# Newtown CT school shooting



## legalskier (Dec 14, 2012)

http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/12/14/3142011/school-shooting-reported-in-newtown.html

Hope everyon'e ok....


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## o3jeff (Dec 14, 2012)

This is all over the local news feeds, but not a lot of info yet.


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## JimG. (Dec 14, 2012)

I'm now hearing multiple injuries including some kids and a few deaths.


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## o3jeff (Dec 14, 2012)

http://www.ctnow.com/news/hc-police-responding-to-incident-in-newtown-20121214,0,455352.story


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## Glenn (Dec 14, 2012)

Just terrible.


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## JimG. (Dec 14, 2012)

27 people dead, 14 of them children.

I'm literally in tears.


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## bvibert (Dec 14, 2012)

JimG. said:


> 27 people dead, 14 of them children.
> 
> I'm literally in tears.



Is that an official statement?  There's been a lot of rumors flying...


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## skiNEwhere (Dec 14, 2012)

27 dead? I heard about the story, but no numbers. 

This is terrible.......


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## skiNEwhere (Dec 14, 2012)

Murder is senseless regardless of who is killed, but even moreso in the case of children. Early reports say it was a parent. I can not, and never will fathom what could possess someone to kill children.


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## marcski (Dec 14, 2012)

I can't eat lunch I'm so nauseous from this story. I want to go home and grab my kids and never let go.


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## bvibert (Dec 14, 2012)

ctnow.com said:
			
		

> The number of dead is unclear, but there are at least 20 shooting victims. Many of the shootings took place in a kindergarten classroom, sources said.
> 
> One entire classrom is unaccounted for outside the school, sources said.



Heartbreaking.  My son was in a kindergarten classroom elsewhere in CT when this occurred..


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## JimG. (Dec 14, 2012)

bvibert said:


> Is that an official statement?  There's been a lot of rumors flying...



No, the number keeps changing.

Now it's 27 dead and 18 of them children. Getting worse and alot of critical injuries means it will only get even more horrible.

This is a heartbreaking tragedy.


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## wa-loaf (Dec 14, 2012)

marcski said:


> I can't eat lunch I'm so nauseous from this story. I want to go home and grab my kids and never let go.



This.

26, 18 of them kids. From a police statement.


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## Nick (Dec 14, 2012)

Wow, just wow. This makes me sick to my stomach. 

My wife is a 1st grade schoolteacher, and I have a 6 month old son at home. I can't even imagine this.... just unreal. And it's even more real because it's in Connecticut; my home state, only 30 minutes from where I grew up, and for a lot of you guys here probably even closer... 

Sick to my stomach.


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## deadheadskier (Dec 14, 2012)

incomprehensible


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## dmc (Dec 14, 2012)

Something needs to be done...


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## FRITOLAYGUY (Dec 14, 2012)

My first job for 5yrs was in newtown down the street from this school i cant believe that happened. Im upset and pissed off all at once


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## deadheadskier (Dec 14, 2012)

dmc said:


> Something needs to be done...



IMO, the only thing that can be done is we as a society need to get better at recognizing the signs of mental illness and prevent such people from committing such heinous and evil crimes.  

That's about all you can do really.


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## skiNEwhere (Dec 14, 2012)

deadheadskier said:


> IMO, the only thing that can be done is we as a society need to get better at recognizing the signs of mental illness and prevent such people from committing such heinous and evil crimes.
> 
> That's about all you can do really.



That's a long, long road. Unfortunately though, when there's a will, there's a way.

This is very sad


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## thetrailboss (Dec 14, 2012)

Horrific.  

Hug your kids and family.  

Reach out to friends and family when they are having difficulty to prevent something like this from happening.  Take responsiblity for yourself and your friends and family.


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## 2sons (Dec 14, 2012)

I think my son played travel baseball there- I'm grief stricken, horrified and sick to my stomach.


