# Another Snow Tire Question



## wa-loaf (Dec 15, 2009)

So the standard tire size for my Outback is 225/60R 16. Tire Rack has as an alternate size 215/60R 16, which is cool as slightly narrower is good for snows (they'd go on 16" steel rims). I also called around a little for quotes and was told if I want to go with 215's I should get 215/*65R* tires to keep the same height ratio.

Can any of you tell me what would be correct?


----------



## Marc (Dec 15, 2009)

Well, 60% of 225 is 135, 65% of 215 is 139.75 and 60% of 215 is 129.  So you'd be a little bit closer to the stock overall diameter at 215/65.  But if you went with 215/60 your indicated speed will be slightly higher than your actual speed and your indicated mileage will be slightly higher than your actual mileage.

To be honest, I don't think the Outback really needs 215.  With its ground clearance and AWD, you'd do just fine with 225.


----------



## Geoff (Dec 15, 2009)

Google on "tire calculator".   

http://www.miata.net/garage/tirecalc.html

Says, "Speedometer reading with non-stock tires is 1.4% too slow.   When your speedo reads 60 mph, you are actually traveling at 60.8 mph"

On most cars, the speedo reads a little low anyways so you are just fine going a little narrower.   The tires are probably slightly cheaper.  You float less on slush.   The speedo difference is inconsequential.


----------



## bvibert (Dec 15, 2009)

wa-loaf said:


> So the standard tire size for my Outback is 225/60R 16. Tire Rack has as an alternate size 215/60R 16, which is cool as slightly narrower is good for snows (they'd go on 16" steel rims). I also called around a little for quotes and was told if I want to go with 215's I should get 215/*65R* tires to keep the same height ratio.
> 
> Can any of you tell me what would be correct?



I wouldn't worry about it, buy which ever is cheaper.


----------



## wa-loaf (Dec 15, 2009)

Yeah, I only went down this road because they didn't have one of the tires I was interested in at the stock size and noticed the 215's were a little cheaper.


----------



## Puck it (Dec 15, 2009)

No a big of enough difference to worry about.  Go with the cheaper ones.


----------



## wa-loaf (Dec 15, 2009)

One more Question. Those of you who've got a mounted wheelset from TireRack, what's the usual going rate for putting them on the car and is an alignment always necessary?


----------



## bvibert (Dec 15, 2009)

I have no idea what the going rate is, since I do it myself.  An alignment should never be necessary when just changing tires.  The only time I'd ever get an alignment is after changing suspension components that would affect the alignment.


----------



## Sky (Dec 15, 2009)

wa-loaf said:


> One more Question. Those of you who've got a mounted wheelset from TireRack, what's the usual going rate for putting them on the car and is an alignment always necessary?



First off...I should keep my pie-hole shut.  With that in mind.  :>   

No input on cost to have someone else do it.

Alignment...I'd recommend one if you haven't had one.  It would be a shame to burn through nice new snows because of an alignment issue.  As for "need"...I don't think so.


----------



## Puck it (Dec 15, 2009)

bvibert said:


> I have no idea what the going rate is, since I do it myself. An alignment should never be necessary when just changing tires. The only time I'd ever get an alignment is after changing suspension components that would affect the alignment.


 
$25 per tire is the going rate thru Tirerack installers.  Yes get an alignment if it has not been done in a while.


----------



## bvibert (Dec 15, 2009)

Why get an alignment if it hasn't been done in a while?  If a suspension component has worn out enough to affect the alignment then it should be replaced, then get the alignment.


----------



## wa-loaf (Dec 15, 2009)

Last alignment was done in the Spring. Car tracks fine, no wobbles on the highway.


----------



## billski (Dec 15, 2009)

Puck it said:


> $25 per tire is the going rate thru Tirerack installers. Yes get an alignment if it has not been done in a while.


 
Let me play with Puckit's comments to explain why I do it myself. I know you didn't ask.... 

It takes me one hour per car using the tire jack that comes with the car. I can also put the tire on when I want to. I'd probably be waiting around an hour to get the tires mounted.

I've got 3 cars to do now!

Remember, you'll have to take them off in the spring, so it's a $200 full season cost. I'll use that on lift tickets, gas, tolls. 

If money is no object, go for it. I doubt you'll save any time, but you won't have grease and grit on your hands!


----------



## Sky (Dec 15, 2009)

bvibert said:


> Why get an alignment if it hasn't been done in a while?  If a suspension component has worn out enough to affect the alignment then it should be replaced, then get the alignment.



Pot holes, curb hits, unknown suspension wear.  Don't know until it's checked.


----------



## mondeo (Dec 15, 2009)

Puck it said:


> $25 per tire is the going rate thru Tirerack installers.  Yes get an alignment if it has not been done in a while.


$25 per is closer to what I'm paying for mounting and balancing. $7 per corner for changing wheels.


