# Ikon replaces MAX in 18/19



## xlr8r (Jan 25, 2018)

https://www.ikonpass.com/en/

The MAX Pass is going to Turn into the Ikon Pass next year.  Looks a lot like the MAX Pass from its first year with Alterra, Powdr, and Boyne joining forces, with the addition of Jackson Hole, Alta and Snowbird.

In the New England the mountains are
Killington
Stratton
Loon
Sunday river
Sugarloaf

Seems to be a vast improvement in the western options in comparison to MAX, but  a reduction onthe mountains in the east.


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## KustyTheKlown (Jan 25, 2018)

not sure how I feel about this. the loss of eastern places is a big hit. tremblant is still on. 

addition of Jackson, aspen, squaw, mammoth, alta bird is pretty cool tho

some places will be unlimited, some will be a set number of days.


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## ss20 (Jan 25, 2018)

Ouch.  Big ouch.


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## gnardawg (Jan 25, 2018)

Good thing I'm headed to Gore and Whiteface in a few weeks on my Max Pass. That's a lot to take off from the East Coast side. Damn.


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## GregoryIsaacs (Jan 25, 2018)

Peaks must be ecstatic


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## KustyTheKlown (Jan 25, 2018)

loss of catskills is such a major bummer. it's been so nice having quick easy day trip options


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## cdskier (Jan 25, 2018)

Interesting to note that the FAQ says Mountain Collective will also still be offered...I was wondering about that due to the overlap between this pass and what MCP offered.


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## KustyTheKlown (Jan 25, 2018)

if k is unlimited days, i'll be less annoyed. but I seriously doubt that will be the case


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## xlr8r (Jan 25, 2018)

One has to wonder now how Mountain Collective will change, what will Triple Peaks do as well?


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## Killingtime (Jan 25, 2018)

Glad I got in a full weekend at both Gore and Mont-Sainte Anne this year. I will miss Gore. Really fun place. May have to go one more time before the season is over.. Stoked about Jackson Hole and Aspen/Snowmass though. Going to Steamboat in two weeks because I though it would be off the Max Pass next year. So long Windham and Belleayre it was nice knowing you.


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## cdskier (Jan 25, 2018)

19 Eastern resorts on MAX vs 6 on Ikon...that hurts eastern skiers that were using the MAX pass for sure (granted all those 19 weren't necessarily worth it or logistically reasonable to visit).

Details of how many days you get on the Ikon will be key to how worthwhile it is for eastern skiers.


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## urungus (Jan 25, 2018)

For an east coast skier, this is a major letdown :evil:

No new areas, and we have lost:

Pico (possibly an oversight since Killington is still there)
Gore
Whiteface
Belleayre
Okemo
Sunapee
Mont Sainte Anne
Mountain Creek
Stoneham
Wachusett
Windham


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## gnardawg (Jan 25, 2018)

Sunapee is a big loss for me day tripping from Boston. I also liked Okemo on there -I could get a few more weekend trips by staying in white river junction and skiing Killington and Okemo on the same weekend.


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## xlr8r (Jan 25, 2018)

As a Boston area skier, losing Sunapee and Wachusett hurts a lot as those are perfect for easy day or night trips.  Now we are back to Loon being the only real day trip option and that is a minimum of 2hrs away.  Pico must still be included as all Killington tickets and passes are valid at Pico.  I bet though if the pass has a set amount of days, that to go to Pico you will use up your Killington allotment whereas with MAX, Killington had 5 allotted days and Pico 5 as well.  I would not be surpriised now to see a new pass with a focus on the east form, or mountain Collective expand more in the east.  Just speculating now, having a pass that had say Sugarbush, Okemo, Jay, Burke, Sunapee, Waterville, Bretton Woods etc would be enticing.


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## KustyTheKlown (Jan 25, 2018)

the loss of 20 days in new york hurts me the most. I don't like okemo but it was useful for early season groomer days without having to drive so far, and allowed me to spread out the killington usage. pico needs to still be included and I pray this is an error. mountain creek sucks but night skiing an hour a way was a nice option and one I availed myself of a few times. 

being able to go back out to squaw and Jackson is great, but if they pull some mountain collective shit and only give 2 days each, that's totally bunk. 

I also fear a $1000 price tag.


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## MEtoVTSkier (Jan 25, 2018)

And what are the odds that more Eastern areas will jump on board by spring, now that the news is out.


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## KustyTheKlown (Jan 25, 2018)

MEtoVTSkier said:


> And what are the odds that more Eastern areas will jump on board by spring, now that the news is out.



the FAQ says this is the list of resorts for 18-19 and that it will not change.


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## MEtoVTSkier (Jan 25, 2018)

KustyTheKlown said:


> the FAQ says this is the list of resorts for 18-19 and that it will not change.



Hmmm...



> [h=4]Question: Will more destinations be joining Ikon Pass?[/h] *Answer:* This is the current line-up for 2018-2019.



Where does it say it will not change? I must be missing something.


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## Bandit2941 (Jan 25, 2018)

KustyTheKlown said:


> the FAQ says this is the list of resorts for 18-19 and that it will not change.



The FAQ says "This is the current lineup for 2018-2019."

I don't interpret that to mean that it will not change. I'm hoping the ORDA resorts get in on the fun again and a season pass add on like what was offered with the MAX pass is available. We'll see! I do like the new western options but if it's a $700 stand alone pass that likely won't be an attractive option to many east coast skiers.


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## KustyTheKlown (Jan 25, 2018)

yea I suppose youre right. I read that to mean that this is it, but the "current" certainly indicates the possibility of change. my bad.


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## Zermatt (Jan 25, 2018)

I know why Pico is not on the list.....because it is not opening next season.  Can't run a ski area selling 50 tickets a day.

Either that or Killington will be full access and that would already include Pico.  Can't wait for details on pricing and access.


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## KustyTheKlown (Jan 25, 2018)

pico is "part" of killington. they can (and I assume do) operate at a loss, which is offset by killington.


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## sankaty (Jan 25, 2018)

billo said:


> I know why Pico is not on the list.....because it is not opening next season.  Can't run a ski area selling 50 tickets a day.
> 
> Either that or Killington will be full access and that would already include Pico.  Can't wait for details on pricing and access.



Are you speculating here are do you have a source for this?

Thanks!


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## sankaty (Jan 25, 2018)

I seems logical/likely that the Ikon Pass will replace the MAX pass, but has this been confirmed anywhere?  I searched online and don't see any confirmation that the MAX pass won't be offered, and it's conceptually possible that both could exist.

Based on where we've been staying, not being able to ski Killington/Pico/Okemo on the same pass would be a major bummer.


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## Zermatt (Jan 25, 2018)

sankaty said:


> Are you speculating here are do you have a source for this?
> 
> Thanks!



Highly educated speculation.  Unlike other skiers, I don't live a in a dream world where ski areas just open because people like skiing.  Most do intend to actually make money.

Reading through the FAQ they mentioned blackout dates, that would be a major change versus the MAX Pass.

I wonder where all the dropped areas are going to go.  If they hated being on MAX or will miss the lost revenue.


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## KustyTheKlown (Jan 25, 2018)

sankaty said:


> I seems logical/likely that the Ikon Pass will replace the MAX pass, but has this been confirmed anywhere?  I searched online and don't see any confirmation that the MAX pass won't be offered, and it's conceptually possible that both could exist.
> 
> Based on where we've been staying, not being able to ski Killington/Pico/Okemo on the same pass would be a major bummer.



the FAQ clearly states that max will not be offered anymore.


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## sankaty (Jan 25, 2018)

KustyTheKlown said:


> the FAQ clearly states that max will not be offered anymore.



I saw that right after posting.  Sorry.


