# Catamount Ski Area News



## mbedle (Apr 4, 2018)

Just saw that over on saminfo.com. Isn't this the place that was looking to expand with a new hotel a couple of years ago?


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## andrec10 (Apr 4, 2018)

mbedle said:


> Just saw that over on saminfo.com. Isn't this the place that was looking to expand with a new hotel a couple of years ago?



And they got stalled by the town and the Hotel owner, to the point where the investors of the new hotel lost interest. I hope Rich still retains the reins! Hell of a nice guy!


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## ss20 (Apr 4, 2018)

Doesn't sound like they're struggling....just sounds like they want to expand and don't have the capital for it.  They are in a prime location and do a fantastic job catering to all levels of skiers- something many mountains can't do these days.  Big ski school with a new magic carpet and plenty of greens, nice blue cruisers, plenty of black terrain that's groomed and ungroomed.  

All that said it's the same drive time from NYC to the Catskills as it is to Catamount.  Catskills have more mountain and more amenities.  I'd have to imagine Catamount is looking to entice the Westchester county crowd (hence that upscale timeshare/hotel thing from years ago).  I always thought Jiminy Peak had that market cornered but we'll see.  

I wish them luck in whatever they do...not just because I like it.  It's a critical stop on the NYC/Westchester conga line of future skiers.  Start them at Thunder Ridge/Mountain Creek, send them to Catamount/Mohawk/Butternut, and the ones that complete the journey end up at Jiminy or Vermont and are hooked.


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## podunk77 (Apr 4, 2018)

ss20 said:


> I wish them luck in whatever they do...not just because I like it.  It's a critical stop on the NYC/Westchester conga line of future skiers.



Not to mention the fact they have one of the best ticket deals around.... $20 if bought online, and usable any Monday through Thursday except for the usual blackout periods (basically Christmas and February school vacation).  For the 85% of skiers who can enjoy a day at a place that isn't Killington, Stowe or MRG, this place is a little gem.


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## ss20 (May 21, 2018)

Purchased by Berkshire East for $2.3M...

http://www.newenglandskiindustry.com/viewstory.php?storyid=688

Couple of interesting points...

1. $2.3M sounds absurdly low.  I can't believe that's the going-rate on a well-established 4-season mountain that has no substantial problems.  

2. I don't know what they're going to invest in to make it more of a summer place.  They already have the ropes course.  Mountain biking?  I do not know the mountain biking industry at all...but the big names I always hear are Killington and Berkshire East so they must know what they're doing.  

3.  New base lodge to be constructed this summer.  Good luck.  Unless it's already started that seems like a stretch to have it done in 6 months.  

4. I only see how things on-hill during the ski season could improve.  BE is not afraid to leave things natural and let some things bump up.  Catamount is good about that too...although they had begun to groom Catapult more and more in recent years.  My wish list for Catamount has a couple of glades and installing a new conveyor-quad like Berkshire East has to replace the summit quad.  Other than that- no big changes needed.


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## benski (May 22, 2018)

ss20 said:


> Purchased by Berkshire East for $2.3M...
> 
> http://www.newenglandskiindustry.com/viewstory.php?storyid=688
> 
> ...



If they have to tear down the base lodge, that’s a huge problem.


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## urungus (May 22, 2018)

benski said:


> If they have to tear down the base lodge, that’s a huge problem.



According to the press release “We also intend to renovate the existing main lodge and build a new lodge in the base area during the summer of 2018.”


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## Killingtime (May 22, 2018)

[2. I don't know what they're going to invest in to make it more of a summer place. They already have the ropes course. Mountain biking? I do not know the mountain biking industry at all...but the big names I always hear are Killington and Berkshire East so they must know what they're doing. 

Mountain Biking has taken off at Killington. Lots of people there on weekends when a decade ago there was nothing. They keep expanding terrain. It actually pretty impressive.


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## Abominable (May 22, 2018)

"My wish list for Catamount has a couple of glades" - agree with this, seemed like the middle of the mountain in between the lifts was sort of under-used, but I don't know the place that well and have never been when trees were in play.

The right folks bought it for that to happen, I'd say.

Also agree 2.3 million seems pretty low.  I mean, the real estate alone should be worth more than that, no?  Unless this thing has been losing money for years.  That 2.3 includes 1.6 of debt as well.

