# Learn any lessons from this winter?



## bdfreetuna (Mar 22, 2016)

I for one will make a point of it to be more flexible in my schedule and when the going is relatively good, get going. We'll see how that works out.

Also got a refresher on skiing icy conditions and boilerplate. As well as mid-season mashed potatoes and really all kinds of variable conditions.

Learned to take it ease with the vehicle after totaling my Impreza. Can't say I regret that a lot driving in a 10x better vehicle now though.

Learned a bit more about weather even though I hope those lessons don't all apply again next season.

Probably going to be booking a trip or two out west each year from now on too.

Difficult times are ideally learning experiences. What have you got?


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## tumbler (Mar 22, 2016)

Make the best of it and have fun!


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## 4aprice (Mar 22, 2016)

We learned that our small home mountain has a really good snowmaking system and when used properly can make things decent in a hurry ,that as long as we're here we will support them, but most of all we learned our desire to go west for good is growing by the year.  Getting tired of the boiler plate, Pocono Pavement with sugar, cloudy and most of all COLD days.  

Alex

Lake Hopatcong, NJ


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## Not Sure (Mar 22, 2016)

Well tuned skis are important part of preventing injuries.


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## JDMRoma (Mar 22, 2016)

Don't pee behind ski patrol shacks at Cannon. 




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## manhattanskier (Mar 22, 2016)

Don't let your friends drink so much that they miss the whole second day of skiing on a two day trip ;-)


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## fcksummer (Mar 22, 2016)

Neither of my thumbs can support my full body weight, especially not individually.


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## bdfreetuna (Mar 22, 2016)

Skiing with the DIN maxed out = less minor injuries. As for major injuries only time will tell.


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## SkiFanE (Mar 22, 2016)

That you can make it through an entire season with one quick edge sharpening, while you wait and wait and wait for conditions to improve before you bother with a full wax and tune.  Generally if skiing requires sharp edges, I'll quit early. Even with this year there were only 2 days that bad. SR snowmaking rocks.


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## Not Sure (Mar 22, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> Skiing with the DIN maxed out = less minor injuries. As for major injuries only time will tell.



You have some interesting theories, Ski length makes a difference also . All DIN's are not equal. I'd rather buy a high DIN binding and have a low setting , gives you some room for spring weakening. 
I had the same DIN settings on both skis this year . Crashed and one heel ejected and the other stayed put and broke a ski in half ? 
The setting windows are pretty small and it's easy to see how one vs other ski would be different. 

New AZ Charity Go Fund Me . Tuna ACL fund.


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## jaytrem (Mar 22, 2016)

Teaching 2 4-year-olds how to ski is an excellent workout.


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## Pez (Mar 22, 2016)

Just go. If you wait for perfect conditions you'll be waiting for a while.  


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## bdfreetuna (Mar 22, 2016)

I actually have a half busted knee right now that I think started up on 2 failed attempts to stick the landing of Vista Glade rock drop. Both involving double ejects. Since then I tightened it up and at least I haven't injured it more. Been wearing knee braces most days out since then (not that I've had a big number of days out this season).

SkiFanE I haven't used anything more than Swix wax since my last tune 3 years ago... the same time I got my edges last sharpened. That's the least of my skis problems though... major scratches in the base, big chips off the top layer, only one ski brake works. Been riding out rock skis for the last few years.

That said I generally prefer, or at least have gotten used to, skis that don't have fresh edges. I like them a little detuned anyway for skiing narrow woods.

Probably getting some Atomic Vantage 90 CTI this summer.


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## abc (Mar 22, 2016)

Lessons learned? I'm so smart that I've had a fabulous season as everybody else moan about the weather! :evil:

No wasted coupons. Pass well used, far beyond breaking even. But only ONE powder day (out of 20 so far)

The lesson I don't need to learn this season (because I learned them long ago already)? If you set your expectation low enough, you'll never be disappointed.

Heading to Squaw and Mammoth Friday! 

[EDIT] Oh yeah, got new skis that cut ice like it's butter. Firm day == happy day!


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## Not Sure (Mar 22, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> I actually have a half busted knee right now that I think started up on 2 failed attempts to stick the landing of Vista Glade rock drop. Both involving double ejects. Since then I tightened it up and at least I haven't injured it more. Been wearing knee braces most days out since then (not that I've had a big number of days out this season).
> 
> 
> Probably getting some Dynastar Powertrack 89's this summer.



The energy gets dissipated somewhere , skis ,legs . Old Rossi freestyles , ripped heels out of skis , Helicoiled and even they started to destroy the cores.


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## jaysunn (Mar 22, 2016)

Sharp edges, Almost like hockey skates, if any hockey players on here can contest. If you have dull skates or poorly tied knots, it will suck. So tight Dins, sharp edges this season was what I liked.  Same for my Snowboard, sharp magnatraction board out performed my powda 165W hovercraft. 

Pray for next season,


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## ss20 (Mar 22, 2016)

jaytrem said:


> Teaching 2 4-year-olds how to ski is an excellent workout.



Try teaching 6 or 7 in a lesson :-o



First, I learned A LOT about snowmaking.  Too much, really.  
Second, there is a direct correlation to the number of friends I ski with.  Crappy season=join me!  Great season=stay away!


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## yeggous (Mar 22, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> Skiing with the DIN maxed out = less minor injuries. As for major injuries only time will tell.



I'd expect the exact opposite. I dropped my DIN after getting hit from behind and hurting my ankle. Been very happy since. Only crank it up for the Vertical Challenge.


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## bdfreetuna (Mar 22, 2016)

Well I only had the DIN on like 7 and increased it to 10.. so it's not super high. The bindings only go to 11.

It became annoying to keep losing skis on every rock drop, or squirrely rabbit hole if I don't ski it just right, or time I sink into some heavy snow. I would say I had my bindings *too low*, not that I cranked them up extremely high.


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## Edd (Mar 22, 2016)

Have a set of carvers in the quiver. I feel dumb going a few years without one.


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## dlague (Mar 22, 2016)

4aprice said:


> but most of all we learned our desire to go west for good is growing by the year.  Getting tired of the boiler plate



Been there now doing that! CO in two weeks for the long term!

What I learned was take what the mountain gives you and have fun!  Oh wait that is what I always say!  I actually enjoyed our skiing days so far.  A couple were not that great but we found something fun to ski on those days too.


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## steamboat1 (Mar 22, 2016)

Not a thing.


