# Enjoying Closed runs on days with big dumps.



## MidnightJester (Feb 9, 2013)

Have to post this to see where others stand... Closed run's happen for many reasons. Sometimes justifed, sometimes not. but ofcourse that doesent mean they arent ridable.  Sometimes that fact that they are closed can even be a benifit... Take this weekend dump. Went to smugglers on Sat.. They didnt update or open more trails from all week at mountain opening.. after checking one closed trail glade "It was good" went to every almost gladed closed trail at Smugglers Notch that we could get to. Most were veryridable, few were a little rough. 3 or 4 were off the chart fun but were all closed.


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## thetrailboss (Feb 9, 2013)

MidnightJester said:


> Have to post this to see where others stand... Closed run's happen for many reasons. Sometimes justifed, sometimes not. but ofcourse that doesent mean they arent ridable.  Sometimes that fact that they are closed can even be a benifit... Take this weekend dump. Went to smugglers on Sat.. They didnt update or open more trails from all week at mountain opening.. after checking one closed trail glade "It was good" went to every almost gladed closed trail at Smugglers Notch that we could get to. Most were veryridable, few were a little rough. 3 or 4 were off the chart fun but were all closed.



Skiing/riding on closed trails is not a good idea at all.  This statement is not true:



> Closed run's happen for many reasons. Sometimes justifed, sometimes not. but ofcourse that doesent mean they arent ridable.



There is a reason why they are closed.  There could be hazard(s) that you can't see or that aren't obvious.  And if you get in trouble patrol does not sweep it.  In Vermont it was one thing but out here if you duck a rope you can be in serious trouble.


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## bdfreetuna (Feb 9, 2013)

I generally pay heed to closed trails if they are roped off.

I generally do not pay heed to closed woods if they are roped off. It's so easy to get into woods from various entry points anyway it's always possible to say you just skied off the trail in-bounds and that's where you ended up (if you get caught).

The whole point of skiing woods is variable terrain and obstacles anyway so I don't see the problem.

Trails, though, are sometimes closed for good reason related to the mountain trying to preserve or work on conditions to allow it to properly open.


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## deadheadskier (Feb 9, 2013)

No such thing as a closed trail.  They are either open or "reserved".


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## skimawk (Feb 9, 2013)

deadheadskier said:


> No such thing as a closed trail.  They are either open or "reserved".



Ski a closed trail and get caught.  Hard to ski the next closed trail when you pass is pulled.  Closed for a reason, most reason is to protect your safety.  Don't be an idiot, plenty of fun on open terrain.


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## WWF-VT (Feb 9, 2013)

deadheadskier said:


> No such thing as a closed trail.  They are either open or "reserved".



Wrong.  Sugarbush opens a lot of trails that are marginal and would likely be closed at other mountains.  If a trail is closed it is legit.  I rode up with a patroller today and asked him about a few closed trails and he gave valid info on why they were closed. They typically won't give you are hard time for poaching but will acknowledge your stupidity for choosing to duck ropes.


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## deadheadskier (Feb 9, 2013)

You've got your opinion, I've got mine


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## bdfreetuna (Feb 9, 2013)

Sugarbush has best trail open policy in the game. Magic is pretty good about it too from what I have seen (trails open with multiple full width exposed waterbars).

Respect to both those players.


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## BenedictGomez (Feb 9, 2013)

I've skied trails at Plattekill that I wish were closed.  They're pretty liberal with the ropes.


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## ss20 (Feb 9, 2013)

If a run is closed, I'll enter using my own path by going through the trees on to the trail.  Makes me feel morally good that I didn't duck.  Did this at Smuggs a lot!  Very rarely do I actually duck a rope; I've done it 5 times this season out of 12 days so far.


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## HowieT2 (Feb 9, 2013)

I hiked over to castlerock today.  It had great powder but there were open water bars and one nasty headwall.  Definitely not safe to have open to the general public.


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## Conrad (Feb 9, 2013)

Have to admit that while I don't normally duck the ropes, I have done so in the past if I'm absolutely certain the trail should be open and patrol just hasn't gotten around to opening it. If I have a season pass, then I would never duck a rope.


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## thetrailboss (Feb 9, 2013)

WWF-VT said:


> Wrong.  Sugarbush opens a lot of trails that are marginal and would likely be closed at other mountains.  If a trail is closed it is legit.  I rode up with a patroller today and asked him about a few closed trails and he gave valid info on why they were closed. They typically won't give you are hard time for poaching but will acknowledge your stupidity for choosing to duck ropes.



+ 1.  I recall that if it was closed at Sugarbush you did not want to be there.  They definitely pushed the limits and we appreciated it.  I'd walk a little bit if needed to enjoy some good snow, especially in the spring.


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## thetrailboss (Feb 9, 2013)

HowieT2 said:


> I hiked over to castlerock today.  It had great powder but there were open water bars and one nasty headwall.  Definitely not safe to have open to the general public.



And they were allowing folks to hike over, with a patroller at the top of the 'Rock, right?  See, that is different because Patrol is out there and monitoring things.  With closed terrain they generally don't.


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## Edd (Feb 9, 2013)

bdfreetuna said:


> Sugarbush has best trail open policy in the game. Magic is pretty good about it too from what I have seen (trails open with multiple full width exposed waterbars).
> 
> Respect to both those players.



At the risk of blowing people's minds, Bretton Woods is extremely flexible when it comes to this.


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## deadheadskier (Feb 10, 2013)

Edd said:


> At the risk of blowing people's minds, Bretton Woods is extremely flexible when it comes to this.



Gaper


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## Edd (Feb 10, 2013)

deadheadskier said:


> Gaper



See?  DHS can't even process what I said so he's lashing out.  Give him time.


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## riverc0il (Feb 10, 2013)

ss20 said:


> If a run is closed, I'll enter using my own path by going through the trees on to the trail.  Makes me feel morally good that I didn't duck.  Did this at Smuggs a lot!  Very rarely do I actually duck a rope; I've done it 5 times this season out of 12 days so far.


I'm glad you found a reason to feel morally justified in breaking the rules. But the fact is that every area I've ever been has woods policy that you have to enter and exit from an open trail. So if you go through the woods to cut into a closed trail, you violated the woods policy AND you are still on a closed trail whether you ducked or not.

The problem with ropes is different areas use them in different ways. Most areas are over cautious and refuse to open runs that have unseen obstacles such as waterbars or a buried rock or three. The better policy in these conditions is bamboo and signs. Let skiers make their own decisions. Some areas are really good about this and a rope means CLOSED and for VERY good reason. 

All ropes have a reason for sure. No ski area wants to have ropes up but patrol can often be too cautious with their reasons, whether through internal patrol practice or ski area management direction. 

