# Least Favorite Trail



## MadMadWorld (Jun 15, 2012)

I have seen tons of threads on favorite/hardest trail but none for this. 

Tell us:
1. What trail 
2. Why you hate it 

Mine is Connifer Connection at Wachusett 
- Don't get me wrong, when no one is around it's a fun trail to rip but this trail is usually severely overcrowded by wreckless kids trying to ski something beyond their ability to impress their friends. The trail usually ends up a sheet of ice by the end of day/night and I can't count how many stupid accidents I have been witness to over the years.


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## gregnye (Jun 15, 2012)

I don't like hating on the easy terrain--but if I were to pick one trail I hated it would either be GrandJunction/Middle Bear Claw at Loon or Bearback/Bear Necessity at Attitash/Bear Peak.

I hate Grand Junction at loon because it is too crowded and leads to either the overpopulated gondola or Kanc. Quad. In terms of population, another trail similar is Taxi at Jay--so many people in a congested space (just take the T-bar).

I hate Bear Neccessity because, for those of you who have never been on it, there is no posible way you will have enough speed and will be walking EVERY TIME!! grrr.

I'm sure I can think of others, but I don't want to hate on the novice terrain too much. Perhaps I should think about which expert terrain is the worst (boneyard at Waterville is a contestant--used to be a blue, then magically labeled as a black and rarely opened)


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## MadMadWorld (Jun 15, 2012)

gregnye said:


> I'm sure I can think of others, but I don't want to hate on the novice terrain too much. Perhaps I should think about which expert terrain is the worst (boneyard at Waterville is a contestant--used to be a blue, then magically labeled as a black and rarely opened)



All very good choices. As far as "advanced" terrain, I would add Tightrope @ Attitash. That trail is just facing the wrong direction on the windiest place on the mountain. It has been a long time since I have skied it but I remember it being a skating rink every time.


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## kickstand (Jun 15, 2012)

gregnye said:


> I hate Bear Neccessity because, for those of you who have never been on it, there is no posible way you will have enough speed and will be walking EVERY TIME!! grrr.



I refuse to take it, but I have not been down thru Jacob's Ladder yet, so I have not yet been forced to skate it.  I will always jump on the Abenaki quad and ski down.  And the addition of the mid-station makes it that much more of a no-brainer.

Might as well stick with Attitash here - the very top of Bear, all of it.  Once in a while, it can be fun, but just the sheer volume of people makes for an ugly mix of ice and soft bumps.  Sometimes you can get lucky with the very edges of Illusion, above Wandering Skis, that's about it.  Once it's skied off, that's it.

I usually find certain sections of trails to be a pain, especially with changing conditions.


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## AdironRider (Jun 15, 2012)

The Alta Chutes in Jackson. 

Dont get me wrong, just like any trail with a foot of fresh, its awesome, but everyone and their Mom seems to think its AOK to set a traverse line across all of them. Completely ruins the runs unless you are lucky and get early ups on the tram.


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## ScottySkis (Jun 15, 2012)

Belt parkway at Hunter,their only intermediate trail from top of Hunter quad nice trail just way to many people on it.


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## Geoff (Jun 16, 2012)

Killington, Lower Bunny Buster, Thanksgiving Saturday between 10:30 and 2:30.   It's like you spilled a box of sugar on the kitchen floor and the ants showed up en-masse.


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## Puck it (Jun 16, 2012)

Big Link at Cannon.  Just to much traffic.


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## steamboat1 (Jun 16, 2012)

Pretty much any trail at Middlebury Snow Bowl.


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## deadheadskier (Jun 16, 2012)

The Eureka, Tin Woodsman Oz trail complex at Sunday River.  Talk about an epic fail in trail design.  It's still fun to ski, but that whole terrain pod could have been so much better had they not cleared so much.


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## millerm277 (Jun 17, 2012)

Pine Knot @ Gore. Take most of the skiers off of a triple chair and a decent portion of a gondola, and then send them down one narrow, twisting, difficult and bumped "intermediate" trail.