But I'm not in this line of work.  Check out the listing for Bousquet - asking 3.2m.  Lemme check my couch cushions....

http://www.stonehouseproperties.com/real-estate/101-dan-fox-dr-pittsfield-ma-01201/222147/52412413


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## Abominable (May 22, 2018)

A bit of googling and it looks like these things generally go for 6X earnings.  So I suppose that means Catamount makes 400K / year.

Is it surprising that Hunter makes so much more (15 times more?) than a Catamount?

ILDWOOD, Mo., November 30, 2015 -- Peak Resorts, Inc. (NASDAQ:SKIS), a leading owner and operator of high-quality, individually branded ski resorts in the U.S., today announced it has entered into an agreement to purchase Hunter Mountain, the Catskills' premier winter resort destination, for cash consideration of $35 million plus the assumption of two capital leases estimated at approximately $1.8 million. Hunter Mountain generates approximately $27 million (unaudited) in annual revenue. The purchase price is slightly more than six times Hunter Mountain’s adjusted EBITDA, which is estimated at approximately $6 million (unaudited) for its fiscal year ended April 30, 2015.


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## x10003q (May 22, 2018)

ss20 said:


> Purchased by Berkshire East for $2.3M...
> 
> http://www.newenglandskiindustry.com/viewstory.php?storyid=688
> 
> ...



The $2.3 million is easily backed into once you see the financial numbers.  BE is really tuned into the value of Catamount based on being in the same business in roughly the same area. After that, you need to see what the current owners will take.


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## machski (May 22, 2018)

Abominable said:


> A bit of googling and it looks like these things generally go for 6X earnings.  So I suppose that means Catamount makes 400K / year.
> 
> Is it surprising that Hunter makes so much more (15 times more?) than a Catamount?
> 
> ILDWOOD, Mo., November 30, 2015 -- Peak Resorts, Inc. (NASDAQ:SKIS), a leading owner and operator of high-quality, individually branded ski resorts in the U.S., today announced it has entered into an agreement to purchase Hunter Mountain, the Catskills' premier winter resort destination, for cash consideration of $35 million plus the assumption of two capital leases estimated at approximately $1.8 million. Hunter Mountain generates approximately $27 million (unaudited) in annual revenue. The purchase price is slightly more than six times Hunter Mountain’s adjusted EBITDA, which is estimated at approximately $6 million (unaudited) for its fiscal year ended April 30, 2015.


You really are comparing apples to oranges here.  For starters, how many detachable lifts did Hunter have when peaks bought it, 3 I think (maybe 4).  Catamount has none, so right there is a big difference.  The real estate thing at Catamount, not such a draw.  The previous owner tried to do some stuff and it got quashed by other local interests.  So not like anything is shovel ready.  Plus the previous ownership retired out, so a bit of cash and freeing of debt may have been good enough here.

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## JimG. (May 22, 2018)

machski said:


> You really are comparing apples to oranges here.  For starters, how many detachable lifts did Hunter have when peaks bought it, 3 I think (maybe 4).  Catamount has none, so right there is a big difference.  The real estate thing at Catamount, not such a draw.  The previous owner tried to do some stuff and it got quashed by other local interests.  So not like anything is shovel ready.  Plus the previous ownership retired out, so a bit of cash and freeing of debt may have been good enough here.
> 
> Sent from my XT1650 using AlpineZone mobile app



2 detachable lifts when Peaks bought Hunter.


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## mister moose (May 23, 2018)

Just curious, how much was Ascutney worth with a new detach?

It's all about earnings, with a little future expectations thrown in.


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## Tin Woodsman (May 23, 2018)

Exactly.  You can invest in all the high-tech equipment you want. Unless it converts into earnings/EBITDA, it means almost nothing in terms of the value of the business.


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## machski (May 23, 2018)

Tin Woodsman said:


> Exactly.  You can invest in all the high-tech equipment you want. Unless it converts into earnings/EBITDA, it means almost nothing in terms of the value of the business.


Except for the fact, most large resorts feature at least one.  Those that don't are either nitch resorts that do well (MRG, Smuggs come to mind) or lesser areas probably not making much return.  I would put Catamount in the later category.  Ascutney couldn't have been worth much, since it went out and no one stepped up to buy.  Kind of sad, I actually took a long cut 2 fridays ago from K and drove by As****ey for the first time ever.  Looked like an interesting area, too bad it is mostly gone (lower half may be revived next winter I guess).

