# Any body know anything about Hunter???



## RichT (Nov 5, 2021)

This was this morning...........
They're still in "ghost" mode!
body know anything from Hunter??


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Nov 5, 2021)

Scheduled to open Nov 19. Glad to see they have started preparing their WROD. At least it covers more than twice as much vertical as what Killington opens with and doesn't involve stairs.


----------



## Smellytele (Nov 5, 2021)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> Scheduled to open Nov 19. Glad to see they have started preparing their WROD. At least it covers more than twice as much vertical as what Killington opens with and doesn't involve stairs.


Well we'll see what is open on Nov 19 at K.


----------



## skiur (Nov 5, 2021)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> Scheduled to open Nov 19. Glad to see they have started preparing their WROD. At least it covers more than twice as much vertical as what Killington opens with and doesn't involve stairs.



But today Nov 5 people are skiing at K and riding lifts.  How much vert is at hunter today? Enjoy the hiking.


----------



## KustyTheKlown (Nov 5, 2021)

i expect K to be open t2b on snowdon and possibly east fall to the runout by nov 20 weekend.


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Nov 5, 2021)

Yeah I'm sure Killington will be as open as Hunter is by the time I make it to Hunter, likely on 11/21. Not denigrating what K is doing. 

But 11 hr r/t drive for 550' vertical with stairs isn't worth it for me from central NJ. 
5.5 hr r/t drive for 1450' vertical with high speed lift will be.


----------



## KustyTheKlown (Nov 5, 2021)

I’ve done opening weekend at killington. I am not going this weekend. If I had an unlimited pass I probably would but def not burning an ikon day for it


----------



## slatham (Nov 5, 2021)

Hunter is now Epic, which given their marketing prowess it’s strange that they don’t seem to be very proactive with cams and news updates early season.


----------



## FBGM (Nov 5, 2021)

The way the forecast looks (take 15 days out with a grain of salt) - Hunter will be lucky to be open on 19th. Possible cold returns on 15 ish - maybe?


----------



## drjeff (Nov 5, 2021)

FBGM said:


> The way the forecast looks (take 15 days out with a grain of salt) - Hunter will be lucky to be open on 19th. Possible cold returns on 15 ish - maybe?


Mother nature looks to make it challenging right now for anyone who isn't open yet, or won't get open this weekend possibly, to get open before Thanksgiving Week if the 10 day is remotely accurate and/or shift to the cold side after that... 

My 50th b-day is Black Friday (the symbolism isn't lost on me  ) and I sure am hoping that mother nature will have cooperated enough by then to let me get some birthday turns!


----------



## thebigo (Nov 5, 2021)

I know hunter is owned by vail, which means they are going to fuck you over.


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Nov 8, 2021)

RichT said:


> This was this morning...........
> They're still in "ghost" mode!
> View attachment 52136body know anything from Hunter??


I know I took that picture....


----------



## catskillman (Nov 13, 2021)

They are drastically understaffed - heard that are going to have a very hard time opening.  They also expect large crowds like last season

food trucks coming in, reservations required to eat indoors, no barstools, credit only, 

sorry no good news to report.

Oh - the changed the doors so they do not need to chain them shut at night any longer........


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Nov 15, 2021)

Good thing I avoid the lodge and bar these days.
I'll continue to be a roll up to the northface and ride for a couple hours person(weekday pow rules in effect though).
My work team is ok with me adjusting my time to ride at lunch for a couple of hours.


----------



## FBGM (Nov 15, 2021)

catskillman said:


> They are drastically understaffed - heard that are going to have a very hard time opening.  They also expect large crowds like last season
> 
> food trucks coming in, reservations required to eat indoors, no barstools, credit only,
> 
> ...


Looked at Vails jobs page. Yikes. Something like 2,400 open positions, and that’s not counting for adds posted that need multiple people.


----------



## IceEidolon (Nov 15, 2021)

For snowmaking, a staffing shortage can be mitigated on their day 1 terrain. A decent proportion of their opening day terrain is covered by automated or line flood guns. Once you get away from that, though, not having a full crew will hurt, and that doesn't count the impact on grooming, lifts, and guest facing services.


----------



## RichT (Nov 15, 2021)

I have no problem standing at the bar!  What I don't want is lack of people for Lift ops, ski patrol, grooming and snowmaking.


----------



## da-bum (Nov 18, 2021)

Any word on whether we can use the downstairs or main area of the main lodge to put on our boots and/or stash our bags?  Even though the main lodge was open for dining last season.  It was not open to change or store our gear bags, so I decided to park near an entrance to the trails and avoided the lodge almost completely, sitting in the cold car eating cold sandwiches, drinking hot coffee/soup from thermos and going into the woods to relive myself.  I could do that again this year, but it is not preferred.


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Nov 19, 2021)

Guns are on.


----------



## zyk (Nov 19, 2021)

Funky_Catskills said:


> Guns are on.


Great!  Any snow this morning?  Was covered here a fair bit to the northwest. Took it as a good sign.


----------



## RichT (Nov 19, 2021)

Was at the lodge today to get my locker keys...............Mask Nazi's are going to be around at least in the beginning. Hopefully they will ease the restrictions as the season progresses.


----------



## FBGM (Nov 19, 2021)

Saw their web cam making snow up
High. As I stared at the wet bulb all day and tried to see who and where had fired up. 

I had a window tonight. And was gonna pull trigger but trended warmer. Only had like 6-8 hours of very marginal. With rain coming Sunday I said no. But we turning on Monday night Tuesday night.


----------



## RichT (Nov 19, 2021)

FBGM said:


> Saw their web cam making snow up
> High. As I stared at the wet bulb all day and tried to see who and where had fired up.
> 
> I had a window tonight. And was gonna pull trigger but trended warmer. Only had like 6-8 hours of very marginal. With rain coming Sunday I said no. But we turning on Monday night Tuesday night.


Yep don't waste the money...............nothing really happens now till mid December anyway. Hoping you have a very busy Christmas week!!!!!1


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Nov 23, 2021)

Guns blasting - Belt and Mainline


----------



## So Inclined (Nov 24, 2021)

Opening on Friday according to their account on the 'Gram.


----------



## RichT (Nov 26, 2021)

Lousy "opening day" rain with flurries mixed in with a little sticking to the grass...........a lot of skiers though.


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Nov 29, 2021)

Hunter was great yesterday morning. At least an inch of carveable surface on tip of firm base, light snow gave everything a pretty frosting, Empty enough that I rode solo my first two trips up the 6 pack.

Both lifts broke down at around 1130 for long enough that I called it a day but I got 6 beautiful 1460' vertical runs in before that which was a nice warm up for my legs after 7.5 months off. Feeling it in the calves slightly today indicating it was just as well I didn't go all day on day 1.


----------



## 180 (Nov 29, 2021)

Both D and 6 pack were down. D never returned.  6 pack came back at 1pm.  We should have Minya, White Cloud and Overlook soon.


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Nov 29, 2021)

180 said:


> Both D and 6 pack were down. D never returned.  6 pack came back at 1pm.  We should have Minya, White Cloud and Overlook soon.


Cool - thanks for update - looks like I made the right call heading for my car at 1140 (when they dispersed line from 6 pack saying it would be a while) rather than waiting 90 minutes for a crowded Flyer. 6 runs with no lines was a great morning.


----------



## Tdizz (Nov 29, 2021)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> Hunter was great yesterday morning. At least an inch of carveable surface on tip of firm base, light snow gave everything a pretty frosting, Empty enough that I rode solo my first two trips up the 6 pack.
> 
> Both lifts broke down at around 1130 for long enough that I called it a day but I got 6 beautiful 1460' vertical runs in before that which was a nice warm up for my legs after 7.5 months off. Feeling it in the calves slightly today indicating it was just as well I didn't go all day on day 1.





Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> Cool - thanks for update - looks like I made the right call heading for my car at 1140 (when they dispersed line from 6 pack saying it would be a while) rather than waiting 90 minutes for a crowded Flyer. 6 runs with no lines was a great morning.


We were stuck on the 6 pack for a while yesterday. Apparently, they're having problems with it again today. Anyone what's going on? I'd like to go Tuesday but don't want to drive up there just to ride D lift (if that's working).


----------



## RichT (Dec 5, 2021)

Lodge/Bar situation is CRAZY!!!!! Can't go upstairs unless you show vax card. Bar has a No shots till the lift close for the day policy plus a 2 drink MAX limit with a 45 minute maximum time limit, not sure if you can leave to go ski and come back in to do the 2 drink 45 minute thing again. I did hear that they would know because of the time stamp on your "cashless" transaction. No seats, bar stools, music or TV will be allowed, Was also told that cashless is going to be permanent this along with all the new cameras, Vail will know when and where you are at all times now! Was at bar yesterday at 2 pm.............two bartenders and only two patrons were there, so sorry for the employees!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (Jon). Check out "Bar Charlie's at Hunter Mountain" FB page for more info! Does anyone have any intel about this being the same thru out all of the Vail properties?? I don't think Windham and Bellayre have these kind of silly rules.


----------



## jimmywilson69 (Dec 5, 2021)

I mean if drinking in expensive ski area bars is your thing I can see how this would be dissapointing.   I'll ski and then drink my much better beer at my car before I leave.


----------



## RichT (Dec 5, 2021)

jimmywilson69 said:


> I mean if drinking in expensive ski area bars is your thing I can see how this would be dissapointing.   I'll ski and then drink my much better beer at my car before I leave.


It's not so much the drinking as it's the socialization, I know a lot of people who've meet there husband/wife's at that bar!


----------



## ss20 (Dec 5, 2021)

jimmywilson69 said:


> I mean if drinking in expensive ski area bars is your thing I can see how this would be dissapointing.   I'll ski and then drink my much better beer at my car before I leave.



I rarely drink during the ski day, but if I do, it's at the car with friends.  I was never big on going to bars with friends...I'd rather have a few friends over at the house, play tunes WE like on the speaker, drink beer we like, and sit on my own couch.  

I can count on one hand the number of times I've gone to a bar and had genuinely enjoyable company with strangers I didn't know...beyond small talk.


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Dec 5, 2021)

Yeah only time I have ever had a drink at a ski area bar is when going to Loon with a friend who was a local and knew half the folks in the bar. I won't generally drink in the lot either. Maybe have one at dinner or in the hotel.


----------



## Kingslug20 (Dec 5, 2021)

What about the K club bar...its where i go


----------



## ThatGuy (Dec 5, 2021)

ss20 said:


> I rarely drink during the ski day, but if I do, it's at the car with friends.  I was never big on going to bars with friends...I'd rather have a few friends over at the house, play tunes WE like on the speaker, drink beer we like, and sit on my own couch.
> 
> I can count on one hand the number of times I've gone to a bar and had genuinely enjoyable company with strangers I didn't know...beyond small talk.


Same here, music I don’t like thats so loud my ears hurt isn't my scene at all. Most of my friends love it though so to each their own.


----------



## drjeff (Dec 5, 2021)

I guess it depends on how much of a "regular" one is at the base lodge bar that shapes one's perspective on this.

I know that the preferred base lodge bar at Mount Snow that my wife and I and SO many of our Mount Snow friends go to, is currebtly slated to re-open next weekend for the 1st time sincve March of 2020, and in talking with many over the last few weeks, we can't wait to be back there, having a few apres ski beverages and socializing with our friends. It's definitely a friends and commraderie thing for some, whereas for other's it no different than say going to some random bar when they're on a trip where they may not know anyone more than who they may have gone in there with


----------



## zyk (Dec 5, 2021)

Tailgating...  Have made great friends in parking lots... Not as creepy as it sounds
Best late season but I'll grill in almost any weather and the car bar is always open.


----------



## 180 (Dec 5, 2021)

Hunter Bar is legendary and a tradition for regulars. If you've never spent a Saturday Happy Hour there don't knock. Same for base lodge bars around the world.  I've spent countless fun times in bars at ski resorts around the world. Tailgating is also a fantastic way to end the day. All depends on the moment.


----------



## RichT (Dec 6, 2021)

drjeff said:


> I guess it depends on how much of a "regular" one is at the base lodge bar that shapes one's perspective on this.
> 
> I know that the preferred base lodge bar at Mount Snow that my wife and I and SO many of our Mount Snow friends go to, is currebtly slated to re-open next weekend for the 1st time sincve March of 2020, and in talking with many over the last few weeks, we can't wait to be back there, having a few apres ski beverages and socializing with our friends. It's definitely a friends and commraderie thing for some, whereas for other's it no different than say going to some random bar when they're on a trip where they may not know anyone more than who they may have gone in there with


Let us all know if they implement the same stupid rules that Hunter has, i'm afraid this is a Vail=Fail rule thru out all of their resorts (but hope i'm wrong).


----------



## drjeff (Dec 6, 2021)

RichT said:


> Let us all know if they implement the same stupid rules that Hunter has, i'm afraid this is a Vail=Fail rule thru out all of their resorts (but hope i'm wrong).


Per one of my ffiends on Saturday, the bar at Carinthia was open, with no time or drink limit restrictions.  The Hunter yhing might be more of as Gov Hochul thing than a Vail thing


----------



## abc (Dec 6, 2021)

ss20 said:


> I rarely drink during the ski day, but if I do, it's at the car with friends.  I was never big on going to bars with friends...I'd rather have a few friends over at the house, play tunes WE like on the speaker, drink beer we like, and sit on my own couch.
> 
> I can count on one hand the number of times I've gone to a bar and had genuinely enjoyable company with strangers


What a revelation! I'm not the only one who doesn't care for bars!!!

For me, it's the loud music that really annoys me. So yeah, tailgating is actually better. That is, when the weather is warm enough for it. 

I do enjoy meeting strangers. I look forward to full chairs the coming season.


----------



## cdskier (Dec 6, 2021)

drjeff said:


> The Hunter yhing might be more of as Gov Hochul thing than a Vail thing


That really makes no sense. There's plenty of bars/restaurants open in NY and I've never heard of any other restrictions like this at any of them.


----------



## abc (Dec 6, 2021)

There's no time limit in the rest of NY. 

It may just be a Hunter thing? Nothing more...


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Dec 6, 2021)

Blissfully unaware of all the lodge drama. And will hit my favorite local spots after my day or just invite people back to my place for a drink or two. Maybe make a nice fire and play some music.  chill....    F the lodge and all the posers...
.
My checklist.....
Parking spots available? check
Lifts open? check
People manning lifts? check
North Face area lot open?  not yet - but soon so I can avoid the whole base lodge BS..  I can wait.


----------



## drjeff (Dec 10, 2021)

Per friends who hit opening day today of the Station Taproom at Mount Snow (one of our base lodge bars) - no time limit, 2 drinks an hour maximum, no reservations needed, just tell the person at the host stand that you're headed up there and all good, for now atleast....


----------



## 180 (Dec 13, 2021)

Heard the bar staff started the mask mandate early Saturday night....


----------



## RichT (Dec 13, 2021)

180 said:


> Heard the bar staff started the mask mandate early Saturday night....


Yep looks like ALL the Fail resorts have gone that way. We'll see how it pans out once if ever the weather gets going the right way. Pray for snow, cause the snowmaking ain't cutting it!


----------



## cdskier (Dec 13, 2021)

RichT said:


> Yep looks like ALL the Fail resorts have gone that way. We'll see how it pans out once if ever the weather gets going the right way. Pray for snow, cause the snowmaking ain't cutting it!


Eh? Effective 12/13 masks are required indoors in NY across the board. Can't blame Vail for that. The only exception is if the business has a vaccine mandate and only allows vaccinated people in, then they're not required to adhere to the new NYS mask mandate.


----------



## Kingslug20 (Dec 20, 2021)

Guns going on all open trails..which isnt much . If they dont open more its going to be sporty this weekend. Skiing really nice though..im sticking to mainline and overlook.


----------



## Jersey Skier (Dec 20, 2021)

Kingslug20 said:


> Guns going on all open trails..which isnt much . If they dont open more its going to be sporty this weekend. Skiing really nice though..im sticking to mainline and overlook.



Epic probably can't afford to blow more.  The Slutsky's would have had the mountain blasting like a blizzard.


----------



## abc (Dec 20, 2021)

Jersey Skier said:


> Epic probably can't afford to blow more.  The Slutsky's would have had the mountain blasting like a blizzard.


I'm not sure that's fair. It's been god awful hot this past week


----------



## Jersey Skier (Dec 20, 2021)

abc said:


> I'm not sure that's fair. It's been god awful hot this past week


I guess we'll see what happens this week. With lower temps and Xmas week coming, it's now or never.


----------



## Kingslug20 (Dec 20, 2021)

The cliff is all grass.
Racers edge...eisenhower
All grass


----------



## JimG. (Dec 20, 2021)

Kingslug20 said:


> The cliff is all grass.
> Racers edge...eisenhower
> All grass


Yeah I noticed all that when I picked up a pair of skis at The Pro last Thurs.

The weather has been horrible.


----------



## Kingslug20 (Dec 20, 2021)

But the skiing today was great...mainline was deep..bumped up...did a few on overlook and minya..a good day
Then i spent hours in traffic..truck jacknifed on the thruway..BIG mess.


----------



## asnowmobiler (Dec 20, 2021)

abc said:


> I'm not sure that's fair. It's been god awful hot this past week


I believe he was referring to what is going on now, not this past week.


----------



## 180 (Dec 21, 2021)

Upper Crossover ready to open!


----------



## RichT (Dec 21, 2021)

180 said:


> Upper Crossover ready to open!


Website shows it open since this morning, do you mean the website's wrong????????????


----------



## zyk (Dec 21, 2021)

180 said:


> Upper Crossover ready to open!


Well its something.  Not the great old hold my beer and watch this snowmaking days but something anyway.

Weather has been tough.  I'm NW of hunter at 1200 ft in a valley and it was over 40 today...


----------



## Mum skier (Dec 24, 2021)

We are at Hunter right now, and honestly compared to the Vail disaster so far in NH, in actual fact Hunter does not suck! Got here, Christmas Eve about 1.00, could not check into hotel (splurge for Christmas on the Katerskill Mountain club) but cunning plan to drive there and “try” to check in, as they said we could just leave the car there. Got stuff on at car, walked out to slope (couldn’t quite ski the access slope, but short downhill walk). No lift line even for the 6-pack. Compared to Sunapee, so many runs open (okay its all relative....). Belt parkway, Hellgate, Minya Konga, K27, Cloud 9, Kennedy. Haven’t been to Hunter for years so the run to the new North lift was new for us. Looks like some of west side (way-out) is ready to open and groomed, so hoping for tomorrow. Some ice, but it’s Hunter so we expected it. Not as bad as Sunapee last weekend.

Amazed at the lack of lines and crowds. Hoping for another quiet day tomorrow.

Kids in pool and adults drinking beer. Happy Christmas.....


----------



## Kingslug20 (Dec 24, 2021)

See...Hunter doesnt suck..as so many think..
I had a great time there a few days ago with only a few runs open..but the guns going full blast...manmade powder day...


----------



## IceEidolon (Dec 24, 2021)

The core trails with new fans and auto/flood system towers are the easy trails to run. It'll be interesting how the last 25% of trails open but Hunter had a core of automation and modernization when Peaks sold, and Vail's added to it (though there aren't as many compressors as there used to be).


----------



## Kingslug20 (Dec 24, 2021)

They tend to neglect the west side..


----------



## andrec10 (Dec 24, 2021)

Kingslug20 said:


> They tend to neglect the west side..


We know....


----------



## Kingslug20 (Dec 25, 2021)




----------



## RichT (Dec 25, 2021)

Mum skier said:


> We are at Hunter right now, and honestly compared to the Vail disaster so far in NH, in actual fact Hunter does not suck! Got here, Christmas Eve about 1.00, could not check into hotel (splurge for Christmas on the Katerskill Mountain club) but cunning plan to drive there and “try” to check in, as they said we could just leave the car there. Got stuff on at car, walked out to slope (couldn’t quite ski the access slope, but short downhill walk). No lift line even for the 6-pack. Compared to Sunapee, so many runs open (okay its all relative....). Belt parkway, Hellgate, Minya Konga, K27, Cloud 9, Kennedy. Haven’t been to Hunter for years so the run to the new North lift was new for us. Looks like some of west side (way-out) is ready to open and groomed, so hoping for tomorrow. Some ice, but it’s Hunter so we expected it. Not as bad as Sunapee last weekend.
> 
> Amazed at the lack of lines and crowds. Hoping for another quiet day tomorrow.
> 
> Kids in pool and adults drinking beer. Happy Christmas.....


It'll be quiet...........with all the rain.


----------



## JimG. (Dec 25, 2021)

Kingslug20 said:


> See...Hunter doesnt suck..as so many think..
> I had a great time there a few days ago with only a few runs open..but the guns going full blast...manmade powder day...


Hunter doesn't suck.

Vail sucks.


----------



## Kingslug20 (Dec 25, 2021)

Ex.....actly......


----------



## RichT (Dec 25, 2021)

JimG. said:


> Hunter doesn't suck.
> 
> Vail sucks.


10000000% correct!


----------



## Kingslug20 (Dec 25, 2021)

I miss the days when the Slutskys owned it...
It was my kind of place...now...not so much..
Yet i still like going there when conditions are good..
Probably wont be there much now that ill be up north.


----------



## Mum skier (Dec 25, 2021)

RichT said:


> It'll be quiet...........with all the rain.


Yes today was absolutely deserted out there. Skied from about 11 to 3.30. Rain stopped for a couple hours over the middle of the day. So quiet they gave up on a couple of the slow lifts as they weren’t needed.  So second year in a row we spent skiing in the rain on Christmas Day, but it was a great day, ski on every lift and quiet runs, with softer snow than yesterday.

The only thing I’d say sucked was they had no park features out at all. Would have been so easy to set up some small things on one of the lower runs.

The rain has destroyed some runs, Belt Parkway is barely passable in places. Glad we are done with our skiing, will not be much left for the busy Christmas to New Year week.


----------



## da-bum (Dec 29, 2021)

Mum skier said:


> We are at Hunter right now, and honestly compared to the Vail disaster so far in NH, in actual fact Hunter does not suck! Got here, Christmas Eve about 1.00, could not check into hotel (splurge for Christmas on the Katerskill Mountain club) but cunning plan to drive there and “try” to check in, as they said we could just leave the car there. Got stuff on at car, walked out to slope (couldn’t quite ski the access slope, but short downhill walk). No lift line even for the 6-pack. Compared to Sunapee, so many runs open (okay its all relative....). Belt parkway, Hellgate, Minya Konga, K27, Cloud 9, Kennedy. Haven’t been to Hunter for years so the run to the new North lift was new for us. Looks like some of west side (way-out) is ready to open and groomed, so hoping for tomorrow. Some ice, but it’s Hunter so we expected it. Not as bad as Sunapee last weekend.
> 
> Amazed at the lack of lines and crowds. Hoping for another quiet day tomorrow.
> 
> Kids in pool and adults drinking beer. Happy Christmas.....


I am amazed at the your decription of lack of crowds on friday.  I was off from work the whole week and decided to ski 3 weekdays on that week.  Looking at the weather, and the usual crowd that builds up on friday, especially one that butts up against a holiday week.  I decided to do a M/Tu/Wed trip.  They were blowing snow on the main mountain all day on monday, but tues and wed were sunny and just above snowmaking temp, so they were great days.  But I didn't encounter any instance where the 6-pack had no lines.  The only lift that had no lift line was the 6-pack on Hunter North (What I think of no lift-line is being able to ski right to the chair, which is how it use to be on the lifts at Hunter North and West, weekdays pre-pandemic).  On Wed, the crowd was getting more crowded than Mon/Tue, with lots more family w/kids and snowboarder gangs.  In fact, I was thinking of heading back on friday since staycation usually meaning someone wanting me to do chores, but thought the likelyhood of crowds and decided against it.  Maybe it the forecast of rain on Sat that caused many people to not show up?

Also, EpicMix's lift wait time is useless.  Maybe its the lack of users to crowdsource, but that should still give a short wait time instead of what I oberved to be 6-9min in the North 6-pack.


----------



## catskillman (Jan 9, 2022)

Another tough season, tough snowmaking, no staff, confusion, etc.....

BUT - I am sure you are all happy Vail is adressing this important issue?









						Hunter Mountain ski resorts suing over name and logo
					

The Hunter Mountain ski resort is suing a nearby lodge owner, contending in federal court...




					www.timesunion.com


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Jan 9, 2022)

Valid and important suit to bring IMO, as trademark owners can lose rights to marks they don't enforce vigilantly.


----------



## So Inclined (Jan 9, 2022)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> Valid and important suit to bring IMO, as trademark owners can lose rights to marks they don't enforce vigilantly.


Yep. Not a lawyer here, but as far as I understand it, trademark owners are legally compelled to fight these things even if it makes them look super shitty (which it sometimes does, but I'm not sure that's really the case here.) That's how you get the likes of Dodge suing dinky rural high schools for using the Ram logo for their football teams and whatnot. I guess the middle ground, at least in cases like that, would be to charge a nominal rights fee? Less likely here though.


----------



## PAabe (Jan 9, 2022)

Copyright in this country is so f'd up


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Jan 9, 2022)

PAabe said:


> Copyright in this country is so f'd up


Trademark


----------



## catskillman (Jan 9, 2022)

There is a Hunter Mountain brewery, and beers with some version of the name.  Are they going to go after them?  

Hunter mountai is the name of the next mountain range that the skiing is not on at all by the way !!!


----------



## abc (Jan 9, 2022)

So Inclined said:


> Yep. Not a lawyer here, but as far as I understand it, trademark owners are legally compelled to fight these things even if it makes them look super shitty (which it sometimes does, but I'm not sure that's really the case here.)


I guess the previous owner of Hunter didn't have a good lawyer?


----------



## chuckstah (Jan 9, 2022)

catskillman said:


> Another tough season, tough snowmaking, no staff, confusion, etc.....
> 
> BUT - I am sure you are all happy Vail is adressing this important issue?
> 
> ...


I'd paint Vail Sucks over the logo and be done with it. Probably be sold out going forward.


----------



## Kingslug20 (Jan 9, 2022)

Vail knows nothing about Hunter


----------



## RichT (Jan 9, 2022)

abc said:


> I guess the previous owner of Hunter didn't have a good lawyer?


The original owners weren't Scumbags!!!!


----------



## millerm277 (Jan 9, 2022)

Not a Vail fan in the least, but IMO they're not exactly in the wrong here. Naming your hotel the _exact _same thing as the ski area's full name is a bit much. It is the 2nd result on Google Maps and I wouldn't be surprised if it occasionally leads to confused tourists for those coming in from the West.

I don't see them suing the "Hunter Inn" or any other "Hunter" named businesses in town. That would seem unreasonable.


----------



## cdskier (Jan 10, 2022)

So this is interesting...it seems "Hunter Mountain" (and the logo) was only officially trademarked in 2020 (aka by Vail after they bought it).


----------



## PAabe (Jan 10, 2022)

The logo is nothing special and I can't believe our bonehead trademark system actually granted a trademark for "Hunter Mountain"...
Interesting but I can see why it wouldn't have been done earlier


----------



## Smellytele (Jan 10, 2022)

PAabe said:


> The logo is nothing special and I can't believe our bonehead trademark system actually granted a trademark for "Hunter Mountain"...
> Interesting but I can see why it wouldn't have been done earlier


Would have been funny if the Lodge had trade marked it…


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Jan 10, 2022)

Any time anyone files an application to register a mark other interested parties are given an opportunity to contest it before the registration is granted.


----------



## cdskier (Jan 10, 2022)

Smellytele said:


> Would have been funny if the Lodge had trade marked it…


They actually did submit an application for "Hunter Mountain Resort" several months before Vail submitted the "Hunter Mountain" trademark requests. However it shows they then abandoned the request later that same year. Not sure if they just didn't follow through with paperwork or if something was contested and they had no response, etc.


----------



## abc (Jan 10, 2022)

RichT said:


> The original owners weren't Scumbags!!!!


You didn't read the post above I quoted who argued Vail isn't being scumbag because they are "_*legally compelled to fight these things*_"?



So Inclined said:


> trademark owners are *legally compelled to fight these things* even if it makes them look super shitty


----------



## catskillman (Jan 10, 2022)

One other thing = 
for as long as anyone remembers the Hunter/Tannersville school kids PE class, if they chose, was to ski for 10 weeks.  The school district bused the kids there 2 days a week.  The mountain provided lessons, lift ticket and rentals if needed.

Vail discontinued this !!!  There is not a lot of money in town so most of these kids won't get to ski.

Windham mountain gives every kid in the school district a FREE Season Pass.

Vail Fail.....


----------



## Kingslug20 (Jan 10, 2022)

Forget what was....


----------



## RichT (Jan 11, 2022)

Today was a surprise!!!! Cold but they had many guns on, conditions were awesome!!!!!!! I stopped to thank a snowmaker on the great job their doing and he said there were three YES three of them working that's all. I have to commend them, they got Ike open in three days, Jimmy is open as is Cliff. GREAT JOB GUYS! BTW no snowmaking on North and West will not be opened this year, I was told.
VAIL still SUCKS!


----------



## So Inclined (Jan 11, 2022)

RichT said:


> I have to commend them, they got Ike open in three days, Jimmy is open as is Cliff. GREAT JOB GUYS! BTW no snowmaking on North and West will not be opened this year, I was told.
> VAIL still SUCKS!



Cliff was outstanding on Sunday, but then everything was if you were willing to brave the freezing rain. Such a bummer to hear that about the West side but it's not surprising. And if they're not blowing snow on Twilight now, when will they?
I'll bet a dollar the E Lift doesn't spin this year either.


----------



## cdskier (Jan 11, 2022)

RichT said:


> Today was a surprise!!!! Cold but they had many guns on, conditions were awesome!!!!!!! I stopped to thank a snowmaker on the great job their doing and he said there were three YES three of them working that's all. I have to commend them, they got Ike open in three days, Jimmy is open as is Cliff. GREAT JOB GUYS! BTW no snowmaking on North and West will not be opened this year, I was told.
> VAIL still SUCKS!



Did they give a reason for not planning to open West this year? Just lack of staff?


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Jan 11, 2022)

Bites if they will not open West which has the most legit terrain on Mt and is a reliable refuge from crowds.

Expect they will if they get enough of a natural dump to do so, as it would then take minimal effort to open some of it ungroomed.


----------



## PAabe (Jan 11, 2022)

Vail just casually planning on not opening half of the most popular ski destination of the biggest city in the country

On the positive side maybe this will benefit operations such as Plattekill which will have more expert terrain open than Hunter


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Jan 11, 2022)

PAabe said:


> Vail just casually planning on not opening half of the most popular ski destination of the biggest city in the country
> 
> On the positive side maybe this will benefit Laszlo's operation down the road


It's no more than 25% of the terrain, but it is the most legit terrain along with (also not open) Lower K27, Racer's Edge and the Milky Way and North side Glades.