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## KustyTheKlown (Jan 25, 2018)

billo said:


> Highly educated speculation.  Unlike other skiers, I don't live a in a dream world where ski areas just open because people like skiing.  Most do intend to actually make money.
> 
> Reading through the FAQ they mentioned blackout dates, that would be a major change versus the MAX Pass.
> 
> I wonder where all the dropped areas are going to go.  If they hated being on MAX or will miss the lost revenue.



but its been this way FOREVER. pico has been associated with killington for as long as I can remember skiing at killington, and has always been empty. its where you could go on a crowded Saturday when killington is slammed and have ski on lift access all day. what about this year makes this any different? nothing in my opinion. it still gets lumped in with killington and any losses are offset by killingtons gains, allowing them to offer a more affordable product to locals etc


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## Whitey (Jan 25, 2018)

urungus said:


> For an east coast skier, this is a major letdown :evil:
> 
> No new areas, and we have lost:



If you are talking about east coast skiers from New England, I don't see this as much of a loss:

Pico  = meh, still have Killington
Gore = Unless you are from NY - NBD
Whiteface = ditto
Belleayre = ditto
Okemo = meh
Sunapee = meh
Mont Sainte Anne = would like to go but probably too far
Mountain Creek = New Jersey only disappointed by this one
Stoneham =  (see mt saint anne)
Wachusett = meh
Windham = (see Bellayre, whiteface, and Gore)

I LOVE the addition of Jackson Hole and this virtually garauntees that I will knock off another one of my "bucket list" mountains in the next 2 ski seasons.


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## KustyTheKlown (Jan 25, 2018)

its a huge hit for the new york market, tho we only had these ny places involved for 1 year, so its sort of easy come easy go, but that is 20 days, 10 of which are under 2.5 hours from nyc

I'd wait for details before you start celebrating Jackson tho. right now my suspicion is that former mountain collective places will have the same shitty 2 day allotment, and then 50% off additional days if you're lucky. Jackson will still have you reaching deep into your pocket to ski an actual 5 day trip. I hope I am wrong.


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## Smellytele (Jan 25, 2018)

Whitey said:


> If you are talking about east coast skiers from New England, I don't see this as much of a loss:
> 
> Pico  = meh, still have Killington
> Gore = Unless you are from NY - NBD
> ...



If you don't travel much it is a let down for EC skiers.


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## Edd (Jan 25, 2018)

This is a bummer not knowing price or # of days and seeing what we’re losing. Aspen and Squaw are excellent additions but not sure I can pull off a western trip next year. 


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## benski (Jan 25, 2018)

I many of the max pass resorts not on the Ikon pass either keep the mass pass going or join another pass.


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## KustyTheKlown (Jan 25, 2018)

and not knowing about blackout dates. the whole thing mostly stinks, at least for now. and I'm anticipating a higher price than max as well.


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## sankaty (Jan 25, 2018)

billo said:


> Highly educated speculation.  Unlike other skiers, I don't live a in a dream world where ski areas just open because people like skiing.  Most do intend to actually make money.
> 
> Reading through the FAQ they mentioned blackout dates, that would be a major change versus the MAX Pass.
> 
> I wonder where all the dropped areas are going to go.  If they hated being on MAX or will miss the lost revenue.



It doesn't seem like Pico would be profitable on its own, but Killington has been operating it this way for years, and presumably they have a business justification for it.  I don't know if it's a good justification or if the facts that led to that justification are changing.

The FAQ is very cagey; it seems to me that there are still lots of negotiations and planning elements in the works.  It does seem possible that they could rope in additional partners.  It would be great if the Okemo/Sunapee/CB group could be included, but I have no idea if that would be attractive to either side.

I don't have a great feeling on the value of this relative to the MAX pass for skiers like me, but I suppose it needs to offer a value at least comparable to the Epic pass, which will cap the cost somewhat.


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## benski (Jan 25, 2018)

The FAQ implies there will be tires and local passes.


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## Whitey (Jan 25, 2018)

Smellytele said:


> If you don't travel much it is a let down for EC skiers.



Corrected;

_If you don't travel much it is a let down for NY skiers._

Sorry, I just can't get too busted up about losing Okemo, Sunapee, and Wachusett.    I always bought my max pass for; day trips to Loon, weekends at Sunday River, and vacations/long weekends at Sugarloaf.   And Killington.   The 2 sugars (loaf & bush) are my favorite mtns in the northeast.  Max pass gave me one of my favorites plus the other mtns.  Other than that, if I did or didn't get to O/S/W - NBD.    If I am going to make the 1 hr drive to WaWa, I'd go to Crotched instead for the extra 15 min drive.   I've just never been a fan of WaWa.


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## Smellytele (Jan 25, 2018)

Whitey said:


> Corrected;
> 
> _If you don't travel much it is a let down for NY skiers._
> 
> Sorry, I just can't get too busted up about losing Okemo, Sunapee, and Wachusett.    I always bought my max pass for; day trips to Loon, weekends at Sunday River, and vacations/long weekends at Sugarloaf.   And Killington.   The 2 sugars (loaf & bush) are my favorite mtns in the northeast.  Max pass gave me one of my favorites plus the other mtns.  Other than that, if I did or didn't get to O/S/W - NBD.    If I am going to make the 1 hr drive to WaWa, I'd go to Crotched instead for the extra 15 min drive.   I've just never been a fan of WaWa.



I was thinking of getting it next year but with Sunapee not being a close option now (25 mins from me) it might not be in the cards. A Winter park/ copper and Steamboat trip might still lure me in but need to weigh all options still.


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## KustyTheKlown (Jan 25, 2018)

depending on pricing and days per resort, this (+skiVT 5-pack) is still the likely best option for me. but it's still a bummer. and I will be very surprised if the excellent additions are more than 2 days at each place, because mountain collective. that would necessitate some annoyingly long drives to put a trip together (alta/bird - Jackson, squaw-mammoth, winter park-aspen, etc).


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## ss20 (Jan 25, 2018)

billo said:


> Highly educated speculation.  Unlike other skiers, I don't live a in a dream world where ski areas just open because people like skiing.  Most do intend to actually make money.



Ahhh OK...so the mountain that has survived being in the shadow of Killington for 50+ years will shut down for good because of an "educated guess".


I think you're just late to the Pico Party seeing that the place is dead and you can get some great skiing in.


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## Zermatt (Jan 25, 2018)

ss20 said:


> Ahhh OK...so the mountain that has survived being in the shadow of Killington for 50+ years will shut down for good because of an "educated guess".
> 
> 
> I think you're just late to the Pico Party seeing that the place is dead and you can get some great skiing in.



I have a season pass at Pico.


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## ss20 (Jan 25, 2018)

Whitey said:


> Corrected;
> 
> _If you don't travel much it is a let down for NY skiers._
> 
> Sorry, I just can't get too busted up about losing Okemo, Sunapee, and Wachusett.    I always bought my max pass for; day trips to Loon, weekends at Sunday River, and vacations/long weekends at Sugarloaf.   And Killington.   The 2 sugars (loaf & bush) are my favorite mtns in the northeast.  Max pass gave me one of my favorites plus the other mtns.  Other than that, if I did or didn't get to O/S/W - NBD.    If I am going to make the 1 hr drive to WaWa, I'd go to Crotched instead for the extra 15 min drive.   I've just never been a fan of WaWa.



So you used it as a Boyne pass (which they still sell, yes?) with Killington.  I don't know how that's cost effective (unless you went west).  Why not just the Boyne pass, which I'm assuming is cheaper than Max.


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## ss20 (Jan 25, 2018)

billo said:


> I have a season pass at Pico.



OK...then I think you're just wrong and trying to scare people with no basis or reason.


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## KustyTheKlown (Jan 25, 2018)

^seriously, what a maroon.


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## ss20 (Jan 25, 2018)

KustyTheKlown said:


> ^seriously, what a maroon.



Actually I think you're the _maroon_...;-)


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## KustyTheKlown (Jan 25, 2018)

I don't get it, but that's ok. pico forever.


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## VTKilarney (Jan 25, 2018)

KustyTheKlown said:


> ^seriously, what a maroon.



Says the guy who uses a word that has a racist origin.


