# Correct ways to drive in the snow and ice



## billski (Dec 14, 2011)

I don't know about you, but I'm weary of our collective complaining about drivers.  I'm as guilty as anyone.
We've beaten the equipment to death (a-la snow tires) so let's move on.

Let's contribute to a thread about the CORRECT WAY to drive in the snow and ice.  

For example, I see a lot of people approach icy and snowy turns in the road with way too much speed. 

So let's set the bar high and begin to explain the best way to navigate icy and snowy roads


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## deadheadskier (Dec 14, 2011)

um, have decent tires and drive at an appropriate rate of speed for the conditions and what your vehicle can handle?

seems pretty simple to me


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## wa-loaf (Dec 14, 2011)

billski said:


> For example, I see a lot of people approach icy and snowy turns in the road with way too much speed.



How else are you going to get a good skid going?


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## bvibert (Dec 14, 2011)

wa-loaf said:


> How else are you going to get a good skid going?



This


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## Nick (Dec 14, 2011)

Snow + E-brake = awesome


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## drjeff (Dec 14, 2011)

wa-loaf said:


> How else are you going to get a good skid going?



Exactly!  I mean doesn't everyone have the drifting skills of say Ken Block or Tanner Faust, especially while they're driving say a Prius??  :lol:


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## bvibert (Dec 14, 2011)

Nick said:


> Snow + E-brake = awesome



Snow + rear wheel drive = even awesomer! (as long as you're not trying to go up hill).


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## billski (Dec 14, 2011)

I have a hard time agreeing with this.  While braking is good, it's the process and timing that seems lost on many people.  Too many people brake IN the curve.  Slow down before the curve, then slightly accelerate to maintain traction.

Nick, what is "E-brake"?  Sounds expensive.


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## Black Phantom (Dec 14, 2011)

billski said:


> I have a hard time agreeing with this.  While braking is good, it's the process and timing that seems lost on many people.  Too many people brake IN the curve.  Slow down before the curve, then slightly accelerate to maintain traction.
> 
> Nick, what is "E-brake"?  Sounds expensive.



billski- you should start driving with a helmet and you should wear a mouth guard at all times. 

E-brake = emergency brake


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## wa-loaf (Dec 14, 2011)

bvibert said:


> Snow + rear wheel drive = even awesomer! (as long as you're not trying to go up hill).



If I give it enough gas I can get the rear end of the subaru to break loose ... and get up the hills.


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## wa-loaf (Dec 14, 2011)

billski said:


> I have a hard time agreeing with this.  While braking is good, it's the process and timing that seems lost on many people.  Too many people brake IN the curve.  Slow down before the curve, then slightly accelerate to maintain traction.
> 
> Nick, what is "E-brake"?  Sounds expensive.



I think you're gong to have a hard time getting us to take this thread seriously. :-D


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## Glenn (Dec 14, 2011)

I like empty parking lots in the snow. Just ask drjeff. :lol: We all took a little detour on the way back to his condo. "Jeff, hold on...I need to do a few donuts before dinner..."


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## drjeff (Dec 14, 2011)

billski said:


> I have a hard time agreeing with this.  While braking is good, it's the process and timing that seems lost on many people.  Too many people brake IN the curve.  Slow down before the curve, then slightly accelerate to maintain traction.
> .



Bingo!  Frankly the way one should "set up" a turn while driving a car isn't that much different than how one set's up a turn while skiing.  Any slowing should occur as the prior to the start/at the start of the turn, roll it smoothly through the center and then begin to accelerate out of the corner and start preparing for the next turn.

If you watch how race car drivers handle a road course (or heck even an oval) and how ski racers handle a course (especially a GS and higher speed events) there's LOTS of similarity in how they go about executing a turn


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## Nick (Dec 14, 2011)

Can we fix the title of this thread to put "drive" into it ? :lol:


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## drjeff (Dec 14, 2011)

Glenn said:


> I like empty parking lots in the snow. Just ask drjeff. :lol: We all took a little detour on the way back to his condo. "Jeff, hold on...I need to do a few donuts before dinner..."