Do I duck ropes? Absolutely. And I don't try to justify it, I'm being selfish of course. But I do weigh the consequences in my mind... are others not as skilled and knowledgable going to follow me? Will I or someone that follows me get hurt? Will that mean patrol has to drag a sled down a suspect trail, maybe causing damage to themselves or their skis? Etc. Having my pass pulled... whatever. It is almost ALWAYS worth it. And that means to me that the rope shouldn't be up.

For what it is worth, I don't like having to resort to the practice and generally don't duck if I can't help it. But sometimes, I just can't help it and the skiing really is that good. But I don't make a habit out of it and rarely go for the duck.


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## Stache (Feb 10, 2013)

Think about this explanation a Patroller gave me once. "We don;t close them because you can't ski them, we close them because we cannot safely evacuate an injured person." So if you poach, remember you are on your own and they are not responsible for your safety or lunacy however you want to describe it.


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## kartski (Feb 10, 2013)

In NYS, There are protocols for marking hazards - Man made objects under 6', that includes fencing when the bases get high enough. Every X number of feet on the side of the trails. Can you get a sled down it. I seen one incident end with a organ harvest.


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## HowieT2 (Feb 10, 2013)

thetrailboss said:


> And they were allowing folks to hike over, with a patroller at the top of the 'Rock, right?  See, that is different because Patrol is out there and monitoring things.  With closed terrain they generally don't.



Correct.  They opened the top of paradise, which was closed, to facilitate access to the long trail over to castlerock.  Patrol is out on the trails at castlerock and sweeps them at the end of the day.  If a trail isnt "open" here, there is a damn good reason for it and it shouldnt be poached.


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## Hawkshot99 (Feb 10, 2013)

Trails are closed for a reason whether you know the reason or not. 

Sent from my SGH-S959G using Tapatalk 2


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## deadheadskier (Feb 10, 2013)

So all you naysayers never duck ropes ever?


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## thetrailboss (Feb 10, 2013)

deadheadskier said:


> So all you naysayers never duck ropes ever?



Nope.  I can only recall ducking a rope once and it was on an AZ Outing with our former fearless leader calling the shot!  :lol:  After we all agreed that it was not worth it.


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## steamboat1 (Feb 10, 2013)

I only recall doing it twice. Once at Pico in the spring Sunset was closed. A friend & myself went down & I was waiting to hit a bare spot while skiing down. Never found it & that trail wound up having the best skiing on the mountain that day. We did many repeats.

Another time at Mt. Snow we were viewing a trail from the chair & it looked excellent but was closed. We went down & found out why it was closed. The whole trail had an unbreakable crust on top & was a sheet of ice.

On the other hand I've skied many trails that were open that should have been closed.


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## Edd (Feb 10, 2013)

I've ducked a number of ropes. I've got no defense. Sometimes the Spirit moves me.


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## Hawkshot99 (Feb 10, 2013)

deadheadskier said:


> So all you naysayers never duck ropes ever?



I used to bw willing to it sparingly. But after becoming friends with many patrollers you realize there are reasons trails are closed.

Sent from my SGH-S959G using Tapatalk 2


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## deadheadskier (Feb 10, 2013)

Hawkshot99 said:


> I used to bw willing to it sparingly. But after becoming friends with many patrollers you realize there are reasons trails are closed.
> 
> Sent from my SGH-S959G using Tapatalk 2



Your patroler friends are quite different than the ones I knew in Stowe or Ragged.  Can't say I've gotten to know many at other hills.  

Guess many of you folks are better citizens than I.  

I'm with rivercoil on this one.  I think it's fine to ski closed terrain provided you use good judgment and take personal responsibility for yourself.  When I say good judgment, that means knowing the mountain and being cognizant of recent weather there.  I'm not going to go to say Whiteface, where I've never been and start ducking ropes, but at say Stowe where I know practically ever square inch of the mountain?  Yup, in a heartbeat.  

It's interesting to hear all the Sugarbush folks being adamantly against ducking ropes.  That attitude couldn't be more opposite at Stowe.  While Stowe is far from as liberal as Sugarbush at opening up marginal terrain, to the regulars there, ropes are merely a suggestion.   I can't tell you how many times I've run into Patrol (and not always ones I knew back in the day) on closed trails.  Never once did I receive a warning or threat of a pulled pass.  They essentially size you up and see if you have the chops and if you do, they'll say, "have fun, be safe and I never saw you here."  Same goes for Ragged.  I've actually been caught by patrol in the Ravine at Ragged and ended up riding the lift back up with them and skiing it with them again just to "make sure" it should stay "closed."  :lol:

So, I guess I disagree with many of you on rope ducking beliefs.  I've been skiing 30 years and only a handful of times out of hundreds and hundreds have I ended up regretting skiing closed terrain.  

Hope you all don't look down upon the many, many AZers who were ducking ropes all weekend at Sugarloaf.  :lol:


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## riverc0il (Feb 10, 2013)

deadheadskier said:


> I've been skiing 30 years and only a handful of times out of hundreds and hundreds have I ended up regretting skiing closed terrain.


This is right on point. If people have a 99.9% success rate when it comes to skiing closed trails (i.e. 99.9% the duck was worth it -- if not the best skiing on the mountain), then the patrol is doing something wrong. Some patrols get it and their ropes are respected as actually being meaningful.


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## skisheep (Feb 10, 2013)

At least at Whiteface, when something is closed, it probably is for a reason. Unfortunatley(but increasingly rarely), the iceface monkier rings true, and when they close stuff that looks good, that's why, it is just a sheet of ice and unskiable. Have seen people try to ski stuff that's closed, when it's a sheet of ice, and needless to say it does not end well. They usually are pretty liberal about opening stuff, and once something's open, it dosen't get closed unless it's horrible. Especially last spring during the torch to end torches, there were plenty of trails that were open that should not have been...

-skisheep


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## deadheadskier (Feb 10, 2013)

riverc0il said:


> This is right on point. If people have a 99.9% success rate when it comes to skiing closed trails (i.e. 99.9% the duck was worth it -- if not the best skiing on the mountain), then the patrol is doing something wrong. Some patrols get it and their ropes are respected as actually being meaningful.



The exception is when there's enough snow for something to ski great with minimal traffic, but not enough to sustain being open.  The Ragged experience was such a day.  The Ravine never opened to the public that day.  It skied incredible, but the traffic an opening would've brought would cause them to have to close it in a half an hour.  So, we considered it packing down the base for the next storm to get it open.


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## takeahike46er (Feb 10, 2013)

skisheep said:


> At least at Whiteface, when something is closed, it probably is for a reason. Unfortunatley(but increasingly rarely), the iceface monkier rings true, and when they close stuff that looks good, that's why, it is just a sheet of ice and unskiable. Have seen people try to ski stuff that's closed, when it's a sheet of ice, and needless to say it does not end well. They usually are pretty liberal about opening stuff, and once something's open, it dosen't get closed unless it's horrible. Especially last spring during the torch to end torches, there were plenty of trails that were open that should not have been...
> 
> -skisheep



I don't entirely agree. One example is Empire. Even when it is skiing beautifully, it will in most cases be closed. It isn't uncommon for patrol to drop the rope many days after a storm has passed through. Patrol is also very conservative opening the glades.