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## bigbog (Jun 17, 2012)

Ralph's Run(Wachusett)...LOL, maybe cuz I largely learned @Wachusett...during midweek nights(6-10p = $88) back in the early 80s, when most people were enjoying the 80's snow on the bigger mountains..  Remembering opting for Ralph's Run often when the main beginner's trail was packed...brings a laugh everytime I think of it, but life was sure depressing before skiing...and Wa-Wachusett.


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## maineskier69 (Jun 18, 2012)

I hear ya deadhead skier.  Eureka is the worst culprit as the wind just blows the snow right down to the base making it a skating rink.  The exception was this past season where they didn't make snow on it.  So the 7 days it was open because of a late season storm, it skied like a whole different trail with no man made base.  Tin Woodsman/Lost Princess can ski quite well most days if you know which areas to avoid, but even then you get that "one section" that tends to be scraped each time, but you are rewarded afterward with some great little zipper lines of bumps to the bottom.

Now Kansas is a different story and is the first to come to mind as a least favorite ski trail.  One must tuck it and hope you don't encounter a traverser (but you usually do).  I feel especially bad for snowboarders on that trail and have been known to offer a pole pull in the right situation,


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## WWF-VT (Jun 18, 2012)

steamboat1 said:


> Pretty much any trail at Middlebury Snow Bowl.



Why so harsh on Middlebury Snow Bowl?  You can't complain about the price and there's lots of off the map options that make it a fun place to ski and ride.  Some of the trails are always groomedand hard pack - but that'swhy the racers train there.


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## 2knees (Jun 18, 2012)

Double Dipper at killington.  Not for what the trail is so much as for what they could've done instead of paving a superhighway down the canyon.


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## marcski (Jun 18, 2012)

WWF-VT said:


> Why so harsh on Middlebury Snow Bowl?  You can't complain about the price and there's lots of off the map options that make it a fun place to ski and ride.  Some of the trails are always groomedand hard pack - but that'swhy the racers train there.



I was thinking the same thing when I read that harshin' post. 




maineskier69 said:


> \



Maineskier....Ever get down to the Shipyard Brewery?  It's in your neck o' the woods and I was loving a nice Growler of the Monkey Fist IPA last night.  Quite tasty, IMHO.


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## skiadikt (Jun 18, 2012)

2knees said:


> Double Dipper at killington.  Not for what the trail is so much as for what they could've done instead of paving a superhighway down the canyon.



that was gonna be my choice but also for the fact that weekends it's usually a death slide by 9am.


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## 4aprice (Jun 18, 2012)

2knees said:


> Double Dipper at killington.  Not for what the trail is so much as for what they could've done instead of paving a superhighway down the canyon.



This is a little OT but your choice of DD made me think of it.  Redesigning runs.  Stratton's got a similar situation where they blew out a ton of trees when installing the gondola and actually eliminating a fun run.  I'm wondering why some islands of tree couldn't be planted and these runs redesigned.  I believe Elk Mountain redesigned their west side by doing this.  Good snowmaking spots could be designed in as well.  

Alex

Lake Hopatcong, NJ


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## amf (Jun 19, 2012)

At Stratton, while its not there anymore the huge open swath that used to be the main Sunbowl(?) face always gave me fits. Huge open expanse, breaking every which way. I like it a lot better now that they basically cut it in two with their superpipe.


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## ceo (Jun 20, 2012)

Second on Big Link. Nearly always a hockey rink even by Cannon standards.
I'll add West Mountain Crosscut at Sugarloaf. Ought to be a cross-country trail. Try it with a tired and cranky 7-year-old for extra lack of fun.