Okay,  I was wondering if it was that time last year, or a couple of weeks ago on my birthday when I was behind you in my car as we were going from the base lodge down to the Last Chair and you started doing slalom turns around the parking lot poles and then did the peel out (or maybe a peel in in this case) heading into the LC parking lot and covered my hood/windshield  :lol:


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## Black Phantom (Dec 14, 2011)

In the butt Bob


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## bvibert (Dec 14, 2011)

wa-loaf said:


> If I give it enough gas I can get the rear end of the subaru to break loose ... and get up the hills.



Sounds sweet! 8)


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## bvibert (Dec 14, 2011)

Glenn said:


> I like empty parking lots in the snow. Just ask drjeff. :lol: We all took a little detour on the way back to his condo. "Jeff, hold on...I need to do a few donuts before dinner..."



I've spent over an hour doing donuts in the parking lot at work during a snow storm. Good times!  That was before I got back into skiing...


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## o3jeff (Dec 14, 2011)

Maybe we can have a doughnut contest at the AZ summit this year in a snowy lot.


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## Nick (Dec 14, 2011)

When I was in high school in Manchester, CT I actually got a reckless driving ticket (I was 17) for doing donuts (well, e-brake slides) in a parking lot after a snow storm at 10PM. 

No, there were no other cars in the parking lot, or at least not in the section we were in. 

Cost me over $300 in court plus points on a license. Jerk. I tried to tell the cop I was learning how to drive in the snow


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## thetrailboss (Dec 14, 2011)

Black Phantom said:


> E-brake = emergency brake



Some folks call the parking brake an E-brake, or Emergency Brake.  And no, it is not coin operated.


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## bvibert (Dec 14, 2011)

o3jeff said:


> Maybe we can have a doughnut contest at the AZ summit this year in a snowy lot.



I'm down for that! 8)



Nick said:


> When I was in high school in Manchester, CT I actually got a reckless driving ticket (I was 17) for doing donuts (well, e-brake slides) in a parking lot after a snow storm at 10PM.
> 
> No, there were no other cars in the parking lot, or at least not in the section we were in.
> 
> Cost me over $300 in court plus points on a license. Jerk. I tried to tell the cop I was learning how to drive in the snow



Note to self - Don't do donuts in the Manchester!  That sounds pretty shitty!!


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## Black Phantom (Dec 14, 2011)

thetrailboss said:


> Some folks call the parking brake an E-brake, or Emergency Brake.  And no, it is not coin operated.



WTF are you taking about?


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## wa-loaf (Dec 14, 2011)

Black Phantom said:


> WTF are you taking about?


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## bvibert (Dec 14, 2011)

Black Phantom said:


> WTF are you taking about?



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parking_brake


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## SkiDork (Dec 14, 2011)

I tell you what - my wife has no idea how to handle a skid.  I can handle a skid with ease

Difference?  When I was in high school, we used to go out and do donuts in parking lots whenever it snowed.  Thats how I learned how to handle a skid.


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## billski (Dec 14, 2011)

Black Phantom said:


> billski- you should start driving with a helmet and you should wear a mouth guard at all times.
> 
> E-brake = emergency brake



At home I wear a helmet, mouthguard, and bulletproof vest.    Most accidents happen within 1.4 miles of home.  Skiing is vastly safer.  I try to get out of town very carefully but quickly!.


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## Black Phantom (Dec 14, 2011)

bvibert said:


> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parking_brake



No shit. I know what a parking/emergency brake is. I asked the idiot WTF he was talking about. Real simple. 

I pointed billski in the direction.  

Are your helmets on to f*king tight or what?


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## bvibert (Dec 14, 2011)

SkiDork said:


> When I was in high school, we used to go out and do donuts in parking lots whenever it snowed.  Thats how I learned how to handle a skid.



Exactly.  How else are you supposed to learn?


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## billski (Dec 14, 2011)

Black Phantom said:


> No shit. I know what a parking/emergency brake is. I asked the idiot WTF he was talking about. Real simple.
> 
> I pointed billski in the direction.
> 
> Are your helmets on to f*king tight or what?



Getting a little cranky in here.  I'm stepping out for a brewski or threeski.


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## wa-loaf (Dec 14, 2011)

bvibert said:


> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parking_brake



I think he was talking about the coin operated portion of the statement. I didn't get it either.


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## bvibert (Dec 14, 2011)

Black Phantom said:


> No shit. I know what a parking/emergency brake is. I asked the idiot WTF he was talking about. Real simple.
> 
> I pointed billski in the direction.
> 
> Are your helmets on to f*king tight or what?



