# Rossi B2 vs. K2 Apache Recon



## kabelnicke (Nov 23, 2005)

I'm looking for an all purpose type of ski and these two are on my current shortlist. If you have any suggestions or advice on this matter, please let me know.


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## Greg (Nov 23, 2005)

Welcome kabelnicke!

Demo. Add the Volkl Unlimited AC3 (predecessor to the 724 EXP) and Dynastar Legend 8000 to your list.


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## kabelnicke (Nov 23, 2005)

Thanx Greg,
Demo is obviously the way! Tough from where I live though(London,UK)


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## Greg (Nov 23, 2005)

kabelnicke said:
			
		

> Thanx Greg,
> Demo is obviously the way! Tough from where I live though(London,UK)


London, eh? Have you seen this forum:

http://www.snowheads.com/

That site is based out of the U.K. Of course you're welcome here too.


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## bigbog (Nov 24, 2005)

*........*

...a few that haven't been mentioned..
Elan's m666  8)  love this ski....
Nordica has the _Hot Rod_, _Speedmachine_, and _SUV_ lines....


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## BeanoNYC (Nov 25, 2005)

Hi and welcome.  I actually got engaged in London.  It's a great town.  I was talking to a salesman the other day and he recommmended the Rossi Zenith Z9.  Might want to explore that option.


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## RossiSkier (Nov 25, 2005)

Assuming you are speaking of the 2005/2006 models. . . Both the K2 Apache Recon (119/78/105 ) and the Rossignol B2 are great skis with the same 16M sidecut.  The Recon is a wood core, as opposed to the foam core of the B2.  Both skis rip.  The B2 has a cult following and the Recon is just plain popular.  I would scoop up the B2 in a heartbeat, but if you can get a good deal for the Recon, go for it.  See if you can get a package deal with bindings.  For the B2's, make sure it's Rossi AXIAL bindings.  The Rossi AXIUM bindings are beginner or garbage binding, so don't dare put a pair of them on B2's.  For the K2's, make sure it's a pair of high end Marker bindings.  K2 and Marker are the same parent company.  Don't know much about Marker bindings to suggest a set.

If you demo, try to find the right length for you.  If you demo skis too short or too long, you will get the illusion that the ski don't perform well.  Both skis rip, and rip hard.

p.s.  If you're looking for value, the new 2005/2006 Rossignol B1 has taken the place of the B2 of previous years.  It is now an all mountain wood core MIDFAT at 114/74/104.  It is a bargin at my local shop at $300 and change.


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## batman (Dec 4, 2005)

Hey *RossiSkier*, I'm looking for new skis this season and have narrowed it down to exactly the two models you mention, K2 Recon and Rossi B2. You sound very knowledgable and I'd like to hear your comments about these skis.

About me...

Physically, I'm male, 5'6" in height, weigh 125lbs, physically fit and strong. I ski mostly black, some double blacks, cruising runs as well as in the trees. Basically, I enjoy skiing all of the mountain. I ski mostly out west (Whisltler, Banff, Tahoe) and in Ontario (Canada) sometimes, also in Europe also and hardly never in Quebec or the east. I'm not sure what level I am because I've never really been rated. I would say 7 or 8.

I currently ski on Rossignol Mountain Vipers (188cm) which I purchased in 1994 or thereabouts. The vipers are great for almost all of the mountain although I find them a bit unwieldly for bumps or tight spots in the trees. I still love these skis, but tried shaped skis last year and found them much more fun to ski that the Vipers. 

I've got it narrowed down to the Rossignol B2 and the K2 Recon models. I'm not sure about the lenght though. I was thinking about 165-170cm length. What do you think I would like or dislike about each ski?

Any feedback about how you think I would like each particular model would be great as well as feedback on the length also!


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## volklyokel (Dec 4, 2005)

I was just in the local ski shop on Friday, faced with exactly this choice. I walked out of the shop having paid for a set of 167cm K2's (I'll pick them up this Friday). The Bandits are an awesome ski, no doubt. The B2 and the Recon are virtually neck-and-neck, in terms of what conditions and kinds of skiing they're designed for. So why did I pick the K2's?

I bought these exclusively for Utah skiing, which I do for a couple of weeks every year. These past several seasons have offered mountain conditions as varied as anything: some years have had great powder, other years gave no fresh snow at all & everything, including off piste, was hardpack or packed powder. So what I was looking for was a ski that can "do it all." I rode Volkl Vertigo G2's in 2003, and they were o.k. In 2004 & 2005 I was on P50's GS skis. 2005 was fine with those since there was no fresh stuff falling for the two weeks I was out there. But they really lacked in 2004 when the snow got deep and we had two 15"+ dumpings. I was restricted to the groomers which was a bummer, that year.

