on the Mt. Snow site that MommaBear made it over there. I'll also check out the TR in the TR forum.


----------



## jaywbigred (Oct 22, 2009)

Mt. Snow not opening this weekend bc of NFP in forecast.

http://mountsnow.com/snowreport.php

Did get a kick out of this though:

Weather: partly sunny skies

Acres of Skiing:
0  
Miles of Skiing:
0  
Percent Open:
0  
Acres We Plan to Have Open This Weekend:
0  
*Primary Surface:
grass  
Secondary Surface:
snow  *
Number of Lifts Open:
0  
Number of Lifts Open This Weekend:
0  
New Snow In the Past 24 hrs:
0 "
New Snow In the Past 0	days:
0 "
Grooming:
0  
Snowmaking:
0  
Base Temperature (7AM):
45°F
Summit Temperature (7AM):
38°F
Average Base Depth:
0 "
Summit Base Depth:
0 "


----------



## drjeff (Oct 22, 2009)

Expect some pics of whats left this weekend


----------



## ta&idaho (Oct 29, 2009)

Question for the Mt Snow crowd: what do you like to ski other than the North Face and Bear Trap?


----------



## billski (Oct 29, 2009)

ta&idaho said:


> Question for the Mt Snow crowd: what do you like to ski other than the North Face and Bear Trap?


  I'm no regular, but the woods alongside Olympic are a lot of fun.


----------



## ta&idaho (Oct 29, 2009)

billski said:


> I'm no regular, but the woods alongside Olympic are a lot of fun.



Agreed, but that's over on the North Face (unless I'm thinking of something else).  I'm curious if anyone finds anything on the front side consistently interesting.


----------



## drjeff (Oct 29, 2009)

ta&idaho said:


> Question for the Mt Snow crowd: what do you like to ski other than the North Face and Bear Trap?



Depends on what I'm in the mood for.  If the snow is good in the trees, I'm in them, all over the mountain often for the full day.  Sometimes if it's more of a groomer day, I just love ripping big GS turns down trails like South Bowl and even Snowdance.  Sometimes, if it's a nice sunny day, I really enjoy a slower cruise down Big Dipper or Little Dipper in Sunbrook and just admire the views.  

The majority of the time though, if we're talking a 100% wide open Mount Snow the vast majority of my time on the hill will be spent on natural snow (trees + trails).  Early and late season (or immediately after a freeze up) is when I spend most of my time on the snowmaking trails.


----------



## jarrodski (Oct 29, 2009)

ta&idaho said:


> Question for the Mt Snow crowd: what do you like to ski other than the North Face and Bear Trap?



carinthia.... otherwise i'll be on the north face... unless im with the girl... then the front areas... no idea what the trail names are.


----------



## ta&idaho (Oct 29, 2009)

I guess my question is whether any of this:


drjeff said:


> The majority of the time though, if we're talking a 100% wide open Mount Snow the vast majority of my time on the hill will be spent on natural snow (trees + trails).  Early and late season (or immediately after a freeze up) is when I spend most of my time on the snowmaking trails.


is to be found anywhere other than the North Face side of the mountain.  I've explored pretty thoroughly (I think), and seem to always end up punctuating laps on the North Face with the occassional scenic cruiser down the front or one of the Sunbrook trails.  Just trying to figure out if I'm missing something on the front.

Thanks!


----------



## drjeff (Oct 29, 2009)

ta&idaho said:


> I guess my question is whether any of this:
> 
> is to be found anywhere other than the North Face side of the mountain.  I've explored pretty thoroughly (I think), and seem to always end up punctuating laps on the North Face with the occassional scenic cruiser down the front or one of the Sunbrook trails.  Just trying to figure out if I'm missing something on the front.
> 
> Thanks!



You can very often find some good trees, that aren't on the map (okay, this year since they're technically ALWAYS open on an enter at your own risk situation there aren't any tree areas on the trail map) on the lower 2/3rd's of the main face (basically from the top of either Canyon or Nitro quads down) where the forest is mainly maple/birch and hence not a lot of branch issues.

Now, if you happened to say look at a Mount Snow Mountain Biking/Hiking trail guide, of course you'd never find any bike/hiking trails that are skiable in the winter


----------



## ta&idaho (Oct 29, 2009)

drjeff said:


> You can very often find some good trees, that aren't on the map (okay, this year since they're technically ALWAYS open on an enter at your own risk situation there aren't any tree areas on the trail map) on the lower 2/3rd's of the main face (basically from the top of either Canyon or Nitro quads down) where the forest is mainly maple/birch and hence not a lot of branch issues.
> 
> Now, if you happened to say look at a Mount Snow Mountain Biking/Hiking trail guide, of course you'd never find any bike/hiking trails that are skiable in the winter



Interesting...the hiking/biking topo map with color-coded tree zones and ski run overlay is pretty cool.  I'll do some more front-side exploring this year.  Thanks.