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## Not Sure (Mar 23, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> Well I only had the DIN on like 7 and increased it to 10.. so it's not super high. The bindings only go to 11.
> 
> It became annoying to keep losing skis on every rock drop, or squirrely rabbit hole if I don't ski it just right, or time I sink into some heavy snow. I would say I had my bindings *too low*, not that I cranked them up extremely high.



Time for new bindings...You may have some internal problem , wear/tear . That problem really wrecks your concentration/confidence  when your skiing hard.


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## Smellytele (Mar 23, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> Well I only had the DIN on like 7 and increased it to 10.. so it's not super high. The bindings only go to 11.
> 
> It became annoying to keep losing skis on every rock drop, or squirrely rabbit hole if I don't ski it just right, or time I sink into some heavy snow. I would say I had my bindings *too low*, not that I cranked them up extremely high.



when you need that extra push over the cliff
these go to 11...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KOO5S4vxi0o


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## bdfreetuna (Mar 23, 2016)

Siliconebobsquarepants said:


> Time for new bindings...You may have some internal problem , wear/tear . That problem really wrecks your concentration/confidence  when your skiing hard.



Maybe but they haven't released once (and I've only taken one spill) since I turned them up. These skis / bindings will only be used next year onward on days when I expect to ski rocks.


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## yeggous (Mar 23, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> Maybe but they haven't released once (and I've only taken one spill) since I turned them up. These skis / bindings will only be used next year onward on days when I expect to ski rocks.



I have mixed emotions on bindings. I totally understand your perspective of why buy a better binding if they're advertised as going up to 11 as I'll never ski an 11 DIN. But the higher DIN bindings just feel more reassuring. I never know how much of a ski's performance can actually be credited to a binding. I generally just get the cheapest 12-13 DIN that I can find and assume everything else is the same. Like the driver toe piece: does it really matter?


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## tnt1234 (Mar 23, 2016)

I learned that the Jay Cloud is really a thing...one of the few good days I had this year was at Jay - staying in Stowe, and we decided in the morning to give Jay a shot.  They had received considerably more snow the night before than stowe, despite being just an hour north.

I also learned that when chasing storms, don't book the room until the day you are heading to the mountain.  Same trip we booked a room for tremblant - non refundable - and let the next morning.  Weather while driving told us we were making a mistake, and we should have stayed put, but we had the room. 

Also learned - or re-learned because I've known this - how fun ANY mountain can be with a lot of snow.  Probably the best day I had this year was Blue in PA after that big dump.  

OK - one more trip to ME to learn a few more lessons....hope I learn limited terrain at Sugarloaf is still tons of fun with the family....


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## BenedictGomez (Mar 23, 2016)

I learned that a ski season can be so bad that it forces you to take a week's vacation and go > 1,000 miles from home.


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## Domeskier (Mar 23, 2016)

I would not have known this season sucked but for the existence of the internet.  I guess I am easy to please.


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## njdiver85 (Mar 23, 2016)

I learned that a first-time snow tire purchase is 100% correlated with a lack of snow in which to use them!


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## benski (Mar 23, 2016)

yeggous said:


> I have mixed emotions on bindings. I totally understand your perspective of why buy a better binding if they're advertised as going up to 11 as I'll never ski an 11 DIN. But the higher DIN bindings just feel more reassuring. I never know how much of a ski's performance can actually be credited to a binding. I generally just get the cheapest 12-13 DIN that I can find and assume everything else is the same. Like the driver toe piece: does it really matter?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using AlpineZone mobile app



I have heard it is not good for the binding to be set to the maximum din. I guess over time is puts too much pressure on a spring or something.


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## ChicoKat (Mar 23, 2016)

Everything looks like an epic snow dump in ski country 7 days out.


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## Bumpsis (Mar 23, 2016)

I've learned that "spring conditions" means skiing wet ice. Also, wet ice doesn't corn up regardless of how many freeze thaws it goes through.


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## Abubob (Mar 23, 2016)

It's like my Dad used to say, "Always ..." wait that's not it

"Never ..." uhm.

Nevermind.


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## yeggous (Mar 23, 2016)

benski said:


> I have heard it is not good for the binding to be set to the maximum din. I guess over time is puts too much pressure on a spring or something.



I have heard the same. I'm just not sure whether I should believe it. I set my 12 DIN at 8 or 9.


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## BenedictGomez (Mar 23, 2016)

benski said:


> I have heard it is not good for the binding to be set to the maximum din.



What would be the point anyway?   I think DIN is overrated.  I'm actually slightly, "under DIN'ed" on my skis, and it would take a spectacular crash for my skis to release.


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## Cannonball (Mar 23, 2016)

Bumpsis said:


> I've learned that "spring conditions" means skiing wet ice. Also, wet ice doesn't corn up regardless of how many freeze thaws it goes through.



^This!  However, if wet ice gets enough traffic the shavings can slightly resemble corn.  Maybe a new conditions designation for "Shave Ice"?


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## BenedictGomez (Mar 23, 2016)

I'm at that awkward stage where I'm no longer young, but I'm not yet old, so I've newly learned that what I've heard Warren Miller say all these years is correct, _ "If you don't do it this year, you'll be another older when you do"_.


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## Smellytele (Mar 23, 2016)

BenedictGomez said:


> I'm at that awkward stage where I'm no longer young, but I'm not yet old, so I've newly learned that what I've heard Warren Miller say all these years is correct, _ "If you don't do it this year, you'll be another older when you do"_.



Also "_if you ski better now than you did when you were young  - you didn't ski very well when you were young_".


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## deadheadskier (Mar 23, 2016)

BenedictGomez said:


> What would be the point anyway?   I think DIN is overrated.  I'm actually slightly, "under DIN'ed" on my skis, and it would take a spectacular crash for my skis to release.



Disagree

I've got three sets of skis with 13+ Din range.  Charts recommend 8-9 for my size and ability.  If I run that DIN on any of those bindings, I will walk out of them several times a year.  I set to 10-11 range and I avoid prereleases, but they still release when I want them to.


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## bdfreetuna (Mar 23, 2016)

Looks like we can conclude not all bindings are the same, nor are skiers... and basically set your bindings so your skis only release when you want them too. There is no magic number.

Agree "wet ice" should be a new term and ski areas should start using it on their snow reports. Then again we don't usually see this much "wet ice" in a season.


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## 4aprice (Mar 23, 2016)

BenedictGomez said:


> I learned that a ski season can be so bad that it forces you to take a week's vacation and go > 1,000 miles from home.



I think you will learn that even when the skiing in the east is good it's worth going > 1000 miles to get to the Rocky Mountains.

Alex

Lake Hopatcong, NJ


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## Puck it (Mar 23, 2016)

I learned do not Superman, tuck and roll!!!!!!