Getting a little testy??

Let me make it real simple for you:

Billski was confused about what an e-brake was, and thought it sounded expensive.
TTB responded with some of the other names that such a brake goes by and mentioned that it was not coin operated, in other words it does not require any additional cost to operate, making it no more expensive to use or not.  
This seemed to further confuse you, so I posted a picture since that seems to be the way that you primarily like to communicate.  
Perhaps next time I'll just post a picture of something random and that will make more sense for you?


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## bvibert (Dec 14, 2011)

wa-loaf said:


> I think he was talking about the coin operated portion of the statement. I didn't get it either.



See my post above...


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## hammer (Dec 14, 2011)

SkiDork said:


> I tell you what - my wife has no idea how to handle a skid.  I can handle a skid with ease
> 
> Difference?  When I was in high school, we used to go out and do donuts in parking lots whenever it snowed.  Thats how I learned how to handle a skid.


I'm still meaning to take my son out to an empty snowy parking lot for just that purpose.

Big disadvantage of foot-operated parking brakes...no power slides.


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## Nick (Dec 14, 2011)

FWIW I was confused on the coin operated thing as well. 

that would be funny though....


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## ski stef (Dec 14, 2011)

I like to pretend I know how to do a e-brake slide.   

but in all seriousness I definitely drive safe in the snow during commutes...although i just picked up an AWD,, kind of boosted my confidence without even having a serious day on those snowy roads yet.


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## Glenn (Dec 14, 2011)

drjeff said:


> Okay,  I was wondering if it was that time last year, or a couple of weeks ago on my birthday when I was behind you in my car as we were going from the base lodge down to the Last Chair and you started doing slalom turns around the parking lot poles and then did the peel out (or maybe a peel in in this case) heading into the LC parking lot and covered my hood/windshield  :lol:



Your B-day was the parking lot mud spray "oops! I didn't realize the 4.0 had that much grunt...I think I just sprayed the Jeff mobile". 

Snowy donuts was last season. I can't remember exactly when....Around E's b-day? 

I really need to start filming these adventures. :lol:


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## Glenn (Dec 14, 2011)

Black Phantom said:


> WTF are you taking about?



The guy who can't post without aswering a question with another question.


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## ctenidae (Dec 14, 2011)

Back to topic (a rarity for me, I know- sorry), the #1 most impotant thing in driving in the snow, or in any condition, or in most apsects of life, is to think far enough ahead to be prepared. Doesn't do any good to realize you're going too fast in the middle of a trun, whether it's icy, wet, or dry.

For the record, the coin-op comment went right by me, too. Even explained, it's a bit of a stretch.


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## bvibert (Dec 14, 2011)

wa-loaf said:


> I think he was talking about the coin operated portion of the statement. I didn't get it either.





Nick said:


> FWIW I was confused on the coin operated thing as well.
> 
> that would be funny though....





ctenidae said:


> For the record, the coin-op comment went right by me, too. Even explained, it's a bit of a stretch.



Now I'm getting worried.  I wasn't the only one who got TTB's reference, was I? :lol:

I think I've been hanging around here too long...


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## ctenidae (Dec 14, 2011)

bvibert said:


> Now I'm getting worried.  I wasn't the only one who got TTB's reference, was I? :lol:
> 
> I think I've been hanging around here too long...



I'll have what he's having.

But make mine a double.


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## bigbog (Dec 14, 2011)

Agree with the your OP Billski.   When it's broken pp and it's not deep enough to insulate & melt the black ice..on those high, country roads...like I once experienced with Dad's car..mid-sized mediocre car(wimpy 70s, A/T tires)... rather long lefthand curve _AND TELEPHONE POLE(@mid-turn) in  sight..._~15-20mph. Could feel it start to glide and the cheap tires wouldn't grip.  Bro...it was a _long_(~40') ~10mph slide...just got by & cleared the telephone pole by ~6":wink:..:-o.  
Sure glad we're on better tires nowadays.....and I know what to look for...but I hear ya' *hammer*, teens need to practice on how to handle the auto...on every surface/condition.

Agree on that beer!...LOL.


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## thetrailboss (Dec 14, 2011)

bvibert said:


> Now I'm getting worried.  I wasn't the only one who got TTB's reference, was I? :lol:
> 
> I think I've been hanging around here too long...