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## BackLoafRiver (Dec 14, 2012)

So unbelievably sad.


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## skiNEwhere (Dec 14, 2012)

You could see how much it affected the president during his address, tragic


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## Nick (Dec 14, 2012)

deadheadskier said:


> IMO, the only thing that can be done is we as a society need to get better at recognizing the signs of mental illness and prevent such people from committing such heinous and evil crimes.
> 
> That's about all you can do really.



Yup. 

When you think about it ... we are a nation of 300 million. Even if only .00001% of the people in this country would do something like this, that's still 30 individuals. 

I think part of the difficulty is that things are always easier seen in hindsight. I like to think of it like .... when you go ski, how many times do you nearly fall, for every time you actually fall? It's like 20:1. There are always going to be close calls. So how many people across the country probably exhibit behavior that could result in a killing like this? There are probably 1000 people showing the exact same signs for the 1 that actually follows through. 

It's the proverbial needle in a haystack. No easy solutions. Just sadness. 

Just sickening ..


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## JimG. (Dec 14, 2012)

deadheadskier said:


> IMO, the only thing that can be done is we as a society need to get better at recognizing the signs of mental illness and prevent such people from committing such heinous and evil crimes.
> 
> That's about all you can do really.



Perhaps, but you don't have kids yet.

When you do, you will change your opinion and you will demand that something more concrete be done. My greatest fear in life is that something like this happens to one of my kids. A buddy of mine from CT has a son who is in first grade at that school. I freaked out when I heard the news and spent an hour in terror that his son was shot. His son is OK but very shaken. Hasn't stopped crying all day. Terrified to go back to school.


Psychos like this guy live on the idea that society can't stop them when they decide to go off. I'll be attending my next school board meeting and I'll be demanding that our schools hire armed guards to monitor and control entry to all school buildings. That's what needs to be done. Shoot the bastards before they get the chance to hurt kids.


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## deadheadskier (Dec 14, 2012)

I didn't realize I had to have children to have a valid opinion on the matter...........


I certainly wouldn't be opposed to having armed guards at my town's schools, but I'm not sure how much that helps when you're dealing with a psychopath of such magnitude.  Maybe the guards kill the gunman or maybe the guards become added to the casualty list.  Where else do we add more armed security in the country?  The movie theater?  All workplaces?  Two years ago a gunman killed eight fellow employees and himself at his workplace in CT.   I guess I just see us as already having one of the most heavily policed nations in the world.  We have the highest incarceration rate in the world.  Almost 1% of the population is in jail; an additional 2% is on probation. Yet, sadly, these mass murders still happen all too frequently.

I do understand the call for "concrete" action, but also understand that that doesn't guarantee "concrete" results.


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## dmc (Dec 14, 2012)

deadheadskier said:


> I didn't realize I had to have children to have a valid opinion on the matter...........



Gregg established that fact with me 5 years ago...    Was dismissed in a conversation for not having kids...

But your opinion is valid.. Mental health plays into this for sure...


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## 2knees (Dec 14, 2012)

I have no words, no anger, just despair.  20 children.  20 awesome little people who havent even learned prejudice and hate.  20 chances at so much gone forever.  I hope they are all somewhere with bags of lollipops and candy playing with each other.  It's all i can think to keep from throwing up.


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## witch hobble (Dec 14, 2012)

Mental health, easy access to powerful weapons, and young men's transition into adulthood are all things that need to be reflected upon here. There will be some unique details specific to this incident, but there will be more that fit a pattern that has been playing out with increasing frequency over the last 20 years.

I agree something (or a lot of things) need to be done.  But I have a feeling that with the holidays and new years approaching, many will resolve not to think much about it after the initial shock wears off.

Nobody's opinion is invalid due to not having kids, but you guys also have to understand how fraught with emotion and anxiety parenting is when these shootings become commonplace, so cut the dads some slack too.