----------



## reefer (Oct 29, 2009)

Yo Mr. Idaho, what's up.
1.) PM me when you’re going to Mt. Snow........................

2.)You'll need a trail map:
On the main face Ledge is the best trail. 2/3 the way down when Standard comes into view, take a sharp skiers right cut-over (above Somerset Road) to hit Pat's Pitch. Lower Ledge and Lower Lodge can be an un-groomed option down there also where Pat's pitch is.
The Sap Tapper woods are fun. Between Ego Alley and Sundance. Enter at top of Ego Alley Chair lift. Hit Yard Sale a little further down. As Dr. Jeff stated, there are some bike trails you can weave through on the way to Yard Sale.
Fantastics woods can be fun. Between Ridge and Uncles. Can enter high off Ridge. Hard Left when you come out to hit Yard Sale at the bottom.
Uncles and Hop don't get groomed and can be fun, especially Uncles.
The Ego alley and Sundance chairs are slow but never a lift line to get you back up. You can lap Uncles, Hop and Fantastics off the Sundance. Sap Tapper off the Ego alley.

Of course there is Dark Side of the Moon on Sunbrook, between Sunspot and Shooting Star. My favorite for a safety meeting before hitting Bear Trap for a few laps.

There are days when the North Face is the only place to be however and I never leave. These would be maybe a quick first run to the bottom before the crowds, for lunch, and at the end of the day.

hope to hitch up with you again some day........................................


----------



## ta&idaho (Oct 29, 2009)

reefer said:


> Yo Mr. Idaho, what's up.
> 1.) PM me when you’re going to Mt. Snow........................
> 
> 2.)You'll need a trail map:
> ...



ah, yes, i forgot you were a mt snow regular.  i'll definitely let you know when i'm coming that way this year...


----------



## tylerjames (Oct 29, 2009)

the boonies are fun and overlooked, saying that if you enter above the boonies and continue down alongside the dingle or valley their are some seriously cool bolders that you can throw yourself off and its one of the only places on the mountain that is untouched knee deep at all times. it spits you out on some of the snowshowing and xc trails so you will need to ski/hike out.


----------



## vcunning (Oct 29, 2009)

drjeff said:


> Depends on what I'm in the mood for.  If the snow is good in the trees, I'm in them, all over the mountain often for the full day.  Sometimes if it's more of a groomer day, I just love ripping big GS turns down trails like South Bowl and even Snowdance.  Sometimes, if it's a nice sunny day, I really enjoy a slower cruise down Big Dipper or Little Dipper in Sunbrook and just admire the views.
> 
> The majority of the time though, if we're talking a 100% wide open Mount Snow the vast majority of my time on the hill will be spent on natural snow (trees + trails).  Early and late season (or immediately after a freeze up) is when I spend most of my time on the snowmaking trails.



DrJeff . . . Thanks for not mentioning Overbrook.  I wouldn't want anyone to found out the secret that nobody is ever on that trail.  

_Sigh. If only they put in the banked turns and kept the access rope up from Canyon._

Not real challenging, but just a ton of fun.  Great place to do laps with the family.


----------



## drjeff (Oct 29, 2009)

vcunning said:


> DrJeff . . . Thanks for not mentioning Overbrook.  I wouldn't want anyone to found out the secret that nobody is ever on that trail.
> 
> _Sigh. If only they put in the banked turns and kept the access rope up from Canyon._
> 
> Not real challenging, but just a ton of fun.  Great place to do laps with the family.



Hey V, atleast I didn't mention Grommet, practically your own personal powder stash this year  :lol:


----------



## RootDKJ (Oct 29, 2009)

You guys realize I'm taking notes, as I'm planning my 1st trip to Mount Snow this year...


----------



## Tin Woodsman (Oct 29, 2009)

Though I've never checked it out or even heard of runs there, I'd be willing to bet that a short hike out on that X-C trail connecting to Haystack would be worthwhile.


----------



## Newpylong (Oct 29, 2009)

Tin Woodsman said:


> Though I've never checked it out or even heard of runs there, I'd be willing to bet that a short hike out on that X-C trail connecting to Haystack would be worthwhile.



I have tried it - trees are mostly too tight - and I aint just trying to hide the goods, ha.


----------



## drjeff (Oct 30, 2009)

Tin Woodsman said:


> Though I've never checked it out or even heard of runs there, I'd be willing to bet that a short hike out on that X-C trail connecting to Haystack would be worthwhile.