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## Hawkshot99 (Mar 23, 2016)

Don't bother listening to people who haven't actually been skiing at the mtns. I have been told by many people how its not even worth going this year. I have 35 days or so this season, and I would say 2 of them I refretted having put in the effort to go.


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## fbrissette (Mar 23, 2016)

deadheadskier said:


> Disagree
> 
> I've got three sets of skis with 13+ Din range.  Charts recommend 8-9 for my size and ability.  If I run that DIN on any of those bindings, I will walk out of them several times a year.  I set to 10-11 range and I avoid prereleases, but they still release when I want them to.



I'd be curious as to your weight and boot sole length.  I did not think you could get a DIN of 9 based on standard charts.


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## SIKSKIER (Mar 23, 2016)

I learned that no matter how many times  by many many members you tell somebody its going to rain yet they insist they will be skiing powder so "I'll post pics from there",it doesn't sink in.Why do we bother?


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## fbrissette (Mar 23, 2016)

benski said:


> I have heard it is not good for the binding to be set to the maximum din. I guess over time is puts too much pressure on a spring or something.



I've heard the same thing and it makes little physical sense.

As to the choice of a binding, if you ski above recommended DIN settings, binding characteristics (e.g. elastic travel, anti-friction mechanisms) become way more important than absolute DIN value.


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## deadheadskier (Mar 23, 2016)

fbrissette said:


> I'd be curious as to your weight and boot sole length.  I did not think you could get a DIN of 9 based on standard charts.



5'8" 200# and wear a 26.5.  I select 3+ for ability at the chart.  Always come back set in the 8-9 range no matter the shop. I then manually adjust to 10. If I keep having prerelease problems I raise to 11.  Haven't had to go beyond that.


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## Puck it (Mar 23, 2016)

deadheadskier said:


> 5'8" 200# and wear a 26.5.  I select 3+ for ability at the chart.  Always come back set in the 8-9 range no matter the shop. I then manually adjust to 10. If I keep having prerelease problems I raise to 11.  Haven't had to go beyond that.


I have all of mine set to 11 and still had a prerelease on one ski that caused a broken shoulder.


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## 57stevey (Mar 23, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> I for one will make a point of it to be more flexible in my schedule and when the going is relatively good, get going.



This. My best day was on a sketchy forecast day when I wasn't really pumped to go and tickets were full price, and it turned into a semi-private mini-pow day at Mittersill.


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## Cannonball (Mar 23, 2016)

deadheadskier said:


> 5'8" 200# and wear a 26.5.  I select 3+ for ability at the chart.  Always come back set in the 8-9 range no matter the shop. I then manually adjust to 10. If I keep having prerelease problems I raise to 11.  Haven't had to go beyond that.





Puck it said:


> I have all of mine set to 11 and still had a prerelease on one ski that caused a broken shoulder.



You guys both ski with a LOT of power.  Puckit, I've seen you prerelease many times.  I agree with BG that DIN is often overrated and used as a bragging point.  I keep mine pretty low because I tend to ski 'light'.  But it has to be case by case.  Like anything, you learn your own preference and needs pretty quickly and that is always going to be a much better indication than some generalized guidance.


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## witch hobble (Mar 23, 2016)

deadheadskier said:


> 5'8" 200# and wear a 26.5.  I select 3+ for ability at the chart.  Always come back set in the 8-9 range no matter the shop. I then manually adjust to 10. If I keep having prerelease problems I raise to 11.  Haven't had to go beyond that.


Does the chart really have a 3+ these days?  Why would they not just call it 4?


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## andrec10 (Mar 23, 2016)

Mother nature is a BITCH! LOL...


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## crank (Mar 23, 2016)

I learned that Aspen is really expensive and that 25 years is way too long between trips to Jackson Hole.


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## fcksummer (Mar 23, 2016)

Puck it said:


> I learned do not Superman, tuck and roll!!!!!!



Fuck the tuck and roll. I tucked my good thumb right into my sternum...landed directly on it. Knocked the wind out of myself, broke my cell phone, had severe chest pains for about a week (which drastically slowed my beer drinking time) and pretty sure my formally good thumb is broke. :angry:


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## Not Sure (Mar 23, 2016)

fcksummer said:


> Fuck the tuck and roll. I tucked my good thumb right into my sternum...landed directly on it. Knocked the wind out of myself, broke my cell phone, had severe chest pains for about a week (which drastically slowed my beer drinking time) and pretty sure my formally good thumb is broke. :angry:



Or worse , UCL? , was told I had a short window when I had mine done.


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## dlague (Mar 23, 2016)

yeggous said:


> I have heard the same. I'm just not sure whether I should believe it. I set my 12 DIN at 8 or 9.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using AlpineZone mobile app



+1


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## abc (Mar 23, 2016)

Smellytele said:


> Also "_if you ski better now than you did when you were young  - you didn't ski very well when you were young_".


How many can say they "ski very well when young"? How "well" could that be? Unless you're a former Olympian, that is.


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## ss20 (Mar 23, 2016)

deadheadskier said:


> 5'8" 200# and wear a 26.5.  I select 3+ for ability at the chart.  Always come back set in the 8-9 range no matter the shop. I then manually adjust to 10. If I keep having prerelease problems I raise to 11.  Haven't had to go beyond that.



Can I ask you what skis you have?  Not for the bindings or anything... you're the _exact_ same height and weight as me.  What's skied good for you?


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## catskillman (Mar 23, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> I for one will make a point of it to be more flexible in my schedule and when the going is relatively good, get going. We'll see how that works out.
> 
> Also got a refresher on skiing icy conditions and boilerplate. As well as mid-season mashed potatoes and really all kinds of variable conditions.
> 
> ...



Yeah - stay clear of BlueBoy!!!!!


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## Not Sure (Mar 23, 2016)

abc said:


> How many can say they "ski very well when young"? How "well" could that be? Unless you're a former Olympian, that is.



One of my neighborhood friends father sent him to freestyle camp when he was 12, Everyone of my friends became a better skier just trying to keep up with him.


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## Zand (Mar 23, 2016)

I learned to stop "waiting for the good part of winter" and ski what's available at any given time. I've gotten a grand total of 7 days this winter because I waited around early season for it to get better. Suddenly it's March and I have a grand total of 3 days. As I was driving up to Wachusett yesterday just to ski for one more hour after work, I regretted all the times I was going to go this winter but said "eh I'll just go next week" and now there is no next week. Hoping to get up to Killington once or twice now but definitely made some wrong choices this winter.