So, armed with the Fall issue of Ski Press (which has all the ski reviews), the riders who contributed to the tests gave the nod to the Recons in that they were: stable, have superior edge grip and they gave it high marks in the versatility department. Ski press reviewers, gave the B2 a review that either was the same as, or a couple of notches down, in all categories, from the review they gave the Recon. Having studied previous Ski Press reviews and demoed a few of those skis in past years, I feel pretty confident in their reviewing process.

Now, I've yet to ride the Recons, and so I won't really know until I give them the once through, especially out in Utah in March. I admit that I took a risk and bought without demoing, but I did so because the Recons are selling like hot cakes and I didn't want to be faced with the prospect of having waited too long, and not having been able to get a pair later in the season.

Background: I'm 5'-9" and weigh in around 180, but have been skiing pretty solidly for the last 5 seasons, but have been on and off skis for 30 years. My favorite Utah hills are Snowbasin, Alta/Snowbird, Brighton/Solitude & Deer Valley. I'll go down practically anything except cliffs. Here in the east I ride Volkl P50's (when I feel like going fast) and Six Stars (for fooling around). I enjoy Blue Knob and various small hills in southern PA. Its all warm-up for Utah.

Cheers - VY


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## RossiSkier (Dec 5, 2005)

It's nice to have choices.  Glad to hear that you Got your money's worth out of those Vipers.  

The Apache Recon is an acclaimed ski.  No doubt about it's performance. This ski is a monster and I have no doubt that you would love it. 
http://www.skimag.com/skimag/buyers_guide/app/product/0,15058,ski1122,00.html

Picking between the Recon and the B2 is like picking between a Porche and a Ferrari.  The B2 has a cult following and I'm sure the Recon has something to that effect as well.  

Biggest difference may be price. What's your best deal.  The B2 (gulp) may actually be less expensive.  
Don't let them put garbarge bindings on either ski.
It HAS to be a Rossi Axial for the B2's and a Marker Titanium Piston for the Recon.

_For you, I would go short.  Get the model in the 160's._ 

Both skis are champions, but the B2's are lighter.  The Recon has a spruce core and the B2 is milled foam, and it's lighter.

*GO FOR THE BEST VALUE!* 

K2 Apache Recon 119/78/105 - 160, 170, 174, 181
16.0 sidecut @ 174
Wood core
Retail: $800
Marker Titanium Piston Control Bindings
12.0 - $170.00
1300 - $190.00
14.0 - $230.00


http://www.k2skis.com/product/skis/pictoviews/high/picto_HIGH.asp?ProductID=2

Rossignol B2 113/76/103 - 148,158,166,174,182 cm
16.6 @ 174
Retail for $829, but you can get them for $600.
Milled foam core
Axial Pro Bindings
120 - $160.oo
140 - $200.00

Click


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## JimG. (Dec 5, 2005)

volklyokel said:
			
		

> I was just in the local ski shop on Friday, faced with exactly this choice. I walked out of the shop having paid for a set of 167cm K2's (I'll pick them up this Friday). The Bandits are an awesome ski, no doubt. The B2 and the Recon are virtually neck-and-neck, in terms of what conditions and kinds of skiing they're designed for. So why did I pick the K2's?
> 
> I bought these exclusively for Utah skiing, which I do for a couple of weeks every year. These past several seasons have offered mountain conditions as varied as anything: some years have had great powder, other years gave no fresh snow at all & everything, including off piste, was hardpack or packed powder. So what I was looking for was a ski that can "do it all." I rode Volkl Vertigo G2's in 2003, and they were o.k. In 2004 & 2005 I was on P50's GS skis. 2005 was fine with those since there was no fresh stuff falling for the two weeks I was out there. But they really lacked in 2004 when the snow got deep and we had two 15"+ dumpings. I was restricted to the groomers which was a bummer, that year.
> 
> ...



Love the handle volklyokel...hard to believe you're skiing K2's :lol: .

Welcome aboard.


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## SKIQUATTRO (Dec 6, 2005)

1 word.................DEMO

no one skis like you do, each and every ski will feel and ski different for everyone, you must demo.

did i mention.......DEMO


Also, make sure its tuned properly.  When I demoed my Atomics last year they were fantastic, then I bought them at my local shop, when skied them the next day with the shop tune and the skis were AWFUL..wasnt until I tuned them myself did they come back to life and be the ski that they are.

Oh,,,DEMO


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## salida (Dec 6, 2005)

After working in ski hardgood marketing this summer for a amherst, nh based ski company, I found that all those ski tests are a bunch of crap, the magazines "feature" your skis based on the advertising dollars that you spend with them... Just a heads up for people who go into shops with preconcieved notions based on magazine tests


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## volklyokel (Dec 6, 2005)

*Quattro*: It's a shame that your local shop is so inept at setting a tune for the skis they sell. My experience has taught me that shops that focus more on rentals only seem only to know how to de-tune. It is a true blessing to have a shop that has been in business for more than two decades, who prides itself on having skiied everything they sell and knowing what they're talking about. I'm a repeat customer with my local shop and in the half decade I've been with them, they've never steered me wrong. I agree, demoing is the safest bet. I purchased the way I did because the long-term availability of Recons is not very well guaranteed.