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## riverc0il (Jun 20, 2012)

The Links at Cannon are terrible! There are bad trails that are avoidable and then there are critical junction trails you can't avoid. The Links are the latter. Hard to ski a full day at Cannon without skiing the links at least once (particularly if the Tram isn't running). It is unfortunate that the HSQ didn't just follow the old double lift line. The new cut destroyed some character of the trails and all we gained was being able to ski Middle Cannon or Bypass. Spookie accesses everything below these two trails. And who willfully wants to ski Bypass?


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## thetrailboss (Jun 20, 2012)

Probably been said, but Deathspout at Sugarbush (Downspout).  It's the only way down early season and gets way too much traffic.  Icy in one hour or so.  Ugh.


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## thetrailboss (Jun 20, 2012)

steamboat1 said:


> Pretty much any trail at Middlebury Snow Bowl.



Why say that?  In a good season the 'Bowl has some good old school terrain and never a crowd.


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## steamboat1 (Jun 20, 2012)

thetrailboss said:


> Why say that?  In a good season the 'Bowl has some good old school terrain and never a crowd.



Well maybe I spent far, far to much time there in my youth.


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## kickstand (Jun 21, 2012)

riverc0il said:


> There are bad trails that are avoidable and then there are critical junction trails you can't avoid.



Like ClusterF*** Corner at Sunday River....

For those of you not familiar with it, it is where T2, Upper Sunday Punch and Ecstasy all come together and filter into Middle Sunday Punch, Monday Mourning and Cascades, arguably 6 of the 10-15 most popular/high-traffic trails on the mountain.  It gets skied off by about 10am.  It is truly a place where people of all abilities come together, for better or worse.


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## SIKSKIER (Jun 21, 2012)

riverc0il said:


> The Links at Cannon are terrible! There are bad trails that are avoidable and then there are critical junction trails you can't avoid. The Links are the latter. Hard to ski a full day at Cannon without skiing the links at least once (particularly if the Tram isn't running). It is unfortunate that the HSQ didn't just follow the old double lift line. The new cut destroyed some character of the trails and all we gained was being able to ski Middle Cannon or Bypass. Spookie accesses everything below these two trails. And who willfully wants to ski Bypass?



Dead spot on Steve.Couldn't have said it better.Totally changed the way the Tramway side skied forever.The old Middle Cannon has no resemblence to the current one and the old Big link is totally trashed now.Upper Cannon ends so much earlier than it used to.I find I don't ski that side as much because the abrupt end to the flow of the run at the detach unload.Don't get me started on Profile.And no,I will not call it Cannonball.


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## Watatic Skier (Jun 21, 2012)

kickstand said:


> Like ClusterF*** Corner at Sunday River....
> 
> For those of you not familiar with it, it is where T2, Upper Sunday Punch and Ecstasy all come together and filter into Middle Sunday Punch, Monday Mourning and Cascades, arguably 6 of the 10-15 most popular/high-traffic trails on the mountain.  It gets skied off by about 10am.  It is truly a place where people of all abilities come together, for better or worse.




I really hate that junction, however it doesn't even compare to the junction above the Spruce Triple.  Loads of people coming down from the Chondola, Lazy River, and pretty much everything to the west all funneling down onto Tourist trap.


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## deadheadskier (Jun 21, 2012)

Tourist Trap is definitely equally as bad.  Maybe not conditions wise, but crowd wise for sure.  Where it's probably worse is there is a far greater percentage of novice skiers who probably intended to stay over more on South Ridge proper, but get stuck in the cross hairs of people speeding for Barker.


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## deadheadskier (Jun 21, 2012)

Not a lot of Okemo skiers here, but I'll throw my vote in for Lower Arrow.  Damn nasty funnel trail.


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## drjeff (Jun 21, 2012)

The Viper Pit at K.  Always had me skiing defensively through that area, and then breathing a big sigh of relief when I emerged, hopefully unscathed onto either Bear Claw or Wildfire depending on where I was headed.  Now that i've gone through there with my kids a few times, my collision anxiety has been tripled as the masses go barreling through there often with reckless abandon


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## bigbog (Jun 22, 2012)

AHH..HA...Ditto *ceo* and *dhs*,
Two trails definitely _out of the box_...ie devised on Friday afternoons after lunches with too many brews....