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## KustyTheKlown (Jan 25, 2018)

VTKilarney said:


> Says the guy who uses a word that has a racist origin.



gimme a break man, I was clearly quoting bugs bunny, wrong turn at Albuquerque, etc.


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## VTKilarney (Jan 25, 2018)

KustyTheKlown said:


> gimme a break man, I was clearly quoting bugs bunny, wrong turn at Albuquerque, etc.



That doesn't make any of what I said untrue.


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## Whitey (Jan 25, 2018)

ss20 said:


> So you used it as a Boyne pass (which they still sell, yes?) with Killington.  I don't know how that's cost effective (unless you went west).  Why not just the Boyne pass, which I'm assuming is cheaper than Max.



Boyne pass is way more expensive than max (currently $1350 for gold pass).   Last year I got 18 days total at Loon/SR/'loaf.    That's not bad for $600.   Plus the other mtns.  If I had just stopped there with the Boyne mtns (I didn't) that would have made my per day cost $33.  

See my Steamboat/WP/Copper TR from last yr - all MP mtns.    And see my TR for Big Sky that will post sometime in late Feb after I complete that trip (also a MP mtn).   And my TR for Solitude and Brighton when I post that in early April.


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## boston_e (Jan 25, 2018)

Pico is not included per the Killington Facebook page.  However they also clarified that their "Beast Pass" will continue to be valid at Pico.


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## Zermatt (Jan 25, 2018)

boston_e said:


> Pico is not included per the Killington Facebook page.  However they also clarified that their "Beast Pass" will continue to be valid at Pico.



That makes no sense to me.  Killington should be bending over backwards to get people off Killington slopes and onto Pico.  

I'm really skeptical they are going to build something better than the MAX Pass and/or comparable to the Epic Pass.  So many questions.


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## machski (Jan 25, 2018)

billo said:


> That makes no sense to me.  Killington should be bending over backwards to get people off Killington slopes and onto Pico.
> 
> I'm really skeptical they are going to build something better than the MAX Pass and/or comparable to the Epic Pass.  So many questions.


Not sure what Powdr is doing on the Ikon.  Pico may well be off it, I noticed they did not include Mount Bachelor either.  Interesting mix none the less, Mammoth usually has a longer season than Bachelor so great replacement there if this is the case.

Also, I read it as there will be a fully unlimited pass available.  Who knows how much and whether it will be offered for a limited time/quantities.

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## Jcb890 (Jan 25, 2018)

I guess I'll wait to complain until we see the rest of the details... number of days to each place and price will be important of course.

PS - I just noticed in Canada:
CMH HELI-SKIING & SUMMER ADVENTURES
Interesting!


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## gladerider (Jan 25, 2018)

would only be worth on a year when i have a trip planned for the west for me.
i bought it this year for the ny + vt mountains.


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## Jcb890 (Jan 25, 2018)

gladerider said:


> would only be worth on a year when i have a trip planned for the west for me.
> i bought it this year for the ny + vt mountains.


As snowboarders, Deer Valley and Alta don't do much to move the needle either, sadly.


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## sankaty (Jan 25, 2018)

For our situation, lodging between Okemo and Killington with a trip out west, this is a total disaster with both Okemo and Pico dropped from the pass.  We have the Pico Pass with the MAX add on this year, which is a great value.  Seems like our lift ticket prices could easily double (or more) if we want similar access next year, which is prohibitively expensive for us.  Such a bummer.


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## Boxtop Willie (Jan 25, 2018)

As a Marketing/Competitive Strategy guy by profession, I can't wait to see the response by Mountain Collective. From a Sugarbush perspective, can't wait to see how it may affect me.
This business is getting very fun to watch.


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## Zand (Jan 25, 2018)

As a Wachusett passholder the Max Pass was like finding a gold mine this year. Too bad it only lasted for 1 year. Back to the drawing board this spring I guess. Interested to see what comes along.


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## Zermatt (Jan 26, 2018)

Jcb890 said:


> I guess I'll wait to complain until we see the rest of the details... number of days to each place and price will be important of course.
> 
> PS - I just noticed in Canada:
> CMH HELI-SKIING & SUMMER ADVENTURES
> Interesting!



I think it is only early access to booking.... What a perk!


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## skiur (Jan 26, 2018)

billo said:


> I have a season pass at Pico.



Killington is not closeing Pico, they are still working on the village plans and the interconnect is part of that, yes they have been working on it for 15 years but they are getting closer to actually starting phase 1.


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## machski (Jan 26, 2018)

Unfortunately, all these combo passes that have been great for the skier may not have been as beneficial financially to the resorts on them.  Remember, Boyne and Powdr started the Max Pass.  They are the key players along with Alterra now on the Ikon.  I have no idea why Pico and Bachelor were left off from Powdr's group, but they must have a reason, and I'm betting it comes down to better revenue returns.  Ultimately, whether this pass is great or a bust will come down pricing and pass levels.  We should table this debate til later next month when that comes out.

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## Jully (Jan 26, 2018)

Alterra is shooting for higher end stuff, so it makes sense that they wouldn't want some mountains on it. Pico fits there. Not sure about Bachelor though. It isn't as much of a destination resort with slopeside facilities, but it isn't like people don't vacation there.


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## gregnye (Jan 26, 2018)

skiur said:


> Killington is not closeing Pico, they are still working on the village plans and the interconnect is part of that, yes they have been working on it for 15 years but they are getting closer to actually starting phase 1.



I'll believe it only when I see it. While they probably won't close Pico, I doubt they are actually going to do the interconnect. I mean while Killington does snow making well there's so much decaying lift infrastructure there. Like for example the K1 gondola is starting to show it's age. Most of the cabins are out of service when I'v visited. The cabin doors constantly open even in the slightest wind. I mean they can't even replace the south ridge triple chair or the snowdon quad, why would they have money to expand?


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## boston_e (Jan 26, 2018)

Jully said:


> Alterra is shooting for higher end stuff, so it makes sense that they wouldn't want some mountains on it. Pico fits there. Not sure about Bachelor though. It isn't as much of a destination resort with slopeside facilities, but it isn't like people don't vacation there.



I'm withholding judgement until I see the final product / price etc.

I think the only people really bothered by the lack of Pico on the pass are those of use who call Killington / Pico our "home area".  It seems we may be having to choose between a pass that is valid at Killington / Pico or this IKON pass which is Killington and these other mountains.

Not an easy choice for those of us who spend most of our weekends in the Killington / Pico area but take a couple of trips to other areas each year.


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## boston_e (Jan 26, 2018)

gregnye said:


> I'll believe it only when I see it. While they probably won't close Pico, I doubt they are actually going to do the interconnect. I mean while Killington does snow making well there's so much decaying lift infrastructure there. Like for example the K1 gondola is starting to show it's age. Most of the cabins are out of service when I'v visited. The cabin doors constantly open even in the slightest wind. I mean they can't even replace the south ridge triple chair or the snowdon quad, why would they have money to expand?



Personally I hope they never do the interconnect... so that would be fine for me.

Evidently the South Ridge lift is on deck for this summer...


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## mbedle (Jan 26, 2018)

boston_e said:


> Personally I hope they never do the interconnect... so that would be fine for me.
> 
> Evidently the South Ridge lift is on deck for this summer...



In 2016, they submitted a request to extend the permit date to complete the interconnect buildout until 2021. The reason stated was the money to install the 4 new lifts and add the terrain between the two resorts is coming from the village real estate sales.


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## mbedle (Jan 26, 2018)

I am going to venture to guess that the Ikon Pass is going to be like the Epic Pass for the Alterra destination resorts, with discounts at the partner destination resorts. Given that the Max Pass was Intrawest, it kind of makes sense for them to discontinue it.


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## Zermatt (Jan 26, 2018)

mbedle said:


> I am going to venture to guess that the Ikon Pass is going to be like the Epic Pass for the Alterra destination resorts, with discounts at the partner destination resorts. Given that the Max Pass was Intrawest, it kind of makes sense for them to discontinue it.