Newpylong said:


> I have tried it - trees are mostly too tight - and I aint just trying to hide the goods, ha.



Agree with Newpylong, and if your not real carefull out there, you can quickly end up with a LONG hike up and out of the drainage gully that the basin there feeds into


----------



## Glenn (Oct 30, 2009)

Back in the day...I've heard of people taking sleds on that trail connecting Haystack and Snow. Last season, I did see a few sled tracks on that trail when we stopped to take a look.


----------



## drjeff (Oct 30, 2009)

RootDKJ said:


> You guys realize I'm taking notes, as I'm planning my 1st trip to Mount Snow this year...



[size=-2] the MOST important note to take is that Vcunning's place and his beertender is at a ski up to location this season![/size]


----------



## Beetlenut (Oct 30, 2009)

drjeff said:


> [SIZE=-2] the MOST important note to take is that Vcunning's place and his beertender is at a ski up to location this season![/SIZE]


 
Sounds like the makings for an AZ event! :flag:


----------



## Glenn (Oct 30, 2009)

I'll say it again...we need an AZ Mt. Snow crew gathering this season.


----------



## Beetlenut (Oct 30, 2009)

Glenn said:


> I'll say it again...we need an AZ Mt. Snow crew gathering this season.


 
I'm down. I vote Reefer as tour guide!


----------



## ta&idaho (Oct 30, 2009)

Beetlenut said:


> I'm down. I vote Reefer as tour guide!



I'm in for that.


----------



## vcunning (Oct 30, 2009)

drjeff said:


> [size=-2] the MOST important note to take is that Vcunning's place and his beertender is at a ski up to location this season![/size]





Beetlenut said:


> Sounds like the makings for an AZ event! :flag:



It's not too fancy of a place, but you can ski to beer (heck, I'll even provide some food) while the AZers terrorize Grommet


----------



## drjeff (Oct 30, 2009)

vcunning said:


> It's not too fancy of a place, but you can ski to beer (heck, I'll even provide some food) while the AZers terrorize Grommet



V, I'll have to bring the pop up tent one weekend, and I'm sure we can find a banner or two of Mount Snow's mythical snowmaking super hero to hang on the tent!  :lol:  

Sounds like we'll need to atleast once this winter have a glorified slopeside "tailgating" session! :beer:


----------



## Highway Star (Oct 30, 2009)

Just looking at google maps, it seems there are some pretty good sidecounty options available.....


----------



## Beetlenut (Oct 30, 2009)

vcunning said:


> It's not too fancy of a place, but you can ski to beer (heck, I'll even provide some food) while the AZers terrorize Grommet


 
That's ok, we're not too fancy of a group. Access to Beer and,.. well no that should about do it!


----------



## Tin Woodsman (Oct 30, 2009)

drjeff said:


> Agree with Newpylong, and if your not real carefull out there, you can quickly end up with a LONG hike up and out of the drainage gully that the basin there feeds into



If that's the case, then lousy job by the Mt. Snow locals.   It's a pretty obvious option with everything you're looking for.  Somewhat out of the way entrance and an exit onto a run that doesn't see much traffic.  Further you go out, the longer you're run, but the longer your traverse/hike back.


----------



## reefer (Oct 30, 2009)

I'm there. Let me know when. If anyone was interested, I'm in on a house on Route 100 less than (10) minutes away and guests can stay for $30.00. Ski bum type of place with singles and bunk beds, couple bathrooms, huge kitchen, bar with dartboard, living room with wood stove, and a grill on the deck.
Pretty much always plenty of room.
Oh and four refrigerators. One for food, three for beer.


----------



## Beetlenut (Oct 30, 2009)

reefer said:


> I'm there. Let me know when. If anyone was interested, I'm in on a house on Route 100 less than (10) minutes away and guests can stay for $30.00. Ski bum type of place with singles and bunk beds, couple bathrooms, huge kitchen, bar with dartboard, living room with wood stove, and a grill on the deck.
> Pretty much always plenty of room.
> Oh and four refrigerators. One for food, three for beer.


 
I'll have to keep that in mind as a "drive up the night before" option. Good ratio on the refrigerators!


----------



## Newpylong (Oct 30, 2009)

Tin Woodsman said:


> If that's the case, then lousy job by the Mt. Snow locals.   It's a pretty obvious option with everything you're looking for.  Somewhat out of the way entrance and an exit onto a run that doesn't see much traffic.  Further you go out, the longer you're run, but the longer your traverse/hike back.