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## ss20 (May 23, 2018)

Its just surprising...I'd figure the equipment of the lifts, groomers, snowmaking, etc is worth $2m alone...


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## Smellytele (May 24, 2018)

When Ascutney went OOB they sold all their lifts. Crotched got the detachable and Pat's Peak bought the rest as well as a bunch of snow making equipment (which they turned around and sold to someone else)


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## Killingtime (May 24, 2018)

Some new construction going on at Ascutney. Looks like new base building being put in and the remaining tow rope was refurbished.  The mountain itself was much taller and bigger than I imagined. Looks like it had some decent terrain back in the day.


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## deadheadskier (May 25, 2018)

It had very fun terrain.  Lack of natural snow and decent snowmaking did it in.  A real shame as it was so convenient to 91.  Had it been done right, it could have been a nice low key family alternative for folks in CT and western Mass who desired a bigger hill than what is in the Berkshires, but didn't want to deal with the southern VT big resort crowds and expense.

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## jaytrem (May 25, 2018)

deadheadskier said:


> It had very fun terrain.  Lack of natural snow and decent snowmaking did it in.  A real shame as it was so convenient to 91.  Had it been done right, it could have been a nice low key family alternative for folks in CT and western Mass who desired a bigger hill than what is in the Berkshires, but didn't want to deal with the southern VT big resort crowds and expense.



I always thought this was interesting...

Steve and Susan Plausteiner purchased Ascutney at auction, beating the owners of Smugglers Notch and an equipment liquidator. Ascutney reopened in December of 1993.

Wonder how things would have turned out if Smuugs had managed to buy it.  Anyway, it is what it is, and hopefully the T-bar will be up and running soon.


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## Abominable (Aug 7, 2018)

Catamount pass holders get 15 dollar day tickets to BEast.  Pretty good deal for the Westchester / Putnam county crowd.  If the kid(s) were a little older..... (currently 16 months and negative five months).


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## ss20 (Aug 22, 2018)

New used chairlift coming from Berkshire East to Catamount-

https://liftblog.com/2018/08/21/catamount-to-build-fifth-chairlift/



> A new triple chair will soon improve the beginner experience on the Massachusetts side of the mountain.  The lift is a 1987 Poma Alpha model which began its life in Vermont as Magic Mountain’s Sun Corner lift.  Magic went dark only four years later and the triple flew south to Berkshire East, where it was the Summit lift.  Skytrac replaced it with a quad in 2014 and the Poma has sat awaiting a new home ever since.  Ironically, a used chairlift from Stratton will finally return lift service to Magic’s Sun Corner this fall after 27 years.
> 
> Catamount’s new 1,600′ lift will run up up the Esplanade trail.  I suspect this will be a 2019 project but there’s a chance it could happen sooner.



I kinda think it's redundant with the Meadows lift and upgrading the summit Quad to a carpet-loader would've been a more useful improvement.


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## Newpylong (Aug 22, 2018)

They already own the Triple, so they must see the operational need for it in their Learning programs.

The bigger question becomes, what will serve Berkshire Easts expansion if not this lift now?


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## urungus (Aug 22, 2018)

Newpylong said:


> The bigger question becomes, what will serve Berkshire Easts expansion if not this lift now?



Bummed to hear about this.  I was already losing hope that the Berkshire East expansion was going to be finished this year, but given this news I wonder if the project will ever be completed.  The new Thunder and Bolt trails opened last year are pretty useless IMO if they are not going to connect to anything new.


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## benski (Aug 22, 2018)

Newpylong said:


> They already own the Triple, so they must see the operational need for it in their Learning programs.
> 
> The bigger question becomes, what will serve Berkshire Easts expansion if not this lift now?



It will serve esplanade, I guess this allows people to ski it without skiing a blue as currently required for the upper half.


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## jaytrem (Aug 22, 2018)

urungus said:


> Bummed to hear about this.  I was already losing hope that the Berkshire East expansion was going to be finished this year, but given this news I wonder if the project will ever be completed.  The new Thunder and Bolt trails opened last year are pretty useless IMO if they are not going to connect to anything new.



I had the opposite reaction.  My thoughts were "oh good, that means Berkshire East will probably get another brand new lift".


