# Ski Tuning



## Goblin84 (Jan 4, 2007)

Hello everyone....

Well i have been blessed by living with amazing roommates who have had all their own ski tuning equipment.  Now, sadly i moved and no longer have all the equipment I once did.  Anyway, I wonder what you all thought about multi-tool's for edges.  I have always used a file/stone and clamped it to a bevel guide so I have never really used the multi-tools and know nothing about them.

I have been searching the internet and ski stores for the tools I used to use but it seems everyone only carries the multitools now.  any recommendations on good ones to get?  how well do they work and all that jazz??  and you can still switch out files, pocket stones, and diamond stones with em??


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## MarkC (Jan 4, 2007)

Most of the tools that I use at home come form this site. http://www.tools4boards.com/  You can go from a basic kit with the edge tuner tool to an advanced kit with file guides.  Also it is better to get a set that comes with scrapers wide enough for snowbards so you can tune everything.


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## Charlie Schuessler (Jan 4, 2007)

For tuning the multipurpose tools offered by www.artech.com and www.tognar.com are easy to use.  You can easily interchange files or polishing stones at differing angles for base or side edge work accordingly.


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## drjeff (Jan 4, 2007)

Just received an e-mail today, Reliable Racing Supply (www.reliableracing.com) is having a sale on tuning equipment right now.  Good thing since after 20+ years and countless sets of skiis, my waxing iron died last night!  A new digital swix iron is on the way.  Now hopefully the snow will hold out so I'll have something to wax for


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## SKIQUATTRO (Jan 4, 2007)

I buy from TOGNAR and use the mulit edge tool...its great, can swap out files/stones....and you can set any edge angle you want


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## BeanoNYC (Jan 4, 2007)

grrrrr....can someone teach me how to tune ....please?  All I need is one lesson...I'll supply the beer.


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## eatskisleep (Jan 4, 2007)

BeanoNYC said:


> grrrrr....can someone teach me how to tune ....please? All I need is one lesson...I'll supply the beer.


If you were closer I'd take you up on that offer  :beer:


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## SKIQUATTRO (Jan 5, 2007)

there are some great books and vids out there,,,,,its not that difficult, you can do it!


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## Goblin84 (Jan 5, 2007)

BeanoNYC, you live in Rockaway?  as in just south of NYC?   well...i guess the NYC part of your name would imply to that.

I have been tuning for a couple years (just without the multi tool as previously noted).  I am heading down your way in the spring for work.  I am a college recruiter and travel all over long island, nj, but not nyc proper.  If you want one of those trips I could swing by and show ya.  But as SkiQ said, there are some great dvd's out there.  also check out http://www.tetongravity.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5528&page=4    it has pictures and stuff, is a real basic guide.


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## BeanoNYC (Jan 5, 2007)

Goblin84 said:


> BeanoNYC, you live in Rockaway?  as in just south of NYC?   well...i guess the NYC part of your name would imply to that.
> 
> I have been tuning for a couple years (just without the multi tool as previously noted).  I am heading down your way in the spring for work.  I am a college recruiter and travel all over long island, nj, but not nyc proper.  If you want one of those trips I could swing by and show ya.  But as SkiQ said, there are some great dvd's out there.  also check out http://www.tetongravity.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5528&page=4    it has pictures and stuff, is a real basic guide.




Yep...Rockaway is in Queens about 12 miles from Downtown Manhatta.  Yeah, that would be great. I'm just looking for someone to look over my shoulder for a little bit to make sure I don't screw it up too much.  Thanks.


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## NYDrew (Jan 5, 2007)

BeanoNYC said:


> grrrrr....can someone teach me how to tune ....please?  All I need is one lesson...I'll supply the beer.



alright rich, im home for good now no more of this problems arranging schedules.  time place and I want otter creek or long trail....a tall blond wouldnt hurt either.


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## BeanoNYC (Jan 6, 2007)

Do they even sell Long Trails around here?  I bump into an occasional Magic Hat, every once in a while...but LT's?

Edit:  oh yeah...thanks..Date, Place, Time?


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## NYDrew (Jan 6, 2007)

well, if you were still in the bellmore area you would know that you could get long trail on the corner of newbridge and bellmore ave (look at me, talking like I actually like long island)


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## Goblin84 (Jan 8, 2007)

Yeah....I travel to Long Island for work and normally hate every minute of it.  Unless i'm on the eastern half of the island...that parts nice.  But all the students i recruit are on the western half :evil:


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## tree_skier (Jan 9, 2007)

BeanoNYC said:


> grrrrr....can someone teach me how to tune ....please?  All I need is one lesson...I'll supply the beer.





BEER -- Long trail but you need to bring it to dover, VT


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## SKIQUATTRO (Jan 9, 2007)

Syosset Beverage sell LT.....just bought me some Double Bag and Original


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## MarkC (Jan 9, 2007)

BeanoNYC said:


> grrrrr....can someone teach me how to tune ....please?  All I need is one lesson...I'll supply the beer.