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## kickstand (Jun 22, 2012)

Watatic Skier said:


> I really hate that junction, however it doesn't even compare to the junction above the Spruce Triple.  Loads of people coming down from the Chondola, Lazy River, and pretty much everything to the west all funneling down onto Tourist trap.



I had to look at a map to see exactly where you talking about.  Was wondering where there was a junction above the Spruce Triple......but, yes, that whole area kind of blows, especially from where Lazy River meets American Express.  From that point down is like skiing thru a mine field.


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## soposkier (Jun 22, 2012)

Watatic Skier said:


> I really hate that junction, however it doesn't even compare to the junction above the Spruce Triple.  Loads of people coming down from the Chondola, Lazy River, and pretty much everything to the west all funneling down onto Tourist trap.




I enjoy the challenge of skiing the icy luge track that forms in the maze that is set up to slow people down.  

Speaking of clusterf**k corners, at Ragged the intersection where Headwall finishes can be scary if people are standing in the wrong spots.


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## MadMadWorld (Jun 22, 2012)

AdironRider said:


> The Alta Chutes in Jackson.
> 
> Dont get me wrong, just like any trail with a foot of fresh, its awesome, but everyone and their Mom seems to think its AOK to set a traverse line across all of them. Completely ruins the runs unless you are lucky and get early ups on the tram.



I have skied JH only once in my life and I was shocked to see all those traverse ruts at such a skiers mountain. Great choice for ugly expert terrain


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## ceo (Jul 13, 2012)

The reason they ran the Peabody Quad up to the Links (or so I conjecture) was so there were two more trails for all that extra traffic to go down. Retaining the alignment of the old chair would have resulted in huge traffic on Ravine and Spookie.


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## riverc0il (Jul 14, 2012)

I realize the reason, ceo. Ideally, they just need to cut a less steep route down to Middle Ravine and it would solve the problem. They really only gained one more trail by ending the Peabody where it ends currently (Middle Cannon -- Bypass was originally not an option thought that has changed but who actually wants to ski Bypass? It is worse than the Links). They could have widened Spookie for increased traffic with the old position and also added a new liftline trail (well, at least officially) as the line would have been cut substantially wider. They also could have better utilized Lower Hard. There are ways that they could have made the old lift line work just fine if not better than the current design.


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## SkiFanE (Jul 17, 2012)

uphillklimber said:


> American Express or Risky Business at the River. First, you gotta take the longest slowest chairlift where you have three trails down mid season, and one traverse trail. AE and RB are decent runs, but... down near the bottom of those runs, it gets scraped and icy early in the day. A lot of crossing traffic, and people always coming to a stop due to crossing traffic. I doubt they could keep the lower sections of those trails kin decent shape even if they groomed 3 times a day and blew snow there every night. It just is a tough area to keep good, too much of a bunch up area.



Wow...Risky is probably my favorite, most reliable trail at SR.  I ski 50-70 days there and from beginning to end of season it always has something for me.  The top has my favorite pit stop (he he), then I usually stay right the entire run...the part under the chair lift (below Lazy River) is usually SO nice...they don't groom it often and it bumps up nicely.  Of course..if you are a middle of the trail/groomer skier...well you're missing the fun and getting stuck in the icy chutes - time to start taking the bumps 

Yup..the cluster fuck junction/corners/intersections at SR are worst.  The lowest part of Amex can bump up nicely...just have to wait for an opening to avoid the masses before the chair.


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## bigbog (Jul 17, 2012)

With a little mental-physical_adjustment correcting my subtle-banking stance...paying big dividends everywhere...near the end of last season I'm going to get some satisfaction in skiing Jungle Road in the cold, late afternoon, under control 100%...8)


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## J'Hams (Jul 17, 2012)

Roper's Road at Wachusett.
Flat and out of the way--dumb.