I don't think they can beat the price of the Epic Pass though


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## mbedle (Jan 26, 2018)

billo said:


> I don't think they can beat the price of the Epic Pass though



I don't know, their resort season passes are not that much more expensive, except Deer Valley.


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## gnardawg (Jan 26, 2018)

Teasing this thing with no details or price is so ridiculous.


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## Jcb890 (Jan 26, 2018)

gnardawg said:


> Teasing this thing with no details or price is so ridiculous.


It does kinda suck, I figured there would be SOME details to go along with the "press release".


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## gnardawg (Jan 26, 2018)

Man I remember when the SRT was there and just lapping the Jug and Breakaway all afternoon....


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## medfordmike (Jan 26, 2018)

boston_e said:


> I'm withholding judgement until I see the final product / price etc.
> 
> I think the only people really bothered by the lack of Pico on the pass are those of use who call Killington / Pico our "home area".  It seems we may be having to choose between a pass that is valid at Killington / Pico or this IKON pass which is Killington and these other mountains.
> 
> Not an easy choice for those of us who spend most of our weekends in the Killington / Pico area but take a couple of trips to other areas each year.



My spouse and I are in the Pico home mountain boat too.  I agree with the view that the Ikon pass has better destination resorts.  So for folks who do a week or two out west it has really nice options. For those who do most or nearly all of their skiing on day or overnight car trips this is a let down.  My weekend place is between Dartmouth and Sunapee so having options in addition to Pico (plus five days at Killington has been really nice this season) with the add on.  For weekends or midweek having places like Wachusett and Loon while not favorites on this site has been great since I rather go there than sit home. I think the Wachusett folks are probably in the same boat as the Pico homers.  A lot of local options with an add on are gone.

The Pico pass used to have 3 days at Sunapee no restrictions pre Max maybe that will return or something will take the place of the Max Pass for the mountains not included.


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## sankaty (Jan 26, 2018)

medfordmike said:


> The Pico pass used to have 3 days at Sunapee no restrictions pre Max maybe that will return or something will take the place of the Max Pass for the mountains not included.



I hadn't thought of that.  It would be great if Killington/Pico eased some of the pain caused by the MAX Pass add-on disappearing by adding some reciprocal days at Killington/Okemo/Sunapee for Pico pass holders.  I can imagine a universe where a Pico Pass plus a Mountain Colletive pass (or a cheap Ikon pass with limited days) could approximate the value of the Pico Pass with MAX add-on.  I guess it's too soon to freak out about this with so many details still to be worked out.

I wonder if there is any chance that the Okemo/Sunapee/CB group will join the Mountain Collective.


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## JimG. (Jan 27, 2018)

Guess I'll be back with the Peaks pass next season. Losing all of the eastern mountains is a major blow for me since I have no serious interest in western offerings.


----------



## boston_e (Jan 27, 2018)

JimG. said:


> Guess I'll be back with the Peaks pass next season. Losing all of the eastern mountains is a major blow for me since I have no serious interest in western offerings.



Except some of these might be unlimited access... so you could actually gain days.

as mentioned before, I’m withholding judgement until I see details.


----------



## mbedle (Jan 27, 2018)

The fact that they are calling it a "season pass" leads me to believe that it will be for the Alterra resorts. What you get at the partner resorts will be seen.


----------



## boston_e (Jan 27, 2018)

It is unlimited for sure for at least some resorts.  Which ones, remains to be seen.  Killington posted on their facebook page:

"Ikon Pass pass privileges will range from full unlimited access to a set number of days that will vary by destination. More details to be released in the coming weeks"


----------



## p_levert (Jan 28, 2018)

boston_e said:


> It is unlimited for sure for at least some resorts.  Which ones, remains to be seen.  Killington posted on their facebook page:
> 
> "Ikon Pass pass privileges will range from full unlimited access to a set number of days that will vary by destination. More details to be released in the coming weeks"



I predict it will be unlimited for Copper, Winter Park and Eldora.  They need to grab the large number of Rocky Mountain Super Pass holders.  After that, I don't expect much unlimited.  I certainly don't expect it for Killington or Stratton.


----------



## machski (Jan 28, 2018)

p_levert said:


> I predict it will be unlimited for Copper, Winter Park and Eldora.  They need to grab the large number of Rocky Mountain Super Pass holders.  After that, I don't expect much unlimited.  I certainly don't expect it for Killington or Stratton.


You are all reading the release wrong.  There will be a totally unlimited pass and then multiple levels below, some offering a limited set of areas unlimited with day limits at others all the way to limited number of days at each.  But they have absolutely said on many media channels that there will be an all inclusive, totally unlimited pass a la Epic.

Sent from my XT1650 using AlpineZone mobile app


----------



## Jully (Jan 28, 2018)

machski said:


> You are all reading the release wrong.  There will be a totally unlimited pass and then multiple levels below, some offering a limited set of areas unlimited with day limits at others all the way to limited number of days at each.  But they have absolutely said on many media channels that there will be an all inclusive, totally unlimited pass a la Epic.
> 
> Sent from my XT1650 using AlpineZone mobile app



This, though cost will be way different. I'm betting the unlimited will be a little over $2,000 (my guess is $2,300) and then options dropping down to MAX pass levels.

Definitely looking forward to the options, should be kind of cool.


----------



## FBGM (Jan 31, 2018)

Hoping this gives the fail pass a run for the monies. Jersey Jerry nation needs to spread out, to some goods, which sucks. But fail sucks more so it's 6's.


----------



## Zermatt (Jan 31, 2018)

machski said:


> You are all reading the release wrong.  There will be a totally unlimited pass and then multiple levels below, some offering a limited set of areas unlimited with day limits at others all the way to limited number of days at each.  But they have absolutely said on many media channels that there will be an all inclusive, totally unlimited pass a la Epic.
> 
> Sent from my XT1650 using AlpineZone mobile app



The best way to get them to release all the details is to spread bad details on the internet. 

Honestly, I need to know within the next month as it will determine if I go to Europe again or to western resorts. The death of the MAX pass really put a wrench in my plans for next season.


----------



## Jully (Jan 31, 2018)

billo said:


> The best way to get them to release all the details is to spread bad details on the internet.
> 
> Honestly, I need to know within the next month as it will determine if I go to Europe again or to western resorts. The death of the MAX pass really put a wrench in my plans for next season.



You'd be booking a Europe trip for next year in February?

We should get pricing details by mid to late February. March at the latest.


----------



## Zermatt (Jan 31, 2018)

Jully said:


> You'd be booking a Europe trip for next year in February?
> 
> We should get pricing details by mid to late February. March at the latest.



People roll over their apartments for next year right after they leave. For flights I find airfares to Europe are cheapest when they are first available 11 months out. 

Knowing the details about Ikon by early March would be nice.


----------



## jaytrem (Feb 1, 2018)

billo said:


> People roll over their apartments for next year right after they leave. For flights I find airfares to Europe are cheapest when they are first available 11 months out.
> 
> Knowing the details about Ikon by early March would be nice.



Smart, the early bird often gets the worm.  I've booked a number of mileage flights about a year in advance.  Often the first day they become available.  Sometimes there are only 4-8 12,500 mile seats available, so if you don't grab them early you're out of luck.  A few times I'had friend have to pay double miles or cash because they couldn't commit super early.  Always book the cars early too, even if I'm not sure I'm going, can always cancel if necessary and re-book if the price drops.

I know I've said this before, but working the credit card companies for miles/points can be very lucrative.  Can't recommend it enough.  I think it's been about 15 years since I've actually paid to fly.  Get a new card every 6 months and it won't mess up your credit score.  My wife and I rotate, so every 3 months we get some kind of sign up bonus. Anybody else been doing this?


----------



## gnardawg (Feb 1, 2018)

Ok Folks it's now been a week since this bombshell has been dropped and a massive marketing campaign was launched. Lot's of hype but no substance. Where are the details - LFG here Ikon Pass.