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## Huck_It_Baby (Feb 10, 2013)

At Smuggs today my buddy got busted for ducking a rope off Madonna. It was our last run of the day and patrol swiped his ticket but they were pretty cool about it and they skied the run together. He said it was his best run of the day. Untracked powder.

I duck ropes but I think you can generally get to the "closed" terrain more creatively than a blatant duck. A strategic traverse will usually do the trick.

Sometimes there are good reasons a trail is closed and the majority of skiers should stay clear. Many of us on this board are decent skiers, tree skiers, BC skiers, etc and it's not as if we can't handle the conditions or terrain. The weekend skier and vacationer would do well do avoid closed runs.

However many resorts let you ski open glades and they have signs that there are rocks, stumps, creeks and natural obstacles and that the woods are not patrolled. I don't see any difference in this and a closed trail. By most accounts a closed trail that probably has some amount of base is safer than skiing a natural glade.


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## riverc0il (Feb 10, 2013)

Smuggs is a good example of an area too conservative with ropes and disrespectful of skiers making their own assessment of the conditions, their abilities, and tolerance for base damage. And I'm not talking about trails like Liftline or Robin's Run. I've had some incredible reserved days there when they kept ropes up on the blue squares off M2 which are all flat, low angle, and well pruned/manicured. Same trail and same conditions would be open at places like MRG, Jay, Stowe, Bush, Magic, etc.


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## STREETSKIER (Feb 11, 2013)

bdfreetuna said:


> Sugarbush has best trail open policy in the game. Magic is pretty good about it too from what I have seen (trails open with multiple full width exposed waterbars).
> 
> Respect to both those players.


MrgAlso otherwise they wouldn't   be open


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## STREETSKIER (Feb 11, 2013)

At sb they open trails to get trail counts up lots of pressure from others, most of the time I skip the openings because I care about my gear i don't poach no need to  . Usually wait til its good cover
!! But then again  I get out a lot so I'm fussy let the gung ho's  beat there skis up  ,spills is always open have not been on it. Inyears it never heals. HAve fun that's what it's about


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## dmc (Feb 11, 2013)

NSP is under the gun about poaching after a ski patroller was killed on a closed trail last year out west...
OSHA got involved..    

Hunter is cracking down..  But rightfully so..  No good could come from 8"-10" of blower on rock..  And sure enough someone tried to poach 44 and got airlifted out..  Now the hammer is down harder and 2 people were arrested last weekend and many tickets taken..  

No ski patroller should have to do a rescue on a bare trail covered in rock and ice..  I dangerous to them and selfish..


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## drjeff (Feb 11, 2013)

dmc said:


> NSP is under the gun about poaching after a ski patroller was killed on a closed trail last year out west...
> OSHA got involved..
> 
> Hunter is cracking down..  But rightfully so..  No good could come from 8"-10" of blower on rock..  And sure enough someone tried to poach 44 and got airlifted out..  Now the hammer is down harder and 2 people were arrested last weekend and many tickets taken..
> ...



+1


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## MadMadWorld (Feb 11, 2013)

One big pet peeve of mine.....mountains that keep trails closed to save them for holidays/vacations. It happens all the time and it drives me nuts.


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## Hawkshot99 (Feb 11, 2013)

dmc said:


> NSP is under the gun about poaching after a ski patroller was killed on a closed trail last year out west...
> OSHA got involved..
> 
> Hunter is cracking down..  But rightfully so..  No good could come from 8"-10" of blower on rock..  And sure enough someone tried to poach 44 and got airlifted out..  Now the hammer is down harder and 2 people were arrested last weekend and many tickets taken..
> ...



+1. But I am sure that person on 44 knew more than patrol.

Sent from my SGH-S959G using Tapatalk 2


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## dmc (Feb 11, 2013)

I just can't believe people are SOOOO F'ing stupid as to think they can ride a trail with 8" of blower and no base..

Do they think EVERY trail is a meadow with grass and flowers??!?!?!

No - it's the Catskills... We got a ton of rocks around.. big ones... sharp ones...  Rocks that will ALWAYS win...


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## ss20 (Feb 11, 2013)

dmc said:


> I just can't believe people are SOOOO F'ing stupid as to think they can ride a trail with 8" of blower and no base..
> 
> Do they think EVERY trail is a meadow with grass and flowers??!?!?!
> 
> No - it's the Catskills... We got a ton of rocks around.. big ones... sharp ones...  Rocks that will ALWAYS win...



Harsh.  If it's 8 inches, you'll be able to see the larger rocks and obstacles and you'll avoid them.


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## dmc (Feb 11, 2013)

Except for all those rocks that are less than 8"...
That's harsh...  Cartwheeling down a rocky trail after catching a rock under the snow...

It was solid rock underneath that blower pow..  Nobody can tell me they can ride/ski that shit safely..


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## ss20 (Feb 11, 2013)

I was skiing yesterday at Catamount when I poached...and failed.  Here's a video of it 



Guess what thread I was thinking about?


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## dmc (Feb 11, 2013)

Glad you didn't get hurt...


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## deadheadskier (Feb 11, 2013)

dmc said:


> I just can't believe people are SOOOO F'ing stupid as to think they can ride a trail with 8" of blower and no base..
> 
> Do they think EVERY trail is a meadow with grass and flowers??!?!?!
> 
> No - it's the Catskills... We got a ton of rocks around.. big ones... sharp ones...  Rocks that will ALWAYS win...



Well that person was an idiot.  I would never consider poaching in such conditions.

However, I did poach Misery Whip at Sugarloaf this weekend.  Only rope I ducked this weekend.  This was Friday after 4-5 inches of snow had fallen.  Underneath was a 2 foot base of man made that was glazed over from the warm up.  Now, I was the third person down and it was good.  It wasn't very good for those behind me, but I wouldn't necessarily call it bad.  I actually don't mind skiing something completely bullet proof from time to time.  I enjoy the challenge and it keeps my skills sharp for when I hit nasty skied off patches on generally decent snow trails.

The trail shouldn't have been closed IMO.  I don't think the dozen or so folks who skied it with me would say the trail should have been closed either because they had the skills to ski it.  An intermediate level skier would've been screwed on it.  Well, it's a Double Diamond trail, they shouldn't be on it even when the snow is good.

I stand by my stance that good judgment and personal responsibility is what matters when poaching something or even skiing open terrain.  Ski Patrol shouldn't be making judgment calls based on factoring in situations where an unskilled skier or rider uses bad judgment and might get in over their head.


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## dmc (Feb 11, 2013)

deadheadskier said:


> I stand by my stance that good judgment and personal responsibility is what matters when poaching something or even skiing open terrain.  Ski Patrol shouldn't be making judgment calls based on factoring in situations where an unskilled skier or rider uses bad judgment and might get in over their head.