----------



## Puck it (Dec 15, 2009)

mondeo said:


> $25 per is closer to what I'm paying for mounting and balancing. $7 per corner for changing wheels.



Are they mounted all ready?  I did not see that.


----------



## Puck it (Dec 15, 2009)

wa-loaf said:


> Last alignment was done in the Spring. Car tracks fine, no wobbles on the highway.



Should be fine.  Always get an alignment with new shoes if over a year.  There are 2 or 3 adjustments per wheel.


----------



## bvibert (Dec 15, 2009)

Puck it said:


> Are they mounted all ready?  I did not see that.



Yes mounted already:



wa-loaf said:


> Those of you who've got a *mounted wheelset* from TireRack, what's the usual going rate for putting them on the car


----------



## wa-loaf (Dec 15, 2009)

Prices aren't too far off, but I think TireRack is going to win this one. Wish I could just pick them up somewhere for the TireRack price and not pay the $80 shipping.


----------



## WWF-VT (Dec 15, 2009)

I get my tires done at DirectTire in the Boston area.  When you buy snow tires the mounting and balancing is included with the price of the tires.  You also get no cost changeover.


----------



## tjf67 (Dec 15, 2009)

bvibert said:


> Why get an alignment if it hasn't been done in a while?  If a suspension component has worn out enough to affect the alignment then it should be replaced, then get the alignment.



Because they have money to waste.  Come on they are putting snow tires on all wheel drive vehicles.  

Oh yeah make sure you get the rear wheels aligned while you are at it.


----------



## mondeo (Dec 15, 2009)

tjf67 said:


> Because they have money to waste.  Come on they are putting snow tires on all wheel drive vehicles.
> 
> Oh yeah make sure you get the rear wheels aligned while you are at it.


Because that AWD helps soooo much outside of not getting stuck.

I'd rather have my old FWD car in snow than my current AWD car.


----------



## tjf67 (Dec 15, 2009)

mondeo said:


> Because that AWD helps soooo much outside of not getting stuck.
> 
> I'd rather have my old FWD car in snow than my current AWD car.




Excuse me but what else are you looking for other than not getting stuck.


----------



## mondeo (Dec 15, 2009)

tjf67 said:


> Excuse me but what else are you looking for other than not getting stuck.


Not driving off the road in the first place is nice.


----------



## tjf67 (Dec 15, 2009)

mondeo said:


> Not driving off the road in the first place is nice.




I guess I just slow down when the roads get slick.   :-o


----------



## Geoff (Dec 15, 2009)

The tire center at a BJ's Wholesale gets $16.00 (member price) for a tire rotation or swapping on pre-mounted snow tires.


----------



## mondeo (Dec 15, 2009)

tjf67 said:


> I guess I just slow down when the roads get slick.   :-o


So do I. Slick just happens a lot less.

Plus snows only cost me the cost of the wheels. I'm putting miles on tires anyways, might as well have the right ones for the conditions. Tires are by far the most significant safety feature on the car. Good tires ensure I can stop faster than the guy in front of me and make conditions surprise me a lot less.


----------



## tjf67 (Dec 15, 2009)

mondeo said:


> So do I. Slick just happens a lot less.
> 
> Plus snows only cost me the cost of the wheels. I'm putting miles on tires anyways, might as well have the right ones for the conditions. Tires are by far the most significant safety feature on the car. Good tires ensure I can stop faster than the guy in front of me and make conditions surprise me a lot less.




I will disagree with you.  The most significant safety feature on a vehicle is the person holding the steering wheel.   If you feel more comfortable with snows I say have at it.  For me I consider them a waste of money.


----------



## wa-loaf (Dec 15, 2009)

tjf67 said:


> I guess I just slow down when the roads get slick.   :-o



You sound like those guys who refuse to sharpen the edges on their skis. I grew up Maine driving around in the snow on bald tires. Just because I can do it doesn't make it cool. I'd rather add as much safety as I can especially since I've got 2 little kids to look out for. 

So have fun on your smug bald tires.


----------



## tjf67 (Dec 15, 2009)

wa-loaf said:


> You sound like those guys who refuse to sharpen the edges on their skis. I grew up Maine driving around in the snow on bald tires. Just because I can do it doesn't make it cool. I'd rather add as much safety as I can especially since I've got 2 little kids to look out for.
> 
> So have fun on your smug bald tires.



My edges are plenty sharpe.  My tires have plenty of tread.  You do what you think you need tot to keep your rug rats safe.  Thanks for playing smuggy smuggerson


----------



## mondeo (Dec 15, 2009)

tjf67 said:


> I will disagree with you.  The most significant safety feature on a vehicle is the person holding the steering wheel.   If you feel more comfortable with snows I say have at it.  For me I consider them a waste of money.


A person is not on a car.