Plattekill Bar - any Saturday night this season I am usually up there by 5PM.


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## Marc (Jan 10, 2007)

drjeff said:


> Just received an e-mail today, Reliable Racing Supply (www.reliableracing.com) is having a sale on tuning equipment right now.  Good thing since after 20+ years and countless sets of skiis, my waxing iron died last night!  A new digital swix iron is on the way.  Now hopefully the snow will hold out so I'll have something to wax for



I bought a $6 iron at Walmart... it works really well.


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## Marc (Jan 10, 2007)

As far as edge tuning, I'd prefer just a simple fixed guide.  It is ludicrous what they charge for a precision bent piece of anodized aluminum, but it should last forever.  I wouldn't trust the multi angle tools to give an accurate angle for life.


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## SKIQUATTRO (Jan 10, 2007)

that a "ski" iron or a clothes iron??


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## Marc (Jan 10, 2007)

Definitely a clothes iron.  I don't think Wally World sells "ski" irons.  I may try to fill in the steam holes with JB Weld, but they really didn't seem to affect anything.  There isn't really even that much wax left on the bottom of the iron.


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## SKIQUATTRO (Jan 10, 2007)

just becareful not to get it too hot, if the wax is smoking off the iron, turn it down...thats why ski irons are great, you can set the temps exactly..


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## Marc (Jan 10, 2007)

SKIQUATTRO said:


> just becareful not to get it too hot, if the wax is smoking off the iron, turn it down...thats why ski irons are great, you can set the temps exactly..



I set it just hot enough to melt the wax, the lowest or second lowest fabric settings on most irons, as described by our friends at Harb: http://www.harbskisystems.com/tuning/hotwax.htm.

That's why I think a ski iron is kind of a collosal waste of money, and no offense to anyone here that bought one or has one, but Swix charging $60 or in some cases over $100 is retarded for a slab of stainless with a heating element in it, just because it has a digital display.


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## SKIQUATTRO (Jan 11, 2007)

I got mine from Tognar when i was ordering all my other stuff for like $30...takes up less space, fits nicely in my bag when i go on exteneded trips so i can wax...


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## kbroderick (Jan 11, 2007)

True ski irons do have significant advantages over clothes irons:
a) a purpose-designed thermostat that lets the iron more accurately cover the range for waxing (i.e. the difference between "cold" and "hot" on a wax iron is likely to fall somewhere between "barely on" and "slightly warm" on a clothes iron)
b) said thermostat should have a tighter tolerance than on a clothes iron (i.e. a clothes iron may turn off the heating element when the temperature reaches the desired temp plus 5 degrees and on when it falls to desired temp minus 5, whereas a wax iron will turn off at plus 2.5 and on at minus 2.5; numbers are completely made up, but they illustrate the concept)
c) a good wax iron will have a thicker, heavier base plate that will more evenly distribute heat, while a clothes iron will usually have a thin baseplate that has hot spots and not-so-hot spots

Personally, I wouldn't bother spending $100+ on a high-end wax iron unless I was putting expensive wax on a lot of skis, but I'd definitely go for a purpose-built wax iron before I'd buy a cheap clothes iron from Walmart.  Reliable Racing lists the Swix Consumer Wax Iron for $39 before shipping (although they don't currently have any in stock), and the Econo Wax Iron is only $59 before shipping (and includes some wax).  Having a good iron with a thick baseplate just makes waxing soooo much easier...trying to keep a consistent temp with a cheap iron can get really frustrating.

(Of course, you may find the best of both worlds if you can dig up an old iron with a thick baseplate at a yard sale, which is what I had been lucky enough to do on my last iron purchase.)


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## Marc (Jan 11, 2007)

kbroderick said:


> True ski irons do have significant advantages over clothes irons:
> a) a purpose-designed thermostat that lets the iron more accurately cover the range for waxing (i.e. the difference between "cold" and "hot" on a wax iron is likely to fall somewhere between "barely on" and "slightly warm" on a clothes iron)
> b) said thermostat should have a tighter tolerance than on a clothes iron (i.e. a clothes iron may turn off the heating element when the temperature reaches the desired temp plus 5 degrees and on when it falls to desired temp minus 5, whereas a wax iron will turn off at plus 2.5 and on at minus 2.5; numbers are completely made up, but they illustrate the concept)
> c) a good wax iron will have a thicker, heavier base plate that will more evenly distribute heat, while a clothes iron will usually have a thin baseplate that has hot spots and not-so-hot spots
> ...



Look, not to be a pain in the ass here, but all the iron has to do is get hot enough to melt the wax without smoking it and without melting your UHMWPE base.  I don't know for sure, but I'd be willing to bet there's a pretty big temperature range between a wax's melting point and its smoke point.  You shouldn't have to worry about that anyway if you keep the iron moving.  I've never used a purpose built ski iron, but I honestly can't imagine the waxing going any easier than it has been for me using my $6 Walmart iron.  I very easily got even coverage very easily.