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## 2knees (Dec 14, 2012)

dmc said:


> Gregg established that fact with me 5 years ago...    Was dismissed in a conversation for not having kids...
> 
> But your opinion is valid.. Mental health plays into this for sure...



Dude. really.  in this thread?


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## Nick (Dec 14, 2012)

2knees said:


> I have no words, no anger, just despair.  20 children.  20 awesome little people who havent even learned prejudice and hate.  20 chances at so much gone forever.  I hope they are all somewhere with bags of lollipops and candy playing with each other.  It's all i can think to keep from throwing up.



Well said .... blah


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## JimG. (Dec 14, 2012)

dmc said:


> Gregg established that fact with me 5 years ago...    Was dismissed in a conversation for not having kids...
> 
> But your opinion is valid.. Mental health plays into this for sure...



I am offended that either of you thinks I am invalidating your opinions because you don't have kids. Utter nonsense! All I'm saying is that you will think less about the societal causes for these acts of evil and think more about what you can do to protect your kids if and when you decide to have any. I assure you you won't take the stance of "what else can you do?"  

All I am saying is that when these things happen it hits very close to home for any parent. That does not mean that you two are not equally disgusted by these murders or that you have no right to an opinion.


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## skiNEwhere (Dec 14, 2012)

JimG. said:


> That does not mean that you two are not equally disgusted by these murders or that you have no right to an opinion.



Agreed. 

There is a lot of stuff after this happened that I wanted to say in this forum, that could prevent events like this in the future, but it would be the same as politics, so I bit my tougue. Right now, this is not the time nor the place to post stuff like that. I think the only opinions that should be posted in this thread is how terrible this whole situation is, and any recent developments

If you want to post about gun control or how to limit violence, this should be posted in another thread, at ANOTHER time, if Nick allows it. Just my .02 cents, I'm not a mod but I would hate to see this thread being torn apart by different peoples opinions on how to prevent this in the future.

I haven't been affected like this emotionally since 9/11, this really stuck since it happen in new england


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## witch hobble (Dec 14, 2012)

skiNEwhere said:


> If you want to post about gun control or how to limit violence, this should be posted in another thread, at ANOTHER time, if Nick allows it. Just my .02 cents, I'm not a mod but I would hate to see this thread being torn apart by different peoples opinions on how to prevent this in the future.



Just because it is topical and people have opinions doesn't mean it is political.

Preventing this from happening again should be important enough that if it mars a thread on a ski forum.....well that is an acceptable consequence, IMO.


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## skiNEwhere (Dec 14, 2012)

witch hobble said:


> Just because it is topical and people have opinions doesn't mean it is political.



Many people have different opinions in regards into how to prevent violence, some who value their opinions strongly. It may not be politics per se, but the arguments that could develop parallel politics. It was on the track to happen earlier in this thread. Just look at when global warming was mentioned in another thread, things got nasty, and that was not politics, in the strictest sense, but it turned into politics, and there was a lot of name calling and belittling. I've seen it happen before, and this is how it usually started.

All I'm saying is that this thread is not the place for that.


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## witch hobble (Dec 14, 2012)

A solution to these problems will require political will.  And even then will not be 100% effective. Similar to carbon emission reduction, yes.

 If somebody jumped in and argued that "if only these kindergarteners had weapons then this could have been prevented", that would be bordering on the "political".  I hope you (or anybody) are not suppressing the desire to express that opinion.


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## skiNEwhere (Dec 14, 2012)

People can express their opinion, but not here (meaning this thread), not now (too soon). I've said enough already and ruining the point of this thread. I'm not saying anything else regarding this


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## 4aprice (Dec 14, 2012)

I actually shed a tear over this.  I hugged my high school kid when he came home.  This hit hard especially when I think back to the days when my kids were that age.  I can't imagine what these parents are going through.  God bless their souls.