I think the most telling thing that my brain was trying to show me that I was going to regret not going all winter was that I was purposely avoiding reading and posting here so that I wouldn't see everyone else having fun and feel worse about not going. Maybe it would've motivated me to go if I did come on here but live and learn I guess.


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## deadheadskier (Mar 23, 2016)

witch hobble said:


> Does the chart really have a 3+ these days?  Why would they not just call it 4?



I've never seen one that has 3+ written on the slip.  I was just told long ago that the 3 settings really doesn't cover an aggressive skier.  So, for years a shop has just put a plus next to the 3 and circled it. 

I'm not claiming to be Highwaystar, I just know that a 9 for my height, weight and how I ski has never been a high enough DIN to prevent frequent pre-releases.


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## machski (Mar 24, 2016)

That I'm very happy to call myself a Sunday River skier.  Oh wait, I learned that 2.5 decades ago.


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## Vortex (Mar 24, 2016)

machski said:


> That I'm very happy to call myself a Sunday River skier.  Oh wait, I learned that 2.5 decades ago.



I already  knew In  bad weather year, Sunday river is the place to be.


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## witch hobble (Mar 24, 2016)

deadheadskier said:


> I've never seen one that has 3+ written on the slip.  I was just told long ago that the 3 settings really doesn't cover an aggressive skier.  So, for years a shop has just put a plus next to the 3 and circled it. I'm not claiming to be Highwaystar, I just know that a 9 for my height, weight and how I ski has never been a high enough DIN to prevent frequent pre-releases.


I thought I was gonna learn something there. Highest din setting is for tall, heavy expert skier with small feet.


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## Rushski (Mar 24, 2016)

Definitely learned that I'm better off on my fairly wide all-mountain skis, even in firm conditions.

Just feel more stable on my 90 underfoot skis than I do on my carvers from quite a few years ago.  Truly feel more comfortable and therefore more confident which leads me to believe I'm skiing better on the wider planks.

Maybe getting back on the carvers a couple times and not being used to them has some bearing on this?


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## deadheadskier (Mar 24, 2016)

witch hobble said:


> I thought I was gonna learn something there. Highest din setting is for tall, heavy expert skier with small feet.



A ski shop guy like Hawkshot can confirm this for me, but I basically think the + just has them bump the Din up a Notch.


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## fbrissette (Mar 24, 2016)

deadheadskier said:


> I'm not claiming to be Highwaystar.



Nobody can be Highwaystar.  Not even Chuck Norris.


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## Hawkshot99 (Mar 24, 2016)

deadheadskier said:


> A ski shop guy like Hawkshot can confirm this for me, but I basically think the + just has them bump the Din up a Notch.



A 3+ is basically the same as a type 4 skier.  I dont know why they call it a 3+.  Doesnt neccisarily bump the Din a notch, it all depends on the chart and where you fall.

For me a type 3 is a 9.5 din, a type 3+ is a 11.


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## abc (Mar 24, 2016)

witch hobble said:


> I thought I was gonna learn something there. Highest din setting is for tall, heavy expert skier with small feet.


Why "small feet"?


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## Smellytele (Mar 24, 2016)

abc said:


> How many can say they "ski very well when young"? How "well" could that be? Unless you're a former Olympian, that is.



Young is relative. When Warren Miller said it he was talking about 20 something's


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## cdskier (Mar 24, 2016)

I've learned that many people apparently have much higher DIN settings than I do. I've been using 7 for years and never had a problem and always considered myself a somewhat aggressive skier (granted I'm not jumping off cliffs, etc).


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## deadheadskier (Mar 24, 2016)

abc said:


> Why "small feet"?



Physics.  Tall and heavy over a small platform (feet) results in greater pressure / torque than when you spread it out over a larger platform.


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## fbrissette (Mar 24, 2016)

abc said:


> Why "small feet"?



DIN scale is ultimately based (through empirical evidence) on bone strength and it's ability to resist forces.  For a given force at the toe, the torque at the leg is larger if the lever (boot length) is longer.   If you have the din setting identical on longer boots, the release force at the binding correspond to a higher torque at the leg and a higher likelihood of injury.


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## bdfreetuna (Mar 24, 2016)

That's why I only have mine set to 10 with size 12 feet being a 4++ skier. (kidding)

It was getting to the point the bindings were releasing way too much though. Maybe they were getting worn out. Not really great bindings in the first place, I don't think, just Rossignol Axiums that came with the ski.

Since this has turned into binding discussion thread anyway... and since I'm getting new skis for next season... does anyone want to give me reasons why I should pony up a bit more $ for fancy bindings? Is it really worth it if you're not racing?


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## yeggous (Mar 24, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> That's why I only have mine set to 10 with size 12 feet being a 4++ skier. (kidding)
> 
> Since this has turned into binding discussion thread anyway... and since I'm getting new skis for next season... does anyone want to give me reasons why I should pony up a bit more $ for fancy bindings? Is it really worth it if you're not racing?



Excellent question. Would love to have a discussion about this. I have been told it's about the width of the toe piece and mounting platform vs the width of the ski. Cheaper bindings tend to have a narrower platform that don't as readily transfer torque to a wider ski. Please correct me!


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## fbrissette (Mar 24, 2016)

cdskier said:


> I've learned that many people apparently have much higher DIN settings than I do. I've been using 7 for years and never had a problem and always considered myself a somewhat aggressive skier (granted I'm not jumping off cliffs, etc).



You should not read too much into that.   Final DIN setting is related to risk tolerance a lot more than skier ability.  For strong skiers, charts are a starting point to be adjusted on empirical experience.   Your choice of DIN is a balance between retention and injury risk.  I prefer to be conservative since I believe the risk of injury from an unwanted release to be much smaller than binding not releasing on a big fall.   Typically, on a 50-day season I will fall twice.   Once from an unwanted release, and a real one resulting in binding release. I'm happy with this balance.  I have a few friends who will not tolerate any unwanted release and who use real high DIN values.  They all have something in common however - ligament damage at some point.

If you are not experiencing unwanted releases, don't change it.


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## cdskier (Mar 24, 2016)

fbrissette said:


> If you are not experiencing unwanted releases, don't change it.



Yea, I have no plans to change it since I'm not having issues. My dad did have problems with pre-releasing on powder days with his powder skis a year or two ago. We didn't realize that due to his age the DIN charts say to use a lower DIN. We had it bumped back up and now he doesn't have issues anymore.


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## fbrissette (Mar 24, 2016)

bdfreetuna said:


> does anyone want to give me reasons why I should pony up a bit more $ for fancy bindings? Is it really worth it if you're not racing?