Then again, I don't fret a lot over my wax job, but I don't race either.  I'm not using expensive wax.  I might care more if I did.  I just want something to protect my bases and so I can slide past my friends on the flats and laugh at them when they have to skate more than me.


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## SKIQUATTRO (Jan 11, 2007)

hey, no matter what you are using, you are doing more than most!!! 

"Too many go thru life with dull edges" (Tognar 2006)


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## Terry (Jan 12, 2007)

I bought an iron at a yard sale 4 years ago with no steam holes. I paid 1 dollar for it. Works great for my purposes. Takes a while to heat up but gives me more time to drink a beer while waiting! :beer:


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## kbroderick (Jan 12, 2007)

Marc said:


> Look, not to be a pain in the ass here, but all the iron has to do is get hot enough to melt the wax without smoking it and without melting your UHMWPE base.  I don't know for sure, but I'd be willing to bet there's a pretty big temperature range between a wax's melting point and its smoke point.  You shouldn't have to worry about that anyway if you keep the iron moving.  I've never used a purpose built ski iron, but I honestly can't imagine the waxing going any easier than it has been for me using my $6 Walmart iron.



I may have just picked up a particularly crummy clothes iron or two, but I have used irons that would drop below the melt point before the thermostat kicked the heating element back on and then go above the friggin' smoke point before it kicked back off.  And it's not the melting of the wax to drip it onto the base that gets obnoxious, it's the melting it into the base part of the process; a good wax iron lets me get a nice, even, uniform coat in less than three passes (not counting the first, quick, pass to spread the wax out after I drip it on).  With better-but-not-good irons, the variations in iron temperature mean that you have to make significant changes in iron speed as you move down the ski (and risk either ripples in your nice even puddle of molten wax or nasty, insufficiently melted spots where you moved over them too quickly..or even worse results from moving too slowly).  Soft wax does mitigate both concerns; I've had much more difficulty with low-temp wax than with higher-temp stuff.



Marc said:


> I very easily got even coverage very easily.



That's good...I hate it when I very easily get even coverage very labourilously.  



Marc said:


> Then again, I don't fret a lot over my wax job, but I don't race either.  I'm not using expensive wax.  I might care more if I did.  I just want something to protect my bases and so I can slide past my friends on the flats and laugh at them when they have to skate more than me.



At this point, I use whatever bulk wax happens to be easiest to grab (which is usually whatever someone else left out, so hopefully it's reasonably close to the right temperature range).  Having a decent structure, a well-brushed ski, and the appropriate cheap wax will provide more than enough glide for most folks; you need to get into a fairly lengthy race course _and_ be skiing pretty well before it makes any sense to add in the flouro.


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## drjeff (Jan 12, 2007)

Afer waxing experience #1 with the new Swix iron vs. "old faithfull" (20 yr old regular flat based travel iron),  the difference is night and day.  I didn't think that it would be as much of a difference as it was.  Much, much, much easier to distribute the wax evenly over the base, no smoke, no guessing about extactly where to set the temp dial.  The swix guide that is came with basically had a chart that linked rough temperature waxes to iron temps.  I almost feel like I could sum up the ease using that stupid Ronco Rotisserie infomercial line,  "just set it and forget it" :roll: uke: :wink:


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## SkiDog (Jan 12, 2007)

Honestly I could give a crap what kind of iron the guy at the shop whos waxing my skis uses...as long as they're waxed when I get em back and theyre fast when I ski em he can melt it with his breath and spread it with a butter knife for all i care... 

Ha...im teasin...IM WAY TOO LAZY to tune my own boards...besides I have a friend who owns a shop right near the base of my mtn....whats $15 every few days out amongst friends???

M


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## Marc (Jan 15, 2007)

kbroderick said:


> I may have just picked up a particularly crummy clothes iron or two, but I have used irons that would drop below the melt point before the thermostat kicked the heating element back on and then go above the friggin' smoke point before it kicked back off.  And it's not the melting of the wax to drip it onto the base that gets obnoxious, it's the melting it into the base part of the process; a good wax iron lets me get a nice, even, uniform coat in less than three passes (not counting the first, quick, pass to spread the wax out after I drip it on).  With better-but-not-good irons, the variations in iron temperature mean that you have to make significant changes in iron speed as you move down the ski (and risk either ripples in your nice even puddle of molten wax or nasty, insufficiently melted spots where you moved over them too quickly..or even worse results from moving too slowly).  Soft wax does mitigate both concerns; I've had much more difficulty with low-temp wax than with higher-temp stuff.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Apparently I just got insanely lucky with my $6 iron?




And yeah... I work for the department of redundancies department.  With the emphasis on easy.


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