----------



## Zermatt (Feb 1, 2018)

gnardawg said:


> Ok Folks it's now been a week since this bombshell has been dropped and a massive marketing campaign was launched. Lot's of hype but no substance. Where are the details - LFG here Ikon Pass.



Exactly, antagonism level 8 now beginning. 

My prediction. Full unlimited Ikon Pass is in excess of $2,000. 

Next level down is 5 days per resort at $800 with blackout dates. 

Pico will not open or will be fully absorbed into Killington under the same ticket, which explains why it was not included in the original release. Or....it is being sold and will re open with new management.


----------



## Jcb890 (Feb 1, 2018)

billo said:


> Exactly, antagonism level 8 now beginning.
> 
> My prediction. Full unlimited Ikon Pass is in excess of $2,000.
> 
> ...


Raising the price by $171 and keeping a 5-day limit would suck with the loss of some of the New England/Eastern options.  I hope you're not correct.


----------



## Higgl (Feb 1, 2018)

gnardawg said:


> Ok Folks it's now been a week since this bombshell has been dropped and a massive marketing campaign was launched. Lot's of hype but no substance. Where are the details - LFG here Ikon Pass.



The Ikon people were up front in saying that it will be a few weeks before full pricing details are released. I'm thinking pricing details will be released around President's Day to make that the buzz again around that big ski weekend. Any announcement before that weekend would shock me.



billo said:


> Exactly, antagonism level 8 now beginning.
> 
> My prediction. Full unlimited Ikon Pass is in excess of $2,000.
> 
> ...



I agree that the unlimited version will be > $2000. Speculation on other forums has been that there will be a variety of options by region (though there may also be a 5 day for everyone 'sampler' pass. The notion that Killington is closing Pico is laughable though. They've been fully transparent on social media that Pico will be included in the K specific pass and have given no hint of closing it. With the village on the 5 year horizon (though it has been there for the last 15 years...), closing Pico would be ludicrous. 

An interesting caveat though - assuming next year tickets at K are also valid at Pico, if you redeem an Ikon pass for a day ticket (like you do with the Max), will K develop a specific ticket that won't work at Pico? I doubt it personally. All Pico not being on the Ikon really does is prevent the unlimited passholders from skiing there (assuming it is DTL) and it prevents you from getting x# of pico days AND x# of K days. It is just combined.



Jcb890 said:


> Raising the price by $171 and keeping a 5-day limit would suck with the loss of some of the New England/Eastern options.  I hope you're not correct.



If that is at all how the Ikon plays out, I will not be participating unfortunately. $800 for the eastern lineup is absurd and there are cheaper western option passes to, as I only plan on taking 1-2 western trips. IMO, $800 for 5 days each is a pretty shitty value for the eastern skier, unless they ski out west as much as they ski back east.

I'm hopeful for either better pricing or an Ikon add on option roughly equivalent to the Max add on price.


----------



## Jcb890 (Feb 1, 2018)

Higgl said:


> The Ikon people were up front in saying that it will be a few weeks before full pricing details are released. I'm thinking pricing details will be released around President's Day to make that the buzz again around that big ski weekend. Any announcement before that weekend would shock me.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The Killington / Pico strategy seems like an odd one also...
Who is going to pick Pico over Killington if they both count as the same 1 of 5 (if the limit stays the same)?  99% of people will pick Killington over Pico and Pico will see no crowds.  Whereas now there's the option for 5 at each so plenty of people will go to Pico.

Agreed, if it is $800 and 5 days each, I'll be passing as well.


----------



## Higgl (Feb 1, 2018)

Jcb890 said:


> The Killington / Pico strategy seems like an odd one also...
> Who is going to pick Pico over Killington if they both count as the same 1 of 5 (if the limit stays the same)?  99% of people will pick Killington over Pico and Pico will see no crowds.  Whereas now there's the option for 5 at each so plenty of people will go to Pico.
> 
> Agreed, if it is $800 and 5 days each, I'll be passing as well.



Oh definitely folks will VERY rarely if not never utilize the Pico option. Especially as it won't even be advertised. I was just pointing out that it is possible. 

A shame either way. I haven't yet used Pico on my Max and likely won't this season. I suppose I'm not alone and maybe that is why K opted to not put Pico on the Ikon. More likely though, is that Alterra said thanks, but no thanks, when Powdr offered Pico. I don't think they are looking for relatively 'no-name' resorts. They want mountains that stand out in their respective markets. I'd say 1/3 of the skiers any day at K don't know what Pico is, never mind skiers that don't even ski at K or in VT!


----------



## Jcb890 (Feb 1, 2018)

Higgl said:


> Oh definitely folks will VERY rarely if not never utilize the Pico option. Especially as it won't even be advertised. I was just pointing out that it is possible.
> 
> A shame either way. I haven't yet used Pico on my Max and likely won't this season. I suppose I'm not alone and maybe that is why K opted to not put Pico on the Ikon. More likely though, is that Alterra said thanks, but no thanks, when Powdr offered Pico. I don't think they are looking for relatively 'no-name' resorts. They want mountains that stand out in their respective markets. I'd say 1/3 of the skiers any day at K don't know what Pico is, never mind skiers that don't even ski at K or in VT!


Personally, I've never been to Pico.  Didn't use any of my MAX Passes there last year and probably won't this year either.  I treat Okemo the same way though, I'd rather drive the extra 20-30 mins to Killington than go to Okemo.

It would be cool if Ikon's price was similar to MAX, had an unlimited option or had an option to "trade" from 1 mountain to another, effectively allowing more than 5 tickets to each mountain.

But, we'll have to wait and see I guess. Man, I hate waiting.


----------



## Killingtime (Feb 1, 2018)

Higgl said:


> Oh definitely folks will VERY rarely if not never utilize the Pico option. Especially as it won't even be advertised. I was just pointing out that it is possible.
> 
> A shame either way. I haven't yet used Pico on my Max and likely won't this season. I suppose I'm not alone and maybe that is why K opted to not put Pico on the Ikon. More likely though, is that Alterra said thanks, but no thanks, when Powdr offered Pico. I don't think they are looking for relatively 'no-name' resorts. They want mountains that stand out in their respective markets. I'd say 1/3 of the skiers any day at K don't know what Pico is, never mind skiers that don't even ski at K or in VT!



That's the most reasonable explanation I've heard so far. Most likely Alterra passed on it. As a Killington pass holder I've been to Pico just a few times in the last 10 years, even though its a fun mountain with some cool trails.


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## Zermatt (Feb 1, 2018)

Killingtime said:


> That's the most reasonable explanation I've heard so far. Most likely Alterra passed on it. As a Killington pass holder I've been to Pico just a few times in the last 10 years, even though its a fun mountain with some cool trails.



Assuming both mountains are 100% open with 10” fresh snow I’d pick Pico every time over Killington. 

I agree it got dropped because it’s not an “icon” theory though.


----------



## Smellytele (Feb 1, 2018)

If Pico was taken care of like K I would go to Pico. I like the place more but they don't take care of it (less snow making). I only go to K when it is the only option or one of a handfull (early/late season). Hate the crowds (lifts, lodges, parking and trails) and vibe mid season.


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## Jully (Feb 1, 2018)

Jcb890 said:


> It would be cool if Ikon's price was similar to MAX, had an unlimited option or had an option to "trade" from 1 mountain to another, effectively allowing more than 5 tickets to each mountain.
> 
> But, we'll have to wait and see I guess. Man, I hate waiting.



Waiting absolutely stinks! Trading or selecting different mountains even would be great. Scuttlebutt on Pugski is that there will be a great deal of customization, but I'm not convinced it'll go that far, or it'll cost a bunch.


----------



## boston_e (Feb 1, 2018)

billo said:


> Assuming both mountains are 100% open with 10” fresh snow I’d pick Pico every time over Killington.
> 
> I agree it got dropped because it’s not an “icon” theory though.



I agree with this even without the 10” of snow.  In a generally good snow year I’ll take Pico over Killington every time.