----------



## PAabe (Jan 11, 2022)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> It's no more than 25% of the terrain, but it is the most legit terrain along with (also not open) Lower K27, Racer's Edge and the Milky Way and North side Glades.


Is Hunter One likely also not opening?


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Jan 11, 2022)

PAabe said:


> Is Hunter One likely also not opening?


Yeah they don't have much of that (now Hunter East) open. Can't say I have ever ventured over there, and most years they don't open much of that - only the green stuff. As not much demand for a black trail on a bunny hill. That must be well under 5% of the terrain.


----------



## JimG. (Jan 11, 2022)

No West side at all?

Blasphemy!!


----------



## So Inclined (Jan 11, 2022)

PAabe said:


> Is Hunter One likely also not opening?


Hunter East (nee One), which is really just a learner pod, is about 55% open. Two of the three green runs suitable for beginners are open, and hopefully the third will get going soonish? By the weekend?
There's also a couple shortish but decent enough blue runs - low-key the best place on the mountain for advanced beginners/low intermediates to go to learn how to deal with a little pitch and narrowness - accessed by an old cantankerous double above them. I'll be very happy if they actually decide to open that terrain at all, but given how things are going I'll believe it when I see it.
I cynically surmised above that they might not want to run E Lift (the double mentioned above) at all this year, but I'm pretty sure they'll get around to opening up the Highlands for the racers and that's how you get up there, so.


----------



## RichT (Jan 11, 2022)

cdskier said:


> Did they give a reason for not planning to open West this year? Just lack of staff?


He did not.


----------



## RichT (Jan 11, 2022)

So Inclined said:


> Hunter East (nee One), which is really just a learner pod, is about 55% open. Two of the three green runs suitable for beginners are open, and hopefully the third will get going soonish? By the weekend?
> There's also a couple shortish but decent enough blue runs - low-key the best place on the mountain for advanced beginners/low intermediates to go to learn how to deal with a little pitch and narrowness - accessed by an old cantankerous double above them. I'll be very happy if they actually decide to open that terrain at all, but given how things are going I'll believe it when I see it.
> I cynically surmised above that they might not want to run E Lift (the double mentioned above) at all this year, but I'm pretty sure they'll get around to opening up the Highlands for the racers and that's how you get up there, so.


Highlands??? I bet there's maybe five people that still work there that knows of the Highlands.


----------



## So Inclined (Jan 11, 2022)

RichT said:


> Highlands??? I bet there's maybe five people that still work there that knows of the Highlands.


Race team people do. That slope gets opened up every year just for the racers. I've never been on it myself


----------



## JimG. (Jan 11, 2022)

So Inclined said:


> Race team people do. That slope gets opened up every year just for the racers. I've never been on it myself


Great area to hike for turns after a snowfall.


----------



## Kingslug20 (Jan 12, 2022)

The west is the first to get knocked off..big..expensive to blow...you know..what vail hates to do..spend money on...skiing stuff


----------



## danimals (Jan 12, 2022)

Kingslug20 said:


> The west is the first to get knocked off..big..expensive to blow...you know..what vail hates to do..spend money on...skiing stuff


West has always been the last to open. Even under peak, westway only opened after a large storm, and annapurna almost never. So running zephyr lift to access clair's and a way back up for people who turned onto wayout from belt seems like a waste. I liked it because that lift was (havent been since spring 2020) always a ski on and never had to share a lift with anyone. 

I dont think running the west side made financial sense under peak, and i think vail is just souless enough to act on it. West needs work. maybe one more route down they can open regularly, whether its better and reliable snowmaking and openign on annapurna, or utilizing that old cut as part of a blue/single black (could have a traverse over to it from right before the steep parts of annapurna). this would at least allow some more traffic to head that way. 

Also, why not utlize the hunter north area as a second lodge? or at least have something like montage mountain's midland there.


----------



## So Inclined (Jan 12, 2022)

danimals said:


> Also, why not utlize the hunter north area as a second lodge? or at least have something like montage mountain's midland there.



I heard this was in the longer-term plans for the North pre-VR. Not sure if Peaks ever announced that publicly, though. Who knows what the plans are now.


----------



## catskillman (Jan 12, 2022)

spoke to an "employee" today = told that the snow guns at the bottom of racers have an issue.  The west side lift is ready to go, not waiting for a part as was the rumour.  Need snowmaking top open the west.

There are only 3 snowmakers !!  and I am sure there are not an extra 7 or 8 lifties sitting around waiting to go to work on the west side.


----------



## So Inclined (Jan 12, 2022)

catskillman said:


> There are only 3 snowmakers !!  and *I am sure there are not an extra 7 or 8 lifties sitting around waiting to go to work on the west side*.



If they didn't have the J1s at the lifts this season, _ceteris paribus_, I don't know how they would even open the mountain.


----------



## IceEidolon (Jan 12, 2022)

For perspective, Hunter used to have teams of 20+ per shift in the days of yore, and ~12 per shift +/- a couple in the early Peaks days. This included some guys that grew up on the mountain and their kids grew up on the mountain working Ops. 

Do you know if that includes compressor and pump operators - if so, they're running at least some equipment unattended that previously was monitored in person. Three people also means they have to be a lot slower starting and stopping - previously they could start three trails at once easily. Front face auto Polecats and auto and flood system HKDs are saving their bacon.


----------



## catskillman (Jan 12, 2022)

So Inclined said:


> If they didn't have the J1s at the lifts this season, _ceteris paribus_, I don't know how they would even open the mountain.


you are 100% correct!!  There are about 30 from what I understand.  Most from Paraguay.    All staying together at the Green Mountain Inn in Tannersville which has only 16 bathrooms with 28 beds.    Vail has rented this through Marh 31st from a Hassidic sect.  Old Old rundown inn.


----------



## So Inclined (Jan 12, 2022)

catskillman said:


> you are 100% correct!!  There are about 30 from what I understand.  Most from Paraguay.    All staying together at the Green Mountain Inn in Tannersville which has only 16 bathrooms with 28 beds.    Vail has rented this through Marh 31st from a Hassidic sect.  Old Old rundown inn.


Old old rundown Tannersville inn for employee housing? Do not give Vail any ideas.


----------



## catskillman (Jan 13, 2022)

So Inclined said:


> Old old rundown Tannersville inn for employee housing? Do not give Vail any ideas.


Honestly, that is where they are staying this year.  The past years were not much better.  They used to stay in the village at an old old pink house that they could walk to the mountain.  Another year they stayed at the old rollar rink in Tannersville, across from the post office.


----------



## KustyTheKlown (Jan 13, 2022)

catskillman said:


> Honestly, that is where they are staying this year.  The past years were not much better.  They used to stay in the village at an old old pink house that they could walk to the mountain.  Another year they stayed at the old rollar rink in Tannersville, across from the post office.



i am picturing a bunch of cots in the center of a 1970s roller skating rink like its some post apocalyptic shelter

shoutout to hotskates formerly of lynbrook new york. which i just found out lasted all the way to 2019, which is impressive. 

there's a very specific smell of bad square pizza i will always associate with roller skating rinks.


----------



## Jersey Skier (Jan 13, 2022)

KustyTheKlown said:


> i am picturing a bunch of cots in the center of a 1970s roller skating rink like its some post apocalyptic shelter
> 
> shoutout to hotskates formerly of lynbrook new york. which i just found out lasted all the way to 2019, which is impressive.
> 
> there's a very specific smell of bad square pizza i will always associate with roller skating rinks.


I used to skate there and at Laces in Herricks. 

My most memorable night at Hotskates was when someone broke into my Datsun B210 and stole my Audiovox equalizer after I had carefully installed it where the ashtray used to be.


----------



## KustyTheKlown (Jan 13, 2022)

maybe the most early 80s sentence ever posted to this website


----------



## Jersey Skier (Jan 13, 2022)

KustyTheKlown said:


> maybe the most early 80s sentence ever posted to this website


Well they didn't get my Fox Remote radar detector since that was well hidden.


----------



## deadheadskier (Jan 13, 2022)

Kingslug20 said:


> The west is the first to get knocked off..big..expensive to blow...you know..what vail hates to do..spend money on...skiing stuff



That's a fair and reasonable excuse for an independent mountain operator during a bad weather year

....it is not a fair and reasonable excuse for a large corporation bragging about selling 70% more passes and having $1.5B on hand. 

That's the biggest problem with Vail.  They whine, complain and make an abundance of excuses.  The competition are not making nearly as many excuses, they're performing better and they are doing so even though they aren't the billionaire operators.


----------



## abc (Jan 13, 2022)

Vote with your wallet.

Make that big corporation small.


----------



## JimG. (Jan 13, 2022)

deadheadskier said:


> That's a fair and reasonable excuse for an independent mountain operator during a bad weather year
> 
> ....it is not a fair and reasonable excuse for a large corporation bragging about selling 70% more passes and having $1.5B on hand.
> 
> That's the biggest problem with Vail.  They whine, complain and make an abundance of excuses.  The competition are not making nearly as many excuses, they're performing better and they are doing so even though they aren't the billionaire operators.


After all, Hunter without the West Side is not Hunter. But Vail does not care about that.


----------



## Kingslug20 (Jan 13, 2022)

Vail has no idea what Hunter was..


----------



## abc (Jan 13, 2022)

JimG. said:


> After all, Hunter without the West Side is not Hunter. But Vail does not care about that.


Oh Vail will care, if they don't right now.

That's one of the biggest chunk of passholders in the east

Probably the biggest hit will be day pass buyers. If they don't see west side opening this year, they won't be buying these prepaid day passes next year.


----------



## x10003q (Jan 13, 2022)

Yesterday, Hunter was 49% open and 10 miles away, Windham was 74 percent open. I am lucky that my main place is Ikon.


----------



## catskillman (Jan 13, 2022)

x10003q said:


> Yesterday, Hunter was 49% open and 10 miles away, Windham was 74 percent open. I am lucky that my main place is Ikon.


3 snow makers total, 19 patrollers with covid, no help, big race tommorrow on Ike, with course reset.  Hmmmmmmmmm

But Russ will probably help with the rubber matts in the morning agian....well you never know


----------



## da-bum (Jan 13, 2022)

catskillman said:


> 3 snow makers total, 19 patrollers with covid, no help, big race tommorrow on Ike, with course reset.  Hmmmmmmmmm
> 
> But Russ will probably help with the rubber matts in the morning agian....well you never know


Ike was great, open but no direct access, so it was the almost untouched even by the end of day.

But the North has been closed, forcing everyone to come down the a frontside trails.

I presume Hunter will get its major capital improvement next year.  Okemo and Mt Snow both seem to be getting theirs this year.


----------



## PAabe (Jan 13, 2022)

Does Hunter really need capital improvements?  They have the capital, lifts in good shape, the mega snowmaking system - Vail just isn't using them.  They need to spend the money on actually operating their capital they already have.


----------



## x10003q (Jan 13, 2022)

da-bum said:


> Ike was great, open but no direct access, so it was the almost untouched even by the end of day.
> 
> But the North has been closed, forcing everyone to come down the a frontside trails.
> 
> I presume Hunter will get its major capital improvement next year.  Okemo and Mt Snow both seem to be getting theirs this year.


Will that capital improvement be a Toll Booth for the paid parking?


----------



## abc (Jan 13, 2022)

da-bum said:


> I presume Hunter will get its major capital improvement next year.  Okemo and Mt Snow both seem to be getting theirs this year.


Maybe Vail will put in higher capacity lifts to dump more people on half the trails that has snow.


----------



## cdskier (Jan 13, 2022)

What major capital improvements does Hunter need? Major/Key lifts are all relatively new. Already has a pretty powerful snow-making system. As PAabe pointed out, they need OpEx, not CapEx...


----------



## PAabe (Jan 14, 2022)

My favorite part is where they spend millions of dollars on new lifts but "can't afford" to pay somebody $16/hr to run them


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Jan 14, 2022)

cdskier said:


> What major capital improvements does Hunter need? Major/Key lifts are all relatively new. Already has a pretty powerful snow-making system. As PAabe pointed out, they need OpEx, not CapEx...


Does clearing the overgrown brush on West count?

I'd like to see them build out on peak above East


----------



## cdskier (Jan 14, 2022)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> Does clearing the overgrown brush on West count?
> 
> I'd like to see them build out on peak above East


Clearing overgrown brush would be OpEx...

So they can't open/run what they currently have, and you want to see them add more terrain/lifts?


----------



## Kingslug20 (Jan 14, 2022)

Redo the bathrooms..think thry havent changed in 20 years


----------



## Jersey Skier (Jan 14, 2022)

Kingslug20 said:


> Redo the bathrooms..think thry havent changed in 45 years


FIFY. That bathroom has been the same for as long as I've skied there.


----------



## IceEidolon (Jan 14, 2022)

They could remove the wall that says "Snowmaking capital of the world"...


----------



## Kingslug20 (Jan 14, 2022)

Replace it with a sign that says
VAIL SUCKS...


----------



## SnowRock (Jan 14, 2022)

I’ve had a brutal work week and just taking a look at this storm forecast. Looks like cats should do pretty decently and may be on the ok side for wind on Monday. 

I don’t know that I’ve ever chased snow at Hunter despite having ridden there a gazillion times over the years… would I be able to get to the mountain Monday AM if I drive up and got a cheap room in saugerties or somewhere like that Sunday night?  Or better off seeing if I can find anything closer to mountain. 

I’m a comfortable driver in snow… 4wd with defender LTX M/S tires so not true snows but have done me right in tough conditions before.


----------



## Kingslug20 (Jan 14, 2022)

Ive chased snow at hunter for 25 years..the roads are usualy plowed pretty well..tons of cheap hotels all over..
Think i stayed at the sunview last time.
My days at hunter are now over..


----------



## SnowRock (Jan 14, 2022)

Kingslug20 said:


> Ive chased snow at hunter for 25 years..the roads are usualy plowed pretty well..tons of cheap hotels all over..
> Think i stayed at the sunview last time.
> My days at hunter are now over..


Yeah that’s what I was wondering. Given holiday weekend probably an easier score to grab a room down near the thruway, but just wanted to make sure I could make it up 23


----------



## Kingslug20 (Jan 14, 2022)

Check out the sunview motel..its right down the road..


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Jan 14, 2022)

Pretty steep curvy narrow drive up 23 to Hunter. With a big storm expected I'd spend a bit more to stay in Hunter or Tannersville, though I usually use the HoJo just off exit 21.


----------



## da-bum (Jan 14, 2022)

Capital improvement like cut some easier trails on the west side (and turn westway into 2 trails so they can better make snow), so that half of the mountain would be better utilized.  I mean I love it when the North and West lifts are literally empty, but that becomes their justification of not opening them.  I remember when Windham opened their East Peak and only had black trails and a lift that the massive crowd can't directly reach.  I would ski only that on weekends, going down to the base only if I use the lodge or decided to ride the wheelchair double from mid-station.  Anyway, they cut some easier trails on the East Peak and turned the quad into a detachable. Now they have a legitimate 2nd mountain that could offload the crowd, although detrimental for skiers like me, it is better for the whole mountain.

I don't care so much about their ancient lodge.  Hunter was never about the apres or amenities.


----------



## abc (Jan 15, 2022)

da-bum said:


> Hunter was never about the apris or amenities.


I'd say Hunter is well known for the apres. 

But Hunter was never about the easy trails.


----------



## zyk (Jan 15, 2022)

SnowRock said:


> Yeah that’s what I was wondering. Given holiday weekend probably an easier score to grab a room down near the thruway, but just wanted to make sure I could make it up 23


Just a thought... Look to the west of hunter.  When I day tripped I would come in from the west because of where I live.  23a from that side is a nice road.  Not sure about lodging as I've never needed it.  Granted you'd have to drive past hunter and backtrack in the morning.


----------



## skidbump (Jan 15, 2022)

You know when Belleayre has more open by percentage then hunter on a no snow yr. Hunter skiers got fucked


----------



## Kingslug20 (Jan 15, 2022)

Its simple..vail has no idea if the history of Hunter..plus..they dont care..
Its like buying a classic car with a long history..then fucking it up..
Its a shame..


----------



## catskillman (Jan 15, 2022)

Kingslug20 said:


> Check out the sunview motel..its right down the road..


do not believe Sunview is open to the public any longer.  Purchased by a religious group.

try the Hunter Mountain Resort Motel, the one Vail is suing for trademark infringement.  It is past the mountain on 23A.    Or the old Roseberry's just opened again afer being redone.  Called the Americina or something similiar.


----------



## catskillman (Jan 15, 2022)

Ike and bleeker were closed yesterday for a Master's race.  Next Wednesday & Thursday it is the East Coast Police Races so some trail will be closed on both days.  There are several other races scheduled as they are supposedly having the local league but there is no info on the website, imagine that...


----------



## Kingslug20 (Jan 15, 2022)

The Hasidiks are buying up the town...oy


----------



## PAabe (Jan 15, 2022)

The Catskills - they don't call them the Jewish Alps for nothing


Kingslug20 said:


> The Hasidiks are buying up the town...oy


----------



## Kingslug20 (Jan 15, 2022)

Used to be the borscht belt


----------



## da-bum (Jan 15, 2022)

catskillman said:


> do not believe Sunview is open to the public any longer.  Purchased by a religious group.
> 
> try the Hunter Mountain Resort Motel, the one Vail is suing for trademark infringement.  It is past the mountain on 23A.    Or the old Roseberry's just opened again afer being redone.  Called the Americina or something similiar.



I think the Americana Mountain Lodge use to be the Mountain View Lodge.  They basically refurnished what was already a motel that was in pretty good condition and increased the price by 150%.  Seems like many of the lodging changed hand during this past year, from Washington Irving, Mountain View to Hunter Inn, not sure if Villa Vosilla changed hand, but it got renamed.  Was it time to cash out?

I've noticed almost every place has raised their price by 30-40% this year.  I can understand the increased labor cost of lodging where they require staffing, but I don't see why B&B's that's run part time by the homeowner also increase by similar amount.


----------



## catskillman (Jan 15, 2022)

da-bum said:


> I think the Americana Mountain Lodge use to be the Mountain View Lodge.  They basically refurnished what was already a motel that was in pretty good condition and increased the price by 150%.  Seems like many of the lodging changed hand during this past year, from Washington Irving, Mountain View to Hunter Inn, not sure if Villa Vosilla changed hand, but it got renamed.  Was it time to cash out?
> 
> I've noticed almost every place has raised their price by 30-40% this year.  I can understand the increased labor cost of lodging where they require staffing, but I don't see why B&B's that's run part time by the homeowner also increase by similar amount.


villa vosila was bought by a Hasidic group during the summer


----------



## Kingslug20 (Jan 15, 2022)

No way...they own like 5 hotels that i know now..and that's a big place


----------



## PAabe (Jan 15, 2022)

Borscht Belt revival


----------



## Kingslug20 (Jan 16, 2022)

Without Henny Youngman..it wont work


----------



## catskillman (Jan 16, 2022)

Kingslug20 said:


> No way...they own like 5 hotels that i know now..and that's a big place


yes.  took away about 80 rooms from the town.  They are using it in the winter.  Today as I left the mountain there were 2 Monsey buses parked there.  They have been skiing....


----------



## catskillman (Jan 16, 2022)

by the way the mountain was a SS again today.  Heard Vail put the incorrect blackout dates on the website for certain types of passholders, so X passholders (sinior, midweek passes whatever restricted passes) skied today as well as the regular passholders and the thousands who bought tickets.
  I should have know better and not gone today, as I know this is usually the busiest weekend....Crazy long lines, all skied off by 9am, I left by 10:30, place was jammed, hundreds in the ticket line, cars parcked everywhere along the roads, on hills and the ski shops in town were packed.


----------



## Kingslug20 (Jan 16, 2022)

Sounds....Epic..


----------



## 180 (Jan 16, 2022)

Crowds dissipated after 1:30pm.  Newly made snow on Upper 42 and Ike nice.  Rest was pretty shiny.


----------



## PAabe (Jan 16, 2022)

I find it interesting that MLK weekend is busier than Presdient's despite President's usually having much better conditions


----------



## ss20 (Jan 16, 2022)

PAabe said:


> I find it interesting that MLK weekend is busier than Presdient's despite President's usually having much better conditions


Tighter ski window and universal days off with MLK.  President's week is no longer a full week at many schools.  And people who do get the full week usually aren't skiing the full 9 day stretch.  Meanwhile every school and many offices have MLK Monday off.


----------



## KustyTheKlown (Jan 17, 2022)

platty reporting 10-12" already. and i think catskills are gonna stay safe from mixing. region needs this one bad.


----------



## Jersey Skier (Jan 17, 2022)

KustyTheKlown said:


> platty reporting 10-12" already. and i think catskills are gonna stay safe from mixing. region needs this one bad.


And Hunter reports nothing since Vail can't be bothered to update their Snow Report.


----------



## catskillman (Jan 17, 2022)

Jersey Skier said:


> And Hunter reports nothing since Vail can't be bothered to update their Snow Report.


I checked at 9 am this morning and it showed no snowfall for the last 7 days.  
There is about a foot out there.  

The lift and trail status map is never updated either.  Now it has mad box closed, but it has been open for weeks.  It has drop off as a terrain park, which it hasen't been in years, and if they ever open it this year it is doubtful it will be a terrain park as they can't get the park ave one open.

There are NO events on the event schedule, yet there was a master's race last week, and there is the police ordeal this week for 2 days.  

I get that it is updated in CO, but someone needs to tell them current and accurate information.  Maybe Russ can do this or assign someone else since he no longer has the responsibility to put down the rubber matts any longer.

The north side parking lot has not been plowed yet, you really shuld plow a lot when you get 12 inches of snow.............


----------



## SnowRock (Jan 17, 2022)

Would say about a solid foot… plus whatever fell in the AM of high QPF cream cheese. Was on one of the first 10 chairs or so. Fun first couple runs. Then turned into some real thick and chopped up mashed with the traffic on the hill. 

Left by 11 and the lot and traffic scene was an enormous schit show. Carnage with dolts stuck everywhere, cars parking everywhere… solid 3/4 of a mile to mile line of growing traffic on 23A


----------



## Jersey Skier (Jan 17, 2022)

catskillman said:


> I checked at 9 am this morning and it showed no snowfall for the last 7 days.
> There is about a foot out there.
> 
> The lift and trail status map is never updated either.  Now it has mad box closed, but it has been open for weeks.  It has drop off as a terrain park, which it hasen't been in years, and if they ever open it this year it is doubtful it will be a terrain park as they can't get the park ave one open.
> ...


This pretty much sums up how much Vail cares about Hunter. No care for the skiers. I guess a powder day has no effect on share price, so it's not on their radar.


----------



## 180 (Jan 18, 2022)

Izzy was good to us, After we got done plundering the snow, we switched to mogul mode.  Every nook and cranny was a mogul. Plus still hit reserved pow on Gun Hill and K27 runout.  https://photos.app.goo.gl/CKXzEhScd6Lwdn3o7
Izz


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Jan 18, 2022)

180 said:


> Izzy was good to us, After we got done plundering the snow, we switched to mogul mode.  Every nook and cranny was a mogul. Plus still hit reserved pow on Gun Hill and K27 runout.  https://photos.app.goo.gl/CKXzEhScd6Lwdn3o7
> Izz



Way to get it!!!


----------



## da-bum (Jan 19, 2022)

catskillman said:


> do not believe Sunview is open to the public any longer.  Purchased by a religious group.
> 
> try the Hunter Mountain Resort Motel, the one Vail is suing for trademark infringement.  It is past the mountain on 23A.    Or the old Roseberry's just opened again afer being redone.  Called the Americina or something similiar.


I now mostly stay near Windham since they seem to have a larger variety of places that doesn't just cater to the ski and sleep crowd (gotta please the Missus, we kind of compromised in the middle, I came from packing a motel room or sleeping in a van, she came from ski-in/ski-out/spa world).


----------



## Kingslug20 (Jan 19, 2022)

I took my wife to "the mansion" hotel once....oy..never again..


----------



## catskillman (Jan 19, 2022)

conditions were good today, late morning line at 6 pack was long, but they had D open.  The East Coast Police Games were there so that took a lot off and sent them all to B for the race.  

The worst place on the mountain by far was the parking lot.  A total sheet of ice, because they never plowed.  Everyone was sliding and I saw one guy go down and land on his skis.  Said he was okay, but I find it hard to believe he is not feeling it now.  

They had some poor elderly man chopping sections of 4" ice by the ambulance enterance.  I commented that this is what happens when the do not plow....he said they tried to at some point but could not keep up with it...  

Oh _ getting off the 6 there were "2" mgt skier guys moving an orange cone and placing a rock on it as you unload.  2 mgt people to do this....

What a mess.....


----------



## catskillman (Jan 20, 2022)

and today.. snow was good , not crowded, f open D closed, overlook horrendes as usual.

Worst place again was the parking lot.  They had a front loader on the lower lot, but up top covered with ice.  Thankfully it warmed up a bit and some melted so it was better to walk out, but with negative temps tonight tomorrow morning will be worse than ever.

mgt guy was emptying out the trash can at the 9 pack.  on his knees seperating out the recycleable's .  Who gets the nickles???

every day gets crazier....can't make this stuff up.

Oh - there was a 2 day East Coast police race yesterday and today.  The mountain wound not feed them inside, however, for some reason the US Chef's can eat in.  Over 100 cops were packed into macgregors for dinner for 2 nights and opening cermony on tuesday.


----------



## 180 (Jan 21, 2022)

Blowing snow on Wayout and Clairs. Zephyr will be open soon.  Overlook groomed beautifully. No crowds. 0 degress. No wind. Racers open ungroomed natural.


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Jan 21, 2022)

I need to get out there today


----------



## Kingslug20 (Jan 21, 2022)

Hmmm...wonder if vail...is waking up to reality..


----------



## kendo (Jan 21, 2022)

I may have to end my boycott.


----------



## RichT (Jan 21, 2022)

I wonder if the Zephyr will open? Or do they have plans on using the Northern to load back up, head down Belt onto 6 pack to start over again????!!!!! Sounds like a Fail way to do things.


----------



## catskillman (Jan 22, 2022)

another debacle.... this morning at 8:30.  The fences for the que at the 6 pack had not been put up yet.  6 pack opened without them, free for all.  The comments in line were entertaining.  Suprisingly none were good...Hmmmmmmmm

Not sure what happened, all kinds of rumers I can't confirm, yet...


----------



## So Inclined (Jan 22, 2022)

Late morning status: Lines for B and the Flyer are predictably nuts, but if you know what you're doing and where to go (eg bumped-up Milky Way) it's actually not half bad.


----------



## RichT (Jan 22, 2022)

AND they put that "Mountain Excursions" Sno-Cat fenced in right in the middle of the runoff from the belt!! Dopes!


----------



## So Inclined (Jan 22, 2022)

QQ


RichT said:


> AND they put that "Mountain Excursions" Sno-Cat fenced in right in the middle of the runoff from the belt!! Dopes!


I laughed out loud. What are they thinking?


----------



## nycskier (Jan 22, 2022)

Today at Hunter was a disgrace. I've skied Hunter since I was a kid & have NEVER seen it as crowded as it was today (& I've been there over holiday weekends). Vail just keeps selling tickets WAY beyond the capacity of the mountain & does not give a rats ass. With #COVID you would think there would at least be some care about not packing the place to the gills but they don't care. The place was beyond overcrowded, 45 minute lift lines & they kept selling tickets to people strolling up. It was beyond ridiculous.


----------



## So Inclined (Jan 22, 2022)

nycskier said:


> Today at Hunter was a disgrace. I've skied Hunter since I was a kid & have NEVER seen it as crowded as it was today (& I've been there over holiday weekends). Vail just keeps selling tickets WAY beyond the capacity of the mountain & does not give a rats ass. With #COVID you would think there would at least be some care about not packing the place to the gills but they don't care. The place was beyond overcrowded, 45 minute lift lines & they kept selling tickets to people strolling up. It was beyond ridiculous.


I don't think they kept "selling tickets" per se in any meaningful numbers today. This is just what happens with 2.1 million Epic passes sold and no reservation system or other way of limiting the number of people on the mountain.


----------



## baykon (Jan 23, 2022)

nycskier said:


> Today at Hunter was a disgrace. I've skied Hunter since I was a kid & have NEVER seen it as crowded as it was today (& I've been there over holiday weekends). Vail just keeps selling tickets WAY beyond the capacity of the mountain & does not give a rats ass. With #COVID you would think there would at least be some care about not packing the place to the gills but they don't care. The place was beyond overcrowded, 45 minute lift lines & they kept selling tickets to people strolling up. It was beyond ridiculous.


it was brutal. i'm an epic passholder in the city and hadn't been to hunter all year. i'm under no illusions on saturday crowds but it exceeded my expectations. i didn't ride the flyer all morning, northern express singles line was basically ski on, so lapped overlook (which admittedly was pretty fun) and figured i'd move around in afternoon. tried the KF singles line 2x in the afternoon (once by accident when i spaced on skiing to F chair), and it took a chunk out of my day. could have sworn it was 40mins+ the second time. F chair was ok for singles but there was a decent line for groups.  

apparently they ran out of rental gear yesterday pretty early on as well


----------



## catskillman (Jan 23, 2022)

parking is out of control.  The road to the condo's and hotel was unpassable.  people could not get to their condo or the hotel because people parked literarly everywhere. !!  

Today, we went to leave at 11:30 and a religious school van blocked the enterance to the old $15 a day lot so anyone in the trird row was blocked in and could not leave.  I have seen this before.....


----------



## catskillman (Jan 23, 2022)

so Vail is supposed to be all about safety...  that water volcano under the 6 pack at the top of the double is growing in size and the color is now yellow.  This is a 3! pile of solid ice.  Today it was marked by a red lollipop at least.  Someone hits that and it is all over.......


----------



## catskillman (Jan 23, 2022)

SO the Ski School Director broke her tib, fib, both thumbs, and tore her ACL and MCL yesterday on the ice on Hellgate.

SO -
Why was the school school director free skiing on one of the busiest days of the year.  Yesterday was a zoo, but not as bad as the past 2 Saturdays
Why was she not helping out the instructors / teaching etc.  The mountain is turning away lessons due to the lack of instructors.
Why was she not recruiting instructors /coaches that were there from other mountains for the kids competiotion event
OR - novel idea why was she not watching these competitions, supporting Hunters competitors, and supporting their coaches

And - if the ice was too much for her, what does it tell you about the coditions at the mountain.  They desperatly need to make snow and groom in the moring.  Vail is allegedly all about safety but you would never it......


----------



## Kingslug20 (Jan 23, 2022)

I would simply. Stop going there..drive farther...