As long as it doesn't endanger the patrollers - that's my big issue...


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## deadheadskier (Feb 11, 2013)

dmc said:


> As long as it doesn't endanger the patrollers - that's my big issue...



Well in the case of Misery Whip on Friday, if a patroller couldn't ski those conditions and be able to perform a rescue if needed, then they shouldn't be a patroller.


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## from_the_NEK (Feb 11, 2013)

riverc0il said:


> This is right on point. If people have a 99.9% success rate when it comes to skiing closed trails (i.e. 99.9% the duck was worth it -- if not the best skiing on the mountain), then the patrol is doing something wrong. Some patrols get it and their ropes are respected as actually being meaningful.



I'll admit it, I'm a ducker but usually I know what I'm getting into.

I ducked several ropes at Widcat this weekend. All ducks involved at least a short section of trail that was nasty (giving a good reason for the closing) but passible. However, one ducked rope was a REAL bad idea  (i was following another guy in the group that knew the mtn better). I had a hard time figuring out how they could EVER open that trail, even on a decent snow year. It was a short one but it was steep and all boulders with only the 24" of fluff on top. I can't believe I got out of that one with no core shots.


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## thetrailboss (Feb 11, 2013)

ss20 said:


> I was skiing yesterday at Catamount when I poached...and failed. Here's a video of it
> 
> 
> 
> Guess what thread I was thinking about?



Why poach a liftline with folks overhead watching?  I'd prefer to be more elusive.


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## deadheadskier (Feb 11, 2013)

from_the_NEK said:


> I'll admit it, I'm a ducker but usually I know what I'm getting into.
> 
> I ducked several ropes at Widcat this weekend. All ducks involved at least a short section of trail that was nasty (giving a good reason for the closing) but passible. However, one ducked rope was a REAL bad idea  (i was following another guy in the group that knew the mtn better). I had a hard time figuring out how they could EVER open that trail, even on a decent snow year. It was a short one but it was steep and all boulders with only the 24" of fluff on top. I can't believe I got out of that one with no core shots.



Sounds like Hairball.  Takes a ton of snow for that to fill in and even at really deep snow pack levels at Wildcat, it's really difficult to ski that trail without doing some damage; jumping rocky sections is pretty much mandatory.


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## from_the_NEK (Feb 11, 2013)

thetrailboss said:


> Why poach a liftline with folks overhead watching?  I'd prefer to be more elusive.



It makes it easier for someone to come rescue him if he gets hurt?
Yeah a lift line is usually the last place to duck a rope. The odds of getting your pass pulled increase A LOT hitting those. Patrol usually frowns heavily on such a blatent disregard for a closing especially if you are falling all over the place.


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## Huck_It_Baby (Feb 11, 2013)

deadheadskier said:


> Well in the case of Misery Whip on Friday, if a patroller couldn't ski those conditions and be able to perform a rescue if needed, then they shouldn't be a patroller.



I'm with you on this. Most patrollers are skiing the closed runs for fun anyway and if they can't get down themselves they aren't up to snuff. When my friend was busted by patrol this weekend they pulled his ticket because their boss made them but they were joking around and then they all skied the closed run together and had a great time. The two patrollers then branched off to go ski another closed run simply for the powder.

It comes down to making an educated decision on conditions that day and being responsible for yourself. Just the same with skiing out of bounds or glades areas.


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## from_the_NEK (Feb 11, 2013)

deadheadskier said:


> Sounds like Hairball.  Takes a ton of snow for that to fill in and even at really deep snow pack levels at Wildcat, it's really difficult to ski that trail without doing some damage; jumping rocky sections is pretty much mandatory.



Yep  That was a one turn at a time survival skiing at its best (worst?). You could see the BIG rocks through the snow but the 24+ inches of unsupportive powder hid the nasty stuff well. At least the super deep snow allowed you to shed speed quickly.


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## MadMadWorld (Feb 11, 2013)

from_the_NEK said:


> Yep  That was a one turn at a time survival skiing at its best (worst?). You could see the BIG rocks through the snow but the 24+ inches of unsupportive powder hid the nasty stuff well. At least the super deep snow allowed you to shed speed quickly.



Sounds like the person you were with didn't know the mountain all that well!


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## snowmonster (Feb 11, 2013)

I'm a bad human being. I poach all the time. I have no moral high ground to speak from. Do I regret my actions? No. I kind of have a backcountry skiers' mentality when it comes to poaching: if something goes wrong, I'm on my own. I look at the closed trail then make a judgment if it's skiable or worth skiing at all. If there's a rope across it and the trail looks fat, I'm ducking it. Why do I do it? Maybe because being bad feels so good. It's a risk-reward calculation that we make every day. That being said, I usually do my ducking at places that I am familiar with. No way am I ducking into anything when it's my first time there or at any place out west where those ropes usually mean avalanche danger. 

One time there was a rope across Black Hole at Sunday River. It had been dumping for two days and it was fat. There's a lift line that goes across it. Just when I start down the trail, a patroller was riding the lift. We look at each other and he's grinning at me giving me the thumbs-up. Only time I got close to getting caught was at MRG (of all places). Place was an ice cube and Canyons was closed. Without wanting to duck into Canyons (I was still a novice at skiing then), I went into some woods but it spit me out on Canyons. As I make my way down, there's a patroller right there. He threatens to pull my pass but I use the Jedi mind trick. These are not the skiers you are looking for.


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## timm (Feb 11, 2013)

thetrailboss said:


> + 1.  I recall that if it was closed at Sugarbush you did not want to be there.  They definitely pushed the limits and we appreciated it.  I'd walk a little bit if needed to enjoy some good snow, especially in the spring.



Seconded. Was up at SB all weekend and some of the stuff they had open I couldn't believe -- Black Diamond was just ice and rock for the first half. I saw a few ropes that looked like they were hiding nice deep fluff but given that even on many of the open trails you could often see a fair amount of solid ice and dirt, I wasn't going to test it.

Other mountains are more conservative and ducking might be more appropriate. If I had money invested in a pass, I would not mess around though -- not worth the risk. On a one day ticket...probably would if it looks right.


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## Huck_It_Baby (Feb 11, 2013)

snowmonster said:


> No way am I ducking into anything when it's my first time there or at any place out west where those ropes usually mean avalanche danger.



Western mountains are a totally different ball game and ducking ropes shouldn't be taken as lightly as we do New England.

This a great thread.  I wonder how far a resort could take things *legally *against a poacher if they wanted??


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## marcski (Feb 11, 2013)

ss20 said:


> I was skiing yesterday at Catamount when I poached...and failed.  Here's a video of it
> 
> 
> 
> Guess what thread I was thinking about?





thetrailboss said:


> Why poach a liftline with folks overhead watching?  I'd prefer to be more elusive.