Pico does lack the same type of snowmaking capacity so in a lean year Killington obviously has an advantage.

It is very curious that Pico is not included.  Perhaps the Ikon pricing will be such that Powdr was worried that Ikon pass sales could hurt Beast pass sales, so they held back Pico in hopes of not bastardizeing the sales of Pico and Beast passes.


----------



## xlr8r (Feb 1, 2018)

Pico is not the place to go when the only trails open are man-made groomed.  On those days Killington is the better option.  But if both mountains are at or near 100% open with recent fresh snow, Pico beats Killington hands down.  I don't get to Pico that often because I wait to go there until it is in peak conditions.  Not having Pico on Icon is a huge bummer and is a major factor in me probably purchasing the pas.  Even though I have twice as many days lifetime at Killington vs Pico, I prefer going to Pico.


----------



## machski (Feb 1, 2018)

For those stuck on Pico lockout of Ikon, Mt. Bachelor is bigger, in a region all by itself and was left off.  So by that measure, Pico not on it is no big deal with K and Stratton within short distance of each.

Sent from my XT1650 using AlpineZone mobile app


----------



## boston_e (Feb 1, 2018)

machski said:


> For those stuck on Pico lockout of Ikon, Mt. Bachelor is bigger, in a region all by itself and was left off.  So by that measure, Pico not on it is no big deal with K and Stratton within short distance of each.
> 
> Sent from my XT1650 using AlpineZone mobile app



For those of us who base ourselves out of the Killington / Pico area it could be a big deal as it seems we may be forced into choosing between a Killington / Pico pass (the killington pass is always valid at both) or a Killington / all these other 
mountains pass.  Obviously that opinion may change once final Ikon details are released.

As to Stratton, it is a solid hour+ from Killington.  I doubt that most weekend people would want to schlep to Stratton on Saturday morning after just arriving in Killington on Friday night.  So in that regard Okemo / Pico would be much more appealing.


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## ss20 (Feb 1, 2018)

boston_e said:


> For those of us who base ourselves out of the Killington / Pico area it could be a big deal as it seems we may be forced into choosing between a Killington / Pico pass (the killington pass is always valid at both) or a Killington / all these other
> mountains pass.  Obviously that opinion may change once final Ikon details are released.



It took 102 post but someone figured out why Pico may not be included...

Max Pass people are everywhere at K (me too, not trying to trash).  Because 10 days at Killington and Pico is plenty for a season, unless you have a house up there.  Want more?  Buy a Spring pass for a measly $200.   No one knows how revenue from the Max Pass gets to the hills, but it's not as much as Killington would get from one of their own pass products.

Essentially, between Max Pass and Killington Spring pass you could get 20+ days at Killington and Pico and they'd get $200+ whatever small amount they get from the Max Pass.  So next year when it's a limited number of Killington days (presumably) on Ikon people like myself will be roped into buying a Killington/Pico pass for $700...$800...$900...whatever, instead of the Max Pass/Spring pass combo.  That's a lot more $$$ going to Killington.



And the amount of speculation in this thread is nauseating.  And wrong (imo).  I don't know where people get the $2,000 figure from but that's not gonna compete with an Epic Pass which is less than half the cost.  No way this pass sells for more than $1,000.  They couldn't compete otherwise.


----------



## deadheadskier (Feb 1, 2018)

I would fault Powdr for not negotiating Pico into the deal on at least a five day basis.  

Who is "driving" the deal with the Ikon pass anyways?  Who was driving the deal with Maxx?  Intrawest?

Sent from my XT1635-01 using AlpineZone mobile app


----------



## urungus (Feb 2, 2018)

ss20 said:


> It took 102 post but someone figured out why Pico may not be included...
> 
> Max Pass people are everywhere at K (me too, not trying to trash).  Because 10 days at Killington and Pico is plenty for a season, unless you have a house up there.  Want more?  Buy a Spring pass for a measly $200.   No one knows how revenue from the Max Pass gets to the hills, but it's not as much as Killington would get from one of their own pass products.
> 
> Essentially, between Max Pass and Killington Spring pass you could get 20+ days at Killington and Pico and they'd get $200+ whatever small amount they get from the Max Pass.  So next year when it's a limited number of Killington days (presumably) on Ikon people like myself will be roped into buying a Killington/Pico pass for $700...$800...$900...whatever, instead of the Max Pass/Spring pass combo.  That's a lot more $$$ going to Killington.



Or maybe people will decide the extra expense is not worth it next year and will ski somewhere else, then Killington/Pico will not only lose out on the money for the passes, but also the money spent in the lodges.


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## Higgl (Feb 2, 2018)

deadheadskier said:


> I would fault Powdr for not negotiating Pico into the deal on at least a five day basis.
> 
> Who is "driving" the deal with the Ikon pass anyways?  Who was driving the deal with Maxx?  Intrawest?
> 
> Sent from my XT1635-01 using AlpineZone mobile app



My guess (which comes from following the "industry insider" people on Pugski who claim to have friends associated with the Alterra situation) is that Alterra is driving the deal.

They supposedly reached out to a whole slew of Mountain Collective and MAX mountains and only got two "no" answers. I highly doubt one of those two nos was for Pico LOL.

So I'd agree with you, Powdr failed to get Pico on the pass. Alterra is being selective with who they put on this thing.


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## machski (Feb 2, 2018)

I think Max was more balanced between Intrawest, Boyne and Powdr.  All of Powdr and Boyne's areas were on the Max anyway.  Ikon has left some big Powdr off and Boyne doesn't have everything they run as well.

Sent from my XT1650 using AlpineZone mobile app


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## xlr8r (Feb 2, 2018)

machski said:


> I think Max was more balanced between Intrawest, Boyne and Powdr.  All of Powdr and Boyne's areas were on the Max anyway.  Ikon has left some big Powdr off and Boyne doesn't have everything they run as well.
> 
> Sent from my XT1650 using AlpineZone mobile app



Max was balanced between what areas you could go to and for how many days, but it was created by Intrawest and run out of Intrawest's offices.


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## boston_e (Feb 4, 2018)

Higgl said:


> My guess (which comes from following the "industry insider" people on Pugski who claim to have friends associated with the Alterra situation) is that Alterra is driving the deal.
> 
> They supposedly reached out to a whole slew of Mountain Collective and MAX mountains and only got two "no" answers. I highly doubt one of those two nos was for Pico LOL.
> 
> So I'd agree with you, Powdr failed to get Pico on the pass. Alterra is being selective with who they put on this thing.



agreeing with SS20’s post above, i suspect powder did not want Pico in there.... powder would not want to lose Killington/Pico pass sales to the locals.


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## Monica (Feb 8, 2018)

That’s a bummer!


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## gnardawg (Feb 12, 2018)

Another Monday with no additional information.......


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## machski (Feb 12, 2018)

gnardawg said:


> Another Monday with no additional information.......


Not like any season passes for next year are on sale yet anyway.

Sent from my XT1650 using AlpineZone mobile app


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## boston_e (Feb 12, 2018)

machski said:


> Not like any season passes for next year are on sale yet anyway.
> 
> Sent from my XT1650 using AlpineZone mobile app



Indeed.  Pass decisions do not need to be made right now, although inquiring minds want to know!!!


----------



## gnardawg (Feb 13, 2018)

no one is pimping season pass yet though either. Unlike Ikon which blitzed the world with ads/hype.


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## xlr8r (Feb 13, 2018)

I would expect Ikon pass prices to be released post presidents week/early March.  That seems to be the time most passes get released in recent years


----------



## Jcb890 (Feb 13, 2018)

I think people were just opining that it was annoying Ikon came out and made a big announcement, but followed up with no details other than a list of mountains and a note that the MAX Pass was going bye-bye.


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## KustyTheKlown (Feb 13, 2018)

yea, its just shitty of them. "hey we're taking away a product that you loved and replacing it with something that sounds a lot worse and fuck you we aren't giving you any details"


----------



## machski (Feb 13, 2018)

But we all are talking about it, which I imagine is what they wanted.  Hell, other than the high end all inclusive, they might not even have all the details nailed down anyway.