Alex

Lake Hopatcong, NJ


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## ScottySkis (Dec 14, 2012)

Sent from my ADR6410LVW using Tapatalk 2
Heart breaking, my Aunt is a school teacher of children in Newburgh NY not far from their just horrible.


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## deadheadskier (Dec 14, 2012)

JimG. said:


> I am offended that either of you thinks I am invalidating your opinions because you don't have kids. Utter nonsense! All I'm saying is that you will think less about the societal causes for these acts of evil and think more about what you can do to protect your kids if and when you decide to have any. I assure you you won't take the stance of "what else can you do?"
> 
> All I am saying is that when these things happen it hits very close to home for any parent. That does not mean that you two are not equally disgusted by these murders or that you have no right to an opinion.



You're the one who is offended?  

You were the one who is now twice telling me that my opinion will change if/when I become a father.  Personally, I don't think it will.  I've got a lot of friends who are great parents who I've discussed this horrible tragedy with.  The range of opinions/emotions is broad among all of us, but I can assure you that many of the parents I've spoken with on the matter shared similar thoughts as I do.  The safety of their own children being their number one priority goes without even saying, but that doesn't mean they think armed guards is the answer.  I actually agreed with you on that one, but I don't think it's the biggest part of the solution. 

I'm not right/wrong in my opinions on what can be done about such tragedies and you're not right/wrong in your stance either.  

What is wrong is essentially invalidating the opinion of someone by saying you only feel such a way for such and such a reason, but your opinions will change down the line.   I don't do that with others and I don't appreciate it when others do that with me.


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## JimG. (Dec 14, 2012)

It's been a rough day. I've cried a few times

After a nap and a couple of drinks, I've been able to calm down.

What happened today is my only true fear in life. Babies were killed. Just thinking of their families brings me to tears again.

Sorry if anything I wrote offended anyone; didn't mean to make this political either.

Understand it certainly wasn't intentional.

I'm going to sign off for the night and have another drink.


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## Nick (Dec 14, 2012)

skiNEwhere said:


> I haven't been affected like this emotionally since 9/11, this really stuck since it happen in new england



I said exactly this today. I haven't been this affected by an event emotionally since 9/11. 

I was decorating my tree with my wife and son tonight. Well my son is just 6 months so he sat their and watched. But I couldn't get out of my head all these families having trees at home, with ornaments ... "Baby's first christmas" .... stockings hung ... presents probably already wrapped or probably getting delivered by UPS tomorrow .... and now the families have to plan a wake and a funeral ... sickening... just sickening


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## gmcunni (Dec 14, 2012)

i live in Monroe CT, we border Newtown.  i was driving thru Newtown around 10:15 this morning on my way to pick up Jake at school.  as i pulled into the gas station a state trooper flew by me.  as i was filling up a 2nd trooper went by (sirens + lights on both) i figured something must be going on, i suspected an accident on 84, which was where i was headed.  as i went to get on 84 another police car passed by flying thru a blind intersection, i was shocked that he didn't get on 84 (thinking it was accident related) but rather continued on down the road.   i flippped over to news as i got on 84 and heard what was going on. i was beyond shocked.  i can't imagine the pain the parents are going thru.


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## Mpdsnowman (Dec 14, 2012)

You know this is the first time Ive watched Rudolf the red nosed reindeer and felt sad. With what happened today, that's tough.

It scares me. My sons are the ages of the brothers involved. As a parent I worried when my kids were in elementary school and to this day I still have to worry because I am asking the same question everyone is....why?? what led that 20 year old kid to this. If the mother was alive she would probably be just as clueless to that answer as everyone else is...

I live with my two sons again their ages (the shooter and his brother who apparently is clueless too). I see fully what they do and as I can figure they are just like all the others their ages in this area. Can I feel secure that it wont happen where I live... no...So I keep asking myself these questions tonight...

Is it in the video games they play?
Is it in their social network/lifestyle?
Is it in their jobs?
Is it drugs/alcohol?
Something I could have missed along the way...what....