*Salida*: Last year, I demoed five different pairs of skis on a demo weekend at Elk Mountain, PA. I made notes on how each of the skis I tried behaved. Then I went back to various magazine reviews (notably, Ski, Skiing and Ski Press) and the Ski Press reviews offered in the Fall 2004, by golly, were on the money, for the most part, with four out of five of those reviews. With regard to the Ski Press reviews, I remain unconvinced that a favorable ski rating is only correlated with the amount of advertising revenues.

Volklyokel - with a little K2 on the side


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## salida (Dec 6, 2005)

volklyokel

its not what the review says, its whether the ski is reviewed or not, any ski that is reviewed gets a good rating... sorry to burst the buble


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## RossiSkier (Dec 7, 2005)

salida said:
			
		

> After working in ski hardgood marketing this summer for a amherst, nh based ski company, I found that all those ski tests are a bunch of crap, the magazines "feature" your skis based on the advertising dollars that you spend with them... Just a heads up for people who go into shops with preconcieved notions based on magazine tests



I couldn't agree more.  What a 150lbs twenty-something thinks about a set of skis is USELESS to me.  I buy the preseason guides for all the technical specifications that they contain.


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## batman (Dec 8, 2005)

Thanks for all the great advice!

I skied on the Rossi B2s last season while at Whistler. I found the skis easy to ride (probably because of the lenght, sidecut and softness), however, found them a bit unstable at higher speeds. I imagine that is because of the softness of them. I asked the rep and he thought I wasn't skiing on them properly. I'm a pretty aggressive skier. By looking at me, one wouldn't think that.

I'm leaning towards the K2s because they seem stiffer than the Rossi B2s, however, I've never skied on the K2s and have some worries about that.

My logic is if I get the K2s I can always work them harder to make them do what I want. However, it would be difficult to do that with the Rossi B2s because I've already surpassed their upper limit.


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## RossiSkier (Dec 8, 2005)

batman said:
			
		

> Thanks for all the great advice!
> 
> I skied on the Rossi B2s last season while at Whistler. I found the skis easy to ride (probably because of the lenght, sidecut and softness), however, found them a bit unstable at higher speeds. I imagine that is because of the softness of them. I asked the rep and he thought I wasn't skiing on them properly. I'm a pretty aggressive skier. By looking at me, one wouldn't think that.
> 
> ...



Last year's B2's are different from this year's. This years B2 became last years B3. Last year's B2's became this years B1, etc. Now they're all midfats and fatties.   Point being is that now it's a different ski.


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## dmo (Dec 8, 2005)

As mentioned a couple of times, all of the B series dimensions have changed. Over the last few years though, I've found the whole lot of them to be soft, unresponsive, chattery and slightly boring.

But, to each his own!


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## batman (Dec 8, 2005)

RossiSkier said:
			
		

> Last year's B2's are different from this year's. This years B2 became last years B3. Last year's B2's became this years B1, etc. Now they're all midfats and fatties.   Point being is that now it's a different ski.



Hmm, interesting. I'm fairly certain I skied on the 2005/06 B2s because it was a vendor demo day and it was in April (where there was snow at Whistler!). It would be highly unlikely that they would have the old stock for people to try. Most wouldn't buy skis at that time of year, but probably in the following season - like me.

I found a shop that is selling the K2 Recon (including IBX12) for about $150 less than the Rossi B2s. If I go with K2, this will be my first pair of non-Rossi skis!


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## RossiSkier (Dec 9, 2005)

batman said:
			
		

> RossiSkier said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Oh ok.  It's so early in the season I thought you had skied on the latter year's model.  Like I said, go for the best value.  If that's the K2's, then God bless you.  Get 'em and go rip.


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## batman (Dec 18, 2005)

I did it! Last week, I got the K2 Apache Recon!!! 167cm with Marker IBX12. There was a good deal at one of the local ski shops. They were $150 _less_ than the Rossi B2!

I tried them out on Saturday. Turning was effortless. They were extremely stable at all speeds (the B2s were not good at higher speeds), super grippy, great on the hard pack and in the crud too! I haven't tried them on powder of off piste yet, but I'm sure I will be pleasantly surprised!

The strangest thing was the lack of chatter or vibration in the skis! They are very quiet! I thought they were amazing! They Rip!  

Thanks for all of your advice! :beer:


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## RossiSkier (Dec 19, 2005)

Sounds like you got a great deal and a great pair of boards.  Now go ski like a madman!


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