Sent from my XT1650 using AlpineZone mobile app


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## Jcb890 (Feb 13, 2018)

KustyTheKlown said:


> yea, its just shitty of them. "hey we're taking away a product that you loved and replacing it with something that sounds a lot worse and fuck you we aren't giving you any details"





machski said:


> But we all are talking about it, which I imagine is what they wanted.  Hell, other than the high end all inclusive, they might not even have all the details nailed down anyway.


For reasons KTK just mentioned, of course we're all talking about it.  We're talking about it because many of us on here were happy customers of the MAX Pass and are concerned we might be getting a worse product to replace it.


----------



## AdironRider (Feb 13, 2018)

machski said:


> But we all are talking about it, which I imagine is what they wanted.  Hell, other than the high end all inclusive, they might not even have all the details nailed down anyway.
> 
> Sent from my XT1650 using AlpineZone mobile app




They don't have all the details locked down, the mountains are still working out who gets paid what for each skier day. 

That being said, saying the Ikon pass is worse than the Max pass is pure hyperbole. Only on AZ do people bitch about getting access to Aspen, JHole and other premier mountains.


----------



## KustyTheKlown (Feb 13, 2018)

I had plenty of access to premier mountains on max pass, at $600, with 20 places within 6 hours of drive of my apt


----------



## gnardawg (Feb 13, 2018)

Agreed - I have 2 year old - I don't have time to take advantage of the premier mountains out west. At least the Max Pass gave my season some variety locally. Losing Sunapee/Okemo/Wachuessett/Pico is huge for me. 



KustyTheKlown said:


> I had plenty of access to premier mountains on max pass, at $600, with 20 places within 6 hours of drive of my apt


----------



## WJenness (Feb 13, 2018)

gnardawg said:


> Agreed - I have 2 year old - I don't have time to take advantage of the premier mountains out west. At least the Max Pass gave my season some variety locally. Losing Sunapee/Okemo/Wachuessett/Pico is huge for me.



Same. (Except for the two year old part)

This is my second year on the Max.

I've gotten (and will most likely get) zero days West of VT.

My wife does not ski, it's mostly day trips for me. At this point, I do one or two nights away from home over the course of the entire season.

Taking off my night skiing option (WaWa), one of my easy day trip options (Sunapee), one of my crowd avoidance options (Pico), and one of my good early season options (Okemo) sucks a lot of value out of the pass for me.

Really not sure what I'm going to do next year at this point.

-w


----------



## cdskier (Feb 13, 2018)

AdironRider said:


> That being said, saying the Ikon pass is worse than the Max pass is pure hyperbole. Only on AZ do people bitch about getting access to Aspen, JHole and other premier mountains.



What good is getting access to places you don't plan to visit in exchange for losing areas that you did visit? I can agree that Ikon is not worse for everyone and some people could benefit from it (depending on pricing), but to say this new pass is not worse for at least some eastern skiers is not very realistic. Also, this is an eastern-focused forum after all. So from an eastern perspective I think many of the concerns raised are valid.


----------



## Jcb890 (Feb 13, 2018)

cdskier said:


> What good is getting access to places you don't plan to visit in exchange for losing areas that you did visit? I can agree that Ikon is not worse for everyone and some people could benefit from it (depending on pricing), but to say this new pass is not worse for at least some eastern skiers is not very realistic. Also, this is an eastern-focused forum after all. So from an eastern perspective I think many of the concerns raised are valid.


That, and how about if the price of the pass comes in high and only gives something like 2 days at Jackson Hole or Aspen?  What good does that do?  But we're supposed to just blindly be happy that Jackson Hole is on the list... give me a break.


----------



## machski (Feb 13, 2018)

Jcb890 said:


> For reasons KTK just mentioned, of course we're all talking about it.  We're talking about it because many of us on here were happy customers of the MAX Pass and are concerned we might be getting a worse product to replace it.


And before Max what did you have?  You all are acting like Max was a God given right.  These multi-resort passes will morph and change several more times in the future.  The only one slightly stable is Epic, but I expect it's cost to the skier will continue to increase.  Deal with it and move on.

Sent from my XT1650 using AlpineZone mobile app


----------



## AdironRider (Feb 13, 2018)

Jcb890 said:


> That, and how about if the price of the pass comes in high and only gives something like 2 days at Jackson Hole or Aspen?  What good does that do?  But we're supposed to just blindly be happy that Jackson Hole is on the list... give me a break.



You are getting worked up over a hypothetical situation.


----------



## Jcb890 (Feb 13, 2018)

machski said:


> And before Max what did you have?  You all are acting like Max was a God given right.  These multi-resort passes will morph and change several more times in the future.  The only one slightly stable is Epic, but I expect it's cost to the skier will continue to increase.  Deal with it and move on.
> 
> Sent from my XT1650 using AlpineZone mobile app


Nobody is acting like that, nor are they opining saying anyone deserves anything.  We're just a little antsy that a pass option might be turned to crap next season.  We all know things are changing and they are going to continue to do so.

Last I checked, this was a forum to discuss these kind of things and this is a thread to discuss exactly that.  This would be a pretty boring website/forum if it was just threads to post news and trail reports, don't you think?


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## Jcb890 (Feb 13, 2018)

AdironRider said:


> You are getting worked up over a hypothetical situation.


I'm not worked up.  I've said it more than once - I'll wait to get aggravated/annoyed/pissed/whatever until details are released.
I will agree that I am annoyed there's no details yet though.


----------



## FBGM (Feb 13, 2018)

Lol's at the peeps complaining they can't ski Wachusett. Did you also complain when Ford stopped making the Pinto? Or when snowblades got out of fad. 

Global climate change warming will have that east coast mole hill gone within the next 10 years anyway


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## AdironRider (Feb 13, 2018)

I can see customer service person fielding calls "You dropped Wawa for Jackson and Aspen! This is a travesty!" and just hanging up.


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## speden (Feb 13, 2018)

FBGM said:


> Lol's at the peeps complaining they can't ski Wachusett. Did you also complain when Ford stopped making the Pinto? Or when snowblades got out of fad.
> 
> Global climate change warming will have that east coast mole hill gone within the next 10 years anyway



I doubt it. They just beefed up the pump capacity and will lay down a six foot base if they have to. That place is a cash cow.


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## KustyTheKlown (Feb 13, 2018)

machski said:


> And before Max what did you have?  You all are acting like Max was a God given right.  These multi-resort passes will morph and change several more times in the future.  The only one slightly stable is Epic, but I expect it's cost to the skier will continue to increase.  Deal with it and move on.
> 
> Sent from my XT1650 using AlpineZone mobile app





before max i had a mountain collective one year, and it didnt cover anything in the east and i had to spend lots of extra money on lift tix

after mountain collective i had an epic pass for one year, and it didnt cover anything in the east but i skied out west for 20 days on it

now that stowe is on the epic pass, and pending ikon's pricing and structure, i may be switching to an epic pass next year and looking for a seasonal share in stowe. and that bites. variety is everything to me, and is so important for conditions and fun in the east. two of my best ski buds are already pushing so hard for us to get epic passes. i also have mileage issues with my leased car which has one more year on it. going to and from stowe every weekend will end up costing me $$$. cant wait to own a car instead after the lease ends.


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## boston_e (Feb 14, 2018)

KustyTheKlown said:


> before max i had a mountain collective one year, and it didnt cover anything in the east and i had to spend lots of extra money on lift tix
> 
> after mountain collective i had an epic pass for one year, and it didnt cover anything in the east but i skied out west for 20 days on it
> 
> now that stowe is on the epic pass, and pending ikon's pricing and structure, i may be switching to an epic pass next year and looking for a seasonal share in stowe. and that bites. variety is everything to me, and is so important for conditions and fun in the east. two of my best ski buds are already pushing so hard for us to get epic passes. i also have mileage issues with my leased car which has one more year on it. going to and from stowe every weekend will end up costing me $$$. cant wait to own a car instead after the lease ends.