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## deadheadskier (Dec 15, 2012)

Mpdsnowman said:


> Is it in the video games they play?
> Is it in their social network/lifestyle?
> Is it in their jobs?
> Is it drugs/alcohol?
> Something I could have missed along the way...what....



All of those things and none of those things.  What I mean when I say all of those things, is that in certain circumstances anything can tip someone over the edge depending on the individual, yet have zero effect on most others.  When I say none of those things, I (unfortunately) mean that violence is part of human nature.  An estimated 1400 people a day are murdered world wide.  That number doesn't include war casualties.  We humans do a lot of killing.  

Guess that's why situations like today are so heartbreaking and hard to understand.  We search for answers, but there are no answers.


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## drjeff (Dec 15, 2012)

As a parent of a 1st and 3rd grader, this was so hard to take as the news reports kept coming out.  About lunchtime when the terrible details of the numbers killed and the first rumors of their ages started trickling out, I was at lunch with 8 of my employees - all of us have kids, 7 of the 9 of us have kids roughly of the age affected, we were al just beside ourselves thinking "what if..."

When I got home, the feeling I had when I hugged my kids has only been rivaled by the feeling I had when I first hugged them just moments after they were born.  A few hours later at my kids school Holiday Concert, when the kindergarten class got up to sing their songs,  it was impossible for me to not look at those 11 kids on stage singing and think that almost twice that number of innocent kids were taken today, made even tougher by the fact that this time of year for those kids (and often their parents from watching their kids) is the happiest, most exciting time of the year with Christmas and Hannukah, a time when as a parent you really do get to see the amazing excitement and joy that the innocence of youth at that age brings with it.  There was hardly a dry parents eye in the auditorium during the concert this evening, myself included.


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## riverc0il (Dec 15, 2012)

I hope it is not to early to discuss the meta, obviously still completely stunned by what happened...

...parents might feel it more immediately due to their children, but everyone feels it too, even us without children. I couldn't believe it when I heard the news. Little kids! Never thought the mass shootings would come to this.

I work in a college. I think about this stuff all the time, these shootings in academic buildings always hit close to home for me, regardless of age of the students. We have annual discussions about "what to do" situations. Mass shooters have walked into high schools, universities, malls, movie theatres, military bases, and now an elementary school.

It can happen any where and the only reason I can see for parents of young children to be more effected now, by this shooting, than by any other of these shootings, is this is the first mass shooting that I can recall in modern times in a friggin elementary school. Unreal. 

The issue hasn't changed, only the targets continue to grow more broadly. 

It would make sense that parents would feel more "intensely" since they care for the lives of young ones in addition to their own. But in today's world, this type of thing can (and continues to) happen any where people gather. People say "but what can you do" not because they don't have kids, but because of their political leanings. Which I think we should steer far away from in this thread. AZ has become particularly polarizing lately and it is not a welcome change IMO. Let's all agree this is devastating, hits far too close to home for many, is deeply concerning for us all,and leave the talk of what to do at the town meeting and the court of public opinion outside of AZ.


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## thetrailboss (Dec 15, 2012)

This year alone these shootings have happened in a movie theater, a church, and now an elementary school.  WTF?


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## Warp Daddy (Dec 15, 2012)

This unspeakable horror touches everyone in a very personal way and that is to be expected as is the search for understanding and insight. These notions and emotions make us who we are as rarional ,empathethic beings.  Truth is there are no answers ,only hypotheses. Evil exists in this world . We are neither in control now nor were we in the past, control is strictly an illusion we create to make us better assuage our fears. 

Love and empathy is all we have to combat  this kind of situation . We truly need to seek ,strive and make very effort imaginable to a kinder , gentler and more empathetic society . 