+1 to TB.

And...why was this a fail?  It didn't seem like you really fell hard at all.  Did you gauge your skis badly?  

As my friend John said over the weekend...it's rude to duck ropes, just ski around them!


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## WWF-VT (Feb 11, 2013)

ss20 said:


> I was skiing yesterday at Catamount when I poached...and failed.  Here's a video of it
> 
> 
> 
> Guess what thread I was thinking about?



Were you thinking about the " Do I need a lesson to learn to ski 5" of powder? " or the "Does skiing with a Go Pro make me look like a dork" thread?


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## Puck it (Feb 11, 2013)

This year, it is has been a rarity at Cannon.  For exmaplem,Vista has been roped for a couple of weeks now and justly so.  Looking from the bottom, it is one massive ice flow.  This is one way that we regularly duck at Cannon because of the wind loading.


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## Razor (Feb 11, 2013)

We ski weekdays, and I get really pissed when I see runs closed that are perfectly fine because they are saving them for the weekends.  A good example is the tree runs at Loon.  We've skied them many times when they were closed, and had some great powder runs with no problems at all.


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## thetrailboss (Feb 11, 2013)

Razor said:


> We ski weekdays, and I get really pissed when I see runs closed that are perfectly fine because they are saving them for the weekends. A good example is the tree runs at Loon. We've skied them many times when they were closed, and had some great powder runs with no problems at all.




I think that this, as well as the practice of some ski areas closing terrain that would be open at others, raises good arguments that there is no real standard as to what should be closed and that the National Ski Patrol might want to address that concern if they already haven't.  There's no real way to set a standard, but there is a problem when some folks see a rope and are conditioned to automatically think that there is no legitimate reason for it to be closed and poach it.  Pretty much for me the rule has always been if there is a rope I don't go.


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## HowieT2 (Feb 11, 2013)

deadheadskier said:


> Your patroler friends are quite different than the ones I knew in Stowe or Ragged.  Can't say I've gotten to know many at other hills.
> 
> Guess many of you folks are better citizens than I.
> 
> ...



I'm sorry, I didnt mean to give the impression that I dont condone ducking closed trails.  In fact, I did one this weekend.  But I did so with the knowledge that there was a barren rockwall that I could safely navigate.  while I got what I was looking for from that trail, it was rightfully closed and I wouldnt recommend it to others.  My only point was that at SB I have never skied a closed trail that afterwards, I thought should have been open.


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## MidnightJester (Feb 11, 2013)

Puts a smile on my face with how well this thread is going. What did I start, figuired I will get back into this debate. I am very much more on the skiing on closed runs if you chose too that not skiing them. We assume alot when we get on a lift. Just about sign away all injury and damage to equipment right's. So if I lose out even when mountains are at fault I will grab the snow whereever whenever. My risk, my gain. You only get good at less then optimal or bad conditions when you ride them. My smugglers ride would of been half as good if I stayed on only open areas. The way I look at it I would of cost myself to not of tried and missed out on all the riding. My weekend was a fun, wild ride.. Mostly intact. Three days behind me Fri"Sugarbush", Sat"Smugglers", Sun"Killington". Few bumps, few bruises, minor board damage, few lost items : (. All in All well worth the trip.


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## MadMadWorld (Feb 11, 2013)

MidnightJester said:


> Puts a smile on my face with how well this thread is going. What did I start, figuired I will get back into this debate. I am very much more on the skiing on closed runs if you chose too that not skiing them. We assume alot when we get on a lift. Just about sign away all injury and damage to equipment right's. So if I lose out even when mountains are at fault I will grab the snow whereever whenever. My risk, my gain. You only get good at less then optimal or bad conditions when you ride them. My smugglers ride would of been half as good if I stayed on only open areas. The way I look at it I would of cost myself to not of tried and missed out on all the riding. My weekend was a fun, wild ride.. Mostly intact. Three days behind me Fri"Sugarbush", Sat"Smugglers", Sun"Killington". Few bumps, few bruises, minor board damage, few lost items : (. All in All well worth the trip.



That's taking it a bit to the extreme. There is a fine line and as DMC said, you are not just putting yourself at risk, you are also putting the patrollers that have to come in and rescue you at risk if you were to injure yourself. Saying you will "grab the snow wherever whenever" is just ignorance.


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## MidnightJester (Feb 11, 2013)

Whereever Whenever is with a grain of salt. Risk is part of it and being on the fine line is where it is at for some.  When doing some of the more risky terrain you minimize where you can. Ride with buddy system, start slow, preplan where you can. Taking in gladed terrain at most moutains that have them is extra risky to start. Most state they arent even patrolled and carry seen and unseen obstacles. If I only kept to safer things I would not be as good a boarder as I have become in the timespan I have been riding. To most I say stay on open terrain and avoid the trees for others its a little more murky and to sieze the day.


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## thetrailboss (Feb 11, 2013)

MadMadWorld said:


> That's taking it a bit to the extreme. There is a fine line and as DMC said, you are not just putting yourself at risk, you are also putting the patrollers that have to come in and rescue you at risk if you were to injure yourself. Saying you will "grab the snow wherever whenever" is just ignorance.



I agree and I also think that there are some folks who don't get the assumption of risk part and the "not suing" part when they get hurt.  Just saying...


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## snoseek (Feb 12, 2013)

I'm guilty both east and west.

Out here i often duck the shoulder on cal side and ski away from the ski area to go home. 2000plus vert of steep untracked to my doorstep. I'm careful and if shit goes wrong its on me, ski patrol aint coming.

In the east as a midweek skier i noticed areas would save stuff for the weekend crowd. There's my justification for that.


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## andyzee (Feb 12, 2013)

deadheadskier said:


> No such thing as a closed trail.  They are either open or "reserved".



Agreed, the rope at closed trails is just like a rope a some of your most exclusive night clubs. I've seen open trails in far worst condition than many closed ones.


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## Huck_It_Baby (Feb 12, 2013)

snoseek said:


> I'm guilty both east and west.
> 
> 2000plus vert of steep untracked to my doorstep.



That is so awesome


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## bvibert (Feb 12, 2013)

I've done it and I'll do it again.  It depends on who I'm with, the conditions, and my familiarity with the mountain and their opening/closing policy.  Sometimes I just look for the trails marked with "Thin Cover" signs, as they're usually some of the best skiing on the mountain.

Like others have said, usually it's well worth the risk.


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## dmc (Feb 12, 2013)

bvibert said:


> Like others have said, usually it's well worth the risk.




Just as long as your not risking endangering a ski patroller..

This is what should never happen....