Depending on pricing and format, Ikon could be much better for the New England scene than Epic.  I'd take unlimited at Killington, SR, Sugarloaf over unlimited at Stow any day.  It does stink to lose Sunapee, Okemo, Wawa etc for those who want to do day trips though.


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## machski (Feb 15, 2018)

Well, we learned that the pass has partnered with POW (protect our winters).  Every pass will get a $50 membership with POW.  Those who deny climate change I guess need not buy.

Sent from my XT1650 using AlpineZone mobile app


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## Oz Von Toco (Feb 16, 2018)

I was quite happy with the max pass the last 2 winters

This is only my 4th season riding so I have yet to be out west. Mostly for money reasons, losing the ability to hop in my car and have a ton of options kinda stinks. 

I'll probably do the peak pass with hunter, snow, jfbb for $400 since I'm 26 and the good price is only until your 29. Few of my friends got that pass and they're very happy with it. Having Jackson hole is only great if you can afford to get over there..


Sent from my iPhone using AlpineZone


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## Smellytele (Feb 16, 2018)

My wife already has asked what my plans for season passes are for next year. I told her I had to wait to weigh my options. She wanted calculations of what it cost per visit and is it worth it for her to get one or just me and pay as she goes. I am down to 22 a visit on my pass but she is at around 100 but she will ski a few more times.


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## Zermatt (Feb 17, 2018)

Increasing antagonism has prompted Ikon to say sometime in February we will know. 

Right now they are busy wasting their time with POW and unicorn farts, but hopefully we know in the next 2 weeks.


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## Scruffy (Feb 17, 2018)

billo said:


> Increasing antagonism has prompted Ikon to say sometime in February we will know.
> 
> Right now they are busy wasting their time with POW and unicorn farts, but hopefully we know in the next 2 weeks.



They should feel the heat, they threw a bomb onto the playing field without any clarity. Typical FUD. We, the paying public, need certainty on how we spend our $$s and some make plans a year out for such things as expensive passes.


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## abc (Feb 17, 2018)

Scruffy said:


> They should feel the heat, they threw a bomb onto the playing field without any clarity. Typical FUD. We, the paying public, need certainty on how we spend our $$s and some make plans a year out for such things as expensive passes.


First, they don't care so much to attract the business of people who only want to spend $$. They're more interested in people who spend $$$$! 

Complaining about the lack of clarity in February is like complaining about not knowing what's on sales on Black Friday, in October! :smash::smash::smash:


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## AdironRider (Feb 18, 2018)

Has anyone released pass prices anywhere yet? 

No, so this whole planning argument is pointless.


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## Smellytele (Feb 18, 2018)

AdironRider said:


> Has anyone released pass prices anywhere yet?
> 
> No, so this whole planning argument is pointless.



+1
living in the digital age everyone wants everything right now.


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## Jully (Feb 18, 2018)

White Mountain Super Pass typically releases the last week of February IIRC. Usually the first in the east at least.


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## deadheadskier (Feb 18, 2018)

Cannon just did

http://www.cannonmt.com/season-passes.html

Some aggressive early buy pricing and add ons

Sent from my XT1635-01 using AlpineZone mobile app


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## Zermatt (Feb 18, 2018)

AdironRider said:


> Has anyone released pass prices anywhere yet?
> 
> No, so this whole planning argument is pointless.


I know what MAX would be within 10%, I know what Epic will be within 10%....I have no idea what Ikon will be! Can't even guess. 

I'm planning next season, I'm not making that up.


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## Dick Gazinya (Feb 18, 2018)

billo said:


> I know what MAX would be within 10%, I know what Epic will be within 10%....I have no idea what Ikon will be! Can't even guess.
> 
> I'm planning next season, I'm not making that up.



I can't even plan tomorrow, idk how you can plan next season.


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## Smellytele (Feb 18, 2018)

Waterville released theirs for next year


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## boston_e (Feb 18, 2018)

Thinking about it more for our situation, the Ikon pass is certainly a downgrade as compared to the Max pass, it almost does not matter what the cost is.

We will for sure be buying our usual Pico passes (our home mountain) and Killington spring passes, and unless there is a 3-5 days at each of the participating mountains somewhere in the $300 range, this Ikon will be a non starter for us.

Losing Okemo takes away a convenient day trip option.  Utah is the easiest direct flight from Boston and swapping Solitude and Brighton for Alta and Deer Valley is a downgrade simply because of the snowboarding policies.  (We do not snowboard much but many friends we like to go with do, so it is unlikely we would utilize those mountains)

I don’t know if Max was profitable.  Maybe it wasn’t and that is why it is going away, but they are likely losing our family as customers.


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## Jully (Feb 18, 2018)

Idk I prefer Snowbird to Solitude and Brighton. Yes Alta and DV stink for snowboarders, but Snowbird more than beats SolBright in my book.


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## Jully (Feb 18, 2018)

deadheadskier said:


> Cannon just did
> 
> http://www.cannonmt.com/season-passes.html
> 
> ...



3 $25 tickets is quite a deal! Love that they went cheaper, but it is still a lot compared to Peaks with multiple resorts. Not sure it will sway me.

Interesting that Cannon isn't advertising the WMSP but WV is.


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## deadheadskier (Feb 18, 2018)

Jully said:


> 3 $25 tickets is quite a deal! Love that they went cheaper, but it is still a lot compared to Peaks with multiple resorts. Not sure it will sway me.
> 
> Interesting that Cannon isn't advertising the WMSP but WV is.


That's exactly where I'm at.  For all of Peaks warts, I still get 3 mountains (one being my favorite in the state) and the longest season in the state for $499 with few blackouts.  Don't really care about Snow other than Peaks gives them far more love than the Granite mountains.

Peaks would probably have to price themselves $100 above that Cannon deal for me to consider change and I do very much like Cannon. 

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## MEtoVTSkier (Feb 19, 2018)

deadheadskier said:


> Cannon just did
> 
> http://www.cannonmt.com/season-passes.html
> 
> ...



Wow, February 18th for next year? Is that an all-time record early date for next years pricing?


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## abc (Feb 19, 2018)

People are just being impatient. Of course I want to know what card you have in a poker game! That doesn’t mean you’re going to tell me. You would only do that if it’s to your advantage to do so. So I’m sorry people will just have to suck it up and wait.


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## machski (Feb 19, 2018)

MEtoVTSkier said:


> Wow, February 18th for next year? Is that an all-time record early date for next years pricing?


Possibly, but being this will be Cannon's 80th season, I have a feeling they may have decided the pricing plan earlier than normal to promote the anniversary season.

Sent from my XT1650 using AlpineZone mobile app


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## Smellytele (Feb 19, 2018)

The Cannon price really has caught my attention. the 3 tickets for 25 each could help out as well if my wife decides not to get a pass. Need to know what teen prices will be.


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## Jully (Feb 20, 2018)

machski said:


> Possibly, but being this will be Cannon's 80th season, I have a feeling they may have decided the pricing plan earlier than normal to promote the anniversary season.
> 
> Sent from my XT1650 using AlpineZone mobile app



WMSP always is the first to release in NE, at least in most years. New England Pass by Boyne is usually a week or two behind. Not sure about 2/18, but IIRC 2/24 (when passes actually go on sale) is almost exactly when they went on sale last year. I suspect they announced the price a few days before last year too.


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## Jully (Feb 20, 2018)

Some details released about the Boyne NE Pass for next year. It will exist (there was some speculation that it might disappear). 

Gold has 50% off Boyne's Western Mtns. 

New Bronze PLUS pass with skiing Sunday-Friday instead of midweek only. I don't ski Saturdays for the most part, so this could be really interesting.

Everything else more or less the same. Young Adult pass at each resort. Same "Flash Sale" in early March (5th to 11th). Last year you saved $50 during that week, I think?

http://www.sundayriver.com/winter/tickets-and-passes/season-passes


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