How is it a lousy job? They would be all over you like flies on a turd if you went up there with any type of saw that would make a difference. A small handsaw aint gonna do anything with the amount of growth out there... The mountain itself if severely restricted in what they can cut/clean up inbounds. When they do a tree cleanup a member of the Forest service has to be with them.

Re: Highwaystar's post - yes, the terrain definitely looks tasty riding up the Sunbrook chair.


----------



## Tin Woodsman (Oct 30, 2009)

Newpylong said:


> How is it a lousy job? They would be all over you like flies on a turd if you went up there with any type of saw that would make a difference. A small handsaw aint gonna do anything with the amount of growth out there... The mountain itself if severely restricted in what they can cut/clean up inbounds. When they do a tree cleanup a member of the Forest service has to be with them.
> 
> Re: Highwaystar's post - yes, the terrain definitely looks tasty riding up the Sunbrook chair.



You're kidding me, right?  There are areas 3 and 4x the times the size of that zone that have been thinned over years at Stowe, Smuggs, SB, Jay, Bolton, Wildcat, Cannon, and numerous other mountains.  I said locals not b/c of some official foray alone with the USFS.  It's pretty easy to hike up there in the summer completely out of sight and you certainly don't need a chain saw or anything silly like that.  

Not that I'm advocating such illegal trimming on USFS land, but rather am just surprised that there isn't a lot out there.  It's one of the first places you'd think of, especially after all the woods that were brought on map over the last decade or so.


----------



## tylerjames (Oct 30, 2009)

Tin Woodsman said:


> You're kidding me, right?  There are areas 3 and 4x the times the size of that zone that have been thinned over years at Stowe, Smuggs, SB, Jay, Bolton, Wildcat, Cannon, and numerous other mountains.  I said locals not b/c of some official foray alone with the USFS.  It's pretty easy to hike up there in the summer completely out of sight and you certainly don't need a chain saw or anything silly like that.
> 
> Not that I'm advocating such illegal trimming on USFS land, but rather am just surprised that there isn't a lot out there.  It's one of the first places you'd think of, especially after all the woods that were brought on map over the last decade or so.



never heard about the idiots up at jay who illegally cut 800 trees and now big jay is off limits?
Illegal Cutting


----------



## Tin Woodsman (Oct 31, 2009)

tylerjames said:


> never heard about the idiots up at jay who illegally cut 800 trees and now big jay is off limits?
> Illegal Cutting



No - never heard of that story.  Must have been way off the radar.  :blink:

Of course, that's a great parallel for what I'm referring to....not.


----------



## tylerjames (Oct 31, 2009)

Tin Woodsman said:


> No - never heard of that story.  Must have been way off the radar.  :blink:
> 
> Of course, that's a great parallel for what I'm referring to....not.



its cutting down trees in a US forest, what don't you get?

firstly its illegal and secondly why if someone did cut would tell everyone from new york where those trails are just so they can say what a lousy job they did? those guys up at jay were doing the same thing your faulting the mount snow locals for not doing.


----------



## Tin Woodsman (Oct 31, 2009)

tylerjames said:


> its cutting down trees in a US forest, what don't you get?
> 
> firstly its illegal and secondly why if someone did cut would tell everyone from new york where those trails are just so they can say what a lousy job they did? those guys up at jay were doing the same thing your faulting the mount snow locals for not doing.



No - you have zero idea what you're talking about.  Zero.

Those guys at Jay were absolute maroons who went up to protected state land and started mowing down a wide boulevard with a chainsaw.  Aside from the stupidity of this from a pure skiing department (the trees were widely enough spaced as it was), this was wrong on so many levels.  

I'm surely not advocating cutting down trees on USFS land, let alone with a chainsaw.  I'm simply expressing surprise that it hasn't been done before (if this is in fact true - which I doubt), as MUCH larger swathes have been pruned in similarly protected areas (both USFS and State lands) at SB, Stowe, Burke, Wildcat and many other resorts that receive enough snow for it to be worth it.   What part of this remedial discussion do you not understand?


----------



## Newpylong (Oct 31, 2009)

At the end of the day it's just as easy to go into the Trials and keep going until you're worried you're going to come out in New Hampshire - effectively giving you a 1000 vert of uninterrupted excellent tree skiing.


----------



## drjeff (Nov 1, 2009)

Newpylong said:


> At the end of the day it's just as easy to go into the Trials and keep going until you're worried you're going to come out in New Hampshire - effectively giving you a 1000 vert of uninterrupted excellent tree skiing.