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## ALLSKIING (Feb 12, 2013)

deadheadskier said:


> Well that person was an idiot.  I would never consider poaching in such conditions.
> 
> However, I did poach Misery Whip at Sugarloaf this weekend.  Only rope I ducked this weekend.  This was Friday after 4-5 inches of snow had fallen.  Underneath was a 2 foot base of man made that was glazed over from the warm up.  Now, I was the third person down and it was good.  It wasn't very good for those behind me, but I wouldn't necessarily call it bad.  I actually don't mind skiing something completely bullet proof from time to time.  I enjoy the challenge and it keeps my skills sharp for when I hit nasty skied off patches on generally decent snow trails.
> 
> ...


It was still good and I saw no reason for it to be closed...A few years back we ducked rumble at the bush and while not great it was fine and tons of fun. I have never ducked a rope and said this is dangerous...


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## ALLSKIING (Feb 12, 2013)

dmc said:


> Just as long as your not risking endangering a ski patroller..
> 
> This is what should never happen....


I totally agree with this....before ducking you should have an idea of the conditions of woods/closed trails before going in.


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## gottabelight (Feb 12, 2013)

^ I agree with this as well, if you are a ducking a rope, you are essentially saying I am now on my own and do not expect to be rescued. If you are willing to take your safety into your own hands and take the liability of what may happen, then I see no problem with doing it. I sometimes do this when I am with my friends, and we are careful and always looking out for each other. We don't expect anyone to come get us when we go to places like this.


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## riverc0il (Feb 12, 2013)

gottabelight said:


> ^ I agree with this as well, if you are a ducking a rope, you are essentially saying I am now on my own and do not expect to be rescued. If you are willing to take your safety into your own hands and take the liability of what may happen, then I see no problem with doing it. I sometimes do this when I am with my friends, and we are careful and always looking out for each other. We don't expect anyone to come get us when we go to places like this.


More justifications. C'mon guys, just say you are breaking the rules and you don't care. It is okay to admit to having a sociopathic side. We all do in some small ways.

The problem with trying to legitimize from the perspective of "I assume the risks, I don't expect a rescue, it is like BC, etc." is that it is decidedly NOT like BC and patrol WILL come rescue your ass if they find out that you are hurt in bounds on a closed trail. And they may need to ruin their skis that they would rather not ruin, they may need to push beyond what their ability level may be at, and they may be performing a rescue with a sled down a run they would never go down unless they had to make a rescue. Actions have consequences. If we break the rules, the only thing we can do is do so intelligently and mitigate risk factors that could have negative outcomes and dial back the skiing to a slightly more conservative level than normal.

Two seasons ago, Cannon had a closed trail death:
http://www.thesnowway.com/2010/12/22/reflections-on-recent-deaths-at-cannon

But people die on open groomed trails far more often than any other non-avalanche prone area, so that probably doesn't say much about the risk.


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## steamboat1 (Feb 12, 2013)

Well I ducked a rope today at Stratton. Drove up early this morning from NYC. First run up on American Express I go to traverse over to the Ursa chair. I usually like taking the lower traverse by the fixed grip chair. Got there & they had it roped off & I wasn't climbing back up to the upper traverse or skiing back down to the bottom to start over. Looked down the trail & it looked fine, plenty of snow & looked groomed. It's only a straight run out over to Ursa but you need to gain speed to make it without having to walk. Pointed them straight & went for the chair. It happened so fast I'm not even sure what happened myself but I hit some kind of compression & next thing I know is both skis popped off & I'm flying forward at a fairly high speed & did a  face plant, got cut up & little & was bleeding which I didn't realize till I got down. Got up & my one leg wasn't feeling to good. I was able to gather my stuff which was all over. One ski & pole were just off the trail ready to go down into a stream but I managed to get them.Then I skied down to the bottom tentatively with no problems but still felt something wasn't right with my one leg. Took off my ski's to go in the lodge to clean my goggles which were filled with snow & I could hardly walk with a lot of pain. This was supposed to be the start of 4 days in a row skiing around VT.. Realized that no way was I going to be able to ski the rest of the week so I hoppled painfully to my car & drove back to NYC. Amazing I was able to drive because it was my right leg that I hurt. Not much of a problem most of the way because it was cruise control for most of the trip. Had some problems braking with stop & go traffic in the city but I made it home. Anyway my angle is swollen like a balloon, shin doesn't feel to Kosher & I think I tweeked my knee. See how I feel in the morning otherwise it's a trip to the ER. Still can barely walk with a lot of pain. Advil's helping with the pain but I might not be able to sleep tonight. Hope I'm not finished for the season.

Guess I found out why the trail was closed.


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## Edd (Feb 12, 2013)

Yikes Steamboat. That blows. Heal quick, hopefully.


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## ALLSKIING (Feb 12, 2013)

steamboat1 said:


> Well I ducked a rope today at Stratton. Drove up early this morning from NYC. First run up on American Express I go to traverse over to the Ursa chair. I usually like taking the lower traverse by the fixed grip chair. Got there & they had it roped off & I wasn't climbing back up to the upper traverse or skiing back down to the bottom to start over. Looked down the trail & it looked fine, plenty of snow & looked groomed. It's only a straight run out over to Ursa but you need to gain speed to make it without having to walk. Pointed them straight & went for the chair. It happened so fast I'm not even sure what happened myself but I hit some kind of compression & next thing I know is both skis popped off & I'm flying forward at a fairly high speed & did a  face plant, got cut up & little & was bleeding which I didn't realize till I got down. Got up & my one leg wasn't feeling to good. I was able to gather my stuff which was all over. One ski & pole were just off the trail ready to go down into a stream but I managed to get them.Then I skied down to the bottom tentatively with no problems but still felt something wasn't right with my one leg. Took off my ski's to go in the lodge to clean my goggles which were filled with snow & I could hardly walk with a lot of pain. This was supposed to be the start of 4 days in a row skiing around VT.. Realized that no way was I going to be able to ski the rest of the week so I hoppled painfully to my car & drove back to NYC. Amazing I was able to drive because it was my right leg that I hurt. Not much of a problem most of the way because it was cruise control for most of the trip. Had some problems braking with stop & go traffic in the city but I made it home. Anyway my angle is swollen like a balloon, shin doesn't feel to Kosher & I think I tweeked my knee. See how I feel in the morning otherwise it's a trip to the ER. Still can barely walk with a lot of pain. Advil's helping with the pain but I might not be able to sleep tonight. Hope I'm not finished for the season.
> 
> Guess I found out why the trail was closed.


Oh man, Hope it feels better in the morning. Tough way to start a 4 day trip.


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## steamboat1 (Feb 12, 2013)

I went to the ticket window first to try & get a voucher for another day since I just started skiing. Told the girl I just started & got hurt. She's the one that told me my face was bleeding, I had no idea. Anyway had no problem getting a voucher for another day. Even though I had used a Vt. Pass to get a ticket.


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## gottabelight (Feb 13, 2013)

hope you are feeling better... that sucks man...


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## dmc (Feb 13, 2013)

gottabelight said:


> ^ I agree with this as well, if you are a ducking a rope, you are essentially saying I am now on my own and do not expect to be rescued. If you are willing to take your safety into your own hands and take the liability of what may happen, then I see no problem with doing it.