Typically, more expensive bindings have the following features:

1- stronger build  (they will last longer, no cheap plastics)
2- more elasticity at the toe and heel  (this would mean you could get away with a lower DIN thus reducing the risk of injury while reducing unwanted release - in other words, you would typically need more DINS on a cheap binding and still end up with more unwanted releases)
3- more releasing mode (more degrees of liberty).
4- better anti-friction mechanisms

To me, no 1 and 2 are the reasons where you should go for a high-quality binding.

Some real good deals on internet right now.


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## fbrissette (Mar 24, 2016)

cdskier said:


> Yea, I have no plans to change it since I'm not having issues. My dad did have problems with pre-releasing on powder days with his powder skis a year or two ago. We didn't realize that due to his age the DIN charts say to use a lower DIN. We had it bumped back up and now he doesn't have issues anymore.



Having just reached 50, I am well aware of this decrease in recommended DIN settings.  Interestingly enough, this is based on bone density that becomes lower as you get older.  Thus, older people are believed to be able to withstand less torque.

More recent research has showed that bone density become lower mostly because older folks become less active.   Hence, there is no real reason why an active 50 year old should reduce his DIN setting.


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## cdskier (Mar 24, 2016)

fbrissette said:


> Having just reached 50, I am well aware of this decrease in recommended DIN settings.  Interestingly enough, this is based on bone density that becomes lower as you get older.  Thus, older people are believed to be able to withstand less torque.
> 
> More recent research has showed that bone density become lower mostly because older folks become less active.   Hence, there is no real reason why an active 50 year old should reduce his DIN setting.



My dad is 65...he never really noticed the issue until he got his new powder skis though. His all mountain carvers were ok even with the lower DIN. My cousin used to work in ski shops so my dad mentioned the problem to him and the first thing he said was to raise the DIN because you ski more like a 45 year old than a 65 year old anyway. :smile:


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## bdfreetuna (Mar 24, 2016)

Thanks fbrissette. :beer:


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## Los (Mar 24, 2016)

I learned that it will be best to significantly lower my expectations each and every year going forward. As someone else on the board pointed out, if you set your expectations low enough, you'll never be disappointed.


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## Tin (Mar 24, 2016)

fbrissette said:


> Having just reached 50, I am well aware of this decrease in recommended DIN settings.  Interestingly enough, this is based on bone density that becomes lower as you get older.  Thus, older people are believed to be able to withstand less torque.
> 
> More recent research has showed that bone density become lower mostly because older folks become less active.   Hence, there is no real reason why an active 50 year old should reduce his DIN setting.



Does bone density really matter or is it soft tissue strength? Specifically the ligaments of the knee, as I think we have all heard more soft tissue knee injuries than breaks or fractures. 

I do agree that more activity is generally better. However, an interesting confound to this is medications. An issue I have, and I'm sure many older individuals have, is that certain medications can really compromise bone density (as simple as antacids) and can REALLY destroy ligaments (prednisone, antibiotics, cholesterol medications, etc). In the past year I have torn major ligaments in my thumb, elbow, and shoulder (that should have NEVER torn) because of the medications I'm on. 

Will staying active keep you healthy, absolutely. But there is a lot more than just activity level that goes into joint/bone strength and DIN settings IMO. Out of fear I keep mine set at 8, hopefully just low enough to save a knee but strong enough to withstand some heavy snow turns.


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## Bumpsis (Mar 24, 2016)

Tin said:


> Does bone density really matter or is it soft tissue strength? Specifically the ligaments of the knee, as I think we have all heard more soft tissue knee injuries than breaks or fractures.
> 
> I do agree that more activity is generally better. However, an interesting confound to this is medications. An issue I have, and I'm sure many older individuals have, is that certain medications can really compromise bone density (as simple as antacids) and can REALLY destroy ligaments (prednisone, antibiotics, cholesterol medications, etc). In the past year I have torn major ligaments in my thumb, elbow, and shoulder (that should have NEVER torn) because of the medications I'm on.
> 
> Will staying active keep you healthy, absolutely. But there is a lot more than just activity level that goes into joint/bone strength and DIN settings IMO. Out of fear I keep mine set at 8, hopefully just low enough to save a knee but strong enough to withstand some heavy snow turns.



Interesting point about the effects of meds on connective tissue (tendons, ligaments). A  microtear in a ligament can side line you for a long time and you don't even need to be all that old. I've been struggling with on and off issues with various tendon injuries ever since I hit my 48 year (which was a long time, at this point). An Achilles tendon tear can sideline you for 6 months or longer. 
I never injured any of my knee supporting ligaments (the same type of connective tissue), but I do fear it. So, I keep my DIN lower than the charts say it should be.

 I still love to ski fast and hard but much rather blow out of a binding than blow a tendon.
When buying a binding, I'll spend extra money for a higher quality and more travel before release. I'm a big fan of Look and happy to see that they decided to come back to the Pivot model and offer it in lower DIN settings. I'm a relative lightweight.
On the other hand, I just about never fall and can't remember when I actually did "pre"-released.


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## Tin (Mar 24, 2016)

Bumpsis said:


> Interesting point about the effects of meds on connective tissue (tendons, ligaments). A  microtear in a ligament can side line you for a long time and you don't even need to be all that old. I've been struggling with on and off issues with various tendon injuries ever since I hit my 48 year (which was a long time, at this point). An Achilles tendon tear can sideline you for 6 months or longer.



I'll take a break over a sprain any day. A broke ankle takes a few weeks to heal, a sprained can be felt for years after. 

An Achilles? Ouch! I think I might take an ACL and rebuild over Achilles. Just a nasty injury that scares me (ever since the scene in Pet Sematary when the baby slices the guy's when he gets out of bed).


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## drjeff (Mar 24, 2016)

Never got the whole DIN cranking thing!! I'm a big guy (6'3" pushing 240lbs with my ski gear on, 332mm boot sole length, 3+ level skier who skis everything and charges the hill more runs than not!!

I keep my DIN at shop recommended settings - an 8.5 currently, and haven't upped my shop set DIN in probably 20 years. I could probably count the number of pre releases over those 20 years - roughly 850 ski days, on 1 hand and still have a couple of fingers left.

I stand by the statement that if you exhibit proper technique at all times, you're not going to pre release, even in the most of extreme conditions short of super elite racers, super elite free skiers and super elite park skiers.

The other 99.8% of the ski world should just work on their technique a bit, all the while helping decrease the risk of injury!!