----------



## So Inclined (Jan 23, 2022)

catskillman said:


> SO the Ski School Director broke her tib, fib, both thumbs, and tore her ACL and MCL yesterday on the ice on Hellgate.
> 
> SO -
> Why was the school school director free skiing on one of the busiest days of the year.  Yesterday was a zoo, but not as bad as the past 2 Saturdays
> ...


Safe to say she was not free skiing.

Instructors have numerous clinics going on, both scheduled/formal and informal "anyone who's got 45 mins until their assignment begins, come out for a run and work on a skill" type things throughout the day. Maintaining a commitment to training and skill development among instructors is a really good thing for a ski school. Much better bet that that's what she was involved in, and something bad or unlucky happened. Shit happens. Speculation beyond that helps nothing.

The instructor shortage - a problem faced by ski schools all over the country - is not going to be changed in any meaningful way by recruiting people from other teams/mountains(!) in late January (!!!) Or, for that matter, by a director standing at a line-up.


----------



## So Inclined (Jan 23, 2022)

catskillman said:


> so Vail is supposed to be all about safety...  that water volcano under the 6 pack at the top of the double is growing in size and the color is now yellow.  This is a 3! pile of solid ice.  Today it was marked by a red lollipop at least.  Someone hits that and it is all over.......


I was even more concerned by the large band of ice I saw at the bottom of the first big pitch on Belt, but that's just me.


----------



## catskillman (Jan 23, 2022)

So Inclined said:


> Safe to say she was not free skiing.
> 
> Instructors have numerous clinics going on, both scheduled/formal and informal "anyone who's got 45 mins until their assignment begins, come out for a run and work on a skill" type things throughout the day. Maintaining a commitment to training and skill development among instructors is a really good thing for a ski school. Much better bet that that's what she was involved in, and something bad or unlucky happened. Shit happens. Speculation beyond that helps nothing.
> 
> The instructor shortage - a problem faced by ski schools all over the country - is not going to be changed in any meaningful way by recruiting people from other teams/mountains(!) in late January (!!!) Or, for that matter, by a director standing at a line-up.


Training , at Hunter??? , seriously?  big issue with instructors, they have all been failing exams...wasting money.  You name it.  And you don't train on Saturday with 7,000 perople on the slopes.

Also- they are turning down lessons - you think they are training........


----------



## So Inclined (Jan 23, 2022)

catskillman said:


> And you don't train on Saturday with 7,000 perople on the slopes.



Just when would anyone ever train at Hunter, then?
Patrol was practicing sledding each other down the bumps on Milky Way midday yesterday too.


----------



## catskillman (Jan 23, 2022)

So Inclined said:


> Just when would anyone ever train at Hunter, then?
> Patrol was practicing sledding each other down the bumps on Milky Way midday yesterday too.


pre opening, and whenever there is a break in business, which has been non existant.  

Trust me I know this


----------



## raisingarizona (Jan 23, 2022)

catskillman said:


> SO the Ski School Director broke her tib, fib, both thumbs, and tore her ACL and MCL yesterday on the ice on Hellgate.
> 
> SO -
> Why was the school school director free skiing on one of the busiest days of the year.  Yesterday was a zoo, but not as bad as the past 2 Saturdays
> ...


I don't think that's any of your business honestly. 

Slow your roll CatskillKaren.


----------



## ss20 (Jan 23, 2022)

I've skied plenty of Saturday runs in-uniform... sometimes doing things and sometimes just skiing.  

Today our assistant director skied with my group for a few runs as his kid is in my seasonal program.  

Hunter always had some really good pros...hope their training program hasn't gone to shit as claimed.


----------



## So Inclined (Jan 23, 2022)

catskillman said:


> pre opening, and whenever there is a break in business, which has been non existant.
> 
> Trust me I know this


"They all suck!"
"They should never train! Or only for the pre-dawn half hour or so that they're not even allowed to actually go up on the mountain."

Yeah, clearly you know whereof you speak. Any area's program would be blessed to have you in management, dude. An incalculable loss to them.


----------



## nycskier (Jan 23, 2022)

So Inclined said:


> I don't think they kept "selling tickets" per se in any meaningful numbers today. This is just what happens with 2.1 million Epic passes sold and no reservation system or other way of limiting the number of people on the mountain.


There was.a line all the way to the ski shop. And I went up the lift with someone who told me that they said they where "sold out" but they sold her 4 tickets for her family anyways.


----------



## catskillman (Jan 23, 2022)

So Inclined said:


> Just when would anyone ever train at Hunter, then?
> Patrol was practicing sledding each other down the bumps on Milky Way midday yesterday too.


but the ski patrol is not turning away business,  The ski school is and they do not have enough instructors.  And a lot are just waiting to get their 20 years pension and life time pass.  They will be gone.

Trust me... I know and I do not work for Vail


----------



## catskillman (Jan 23, 2022)

So Inclined said:


> I was even more concerned by the large band of ice I saw at the bottom of the first big pitch on Belt, but that's just me.


and the run out on huga and white cloud, and the top of D lift.....


----------



## catskillman (Jan 23, 2022)

raisingarizona said:


> I don't think that's any of your business honestly.
> 
> Slow your roll CatskillKaren.


Everyone that skis there should be concerned especially those that are financilly invested in the area and the mountain. passes, programs, real estate, commute time, on and on


----------



## catskillman (Jan 23, 2022)

ss20 said:


> I've skied plenty of Saturday runs in-uniform... sometimes doing things and sometimes just skiing.
> 
> Today our assistant director skied with my group for a few runs as his kid is in my seasonal program.
> 
> Hunter always had some really good pros...hope their training program hasn't gone to shit as claimed.


It went downhill many years ago when Mike Rogan and Robin Barnes left.  For a few years there was not even a trainer, and then it was eliminated when they let Suzy go.  They always published their certification rates, which included a national team member and 3 eastern team members at one time.  They have not done that in years and for good reason.  Suzy is the only examiner on staff and Gary the only PSIA training team member and they did not even use him for ITC becaues they did not want to pay his salary.  

enough said and I could go on......


So Inclined said:


> "They all suck!"
> "They should never train! Or only for the pre-dawn half hour or so that they're not even allowed to actually go up on the mountain."
> 
> Yeah, clearly you know whereof you speak. Any area's program would be blessed to have you in management, dude. An incalculable loss to them.


they have not been able to go up on the main mountain before opening for many years.  They used to go up and could just ski F lift and had to stay out of site, no hellgate etc until 1/2 hour after the mountain opened.


----------



## raisingarizona (Jan 23, 2022)

catskillman said:


> Everyone that skis there should be concerned especially those that are financilly invested in the area and the mountain. passes, programs, real estate, commute time, on and on


Your concerned about an instructor having a freeski run? Really? You need to get a life bud.


----------



## catskillman (Jan 23, 2022)

raisingarizona said:


> Your concerned about an instructor having a freeski run? Really? You need to get a life bud.


read the entire issue today, and then let me know.  consider it all as a customer...


----------



## raisingarizona (Jan 23, 2022)

catskillman said:


> read the entire issue today, and then let me know.  consider it all as a customer...


I think the main issue is that you’re at Hunter on a weekend. I can’t really relate to that customer. I mean seriously, how does a skier ever think that’s a good option?


----------



## catskillman (Jan 23, 2022)

raisingarizona said:


> I think the main issue is that you’re at Hunter on a weekend. I can’t really relate to that customer. I mean seriously, how does a skier ever think that’s a good option?


The only reason I was at hunter this weekend was for the kids race and mogul mash.  

Parents had to walk to the bottom of courses as the lift lines were so long they were afraid to miss their kids.  And kids were late for their times or had to stand in the freezing cold to wait their turn due to the long long lift lines.  Walking up an overcrowded mountain with in experienced skiers is not really safe....


----------



## catskillman (Jan 23, 2022)

raisingarizona said:


> Your concerned about an instructor having a freeski run? Really? You need to get a life bud.


This is the director.  Her employees are busting their ass in the freesing cold and she was out having a run...and they are turning away lessons due to lack of staff.


----------



## Kingslug20 (Jan 24, 2022)

Think its time for those affected..ie..vested interest in the area to band together and speak up..
Lot of money in that area..


----------



## So Inclined (Jan 24, 2022)

catskillman said:


> they have not been able to go up on the main mountain before opening for many years.  They used to go up and could just ski F lift and had to stay out of site, no hellgate etc until 1/2 hour after the mountain opened.


Yes, that was the point. Why the statement that they should be training pre-opening when they can't, through no fault of their own? If they were allowed to be doing that, they would be. Someone got badly hurt and "that's terrible, hope she is ok" would have been a lot more graceful a response as opposed to having a go at a whole bunch of people, slinging misinformed insults at them.



catskillman said:


> The ski school is and they do not have enough instructors.  And a lot are just waiting to get their 20 years pension and life time pass.  They will be gone.


The patrol was carting actual hurt people off the mountain left right and center on Saturday, and still training at the same time. Because you train when you can given the circumstances you're in. Hunter is a Vail mountain. You understand the past few weekends are the new normal there, right? It's going to look like that every weekend for the rest of the season, at least.

20 years' pension and lifetime pass for instructors, LOL what?


----------



## deadheadskier (Jan 24, 2022)

catskillman said:


> This is the director.  Her employees are busting their ass in the freesing cold and she was out having a run...and they are turning away lessons due to lack of staff.



The fault is with Vail wages and HR for lack of instructors.  It's not like the Director is going to pick up a class.  They can't. They need to be available to address issues.  Now I suppose you could say, she should have been in the ski school meeting area and helping direct traffic or answering guest questions.  But honestly, taking a run isn't that big of a deal.  There's actually some benefit to it.  She can experience what the conditions are like up on the hill and maybe convey potential problem areas to ski school staff.  "Don't take intermediate skiers here because it's icy or avoid this area cause it's real crowded, etc." 

The reality is if she hadn't gotten hurt, you and most others wouldn't have known the difference.  
You're making a mountain out of a molehill here.


----------



## So Inclined (Jan 24, 2022)

deadheadskier said:


> The fault is with Vail wages and HR for lack of instructors.  It's not like the Director is going to pick up a class.  They can't. They need to be available to address issues.  Now I suppose you could say, she should have been in the ski school meeting area and helping direct traffic or answering guest questions.  But honestly, taking a run isn't that big of a deal.  There's actually some benefit to it.  She can experience what the conditions are like up on the hill and maybe convey potential problem areas to ski school staff.  "Don't take intermediate skiers here because it's icy or avoid this area cause it's real crowded, etc."
> 
> The reality is if she hadn't gotten hurt, you and most others wouldn't have known the difference.
> You're making a mountain out of a molehill here.


This is it.
Also, best info I have is that it was a morning clinic, not skiing-for-funsies.


----------



## catskillman (Jan 24, 2022)

So Inclined said:


> Yes, that was the point. Why the statement that they should be training pre-opening when they can't, through no fault of their own? If they were allowed to be doing that, they would be. Someone got badly hurt and "that's terrible, hope she is ok" would have been a lot more graceful a response as opposed to having a go at a whole bunch of people, slinging misinformed insults at them.
> 
> 
> The patrol was carting actual hurt people off the mountain left right and center on Saturday, and still training at the same time. Because you train when you can given the circumstances you're in. Hunter is a Vail mountain. You understand the past few weekends are the new normal there, right? It's going to look like that every weekend for the rest of the season, at least.
> ...


yes - pension and lifetime pass for all employees.  Pass is for all Vail resorts, as opposed to the Hunter only lifetime pass that was given to others at 12 years of volunteer work.

Vail is honoring it.  Know of several who got it, and several trying to prove they have been there that long, as at one point the ski school was owned and operated by a 3rd party, Karl Plattner, which is a whole different story.

They train at Hunter 1/East.  No lift service, have to hike.  And there used to be many pre opening indoor clinics run by Katy, because she was nice and concerned...


----------



## catskillman (Jan 24, 2022)

deadheadskier said:


> The fault is with Vail wages and HR for lack of instructors.  It's not like the Director is going to pick up a class.  They can't. They need to be available to address issues.  Now I suppose you could say, she should have been in the ski school meeting area and helping direct traffic or answering guest questions.  But honestly, taking a run isn't that big of a deal.  There's actually some benefit to it.  She can experience what the conditions are like up on the hill and maybe convey potential problem areas to ski school staff.  "Don't take intermediate skiers here because it's icy or avoid this area cause it's real crowded, etc."
> 
> The reality is if she hadn't gotten hurt, you and most others wouldn't have known the difference.
> You're making a mountain out of a molehill here.


this is Hunter, it is almost all ice and usually crowded LOL.

Agree on the wages.  She is crashing in a group share house here.  No pun intended....


----------



## JimG. (Jan 24, 2022)

Vail does suck.


----------



## nycskier (Jan 24, 2022)

What I also fault Vail for is not having E lift open and spending the money to blow enough snow at the top of Hunter One (or Hunter East as they are calling it now). Having E lift open opens up the entire Hunter One for beginners and intermediate skiers. Takes pressure off of B & C lift and off of Belt Parkway as well as it gives beginners another option and more terrain to ski. Not having it open when they are as crowed as they are is ridiculous.


----------



## millerm277 (Jan 25, 2022)

nycskier said:


> What I also fault Vail for is not having E lift open and spending the money to blow enough snow at the top of Hunter One (or Hunter East as they are calling it now). Having E lift open opens up the entire Hunter One for beginners and intermediate skiers. Takes pressure off of B & C lift and off of Belt Parkway as well as it gives beginners another option and more terrain to ski. Not having it open when they are as crowed as they are is ridiculous.



While I think there's no (good) excuse for not having just about everything aside from maybe 44 + Taylors open at this point or being in the staffing situation they appear to be in, getting the West Side open represents far more lift/skier capacity than opening E lift does. And Colonels + Claires do distribute summit crowds better if they're open and in decent shape.

One old double doesn't exactly take that much off the beginner crowds. Not arguing it wouldn't be helpful, of course. But if you're short on lifties, having them running a HSQ is better than a double. (Related - have they been opening H lift on the weekends?)

--------

While it has been a long time since I skied much off E lift, I also don't recall much (if any?) fixed snowmaking infrastructure over there. There's certainly pipes/hydrants other than possibly West Side Glide, but I don't recall any fixed guns on any of the runs above the top of C/H lift, so I wonder if it's also coming back to staffing and how much additional work it is to make snow there vs the areas of the mountain with fixed guns. Still not a good excuse for why they can't manage to open _one_ run off it, but just theorizing.


----------



## So Inclined (Jan 25, 2022)

nycskier said:


> What I also fault Vail for is not having E lift open and spending the money to blow enough snow at the top of Hunter One (or Hunter East as they are calling it now). Having E lift open opens up the entire Hunter One for beginners and intermediate skiers. Takes pressure off of B & C lift and off of Belt Parkway as well as it gives beginners another option and more terrain to ski. Not having it open when they are as crowed as they are is ridiculous.



Those trails off E can be a real s***show when beginners find their way up there and discover that frantic power-wedge straightlining isn't an option anymore. But yeah, getting E spinning would make a small but welcome dent in the traffic elsewhere. They really should prioritize it over H.

Let's hope this helps!!


----------



## Newpylong (Jan 25, 2022)

How do you fix all of these issues? Speak. With. Your. Wallet.  No Vail, No Epic, ever ever. There are alternatives and you won't miss it. What has happened at Vail owned Eastern mountains save Mount Snow and Stowe is borderline criminal.


----------



## Kingslug20 (Jan 25, 2022)

Bingo


----------



## nycskier (Jan 26, 2022)

Vail sent me a customer satisfaction survey about my weekend trip to Hunter and I gave them a piece of my mind. Last weekend at Hunter was an absolute disgrace.


----------



## catskillman (Jan 26, 2022)

I went today.  Very cold, conditions overall pretty good.  I did not go to the north side due to the temp, light and wind.

Pluses I did notice =
The volcano has been knocked down.  Huge plus someone could have gotton hurt very badly.
The widended the bottom of Drop Off - remember how is was like a narrow half pipe leading into the parkway.  Now it is much wider, and more than one person can actually fit in there.
Barstools are back in the bar.  You have to wait in a line to get a drink on the one side still, which actaully may work for the better.  I remember having to sqeuuxe through people at the bar, get the bartenders attention, reach over them with drinks...

Minus -
The cost of the food is outrageous for what it is.  There were 3 employees standing benind the counter with nothing to do.  Pizza place is not open.  Wondering what happened to Carol!! She was a very hard worker.  Hope she is not back outside in the waffle shack.  She was treated real bad out there last season.
Masks are not being enforced.  Wheather you agree with it or not, noone wants to get sick, and everyone should follow the rules. Plus wearning one in the bathroom does have it's benefits.
The ski shop has very little merchandise, other than logo wear.  
Demo ski system has not been installed, and they have very few demos for when/if the system gets installed.


----------



## RichT (Jan 26, 2022)

nycskier said:


> Vail sent me a customer satisfaction survey about my weekend trip to Hunter and I gave them a piece of my mind. Last weekend at Hunter was an absolute disgrace.


That means they , probably read the first sentence and then threw it away. You won't hear from them again. Ask me how I know? I did the same at the beginning of December.................got ghosted.


----------



## RichT (Jan 26, 2022)

catskillman said:


> I went today.  Very cold, conditions overall pretty good.  I did not go to the north side due to the temp, light and wind.
> 
> Pluses I did notice =
> The volcano has been knocked down.  Huge plus someone could have gotton hurt very badly.
> ...


Cup of soup............$11.50. Fuck them!


----------



## catskillman (Jan 26, 2022)

RichT said:


> That means they , probably read the first sentence and then threw it away. You won't hear from them again. Ask me how I know? I did the same at the beginning of December.................got ghosted.


and don't you love the inaccuracies of the questions?  Asking about restaurants that have not been open in 2 seasons.  Their on line trail report is never accurate.  Has drop off as a terrain park, which also has not been one in 2 seasons, and is not as of today.  And madbox, the expert run shows as closed and has been open almost all season....


----------



## catskillman (Jan 26, 2022)

RichT said:


> Cup of soup............$11.50. Fuck them!


salads were $11.  And there was hardly anything to them, and they did not look crisp and fresh.  Burgers are about $15 if I recall correctly, and they are wrapped up, cannot even see what you are buying.  I could not believe it.

Friend bought 2 PBR's (16oz), $17


----------



## So Inclined (Jan 26, 2022)

catskillman said:


> Minus -
> The cost of the food is outrageous for what it is.  There were 3 employees standing benind the counter with nothing to do.  Pizza place is not open.  Wondering what happened to Carol!! She was a very hard worker.  Hope she is not back outside in the waffle shack.  She was treated real bad out there last season.


Pizza place has been open on the weekends. If Carol is the woman I've seen there in years past, she's still there too.

But come on now, Hunter lodge food hasn't been anything other than very meh, very overpriced cafeteria fare as long as I've been going. It's not like any of this is a great big step backwards.


----------



## da-bum (Jan 28, 2022)

On thursday, I saw that they started snowmaking on twilight.  I guess they are very belatedly opening up some of the trails where they didn't even touch up until the last snow storm.

Also, the Zephyr shows as being running on the app.  Is that a error?  A running lift with no trails to come down to besides Way Out?

Overlook at the North is pretty much the only trail I ski after lunch (~2pm) since most of the front has been skied out.  That is also when the sun starts appearing on those trails, except for the multiple rollers at the bottom of the headwall, which is always in the shade and invisible.


----------



## raisingarizona (Jan 28, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> How do you fix all of these issues? Speak. With. Your. Wallet.  No Vail, No Epic, ever ever. There are alternatives and you won't miss it. What has happened at Vail owned Eastern mountains save Mount Snow and Stowe is borderline criminal.


No no no. Everything will turn around soon enough. The majority of skiers should definitely continue going with Epic.


----------



## Kingslug20 (Jan 28, 2022)

Go...somewhere...
Else.....


----------



## catskillman (Jan 28, 2022)

Kingslug20 said:


> Go...somewhere...
> Else.....


definite push to maintain pass holders.  Z did run today.  Not needed, but it looks good.  

Volcano is back on hellgate, but now there is a large hole there.  Only marked by lollipop still.    Patroller told us it is definitely a leak, but they have noone to fix it.  I bet the EPA would be happy to do that, but that would cause so many other issues.  Honestly, I have no idea how they could fix it with the ground frozen and the ice on top cause of the water leak.  Crazy.....


----------



## Kingslug20 (Jan 28, 2022)

I get it that people loyal to Hunter and those with a financial stake in it..want to keep it alive...i would if i was still there...but Vail only responds to a hit to their wallet...


----------



## da-bum (Jan 29, 2022)

On Thur, I was skiing down 7th Ave and planned on cutting over to Ike.  I usually cut across broadway once I past the next to last fan tower that stretches down the middle.  But on this run, the wind was blowing the snow coming out of the fans downhill so I thought I cut across one fan earlier with a big round turn.  The snowmaking was making the visibility low between the towers, but I assumed terrain is just like a little lower down.  Next thing I knew I was airborne in the midst of being very much on my edges, landed on my side and sliding all the way to the entrance of Ike (good thing it wasn't one of those days where the left side is just lumps of re-frozen ice).  I hiked back to retrieve my ski and saw there was something like a 3 ft difference in height between the left and right side of the line between the fans, almost like a wall.

Aren't these basically the same trails where they overlap when going over with the groomers?


----------



## JimG. (Jan 29, 2022)

Hunter isn't going anywhere. It's a cash cow.


----------



## Kingslug20 (Jan 29, 2022)

Well..its going....downhill at the moment.


----------



## catskillman (Jan 29, 2022)

JimG. said:


> Hunter isn't going anywhere. It's a cash cow.


they no longer accept cash...lol


----------



## Kingslug20 (Jan 29, 2022)

So...its just a cow......udderly ridiculous


----------



## 180 (Jan 29, 2022)

Yeah Hunter sucks... 








						Jan 29
					

9 new items added to shared album




					photos.app.goo.gl


----------



## Kingslug20 (Jan 29, 2022)

Looks good...
I leave..you guys get the goods...


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Feb 2, 2022)

JimG. said:


> Hunter isn't going anywhere. It's a cash cow.


AND a great mountain to ride/ski...


----------



## abc (Feb 2, 2022)

Funky_Catskills said:


> AND a great mountain to ride/ski...


If there's snow (man made or natural), that is.


----------



## Kingslug20 (Feb 2, 2022)

I think all anyone is trying to say...is Vail is fucking up the place...
An unfortunate situation. They have no idea what they bought..and do not care.


----------



## RichT (Feb 2, 2022)

Kingslug20 said:


> I think all anyone is trying to say...is Vail is fucking up the place...
> An unfortunate situation. They have no idea what they bought..and do not care.


You hit the nail on the head!


----------



## catskillman (Feb 8, 2022)

is it true the 6 pack is still down?
I saw on facebook a couple of days ago they mentioned it AFTER they had a tribute to the groomers for excellant conditions and said there were still lift tickets available.  

Insane...


----------



## RichT (Feb 9, 2022)

catskillman said:


> is it true the 6 pack is still down?
> I saw on facebook a couple of days ago they mentioned it AFTER they had a tribute to the groomers for excellant conditions and said there were still lift tickets available.
> 
> Insane...


I think only weekends, skied Clair's today. To do that, you take 6 pack to top, hike up to top of Clair's ski down (which is very good snow there), speed over to the Northern lift, down the Belt to 6 pack and repeat. Takes about an hour! What a stupid way of doing things..............Not worth it, hardly anyone doing it to, each time I went down Clair's it was just me.


----------



## zyk (Feb 9, 2022)

RichT said:


> I think only weekends, skied Clair's today. To do that, you take 6 pack to top, hike up to top of Clair's ski down (which is very good snow there), speed over to the Northern lift, down the Belt to 6 pack and repeat. Takes about an hour! What a stupid way of doing things..............Not worth it, hardly anyone doing it to, each time I went down Clair's it was just me.


This is why I'm done with hunter.  Remember lapping clairs, taylors, and Annapurna  off the zephyr lift.  Ever since that changed (just pre vail) I've been disappointed.  A side effect of the north expansion I guess.


----------



## da-bum (Feb 11, 2022)

RichT said:


> I think only weekends, skied Clair's today. To do that, you take 6 pack to top, hike up to top of Clair's ski down (which is very good snow there), speed over to the Northern lift, down the Belt to 6 pack and repeat. Takes about an hour! What a stupid way of doing things..............Not worth it, hardly anyone doing it to, each time I went down Clair's it was just me.


The only time I went to Clair's was as on my way to the North.  I did that a few times on my change from the main to north side.  The snow on the west and north held up the best on the quite warm wednesday.

I did hear that the Zephyr was running today, and they cut the grass on one side of Westway.  Did they have a though of opening that this year?  Purely relying on natural snowfall?


----------



## catskillman (Feb 12, 2022)

Just saw on Facebook "Hunter Ski Bums"  - All lifts down at Hunter.  Look at the video posted by Hi Hey

Interested in what this is all about....


----------



## Kingslug20 (Feb 12, 2022)

Omg...what have thry done to the place?????


----------



## abc (Feb 12, 2022)

Kingslug20 said:


> Omg...what have thry done to the place?????


They did a AttiCat to it?


----------



## Kingslug20 (Feb 12, 2022)

Fucking blasphemy...


----------



## catskillman (Feb 12, 2022)

catskillman said:


> Just saw on Facebook "Hunter Ski Bums"  - All lifts down at Hunter.  Look at the video posted by Hi Hey
> 
> Interested in what this is all about....


No one seemed to know the exact reason the 6,b and D went down.  I went there around 2 pm, people were in front of the ticket windows, not sure if they were looking for refunds, or wanted to get a ticket to ski today,.. and the lift lines were still crazy long.

Quite chilly, but nice to see some people out on the deck.  No bar service on the deck ..


----------



## catskillman (Feb 13, 2022)

now today, Sunday, North side 6 pack came to a screeching and jerking hault.....WTF - dangerous.....where is the VAIL Safety BS they constantly talk about???


----------



## catskillman (Feb 14, 2022)

today was freezing - 6 pack did not open until 9:30, and then the parkway was closed for snowmaking - so of course the north and west were also closed.

They need a ton of snow on the parkway to make it safe again - they waited too too long probably.....

The craziness continues.  What will be next ??


----------



## Kingslug20 (Feb 14, 2022)

Dogs and cats sleeping with each other...we...are doomed


----------



## catskillman (Feb 15, 2022)

tiday - noth and west closed.  Ike & race trail closed for races, Racers closed due to conditions.  Bottom of the parkway from drop off down without a doubt the worst conditions on the mtn.  tracks, ice 6 inch blocks of solid ice....some intermediate trail...

think the cold kept folks away.  Planning on going tomorrow, can;t wait to see what surprises are in store.


----------



## catskillman (Feb 16, 2022)

so done by 11 today after being stuck on flyer 2X.  Again - it was a tower 13 issue !  They went right to that tower.  I lost count of how many times this season I have been stuck on that chair, and have seen them work on tower 13.  Very cold today, and no hot chocolate or cookie - at least 15 minutes each time.  I left , the flyer was down, they were not running F, but they were still selling tickets.!

North was open.  Took a run on overlok, slick as can be been.  Then tried wayout thinking it had to be better well was worse.  The Sleepy Hollow - it should not have been open......

What a disaster today was.  And Ike & park ave were closed for high school races.  So if you rode your only choices were drop off, gun hill, kennedy, madison.  I think Mossy is still closed due to iceing.  There were also at least 5 PSIA groups there again today.  Guess they won't be coming back next year either!!


----------



## JimG. (Feb 17, 2022)

catskillman said:


> so done by 11 today after being stuck on flyer 2X.  Again - it was a tower 13 issue !  They went right to that tower.  I lost count of how many times this season I have been stuck on that chair, and have seen them work on tower 13.  Very cold today, and no hot chocolate or cookie - at least 15 minutes each time.  I left , the flyer was down, they were not running F, but they were still selling tickets.!
> 
> North was open.  Took a run on overlok, slick as can be been.  Then tried wayout thinking it had to be better well was worse.  The Sleepy Hollow - it should not have been open......
> 
> What a disaster today was.  And Ike & park ave were closed for high school races.  So if you rode your only choices were drop off, gun hill, kennedy, madison.  I think Mossy is still closed due to iceing.  There were also at least 5 PSIA groups there again today.  Guess they won't be coming back next year either!!


I spoke to an instructor at Gore who attended one of those PSIA events. Her only comment was "Wow, what is wrong with Hunter lately".


----------



## Kingslug20 (Feb 17, 2022)

Far be it for me to tell anyone what to do...but..
Why do you keep going?  Its like going to the same restaurant and eating dog shit every time.
You would be far better off at Belleayre and Gore


----------



## JimG. (Feb 17, 2022)

Kingslug20 said:


> Far be it for me to tell anyone what to do...but..
> Why do you keep going?  Its like going to the same restaurant and eating dog shit every time.
> You would be far better off at Belleayre and Gore


Yeah I wonder about this as well. 

The definition of insanity is doing the same exact thing over and over and expecting (?) different results.


----------



## Kingslug20 (Feb 17, 2022)

I get wanting to be loyal to a place...but Hunter just seems doomed at this point.


----------



## cdskier (Feb 17, 2022)

JimG. said:


> Yeah I wonder about this as well.
> 
> The definition of insanity is doing the same exact thing over and over and expecting (?) different results.



I would guess these people keep going because they bought an Epic pass and don't want to spend money to ski elsewhere. They may have property at/near Hunter so have their hands forced a bit.

Some people could have given them a pass on poor operations last year due to COVID and figured they would get their act together this year. That's understandable as well. People that renew for next year though have no excuses and should fully know what to expect.


----------



## abc (Feb 17, 2022)

cdskier said:


> I would guess these people keep going because they bought an Epic pass and don't want to spend money to ski elsewhere. They may have property at/near Hunter so have their hands forced a bit.


Especially if they have property there. 



> Some people could have given them a pass on poor operations last year due to COVID and figured they would get their act together this year. That's understandable as well. People that renew for next year though have no excuses and should fully know what to expect.


What can they do? Sell their house and move some place else?

I suppose if their properties are not exactly AT Hunter, they could go ski Bell/Platty/Windham etc. Gore is quite a bit further from the Cats.


----------



## Kingslug20 (Feb 17, 2022)

I drove 5 hours to ski at Stowe for years.before we bought up here..because thats where the snow was. To ski a mountain that is a "disaster" because your close to it...???
Doesnt sound too good to me.


----------



## abc (Feb 17, 2022)

Kingslug20 said:


> I drove 5 hours to ski at Stowe for years.before we bought up here..because thats where the snow was. To ski a mountain that is a "disaster" because your close to it...???
> Doesnt sound too good to me.