So if your incapacitated - a ski area is supposed to leave you there and not take the risk of getting you?
Should they wait for you to die?  Let the buzzards pick your bones..?


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## andyzee (Feb 13, 2013)

dmc said:


> So if your incapacitated - a ski area is supposed to leave you there and not take the risk of getting you?
> Should they wait for you to die?  Let the buzzards pick your bones..?




Should sell viewing tickets and have a cat ride to location.


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## steamboat1 (Feb 13, 2013)

Not really feeling better. Hurts even more today. When you 1st injure yourself things go numb. Today the numbness is gone leaving only the pain. Saw my friend this morning who is a sports medicine doctor. The ankle is broken but he couldn't find anything wrong with the knee (maybe I just bruised the bone because it still hurts). Anyway I'm wearing a boot to keep the ankle in place & having a hard time hobbling around on crutches. Probably be out at least 4-6 weeks. Don't think I'll be ducking ropes again anytime soon.


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## deadheadskier (Feb 13, 2013)

Swift healing steamboat1.  That's a real bummer.

Which bone in your ankle did you fracture?  

Lucky that you will only require a boot for the bone to heal.  I had two patients yesterday who had completely cracked off their medial malleolus of their tibia combined with spiral fractures of their fibula.  Both were looking at several screws and at least six months (probably closer to nine months) before sports participation again.


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## andyzee (Feb 13, 2013)

steamboat1 said:


> Not really feeling better. Hurts even more today. When you 1st injure yourself things go numb. Today the numbness is gone leaving only the pain. Saw my friend this morning who is a sports medicine doctor. The ankle is broken but he couldn't find anything wrong with the knee (maybe I just bruised the bone because it still hurts). Anyway I'm wearing a boot to keep the ankle in place & having a hard time hobbling around on crutches. Probably be out at least 4-6 weeks. Don't think I'll be ducking ropes again anytime soon.



Wish you a quick recovery. However at the same time, I do have to say, I've seen open trails where the same could have happened.


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## Huck_It_Baby (Feb 13, 2013)

steamboat1 said:


> Not really feeling better. Hurts even more today. When you 1st injure yourself things go numb. Today the numbness is gone leaving only the pain. Saw my friend this morning who is a sports medicine doctor. The ankle is broken but he couldn't find anything wrong with the knee (maybe I just bruised the bone because it still hurts). Anyway I'm wearing a boot to keep the ankle in place & having a hard time hobbling around on crutches. Probably be out at least 4-6 weeks. Don't think I'll be ducking ropes again anytime soon.



Wow very sorry to hear this. I can't believe you drove home with a broken ankle!
=(


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## steamboat1 (Feb 14, 2013)

Huck_It_Baby said:


> Wow very sorry to hear this. I can't believe you drove home with a broken ankle!
> =(


  Everyone in my family says the same thing. Actually wasn't to bad. It was harder getting to the car from the base lodge & then getting into my house than the drive was. I once drove home with two broken wrists (& other injuries)after hitting a tree. My wife was with me that time. Shows how little faith I have in her driving abilities.

Thanks for the well wishes everyone. Hoping to be back towards the end of March.


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## jimmywilson69 (Feb 14, 2013)

steamboat1 said:


> My wife was with me that time. Shows how little faith I have in her driving abilities.



obviosly she doesn't read Alpinezone!!!

heal up my man...


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## thetrailboss (Feb 14, 2013)

Sorry to hear that, Steamboat.  Get better.  Have to ask though--why not seek immediate medical attention there rather than enduring the long drive home and risking an accident or making things worse?


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## steamboat1 (Feb 14, 2013)

deadheadskier said:


> Swift healing steamboat1.  That's a real bummer.
> 
> Which bone in your ankle did you fracture?
> 
> Lucky that you will only require a boot for the bone to heal.  I had two patients yesterday who had completely cracked off their medial malleolus of their tibia combined with spiral fractures of their fibula.  Both were looking at several screws and at least six months (probably closer to nine months) before sports participation again.


I don't recall the name of the bone but it's the small one on the right looking at the X- Ray. He called me back in this morning & put a hard cast on. He also scheduled me for an MRI to check out my knee which still hurts.


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## steamboat1 (Feb 14, 2013)

thetrailboss said:


> Have to ask though--why not seek immediate medical attention there rather than enduring the long drive home and risking an accident or making things worse?



Because I'm a thick headed SOB.


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## C-Rex (Feb 14, 2013)

I see poaching as being akin to riding side or back country.  It's at your own risk.  You eat it, and you're on your own.  Don't expect anyone to come rescue you, especially without it costing you mad duckets.  If you accept that and are prepared for that possibility then I see no problem with it.


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## jrmagic (Feb 14, 2013)

steamboat1 said:


> Everyone in my family says the same thing. Actually wasn't to bad. It was harder getting to the car from the base lodge & then getting into my house than the drive was. I once drove home with two broken wrists (& other injuries)after hitting a tree. My wife was with me that time. Shows how little faith I have in her driving abilities.
> 
> Thanks for the well wishes everyone. Hoping to be back towards the end of March.



Ugh that sucks.... guess I wont see you at Smuggs. Heal up and hope for a long spring season.


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## NESnow&Golf (Feb 14, 2013)

Sometimes you have to use your judgement.... if you think it's safe and you trust your experiance go for it.... as someone said before things are closed for different reasons... sometimes just to preserve the base... I've skied paradise at Mad River Glen in conditions any other mountian would have had ropes up in. Their motto is ski it if you can I think that's my policy


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## Nick (Feb 14, 2013)

NESnow&Golf said:


> Sometimes you have to use your judgement.... if you think it's safe and you trust your experiance go for it.... as someone said before things are closed for different reasons... sometimes just to preserve the base... I've skied paradise at Mad River Glen in conditions any other mountian would have had ropes up in. Their motto is ski it if you can I think that's my policy



Judgement rules. Welcome to the boards NE Snow & Golf!


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## Nick (Feb 14, 2013)

steamboat1 said:


> I don't recall the name of the bone but it's the small one on the right looking at the X- Ray. He called me back in this morning & put a hard cast on. He also scheduled me for an MRI to check out my knee which still hurts.



Damn; sorry to hear about your injury ... hope all heals quickly.


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## wintersyndrome (Feb 14, 2013)

If there is really a big dump coming my way, I'll ski through people to find the facilities


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## deadheadskier (Feb 14, 2013)

Fibula.  That's the better of the 2 to fracture
  Non-weight bearing


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## steamboat1 (Feb 14, 2013)

jrmagic said:


> Ugh that sucks.... guess I wont see you at Smuggs. Heal up and hope for a long spring season.


Yeah I was looking forward to hooking up. The more people I talk to about the injury the less likely it seems I'll be skiing again this year.