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## deadheadskier (Mar 24, 2016)

drjeff said:


> Never got the whole DIN cranking thing!! I'm a big guy (6'3" pushing 240lbs with my ski gear on, 332mm boot sole length, 3+ level skier who skis everything and charges the hill more runs than not!!
> 
> I keep my DIN at shop recommended settings - an 8.5 currently, and haven't upped my shop set DIN in probably 20 years. I could probably count the number of pre releases over those 20 years - roughly 850 ski days, on 1 hand and still have a couple of fingers left.
> 
> ...




This isn't some bravado thing that I put my bindings in the 10-11 range despite being a half foot shorter and weighing 30ish pounds less than you Doctor Jeff. 

I can count the number of pre-releases on one hand in a season if I leave it at 9. 

And your comment of " as long as you're exhibiting proper technique at all times you won't pre-release unless you're pro" wreaks a little snobbish to me.


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## jack97 (Mar 25, 2016)

DIN settings appear to have non linear step sizes or granularity given the factors for weight, height, sole length and the type of skier. I run it across a calculator just to get another set of data than the settings  from the shop

http://www.mechanicsofsport.com/skiing/equipment/bindings/din-calculator.html


That said, bindings have different designs, toe and heel pieces have more or less elastic travel. I have skied in the bumps or crud with bindings that have good elastic travel and I've pre released. A couple of years ago, I finally crank the dial upward and I haven't had a problem since.


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## Not Sure (Mar 25, 2016)

jack97 said:


> DIN settings appear to have non linear step sizes or granularity given the factors for weight, height, sole length and the type of skier. I run it across a calculator just to get another set of data than the settings  from the shop
> 
> http://www.mechanicsofsport.com/skiing/equipment/bindings/din-calculator.html
> 
> ...



Nice Calculator but has me as "Undefined"  3+ ,160lbs , 5'5",298mm. Ski with an 8 Din , no problems new bindings . Lots with old bindings. Boots also make a difference as mentioned. Also make sure you don't have any snow under your boots or stones imbedded in AFD . Not a problem for first runs but after a P break or lunch. Skis sit in sun snow melts and works in then ices up.


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## SIKSKIER (Mar 25, 2016)

I tend to lean towards the opposite of fbrissette.I much rather risk an injury not releasing than an unwanted release at high speed.I've known 2 expert skiers at Cannon that died from a prerelease.The last,Mark was a top racer and went into the tram cutback from Rocket at speed and his downhill ski released leaving him to head right into the trees.I'll err on the side on a non prerelease.


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## Edd (Mar 25, 2016)

Preferences clearly are influenced by experiences. I tore an ACL, I'm positive, because a binding did not release. I'm 175 lbs, 5' 11". I don't ski with a lot of power. When I hit bumps or trees, I try to ski with a light touch, which isn't right or wrong, just how I ski. The required DIN setting, I think, is much more complicated than it appears.


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## fbrissette (Mar 25, 2016)

SIKSKIER said:


> I tend to lean towards the opposite of fbrissette.I much rather risk an injury not releasing than an unwanted release at high speed.I've known 2 expert skiers at Cannon that died from a prerelease.The last,Mark was a top racer and went into the tram cutback from Rocket at speed and his downhill ski released leaving him to head right into the trees.I'll err on the side on a non prerelease.



It should always be a personal risk analysis. There is no right or wrong answer.  I don't ski at 60 mph close to trees.   However, when skiing Tucks (it's been a while), I cranked my bindings from 8.5 to 11.  

The few times I have done steep icy traverses in Europe above crevasses or rocks, I lock my dynafit bindings in (meaning they essentially cannot release).

At Jay, I stick to the steep and rocky runs, woods and backcountry. Relatively low speed, relatively high risk of hitting hidden rocks, stumps and branches. In such conditions, I feel more comfortable with a lower din setting.   It's all about risk perception.


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## Not Sure (Mar 25, 2016)

fbrissette said:


> However, when skiing Tucks (it's been a while), I cranked my bindings from 8.5 to 11.
> 
> The few times I have done steep icy traverses in Europe above crevasses or rocks, I lock my dynafit bindings in (meaning they essentially cannot release).
> 
> .



A pre release in Tucks 2/3 way up on an icy day is what prompted me to do away with my last bindings.....Still hurts thinking about it. With Tuna on that one!


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## Brad J (Mar 25, 2016)

I am 61 165lbs and 5'10" and ski with a 8 din, I do not ski a high speeds, but life bumps and woods . I tore my ACL in 1998 in bumps at relatively slow speed backseat bad recovery fall where my downhill ski went right and he rest of me went left and forward. The ligament snapped before the binding released. My feeling is that it was the way I fell was the problem not the binding. I also am vey carefull about lining up the boot in the binding and no snow or ice on boot or in binding. That being said IMO pre release is more of operator error than fault of the binding. I just think setting them on facture to prevent a pre release is the wrong way to go.


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## steamboat1 (Mar 25, 2016)

Still haven't learned a thing.


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## JimG. (Mar 25, 2016)

I should have been skiing in Quebec every year; that is going to be a yearly prerogative from now on.

They had snowfall well below average too this season but they still got tons of snow. Great skiing!


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## Terry (Mar 26, 2016)

Just go anyways. There will be something that you will enjoy about the day. Better than sitting home being bummed out about the weather. It is always good to ski in less than stellar conditions to work on your technique. A good friend of mine who was an instructor for years purposely takes us down trails with poor conditions so that we will learn to ski them.


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## Cannonball (Mar 26, 2016)

JimG. said:


> I should have been skiing in Quebec every year; that is going to be a yearly prerogative from now on.



This!  I will absolutely be up there every year now.  I can't believe it took  me this long to check it out.  Tremblant on the Maxx Pass will help too.


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## steamboat1 (Mar 26, 2016)

JimG. said:


> I should have been skiing in Quebec every year; that is going to be a yearly prerogative from now on.
> 
> They had snowfall well below average too this season but they still got tons of snow. Great skiing!


There average is only 150" or so. Like I said in another thread the reason it usually stays good is that they rarely get hit with rain or thaw/freeze cycles. Le Massif can get crusty on the lower section due to humidity coming off the St. Lawrence River though. Glad you had a good time & people are finally turning on to the area. My family & I first started skiing there over 20 years ago.


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## Cannonball (Mar 26, 2016)

steamboat1 said:


> Still haven't learned a thing.



Have you considered making this your signature?  Sums it all up in 5 words.


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## JimG. (Mar 26, 2016)

steamboat1 said:


> There average is only 150" or so. Like I said in another thread the reason it usually stays good is that they rarely get hit with rain or thaw/freeze cycles. Le Massif can get crusty on the lower section due to humidity coming off the St. Lawrence River though. Glad you had a good time & people are finally turning on to the area. My family & I first started skiing there over 20 years ago.