Billski said it would be expensive.  I was making an apparently bad joke on that because we know that Bill is tight with money.


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## mlctvt (Dec 14, 2011)

bvibert said:


> Snow + rear wheel drive = even awesomer! (as long as you're not trying to go up hill).



Yes, but 4-wheel drifting the Subaru around corners is awesome too.


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## o3jeff (Dec 14, 2011)

mlctvt said:


> Yes, but 4-wheel drifting the Subaru around corners is awesome too.



AWD drifting is were it's at, doughnuts get boring after a while.


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## bvibert (Dec 14, 2011)

mlctvt said:


> Yes, but 4-wheel drifting the Subaru around corners is awesome too.





o3jeff said:


> AWD drifting is were it's at, doughnuts get boring after a while.



No doubt it's fun, but I had way more fun in my part-time 4WD truck than I did in my AWD truck.  I'd love to pop that thing into 2WD and letting her rip, then put it back into 4WD when I was done.  Sometimes, though, there wouldn't be enough traction to even get going in 2WD (pickup with no weight in the back), so I'd have to resort to 4 wheel drifts.  The best of both worlds...


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## bvibert (Dec 14, 2011)

ctenidae said:


> I'll have what he's having.
> 
> But make mine a double.



A double of the AZ experience?  That may be more than any mere mortal can handle!


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## o3jeff (Dec 14, 2011)

I still don't understand the coin thing, should I be concerned?


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## wa-loaf (Dec 14, 2011)

o3jeff said:


> should I be concerned?



yes


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## bvibert (Dec 14, 2011)

o3jeff said:


> I still don't understand the coin thing, should I be concerned?


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## o3jeff (Dec 14, 2011)

bvibert said:


>



When did you have that done?


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## ALLSKIING (Dec 14, 2011)

o3jeff said:


> When did you have that done?



:lol::smash:


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## deadheadskier (Dec 14, 2011)

Nick said:


> When I was in high school in Manchester, CT I actually got a reckless driving ticket (I was 17) for doing donuts (well, e-brake slides) in a parking lot after a snow storm at 10PM.
> 
> No, there were no other cars in the parking lot, or at least not in the section we were in.
> 
> Cost me over $300 in court plus points on a license. Jerk. I tried to tell the cop I was learning how to drive in the snow



when I was 9, my brother would take me on rides with him and he'd actually pull the e-brake slide on roads when being chased by police officers.  Called them statey slides.   Amazing he never got caught.


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## snowmonster (Dec 14, 2011)

deadheadskier said:


> when I was 9, my brother would take me on rides with him and he'd actually pull the e-brake slide on roads when being chased by police officers.  *Called them statey slides.*   Amazing he never got caught.



I thought they were called the Tokyo Drift.


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## ALLSKIING (Dec 14, 2011)

This one time at band camp it was snowing and...............................


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## bvibert (Dec 14, 2011)

ALLSKIING said:


> This one time at band camp it was snowing and...............................


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## bvibert (Dec 14, 2011)

o3jeff said:


> When did you have that done?



That back isn't nearly hairy enough to be mine...


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## o3jeff (Dec 14, 2011)

bvibert said:


> That back isn't nearly hairy enough to be mine...



What do you think it does if you put a coin in there?


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## bvibert (Dec 14, 2011)

o3jeff said:


> What do you think it does if you put a coin in there?



I doubt it works as an e-brake...


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## vdk03 (Dec 14, 2011)

hammer said:


> Big disadvantage of foot-operated parking brakes...no power slides.



This is not 100% accurate, it just requires a different technique.... a little practice and the right rental car and you'll have it down.:grin:


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## bvibert (Dec 14, 2011)

vdk03 said:


> This is not 100% accurate, it just requires a different technique.... a little practice and the right rental car and you'll have it down.:grin:



I like your style!


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## o3jeff (Dec 14, 2011)

bvibert said:


> I doubt it works as an e-brake...



Probably rips a fart....

Hmmm, I wonder what the proper lift etiquette is on that subject


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## ctenidae (Dec 14, 2011)

o3jeff said:


> Probably rips a fart....
> 
> Hmmm, I wonder what the proper lift etiquette is on that subject



Outside leg, to direct the blast away from others.


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## bigbog (Dec 14, 2011)

o3jeff said:


> AWD drifting is were it's at, doughnuts get boring after a while.