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## Nick (Feb 14, 2013)

steamboat1 said:


> Yeah I was looking forward to hooking up. The more people I talk to about the injury the less likely it seems I'll be skiing again this year.



Solution: stop talking about it! :lol:


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## drjeff (Feb 14, 2013)

steamboat1 said:


> Yeah I was looking forward to hooking up. The more people I talk to about the injury the less likely it seems I'll be skiing again this year.



Just be patient and let it heal properly.  Enjoy reliving the days you got in this year, and that way you'll have many future seasons worth of memories to come. Much better than pushing it too much and risk messing up more of your future skiing "career"


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## jrmagic (Feb 14, 2013)

steamboat1 said:


> Yeah I was looking forward to hooking up. The more people I talk to about the injury the less likely it seems I'll be skiing again this year.



That really sucks. Guess you'll be looking forward to fishing season to keep your sanity.


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## steamboat1 (Feb 14, 2013)

jrmagic said:


> That really sucks. Guess you'll be looking forward to fishing season to keep your sanity.


I'll be OK. What I'm really worried about is my fathers operation tomorrow (triple bypass). It hasn't been a good week for my family.


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## ScottySkis (Feb 14, 2013)

steamboat1 said:


> I'll be OK. What I'm really worried about is my fathers operation tomorrow (triple bypass). It hasn't been a good week for my family.



Sorry , my dad that operation a few years ago, and his heart is much better, wish your dad and you luck and look foward to a speedy recovery for both of you.


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## steamboat1 (Feb 14, 2013)

Scotty said:


> Sorry , my dad that operation a few years ago, and his heart is much better, wish your dad and you luck and look foward to a speedy recovery for both of you.



Thanks Scotty.


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## thetrailboss (Feb 14, 2013)

steamboat1 said:


> Because I'm a thick headed SOB.



:lol:  Got it.  I, for one, would not want to go to Rutland Regional, let alone Bennington Hospital, which are the closest ones.  

Sorry about the recent misfortunes for you, man.  Pop in some Greg Stump or Warren Miller, kick back, relax, and get better.


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## jrmagic (Feb 14, 2013)

steamboat1 said:


> I'll be OK. What I'm really worried about is my fathers operation tomorrow (triple bypass). It hasn't been a good week for my family.



I hope all goes well Steve.


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## skiNEwhere (Aug 20, 2014)

Bump.

Resorts in CO are notorious for closing down terrain in the "late season" (early April) due to dwindling numbers. Beaver Creek shut down half the mountain and most of the glades last season probably because it wasn't worth the man hours to patrol them and keep them open, even after an 8 inch storm. In this case I'm much more inclined to go exploring.


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## Puck it (Aug 20, 2014)

skiNEwhere said:


> Bump.
> 
> Resorts in CO are notorious for closing down terrain in the "late season" (early April) due to dwindling numbers. Beaver Creek shut down half the mountain and most of the glades last season probably because it wasn't worth the man hours to patrol them and keep them open, even after an 8 inch storm. In this case I'm much more inclined to go exploring.




Hell yeah.  Ropes really don't mean much to me.  I realize the risk when I am doing.


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## ss20 (Aug 20, 2014)

Ain't much of a big dump if there's still ropes up...


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## MadMadWorld (Aug 20, 2014)

ss20 said:


> Ain't much of a big dump if there's still ropes up...



that or patrol is slow on the trail checks. Either way you are doing a service to your fellow skiers by checking on the snow condition.


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## skiNEwhere (Aug 20, 2014)

MadMadWorld said:


> that or patrol is slow on the trail checks. Either way you are doing a service to your fellow skiers by checking on the snow condition.



"Volunteer" ski patrol


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## Savemeasammy (Aug 20, 2014)

MadMadWorld said:


> that or patrol is slow on the trail checks. Either way you are doing a service to your fellow skiers by checking on the snow condition.



Sometimes I like to do the mountain a courtesy by checking several times.  


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## deadheadskier (Aug 20, 2014)

I urge some caution though.  It is possible that while checking out closed terrain conditions for other skiers, you may encounter a different kind of "dump" all together, which was the case at last years summit when bvibert and I headed out into a closed Brackett Basin.


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## MadMadWorld (Aug 20, 2014)

deadheadskier said:


> I urge some caution though.  It is possible that while checking out closed terrain conditions for other skiers, you may encounter a different kind of "dump" all together, which was the case at last years summit when bvibert and I headed out into a closed Brackett Basin.



Seriously? I get #1 but that's just awkward.


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## Puck it (Aug 20, 2014)

MadMadWorld said:


> Seriously? I get #1 but that's just awkward.



and there is photgraphic evidence too.  I think.


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## deadheadskier (Aug 20, 2014)

I don't think Brian or I took a photo.  But, yup, someone left a nice Baby Ruth right in the middle of the lower traverse out to Can't Dog.


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## dlague (Aug 20, 2014)

Savemeasammy said:


> Sometimes I like to do the mountain a courtesy by checking several times.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



A couple of years ago we got a dumping - like 2 ft on October 29th into the 30th and we headed to Killington.  Naturally,  they had the Gondola running but the only open trails were those serviced by North Ridge Triple.  However, we could see that there was good coverage and opted to try a run to the bottom.  It was so much fun ducking the ropes that we never skied the North Ridge Triple.  We did see a guy bite it on some rocks that were below surface.  We actually skied runs that already had first tracks.

We too wanted to help out by thoroughly checking out the closed trails and pack it down for the next snowfall so they could open the trail sooner.


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## Puck it (Aug 20, 2014)

deadheadskier said:


> I don't think Brian or I took a photo. But, yup, someone left a nice Baby Ruth right in the middle of the lower traverse out to Can't Dog.




My bad just words.

http://forums.alpinezone.com/showth...one-Summit-5-0-2-7-14-2-9-14?highlight=summit


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## Puck it (Aug 20, 2014)

dlague said:


> A couple of years ago we got a dumping - like 2 ft on October 29th into the 30th and we headed to Killington. Naturally, they had the Gondola running but the only open trails were those serviced by North Ridge Triple. However, we could see that there was good coverage and opted to try a run to the bottom. It was so much fun ducking the ropes that we never skied the North Ridge Triple. We did see a guy bite it on some rocks that were below surface. We actually skied runs that already had first tracks.
> 
> We too wanted to help out by thoroughly checking out the closed trails and pack it down for the next snowfall so they could open the trail sooner.



I was there that day too.  Some of those were mine probably.


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## dlague (Aug 20, 2014)

Puck it said:


> I was there that day too.  Some of those were mine probably.




Was pretty cool for October turns!  Beats the hell out of climbing those stairs!


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## Puck it (Aug 20, 2014)

dlague said:


> Was pretty cool for October turns!  Beats the hell out of climbing those stairs!




It was good. The best was Wildcat 10/25/05 though. Top to bottom in powder.


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