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 22, 2018)

Berkshire East "expansion" is nice minor regional hype but realistically there's only so much mountain to work with. Make more snow, cut more glades, that's all folks.

The backside (behind Outback trail) could potentially hold some shorter more interesting runs and I assumed this would be the next frontier for Berkshire East if they can make it happen. There's a second smaller peak back there with enough pitch to get creative.

I'm glad Berkie is selling that triple... I've rarely seen it used (not that I frequent B-East as much lately) and it goes too far up the hill. The off loading spot of the current Quad chair is the best location to start from the top. We don't need chairs that are almost never used just rusting on the hill when they can be sold and better future plans made.

Berkshire East optimally would have 1 high speed quad to the top. The current quad is slow, and the triple is rarely used. Berkshire East is typically a ski-on situation and maybe 10 chairs wait at the worst.


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## Newpylong (Aug 22, 2018)

I think perhaps you're confusing lifts. This is the pre-quad Summit triple that's been in storage. The Mountain Top triple is not going anymore. It would be foolish to remove it regardless it's not about capacity but redundancy.


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 22, 2018)

Newpylong said:


> I think perhaps you're confusing lifts. This is the pre-quad Summit triple that's been in storage. The Mountain Top triple is not going anymore. It would be foolish to remove it regardless it's not about capacity but redundancy.



And that's what happens when I try to re-read things a 3rd time to make sure I got it. Nevermind !


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## Newpylong (Aug 22, 2018)

To be fair Beast has made a lot of moves with both of their summit lifts in the past decade lol.


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## urungus (Aug 22, 2018)

bdfreetuna said:


> Berkshire East "expansion" is nice minor regional hype but realistically there's only so much mountain to work with. Make more snow, cut more glades, that's all folks.
> 
> The backside (behind Outback trail) could potentially hold some shorter more interesting runs and I assumed this would be the next frontier for Berkshire East if they can make it happen. There's a second smaller peak back there with enough pitch to get creative.
> 
> ...



Actually there is a fairly major expansion planned for the “north shoulder” of Berkshire East, from last year’s new Thunder/Bolt runs down to River Road.  You can read about it here:  
http://www.newenglandskiindustry.com/viewstory.php?storyid=563

I sent an email to the New England Ski Industry webmaster this morning and he claimed that Berkshire East actually has two unused triple chairlifts in storage (in addition to the currently installed “Mountain Top” Triple) so it would appear they will be able to use one for the Berkshire East expansion, and one for Catamount.


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## urungus (Aug 22, 2018)

Different article from today about Catamount with a few additional details:  http://www.newenglandskiindustry.com/viewstory.php?storyid=711


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## danimals (Mar 29, 2019)

https://www.newenglandskiindustry.com/viewstory.php?storyid=756

They started cutting the new trails. I like this new boom of expansion in recent years (Waterville, hunter, catamount,etc)


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## skimagic (Mar 29, 2019)

danimals said:


> https://www.newenglandskiindustry.com/viewstory.php?storyid=756
> 
> They started cutting the new trails. I like this new boom of expansion in recent years (Waterville, hunter, catamount,etc)
> 
> ...



I'm very impressed with the money being spent at Catamount.  The west expansion area has a pretty consistent pitch and will be a great addition to that side.  
I did notice a new concrete box like structure to the east of the entrance to catapult a few weeks ago and thought it was for a new lift terminal, but the diagram in the link does not show a lift there. Maybe something with snow making?


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## Killingtime (Mar 29, 2019)

danimals said:


> https://www.newenglandskiindustry.com/viewstory.php?storyid=756
> 
> They started cutting the new trails. I like this new boom of expansion in recent years (Waterville, hunter, catamount,etc)
> 
> ...



On the rare occasion I day trip from Long Island its always been to the Catskills. Never skied Catamount because some friends said it wasn't worth the time saved vs. going to the Catskills or Poconos. Will the new trails make enough improvement that its in the same league with say Windam or Belleayre?


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## skimagic (Mar 29, 2019)

Killingtime said:


> On the rare occasion I day trip from Long Island its always been to the Catskills. Never skied Catamount because some friends said it wasn't worth the time saved vs. going to the Catskills or Poconos. Will the new trails make enough improvement that its in the same league with say Windam or Belleayre?