But I bet you drove 5 hrs from your main home to Stowe? 

It's different if you bought a second home specifically to ski a good mountain. Now that the mountain is a disaster. Do you drive to your second home first, and then drive some more to ski some places else?


----------



## millerm277 (Feb 17, 2022)

abc said:


> I suppose if their properties are not exactly AT Hunter, they could go ski Bell/Platty/Windham etc. Gore is quite a bit further from the Cats.



Or even if they are. Windham's barely over 15min away.


----------



## catskillman (Feb 17, 2022)

Kingslug20 said:


> Far be it for me to tell anyone what to do...but..
> Why do you keep going?  Its like going to the same restaurant and eating dog shit every time.
> You would be far better off at Belleayre and Gore


I and my friends & family can/do walk to the mountain.  We live here!  we all thought we had seen everything over the years...each day is a surprise, and not a pleasant one lately....


----------



## catskillman (Feb 17, 2022)

btw - heard Russ and 3 other mgt types were stuck on 6 pack yesterday.  Hope it is true then maybe something will happen.  Russ is not a great intermediate


----------



## Kingslug20 (Feb 17, 2022)

abc said:


> But I bet you drove 5 hrs from your main home to Stowe?
> 
> It's different if you bought a second home specifically to ski a good mountain. Now that the mountain is a disaster. Do you drive to your second home first, and then drive some more to ski some places else?


We would drive to stowe from ct...then bought the condo..then bought the house.
Stowe and SB just got a lot more snow than most places...still hit K throughout the season though.
If im going to spend time and money skiing..im going to get the best out of it.


----------



## drewfidelic (Feb 20, 2022)

At this point, I’m planning on getting a Windham pass for next year. If Hunter doesn’t care about the West side and its expert terrain, which continues to be the best in the Catskills, why bother?


----------



## Kingslug20 (Feb 20, 2022)

And there ya go...


----------



## x10003q (Feb 20, 2022)

drewfidelic said:


> At this point, I’m planning on getting a Windham pass for next year. If Hunter doesn’t care about the West side and its expert terrain, which continues to be the best in the Catskills, why bother?


Stop being so greedy. The CEO needs to keep the share price up to reach her bonuses. Besides, its not fair to open it when so many green and blue skiers never use West.


----------



## kendo (Feb 21, 2022)

Some year they'll commit to fully opening the West side, market it heavily as a *30% terrain expansion* and pat themselves on the back.   


I did see this recent pic showing skier's left of 44 - leaving the well shrubbed liftline to continue filling in.  Maybe there's hope.   




_(photo credit:  https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=10160360253548109&set=pcb.10160360259698109 )_


----------



## zyk (Feb 21, 2022)

kendo said:


> Some year they'll commit to fully opening the West side, market it heavily as a *30% terrain expansion* and pat themselves on the back.
> 
> 
> I did see this recent pic showing skier's left of 44 - leaving the well shrubbed liftline to continue filling in.  Maybe there's hope.
> ...


I like the lift line side just memorize the locations of the pipe flanges....


----------



## So Inclined (Feb 22, 2022)

Looking forward to several years from now, when the tips of those branches are tickling your skis like they do now on F lift.


----------



## catskillman (Feb 22, 2022)

so today, place was empty.  They had B, D, F , 6 pack open.  North opened around 10 with just wayout (not way in), overlook and sleepy hollow.

6 pack stopped and was then closed for maintenacne around 10:15.  What a surprise.  We left....  

OH - rumor has it Russ is leaving...  heard it from a lot of people but not any employees.  Heard the guy who did that ridiculous video calling the north side an oasis and other unbelievable comments is his replacement.


----------



## RichT (Feb 22, 2022)

catskillman said:


> so today, place was empty.  They had B, D, F , 6 pack open.  North opened around 10 with just wayout (not way in), overlook and sleepy hollow.
> 
> 6 pack stopped and was then closed for maintenacne around 10:15.  What a surprise.  We left....
> 
> OH - rumor has it Russ is leaving...  heard it from a lot of people but not any employees.  Heard the guy who did that ridiculous video calling the north side an oasis and other unbelievable comments is his replacement.


I hope he's better than Russ....................BUT from what I see (his video "North is the Oasis") i think we're still in big trouble.


----------



## skidbump (Feb 22, 2022)

Memories of days gone by


----------



## catskillman (Feb 23, 2022)

so Hunter got a ton of rain last night.  They opened an hour late today, understandable - as they groomed all night and into the morning.  As time went on and the 6 was not open yet the crowd got a bit angry (mainly 4 obnoxious guys) and ws yelling on poor lift attendants, some guy in a black jacket and then a ski patrol guy was attempting to explain the conditions and what trails would be open.  
  Those people do not deserve to be abused like that.  There is nothing they can do.  The complaints need to go to Vail Mgt and Mother Nature not some poor $15 an hour guy or a patrol vollunteer!
  And these same people most likely do not understand why the mountain cannot find people to do these jobs.  Who want to do that job anyway, and then on top of everything they have to be abused........


----------



## IceEidolon (Feb 23, 2022)

Those Minimum Vail Wage people on the front lines may not be quite up to $15/hr yet, as Vail applied its company wide minimum wage very selectively and the recent raises may not have pushed everyone over the line.

I agree that anyone who wears ski boots or a parka all day doesn't deserve the blame or the viritol for Vail's failings nor for the weather.


----------



## catskillman (Feb 23, 2022)

IceEidolon said:


> Those Minimum Vail Wage people on the front lines may not be quite up to $15/hr yet, as Vail applied its company wide minimum wage very selectively and the recent raises may not have pushed everyone over the line.
> 
> I agree that anyone who wears ski boots or a parka all day doesn't deserve the blame or the viritol for Vail's failings nor for the weather.


agree.  and some of the foreign workers at hunter, work the lifts etc.  all day and then go to the hotel and work to at least 10pm doing dishes, maintenance etc....  They have classmates, firinds etc. working at non vail resorts that have much better everything...they will not be back at Hunter when they can posssibly go elsewhere next year.  Other Vail resorts are also better in so so many many ways.  Where would you go - Hunter, Heavenaly, Vail...etc...If you could not get a non Fail Vail resort.


----------



## skiur (Feb 24, 2022)

catskillman said:


> so Hunter got a ton of rain last night.  They opened an hour late today, understandable - as they groomed all night and into the morning.  As time went on and the 6 was not open yet the crowd got a bit angry (mainly 4 obnoxious guys) and ws yelling on poor lift attendants, some guy in a black jacket and then a ski patrol guy was attempting to explain the conditions and what trails would be open.
> Those people do not deserve to be abused like that.  There is nothing they can do.  The complaints need to go to Vail Mgt and Mother Nature not some poor $15 an hour guy or a patrol vollunteer!
> And these same people most likely do not understand why the mountain cannot find people to do these jobs.  Who want to do that job anyway, and then on top of everything they have to be abused........



While I agree that these bottom of the totem pole employees dont deserve to get that crap, complaining to Vail management seems to be pretty useless.  It's a lose lose situation.


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Feb 24, 2022)

Guns are on. Expecting a foot of snow tonight.
Be nice to employees for sure.  My buddy is a groomer at HM.   He's taking some sh|t - but he's just doing his job.   And he does a great job!


----------



## jimmywilson69 (Feb 24, 2022)

Who's giving a groomer shit?  Whoever is doing that is an asshole


----------



## IceEidolon (Feb 24, 2022)

In a lot of cases where the public gripes about grooming conditions, the root cause or one root cause is planning and management. If they aren't given time for fresh snowmaking to cure (or if the snowmaking team is told to make base snow instead of conditioning snow), or if there isn't time/enough machines to properly rework a bad trail, etc. 

It's also possible for a careless/tired/no fucks given operator to turn in a bad product. Inexperienced operators I put down to management on a lack of training. From a guest perspective it's not easy to tell the difference.


----------



## catskillman (Feb 24, 2022)

Funky_Catskills said:


> Guns are on. Expecting a foot of snow tonight.
> Be nice to employees for sure.  My buddy is a groomer at HM.   He's taking some sh|t - but he's just doing his job.   And he does a great job!


hard to imagine - what are they doing going 90 minutes early, as suggested on that crazy video the mountain had that poor man do, and getting them as they pull in in the morning, and yelling at them?  That is crazy.

Apparently your buddy is not assigned to the middle entrance of Minya, or other choice unsafe spots I have seen recently.  I am not 100% for grooming everything, but it should be safe and there have been a lot of "ledges" and huge balls of snow / ice in the trails that we never used to see before.

Hope they pay him well - crazy hours and probably not the safest job....


----------



## catskillman (Feb 24, 2022)

IceEidolon said:


> In a lot of cases where the public gripes about grooming conditions, the root cause or one root cause is planning and management. If they aren't given time for fresh snowmaking to cure (or if the snowmaking team is told to make base snow instead of conditioning snow), or if there isn't time/enough machines to properly rework a bad trail, etc.
> 
> It's also possible for a careless/tired/no fucks given operator to turn in a bad product. Inexperienced operators I put down to management on a lack of training. From a guest perspective it's not easy to tell the difference.


agree on the training.  And I think it depends on when they groom,  if they do it right after the mountain closes or in the morining before it opens.  Hunter seems to be doing it before opening lately, which I think would be better in most cases...


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Feb 24, 2022)

jimmywilson69 said:


> Who's giving a groomer shit?  Whoever is doing that is an asshole


Things are getting ugly with Hunter so called "regulars" - it doesn't surprise me.    
The things I read are pretty vitriolic and downright nasty.   People just doing their jobs in the most entitled sport in the world.


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Feb 24, 2022)

catskillman said:


> Hope they pay him well - crazy hours and probably not the safest job....


Pretty sure he knows that - winch cats are no joke.


----------



## urungus (Feb 24, 2022)

Funky_Catskills said:


> the most entitled sport in the world.


What about equestrian or pheasant shooting ?


----------



## NYDB (Feb 24, 2022)

Polo and fox hunting


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Feb 24, 2022)

But not curling


----------



## IceEidolon (Feb 24, 2022)

urungus said:


> What about equestrian or pheasant shooting ?


That depends on which equestrians you're shooting.


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Feb 25, 2022)

It was dumping like a mutha f'er here in Hunter.
Guessing 10" in my yard right now.   Sound sounds like it's turning to ice a little - 23 degrees outside.
Current status - clearing work calendar for the afternoon.


----------



## catskillman (Feb 25, 2022)

Funky_Catskills said:


> It was dumping like a mutha f'er here in Hunter.
> Guessing 10" in my yard right now.   Sound sounds like it's turning to ice a little - 23 degrees outside.
> Current status - clearing work calendar for the afternoon.


could you get into the north lot?  6 pack was down again - and again it was tower 13 !!


----------



## Kingslug20 (Feb 25, 2022)

Tower 13...unlucky tower...


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Feb 25, 2022)

North Lot was open


----------



## So Inclined (Feb 25, 2022)

catskillman said:


> could you get into the north lot?  6 pack was down again - and again it was tower 13 !!


 Official word was that 6 pack was down through the morning because of the wind. Seemed legit from what I saw and felt taking the B-F route to the top (and then swiftly over to the north, which was fairly sheltered from the wind.)


----------



## catskillman (Feb 26, 2022)

So Inclined said:


> Official word was that 6 pack was down through the morning because of the wind. Seemed legit from what I saw and felt taking the B-F route to the top (and then swiftly over to the north, which was fairly sheltered from the wind.)


no - friend was stuck on it for 15 minutes and they were working on tower 13.  two guys this time.  It is always tower 13 this season...


----------



## catskillman (Feb 27, 2022)

F broke yesterday afternoon, today loading only every other chair.....busy busy day, and a lot of ski patrol action.  Just heard the chopper coming in


----------



## Kingslug20 (Feb 27, 2022)

.......


----------



## catskillman (Feb 27, 2022)

someone was seriously injured which is why the choper was called !  

Head and neck injury and not alert I am told.  Young woman in her 20's - hit from behingd by a snowboarder from what I understand.  Sad and not to be made light of.  could have been anyone, this person was just very very unlucky


----------



## RichT (Feb 27, 2022)

Someone also fell off a lift on, I believe Hunter One.


----------



## So Inclined (Feb 27, 2022)

RichT said:


> Someone also fell off a lift on, I believe Hunter One.


Unfortunately, you're correct.


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Feb 28, 2022)

So Inclined said:


> Unfortunately, you're correct.


Was that before or after she was "hit from behingd by a snowboarder" as previously mentioned


----------



## So Inclined (Feb 28, 2022)

Funky_Catskills said:


> Was that before or after she was "hit from behingd by a snowboarder" as previously mentioned



Not the same person. I don't know anything about the snowboarder, but was relatively close to the lift-faller.


----------



## catskillman (Feb 28, 2022)

Funky_Catskills said:


> Was that before or after she was "hit from behingd by a snowboarder" as previously mentioned


2 seperate accidents.  Woman fell off C lift at Hunter 1, right before you get off/on the ramp.


----------



## catskillman (Mar 7, 2022)

soo - today, monday, the website says that the north lift is open, but all the trails over there and the west side i closed.

i guess they are just running that lift for people parking at the OASIS so they can get to the front.  Guess they have to download or walk back.

it also says B is closed but it is running....

What is so difficult about giving people accurate information?


----------



## So Inclined (Mar 7, 2022)

So this was just posted a few minutes ago on the 'gram. I can't decide if it's some kind of sick joke given the conditions right now, the most unbelievably unexpected thing I've seen all year, or both.


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Mar 7, 2022)

Power was out - just getting restored.  And it's pouring rain.


----------



## x10003q (Mar 7, 2022)

and currently Hunter is reporting 49F. It is 75F here in NNJ.


----------



## So Inclined (Mar 7, 2022)

x10003q said:


> and currently Hunter is reporting 49F. It is 75F here in NNJ.



And that's accurate, according to my car's thermometer. I was running a few errands nearby, so I just scarfed my lunch down in the parking lot there. As of 2 pm-ish, C, B, and the Flyer were spinning and not a single person was to be seen on a chair or on the slopes.


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Mar 7, 2022)

My thermo reads 56  in the valley by the Northside.


----------



## catskillman (Mar 7, 2022)

So Inclined said:


> So this was just posted a few minutes ago on the 'gram. I can't decide if it's some kind of sick joke given the conditions right now, the most unbelievably unexpected thing I've seen all year, or both.
> View attachment 53528


I saw this - maybe they got hacked and it is a joke.  I would be happy if they got the April 1st.  who is going to run the place, the foreign workers will all be gone by then!  And if you check the site they are not selling tickets for past the 2nd.  

saw similar for Mt Snow and Vail is now saying May 1st.  Now forever Vail always said they had to close early because of some animal migration.  Guess they worked out a deal with the herd......


----------



## RichT (Mar 7, 2022)

I just filled out another survey they sent me..................I know they don't read them, shit they asked about the food service of restaurants that haven't been open in two years! Total formatted survey junk, just like the EpicMix!


----------



## da-bum (Mar 10, 2022)

Went on Wed, West was closed, and when Overlook eventually opened in the North, they had markers signifying to ski in 20 ft wide area between them.  I wondered why, and when I skied past those markers, it was rock hard ice under that thin layer of snow.  They seem to be doing minimal grooming to get a trail opened.  I was wondering why all the trails that looks like its covered by powder are not open, I guess this is why.


----------



## da-bum (Mar 10, 2022)

I was looking at Vail's capital improvement for the northeast, and it includes replacement of lifts in both Okemo and Mt Snow (after already doing extensive upgrades this year).  Either Hunter already has the latest snowmaking/lifts/trails that it doesn't need improvement, or it is not considered important enough to spend money on, or that the new yawkers will always come no matter what.


----------



## urungus (Mar 10, 2022)

da-bum said:


> I was looking at Vail's capital improvement for the northeast, and it includes replacement of lifts in both Okemo and Mt Snow (after already doing extensive upgrades this year).  Either Hunter already has the latest snowmaking/lifts/trails that it doesn't need improvement, or it is not considered important enough to spend money on, or that the new yawkers will always come no matter what.


Hunter North including Hunters second six-pack opened 3 seasons ago.  Suspect it will be awhile before we see any additional upgrades from Vail.  What would you like to see ?  D, E, F and H lifts are pretty old.


----------



## RichT (Mar 11, 2022)

urungus said:


> Hunter North including Hunters second six-pack opened 3 seasons ago.  Suspect it will be awhile before we see any additional upgrades from Vail.  What would you like to see ?  D, E, F and H lifts are pretty old.


My wish is that they put it back the way they found it, especially all those great employees they let go!


----------



## JimG. (Mar 11, 2022)

I rode a lift at Belleayre yesterday with a Hunter regular. The ride was a non-stop bitch session about how crappy Hunter is being run under Vail.

I swear I almost asked him if he was catskillman or Rich T.


----------



## Kingslug20 (Mar 11, 2022)

Rode the gondi at stowe with a regular..same thing..guess he discovered stowe is a viable..if far option


----------



## RichT (Mar 12, 2022)

JimG. said:


> I rode a lift at Belleayre yesterday with a Hunter regular. The ride was a non-stop bitch session about how crappy Hunter is being run under Vail.
> 
> I swear I almost asked him if he was catskillman or Rich T.


Wasn't me


----------



## zyk (Mar 12, 2022)

I have heard whispers and murmurs that some locals are headed for Windham next year.  This was the final nail that convinced me to bail on Vail after a good number of years as a Hunter regular.  Thankfully I don't live that close so i'll be looking into other snowy pastures next year.


----------



## RichT (Mar 12, 2022)

I was there (Hunter) yesterday when I saw those two patrollers coming down either Gunhill or Ike at speed with a sled. One patroller steering the sled and the other unbelievably kneeling over this poor guy while on the sled giving him CPR! It literally took my breath away, I can't imagine the work and dedication it takes to do this job! Give them ALL of those perks and more! I will be thanking everyone of them any time I see them. BACK THE PATROL!!!!!!! Hope the guy survived...............


----------



## ThatGuy (Mar 12, 2022)

Thats one of the worst results of these corporate aholes taking resorts over. They screw over the employees who are the face of the place and they also take the brunt of the bs that should be directed towards said corporate overlords. Ski patrol still has to save people, snowmakers still have to make snow, lifties still gotta load the lifts. They deserve thanks and appreciate despite the appalling ownership.


----------



## catskillman (Mar 12, 2022)

RichT said:


> Wasn't me


or me...  Went North (not to the Oasis).  No crowds, lots of snow, and excellent grooming.  Like the old days


----------



## catskillman (Mar 12, 2022)

RichT said:


> I was there (Hunter) yesterday when I saw those two patrollers coming down either Gunhill or Ike at speed with a sled. One patroller steering the sled and the other unbelievably kneeling over this poor guy while on the sled giving him CPR! It literally took my breath away, I can't imagine the work and dedication it takes to do this job! Give them ALL of those perks and more! I will be thanking everyone of them any time I see them. BACK THE PATROL!!!!!!! Hope the guy survived...............


Hunter ski patrol is having a job fair Monday to get more people to join.  They are way understaffed, and need more people like these two !!  Everyone needs people like them!


----------



## Jersey Skier (Mar 12, 2022)

I just clicked on both Hunter's and Windham's webcams. I don't understand how Windham has no lines.


----------



## tumbler (Mar 12, 2022)

RichT said:


> I was there (Hunter) yesterday when I saw those two patrollers coming down either Gunhill or Ike at speed with a sled. One patroller steering the sled and the other unbelievably kneeling over this poor guy while on the sled giving him CPR! It literally took my breath away, I can't imagine the work and dedication it takes to do this job! Give them ALL of those perks and more! I will be thanking everyone of them any time I see them. BACK THE PATROL!!!!!!! Hope the guy survived...............


This is one of the worst things you can see skiing.  I've seen it a couple times and just hearing about it is unsettling.


----------



## catskillman (Mar 12, 2022)

Jersey Skier said:


> I just clicked on both Hunter's and Windham's webcams. I don't understand how Windham has no lines.


Windham limits the amount of tickets they sell.  Hunter was still selling lift tickets at 2pm a few Saturday's ago when the mountain was over wellmed and a sheet of ice.


----------



## 180 (Mar 13, 2022)

Hunter blowing snow today.  And they need to if  they want to make the 10th.  Latest I can ever remember.
In other news, both winch cats are broken, hence the dismal grooming and then another groomer broke down last night on East Side Drive.
Otherwise, yesterday and this morning were fantastic powder skiing, but the boilerplate underneath.....


----------



## RichT (Mar 13, 2022)

180 said:


> Hunter blowing snow today.  And they need to if  they want to make the 10th.  Latest I can ever remember.
> In other news, both winch cats are broken, hence the dismal grooming and then another groomer broke down last night on East Side Drive.
> Otherwise, yesterday and this morning were fantastic powder skiing, but the boilerplate underneath.....


And warm temps/rain........


----------



## drjeff (Mar 14, 2022)

RichT said:


> I was there (Hunter) yesterday when I saw those two patrollers coming down either Gunhill or Ike at speed with a sled. One patroller steering the sled and the other unbelievably kneeling over this poor guy while on the sled giving him CPR! It literally took my breath away, I can't imagine the work and dedication it takes to do this job! Give them ALL of those perks and more! I will be thanking everyone of them any time I see them. BACK THE PATROL!!!!!!! Hope the guy survived...............



I've witnessed that same, shocking, sight 2 times over the years. Once at Mount Snow and once at Deer Valley.  Also saw an incident, from a lift,  just after it happened at Mount Snow that ended up as a fatality where patrol never got the chance to attempt CPR on this individual (ended up being a broken neck with a significant (and obvious) skull fracture.

Definitely affects you just seeing it.  Really can take it's toll on the staff who are part of the incident and the attempts to save the person.  There certainly are times when I either see someone obviously out of control or plain and simply skiing/riding too fast for the location and/or conditions at that moment in time, where I just wish they'd realize that the "1 in a million" chance that something bad may happen isn't worth it, as I guess I've spent enough hours/days/years on the hill now over my skiing career, that I have now seen multiple "1 in a million" events


----------



## deadheadskier (Mar 14, 2022)

A good friend of mine was on patrol at Killington for about ten years.  Twice he had to be the guy in the sled giving chest compressions; one of which was coming down in a sled through Julio.  Both were cardiac episodes, not injury.  In each situation the victim was blue in the face and already dead.  But, the rules were you kept going with the chest compressions until the patient was in the ambulance with paramedics taking over.  They were the ones who could make the call to give up. Not K patrol.


----------



## catskillman (Mar 14, 2022)

180 said:


> Hunter blowing snow today.  And they need to if  they want to make the 10th.  Latest I can ever remember.
> In other news, both winch cats are broken, hence the dismal grooming and then another groomer broke down last night on East Side Drive.
> Otherwise, yesterday and this morning were fantastic powder skiing, but the boilerplate underneath.....


had not heard the groomers were out of service, but confirmed that today.  They were still grooming at 8:45 this morning.  

Have to say Hellgate was probably the worst I have seen today 1st run.  There was a 15' trench with about an 8" dropoff in the middle - marked by only one large stick where there should have been at least 3 across it.  And getting to that point was pretty treacherous.  

left at about 12 and while the run was softer that trench was still there.  Overall today was much better than anticipated.


----------



## KustyTheKlown (Mar 15, 2022)

Jersey Skier said:


> I just clicked on both Hunter's and Windham's webcams. I don't understand how Windham has no lines.



windham isnt an unlimited destination on shit pass. 

next?


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Mar 15, 2022)

deadheadskier said:


> A good friend of mine was on patrol at Killington for about ten years.  Twice he had to be the guy in the sled giving chest compressions; one of which was coming down in a sled through Julio.  Both were cardiac episodes, not injury.  In each situation the victim was blue in the face and already dead.  But, the rules were you kept going with the chest compressions until the patient was in the ambulance with paramedics taking over.  They were the ones who could make the call to give up. Not K patrol.


I had a friend die on Racers Edge a while ago - where the crossover to Ike is.
Marathon runner - had a heart attack on the hill.  DOA...   They tried their hardest.


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Mar 15, 2022)

180 said:


> Hunter blowing snow today.  And they need to if  they want to make the 10th.  Latest I can ever remember.
> In other news, both winch cats are broken, hence the dismal grooming and then another groomer broke down last night on East Side Drive.
> Otherwise, yesterday and this morning were fantastic powder skiing, but the boilerplate underneath.....


I saw the guns were on  - and immediately wanted to post here..   But I didn't because someone would probably just turn it into a bad thing.


----------



## da-bum (Mar 15, 2022)

urungus said:


> Hunter North including Hunters second six-pack opened 3 seasons ago.  Suspect it will be awhile before we see any additional upgrades from Vail.  What would you like to see ?  D, E, F and H lifts are pretty old.


Redo Westway so they can actually open it with the snow they make.  Maybe cut an easier trail on the west side so more people will ski there to justify opening the lift and rest of the trail there.  I don't think anybody ever use the Z lift so they can ski Way In/Way Out.  Also, extend the F-lift to the base and turn it into a high speed one.  That was my go-to lift on weekends, but its mid station and speed doesn't attract enough skiers, and that low volume doesn't justify detachable chairs, unless it is extended to the base.  Maybe extend the D lift somewhat and cut some trails so that one can cross over to the north side.  The frequent shutdown the Flyer due to wind leave everyone stuck on the main mountain's lower trails.


----------



## da-bum (Mar 15, 2022)

catskillman said:


> had not heard the groomers were out of service, but confirmed that today.  They were still grooming at 8:45 this morning.
> 
> Have to say Hellgate was probably the worst I have seen today 1st run.  There was a 15' trench with about an 8" dropoff in the middle - marked by only one large stick where there should have been at least 3 across it.  And getting to that point was pretty treacherous.
> 
> left at about 12 and while the run was softer that trench was still there.  Overall today was much better than anticipated.


Everyone could see that trench on their way up the lift, so they must be cuckoo to ski into the trench without knowing so (maybe if someone came at 11am, it was not so obvious as it was in the beginning of the day).  I went to the north when the snow was getting too thick.


----------



## So Inclined (Mar 17, 2022)

da-bum said:


> Redo Westway so they can actually open it with the snow they make.  Maybe cut an easier trail on the west side so more people will ski there to justify opening the lift and rest of the trail there.  I don't think anybody ever use the Z lift so they can ski Way In/Way Out.  Also, extend the F-lift to the base and turn it into a high speed one.  That was my go-to lift on weekends, but its mid station and speed doesn't attract enough skiers, and that low volume doesn't justify detachable chairs, unless it is extended to the base.  Maybe extend the D lift somewhat and cut some trails so that one can cross over to the north side.  The frequent shutdown the Flyer due to wind leave everyone stuck on the main mountain's lower trails.



It appears the "fix" to Westway will occur naturally as the saplings grow into trees over half the trail.
Extend F-lift to the base? How would you do that without running it over B? Better, if we're pipe-dreaming here, to just extend B all the way up from the bottom over the path of F with a mid-station exit. 
F doesn't attract enough skiers? I mean, have you seen it lately? It attracts plenty. It being a mid-station lift is totally its appeal!
I can't imagine how D would get extended without some very creative (and expensive) engineering, as (if my memory serves) it terminates shortly before hitting a pretty steep bluff. Nowhere for it to go in that direction.


----------



## da-bum (Mar 18, 2022)

So Inclined said:


> It appears the "fix" to Westway will occur naturally as the saplings grow into trees over half the trail.
> Extend F-lift to the base? How would you do that without running it over B? Better, if we're pipe-dreaming here, to just extend B all the way up from the bottom over the path of F with a mid-station exit.
> F doesn't attract enough skiers? I mean, have you seen it lately? It attracts plenty. It being a mid-station lift is totally its appeal!
> I can't imagine how D would get extended without some very creative (and expensive) engineering, as (if my memory serves) it terminates shortly before hitting a pretty steep bluff. Nowhere for it to go in that direction.


Letting nature take care of westway would take decades.  It is be probably better to split it into 2 narrower trails by relocating or planting some evergreens.

I remember taking F all the time when I use to go on weekends, but its slow speed made take just as long as the base high speed lift.  Combining the B and F would be an option, but turning it into a non-detachable lift just for the sake of mid-station dropoff defeats its purpose.  They could have a bend on the D lift to avoid the B lift.  Same goes for the D lift.  If that is not feasible, they should cut some trail from the D lift dropff to the north.


----------



## RichT (Mar 20, 2022)

I'm sure Hunter management reads these (hope so). Now that the snow has melted, it even shows much more, what a pigsty this place has become! Under the six pack there's so many budlight cans and such spewed all the way up!! How about putting those "drop-zones" back. Place looks like the city jeez..............


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Mar 22, 2022)

RichT said:


> I'm sure Hunter management reads these (hope so). Now that the snow has melted, it even shows much more, what a pigsty this place has become! Under the six pack there's so many budlight cans and such spewed all the way up!! How about putting those "drop-zones" back. Place looks like the city jeez..............



Before I went out on Friday afternoon - I was thinking about how the whole town looks like crap with the snow gone.  crap everywhere.   It melted fast so it was a shock.  Then when I was shti show under the 6pack it didn't seem so bad.   wow.  Just wow on so many levels.   I've never seen it that bad.


----------



## RichT (Mar 23, 2022)

Funky_Catskills said:


> Before I went out on Friday afternoon - I was thinking about how the whole town looks like crap with the snow gone.  crap everywhere.   It melted fast so it was a shock.  Then when I was shti show under the 6pack it didn't seem so bad.   wow.  Just wow on so many levels.   I've never seen it that bad.


Here's Hunters replay..............I asked them who the "Director of resorts operations" was? Still waiting for and answer (?)

Hi Rich,

Thank you for your comment. We will pass it along to our Director of resort operations.
We have garbage cans at the bottom and the top of the chairlifts where guests are supposed to leave garbage and cans instead of throwing them from the lifts.

Have a great day!


Hunter Mountain Product Sales & Services ️
huinfo@vailresorts.com
518-263-5367
64 Klein Ave
Hunter, NY 12442


----------



## catskillman (Mar 23, 2022)

RichT said:


> I'm sure Hunter management reads these (hope so). Now that the snow has melted, it even shows much more, what a pigsty this place has become! Under the six pack there's so many budlight cans and such spewed all the way up!! How about putting those "drop-zones" back. Place looks like the city jeez..............


Why do they even let people on the lift openly carrying and drinking cans of beer?  I see this most days...


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Mar 23, 2022)

catskillman said:


> Why do they even let people on the lift openly carrying and drinking cans of beer?  I see this most days...


To keep their customers from switching to mountains that do. Since they haven't gotten in any legal trouble for this, there is no reason for those to change. Those who want to drink want to drink more than those who don't want to be around drinkers don't want to be around drinkers.