LOL..o3jeff, between midnight and 4am...and you're golden up here in Bangorlol, really anywhere above Portland = more territory to roam about in and far fewer vehicles(& police departments) to contend with...than you've ever seen down south...;-)


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## Hawkshot99 (Dec 14, 2011)

The secret to good snow driving is definitely going out to parking lots when it snows and playing.  When my vehicles start to slide in the snow, I have felt it many times before when playing, and know how to fix the problem.  Get in a car with a person who doesn't do this, and they will panic when the car starts to slide.

Good tires, and a good vehicle just make it easier.  No matter how good your vehicle/tire combo is, it will break loose at some time, this is when your training kicks in.


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## Hawkshot99 (Dec 14, 2011)

PS the quarter thing didnt make much sense, and that tattoo is just wrong.  Why would the tattooer even agree to do that?


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## wa-loaf (Dec 14, 2011)

o3jeff said:


> Probably rips a fart....



I just saw Hall Pass. Anyone else see this, the scene with the girl in the bathroom ...


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## wa-loaf (Dec 14, 2011)

Hawkshot99 said:


> Why would the tattooer even agree to do that?



Money?


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## Hawkshot99 (Dec 14, 2011)

wa-loaf said:


> Money?



I doubt any amount of $ would not be enough for a tattooer to allow me to drop my pants for them.


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## o3jeff (Dec 14, 2011)

Hawkshot99 said:


> I doubt any amount of $ would not be enough for a tattooer to allow me to drop my pants for them.



Long term investment, just imagine all the coins they are getting now


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## Hawkshot99 (Dec 14, 2011)

o3jeff said:


> Long term investment, just imagine all the coins they are getting now



But imagine what he has to pay some person to dig them out....uke:


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## Geoff (Dec 15, 2011)

Nick said:


> When I was in high school in Manchester, CT I actually got a reckless driving ticket (I was 17) for doing donuts (well, e-brake slides) in a parking lot after a snow storm at 10PM.
> 
> No, there were no other cars in the parking lot, or at least not in the section we were in.
> 
> Cost me over $300 in court plus points on a license. Jerk. I tried to tell the cop I was learning how to drive in the snow



Yeah, well....   The lesson here is that you don't screw around with a cop an doughnuts.


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## Abubob (Dec 15, 2011)

Geoff said:


> Yeah, well....   The lesson here is that you don't screw around with a cop an doughnuts.



Cop pulls this guy over and says "Your eyes look glassy. You been drinkin'?"

The guy says "Officer, your eyes looks glazed. You been eating doughnuts?"




Back to the subject - I do doughnuts backwards now that I have front wheel drive.


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## bvibert (Dec 15, 2011)

Abubob said:


> Back to the subject - I do doughnuts backwards now that I have front wheel drive.



Yup, that's fun too!


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## Nick (Dec 15, 2011)

yeah the reverse donut is a good time


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## C-Rex (Dec 16, 2011)

How to drive in the snow?  Get a Subaru!!

I like to have fun on the drive to/from the mountain as well as while I'm there.  So a couple years ago, I put a roof rack, coil-over's and rally flaps on my STi.  So now I can get 4 people and their gear to the mountain, and quickly.


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## ctenidae (Dec 16, 2011)

Abubob said:


> Back to the subject - I do doughnuts backwards now that I have front wheel drive.



FWD is also good for lunch tray donuts.


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## bvibert (Dec 16, 2011)

ctenidae said:


> FWD is also good for lunch tray donuts.



Lunch tray donuts?  Does that have something to do with a coin operated e-brake?


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## ctenidae (Dec 16, 2011)

bvibert said:


> Lunch tray donuts?  Does that have something to do with a coin operated e-brake?



Not nearly as messy.

How it's not done...


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## Glenn (Dec 16, 2011)

C-Rex;672715rally flaps [/QUOTE said:
			
		

> I'm somewhat perplexed by those. I can see it if you're sideways on gravel roads...
> 
> However, makes a lot more sense on an STi vs the frontwheel drive mini I saw them on at the Depot the other day. ;-)


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## bvibert (Dec 16, 2011)

ctenidae said:


> Not nearly as messy.
> 
> How it's not done...



:beer:


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## SkiingInABlueDream (Dec 16, 2011)

Scandanavian flick or else stay off the road.


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