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 2, 2012)

2knees said:


> Double Dipper at killington.  Not for what the trail is so much as for what they could've done instead of paving a superhighway down the canyon.



Good call.

My least favorite at Killington is Mouse Trap. The whole right side of the trail (going down) is shrubs and sticks coming up through the snow, even if it's relatively deep. They need to take a hedge trimmer to that sh*t. And so many trails funnel into Mouse Trap, it's hard to avoid. It's hard to carve or catch a good edge on a field of sticks.


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## Puck it (Aug 2, 2012)

bdfreetuna said:


> Good call.
> 
> My least favorite at Killington is Mouse Trap. The whole right side of the trail (going down) is shrubs and sticks coming up through the snow, even if it's relatively deep. They need to take a hedge trimmer to that sh*t. And so many trails funnel into Mouse Trap, it's hard to avoid. It's hard to carve or catch a good edge on a field of sticks.




At Mach speed, I would guess.


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 2, 2012)

It's not a good trail for going fast. Crowded, short, and did I mention the field of sticks? I've probably only hit 75mph on that one


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## Nick (Aug 2, 2012)

bdfreetuna said:


> It's not a good trail for going fast. Crowded, short, and did I mention the field of sticks? I've probably only hit 75mph on that one



Just 75?? 

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 2, 2012)

Yeah there was a pretty strong head wind. Slowed me down a lot.


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## steamboat1 (Aug 3, 2012)

bdfreetuna said:


> Good call.
> 
> My least favorite at Killington is Mouse Trap. The whole right side of the trail (going down) is shrubs and sticks coming up through the snow, even if it's relatively deep. They need to take a hedge trimmer to that sh*t.  It's hard to carve or catch a good edge on a field of sticks.


Funny that's exactly what I like about Pipeline over in South Ridge.


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## drjeff (Aug 3, 2012)

bdfreetuna said:


> It's not a good trail for going fast. Crowded, short, and did I mention the field of sticks? I've probably only hit 75mph on that one



Sticky spring snow that day?


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## SIKSKIER (Aug 3, 2012)

riverc0il said:


> Ideally, they just need to cut a less steep route down to Middle Ravine and it would solve the problem. They really only gained one more trail by ending the Peabody where it ends currently (Middle Cannon -- Bypass was originally not an option thought that has changed but who actually wants to ski Bypass? It is worse than the Links). They could have widened Spookie for increased traffic with the old position and also added a new liftline trail (well, at least officially) as the line would have been cut substantially wider. There are ways that they could have made the old lift line work just fine if not better than the current design.



Again,riv is spot on.Bypass is the only trail that was gained by moving the lift and in the process screwwing up by effectivly shortening Upper Cannon and Tramway and Vistaway.Those runs for me are finished just above the unload now.The rest of the vert is survival.The old links were so much fun but that was all demolished to support the large increase in skiers unloading in that area.Middle Cannon also use to have an entrance higher than Spookie.It was called the Goat Path and located hard right after coming out of Easy Link.Very little gain and a huge loss relocating.Also,the old unload had a perfect secluded unload area totally away from any traffic.I can go on and on with how much  Middle Cannon has changed for the bad and it being disconnected from Upper.


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## arik (Aug 3, 2012)

deer run/long john at mount snow

too crowded with too many of varying abilities (and varying speed)


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## Puck it (Aug 3, 2012)

SIKSKIER said:


> Again,riv is spot on.Bypass is the only trail that was gained by moving the lift and in the process screwwing up by effectivly shortening Upper Cannon and Tramway and Vistaway.Those runs for me are finished just above the unload now.The rest of the vert is survival.The old links were so much fun but that was all demolished to support the large increase in skiers unloading in that area.Middle Cannon also use to have an entrance higher than Spookie.It was called the Goat Path and located hard right after coming out of Easy Link.Very little gain and a huge loss relocating.Also,the old unload had a perfect secluded unload area totally away from any traffic.I can go on and on with how much  Middle Cannon has changed for the bad and it being disconnected from Upper.