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Mar 23, 2022)

And now there is no info at all on their web page about what lifts and trails are open - when you thought their reporting could not get worse


----------



## urungus (Mar 23, 2022)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> And now there is no info at all on their web page about what lifts and trails are open - when you thought their reporting could not get worse



seems to be working for me … https://www.huntermtn.com/the-mountain/mountain-conditions/lift-and-terrain-status.aspx


----------



## jimmywilson69 (Mar 23, 2022)

regarding the beer cans I've never seen anyone get on a lift with an open beer can.  I've seen plenty of people, including myself on occasion, pull them out of their pocket.  

unfortunately a lot of people are pigs.  Its not just concentrated to ski areas.  just look around along highways.  I've never understood littering  Clearly some/many people just don't care.


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Mar 23, 2022)

urungus said:


> seems to be working for me … https://www.huntermtn.com/the-mountain/mountain-conditions/lift-and-terrain-status.aspx


Glad to see they got it back up.
I will likely go there one last time for the season on Sunday if they can keep close to this much open.


----------



## drjeff (Mar 23, 2022)

jimmywilson69 said:


> regarding the beer cans I've never seen anyone get on a lift with an open beer can.  I've seen plenty of people, including myself on occasion, pull them out of their pocket.
> 
> unfortunately a lot of people are pigs.  Its not just concentrated to ski areas.  just look around along highways.  I've never understood littering  Clearly some/many people just don't care.


Spot on truth in this one


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Mar 23, 2022)

jimmywilson69 said:


> regarding the beer cans I've never seen anyone get on a lift with an open beer can.  I've seen plenty of people, including myself on occasion, pull them out of their pocket.
> 
> unfortunately a lot of people are pigs.  Its not just concentrated to ski areas.  just look around along highways.  I've never understood littering  Clearly some/many people just don't care.


I carry a flask of bourbon.  Just a couple nips during the day.
I hate to say it but FDNY and NYPD weekends really add to that pile.


----------



## skiur (Mar 23, 2022)

Funky_Catskills said:


> I carry a flask of bourbon.  Just a couple nips during the day.
> I hate to say it but FDNY and NYPD weekends really add to that pile.



Probably mostly the cops doing the littering, too many of them have an  above the law attitude and feel they can litter if they want.  Firemen I know don't have that attitude.


----------



## KustyTheKlown (Mar 23, 2022)

Funky_Catskills said:


> I carry a flask of bourbon.  Just a couple nips during the day.
> I hate to say it but FDNY and NYPD weekends really add to that pile.



nypd being horrible citizens and neighbors? no fuckin way!


----------



## KustyTheKlown (Mar 23, 2022)

skiur said:


> Probably mostly the cops doing the littering, too many of them have an  above the law attitude and feel they can litter if they want.  Firemen I know don't have that attitude.



firemen serve their communities
policemen serve themselves.


----------



## catskillman (Mar 23, 2022)

Funky_Catskills said:


> I carry a flask of bourbon.  Just a couple nips during the day.
> I hate to say it but FDNY and NYPD weekends really add to that pile.


PD was there this year.  They had 2 races and several parties/dinners at macgregors.

FDNY trashed the hotel too many times and are now banned.  Villa Vousila put them up for one year and now that is also over.  Will be interesting.


----------



## catskillman (Mar 23, 2022)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> Glad to see they got it back up.
> I will likely go there one last time for the season on Sunday if they can keep close to this much open.


it is up but not accurate.  It has the north/oasis lift open, but no trails on the west or north side open.  Upper K was not open, the terrain parks all were, as was the race trail.  report says otherwise

  I just left there an hour ago.  Not bad, but the rain tonight and tomorrow could destroy it...


----------



## danimals (Mar 23, 2022)

Imagine how clean our country would be if cops actually enforced littering laws, resulting in less people feeling like it’s okay to just toss their trash out.

I saw a cop sitting on the side of the road yesterday drop a Wawa bag of trash out of his window onto the ground. Then flicked a lit cig into some nice dry grass. This was right next to a oil tank farm.


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Mar 23, 2022)

catskillman said:


> it is up but not accurate.  It has the north/oasis lift open, but no trails on the west or north side open.  Upper K was not open, the terrain parks all were, as was the race trail.  report says otherwise
> 
> I just left there an hour ago.  Not bad, but the rain tonight and tomorrow could destroy it...


Thanks for the update. Disappointing they would get it back up in an inaccurate state.


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Mar 23, 2022)

danimals said:


> Imagine how clean our country would be if cops actually enforced littering laws, resulting in less people feeling like it’s okay to just toss their trash out.
> 
> I saw a cop sitting on the side of the road yesterday drop a Wawa bag of trash out of his window onto the ground. Then flicked a lit cig into some nice dry grass. This was right next to a oil tank farm.


I hope Officer Obie refrains from arresting any more people for littering at least as long as there is no draft. 

"You can get anything you want . . . "

Cops no longer seeing themselves as being above the law would certainly be a positive development.


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Mar 23, 2022)

danimals said:


> Imagine how clean our country would be if cops actually enforced littering laws, resulting in less people feeling like it’s okay to just toss their trash out.
> 
> I saw a cop sitting on the side of the road yesterday drop a Wawa bag of trash out of his window onto the ground. Then flicked a lit cig into some nice dry grass. This was right next to a oil tank farm.





catskillman said:


> PD was there this year.  They had 2 races and several parties/dinners at macgregors.
> 
> FDNY trashed the hotel too many times and are now banned.  Villa Vousila put them up for one year and now that is also over.  Will be interesting.


I have friends that leave town for the FDNY weekend.   
NYPD not so much..


----------



## cdskier (Mar 23, 2022)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> And now there is no info at all on their web page about what lifts and trails are open - when you thought their reporting could not get worse


I suspect this was a Vail snow report platform issue. Stowe's snow report, weather, and trail report status information was all coming up blank for me this morning (of course on the ONE day I actually was going to one of their resorts and wanted to see the info).


----------



## catskillman (Mar 25, 2022)

Hunter has a sign out today saying they would be making snow Sunday and Monday....

also - Russ had a town hall zoom last night for associates  update


----------



## Creakyknees (Mar 25, 2022)

Two or more years out for this project. I did hear from a reliable source the "B" lift will be moved to Hunter One and a new high speed quad will go in the same location and go higher up the mountain. I don't know what the plans are for the "F" lift.


----------



## Smellytele (Mar 25, 2022)

The only thing I know about Hunter is that I will probably never ski there.


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Mar 25, 2022)

Smellytele said:


> The only thing I know about Hunter is that I will probably never ski there.



Awesome - now I can sleep at night.


----------



## da-bum (Mar 26, 2022)

Creakyknees said:


> Two or more years out for this project. I did hear from a reliable source the "B" lift will be moved to Hunter One and a new high speed quad will go in the same location and go higher up the mountain. I don't know what the plans are for the "F" lift.


If they plan on shutting down the F lift, they can't reuse the lift towers as it is spaced only for a triple chair.  I don't see the space to run another lift next to the F lift, unless it veers off slightly and unload near where the old Z lift unloaded.  Most likely the new HSQ will use the F lift's path and F would be dismantled.


----------



## RichT (Mar 26, 2022)

da-bum said:


> If they plan on shutting down the F lift, they can't reuse the lift towers as it is spaced only for a triple chair.  I don't see the space to run another lift next to the F lift, unless it veers off slightly and unload near where the old Z lift unloaded.  Most likely the new HSQ will use the F lift's path and F would be dismantled.


There's enough uphill capacity now. What I would suggest is to open that groomer trial that goes from top of Drop-off to the belt. Then when the upper lifts are on hold you can still get to the North by way of this and "Sleep Hollow"


----------



## billyb3 (Mar 26, 2022)

RichT said:


> What I would suggest is to open that groomer trial that goes from top of Drop-off to the belt.


I like that idea, is it all downhill?

If they do that, they might want to consider a tunnel/bridge like Killington put on Snowdon to help with a new intersection with Belt.


----------



## RichT (Mar 27, 2022)

billyb3 said:


> I like that idea, is it all downhill?
> 
> If they do that, they might want to consider a tunnel/bridge like Killington put on Snowdon to help with a new intersection with Belt.


Needs a little grading.


----------



## catskillman (Mar 28, 2022)

Creakyknees said:


> Two or more years out for this project. I did hear from a reliable source the "B" lift will be moved to Hunter One and a new high speed quad will go in the same location and go higher up the mountain. I don't know what the plans are for the "F" lift.


Yes, B will go up higher as maybe be a 6 pack.  they want to have access to Gun Hill from it.  Hope to give access to more blue terrain from lift and take pressure off the 6 pack.  At least 2 years out.  Possibly a tunnel, otherwise the cross over mid station would be incredibly dangerout.

F will likely be condemned by the time they replace B


----------



## catskillman (Mar 28, 2022)

RichT said:


> There's enough uphill capacity now. What I would suggest is to open that groomer trial that goes from top of Drop-off to the belt. Then when the upper lifts are on hold you can still get to the North by way of this and "Sleep Hollow"


Groomer trail ?  everyone uses that work road now to get over to the north when the 6 is on wind hold, insane lines or broken, which is often.  Mgt is working on figuring out a way to make this a permanent option.  Oops maybe I should not give out that secret......


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Apr 1, 2022)

Looks from the trail report like they are basically down to Hellgate, Minya and Belt. Anyone got any intel on conditions. Wondering if it is worth the trip tomorrow.


----------



## da-bum (Apr 1, 2022)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> Looks from the trail report like they are basically down to Hellgate, Minya and Belt. Anyone got any intel on conditions. Wondering if it is worth the trip tomorrow.


Ike and Bleeker are open too.

They seem to close trails on weekdays when they don't have time to groom the trails.  When I was there tuesday, many trails that seemed skiable were closed, such as Ike. While I constantly see people coming out of closed trails like Jimmy Huega.  The whole North was closed too (which were open on Monday).  But on the next day's report, Ike, Twlight, Overlook, upper K27 were all opened.


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Apr 3, 2022)

I was there yesterday and there were basically 6 runs open. Here is my assessment of each

ESD/L.Crossover/Mossy - thin with bare spots. unlikely to make it to Monday

Minya/L.Crossover/Madison - thin with bare spots. unlikely to make it to Monday

Hellgate/Ike - had some rough spots but should be able to stay open

White Cloud/Bleeker - thin with bare spots. unlikely to make it to Monday 

White Cloud/Drop Off - top of WC has a bare patch but other than that pretty good and should make it to Monday

Belt Parkway - pretty good, should be fine Monday

Overlook - real nice - best run they have now.

I am planning to hit Okemo Monday. They seem to be the best Epic option in region based on what they will still have open Monday


----------



## catskillman (Apr 3, 2022)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> I was there yesterday and there were basically 6 runs open. Here is my assessment of each
> 
> ESD/L.Crossover/Mossy - thin with bare spots. unlikely to make it to Monday
> 
> ...


i was there yesterday.  no crowds, except on the deck.  They will most likely open Monday with the belt and hellgate.  White cloud is closed today, and east & minya are open but not groomed.  Doubt they ever will again, not a ton of snow and several days of rain ahead.

There was a big brawl on Hellgate yesterday around 2.  Snowboarders beat the hell out of a kid, looked about 15 yr old.  Supposedly he blocked the jump, He was unconsious.  Heard someone say, he had the lift attendent at the top call patrol when he saw it from the lift.  He skied down, and rode the lift back up and he was still out and surrounded by ski patrol.  Police were called of course...Not sure of the outcome.  Love that high class Vail clientele.


----------



## jimmywilson69 (Apr 3, 2022)

I mean the clientele hasn't changed at Hunter not sure why you'd blame that on Vail.  Its full of NYC and Jersey's finest and always has been...

One of the reasons I've always driven right by it, even though I can ski there for free now.


----------



## catskillman (Apr 3, 2022)

jimmywilson69 said:


> I mean the clientele hasn't changed at Hunter not sure why you'd blame that on Vail.  Its full of NYC and Jersey's finest and always has been...
> 
> One of the reasons I've always driven right by it, even though I can ski there for free now.


I have to agree with you on that.  I guess the last 2 years without the bar, or limited this year, there were minimal fights and I had not heard of any guns pulled this year at all.  I ski mostly mid week so the crowds are not as bad, though far from the pre Vail crowds.  This brawl was brutal and it was not just 2 guys fighting.  

Not sure what the future holds, but it won't be any better that is for sure.  

Many people are giving up their seasonal lockers, and leaving .  long term folks.......


----------



## jimmywilson69 (Apr 3, 2022)

I guess no guns being pulled is a positive?  

long term people leaving is not.  But that's why vail sucks...


----------



## RichT (Apr 4, 2022)

jimmywilson69 said:


> I mean the clientele hasn't changed at Hunter not sure why you'd blame that on Vail.  Its full of NYC and Jersey's finest and always has been...
> 
> One of the reasons I've always driven right by it, even though I can ski there for free now.


You can? How'd you pull that off?


----------



## cdskier (Apr 4, 2022)

RichT said:


> You can? How'd you pull that off?


Wild stab in the dark here...but he has an Epic pass that he bought to access the resorts he regularly skis, so now he also has "free" access to Hunter.


----------



## jimmywilson69 (Apr 4, 2022)

yeah  Free was not the best choice of words...

Included in my pass is what I should've said


----------



## cdskier (Apr 4, 2022)

jimmywilson69 said:


> yeah  Free was not the best choice of words...
> 
> Included in my pass is what I should've said



"Free" is fine and I think that's the way a lot of people view it. When I skied a day in the Catskills around New Years, myself and the person I skied with both agreed that Windham was the logical choice that day since it was "free" for us.


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Apr 4, 2022)

catskillman said:


> Not sure what the future holds, but it won't be any better that is for sure.
> 
> Many people are giving up their seasonal lockers, and leaving .  long term folks.......


Hunter is going to get better - it already is!
I've been waiting for years for all the old "seasonal locker(I gave up mine years ago)" people to go away and let the new blood in. 
And they are here and they are revitalizing this town - out with the old and stogy!!!  In with fun positive people!
They should all go ski Windham like my Dad did when he got old.   I'm down with that.


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Apr 4, 2022)

jimmywilson69 said:


> I mean the clientele hasn't changed at Hunter not sure why you'd blame that on Vail.  Its full of NYC and Jersey's finest and always has been...


Yet somehow the people from PA and Mass bug me way more.   
I think the cliental has changed.   I'm seeing more diversity and new older skiers.   Less grumpy old carvers.


----------



## jimmywilson69 (Apr 4, 2022)

Funky_Catskills said:


> I think the cliental has changed.   I'm seeing more diversity and new older skiers.   Less grumpy old carvers.


This is good to hear!


----------



## RichT (Apr 4, 2022)

Funky_Catskills said:


> Hunter is going to get better - it already is!
> I've been waiting for years for all the old "seasonal locker(I gave up mine years ago)" people to go away and let the new blood in.
> And they are here and they are revitalizing this town - out with the old and stogy!!!  In with fun positive people!
> They should all go ski Windham like my Dad did when he got old.   I'm down with that.


It is? From the guy who played a lot of Saturdays in a very good band on a stage in a bar in a lodge? Which has been not in use for over two years? That's better? I THINK NOT! Us old and stogy(sp) miss all that and so do you! Revitalizing Hunter? The town is dead my friend, look around then hop on over to Windham. That's the town Hunter should be and Tannersville also. And now Drew's store is gone.............. Jeez


----------



## 180 (Apr 4, 2022)

One step forward, 2 steps back.  Its happening slowly, but its happening in Hunter.  We'll see if the progress continues.  We do miss the band on stage.


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Apr 5, 2022)

RichT said:


> It is? From the guy who played a lot of Saturdays in a very good band on a stage in a bar in a lodge? Which has been not in use for over two years? That's better? I THINK NOT! Us old and stogy(sp) miss all that and so do you! Revitalizing Hunter? The town is dead my friend, look around then hop on over to Windham. That's the town Hunter should be and Tannersville also. And now Drew's store is gone.............. Jeez


I moved on from that band years ago - I didn't like playing the lodge so much and cover music was boring me.  And the singer hated me.
I stand by my statements - things are getting better.   Restaurants are killing it!  Summers have been amazing with people up.
Sorry Natashas place closed. They'll be OK.   I go to windham to eat every now and then - it is nice.


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Apr 5, 2022)

180 said:


> One step forward, 2 steps back.  Its happening slowly, but its happening in Hunter.  We'll see if the progress continues.  We do miss the band on stage.


And I'm here for it!


----------



## drjeff (Apr 5, 2022)

Funky_Catskills said:


> Hunter is going to get better - it already is!
> I've been waiting for years for all the old "seasonal locker(I gave up mine years ago)" people to go away and let the new blood in.
> And they are here and they are revitalizing this town - out with the old and stogy!!!  In with fun positive people!
> They should all go ski Windham like my Dad did when he got old.   I'm down with that.


Glad to hear that from the perspective of someone who is there on the ground year round!  And hope that the trend continues!


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Apr 5, 2022)

drjeff said:


> Glad to hear that from the perspective of someone who is there on the ground year round!  And hope that the trend continues!


Thank you.  So do I!!!

I'm staying positive - which is really hard with all the negativity pushing in.  
The entitlement and vitriol has been nasty on all fronts.   
And yet - my friends that run events and work on the mountain have been rolling on successfully - in spite of all the things that everyone says are going wrong.


----------



## abc (Apr 5, 2022)

Changed, but not necessarily for the better.

I happen to know one such "old and stogy" regular who had now cleared out his locker and stopped skiing there. The lack of snow making and the slow (or never) opening of the more "interesting" (aka Hunter West) terrain had turned many "old timers" away. (I'm not that old, and not exactly a Hunter regular. But I'm not bothering to go there when the west side is not open).

But the new "diversity" who didn't know what Hunter was like before may not be bothered by the shortened season, the shrinking of terrain "diversity", etc. They'll be happy to have a long vertical mountain within easy day trip distance. It's a "new normal" for Hunter.


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Apr 5, 2022)

abc said:


> Changed, but not necessarily for the better.
> 
> I happen to know one such "old and stogy" regular who had now cleared out his locker and stopped skiing there. The lack of snow making and the slow (or never) opening of the more "interesting" (aka Hunter West) terrain had turned many "old timers" away. (I'm not that old, and not exactly a Hunter regular. But I'm not bothering to go there when the west side is not open).
> 
> But the new "diversity" who didn't know what Hunter was like before may not be bothered by the shortened season, the shrinking of terrain "diversity", etc. They'll be happy to have a long vertical mountain within easy day trip distance. It's a "new normal" for Hunter.



I guess that all depends on where you come from.  I think the change as a whole for the town is for the better.   My hope is the mountain gets better for all next year.
I've got no complaints -  I usually ride mid-week.  I live near the Northface so it's easy to jump out for a few runs at lunch.  My boss is cool with it.   I never go to the lodge anymore as my social life has turned more into hanging with local friends not weekenders.   So I've turned my back on the social scene for the most part.  I do miss John the bartender and Jerry too.  
AND
I'm super happy the old folks can find a good place to settle into.  My Dad loved Windham and Bellayre towards the end of his life.  They served him well.
AND
By diversity - I mean *people*.  Not ski trails.  More people of all types are enjoying the area which makes me happy.


----------



## catskillman (Apr 5, 2022)

Funky_Catskills said:


> I guess that all depends on where you come from.  I think the change as a whole for the town is for the better.   My hope is the mountain gets better for all next year.
> I've got no complaints -  I usually ride mid-week.  I live near the Northface so it's easy to jump out for a few runs at lunch.  My boss is cool with it.   I never go to the lodge anymore as my social life has turned more into hanging with local friends not weekenders.   So I've turned my back on the social scene for the most part.  I do miss John the bartender and Jerry too.
> AND
> I'm super happy the old folks can find a good place to settle into.  My Dad loved Windham and Bellayre towards the end of his life.  They served him well.
> ...


the lodge scene is a huge part of any mountain experience, especially for the regulars.  Just because you are no longer interested in socializing with us, does not mean things are improving.  Because, if you go to the lodge, I think you will be hard pressed to find anyone, a regular, that is happy.  The skiing has been awful for the most part of the season, there was no socializing except for frankie twice on the deck.  By the way, he played on Satruday, but the mountain never announced that.  
Sorry Doug, you are way off.  the rest of us do not want to tune back on our social life and want to ski and socialize with civil and safe riders & skiers.  Oh, and who wants to stand in a line for 45 minutes, take an hour to get rentals on a good day, be able to book a lesson and not have to pay $8 for a slice of pizza.  I could go on and on....


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Apr 5, 2022)

catskillman said:


> Sorry Doug, you are way off.  the rest of us do not want to tune back on our social life and want to ski and socialize with civil and safe riders & skiers.  Oh, and who wants to stand in a line for 45 minutes, take an hour to get rentals on a good day, be able to book a lesson and not have to pay $8 for a slice of pizza.  I could go on and on....



Good job becoming the person that speaks for the "rest of us".    
Just my perspective and some others as well(I don't speak for everyone - just my friends).


----------



## abc (Apr 5, 2022)

Funky_Catskills said:


> By diversity - I mean *people*. Not ski trails. More people of all types are enjoying the area which makes me happy.


Diversity, is a word that describes anything that's not homogeneous. 

It can mean diversity of people, which is what this word had recently had been hijacked by the social police. 

But the diversity of people who're now skiing Hunter is skiing a less diversity of terrain. Call it the dumbing down of challenges?


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Apr 5, 2022)

abc said:


> Diversity, is a word that describes anything that's not homogeneous.
> 
> It can mean diversity of people, which is what this word had recently had been hijacked by the social police.
> 
> But the diversity of people who're now skiing Hunter is skiing a less diversity of terrain. Call it the dumbing down of challenges?



ummmm...  The old DMC would tear into you and start a fame war.  Not anymore.  Not worth the effort to me.

Have a great day!  I hope what ever it is you think you deserve - you get!


----------



## abc (Apr 5, 2022)

Funky_Catskills said:


> The old DMC would tear into you and start a fame war. Not anymore. Not worth the effort to me.


I'm a card carrying Democrat (and I'm not white, for those who don't know!). But I will not hesitate to call a spade as a spade!

If anyone want to flame away, be my guest. Just don’t be surprised to find the flame blow right back at ya!


----------



## catskillman (Apr 6, 2022)

Funky_Catskills said:


> Good job becoming the person that speaks for the "rest of us".
> Just my perspective and some others as well(I don't speak for everyone - just my friends).


wow - what happened to the old Don?  you were the one who spoke for the world, and usually were not very happy if I recall


----------



## JimG. (Apr 6, 2022)

Summer lurks


----------



## Kingslug20 (Apr 6, 2022)

It does


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Apr 7, 2022)

JimG. said:


> Summer lurks


Have a great summer Jim!


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Apr 7, 2022)

catskillman said:


> wow - what happened to the old Don?  you were the one who spoke for the world, and usually were not very happy if I recall



Maybe he just got disillusioned with the negative Hunter ski culture and just stepped away.


----------



## drjeff (Apr 7, 2022)

Funky_Catskills said:


> Maybe he just got disillusioned with the negative Hunter ski culture and just stepped away.



Always an interesting experience when many, who don't live or spend a bunch of time in the area, to the point where they don't really know the locals and get the full picture, start ranting on the place, and in many cases just simply because the "cool online kids" decided its the thing to do.  The perceieved reality from those who aren't there more than on an occasional basis and just for a few hours at a time just can't give them the real sense of what is going on in the community. 

Glad the vibe around Hunter is changing for the better in your long time local perspective!


----------



## Funky_Catskills (Apr 7, 2022)

drjeff said:


> Always an interesting experience when many, who don't live or spend a bunch of time in the area, to the point where they don't really know the locals and get the full picture, start ranting on the place, and in many cases just simply because the "cool online kids" decided its the thing to do.  The perceieved reality from those who aren't there more than on an occasional basis and just for a few hours at a time just can't give them the real sense of what is going on in the community.
> 
> Glad the vibe around Hunter is changing for the better in your long time local perspective!


thanks...  
We live in different worlds and have different levels of what we expect from a town for sure.

Dropping off for the summah now..  Enjoy the mountains!!


----------



## catskillman (Apr 7, 2022)

i have 60+ days this season at Hunter.  I know what is going on...


----------



## jaytrem (Apr 7, 2022)

Funky_Catskills said:


> Dropping off for the summah now..  Enjoy the mountains!!



This didn't age well, posted an emoji for Catskillman 30 min later.  Not sure why Funky and Jeff are discounting his experience so much.  He's got more Hunter days in than Jeff has MS days.


----------



## drjeff (Apr 7, 2022)

jaytrem said:


> This didn't age well, posted an emoji for Catskillman 30 min later.  Not sure why Funky and Jeff are discounting his experience so much.  He's got more Hunter days in than Jeff has MS days.



What I am referring to (and what I gathered from his context Funky Catskills was too) is more than just "on hill" experiences.  It's more of the entire community experience, and that is everything from some people moving out of the community and others moving in, to how the surrounding businesses, and their owners and employees are doing.

The last few seasons, between new ownership, as well as the changes in people living in mountain communities as a result of COVID, have brought tangible changes to many mountain communities that extend far beyond when the lifts are spinning and folks are sliding downhill on snow


----------



## jaytrem (Apr 7, 2022)

Just seems like you're only respecting Funky's experience and not Catskillman's.  Kinda ironic since he seems to spend more time at Hunter than you do at MS.  I just think both their experiences are worth listening to.


----------



## 180 (Apr 7, 2022)

CSman is negative 90% of the time that's why. Dwells on guns  and fights


----------



## JimG. (Apr 7, 2022)

Funky_Catskills said:


> Have a great summer Jim!


You as well Doug.

Not ready to hang them up yet but I do hear the fish calling my name.


----------



## jaytrem (Apr 7, 2022)

180 said:


> CSman is negative 90% of the time that's why. Dwells on guns  and fights


That may be, but if you look at Funky's posts, the negativity tends to still find its way out.  You on the other hard seem more positive most of the time.  Probably means everybody should just ski more bumps.


----------



## urungus (Apr 7, 2022)

180 said:


> CSman is negative 90% of the time that's why. Dwells on guns  and fights


Yeah, other than the guns and fights Hunter is terrific


----------



## catskillman (Apr 8, 2022)

drjeff said:


> What I am referring to (and what I gathered from his context Funky Catskills was too) is more than just "on hill" experiences.  It's more of the entire community experience, and that is everything from some people moving out of the community and others moving in, to how the surrounding businesses, and their owners and employees are doing.
> 
> The last few seasons, between new ownership, as well as the changes in people living in mountain communities as a result of COVID, have brought tangible changes to many mountain communities that extend far beyond when the lifts are spinning and folks are sliding downhill on snow


i honestly have not seen DMC all season at the mountain.  

There is a ton more building activity in the area, mostly huge 2nd homes.  Air B&B is an enormous business. There is supposed to be 2 new restaurants in Hunter village, but without any parking it will be very tough for them.  Time will tell, but the new young crowd is not the type that will be having a sit down meal after skiing.  And with the traffic on weekends, the locals stay home.


----------



## catskillman (Apr 8, 2022)

180 said:


> CSman is negative 90% of the time that's why. Dwells on guns  and fights


do want to have to ski around a fight, or dodge a gun in the bar?  Anywhere?  I have not heard of any guns at Hunter the last couple of seasons byw.  Ski patrol did find a knife on a trail this season though.  I do not have the details on the knife size etc...heard it on the radio riding with a courtesy patroller.

I am not negative, just accurately reporting


----------



## catskillman (Apr 8, 2022)

and this is accurate.  They made an unbelievable recovery from yesterday's storm.  Coverage is quite good on the parkway and hellgate.

They were grooming Hunter 1 around noon - going to open that terrain and lifts tomorrow.  Place was empty..


----------



## 180 (Apr 8, 2022)

Today was a beautiful partly sunny day.  About 30 of us enjoyed the Belt, Mainline and Milky.  The groomers did a fantastic job patching it up.


----------



## RichT (Apr 11, 2022)

Last call from Jon, yesterday! Praying for a better next year!!


----------



## catskillman (Apr 12, 2022)

RichT said:


> Last call from Jon, yesterday! Praying for a better next year!!


was there anyone there at the bar?  I left around 12, nothing going on at all.


----------



## catskillman (Apr 13, 2022)

Mentioned on the VAIL SUCKS thread - they are tearing down the Tubing Park and putting up a parking lot.  More spaces to charge for in 2024 $$$.  I bet they find the help for paid parking.


----------



## 180 (Apr 13, 2022)

Massive snowmaking upgrades coming.  Klink automated guns going in all around the mountain.


----------



## jimmywilson69 (Apr 14, 2022)

That's exciting.  Like I just said in the Vail Sucks thread, if anyone can afford to "go the extra mile" it is Vail Resorts.


----------



## RichT (Apr 15, 2022)

180 said:


> Massive snowmaking upgrades coming.  Klink automated guns going in all around the mountain.


Was this announced yet? I haven't heard, but that would be awesome!


----------



## catskillman (Apr 15, 2022)

RichT said:


> Was this announced yet? I haven't heard, but that would be awesome!


mgt has said that they have major snow making imporvements this summer to include fixing the racers and hellgate issues from this season.


----------



## catskillman (Apr 15, 2022)

Why is Russ's car still in the parking lot, if he is supposed to be gone??


----------



## 180 (Apr 15, 2022)

Russ is not gone from the latest I hear.


----------



## catskillman (Apr 16, 2022)

yeah, it does not seem like it.  Shame, he does not respect his employees, except his daughter (who Vail made leave, but got her a job at Okemo), and does a horrible job running the mountain.  Heard he has/had another job so not sure why he is still her.  Just shows how desperate Vail is for GM's.


----------



## tumbler (Apr 16, 2022)

Not a Hunter skier but are you guys really stalking cars in the parking lot?


----------



## abc (Apr 16, 2022)

180 said:


> Massive snowmaking upgrades coming.  Klink automated guns going in all around the mountain.


Wait, Hunter used to open early and close late before Vail took over. The previous management seemed to be able to make tons of snow with existing system

Why all of a sudden the big fanfare that Hunter will get new snowmaking "upgrade"? What about actually using the system that's in place?


----------



## kendo (Apr 17, 2022)

Automation upgrade will increase output with less labor and provide the ability to make more snow in optimal weather windows.  

Holiday Valley's automation shows the potential...


----------



## Kingslug20 (Apr 17, 2022)

Some of the systems in place are old and past their lifetime. Racers edge auto system for one.


----------



## catskillman (Apr 17, 2022)

tumbler said:


> Not a Hunter skier but are you guys really stalking cars in the parking lot?


he has a reserved spot with his name on it, right in front of the lodge.  have to walk by it....


