# Shaped skis, capped skis - please answer some questions and start a discussion...



## patentcad (Mar 9, 2005)

If you read my review of the Volkl 5 Star above, you'll see how blown away I was by this new ski. I've skiied on about 5-6 different 'shaped' skis, but none that seemed to live up to the considerable hype surrounding this new technology. When you read about a new ski that's going to revolutionize skiing, that racers are taking advantage of with major technique changes, yada yada, you figure its going to be a real eye opener. Until this Volkl, I found the shaped skis I had tried rather disappointing - certainly nothing to live up to such intensive advance billing. But the Volkls were an absolute revelation to me - they really improved the skiiing experience considerably with their carving ability, turnability and stability at speed, all at a much more managable length than the 201 to 205's I have skiied for nearly 20 years- a whopping 30cm shorter, yet still longish by today's standards @ 175. I'm loving this. It's like I fell asleep, woke up and it's a whole new ballgame. The Salomon Ellipse boots also amazed me with their comfort/performance blend which seems to stem partly from a combination of snowboard and ski boot technologies.

Can somebody enlighten me on what I've been missing here? What's the difference between a 'cap' ski and a non-cap design? Are all the skis on the market today 'shaped'?  Are they really inherently superior to the old laminated construction? Do they last longer? Do skis still lose their 'zing' after X days, and is 'X' now a bigger number?  I've always enjoyed gear of all kinds and the technical side of it. Let's face it, when you get down to it if the gear sucks the experience won't be nearly as good as it is when you have the right equipment - which is why I'm so adamant that a 'great deal' on ski gear is extremely illusory if you don't get fitted properly or some shop sells you an inappropriate ski.

I'm also hearing that the 5* isn't ideal in powder. Will it be just as good as my old GS skis were or do I need another pair in the quiver for powder days? Can I still have fun on the Volkls in deep (18"+) powder? I'd classify my powder skiing as advanced, perhaps one notch below my hardpack skiing through sheer lack of days, but once I get a day under my belt I can link smooth turns top to bottom without expending too much energy - a technique breakthrough I had at Grand Targhee one day in 1995  that I'll never forget :  ).


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## riverc0il (Mar 9, 2005)

the previous skis you tried may just not have fit you and your style as a skier.  there are lots of different skis, styles, constructions, and performances with different skis being designed to do certain things and fit certain styles better than others.  the volkl 5star probably best fits your needs.

since shaped skis have come out, i have consistantly bought the wrong ski, sadly.  i am always buying a ski for what i am skiing recently and not the ski i needed one or two years later, lol.  but after two skis that seemed perfect, i've lined up my current two ski quivver that really balances out my needs.  i could use a really big powder board eventually, probably find an nobis inspired on ebay eventually that would fit the bill.

to answer your questions: almost all alpine skis today are "shaped" with exception of a small population buying specialized mogul skis that you generally won't find in the shops.  they are really inherently superior in almost every way to the older skis for most people's uses (with exception of mogul skiers or other specialized pursuits).  regarding longevity, i think you're more likely to demo and "need" another ski long before your current ski looses it's performance unless you're doing 30-40 days a year.  but if you fall into that catagory, you are obsessed enough to fall into the former catagory of buying new gear you demo often.

the five star is a pretty heavy ski iirc, so powder float could be an issue.  i can't remember it's exact dimensions...  the 724 would be a better powder performer, but as an all mountain ski with occasional east coast powder, you could do a lot worse than the five star.  but you could do a lot lot better as well.  that performance issue is up for you to decide


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## riverc0il (Mar 9, 2005)

> I'd classify my powder skiing as advanced, perhaps one notch below my hardpack skiing through sheer lack of days, but once I get a day under my belt I can link smooth turns top to bottom without expending too much energy - a technique breakthrough I had at Grand Targhee one day in 1995 that I'll never forget : ).


there are few greater feelings than that moment of breakthrough on any technique you have struggled with.  i still remember finally understanding and "getting" what bump skiing is all about a few years back at wildcat on the old gondi line.  it's a great sensation when you finally get something like that and your technique and enjoyment skyrocket instantly.


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## patentcad (Mar 10, 2005)

My powder skiing breakthrough was a direct result of a book a friend and I had been reading called 'Breakthrough on Skis' - about the best ski instruction material I ever read. It involved letting the snow compress under your skis on the down-weight portion of your unweighting, and then simply rolling the skis over into the new direction - an effortless way of turning in powder compared to the exaggerated unweighting I had been employing. Once I figured that one out I could link turns from top to bottom in deep powder for 1500+ vertical feet or more - something that had been impossible with my previous technique. After that powder skiing became much more graceful and effortless...