Bypass is on this map from 1992, no goat path until 1998.


http://skimap.org/data/347/260/1284384152.jpg


http://skimap.org/data/347/7/1244230554.jpg


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## riverc0il (Aug 3, 2012)

So sad that I don't remember Cannon before the Quad. I think I skied there as a youngster with my family before Peabody Quad went in but I really can't remember much about that trip except freezing on the Cannonball Quad and not being able to ski the bumps on Upper Hard.

I don't remember Goat Path but that gets you half of Middle Cannon per the map above. I'll have to look for the remains of that trail this season. Considering how much vert that double serviced, not being able to access half of Middle Hard or Bypass seems trivial. And F Bypass. Man. Was that trail ever good?


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## Puck it (Aug 3, 2012)

riverc0il said:


> So sad that I don't remember Cannon before the Quad. I think I skied there as a youngster with my family before Peabody Quad went in but I really can't remember much about that trip except freezing on the Cannonball Quad and not being able to ski the bumps on Upper Hard.
> 
> I don't remember Goat Path but that gets you half of Middle Cannon per the map above. I'll have to look for the remains of that trail this season. Considering how much vert that double serviced, not being able to access half of Middle Hard or Bypass seems trivial. And F Bypass. Man. Was that trail ever good?



You know where Goat path is.  It is at the bottom of Easy Link. It is where they store the gates for training sessions behind the rope.


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## Huck_It_Baby (Aug 8, 2012)

I'm surprised nobody has said Juggernaut at K yet. Go back there in the wrong conditions and you are hiking not skiing.

Personally I like the isolation though.


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## ALLSKIING (Aug 9, 2012)

bdfreetuna said:


> Good call.
> 
> My least favorite at Killington is Mouse Trap. The whole right side of the trail (going down) is shrubs and sticks coming up through the snow, even if it's relatively deep. They need to take a hedge trimmer to that sh*t. And so many trails funnel into Mouse Trap, it's hard to avoid. It's hard to carve or catch a good edge on a field of sticks.


I love the natural right side of mouse trap...The left is all groomed out and boring.


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## mediamogul (Aug 13, 2012)

Ill second Double Dipper at K. One of the ugliest scars in the east reminding us all of what could have been. Could have been an awesome set of trails coming down through the canyon in its place. Now its an overgroomed, windscoured, skating rink.


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## jaja111 (Aug 14, 2012)

Huck_It_Baby said:


> I'm surprised nobody has said Juggernaut at K yet. Go back there in the wrong conditions and you are hiking not skiing.
> 
> Personally I like the isolation though.



I'll go on that usually only for safety meetings and/or lunch, but I always regret having done it by latter third of the trail.


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## Puck it (Aug 14, 2012)

Easy Winder( I think that is its name) at Ragged.  I made the mistake of taking it on a warm day.  Juggernaut is a black compared to this one.


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## billski (Aug 14, 2012)

Any runout.

Help me out guys... which ones?


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## St. Bear (Aug 14, 2012)

billski said:


> Any runout.
> 
> Help me out guys... which ones?



Castlerock Runout


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## Puck it (Aug 14, 2012)

Any of the runouts at Alta especially on a deep powder day.  You better find a track or you are poling.


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## Madroch (Aug 14, 2012)

So- too lazy to read the whole thread-- anyone mention plummet at Mt snow-- ruined PDF and some of Jaws, or Free Fall- ruined challenger and some of PDF....ughhh


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## Riverskier (Aug 15, 2012)

Salvation at Sunday River, as it destroyed some of the character of Bims Whim, one of the VERY few classic New England ski trails on the mountain. SR lacks many of these classic trails, as most of the mountain was developed in the 90's.