----------



## Creakyknees (Apr 20, 2022)

catskillman said:


> Mentioned on the VAIL SUCKS thread - they are tearing down the Tubing Park and putting up a parking lot.  More spaces to charge for in 2024 $$$.  I bet they find the help for paid parking.


As for charging for parking not sure the logistics of this but Hunter has one way into the parking lot. All the cars waiting to pay to park will cause a traffic nightmare back onto main street.


----------



## cdskier (Apr 20, 2022)

Creakyknees said:


> As for charging for parking not sure the logistics of this but Hunter has one way into the parking lot. All the cars waiting to pay to park will cause a traffic nightmare back onto main street.


My understanding is that Vail doesn't charge you as you enter. They expect you to pay with an app and then simply walk around the lot checking license plates to see which plates paid and which didn't.


----------



## danimals (Apr 20, 2022)

Do you have to pay if your a pass holder?


----------



## Smellytele (Apr 20, 2022)

danimals said:


> Do you have to pay if your a pass holder?


Yes


----------



## KustyTheKlown (Apr 20, 2022)

lol thats cute. do you have to pay if you're a passholder. lol. so cute.


----------



## danimals (Apr 20, 2022)

Well I guess that kills whatever small sentimental value I still had towards a few of the vail properties.


----------



## catskillman (May 3, 2022)

Pre-Paid Parking | Hunter Mountain Resort
					






					www.huntermtn.com
				




from the website today - paid parking next season in the 2 small lots that several years ago were paid parking at $15. now $20


----------



## RichT (May 17, 2022)

Just went on the website, looking for some events in the coming weeks now that the pandemic(?) is over. Jeep thing this weekend and then??????? Seems weird, there's  nothing posted and I went all the way to 12/31/22. I thought they were going to start doing things again?


----------



## danimals (May 17, 2022)

5/9-12/31 is listed as the summer of a lifetime.


----------



## zyk (May 17, 2022)

Tap NY, Mountain Jam, Country Fest, etc all used to be there.  Tap is now at Bethel Woods don't know where the rest went.


----------



## cdskier (May 17, 2022)

zyk said:


> Tap NY, Mountain Jam, Country Fest, etc all used to be there.  Tap is now at Bethel Woods don't know where the rest went.



Mountain Jam is nowhere this year...but at Bethel Woods in 2023 from what I see on their website. Taste of Country that was previously at Hunter is simply listed as cancelled for the Hunter location on the tour this year. Not sure if that's the same Country Fest you're referring to or not...


----------



## catskillman (May 21, 2022)

danimals said:


> 5/9-12/31 is listed as the summer of a lifetime.


Not sure who's lifetime....

There is activity at the mountain.  clouds of dust on the parkway, and there is a large long ditch being dug in the parking lot below the snow tubing.  Supposedly Octoberfest the first weekend in October


----------



## RichT (May 21, 2022)

catskillman said:


> Not sure who's lifetime....
> 
> There is activity at the mountain.  clouds of dust on the parkway, and there is a large long ditch being dug in the parking lot below the snow tubing.  Supposedly Octoberfest the first weekend in October


The beginning of the end of the snowtubing park???


----------



## RichT (Jun 2, 2022)

So it's true, confirmed on "Hunter Ski Bums" FB page.
Snowtubing making way for parking space.


----------



## catskillman (Jun 3, 2022)

went up earlier - they have all the uphill charis removed from D lift, only the one's facing down are on.  Some sort of maintenance.

All the groomers have been moved to the snow tubing area from over by B lift for some reason.

Grass has been moved, early for that.  A lot of cars in the lot, not sure why, zipline is open but did not see anyone around.

The website has a photo from a previous Octoberfest on it, however there are zero events listed for the rest of 2022.


----------



## 180 (Jun 3, 2022)

Half the snowtubing being removed.  The shop is eventually going to be there for the groomers.


----------



## catskillman (Jun 4, 2022)

180 said:


> Half the snowtubing being removed.  The shop is eventually going to be there for the groomers.


so they will have to drive thru the parking lot to get repaired?  Like the lot is not in bad enough shape now?  The hotel and condo owners will love that noise and dust


----------



## RichT (Jun 5, 2022)

They are also going to put a new(?) Lift from where B is now up to and past a little bit to the left of F lift.............also heard F will be a HS Quad. What Hunter does NOT need without trail expansion is more uphill capacity.


----------



## 180 (Jun 6, 2022)

catskillman said:


> so they will have to drive thru the parking lot to get repaired?  Like the lot is not in bad enough shape now?  The hotel and condo owners will love that noise and dust


they drive behind the hotel


----------



## RichT (Jun 7, 2022)

C


180 said:


> they drive behind the hotel


Correct, there's a dirt road between the hotel and the Belt Parkway. Right at the bottom of Racers/Belt Pky


----------



## RichT (Jun 11, 2022)

Here's some news about Tannersville, looks like a lot of new affordable housing coming. And some MUCH needed repairs!!


----------



## catskillman (Jun 11, 2022)

RichT said:


> They are also going to put a new(?) Lift from where B is now up to and past a little bit to the left of F lift.............also heard F will be a HS Quad. What Hunter does NOT need without trail expansion is more uphill capacity.


all rumer at this point.  They have to figure out how to regrade so you can access Gun Hill from the lift without making it to dangerous....  They also want to have D go higher and faster. and of course all that has to go thru the state & town, and the bean counters.  won't happen anytime soon.

also a lodge over on the north,.  These are all nothing new, dreams from the Slutzky's.......

they tore up the snow making lines by madison last month.  hopefully they will be finished by opening day


----------



## catskillman (Jun 11, 2022)

RichT said:


> Here's some news about Tannersville, looks like a lot of new affordable housing coming. And some MUCH needed repairs!!


none of this is final.  In review stage...decisions on allocation to be made by July.  Only 10 million to spend from NY.    Committee / consultants looking for input from locals...  doubt the dispensary will get a nickle, as well as the religious organizations requesting millions


----------



## RichT (Jun 12, 2022)

catskillman said:


> none of this is final.  In review stage...decisions on allocation to be made by July.  Only 10 million to spend from NY.    Committee / consultants looking for input from locals...  doubt the dispensary will get a nickle, as well as the religious organizations requesting millions


These people have the ability to get what they want (they vote in blocks), will slowly take over town boards. I know we used to live in Rockland NY.


----------



## raisingarizona (Jun 12, 2022)

RichT said:


> These people have the ability to get what they want (they vote in blocks), will slowly take over town boards. I know we used to live in Rockland NY.


People with power and money don't generally like more affordable housing. They'd prefer to keep that riff raft out of their sight.


----------



## RichT (Jun 13, 2022)

raisingarizona said:


> People with power and money don't generally like more affordable housing. They'd prefer to keep that riff raft out of their sight.


We'll see.........


----------



## catskillman (Jun 14, 2022)

On that topic - this town is closer to Belleayre than Hunter, but........









						Voter fraud accusations rock ‘Borscht Belt’ resort in the Catskills
					

A tiny Borscht Belt town that beckons Orthodox Jewish vacationers in the summer staged a pivotal election this spring that was anything but kosher, according to an explosive lawsuit.




					nypost.com


----------



## KustyTheKlown (Jun 14, 2022)

RichT said:


> These people have the ability to get what they want (they vote in blocks), will slowly take over town boards. I know we used to live in Rockland NY.



oh boy do i sure fucking loathe hasids. the only religious group in the world i have utter unmitigated disdain for. and i'm a (secular) jewish person!

the worst neighbors on earth. the worst people on earth.

i quite often go back to/share this article about how they overpowered the public schools in ramapo and totally gutted them and fucked every non-hasid in the district - https://nymag.com/news/features/east-ramapo-hasidim-2013-4/

horrible fucking people. smell like shit on the subway too in 90 degree weather with their woolen overcoats and tuna fish beards.


----------



## RichT (Jun 15, 2022)

Hate to say it, but watch  Tannersville fall.............these people work the system very well. I lived in Airmont NY, was great 20 yrs later it's a slum! Cockroaches they are.


----------



## catskillman (Jun 15, 2022)

RichT said:


> Hate to say it, but watch  Tannersville fall.............these people work the system very well. I lived in Airmont NY, was great 20 yrs later it's a slum! Cockroaches they are.


it has been falling.  Village of Hunter also.  Buying up everything.  Saw several in Windham last week also...


----------



## catskillman (Jun 15, 2022)

catskillman said:


> it has been falling.  Village of Hunter also.  Buying up everything.  Saw several in Windham last week also...


Vail should have purchased several of the hotels recently sold to a religious group for much needed employee housing.


----------



## RichT (Jun 17, 2022)

catskillman said:


> Vail should have purchased several of the hotels recently sold to a religious group for much needed employee housing.


I would bet if Fail tried, there would be lawsuits from the Hasids claiming anti-semitism! That's part of their playbook.


----------



## catskillman (Jun 17, 2022)

RichT said:


> I would bet if Fail tried, there would be lawsuits from the Hasids claiming anti-antisemitism! That's part of their playbook.





RichT said:


> I would bet if Fail tried, there would be lawsuits from the Hasids claiming anti-antisemitism! That's part of their playbook.


in a response to how much they would contribute to a grant they applied for the one said he was going to sell the Greene Mountain Inn, which is where 30 foreign workers stayed last season.  Hopefully Vail is all over that.

The Villa Vousilla, Greene Mountain Inn, and the dispensary project were all eliminated for multiple reasons from the DRI.  Final decision on projects will be made July 7th by the Tannersville committee, then it goes to the state....


----------



## NYDB (Jun 18, 2022)

The Hasidim must have a summer camp around Bromley in SoVt.  They will easily ruin your day there at the summer park if there are enough of them.  Rude, inconsiderate and clueless.  Coupled with the college kids who staff the place unwillingness to provide any pushback to their generally deplorable behavior, it makes for a not so fun experience.  

i Can’t imagine any other group acting the way they do and getting away with it.


----------



## danimals (Jun 18, 2022)

NYDB said:


> The Hasidim must have a summer camp around Bromley in SoVt.  They will easily ruin your day there at the summer park if there are enough of them.  Rude, inconsiderate and clueless.  Coupled with the college kids who staff the place unwillingness to provide any pushback to their generally deplorable behavior, it makes for a not so fun experience.
> 
> i Can’t imagine any other group acting the way they do and getting away with it.


Pennsylvanians at the jersey shore.


----------



## deadheadskier (Jun 19, 2022)

17 years ago, I ran catering operations at what is now the Hilton on the Burlington waterfront.  We hosted a Hasidic wedding one time, which was reported to be the largest ever in the state.  Roughly 400 guests.  They insisted a Rabbi kosherize all of the kitchen equipment before our chefs prepared the meal.   They ended up destroying $50k worth of equipment and insisted it wasn't their fault and the hotel had to make their own insurance claim.


----------



## ss20 (Jun 19, 2022)

deadheadskier said:


> 17 years ago, I ran catering operations at what is now the Hilton on the Burlington waterfront.  We hosted a Hasidic wedding one time, which was reported to be the largest ever in the state.  Roughly 400 guests.  They insisted a Rabbi kosherize all of the kitchen equipment before our chefs prepared the meal.   They ended up destroying $50k worth of equipment and insisted it wasn't their fault and the hotel had to make their own insurance claim.



First chef I worked under for banquets/weddings would do/sell anything to get a gig.  Including taking a wedding 5 hours away from our kitchen resulting in a 21 hour day for the staff (good times getting back to the kitchen seeing the sunrise).  Including agreeing that the kitchen crew would help move tables/chairs from ceremony to reception, thus delaying the dinner bc he didn't want to pay for more servers to move the stuff.  Including agreeing to cater a breakfast which we had never done before or since in 12 years of business.  We'd do entire weddings that were vegan, vegetarian, gluten free- whatever... we'd "improvise".  But no Kosher.  That was the line he drew lol.  Did not want to deal with any of that.


----------



## catskillman (Jun 27, 2022)

went up over the weekend.  The furniture hs all been removed from the cafeteria and bar area and is blocked off.  Thought they may be replacing the carpet, but no.  Nothing is new except some bamboo arch by the ziplining area.  Snow guns are still up in the tubing park.  they dug up something, but no work has been done grading it out for parking.

Russ's car was in his parking spot........ugh..........

The pool area outdoor bar area has been cleaned up at the hotel.  Place was empty though...actually the whole area was deserted.  The trolley is running.  Saw it about 10 times over the weekend.  Noone was in it except the driver at any time, which is sad.....


----------



## raisingarizona (Jun 27, 2022)

Somebody should call a doctor because this guy is getting sick!


----------



## catskillman (Jun 27, 2022)

not a joke actually.  There are many many that ski in similar garments.  Specifically the girls that have to wear a skirt


----------



## raisingarizona (Jun 27, 2022)

catskillman said:


> not a joke actually.  There are many many that ski in similar garments.  Specifically the girls that have to wear a skirt


Freedom first. I love what the Fundamentalist Mormans have going on in Southern Utah.


----------



## 180 (Jun 28, 2022)

catskillman said:


> went up over the weekend.  The furniture hs all been removed from the cafeteria and bar area and is blocked off.  Thought they may be replacing the carpet, but no.  Nothing is new except some bamboo arch by the ziplining area.  Snow guns are still up in the tubing park.  they dug up something, but no work has been done grading it out for parking.
> 
> Russ's car was in his parking spot........ugh..........
> 
> The pool area outdoor bar area has been cleaned up at the hotel.  Place was empty though...actually the whole area was deserted.  The trolley is running.  Saw it about 10 times over the weekend.  Noone was in it except the driver at any time, which is sad.....


Supposedly they changed their minds about ripping all the tubing out.


----------



## KustyTheKlown (Jun 28, 2022)

i forget what its called. holiday mountain maybe? near monticello. you can see the top of a lift from route 17. hasidics ski there and its a sight.


----------



## RichT (Jun 29, 2022)

Downtown Revitalization Initiative | Tannersville DRI | New York
					

Welcome to the Tannersville Downtown Revitalization Initiative (DRI) website. New York State has awarded $10M to the Village of Tannersville as part of DRI Round 5 funding, to develop a downtown strategic investment plan and implement key catalytic projects.




					www.tannersvilledri.com


----------



## catskillman (Jul 1, 2022)

RichT said:


> Downtown Revitalization Initiative | Tannersville DRI | New York
> 
> 
> Welcome to the Tannersville Downtown Revitalization Initiative (DRI) website. New York State has awarded $10M to the Village of Tannersville as part of DRI Round 5 funding, to develop a downtown strategic investment plan and implement key catalytic projects.
> ...


This Thursday at 5:30 at the library is the final input meeting for local input on the pending projects.  Many have been eliminated for various reasons, like the person applying did not own the building, taxes on building had not been paid, dispensary, religious ownership did not meet open requirements.  What is mostly left is the trolley, theatre, library, highschool, public housing and a lot of restoration for buildings on main st.

they were at $16 million last I knew.......


----------



## catskillman (Jul 8, 2022)

n a response to how much they would contribute to a grant they applied for the one said he was going to sell the Greene Mountain Inn, which is where 30 foreign workers stayed last season. Hopefully Vail is all over that.

So at the meeting last night, it was stated that the Inn was under contract - no one seemed to know if it was Vail or not, and no one wanted to ask the sole mountain employee that was there if it was true.  She may not have known anyway, as she is just in charge of skier services.......Let's hope, or it may be 30 less foreign workers without a place to stay.....

Vail has recently been turned down in Vail regarding building housing on land that they own.  Neighboring lots are occupied by sheep and mega million dollar homes


----------



## jimmywilson69 (Jul 8, 2022)

the opposition in East Vail was weird, they (Vail Resorts) were blowing up their social media about it.  Seemed rooted in NIMBYism...


----------



## RichT (Jul 19, 2022)

OMG!!!!!! They even took the vaccine requirement away!





__ https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=874614066841046


----------



## catskillman (Aug 5, 2022)

Went up to the mountain - they have removed the deck from the front of the base lodge (which was a safety hazard) and have put down new blacktop.

They also paved sections of the parking lot, specifically the lots that are going to be paved lots.  Also painting the floors downstairs in the locker room.  Snow tubing is torn up in the middle, not sure why.

New wrapping on the posts by the ticket booths, resembling the NYC subway system....
Web site has been updated with Octoberfest dates....

That's all I noticed......


----------



## IceEidolon (Aug 5, 2022)

RichT said:


> OMG!!!!!! They even took the vaccine requirement away!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Basically the only thing they did right last year and now they screwed it up too.


----------



## RichT (Aug 7, 2022)

IceEidolon said:


> Basically the only thing they did right last year and now they screwed it up too.


I totally disagree with you.


----------



## raisingarizona (Aug 7, 2022)

RichT said:


> I totally disagree with you.


Yup. If people are that scared of getting what amounts to a cold now they should stay home.


----------



## IceEidolon (Aug 8, 2022)

You're clearly not living with anyone who's gotten Long Covid - it's a heck of a lot worse than a cold. Vail was actually protecting guests and employees and gave up on it. As a mountain ops worker, they're risking losing an entire crew if one guy comes down sick and passes it to the break room and I'm not willing to sign onto a crew without a vaccination requirement.

I think further discussion on this topic is probably not suited for this thread, though, since it's going to end up in an ideological argument.


----------



## RichT (Aug 8, 2022)

IceEidolon said:


> You're clearly not living with anyone who's gotten Long Covid - it's a heck of a lot worse than a cold. Vail was actually protecting guests and employees and gave up on it. As a mountain ops worker, they're risking losing an entire crew if one guy comes down sick and passes it to the break room and I'm not willing to sign onto a crew without a vaccination requirement.
> 
> I think further discussion on this topic is probably not suited for this thread, though, since it's going to end up in an ideological argument.


I think Biden feels the same way.................but guess what?


----------



## abc (Aug 8, 2022)

IceEidolon said:


> I think further discussion on this topic is probably not suited for this thread, though, since it's going to end up in an ideological argument.


Sorry, I don’t think it’s an idealogical discussion any more. Maybe it was last year. Not today.

It’s a business decision of whether the mask requirement will deter more customer vs masks making people feel safe and not stay away. 

If you’re on social media, you’ll believe most people are deter by mask requirement more than by safety concern. So it doesn’t surprise me they’re dropping mask requirements. What do the majority of customer really think in the real world outside of social media? I don’t know. But business will need to make business decisions. Right now, with even indoor entertainments are dropping mask requirements, no chance a ski hill will keep that requirement! 

Personally, I love it when employees are required to wear masks whilst guests are free to choose. But I’m being selfish there…


----------



## IceEidolon (Aug 8, 2022)

I was talking about employee vaccinations instead of guest masking requirements. In either case, personal freedom to infect other people has won out over basic precautions. There are over a million dead in the US and we're still averaging over a hundred more deaths per day, with many more stuck with long-term symptoms that we don't fully understand nor know how to treat.


----------



## abc (Aug 8, 2022)

IceEidolon said:


> I was talking about employee vaccinations instead of guest masking requirements. In either case, personal freedom to infect other people has won out over basic precautions. There are over a million dead in the US and we're still averaging over a hundred more deaths per day, with many more stuck with long-term symptoms that we don't fully understand nor know how to treat.


Sorry, my mistake in reading. So disregard my previous post. It’s irrelevant.

Vaccine requirement. That’s on even thinner ice! Whether you’re vaccinated doesn’t impact me. So I really don’t care, even if I’m sharing the same break room. I’m back in the office (“occasionally”). And I really don’t care if my co-workers are vaccinated or not. 

Now, if I’m immune compromised, or can’t be vaccinated for other reason, I would have cared more. Perhaps I may then choose to wear a mask. 

I wouldn’t say Covid is “like a cold”. It’s more like a flu. A really bad flu at that. But I’ve been going to the office for many decades during flu season. And had caught it once. Not fun. That’s why I take the flu vaccine. thank god, haven’t gotten flu since. 

Now, if my employer would give us unlimited sick leave, so my co-worker don’t have to come in while they had the flu, I wouldn’t have  caught the thing! Though these days, they probably wouldn’t come in when they “don’t feel like it” anyway.


----------



## skiur (Aug 9, 2022)

IceEidolon said:


> I was talking about employee vaccinations instead of guest masking requirements. In either case, personal freedom to infect other people has won out over basic precautions. There are over a million dead in the US and we're still averaging over a hundred more deaths per day, with many more stuck with long-term symptoms that we don't fully understand nor know how to treat.


Vaccines for covid aren't really going to work.  The new strains are so different from the old ones that the vaccines do nothing for the new strains.  It's just like another coronavirus called the common cold that there is no vaccine for because corona viruses mutate much too much for a vaccine to work.  I've had covid three times, once before I was vaccinated and twice after.  None of my cases were more than mild, but the second time (after being vaccinated) was the most severe.


----------



## IceEidolon (Aug 9, 2022)

I completely agree that more permissive sick time policies could help cut down on disease spread generally.

Anecdotes just aren't convincing arguments. Collect a bunch of anecdotes and present them and I'll listen, but your personal experience shouldn't dictate health policy.


----------



## raisingarizona (Aug 9, 2022)

IceEidolon said:


> You're clearly not living with anyone who's gotten Long Covid - it's a heck of a lot worse than a cold. Vail was actually protecting guests and employees and gave up on it. As a mountain ops worker, they're risking losing an entire crew if one guy comes down sick and passes it to the break room and I'm not willing to sign onto a crew without a vaccination requirement.
> 
> I think further discussion on this topic is probably not suited for this thread, though, since it's going to end up in an ideological argument.


I had covid before it was even in the news. I got wicked sick right after New Years 2020. I thought I was going to die. The pools of sweat were insane, I couldn't taste or smell anything and I couldn't move for 8 days. That funk stuck with me for another three months after that. I didn't feel sick but I had strange pains throughout my body and what felt like a swollen heart. I couldn't lay on my stomach because of that swollen heart discomfort. I also couldn't catch my breathe for that whole period. walking up and down stairs was a challenge. 

I had it again this past winter. The new strains seem much less dangerous, especially if you've been vaccinated. 

It's time we move on. We can't let the fearful run the show. I'm not sorry. If you're vulnerable and concerned then do as you feel necessary but don't tell everyone else what to do.


----------



## catskillman (Aug 11, 2022)

adding guns to Clair's.  Now if they only have snowmakers...........


----------



## catskillman (Aug 21, 2022)

7717 Main Street, Hunter, NY 12442 | Compass
					

7717 Main Street, Hunter, NY 12442 is a mixed use property not currently listed. This is a 6-bed, 5-bath, 6,152 sqft property.



					www.compass.com
				




Vail just bought this for $2.5 million.  To be used for visiting Vail executives!


----------



## RichT (Aug 21, 2022)

catskillman said:


> 7717 Main Street, Hunter, NY 12442 | Compass
> 
> 
> 7717 Main Street, Hunter, NY 12442 is a mixed use property not currently listed. This is a 6-bed, 5-bath, 6,152 sqft property.
> ...


Forget about employee housing..........let's buy this instead. What a joke Vail is.


----------



## raisingarizona (Aug 21, 2022)

RichT said:


> Forget about employee housing..........let's buy this instead. What a joke Vail is.


Well, this technically is employee housing.


----------



## catskillman (Aug 21, 2022)

raisingarizona said:


> Well, this technically is employee housing.


and most likely will be empty most of the time!  How often do you think executives are going to be visiting Hunter?

The dump Vail rented last season for foreign workers has been sold.  Not sure what they are going to use now if they can't rent it again...


----------



## raisingarizona (Aug 21, 2022)

catskillman said:


> and most likely will be empty most of the time!  How often do you think executives are going to be visiting Hunter?
> 
> The dump Vail rented last season for foreign workers has been sold.  Not sure what they are going to use now if they can't rent it again...


Well, it was a joke.

We’re on the same page. F Vail!


----------



## Domeskier (Aug 23, 2022)

Interior looks nice. I think they over paid.


----------



## catskillman (Aug 23, 2022)

Domeskier said:


> Interior looks nice. I think they over paid.


Original asking was $2.1 Million.  They paid $2.5 !  It is nice,  on main drag, walk to mountain, on top of  neighboring air B&B's.  Hasidic are in their now.


----------



## catskillman (Aug 23, 2022)

2022 SKI NY - SKIPA EXPO​











​











*Hunter Mountain
Hunter, N.Y.
September 19-21, 2022*









25+ seminars
Resort activities plus golf
Ziplining and more!
Big theme party
Keynote by Kelly Pawlak of NSAA
CORRECTION: NSAA Lift Boot Camp and Active Shooter Sessions 
NSAA Fall Education Workshops












Learn more and register.​














​


----------



## Domeskier (Aug 23, 2022)

catskillman said:


> Original asking was $2.1 Million.  They paid $2.5 !  It is nice,  on main drag, walk to mountain, on top of  neighboring air B&B's.  Hasidic are in their now.


Wow.  Maybe I am underestimating how much money they put into it, but whoever bought the property in 2019 for $410k turned a nice profit…


----------



## kendo (Sep 23, 2022)

Hunter auctioning some double chairs and a few vintage signs.  Auction is next Mon/Tues...









						Hunter Chair Sale | Powered by Givergy
					

Bid on exclusive money can't buy items & experiences with Vail Resorts Management Company - EpicPromise Foundation. Enter into one of our charity auct




					givergy.us


----------



## Kingslug20 (Sep 23, 2022)

Maybe they'll use the money..to spruce up the bathrooms


----------



## catskillman (Sep 30, 2022)

I was gifted the program for the NY/PA Expo for mountain management that was held at Hunter in late September.  Vail helped sponser the event which included golf and a big bash with a live band.  Typical convention type stuff.  The hotel and condo's were full.

Russ wrote a welcome letter, so he is still there....

Impressed with the schedule, speakers and program. There was also a trade show which included snowcats. (saw them in the lot, but none stayed at Hunter)

The active shooter and terrorism awareness classes are kind of worrisome in that they are needed unfortunatly.  

Speakers included NYS counter terrorism intelligence head, homeland secutity & office of counter terrorism, pres of national ski area association and PSIA East, sherrifs from several counties, and a lot of software and equipment vendors.


----------



## RichT (Oct 2, 2022)

How's the "Octoberfest" going? I can't tell by looking at the webcams.............. I know it didn't rain.


----------



## catskillman (Oct 3, 2022)

RichT said:


> How's the "Octoberfest" going? I can't tell by looking at the webcams.............. I know it didn't rain.


went yesterday.  not crowded really.  Noone watching indoor band, although they were good.  outside the picnic tables were full, noone dancing,  weather was cool but nice,  it never did rain.

Beers were $9.25 !  they add 18% tip to everything.  Crazy thing is if they do not make any $ they won't do them again next year.

$20 for a skyride ticket.........


----------



## RichT (Oct 3, 2022)

catskillman said:


> went yesterday.  not crowded really.  Noone watching indoor band, although they were good.  outside the picnic tables were full, noone dancing,  weather was cool but nice,  it never did rain.
> 
> Beers were $9.25 !  they add 18% tip to everything.  Crazy thing is if they do not make any $ they won't do them again next year.
> 
> $20 for a skyride ticket.........


Jeez.........are they taking cash yet? Or is all their stuff still cashless? Thanks.


----------



## catskillman (Oct 3, 2022)

RichT said:


> Jeez.........are they taking cash yet? Or is all their stuff still cashless? Thanks.


credit only.  don't see that changing.  they would have to hire people to count the money, armored car etc....


----------



## MidnightJester (Oct 3, 2022)

RichT said:


> Jeez.........are they taking cash yet? Or is all their stuff still cashless? Thanks.





catskillman said:


> went yesterday.  not crowded really.  Noone watching indoor band, although they were good.  outside the picnic tables were full, noone dancing,  weather was cool but nice,  it never did rain.
> 
> Beers were $9.25 !  they add 18% tip to everything.  Crazy thing is if they do not make any $ they won't do them again next year.
> 
> $20 for a skyride ticket.........


credit only here
as a comparison Mountain Creek in North NJ had a Octoberfest that I thought went pretty well. Decent Music and prices I guess. I brought in a backpack of hidden beers and bought 1 BEER inside plus some food.

$20 entrance fee with free unlimited lift SKY RIDES(6 person standing cabriolet)  and fun games.
Beers were $8 pint and $8 or $16 for a stein refill
Canned Seltzers were  $7
Canned cocktails were $12






						Oktoberfest – Mountain Creek
					

This isn’t the New Jersey you think you know.




					mountaincreek.com


----------



## catskillman (Oct 5, 2022)

MidnightJester said:


> credit only here
> as a comparison Mountain Creek in North NJ had a Octoberfest that I thought went pretty well. Decent Music and prices I guess. I brought in a backpack of hidden beers and bought 1 BEER inside plus some food.
> 
> $20 entrance fee with free unlimited lift SKY RIDES(6 person standing cabriolet)  and fun games.
> ...


If Vail charged $20 to get in there were not have been many there.  It was not well attended as it is.


----------



## RichT (Oct 6, 2022)

catskillman said:


> If Vail charged $20 to get in there were not have been many there.  It was not well attended as it is.


Hoping this weekend will be better! I'm going, excited to see WyldBlu.


----------



## catskillman (Oct 6, 2022)

RichT said:


> Hoping this weekend will be better! I'm going, excited to see WyldBlu.


WyldBlu is only playing on Sunday this weekend.  They played last weekend.  Not as good as they used to be for sure.  Keith is not playing with them and the harmonica player is annoying and not a great singer.....but fun for sure

*Saturday, October 8th*

12pm-1pm, 2pm-3pm,4pm-5pm:

Beer Stained Fiddle on the Indoor Stage

1pm-2pm, 3pm-4pm, 5pm-6pm:

AJ Jansen on the Sam Adams Outdoor Stage



*Sunday, October 9th*

12pm-1pm, 2pm-3pm, 4pm-5pm:

Wyld Blu on the Sam Adams Outdoor Stage

* 

Saturday, October 15th:*

12pm-1pm, 2pm-3pm,4pm-5pm:

Session Brothers on the Indoor Stage

1pm-2pm, 3pm-4pm, 5pm-6pm:

Guilty Pleasure on the Sam Adams Outdoor Stage



*Sunday, October 16th:*

1pm-2pm, 3pm-4pm:

Homegrown Band on the Indoor Stage

12pm-1pm, 2pm-3pm, 4pm-5pm:

the Counterfeiters on the Sam Adams Outdoor Stage


----------



## RichT (Oct 7, 2022)

catskillman said:


> WyldBlu is only playing on Sunday this weekend.  They played last weekend.  Not as good as they used to be for sure.  Keith is not playing with them and the harmonica player is annoying and not a great singer.....but fun for sure
> 
> *Saturday, October 8th*
> 
> ...


Yes we will be for sunday. BTW Guilty Pleasure is a great band also!!!!