Is it possible for you to get any more arrogant? You don't think they're worth it, fine. We're not the ones calling people that don't agree with us idiots.


----------



## wa-loaf (Dec 15, 2009)

tjf67 said:


> My edges are plenty sharpe.  My tires have plenty of tread.  You do what you think you need tot to keep your rug rats safe.  Thanks for playing smuggy smuggerson



Thanks for being a dick. TOOL.


----------



## mondeo (Dec 15, 2009)

tjf67 said:


> My edges are plenty sharpe.  My tires have plenty of tread.  You do what you think you need tot to keep your rug rats safe.  Thanks for playing smuggy smuggerson


----------



## tjf67 (Dec 15, 2009)

mondeo said:


> A person is not on a car.
> 
> Is it possible for you to get any more arrogant? You don't think they're worth it, fine. We're not the ones calling people that don't agree with us idiots.





Where did I call you an idiot?   Me arrogant, you may want to look in the mirror.  :blink:


----------



## mondeo (Dec 15, 2009)

tjf67 said:


> Where did I call you an idiot?   Me arrogant, you may want to look in the mirror.  :blink:


So what is this, then?


tjf67 said:


> Because they have money to waste.  Come on they are putting snow tires on all wheel drive vehicles.
> 
> Oh yeah make sure you get the rear wheels aligned while you are at it.


You didn't use the word, but the statement was pretty clear. You're smart, we're all dumb.


----------



## tjf67 (Dec 15, 2009)

wa-loaf said:


> Thanks for being a dick. TOOL.




A dick tool? Is that something I put on my tires to get better traction so when I go to maine with my two kids they are safer?  

:x


----------



## tjf67 (Dec 15, 2009)

mondeo said:


> So what is this, then?
> 
> You didn't use the word, but the statement was pretty clear. You're smart, we're all dumb.



Me smart=no  you dumb= idont know


----------



## tjf67 (Dec 15, 2009)

tjf67 said:


> Me smart=no  you dumb= idont know




Oh Mondi do you get your back tires aligned?


----------



## billski (Dec 15, 2009)

Oh please dear Ullr, let it snow..


----------



## wa-loaf (Dec 15, 2009)

tjf67 said:


> A dick tool? Is that something I put on my tires to get better traction so when I go to maine with my two kids they are safer?
> 
> :x



This was a thread to get some advice on fitting snow tires. You are the one who came wading into the conversation preaching the coolness of not having snow tires. So either you are trolling or unaware of your smugness. Either way it makes you a tool. So please take this part of the conversation to your own thread: http://forums.alpinezone.com/showthread.php?p=489384#post489384


----------



## 2knees (Dec 15, 2009)

you guys realize what/who you're even arguing with?


----------



## wa-loaf (Dec 15, 2009)

2knees said:


> you guys realize what/who you're even arguing with?


----------



## bvibert (Dec 15, 2009)

wa-loaf said:


> You sound like those guys who refuse to sharpen the edges on their skis.



Hey, I resemble that remark! :angry:

Except I have snow tires on my car...


----------



## tjf67 (Dec 16, 2009)

2knees said:


> you guys realize what/who you're even arguing with?



I like that toilet bowl man.  I am pulling it off of here and going to use it on my face book page.

Thanks


----------



## Greg (Dec 16, 2009)

I don't get the recurring toilet bowel comment.


----------



## Marc (Dec 16, 2009)

wa-loaf said:


> You sound like those guys who refuse to sharpen the edges on their skis. I grew up Maine driving around in the snow on bald tires. Just because I can do it doesn't make it cool. I'd rather add as much safety as I can especially since I've got 2 little kids to look out for.
> 
> So have fun on your smug bald tires.



I don't refuse, I'm just lazy.  There's a difference.

Besides which I have Austin constantly telling me if I'm skiing something that needs sharp edges I should be skiing something else.


----------



## Greg (Dec 16, 2009)

Marc said:


> ..if I'm skiing something that needs sharp edges I should be skiing something else.



Yep.


----------



## dmc (Dec 16, 2009)

Greg said:


> I don't get the recurring toilet bowel comment.



Something to do with his receding hair line?


----------



## wa-loaf (Dec 16, 2009)

Greg said:


> I don't get the recurring toilet bowel comment.



nschat thing


----------



## Greg (Dec 16, 2009)

wa-loaf said:


> nschat thing



Oh....I get it now. I guess that's supposed to be some big insult?


----------



## wa-loaf (Dec 16, 2009)

Greg said:


> Oh....I get it now. I guess that's supposed to be some big insult?



Only in this guys mind:


----------



## dmc (Dec 16, 2009)

Greg said:


> Oh....I get it now. I guess that's supposed to be some big insult?



   banned from the place banned people go...


----------



## dmc (Dec 16, 2009)

2knees said:


>








What hump?


----------