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## Abubob (Aug 15, 2012)

soposkier said:


> Speaking of clusterf**k corners, at Ragged the intersection where Headwall finishes can be scary if people are standing in the wrong spots.



No kidding. Right at the bottom there's a SLOW sign :blink: with a bunch of people standing around after meandering their way off Blueberry Patch wondering "What do I do now?"  You've either gotta crank an emergency stop or weave your way through without knocking anyone over. 



Puck it said:


> Easy Winder( I think that is its name) at Ragged.  I made the mistake of taking it on a warm day.  Juggernaut is a black compared to this one.



After Cabin Fever or Mickey's Run (which is almost never open) or cutting through the woods off Lower Ridge you hit that looooooong run out. Not fun in fresh snow. A little like Ullr's Dream at Jay. :sad:


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## MadMadWorld (Aug 15, 2012)

Love it or hate it.....Lower Antelope at MRG has to be on some peoples list. I personally love the trail because it has a ton of character and that NE feel to it. It also usually has the best snow of all the marked trails on the mountain. However, the runout is probably the worst of any marked trail in all of the northeast! For those not into earning their turns it can be a headache when you have to hike uphill, out of the woods one at a time because the trail is not wide enough to pass someone.


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## St. Bear (Aug 15, 2012)

MadMadWorld said:


> Love it or hate it.....Lower Antelope at MRG has to be on some peoples list. I personally love the trail because it has a ton of character and that NE feel to it. It also usually has the best snow of all the marked trails on the mountain. However, the runout is probably the worst of any marked trail in all of the northeast! For those not into earning their turns it can be a headache when you have to hike uphill, out of the woods one at a time because the trail is not wide enough to pass someone.




Sounds like East Bowl at Burke.


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## ALLSKIING (Aug 15, 2012)

MadMadWorld said:


> Love it or hate it.....Lower Antelope at MRG has to be on some peoples list. I personally love the trail because it has a ton of character and that NE feel to it. It also usually has the best snow of all the marked trails on the mountain. However, the runout is probably the worst of any marked trail in all of the northeast! For those not into earning their turns it can be a headache when you have to hike uphill, out of the woods one at a time because the trail is not wide enough to pass someone.


   I need to hit Lower antelope earlier in the day..For some reason its usually one of my last runs and I am toast by the time I have to hike out making it seem much worse.


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## deadheadskier (Aug 15, 2012)

Though not as bad as Lower Antelope, Lower FIS at SB North is a similar deal.


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## riverc0il (Aug 15, 2012)

I'd rather hike out of LA than pole out of run outs like East Bowl at Burke or Lower FIS at Bush. East Bowl isn't too bad if the snow is packed. But it sucks on a power day. At least LA is a short uphill hike rather than a long slog or poling fest. It is over rather quickly and there is no run out leading into the uphill climb.


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## ceo (Aug 17, 2012)

Puck it said:


> Bypass is on this map from 1992, no goat path until 1998.



Goat Path has been there at least since the late 70s, but it hasn't always been on the map. The start of it is still there, to the right as you start down Missing Link (where you can also see the upper terminal of the old Middle T-bar), but it ends at a steep embankment because of how they regraded Middle Cannon.

(And wow, I'd forgotten how incredibly inaccurate and useless Cannon's trail maps used to be. They used to be even worse than these two.)


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## Smellytele (Aug 17, 2012)

My least favorite trail for skiing is the one that has no snow at all.


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## Zand (Aug 17, 2012)

I definitely prefer Lower Antelope to Lower FIS or East Bowl. I'd rather take my skis off for 90 seconds and hike through the woods (not like it's a hard hike either) than pole for 5+ minutes. As for my least favorite trail, I don't think I hate any trail that has good conditions... being a raised Wachusett skier, I don't mind crowds if the conditions are good, I'm pretty used to it (although Burke has certainly spoiled me crowds-wise). But trails like Bypass at Cannon and Downspout at Sugarbush, which are almost NEVER in good shape, top my list.