----------



## catskillman (Oct 7, 2022)

RichT said:


> Yes we will be for sunday. BTW Guilty Pleasure is a great band also!!!!


yes. 
Sat Windham has a ski swap if interested.  Drop off is beginning at 8am tomorrow .  Main st is closed off for their annual autim affair Sat & Sunday.  Good time.  Check it out before Wyld Blu


----------



## RichT (Oct 8, 2022)

catskillman said:


> yes.
> Sat Windham has a ski swap if interested.  Drop off is beginning at 8am tomorrow .  Main st is closed off for their annual autim affair Sat & Sunday.  Good time.  Check it out before Wyld Blu


Seems since FAIL took over Hunter, Windham is the go to place from now on.


----------



## raisingarizona (Oct 9, 2022)

RichT said:


> Seems since FAIL took over Hunter, Windham is the go to place from now on.


I dunno. I hear there’s a really nice place over on the west side of the Catskills.


----------



## KustyTheKlown (Oct 9, 2022)

raisingarizona said:


> I dunno. I hear there’s a really nice place over on the west side of the Catskills.



most people who ski at windham and hunter either don't know plattekill exist, or are not interested in a ski area with old fixed grip chairs and no resort features


----------



## raisingarizona (Oct 9, 2022)

KustyTheKlown said:


> most people who ski at windham and hunter either don't know plattekill exist, or are not interested in a ski area with old fixed grip chairs and no resort features


This is for the best really.


----------



## Not Sure (Oct 9, 2022)

KustyTheKlown said:


> most people who ski at windham and hunter either don't know plattekill exist, or are not interested in a ski area with old fixed grip chairs and no resort features


Or aren’t good enough to ski it.


----------



## RichT (Oct 10, 2022)

Went to the "Colors of the Catskills" event yesterday, while the band Wyld Blu were FANTASTIC, that was all that was. They did have Scottie's food and a couple other much smaller (food choices) there and a couple of vendors that was it (all cashless). The lines to get the food along with the one for the chair ride were huge. Stayed to the end of Wyld Blu's set and then headed over to the downtown Windham. Over there was such a big difference, they had all their business's open, craft and things for the kids, paint facing, animals........ place was hopping.  Great food, music at different locations thru out. Oh yeah, and they took cash! BTW downtown Hunter now looks like a slum.


----------



## jimmywilson69 (Oct 10, 2022)

Dude its 2022 , its a cashless world.  I had a kid come to the door selling candy bars last night and had to pay him in quarters because I haven't had cash in forever.

There's a lot to shit on vail for, but cashless isn't one of them.


----------



## catskillman (Oct 10, 2022)

RichT said:


> Went to the "Colors of the Catskills" event yesterday, while the band Wyld Blu were FANTASTIC, that was all that was. They did have Scottie's food and a couple other much smaller (food choices) there and a couple of vendors that was it (all cashless). The lines to get the food along with the one for the chair ride were huge. Stayed to the end of Wyld Blu's set and then headed over to the downtown Windham. Over there was such a big difference, they had all their business's open, craft and things for the kids, paint facing, animals........ place was hopping.  Great food, music at different locations thru out. Oh yeah, and they took cash! BTW downtown Hunter now looks like a slum.


agree.  Windham gas it all for a small town.  The residents care, and there is a lot of 2nd homeowner money there.  

That old ski shop and restaruant in Hunter village is supposedly coming down.  Should have been down 10+ years ago, but no one cares in the village.  The windows were broken for years, the overhang fell off a couple of years ago...  Now the rumor is it is going to be a park.  No doubt ignored by the village and will look like crap;  And really who is going to use it?


----------



## cdskier (Oct 10, 2022)

jimmywilson69 said:


> Dude its 2022 , its a cashless world.  I had a kid come to the door selling candy bars last night and had to pay him in quarters because I haven't had cash in forever.
> 
> There's a lot to shit on vail for, but cashless isn't one of them.



I always have some cash on me just in case (or even to use to pay for small things like when I grab a bagel from the bagel shop). But I also have no issues with any business that chooses to be cashless. I don't really see why that is an issue to complain about either. Vail isn't the only one that has gone cashless.


----------



## RichT (Oct 10, 2022)

cdskier said:


> I always have some cash on me just in case (or even to use to pay for small things like when I grab a bagel from the bagel shop). But I also have no issues with any business that chooses to be cashless. I don't really see why that is an issue to complain about either. Vail isn't the only one that has gone cashless.


It bothers me, cause the checkout lines gets long, (think of the bar on a Saturday) plus I love getting that little discount when paying with cash now.


----------



## cdskier (Oct 10, 2022)

RichT said:


> It bothers me, cause the checkout lines gets long, (think of the bar on a Saturday) plus I love getting that little discount when paying with cash now.



I don't understand how paying with a card makes the lines longer. Swiping a card is faster than counting cash and providing change... And if you mean it in the sense of you would usually just leave the cash on the bar and walk away when cash was an option, well I've never trusted doing that anyway (especially in a busy bar). If lines are that long to pay, then it sounds more like a staffing issue rather than a cash vs credit issue.

Also what discount? I get cash back on all my credit cards. Other than some gas stations, very rarely do I come across stores that offer a cash discount (or a credit surcharge).


----------



## raisingarizona (Oct 10, 2022)

Cash is dirty. It's a fantastically effective fomite. It's probably a good thing to move away from, especially in our post pandemic world.


----------



## zyk (Oct 10, 2022)

To continue down this rabbit hole... I like cash for many things.  Why?  The recent $600 1099 law.  Taxes are about to get complicated for many people.


----------



## cdskier (Oct 10, 2022)

zyk said:


> To continue down this rabbit hole... I like cash for many things.  Why?  The recent $600 1099 law.  Taxes are about to get complicated for many people.



Isn't that change related to 1099-Ks? (Which are related to people/businesses that receive payments through places like Paypal and Venmo). Technically they should have been reporting that income on their tax returns even if it wasn't 1099'd... (this only applies to commercial payments, not people getting reimbursed for splitting a dining bill by a friend for example).

And that specific reason has no bearing at all on not being able to use cash at a large corporate-owned ski resort. Vail going cashless isn't having any impact at all on you from a 1099 or tax perspective since you're paying them.


----------



## zyk (Oct 10, 2022)

cdskier said:


> Isn't that change related to 1099-Ks? (Which are related to people/businesses that receive payments through places like Paypal and Venmo). Technically they should have been reporting that income on their tax returns even if it wasn't 1099'd... (this only applies to commercial payments, not people getting reimbursed for splitting a dining bill by a friend for example).
> 
> And that specific reason has no bearing at all on not being able to use cash at a large corporate-owned ski resort. Vail going cashless isn't having any impact at all on you from a 1099 or tax perspective since you're paying them.


Yes you are correct in all of this and it does not apply to corporations such as Vail.  More so it causes paperwork complications for stuff like yard sales and small farm stands.  Before this income would be self reported.   Sorry I wandered so far off topic.


----------



## Not Sure (Oct 10, 2022)

raisingarizona said:


> Cash is dirty. It's a fantastically effective fomite. It's probably a good thing to move away from, especially in our post pandemic world.


I can remember a major snowstorm where the ski areas data  system was down if you had to buy at the window it was only cash. It was painful watching people walk away from 40” plus snow.


----------



## urungus (Oct 10, 2022)

zyk said:


> Yes you are correct in all of this and it does not apply to corporations such as Vail.  More so it causes paperwork complications for stuff like yard sales and small farm stands.  Before this income would be self reported.   Sorry I wandered so far off topic.


Seems like there is *less* paperwork involved in the new system since you automatically get a 1099 in the mail, rather than having to document the totals yourself.   Only negative consequence would be for people who are no longer able to cheat their fellow taxpayers by hiding income.


----------



## NYDB (Oct 10, 2022)

Not Sure said:


> I can remember a major snowstorm where the ski areas data  system was down if you had to buy at the window it was only cash. It was painful watching people walk away from 40” plus snow.


yeah, I'm not sure how you could have lived through the past 20+ years of events and not roll with some  decent  cash at all times in multiple denominations.  And no I'm not in the mob or cheat on my taxes.


----------



## cdskier (Oct 10, 2022)

NYDB said:


> yeah, I'm not sure how you could have lived through the past 20+ years of events and not roll with some  decent  cash at all times in multiple denominations.  And no I'm not in the mob or cheat on my taxes.



I do agree it makes sense to always have at least some cash on hand because you never know when it will be needed...

That's a different topic than a business choosing to go cashless though and someone complaining about that decision...


----------



## camberstick (Oct 10, 2022)

cdskier said:


> I don't understand how paying with a card makes the lines longer. Swiping a card is faster than counting cash and providing change... And if you mean it in the sense of you would usually just leave the cash on the bar and walk away when cash was an option, well I've never trusted doing that anyway (especially in a busy bar). If lines are that long to pay, then it sounds more like a staffing issue rather than a cash vs credit issue.
> 
> Also what discount? I get cash back on all my credit cards. Other than some gas stations, very rarely do I come across stores that offer a cash discount (or a credit surcharge).


----------



## Not Sure (Oct 10, 2022)

Well then there's a potential for a Solar hiccup ...One big direct hit of a CME and everything electronic is done ,Bitcoin , internet, no electricity.........Cash and the  Amish not affected LOL .


----------



## catskillman (Oct 10, 2022)

Windham mountain just bought 450 acres.....  they also bought a hotel that they are renovation for employee housing.





__





						Windham Mountain Announces Over $9 Million in 22/23 Capital Investments and East Side Property Acquisition
					

/PRNewswire/ -- Windham Mountain announces the investment of over $9 million in capital improvement projects. Highlights of the capital expenditure include a...




					www.prnewswire.com


----------



## catskillman (Oct 10, 2022)

raisingarizona said:


> Cash is dirty. It's a fantastically effective fomite. It's probably a good thing to move away from, especially in our post pandemic world.


another thing noone is considering.  Since they automatically add 18% to the tab, the bartenders wait staff etc.  get the tips added to their W2.  So they will be paying more in taxes, since you know they never declared all their tips.  They also do not get it until their next pay period.


----------



## RichT (Oct 11, 2022)

cdskier said:


> I don't understand how paying with a card makes the lines longer. Swiping a card is faster than counting cash and providing change... And if you mean it in the sense of you would usually just leave the cash on the bar and walk away when cash was an option, well I've never trusted doing that anyway (especially in a busy bar). If lines are that long to pay, then it sounds more like a staffing issue rather than a cash vs credit issue.
> 
> Also what discount? I get cash back on all my credit cards. Other than some gas stations, very rarely do I come across stores that offer a cash discount (or a credit surcharge).


BC at least in the bar, they have you sign the cc receipt. As for the discount, just about any restaurant has two prices on your bill now, one for cash or the other for credit.
CASH IS KING


----------



## jimmywilson69 (Oct 11, 2022)

I've literally never seen a cash or credit price anywhere but gas stations.  Hell most of the restaurants/breweries I've visited recently you can pay right at the table either by scanning a QR code on the receipt or on the server has a tablet that takes the payment.  A lot of the time you can use Apple or Google Pay to make a secure transation.

I'm not dismissing that cash doesn't have a place, but to say its king and preferred most places is flat out incorrect.


----------



## cdskier (Oct 11, 2022)

jimmywilson69 said:


> I've literally never seen a cash or credit price anywhere but gas stations.  Hell most of the restaurants/breweries I've visited recently you can pay right at the table either by scanning a QR code on the receipt or on the server has a tablet that takes the payment.  A lot of the time you can use Apple or Google Pay to make a secure transation.
> 
> I'm not dismissing that cash doesn't have a place, but to say its king and preferred most places is flat out incorrect.



I can only think of one single restaurant that I know in NJ that used to (not sure if they still do) charge a surcharge for credit card use. Otherwise I've been to numerous restaurants in NJ, VT, MA, and NY over the past 6-12 months where I've never seen any different prices being charged.


----------



## drjeff (Oct 11, 2022)

cdskier said:


> I can only think of one single restaurant that I know in NJ that used to (not sure if they still do) charge a surcharge for credit card use. Otherwise I've been to numerous restaurants in NJ, VT, MA, and NY over the past 6-12 months where I've never seen any different prices being charged.



The only ones I have experienced have been very small operations where the cost per item was typically $5-7 or less, and they seemed to be operating close enough to their margin that the extra say 0.5 to maybe 3% that most CC keep as processing/service fees, would likely be noticable at months end for their bottom line.

I am guessing that many a bar tender and/or say drive thru window staffer at say a coffee shop wishes it was only cash as it's much easier (and convenient) to just say "keep the change" rather than actually rather than fill out the tip line and total amount on a CC slip and/or figure out which of the 5%, 10%, 15% etc amounts you see as an option for some CC payment option modalities


----------



## RichT (Oct 11, 2022)

cdskier said:


> I can only think of one single restaurant that I know in NJ that used to (not sure if they still do) charge a surcharge for credit card use. Otherwise I've been to numerous restaurants in NJ, VT, MA, and NY over the past 6-12 months where I've never seen any different prices being charged.


Just about every restaurant down in the Toms River area, and just this weekend up at Prime in Windham are doing it.








						New Yorkers are furious over sneaky credit card surcharges
					

A long-running court battle that ended in January gives New York merchants the right to charge extra for credit card purchases as long as the pricing is clear. A long-running court battle that ende…




					nypost.com


----------



## skiur (Oct 11, 2022)

RichT said:


> BC at least in the bar, they have you sign the cc receipt. As for the discount, just about any restaurant has two prices on your bill now, one for cash or the other for credit.
> CASH IS KING


Cash is obsolete 

And I have rarely seen a restaurant that had a separate price for cash and credit.  Maybe a small diner but any real restaurant does not do that.


----------



## cdskier (Oct 11, 2022)

RichT said:


> Just about every restaurant down in the Toms River area, and just this weekend up at Prime in Windham are doing it.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


A handful of restaurants that you've come across doing this is very different from "just about any restaurant" as you earlier claimed. Also an article from the NY Post from 3 years ago doesn't really prove much. A law changed back then in NY and it seems some restaurants tried to see what they could get away with at the time. Doesn't mean they are still doing it today. A lot has changed in the past 3 years.

In NJ the only restaurant I personally know that was doing this for a bit (and not sure if they still are) is in upper Bergen county. Otherwise I've been to numerous restaurants in Montclair, Hoboken, Jersey City, down the shore, Bridgewater, Bergen county, Passaic county and not seen this at any other places I've been. In MA none of the half dozen restaurants I went to in Cambridge/Boston on a business trip back in April did this. The only place I know of in VT near Sugarbush that did this only did it for a year or two and stopped with the extra fee 2 years ago and went back to the same price for cash/credit. In the Finger Lakes of NY none of the restaurants or wineries I've been to charge fees for credit cards.

If "Cash is King" as you claim...then the king is dead. Cash usage has been steadily declining for quite some time. I don't see that suddenly changing anytime soon.

And again back to the original point, there are a lot of things you can fault Vail for doing (or not doing), but going cashless is not one of them.


----------



## raisingarizona (Oct 11, 2022)

catskillman said:


> another thing noone is considering.  Since they automatically add 18% to the tab, the bartenders wait staff etc.  get the tips added to their W2.  So they will be paying more in taxes, since you know they never declared all their tips.  They also do not get it until their next pay period.


As a restaurant worker for over 20 years, I do not like this information.


----------



## zyk (Oct 11, 2022)

catskillman said:


> another thing noone is considering.  Since they automatically add 18% to the tab, the bartenders wait staff etc.  get the tips added to their W2.  So they will be paying more in taxes, since you know they never declared all their tips.  They also do not get it until their next pay period.


I despise this.  In essence the establishment is just raising prices under the guise of a mandatory tip.  If an establishment wants to raise prices and pay staff more just do that.  Let the patrons decide the tips.  Great service is worth much more than 18% and bad service is worth much less.


----------



## skiur (Oct 11, 2022)

Any restaurants that automatically add the tip to the bill are restaurants that I don't go back to.  A tip is dependent on the service I received.  Give me great service and I will give you a 25% tip.  Give me ok service I will give you 15%.  Give me $hitty service and you don't get a tip.


----------



## RichT (Oct 12, 2022)

cdskier said:


> A handful of restaurants that you've come across doing this is very different from "just about any restaurant" as you earlier claimed. Also an article from the NY Post from 3 years ago doesn't really prove much. A law changed back then in NY and it seems some restaurants tried to see what they could get away with at the time. Doesn't mean they are still doing it today. A lot has changed in the past 3 years.
> 
> In NJ the only restaurant I personally know that was doing this for a bit (and not sure if they still are) is in upper Bergen county. Otherwise I've been to numerous restaurants in Montclair, Hoboken, Jersey City, down the shore, Bridgewater, Bergen county, Passaic county and not seen this at any other places I've been. In MA none of the half dozen restaurants I went to in Cambridge/Boston on a business trip back in April did this. The only place I know of in VT near Sugarbush that did this only did it for a year or two and stopped with the extra fee 2 years ago and went back to the same price for cash/credit. In the Finger Lakes of NY none of the restaurants or wineries I've been to charge fees for credit cards.
> 
> ...


We'll see how this plays out.


----------



## catskillman (Oct 12, 2022)

Tubing park will not be torn down this season.  Does not mean it will open though.  paid parking is rumored as a go, for the 2 lots.  A bargain at $20


----------



## catskillman (Nov 6, 2022)

Hunter had a job fair this week.  Am told that there was next to no one that showed up!

Also, I went to the Albany Snow Expo and Hunter was not represented.  The closest and largest mountain to the Albany area was not there.  All others were represented, lot from Vermont, and some obscure Buffalo area mountains.  Of course, Gore, Whiteface, Stratton, Smuggs.. you name it they were there.  
I actually am happy they weren't there.  May result in less skiers this season..........


----------



## Newpylong (Nov 7, 2022)

Was Jiminy and West there? They're closer to Albany than Hunter, but obviously not as large.


----------



## Great Bear (Nov 7, 2022)

cdskier said:


> I always have some cash on me just in case (or even to use to pay for small things like when I grab a bagel from the bagel shop). But I also have no issues with any business that chooses to be cashless. I don't really see why that is an issue to complain about either. Vail isn't the only one that has gone cashless.



I definitely wolud have an issue with a resort going cashless.  Issues for me are that I really don't want to have a bunch of $4 and $8 charges on my card (like you describe if you are just grabbing a coffee or something).  Other issue i have would be for my kids.  My kids are old enough where i am comfortable with them going off and skiing on their own (and they do and i give them some money if they want to get a hot chocolate or lunch) - but I'm not going to put a credit card in their name.

So yes - a resort going cashless would be a big problem IMO


----------



## skiur (Nov 7, 2022)

The world is going cashless sooner or later, mys we'll get used to it.


----------



## Domeskier (Nov 7, 2022)

The cashless vending machine at work rats me out when I take a pop-tart break...


----------



## IceEidolon (Nov 7, 2022)

If the resort is smart about it they'll do like Blue Mtn PA (but better/smarter/more convenient) and tie everything to your pass. So they could go cashless everywhere that isn't the ticket window where you load money on your pass - parents could give their kids the cashless meal plan with no credit card, you only need one piece of plastic, etc.

As far as I know, though, nobody has the user experience quite figured out, not as well as centuries of cash based payment is.


----------



## jimmywilson69 (Nov 7, 2022)

I thought you could do that with Vail?


----------



## catskillman (Nov 7, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> Was Jiminy and West there? They're closer to Albany than Hunter, but obviously not as large.


yes.  and catamount.  all with discount passes and an interested crowd.  Esp Catamount. - 3 days, anytime, $99


----------



## urungus (Nov 7, 2022)

Great Bear said:


> I definitely wolud have an issue with a resort going cashless.  Issues for me are that I really don't want to have a bunch of $4 and $8 charges on my card (like you describe if you are just grabbing a coffee or something).  Other issue i have would be for my kids.  My kids are old enough where i am comfortable with them going off and skiing on their own (and they do and i give them some money if they want to get a hot chocolate or lunch) - but I'm not going to put a credit card in their name.
> 
> So yes - a resort going cashless would be a big problem IMO



Instead of giving your kids cash, you can give them a small denomination VISA/MC gift card.  More of a minor inconvenience than a big problem.


----------



## cdskier (Nov 10, 2022)

Great Bear said:


> I definitely wolud have an issue with a resort going cashless.  Issues for me are that I really don't want to have a bunch of $4 and $8 charges on my card (like you describe if you are just grabbing a coffee or something).  Other issue i have would be for my kids.  My kids are old enough where i am comfortable with them going off and skiing on their own (and they do and i give them some money if they want to get a hot chocolate or lunch) - but I'm not going to put a credit card in their name.
> 
> So yes - a resort going cashless would be a big problem IMO



Some solutions to that problem have already been mentioned in this thread. Resort charge linked to their season pass/RFID card is a key one in my mind that any ski area that goes cashless should absolutely offer. I don't think anyone expects kids to have their own CCs. But there are a multitude of resorts that are cashless and also have plenty of kids that still manage to get food/drinks on their own. So it would seem people have found workable solutions without it being a big problem.

FWIW, Killington just announced they're now going cashless this season as well. This trend will continue (and not just at ski areas). One interesting plan from Killington though to help ease the transition to cashless is that they will have "Reverse ATMs" soon where you you can convert cash to a "nationally accepted card format".


----------



## skiur (Nov 10, 2022)

Great Bear said:


> I definitely wolud have an issue with a resort going cashless.  Issues for me are that I really don't want to have a bunch of $4 and $8 charges on my card (like you describe if you are just grabbing a coffee or something).  Other issue i have would be for my kids.  My kids are old enough where i am comfortable with them going off and skiing on their own (and they do and i give them some money if they want to get a hot chocolate or lunch) - but I'm not going to put a credit card in their name.
> 
> So yes - a resort going cashless would be a big problem IMO



Curious, why would you mind having a bunch of $4 or $8 charges on your card?


----------



## urungus (Nov 10, 2022)

skiur said:


> Curious, why would you mind having a bunch of $4 or $8 charges on your card?


Makes reconciliation much more annoying if you like to verify each individual charge on your cc at the end of the month


----------



## cdskier (Nov 10, 2022)

urungus said:


> Makes reconciliation much more annoying if you like to verify each individual charge on your cc at the end of the month


I'm a bit obsessive and verify as each charge is made (I literally have my cards setup to alert me anytime a charge over $0 is made). But I don't care about how many or how much they are overall...


----------



## jimmywilson69 (Nov 10, 2022)

urungus said:


> Makes reconciliation much more annoying if you like to verify each individual charge on your cc at the end of the month


----------



## NYDB (Nov 10, 2022)

mfs need to hire a bookkeeper n shit.


----------



## RichT (Nov 14, 2022)

They've been making snow all day!! Next ten nights will also be below freezing!


----------



## Newpylong (Nov 14, 2022)

cdskier said:


> I'm a bit obsessive and verify as each charge is made (I literally have my cards setup to alert me anytime a charge over $0 is made). But I don't care about how many or how much they are overall...



I have Chase email me in the same way, whenever the card is used. As for how many charges, could care less as long as they're all legit.


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Nov 14, 2022)

RichT said:


> They've been making snow all day!! Next ten nights will also be below freezing!


Nice - hope to make some Turkey weekend turns and won't want to drive much further than this for limited terrain likely to be on offer.


----------



## Great Bear (Nov 15, 2022)

skiur said:


> Curious, why would you mind having a bunch of $4 or $8 charges on your card?


It is that many more charges to comb through when checking my statement to be sure there are no fraudulent charges.  As others have mentioned it is annoying.

Very disappointed to see that Killington has gone this route.  Definitely a step down in customer service.  Gift cards are an option but those always seem to end up having small denominations left on them that go unused so kind of throwing money away.


----------



## jimmywilson69 (Nov 15, 2022)

Great Bear said:


> Definitely a step down in customer service.


I am certain this is not a widely held sentiment.  not discounting the concern with children, because that is a pain.  but an adult that has a credit card should be completely unfazed by this.

I'll gladly earn my reward points


----------



## cdskier (Nov 15, 2022)

Great Bear said:


> It is that many more charges to comb through when checking my statement to be sure there are no fraudulent charges.  As others have mentioned it is annoying.
> 
> Very disappointed to see that Killington has gone this route.  Definitely a step down in customer service.  Gift cards are an option but those always seem to end up having small denominations left on them that go unused so kind of throwing money away.



I hate to say this, but if that is the way you feel, you better get used to disappointment then. This will become common at more and more ski areas (and larger businesses in general) as time goes on.


----------



## skiur (Nov 15, 2022)

Great Bear said:


> It is that many more charges to comb through when checking my statement to be sure there are no fraudulent charges.  As others have mentioned it is annoying.
> 
> Very disappointed to see that Killington has gone this route.  Definitely a step down in customer service.  Gift cards are an option but those always seem to end up having small denominations left on them that go unused so kind of throwing money away.


Takes me all of a minute to look thru my numerous charged and make sure they are legit.  If your disappointed in K right now, prepare to be disappointed a lot more in the future as cashless is the way of the future.


----------



## drjeff (Nov 15, 2022)

skiur said:


> Takes me all of a minute to look thru my numerous charged and make sure they are legit.  If your disappointed in K right now, prepare to be disappointed a lot more in the future as cashless is the way of the future.


Honestly with Vail Resorts having been cashless the last 2 full seasons, what initially I thought might be an issue, never became an issue. And even many of my friends with young kids in mountain programs never had an issue with this policy.

I still keep some small bills with me for tipping various staff members when I feel its appropriate, but the cashless ski day, for me and my family atleast, is completely a non issue thing


----------



## Great Bear (Nov 16, 2022)

cdskier said:


> Resort charge linked to their season pass/RFID card is a key one in my mind that any ski area that goes cashless should absolutely offer.
> 
> FWIW, Killington just announced they're now going cashless this season as well. This trend will continue (and not just at ski areas). One interesting plan from Killington though to help ease the transition to cashless is that they will have "Reverse ATMs" soon where you you can convert cash to a "nationally accepted card format".


So after exchanging a couple of emails with K customer service, I can confirm that they have done away with the resort charge feature linked to the season pass as you describe.

Doing away with that and going cashless seems to be a very odd combination of things to do in parallel.

Obviously, I'll figure out a way to deal with it so my kids can buy lunch, but it is super annoying to me.


----------



## jimmywilson69 (Nov 16, 2022)

I agree on killing the season pass credit card link.   Their online POS systems has always been sketchy.


----------



## 180 (Nov 16, 2022)

So is the mountain opening Friday?


----------



## cdskier (Nov 16, 2022)

Great Bear said:


> So after exchanging a couple of emails with K customer service, I can confirm that they have done away with the resort charge feature linked to the season pass as you describe.
> 
> Doing away with that and going cashless seems to be a very odd combination of things to do in parallel.



Yea...that's an odd combination for sure and doesn't seem very logical.


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Nov 16, 2022)

180 said:


> So is the mountain opening Friday?


Yep per their PB feed - making snow on 1 TTB run starting with Hellgate - same way they start most seasons


----------



## skiur (Nov 16, 2022)

cdskier said:


> Yea...that's an odd combination for sure and doesn't seem very logical.



They claim it has to do with a recent change in their credit card processing.  Maybe they should change it back.


----------



## Creakyknees (Nov 16, 2022)

Cash could be King once again;






						It May Soon Be Illegal For Businesses to Refuse Cash: An Update on the Payment Choice Act
					

Based in Houston, Texas, we provide secure armored transport, ATM services, and cash-management services through our service network of nearly 200 operating locations in the US and Puerto Rico.




					www.loomis.us


----------



## PAabe (Nov 16, 2022)

I use cash at small businesses like my ski shop so that they don't have to eat the credit card processing fees going to big evil banking corp, which can be upwards of 3%. I do cash tips when I can rather than card so folks can... choose how much to report to the boss... but seriously some tip sharing/skimming schemes are ridiculous.  There is also then less opportunity for credit card skimming or fraud, and less databases with my card transactions in them.

Chains and big companies like Vail I couldn't care less about them paying those fees and am happy to use my credit card to build credit and get rewards.


----------



## skiur (Nov 17, 2022)

many Banks charge fees for large cash deposits now.  Businesses have to pay either an accountant or employee to count cash as well so paying with cash is saving the company CC fees but it is pretty much a wash because they have to pay to deposit the cash.


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Nov 17, 2022)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> Yep per their PB feed - making snow on 1 TTB run starting with Hellgate - same way they start most seasons


Looks like they are shooting for 2 runs - also including Belt Parkway.

Not as interesting as mechanics of credit card payment systems, I know.


----------



## catskillman (Nov 17, 2022)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> Looks like they are shooting for 2 runs - also including Belt Parkway.
> 
> Not as interesting as mechanics of credit card payment systems, I know.


Also, from various facebook groups it looks like opening day is Saturday and not tomorrow.  Although their web site still has tomorrow.

typical!!


----------



## catskillman (Nov 17, 2022)

On one website Sarah stated that they were looking for "young" employees.  If they had any HR at the mountain, she would be in trouble for that discriminatory comment!


----------



## cdskier (Nov 17, 2022)

Well Belleayre is opening tomorrow but Hunter is now stating "as soon as possible" on social media (although the snow report section on their website hasn't been updated since April 10th...impressive!)


----------



## Great Bear (Nov 18, 2022)

Creakyknees said:


> Cash could be King once again;
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That would be awesome!


----------



## catskillman (Nov 24, 2022)

1. Conditions are quite good
2. Expect crowds this weekend
3.  Rain could be devestating
4.  Food prices have gone up even more!
5.  Bar prices have gone up also, with a 18% tip added automatically
6.  Scanners seem to be running slow.
7.  A lot of new faces
8.  Ski school has new jackets
9.  There is an all terrain vehicle that they are driving around on the slopes while the mountain is open
10.  Something / confusion is going on in the $$ locker room.  Apparently things were taken from lockers over the summer, and they are cutting back on availibility etc.  Heard lift line chatter on 2 days about this, but do not have absolute details.
11.  No pay parking yet that I have seen.
12.  Overlook should open today, nothing on the west side

Stay tuned.


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Nov 24, 2022)

catskillman said:


> 1. Conditions are quite good
> 2. Expect crowds this weekend
> 3.  Rain could be devestating
> 4.  Food prices have gone up even more!
> ...


Overlook now open - so up to 5 distinct runs now


----------



## Kingslug20 (Nov 25, 2022)

We shall see tomorrow...
Scratch that..I'm out


----------



## RichT (Nov 26, 2022)

Any update? Not sure what you mean by "$$ Locker room"? Maybe High Peaks?

10. Something / confusion is going on in the $$ locker room. Apparently things were taken from lockers over the summer, and they are cutting back on availibility etc. Heard lift line chatter on 2 days about this, but do not have absolute details.


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Nov 26, 2022)

Minimal lines today. 
15 runs 830-1230
East Side Drive not actually open.