I'd say no, the Catskill areas are a bit better.  The west side is the only side worth skiing at Catamount, and that's only a few trails with about 950 vertical


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## Newpylong (Mar 29, 2019)

Catamount is a great little area, one that certainly has done a 180 since my racingsl days there in the early 90s.

Concrete enclosures on hill are usually valve stations.


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## ss20 (Mar 29, 2019)

Believe the concrete boxes are for ziplines.  Catamount skis bigger than 1000vrt as the trails are pretty twisty and lots of pitch varieties make it fun.  I hope they build the trails off of Ridge one day...those would be 500-600vertical feet of legitimately steep terrain.


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## ss20 (Jul 20, 2019)

ss20 said:


> Believe the concrete boxes are for ziplines.  Catamount skis bigger than 1000vrt as the trails are pretty twisty and lots of pitch varieties make it fun.  I hope they build the trails off of Ridge one day...those would be 500-600vertical feet of legitimately steep terrain.



Hahaha yeah baby!  Per Facebook... 





> It might be hot now but the snow will be flying before you know it. When it does we'll be opening this new double black diamond from the summit!



They posted a video and it appears to run parallel to Catapult and drop into On Stage to the skiers right of the little double.  That's really freakin' steep if you don't know the mountain!


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## Sotto (Jul 21, 2019)

ss20 said:


> Hahaha yeah baby!  Per Facebook...
> 
> They posted a video and it appears to run parallel to Catapult and drop into On Stage to the skiers right of the little double.  That's really freakin' steep if you don't know the mountain!









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## slatham (Jul 21, 2019)

New trails between Sidewinder and Alley Cat. Really adding terrain. Good for them - I always enjoyed the day trip to Catamount and now there will be a lot more to offer.


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## ss20 (Jul 21, 2019)

Sotto said:


> Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk



Wow...a new double diamond and it looks like 2 more intermediate or advanced trails.  This expansion and the smaller stuff they did last year putting in the new triple and cutting a couple small trails puts Catamount on-par with the size of Jiminy Peak and absolutely blows Butternut out-of-the-water.  

And the new double diamond looks to head "straighter" down the mountain than Catapult which tends to make me think it'd be steeper.  IMO, Catapult is at the top range of what most major Vermont mountains would consider a single black (it's profile always reminded me of the bottom of Superstar at Killington or Organgrinder at Sugarbush)...this new trail might be a legit thriller.


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## ss20 (Nov 9, 2019)

The new trail map is up...

https://www.catamountski.com/trail-maps/



New parallel Catapult double black diamond trail.  One new long blue and one long black trail between Alleycat and Fisher's.  Another new double black trail from Ridge Run into Holiday (not sure if this one is actually cut yet or not...).  Night skiing now on Ridge.  Expanded Spencer's run so it now continues under the liftline of the Promenade triple. 

Last year their trail map listed 34/39 trails with snowmaking, this year it says 40/43 with snowmaking.  So it's a fair assumption all the new terrain has snowmaking.

If you live within 2 hours of this place their is absolutely no reason not to try it out.


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## JimG. (Nov 9, 2019)

Been by Catamount a few times this summer on my way to Great Barrington. 

New trails look interesting, I might very well give it a shot this season. Only about an hour from my house.

Have not skied Catamount in at least 45 years.


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## urungus (Nov 9, 2019)

Wow, those are some great improvements ... unfortunately it seems that they have abandoned their expansion plans at Berkshire East (my home area) to concentrate on Catamount.


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## Tin (Nov 9, 2019)

urungus said:


> Wow, those are some great improvements ... unfortunately it seems that they have abandoned their expansion plans at Berkshire East (my home area) to concentrate on Catamount.




Was thinking the same and bummed about it. Berkie has amazing terrain but the ledge and conifers make it difficult to ever ski. It has to be a wild winter to be able to get in the unmarked woods. I would think Catamount does better in terms of snowfall than Berkshire East and doesn't have as much rock so expanding terrain that can be opened easier makes sense. Unfortunately Berkshire East is in a bit of a snow hole. Just drive 10 miles west down the Mohawk or north towards Heath and the snowfall/pack difference is incredible.


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## Pez (Nov 9, 2019)

The last couple years I’ve had a couple fun days at Berkshire. The place is much steeper than I remember. 

Catamount is a little further for me but I’m itching to get there.  It’s cool that a season pass gets you access to both places.  Wish The Nut would do that with blandford and Otis.  


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