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## MadMadWorld (Aug 20, 2012)

Zand said:


> I definitely prefer Lower Antelope to Lower FIS or East Bowl. I'd rather take my skis off for 90 seconds and hike through the woods (not like it's a hard hike either) than pole for 5+ minutes. As for my least favorite trail, I don't think I hate any trail that has good conditions... being a raised Wachusett skier, I don't mind crowds if the conditions are good, I'm pretty used to it (although Burke has certainly spoiled me crowds-wise). But trails like Bypass at Cannon and Downspout at Sugarbush, which are almost NEVER in good shape, top my list.



I also like the fact that at the bottom of Lower Antelope you can take your skis off and just boot the parking lot if it's an especially sloggy day.


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## thetrailboss (Aug 20, 2012)

Riverskier said:


> Salvation at Sunday River, as it destroyed some of the character of Bims Whim, one of the VERY few classic New England ski trails on the mountain. SR lacks many of these classic trails, as most of the mountain was developed in the 90's.



Agreed.  Although a recent addition, Southpaw, looks like an attempt to try and get something that is narrower.  



deadheadskier said:


> Though not as bad as Lower Antelope, Lower FIS at SB North is a similar deal.



Lower FIS has a pretty significant upslope to it that I always have to pole over.  It also gets really narrow before dropping out into the Sunny D area and that last pitch can get very thin and rough.  That said, Lower FIS is a real gem and on a good day can have great snow for a long time since folks just don't like the run out.  I think they do have plans to *someday* put a lift from the bottom of Lower FIS up to Glen House.  There is some neat terrain there.  



riverc0il said:


> I'd rather hike out of LA than pole out of run outs like East Bowl at Burke or Lower FIS at Bush. East Bowl isn't too bad if the snow is packed. But it sucks on a power day. At least LA is a short uphill hike rather than a long slog or poling fest. It is over rather quickly and there is no run out leading into the uphill climb.



I don't think that East Bowl is as bad as Lower FIS, but I have skied the former for many years and know the drill and where to get speed and where to ski it.  Most of the time they groom the run out so that you can get out, but I have skied it when the lower part was not groomed and it can be interesting.  Agreed that on powder or wet days it can be tougher, but I've found that there is just enough pitch for me and my hopefully freshly waxed skis to get through the flats.  

Again, I loathe the trails like Deathspout at Sugarbush, Times Square at Mount Ellen, Big Emma at Snowbird, and Lower Chip's at Snowbird because all of these areas are overcrowded, overskied, and icy trails that you have a hard time avoiding and are just to get you from Point A to Point B rather than enjoying a nice ski experience.


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## bdfreetuna (Aug 20, 2012)

Deathspout.. lol.. that trail does suck. Usually an icy traffic jam just to get over to Heaven's Gate.

Lower FIS and Lower Antelope are best skiied either right before lunch or last run of the day. Those trails are tiring enough as it is without the uphill.

Then again Sugarbush, Mt Ellen, and MRG are such great places to ski this is really nitpicking


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## thetrailboss (Aug 20, 2012)

bdfreetuna said:


> Then again Sugarbush, Mt Ellen, and MRG are such great places to ski this is really nitpicking



+ 1.


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## riverc0il (Aug 20, 2012)

I hadn't made the connection before but it seems like Big Link at Cannon and Downspout at Bush have a lot in common. Spout is a little longer and Big Link steeper, but both are just connection trails between a high speed unload station and a fixed grip summit lift. It really shows the genius of a layout like Whiteface where the Facelift flows right into the summit lift.


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## ALLSKIING (Aug 21, 2012)

bdfreetuna said:


> Then again Sugarbush, Mt Ellen, and MRG are such great places to ski this is really nitpicking





thetrailboss said:


> + 1.


+2


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## MadPadraic (Aug 24, 2012)

I willfully want to ride Bypass. Middle Cannon broke one of my bones once, and I now avoid it.

My current least favorite trail is birds of prey.


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