El Nino affected them differently because they are so much farther north but it did affect them because they did have a few thaw freeze cycles and many snow events turned to rain at the end of the storms. More crustiness than usual this season. And still I could not find a bare spot anywhere. The snow banks at Le Massif were impressive.


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## eatskisleep (Mar 26, 2016)

The art of the telemark turn.


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## steamboat1 (Mar 26, 2016)

Cannonball said:


> Have you considered making this your signature?  Sums it all up in 5 words.


Learn me sumptin


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## NHSkier13 (Mar 29, 2016)

This season has been so much more icy than other seasons, obviously because there is going to be more artificial snow on the trails. I have gotten so much better at ice and bumpy snow that forms at the end of days that even despite that the last section to the bottom will be tough, there are still some nice turns to be had on the top later in the day, especially on mountains where the sun sets on the face.


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## WWF-VT (Mar 30, 2016)

I learned that buying the 2014/15 Volkl RTM81 for $500 in November was one of the better ski purchases I could have made given the crappy groomers that I have been skiing most of this season


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## abc (Mar 30, 2016)

I finally "get" what the hoopla are about to those desert region ski resorts: Taos, Mammoth etc.

The snow, however much or little that fallen, are SOOOO DRY!!!

You think Utah has dry powder? Try Mammoth or Taos! (and probably should add Telluride, Crested Butte etc., but Taos and Mammoth were what I did this year)

El Nino my friend!


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## snoseek (Mar 31, 2016)

Ive had some pretty heavy snow at mammoth but yeah for sierra standards it wins.

Taos with a 60 or more inch base may be my favorite spot on earth.....or telluride. Yeah you're on to something!

Sent from my LG-H345 using Tapatalk


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## 4aprice (Mar 31, 2016)

snoseek said:


> Ive had some pretty heavy snow at mammoth but yeah for sierra standards it wins.
> 
> Taos with a 60 or more inch base may be my favorite spot on earth.....or telluride. Yeah you're on to something!
> 
> Sent from my LG-H345 using Tapatalk



See Wolf Creek's expansion plans?  Could be an interesting place to go in a few years.

Alex

Lake Hopatcong, NJ


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## ceo (Apr 5, 2016)

Before buying your kid new gear and going on a ski trip with him, make sure he's still interested in skiing. 

Helmets work.


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## tekweezle (Apr 6, 2016)

If all you are going to get to ski are icy groomers,  keep the straightish North Eastern carving skis tuned and ready to go.   Ice is just no fun on soft,  wide skis no matter how much I was wishing for a powder day..... 

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## elks (Apr 6, 2016)

No matter how crappy the winter, you can still ski many days if you just get our there rather than spending your weekends doing snow dances while staring at your skis in the basement.


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## Pez (Apr 6, 2016)

Skiing is better than not skiing. 

But I think most of us learned that a long long time ago. 


Sent from my iPhone using AlpineZone


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## bootladder (Apr 8, 2016)

Don't ski White Nitro when it is blue ice halfway down and you can't see the ice from the top.


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## jimk (Apr 9, 2016)

abc said:


> I finally "get" what the hoopla are about to those desert region ski resorts: Taos, Mammoth etc.
> 
> The snow, however much or little that fallen, are SOOOO DRY!!!
> 
> ...





bootladder said:


> Don't ski White Nitro when it is blue ice halfway down and you can't see the ice from the top.



I skied 23 days this winter in UT and CO and it was probably about day 20 that I finally started to dress light enough to be comfortable most of the time.  40 out there feels like 55 in the East.  The sun is more intense and the humidity is lower.

I was skiing Snowbird on April 5th.  It was very firm.  They had a cold night after several warm days.  The offpiste was coral reef and the groomers were like ice rinks.  No edge grip on a few of the steepest groomer drops, held on to poles with death grip while skiing those sections.  This stirred me to tell a story to a friend on a subsequent lift ride about the time I skied White Nitro at Sugarloaf in similar conditions.  Another buddy fell on White Nitro in slick conditions back in the mid-1990s and slid about 100 yards like a turtle on his back.  Finally came to rest on the side of the trail and fortunately was not hurt.

Since my son moved to UT I have taken more plane rides in last 7 or 8 months than I have in the last 7 or 8 years.  Me wife and I took a voluntary flight bump in early March on a return from UT and each got $800 flight credit for Delta.  First time I tried this, won't be afraid to do it again in future.


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## jimk (Apr 9, 2016)

dlague said:


> Been there now doing that! CO in two weeks for the long term!
> 
> What I learned was take what the mountain gives you and have fun!  Oh wait that is what I always say!  I actually enjoyed our skiing days so far.  A couple were not that great but we found something fun to ski on those days too.
> 
> ...



I hope you will keep us informed about how your transition goes.  I like to hear lessons learned because I might migrate west in the future myself.


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## snoseek (Apr 9, 2016)

Well hes down south a little bit so 285 is a better way in on most days.

But what i did learn in my years there is find an alternative to taking 70 during busy times out of the front range...its infuriating too often. Ive learned for me personally the western slope is more my speed.

Sent from my LG-H345 using Tapatalk


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## abc (Apr 9, 2016)

jimk said:


> Me wife and I took a voluntary flight bump in early March on a return from UT and *each got $800 flight credit* for Delta.  First time I tried this, won't be afraid to do it again in future.


That's a lot of flight credit. I tried more than once, the credit wasn't half as good so I didn't go through with it.


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## 4aprice (Apr 11, 2016)

jimk said:


> I skied 23 days this winter in UT and CO and it was probably about day 20 that I finally started to dress light enough to be comfortable most of the time.  40 out there feels like 55 in the East.  The sun is more intense and the humidity is lower.
> 
> I was skiing Snowbird on April 5th.  It was very firm.  They had a cold night after several warm days.  The offpiste was coral reef and the groomers were like ice rinks.  No edge grip on a few of the steepest groomer drops, held on to poles with death grip while skiing those sections.  This stirred me to tell a story to a friend on a subsequent lift ride about the time I skied White Nitro at Sugarloaf in similar conditions.  Another buddy fell on White Nitro in slick conditions back in the mid-1990s and slid about 100 yards like a turtle on his back.  Finally came to rest on the side of the trail and fortunately was not hurt.
> 
> Since my son moved to UT I have taken more plane rides in last 7 or 8 months than I have in the last 7 or 8 years.  Me wife and I took a voluntary flight bump in early March on a return from UT and each got $800 flight credit for Delta.  First time I tried this, won't be afraid to do it again in future.