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## thetrailboss (Mar 10, 2005)

patentcad said:
			
		

> My powder skiing breakthrough was a direct result of a book a friend and I had been reading called 'Breakthrough on Skis' - about the best ski instruction material I ever read.



Now that you mention it, I have the very same book   and a Ms. Trailboss who needs to learn about powder skiing after our experience at Sunday River a month ago.      1+1 must equal success!   :wink:


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## patentcad (Mar 11, 2005)

Isn't the author that Tito Flores dude? Man does he have some helpful ski instruction concepts in there, for all levels. I wonder if it's still in print. 

Skiing!!! Sunday AM for 4 hours at Mt. Peter (local bump of a hill) and then next Wednesday with the Boyz for a midweek Mental Health Day @ Hunter Mountain I don't know if any of you Eastern guys are familiar with Hunter, but for my money it's better than all but the biggest Vt. ski resorts. Better than Bromley, for example, but only 100 minutes from my house (I've been there so many times I can practically tell you the serial numbers on the highway mile markers :  ). And the best snowmaking I've ever seen at any resort period. They can go from zero to a 15" base in like 72 hours, and on about 15+ trails. All 46 trails have complete snow making. They haven't needed it much this year...

That will make four days this year - and it ain't over for me until late April, right fellas?


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## JimG. (Mar 11, 2005)

patentcad said:
			
		

> Isn't the author that Tito Flores dude? Man does he have some helpful ski instruction concepts in there, for all levels. I wonder if it's still in print.
> 
> Skiing!!! Sunday AM for 4 hours at Mt. Peter (local bump of a hill) and then next Wednesday with the Boyz for a midweek Mental Health Day @ Hunter Mountain I don't know if any of you Eastern guys are familiar with Hunter, but for my money it's better than all but the biggest Vt. ski resorts. Better than Bromley, for example, but only 100 minutes from my house (I've been there so many times I can practically tell you the serial numbers on the highway mile markers :  ). And the best snowmaking I've ever seen at any resort period. They can go from zero to a 15" base in like 72 hours, and on about 15+ trails. All 46 trails have complete snow making. They haven't needed it much this year...
> 
> That will make four days this year - and it ain't over for me until late April, right fellas?



Hunter is my home hill...I love it too, but we're in the minority here. Most people think it's too crowded and don't care for the vibe.


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## patentcad (Mar 11, 2005)

>>Hunter is my home hill...I love it too, but we're in the minority here. Most people think it's too crowded and don't care for the vibe.<<


I have hardly skiied at Hunter on a weekend in 20+ years, and during the week the place is great. I always find the staff to be very friendly, the terrain varied and challenging (on the West side) and the snow conditions the best in the Catskills. Hunter on weekends? Only on Sunday, and only after March 1 when the crowds start thinning out. Hunter in March and April on Sunday can be a great experience - beautiful weather, managable lift lines (the later into March you go the lighter they get) - great Spring skiing.

Of course during the week (we may sneak away Wednesday for a boys ski day out) the place is generally empty and you can get in more vertical feet than just about any mountain I've ever skiied at. I've had 20,000 vertical feet by lunch on many occasions bombing the fast detachable quad on the front. I can actually get in 4-5 1500' vertical runs per hour when I'm cranking.  I'll typically take 2-3 warm up runs on the front and then switch over to Hunter West for some steeper and more challenging runs down the double chair over there, depending on the conditions.

Hunter's negative image stems from the weekends when its proximity to NY and an active social scene can make it an asshole magnet. Oh well. Nothing's perfect. Actually most of the people there are fine, and if  you take the jerkoffs with a big grain of salt and focus on the positive - and manage not to get killed by some unguided missle on Hellgate - you're fine :  ). Like I said, I stay away from Hunter on Saturdays and on weekends all together until very late - or early in the season. Sundays before Dec. 10th or so can also be fairly light.  

The flipside to Hunter is this: I've actually run into and skiied with a good number of outstanding skiers there. It's the only real challenging hill between NY City and Vermont, so any NY Metro Area skiier who's decent who wants to ski good terrain has few choices, and they gravitate to Hunter. I've skiied with U.S. Ski Team members, ex UVM college racers, and just all around kickass skiers who like to do the midweek Hunter thing whenever they can get away. I'm self employed so I can get up there when I want to...

I've always liked the way Hunter is operated. The one exception is the way they tend to blow snow while the place is in operation, sometimes in places that make skiing downright hazardous - but I understand they do that to make the place ready for the weekend assault, so it's a minor gripe I can deal with. Otherwise the snowmaking and grooming is just outstanding. At least that's how it was ten years ago. I just picked this up again after an eight year hiatus, so if it has changed I'll find out soon enough.


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