----------



## Kingslug20 (Nov 26, 2022)

Scratchy?


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Nov 26, 2022)

Belt was scratchy but softened
Overlook had large cookies and wasn't pleasant
Hellgate was groomed flat great surface
Minya had some soft bumps left on it and was spring like by 11.
Bluebird day with nice variety. 
Best November day I have had at Hunter all around


----------



## Kingslug20 (Nov 26, 2022)

Wanted to go..but 2.5 hour drive..and a weekend...
Probably should have gone...


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Nov 26, 2022)

Took me 2:35 to get there. Glad I opted for that instead of Blue an hour closer.


----------



## catskillman (Nov 27, 2022)

RichT said:


> Any update? Not sure what you mean by "$$ Locker room"? Maybe High Peaks?
> 
> 10. Something / confusion is going on in the $$ locker room. Apparently things were taken from lockers over the summer, and they are cutting back on availibility etc. Heard lift line chatter on 2 days about this, but do not have absolute details.


yeah, high peaks.  people that had adult beverages in their lockers had them removed.  however, those that had the $300 lockers did not.  Issue seems to be considered in many ways.  They rent the locker, if it was a rental house the owner cannot enter without permission,,,,,

Also, they are now only allowing the pass cards to allow access 30 minutes before the lifts open, wheras the $300 a year lockers are accessable for hours before the lifts open. 

The mountain has been empty since opening.  

The rain today and Wednesday will most likely destroy what snow is there.


----------



## RichT (Nov 28, 2022)

catskillman said:


> yeah, high peaks.  people that had adult beverages in their lockers had them removed.  however, those that had the $300 lockers did not.  Issue seems to be considered in many ways.  They rent the locker, if it was a rental house the owner cannot enter without permission,,,,,
> 
> Also, they are now only allowing the pass cards to allow access 30 minutes before the lifts open, wheras the $300 a year lockers are accessable for hours before the lifts open.
> 
> ...


Went there today, booze and food were removed (booze was put back). Food crackers and the like shouldn't be left there (mice). Place had very little people skiing, it was a gloomy day, North was closed. Snow flurries right now. Tomorrow looks good.


----------



## Kingslug20 (Nov 28, 2022)

Hmmm....flurries..
Maybe I'll go...
Watched the cam today...very gloomy


----------



## Kingslug20 (Nov 28, 2022)

Friggin rain wednesday..if it wasn't for that they could blow all night tonight..


----------



## Kingslug20 (Nov 29, 2022)

And so they did..blew enough to cover up all the shmaggugus...except for MK...that was not very smooth...
Empty and 30 degrees...pretty good for a few hours..


----------



## catskillman (Nov 29, 2022)

Sad news...  Keith Holmquist "The Pro"  has passed away.  So sad.  He was very optimistic...bought a season pass this year but the C would not let him go.  

RIP


----------



## Kingslug20 (Nov 29, 2022)

Wow...he was one of the best..


----------



## So Inclined (Nov 30, 2022)

catskillman said:


> Sad news...  Keith Holmquist "The Pro"  has passed away.  So sad.  He was very optimistic...bought a season pass this year but the C would not let him go.
> 
> RIP


Oh no! Terrible news.


----------



## JimG. (Nov 30, 2022)

I heard this morning.

RIP Keith


----------



## Kingslug20 (Dec 1, 2022)

Guns are blowing...friday..guess I'm going..


----------



## Kingslug20 (Dec 2, 2022)

Sun is out..3 good trails..they blew all night so its probably the best it's been.


----------



## catskillman (Dec 4, 2022)

Today was rough - delayed opening,  Marbles, ice, sticky snow, and then a broken hose on a snow gun aimed a bleeker throwing out just water.  Thankfully it was not pointed under the lift!!

Tomorrow will hopefully be much better.  There will be a lot of weekenders tomorrow due to Keith's service in the afternoon.


----------



## catskillman (Dec 4, 2022)

RichT said:


> Went there today, booze and food were removed (booze was put back). Food crackers and the like shouldn't be left there (mice). Place had very little people skiing, it was a gloomy day, North was closed. Snow flurries right now. Tomorrow looks good.


And apparently in their infinite wisdom, they mistakenly handed out two new door key fobs for every locker.  So the folks that paid for just one person got two door keys.  Liquer was returned to lockers, but I know one guy who got something that was not his.  And yes, he gave it to the gatekeeper.


----------



## Kingslug20 (Dec 4, 2022)

Stuck in CT another week...Hunter fri,sat,sun...reports look good...


----------



## 180 (Dec 4, 2022)

Overlook was sick this afternoon under the guns.  Rest of the mountain scratchy, They are trying their best however, making snow in marginal conditions on many trails.


----------



## Kingslug20 (Dec 4, 2022)

Overlook is great...when it's great...nice plummet in the middle...


----------



## catskillman (Dec 6, 2022)

yesterday i get to the mountain at 8;45.  the flyer and b are not running.  I ask the scan guy why the lifts are not running,  He said he "thinks" ice.  I go to the ticket window and am told the mountain opens at 9.  They had no clue that the lifts are not running.

They open B at around 9:30 ish, and after about 3 runs F is open.

The filnally open the flyer around 1015 (not exact times).

All day several employees tell us that a snow gun was pointed at the lift and it froze.  Then I read on Facebook that a hydraulic hose broke.  Anyone know the truth?  Just curious


----------



## RichT (Dec 7, 2022)

catskillman said:


> yesterday i get to the mountain at 8;45.  the flyer and b are not running.  I ask the scan guy why the lifts are not running,  He said he "thinks" ice.  I go to the ticket window and am told the mountain opens at 9.  They had no clue that the lifts are not running.
> 
> They open B at around 9:30 ish, and after about 3 runs F is open.
> 
> ...


Truth!? You can't handle the truth!! Lots of rain yesterday, and today looks to be the same, trial count is going down. Sunday looks like a winter winner


----------



## Kingslug20 (Dec 7, 2022)

So far the weather reports have changed..every day.
Sunday.....we shall see...I'll be there.


----------



## catskillman (Dec 7, 2022)

RichT said:


> Truth!? You can't handle the truth!! Lots of rain yesterday, and today looks to be the same, trial count is going down. Sunday looks like a winter winner


I was wondering about the lift - was it an icing delay or maintenance delay. 
According to their website NOW - they do not have the flyer or F open today, but Hellgate, Minya and the Belt are open.  Guess if you hike you can get to them.  They had East Side Drive noted as open for a week, but there was not a flake on it.
  How hard can it be to get this right. 
Guess the rain yesterday, and it is raining here in town now, took out overlook or they just don't feel like running the lift.

Update - now at 9:15 6 pack is loading, but website still says it is closed.....


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Dec 8, 2022)

Webcams sure look depressing. Gonna be spending Sat nt in a hotel in Catskills as a getaway with GF and was gonna get up early Sun and ski 830-10 while she slept in. But unless things turn around significantly I'm not even gonna bother packing skis.


----------



## Kingslug20 (Dec 8, 2022)

They're blowing...might as well go.
I've got 2 pretty days there so far..might go Fri Sat and sun....beats a day on the couch.


----------



## Kingslug20 (Dec 9, 2022)

Guns are blowing...guess I'm going.


----------



## Kingslug20 (Dec 9, 2022)

Guns blowing all over the place...


----------



## RichT (Dec 10, 2022)

Cold temps, snowmaking, lets see how crazy it gets this weekend. Hopefully it goes very well. Weather wise week ahead looks great!


----------



## Kingslug20 (Dec 10, 2022)

Was going to go...but I'm off to VT.
Weekend skiing....nah....
Yesterday was ok for 3 hours


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Dec 13, 2022)

Had East Side Drive and Upper K open today. Zero lines but guns were blowing on a bunch of the open terrain and even hitting you a bit where Flyer crosses Bleeker. Nice soft bumps on Kennedy. 

Looks like the next ones they plan to get open are Eisenhower and Way Out.


----------



## RichT (Dec 18, 2022)

Hunter's been doing a great job! The party and band last night at the lodge was GREAT!! Was surprised of the low turnout, but it is the last shopping weekend till Christmas. On a side note though, they took all of the garbage cans that were spread throughout the upper lodge area and replaced with a three in one out of the way area. Boy did that make a mess of cup, cans and garbage being piled up on tables/and floors. Who comes up with these stupid ideas? Those cans were in the exact same spots for 40yrs!


----------



## Kingslug20 (Dec 18, 2022)

Stupid ideas...hmmm...let's see...oh yeah...vail...


----------



## catskillman (Dec 18, 2022)

What is the issue with the 6 pack?  Down - Again - yesterday !


----------



## Kingslug20 (Dec 18, 2022)

Hmm..let's see...broken lifts....hmm..
Vail??


----------



## catskillman (Dec 26, 2022)

what a debacle.  I can't understand why they cannot get the website accurate regarding what trails and lifts are open.  It is wrong daily.  I won't even get into the grooming updates.  They have trails marked as groomed that have no snow.  It is insane.

Today, the place is a mob scene, and the east side was not open, although it has been open for quite a while and in good shape.   Why?  And F lift is open.  

The terrain park and race trail are closed today, they also have been open daily for a while.  They are blowing a ton of snow on them but they sure could have used the park open today, so kids weren't jumping off everything else and skiing backwards with the crowd that was there.

Someone clue me in to the logic....I would love to understand...


----------



## Kingslug20 (Dec 26, 2022)




----------



## RichT (Dec 26, 2022)

catskillman said:


> what a debacle.  I can't understand why they cannot get the website accurate regarding what trails and lifts are open.  It is wrong daily.  I won't even get into the grooming updates.  They have trails marked as groomed that have no snow.  It is insane.
> 
> Today, the place is a mob scene, and the east side was not open, although it has been open for quite a while and in good shape.   Why?  And F lift is open.
> 
> ...


The place is run by monkees......


----------



## Kingslug20 (Dec 26, 2022)

Who are run by...this..


----------



## catskillman (Dec 28, 2022)

And the shock just keeps coming.
They have the summit lodge steps roped off.  they were never shoveled in the past 20 years, but now if you need to rest room or to warm up you have to walk around the back which is a treacherous uneven patch of ice. And then once inside, you cannot access the top 2 floors, and the benched on the bottom floor are covered in junk.  Safety hazard for sure.

Ironically, this is where ski patrol is housed.  So when they have a call they have to go out over the ice to get into their equipment.  Insane.  I should have taked photos, so you would understand how bad it is


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Dec 28, 2022)

catskillman said:


> And the shock just keeps coming.
> They have the summit lodge steps roped off.  they were never shoveled in the past 20 years, but now if you need to rest room or to warm up you have to walk around the back which is a treacherous uneven patch of ice. And then once inside, you cannot access the top 2 floors, and the benched on the bottom floor are covered in junk.  Safety hazard for sure.
> 
> Ironically, this is where ski patrol is housed.  So when they have a call they have to go out over the ice to get into their equipment.  Insane.  I should have taked photos, so you would understand how bad it is


Are the indoor stairs roped off too?


----------



## RichT (Dec 28, 2022)

catskillman said:


> And the shock just keeps coming.
> They have the summit lodge steps roped off.  they were never shoveled in the past 20 years, but now if you need to rest room or to warm up you have to walk around the back which is a treacherous uneven patch of ice. And then once inside, you cannot access the top 2 floors, and the benched on the bottom floor are covered in junk.  Safety hazard for sure.
> 
> Ironically, this is where ski patrol is housed.  So when they have a call they have to go out over the ice to get into their equipment.  Insane.  I should have taked photos, so you would understand how bad it is


No food or soup up there????


----------



## RichT (Dec 28, 2022)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> Are the indoor stairs roped off too?


Enhancing the guest experience!!


----------



## catskillman (Dec 28, 2022)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> Are the indoor stairs roped off too?


YES


----------



## catskillman (Dec 31, 2022)

so - yesterday went down Minya, took another run down HBK, then went to go back to Minya and the whole east side is closed, with patrol standing there,  Go down to F lift and that is now closed.  Heard the chopper, patrol had to close it all down as it was "a very very unfortunate situation".  The person got a chopper ride so they were apparently alive.  A half hour goes by and there is another issue requiring a chopper.  The day before the chopper was there twice also.

And then there was the fight - a father went after the lift attendants on the B lift, after his 2 daughters fell off the lift.  They were okay but he went biserk.  The police were called to break it up.

Oh, and then there were the 2 people that they had to give narcan to on Thursday in the lodge.  Nice crowd....


----------



## ThatGuy (Dec 31, 2022)

#EpicFail


----------



## raisingarizona (Dec 31, 2022)

catskillman said:


> so - yesterday went down Minya, took another run down HBK, then went to go back to Minya and the whole east side is closed, with patrol standing there,  Go down to F lift and that is now closed.  Heard the chopper, patrol had to close it all down as it was "a very very unfortunate situation".  The person got a chopper ride so they were apparently alive.  A half hour goes by and there is another issue requiring a chopper.  The day before the chopper was there twice also.
> 
> And then there was the fight - a father went after the lift attendants on the B lift, after his 2 daughters fell off the lift.  They were okay but he went biserk.  The police were called to break it up.
> 
> Oh, and then there were the 2 people that they had to give narcan to on Thursday in the lodge.  Nice crowd....


Ahhh, the holidays, the great outdoors and Hunter. What a shit show. I often refer to our ski area here as the Hunter of the South West. Yep, it’s a total shit show too


----------



## MidnightJester (Dec 31, 2022)

catskillman said:


> so - yesterday went down Minya, took another run down HBK, then went to go back to Minya and the whole east side is closed, with patrol standing there,  Go down to F lift and that is now closed.  Heard the chopper, patrol had to close it all down as it was "a very very unfortunate situation".  The person got a chopper ride so they were apparently alive.  A half hour goes by and there is another issue requiring a chopper.  The day before the chopper was there twice also.
> 
> And then there was the fight - a father went after the lift attendants on the B lift, after his 2 daughters fell off the lift.  They were okay but he went biserk.  The police were called to break it up.
> 
> Oh, and then there were the 2 people that they had to give narcan to on Thursday in the lodge.  Nice crowd....


So Vail will be operating their own Vail helicopter soon and the helicopter pilot is getting to know the place well. As to the multi copter rides anyone know the circumstances of the accidents? Wonder if recent rain and flash freeze was the culprit because whatever snow that came down or was made is mostly long gone from the Holiday crowds.

Horribly you also cant rule out a Narcan needing crash from the apparent events of the week you mention.

Maybe the dad should of attacked the lift that dropped them. Bad chair.... What was its number?
Wondering what the difference that on some lifts the Lift workers have to drag or hold back some chairs that can hit you hard if in the wrong spot? Type of older lift drivetrain & chair type system I am guessing


----------



## NYDB (Dec 31, 2022)

Classic Hunta


----------



## camberstick (Dec 31, 2022)

Damn, makes me feel like the Poconos aren't that bad. Haven't been to hunter in 20 years. Horrible.


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Jan 1, 2023)

Wondering if Hunter will be worth hitting for a day trip Jan 7 or 8

Seems pretty certain the PA Epic and Indy options will be crap then, and I can't imagine conditions in VT/NH will warrant the drive time and gas and lodging cost.

Hinges on 
- how hard they are hit by rain Tues-Wed
- how well they can make snow Thurs-Fri nights
- crowding


----------



## KustyTheKlown (Jan 1, 2023)

mmm shooting up on the slopes


----------



## KustyTheKlown (Jan 1, 2023)

MidnightJester said:


> Wondering what the difference that on some lifts the Lift workers have to drag or hold back some chairs that can hit you hard if in the wrong spot? Type of older lift drivetrain & chair type system I am guessing



You really don’t understand the difference between detachable and fixed grip lifts?


----------



## So Inclined (Jan 1, 2023)

MidnightJester said:


> As to the multi copter rides anyone know the circumstances of the accidents? Wonder if recent rain and flash freeze was the culprit because whatever snow that came down or was made is mostly long gone from the Holiday crowds.


The rain and flash freeze was a week ago. Conditions were typical northeast (firm, but not unskiable) the first half of the week and increasingly springlike the last couple days. Thurs to NYE were pretty fun conditions as long as you avoided the growing bare patches. 
Can't speak to circumstances of particular accidents, since I didn't see any happen - but I did see various sled rides, esp yesterday. You just have a lot of people on the trails (but not an unprecedented or uncommon amount - I felt more skeeved by crowds around me at Killington a few weeks back) so you get plenty of everything. You have people running around who can't ski/ride the slopes they're on. You have people who can ski/ride them but insist on straight lining or going too fast for the situation. (I got hit from behind by a snowboarder doing that early this season and was lucky not to get hurt.)
Of course, you also have people who are chemically fortified. Yesterday was the first day I had ever seen dudes drinking tall boys in the line for the beginner area magic carpet at 10:30 in the morning.


----------



## So Inclined (Jan 1, 2023)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> Wondering if Hunter will be worth hitting for a day trip Jan 7 or 8
> 
> Seems pretty certain the PA Epic and Indy options will be crap then, and I can't imagine conditions in VT/NH will warrant the drive time and gas and lodging cost.
> 
> ...



The only thing I would offer here is that so far they seem to have been blowing snow pretty decently when the weather window opens. So keep tabs on that.


----------



## catskillman (Jan 6, 2023)

So Inclined said:


> The only thing I would offer here is that so far they seem to have been blowing snow pretty decently when the weather window opens. So keep tabs on that.


I skied this morning.  Started to rain around 11:30 and it is still raining pretty heavy now.  Rumor is they will make snow tonight, and I saw several snowmakers walking around today, however it is 38 degrees now.  Whatever they make will be only enough to cover the huge bare spots all over.  Such a shame they wasted the water and electric on Clairs etc.  Really could use it on all the trails they are struggling to keep open now.

Conditions were okay to horrible today.  Not much open.  Only HBK, White cloud, Minya, and East side, mossy and madison.  No crowds, visibility was tough.


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Jan 6, 2023)

catskillman said:


> I skied this morning.  Started to rain around 11:30 and it is still raining pretty heavy now.  Rumor is they will make snow tonight, and I saw several snowmakers walking around today, however it is 38 degrees now.  Whatever they make will be only enough to cover the huge bare spots all over.  Such a shame they wasted the water and electric on Clairs etc.  Really could use it on all the trails they are struggling to keep open now.
> 
> Conditions were okay to horrible today.  Not much open.  Only HBK, White cloud, Minya, and East side, mossy and madison.  No crowds, visibility was tough.


So basically their lift and trail report showing Hellgate, Cliff, Belt, Drop Off & Eisenhower open is a lie? And there were bare spots on the 3 runs (Cloud, Minya and ESD) you saw open?

Suppose I can't blame them for the weather, but I can for the lies. Will not go tomorrow, and await tomorrow reports to decide about Sunday.

Thanks for the real scoop


----------



## catskillman (Jan 6, 2023)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> So basically their lift and trail report showing Hellgate, Cliff, Belt, Drop Off & Eisenhower open is a lie? And there were bare spots on the 3 runs (Cloud, Minya and ESD) you saw open?
> 
> Suppose I can't blame them for the weather, but I can for the lies. Will not go tomorrow, and await tomorrow reports to decide about Sunday.
> 
> Thanks for the real scoop


The web site is never correct, and has been wrong all season.  Cannot understand why it is so difficult to get it right.  

The belt, Ike and dropoff were closed yesterday also.  There are bare spots on all trails.  There is room for 2 skis only to get to kennedy under B lift and then very large spots and holes on the trail itself.  They posted something yesterday, late in the day that they were closing the belt to preserve the snow for the weekend.  However, there was huge bare spots before that, and it was all bumped up, which made for a real mess by where the lift drops you off and the entry to overlook, which is always such a bottleneck.  

f


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Jan 6, 2023)

catskillman said:


> The web site is never correct, and has been wrong all season.  Cannot understand why it is so difficult to get it right.
> 
> The belt, Ike and dropoff were closed yesterday also.  There are bare spots on all trails.  There is room for 2 skis only to get to kennedy under B lift and then very large spots and holes on the trail itself.  They posted something yesterday, late in the day that they were closing the belt to preserve the snow for the weekend.  However, there was huge bare spots before that, and it was all bumped up, which made for a real mess by where the lift drops you off and the entry to overlook, which is always such a bottleneck.
> 
> f


Thanks - sounds like if I really want to ski this weekend my best bet is using my 50% off coupon for Big Snow.

Don't think I need to ski that badly though.


----------



## zyk (Jan 6, 2023)

As a recovering hunter homer I keep watching the reports.  Is it really that bad?  Belleayre is a wee bit down the road and seems to have well over half the mountain open.  Am I missing something?

Plan on getting out next week one way or another.


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Jan 6, 2023)

Hunter juat updated FB "It doesn't look like Belt Parkway or Hunter North will be open by tomorrow"

Will wait for updates tomorrow to decide what to do Sun. May consider JFrost as 2/3 the trip if Hunter seems real weak.


----------



## catskillman (Jan 6, 2023)

zyk said:


> As a recovering hunter homer I keep watching the reports.  Is it really that bad?  Belleayre is a wee bit down the road and seems to have well over half the mountain open.  Am I missing something?
> 
> Plan on getting out next week one way or another.


that is because they made snow, with all Hunter's ex snowmakers and NYS $.  Yes Belleayre is the place to be this season........and probably next season also


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Saturday at 1:38 PM)

Julie McGuire reported this today on FB
𝐇𝐮𝐧𝐭𝐞𝐫 𝐌𝐨𝐮𝐧𝐭𝐚𝐢𝐧 (𝐑𝐞𝐬𝐨𝐫𝐭) 

It's obvious that @huntermountain has been focusing on resurfacing after the disaster of a week we had weatherwise, though there is still a lot of iciness and variability. 

𝐁𝐞𝐬𝐭 𝐭𝐫𝐚𝐢𝐥 𝐨𝐟 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐝𝐚𝐲: Upper K27 to East Side Drive to Lower Crossover
It's a lot of hard corduroy, death cookies, and frozen divots, but I felt I could maintain good control and it had few people. 

𝐖𝐨𝐫𝐬𝐭 𝐓𝐫𝐚𝐢𝐥 𝐨𝐟 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐃𝐚𝐲: White Cloud. 
Since Belt and Hunter North are closed, the beginner traffic is on White Cloud, which means a lot of skiers that aren't comfortable in difficult conditions making erratic moves. 

𝐇𝐞𝐥𝐥𝐠𝐚𝐭𝐞: This was my first run of the day. They are blowing snow at the summit off the Flyer and the conditions were variable AF. I was fixing my glove and gliding from Upper K27 to Hellgate when I was abruptly jolted by the new snow. You have these frozen corduroy patches, uneven terrain, super sticky spots, death cookies, and just a lot of variability. What I'm trying to say is that it was typical East Coast skiing. 

𝐌𝐢𝐧𝐲𝐚 𝐊𝐨𝐧𝐤𝐚: Comparable to Upper K27 and East Side Drive.

𝐄𝐢𝐬𝐞𝐧𝐡𝐨𝐰𝐞𝐫: Pretty icy and getting a lot of traffic. There is bottlenecking because there is only a thin strip leading to that trail. 

𝐓𝐡𝐞 𝐂𝐥𝐢𝐟𝐟: Frozen corduroy.  

No crowds, though! I guess this proves that there's always a silver lining.


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Saturday at 1:45 PM)

Seems like Hellgate, Cliff and Ike are open, no lines is a major plus for Hunter on a weekend, and I imagine conditions will be better by tomorrow as good snowmaking weather all night like and they indicate they will have Belt and North open tomorrow.  

Still on the fence for tomorrow. Certainly not great conditions but I have made the trek to Hunter for less terrain early season.


----------



## catskillman (Sunday at 8:44 AM)

report as of now says Belt is closed but north side is open.  That will be interesting.......  
Yesterday was crazy with nothing for an intermediate to ski from the top.  Not that the belt is intermediate anymore with the crowds and the ice by the north lift area.


----------



## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Sunday at 8:52 AM)

catskillman said:


> report as of now says Belt is closed but north side is open.  That will be interesting.......
> Yesterday was crazy with nothing for an intermediate to ski from the top.  Not that the belt is intermediate anymore with the crowds and the ice by the north lift area.


Don't have any stats but I would guess that Belt Parkway is the trail with more injuries that require ski patrol attention than any other trail in Catskills. The huge number of poor (and often intoxicated) "skiers" and "riders" that choose to take the run marked as the least difficult route down from the top, coupled with the extent to which they scrape  off the surface, make for a greater challenge than other route down on weekends and holidays. 

It may have lost the title briefly when Overlook was mistakenly rated blue. That run consistently has the slickest surface on the mountain and gets pretty steep.


----------



## catskillman (Sunday at 9:45 PM)

this is cut from the Hunter Ski Bum facebook site.  While he does have a couple of points, he can't even spell the family name, Slutzky, that he thinks is the best ever correctly....  He is correct, the mountain has been dangerous, 

noone ever thought that crowding would not be an issue, limiting lift ticket sales is a joke when apparently 65% of all epic passholders are in the tri state area,  This week is MLK weekend, tickets are still on sale, the mountain is in terrible shape, the place will be dangerous without a doubt.  But they will sell a lot of beer at $10 + 8& tax and 18% tip.

*From Facebook - *
Just sent this to Vail ceo. :
I used to pray for Vail to buy Hunter Mountain now I M like most others upset it has. You posted so many millions and profits, and yet you do not maintain this mountain, the limited amount of snow making put on this mountain is a disgrace. This is not speculation, this is a fact. All you have to do is go on Hunter ski bums on Facebook, just one of the many Facebook followings that Hunter Mountain has. You do not have to be imaginative to run this mountain the way it should be, it’s already been done years and years ago. Things are supposed to get better not worse. David Slutski when he ran the snow making and grooming of this mountain did a superb job. So this is not speculation, we know how good Hunter could be because it used to be. And the lack of snow is very noticed. We had many many many days of superb snow making weather, with very limited snow making. The snow making crew is trying its best And working very hard, but they cannot do this without the resources from management. It’s a total disgrace. I have been skiing hunter mountain 53 years plus, I work for Val as a ski bum in the late 70s. You guys were always known for precision grooming . call the lack of services, the lack of opening up to rain, it’s negligence, we deserve to have the mountains opened up fully. Now you’ve just gone through a warm spell no doubt, which makes things tougher. But we are the skiers that pay the fees, we buy equipment, we support the infrastructure. We feel we are being screwed. Pretty much I can speak for many. A business is supposed to make money, no doubt. No one would begrudge you from making money. That’s what a business is supposed to do, I had the biggest Airbnb home at Hunter Mountain, so I know what I charged. I spent money and as a result of that I was booked 50 weeks a year, the most profitable Airbnb and VRBO home in the area. Unfortunately it burn to the ground November 3, instead of rebuilding, tired of the bullshit from management at Hunter Mountain, I sold the property. I no longer have faith in Hunter Mountain. I am going to Vail this week on Friday, should have any time does national guard Anyone in power want to talk to me I will make myself available. The lousy grooming and limited snowmaking makes the mountain dangerous. My number is 917-545-0529. My name is victor magnotti. My email is Vic skis@aol.com . This is not the first letter of rote you people, just like Russia hunt the mountain never is there any replies, it lets us know what you think of us customers. I’d much rather be skiing than sitting here writing this letter
8



Like


Reply
Share
10h






Skip Warner
Vic Joseph lousy grooming?

Like


Reply
Share
4h





Vic Joseph
Author
Skip Warner yesterday was outright dangerous skip. Ask anyone.it was way beyond dangerous. Vail. Supposed to be better not worse.


----------



## skiur (Monday at 9:36 AM)

If you are trying to be taken seriously writing to a CEO of a fortune 500 company you should at least run a spell/grammar check before hitting send.


----------



## jimmywilson69 (Monday at 10:09 AM)

It doesn't matter that went right to the delete folder whether it was written as is or written by Mark Twain

I hope I'm wrong, but I'm probably not.


----------



## catskillman (Monday at 1:47 PM)

skiur said:


> If you are trying to be taken seriously writing to a CEO of a fortune 500 company you should at least run a spell/grammar check before hitting send.


agree he should have.  He is a well know character at Hunter.  Spell check would not have picked up the correct spelling of Slutzky however.


----------



## Kingslug20 (Monday at 3:02 PM)

Vail doesn't care about spelling...or anything other than making a profit...


----------



## JimG. (Monday at 6:56 PM)

Has Vail/Hunter completely given up on making snow on any expert terrain?

I drove by yesterday to pick up a pair of skis at the Pro and there was no evidence of any snowmaking on the front side expert terrain save for a patch or two on Racer's. On the west side there was some snow on Claire's but it was just patches like they started to blow then stopped. Pretty sad to see.


----------



## catskillman (Tuesday at 7:54 AM)

JimG. said:


> Has Vail/Hunter completely given up on making snow on any expert terrain?
> 
> I drove by yesterday to pick up a pair of skis at the Pro and there was no evidence of any snowmaking on the front side expert terrain save for a patch or two on Racer's. On the west side there was some snow on Claire's but it was just patches like they started to blow then stopped. Pretty sad to see.


they had clairs open for a couple of days.  honestly it was a waste of money to even try.  they could have used that snow elsewhere.  people bitched all over facebook and they gave in foolishly.  The belt parkway has been closed since at least Thursday due to the horrendous conditions.  You can imaging what the rest of the mountain is like with nowhere for the inexperienced to go.  Dangerous is the only word to describe it.........


----------



## JimG. (Tuesday at 3:45 PM)

Dangerously crowded on certain trails at Belle this past weekend too. Kids programs fired up for the season and it got chaotic at times.

Not trying to pile on the already totally negative feedback about Vail but it's clear they have no idea how to operate a ski area in the east like Hunter. It is clear there is no plan.


----------



## Kingslug20 (Tuesday at 4:54 PM)

Maybe...he's running things....


----------



## So Inclined (Wednesday at 2:38 PM)

catskillman said:


> they had clairs open for a couple of days.  honestly it was a waste of money to even try.  they could have used that snow elsewhere.  people bitched all over facebook and they gave in foolishly.  The belt parkway has been closed since at least Thursday due to the horrendous conditions.  You can imaging what the rest of the mountain is like with nowhere for the inexperienced to go.  Dangerous is the only word to describe it.........


Belt was open yesterday. And guns were blowing all the way down on Overlook, from the top to the North side lift.


----------



## catskillman (Wednesday at 5:19 PM)

Overlook today had everything, huge huge wales, sticky snow at the bottom where the guns were on,   Worst/dangerous run of the day was east side drive.  Smallish wales, but pure ice on the downhill side, tough to get in, hard to describe that mess, but once you got to the flats it was good.

Parkway was ok, hellgate was very good, but skied off by 11.  Not crowded, but just wait - rain tomorrow, and a holiday weekend coming up


----------