I'm with you Jim.  The weather, the snow, the sun, it just plain better out there and I (we as I include my wife) are pretty sure we are going to end up out there one of these days.  

Not only is the skiing more comfortable but life in general out there seems to be more agreeable.  I know it can get cold even snowy in places like Salt Lake and Denver but it doesn't stick around and I love it after spending a day up in the mountains skiing around on nice deep bases coming down to beautiful 60-70 degree weather.   Enjoying that weather down in the valleys and knowing its not killing the skiing above and that the next storm coming in will refresh and reboot the whole scene.  Was a beautiful 70 degree day on Saturday in Denver (the skiing at Loveland was great) and flying into JFK at about 25 degrees Sunday morning was not a very nice welcome.

My son is headed to school in Denver next year and we too will be taking more airplane rides.  Haven't played the bump game yet but may try it.  Right now we are trying to figure out where we could stash equipment out there to avoid having to fly with it but we have 2 major destinations that we go to and the logistics are lacking.  (ie don't want to have to fly to Salt Lake to ski in Colorado, or Denver to ski in Utah)  Anyways the major lesson we learned was really last year when the west was supposedly so bad it was not worth the trip only to find it still better then what we left back east.  Can't wait to get back out there. (Had it with Jersey too)

Alex

Lake Hopatcong, NJ


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## fbrissette (Apr 11, 2016)

jimk said:


> I was skiing Snowbird on April 5th.  It was very firm.



I was skiing the East the entire season.  It was extremely firm.


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## JimG. (Apr 11, 2016)

fbrissette said:


> I was skiing the East the entire season.  It was extremely firm.



+1


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## jimk (Apr 11, 2016)

4aprice said:


> I'm with you Jim.  The weather, the snow, the sun, it just plain better out there and I (we as I include my wife) are pretty sure we are going to end up out there one of these days.
> 
> Not only is the skiing more comfortable but life in general out there seems to be more agreeable.  I know it can get cold even snowy in places like Salt Lake and Denver but it doesn't stick around and I love it after spending a day up in the mountains skiing around on nice deep bases coming down to beautiful 60-70 degree weather.   Enjoying that weather down in the valleys and knowing its not killing the skiing above and that the next storm coming in will refresh and reboot the whole scene.  Was a beautiful 70 degree day on Saturday in Denver (the skiing at Loveland was great) and flying into JFK at about 25 degrees Sunday morning was not a very nice welcome.
> 
> ...



What school is your son going to?  Sounds like you have some good ski opportunities to capitalize on for Christmas and Spring breaks next year.


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## skiMEbike (Apr 12, 2016)

My lesson:   Don't go in on a Seasonal Rental during an El Nino winter.


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## powhunter (Apr 13, 2016)

Head west once a year!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## 4aprice (Apr 13, 2016)

powhunter said:


> Head west once a year!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



+1000   Going to make it 2 next year.  Make it a spring trip and you've got motivation to get out and practice all season.

Alex

Lake Hopatcong, NJ


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## crank (Apr 13, 2016)

I learned the truth of the saying - the best skiing in the east is at the airport.


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## tekweezle (Apr 14, 2016)

Seems like the most snow falls at the airport.... 

Sent from my LGL41C using Tapatalk


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## Domeskier (Apr 14, 2016)

Airports are usually pretty flat for some reason.  I guess whoever came up with this saying is talking about XC skiing.


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## abc (Apr 17, 2016)

4aprice said:


> Make it a spring trip and you've got motivation to get out and practice all season.


Now that's a good one!

I've been doing that for a while, without realising that's what motivated me to ski more at home.

Now I added another trip in January. Bypassing our annual thaw in the east. In years of poor start, that January trip kick start my season. Then the spring trip caps it. Guarantees bookend season.


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## tekweezle (Apr 18, 2016)

powhunter said:


> Head west once a year!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



I took that advice and went to SLC this past weekend.   2 powder days(solitude and snowbird) and 1 slushy spring day(snowbasin) thus far.   1 more day at Snowbird and then the redeye back to NY.   Ironic thing is that the flight was only 4 hours due to good flying weather.   That's less than getting some places in the north east! 

Sent from my LGL41C using Tapatalk


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## VTKilarney (Apr 19, 2016)

tekweezle said:


> Ironic thing is that the flight was only 4 hours due to good flying weather.   That's less than getting some places in the north east!


Not when you factor in getting to/from the airport and waiting to board your flight.  But it's definitely worth it!


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## steamboat1 (Apr 19, 2016)

tekweezle said:


> I took that advice and went to SLC this past weekend.   2 powder days(solitude and snowbird) and 1 slushy spring day(snowbasin) thus far.   1 more day at Snowbird and then the redeye back to NY.   Ironic thing is that the flight was only 4 hours due to good flying weather.   That's less than getting some places in the north east!


Best part is if you catch a early morning flight to SLC you can be on the slopes by late morning/early afternoon. The redeye back is a killer though. I think we didn't land until 6:30am last time I took it home. I can't sleep on planes.


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## abc (Apr 19, 2016)

VTKilarney said:


> Not when you factor in getting to/from the airport and waiting to board your flight.  But it's definitely worth it!


Depends on how far you're from the airport. I can get to the airport in less than an hour. Add another hour waiting for the flight, it's 6 hrs. (some airport has much shorter wait than New York, for example, Reno is 1/2 hr wait only) The same time it takes me to Burke or Jay. 

No wonder I haven't been to Jay for quite a few years now. And never really a Burke fan. It's easier to go out west instead. Cost more, but better skiing. FAR BETTER skiing!


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## abc (Apr 19, 2016)

steamboat1 said:


> The redeye back is a killer though. I think we didn't land until 6:30am last time I took it home. I can't sleep on planes.


That doesn't bother me too badly. I can sleep a bit on the plane. Just enough to be functional at work for that day. The following night I sleep REALLY well. And I'm usually back to normal the next day. (that's TODAY, after flying back from Calgary on a redeye on Sunday night!)


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## tekweezle (Apr 19, 2016)

I made it back this morning.   Flying weather was great so we arrived on time(under 4 hours).   Tuesday morning was a bit of heavy travel day so it was a little hectic getting out of the airport.   I  will have to adjust something in my planning. 

Unfortunately for me the only flights out was at 5:15(too early) and 1am.  So a lot of waiting around in the airport.   But the skiing was worth it  

Sent from my LG-LS980 using Tapatalk


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## dlague (Apr 25, 2016)

Yup move to Colorado!


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## wtcobb (Apr 26, 2016)

This winter I learned that "El Nino" is really Spanish for "get f'd east coast ski resorts."


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