Bingo!  Mount Snow has just as good, if not better both inbounds and maybe slightly out of bounds tree skiing with much easier "escape routes" than the area of The Ridge trail.  And a lot of the other stiff doesn't have they East/Southeast exposure that the stuff off the Ridge Trail has (and I'm honestly not just saying that to keep some goods for myself)


----------



## Vinny (Nov 1, 2009)

Tin Woodsman said:


> No - you have zero idea what you're talking about.  Zero.
> 
> Those guys at Jay were absolute maroons who went up to protected state land and started mowing down a wide boulevard with a chainsaw.  Aside from the stupidity of this from a pure skiing department (the trees were widely enough spaced as it was), this was wrong on so many levels.
> 
> I'm surely not advocating cutting down trees on USFS land, let alone with a chainsaw.  I'm simply expressing surprise that it hasn't been done before (if this is in fact true - which I doubt), as MUCH larger swathes have been pruned in similarly protected areas (both USFS and State lands) at SB, Stowe, Burke, Wildcat and many other resorts that receive enough snow for it to be worth it.   What part of this remedial discussion do you not understand?



"What part of this remedial discussion do you not understand?"

Ummm, I'm not really getting your "absolute maroons" comment?   Do you not like that color?


----------



## Tin Woodsman (Nov 1, 2009)

Vinny said:


> "What part of this remedial discussion do you not understand?"
> 
> Ummm, I'm not really getting your "absolute maroons" comment?   Do you not like that color?



You didn't watch Bugs Bunny enough back in the day.


----------



## Beetlenut (Nov 1, 2009)

Vinny said:


> Ummm, I'm not really getting your "absolute maroons" comment?   Do you not like that color?





Tin Woodsman said:


> You didn't watch Bugs Bunny enough back in the day.



Why he's an Ultra maroon!


----------



## Vinny (Nov 1, 2009)

Tin Woodsman said:


> You didn't watch Bugs Bunny enough back in the day.



Actually a big Bugs fan.  The problem with us earlier fans is the death of brain cells.


----------



## vcunning (Nov 1, 2009)

Beetlenut said:


> Why he's an Ultra maroon!



While were quoting the bunny . . . "What an Ingoraminus!"


----------



## RootDKJ (Nov 3, 2009)

Saw on Mount Snow's facebook page they are going to begin snowmaking tonight!


----------



## Glenn (Nov 3, 2009)

RootDKJ said:


> Saw on Mount Snow's facebook page they are going to begin snowmaking tonight!




Woohoo!!!


----------



## RootDKJ (Nov 3, 2009)

Glenn said:


> Woohoo!!!


That's what I thought exactly.  Can Alpine Zone get a Fan Gun smiley?


----------



## Glenn (Nov 3, 2009)

RootDKJ said:


> That's what I thought exactly.  Can Alpine Zone get a Fan Gun smiley?



I should photoshop one.


----------



## RootDKJ (Nov 3, 2009)

Glenn said:


> I should photoshop one.


It needs to be an animated .gif


----------



## Glenn (Nov 3, 2009)

RootDKJ said:


> It needs to be an animated .gif



Damn, now that's a challenge...


----------



## bvibert (Nov 10, 2009)

RootDKJ said:


> That's what I thought exactly.  Can Alpine Zone get a Fan Gun smiley?



Threw this together, the background is too light here to see it well though...


----------



## drjeff (Nov 10, 2009)

bvibert said:


> threw this together, the background is too light here to see it well though...



awesome!!!!


----------



## Glenn (Nov 11, 2009)

bvibert said:


> Threw this together, the background is too light here to see it well though...




Outstanding work Brian! Thanks!


----------



## RootDKJ (Nov 11, 2009)

bvibert said:


> Threw this together, the background is too light here to see it well though...


Awesome bvibert!  Seriously, well done! :beer:

Now, can we get this added to the forum Smiles (cough greg  cough cough)?


----------



## Vinny (Nov 11, 2009)

bvibert said:


> Threw this together, the background is too light here to see it well though...



Outstanding.  I like that, to add to the realism, you made it quiet as well.  ;-)


----------



## Greg (Nov 11, 2009)

bvibert said:


> Threw this together, the background is too light here to see it well though...



Use this to add it:


```
:fangun:
```

Thanks Brian!

No *HOTLINKING*!


----------



## bvibert (Nov 11, 2009)

Sweet!  I feel like I've finally contributed something worthwhile to the community!


----------



## Glenn (Nov 11, 2009)

Greg said:


> Use this to add it:
> 
> 
> ```
> ...



Very cool! And easy to remember!


----------



## RootDKJ (Nov 11, 2009)

This thread delivers!


----------



## Glenn (Nov 11, 2009)

RootDKJ said:


> I'm a fan of this thread!


----------



## SIKSKIER (Nov 11, 2009)

I'm usually full of hotair but now I can speak into this..


----------