There will always be these unspeakable horrors , there will always be unstable ,sociopaths that are outliers to societal norms all we can do is to use our best instincts to try to better identify markers , behavioral and otherwise that may enable us to better predict and prevent these things from happening . this is a tall order and will require a complete rethinking of how best to manage the delivery of behavioral / mental healthrelated treatment and funding for same that may need to look at reidential facilities for those in need rather than allowing them to wander unassisted and aimless.

As a dad, grandad  and an educator my heart like all of yours is very heavy today .

Be good to each other , be kind 
Warp


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## jack97 (Dec 15, 2012)

My thoughts and heart goes out the families and friends who lost the most important things in their lives.





riverc0il said:


> ....People say "but what can you do" not because they don't have kids, but because of their political leanings. Which I think we should steer far away from in this thread. AZ has become particularly polarizing lately and it is not a welcome change IMO. Let's all agree this is devastating, hits far too close to home for many, is deeply concerning for us all,and leave the talk of what to do at the town meeting and the court of public opinion outside of AZ.




I came to this site because this does hit close to home. Not to single out river, imo, if you want to do something about this instead of talking about it. Vote! This incident goes across several polarizing topics that involves Federal, State and Town laws. As much as it pains me to read the details of the shooting, I can easily see how we have gotten to this point.


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## Geoff (Dec 15, 2012)

jack97 said:


> I came to this site because this does hit close to home. Not to single out river, imo, if you want to do something about this instead of talking about it. Vote! This incident goes across several polarizing topics that involves Federal, State and Town laws. As much as it pains me to read the details of the shooting, I can easily see how we have gotten to this point.



This is the cost for living in a free, open, laissez-faire, mostly-Libertarian society.   The mentally ill are out in the general population instead of being locked up in institutions.   If you ban guns, a mentally ill person can still make a bomb out of household chemicals using an internet recipe and kill hundreds.   What am I supposed to vote for?  To institutionalize anybody who might remotely be capable of doing something like this?   I don't think so.


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## Nick (Dec 15, 2012)

riverc0il said:


> People say "but what can you do" not because they don't have kids, but because of their political leanings. Which I think we should steer far away from in this thread. AZ has become particularly polarizing lately and it is not a welcome change IMO. Let's all agree this is devastating, hits far too close to home for many, is deeply concerning for us all,and leave the talk of what to do at the town meeting and the court of public opinion outside of AZ.



It's difficult. Stuff like this always brings out the best and the worst in people. I agree that we should keep talk of what to do out of the thread. Everyone is entitled to an opinion.


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## Nick (Dec 15, 2012)

Geoff said:


> This is the cost for living in a free, open, laissez-faire, mostly-Libertarian society.   The mentally ill are out in the general population instead of being locked up in institutions.   If you ban guns, a mentally ill person can still make a bomb out of household chemicals using an internet recipe and kill hundreds.   What am I supposed to vote for?  To institutionalize anybody who might remotely be capable of doing something like this?   I don't think so.



I read it on facebook somewhere but there are just bad people who do bad things. Where there is a will there is a way. It's unfortunate that will exists. 

On a side note, my wife is a 1st grade school teacher, and they do drills and stuff in her school, and the front doors are always locked. I always wondered, who the hell would ever attack an elementary school?? 

I am still in a total state of disbelief.


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## jack97 (Dec 15, 2012)

Nick said:


> On a side note, my wife is a 1st grade school teacher, and they do drills and stuff in her school, and the front doors are always locked. I always wondered, who the hell would ever attack an elementary school??



The middle school where my daughter use to go had a glass front door while the elementary school had a window partitioned front desk. The weapons used most likely would have shattered the door.


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## o3jeff (Dec 15, 2012)

Looks like the president possibly is/has stopping by, a couple Chinooks and some Hueys flew overhead about 2 hours ago and a few more just went by now.


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## Bumpsis (Dec 16, 2012)

Geoff said:


> This is the cost for living in a free, open, laissez-faire, mostly-Libertarian society. The mentally ill are out in the general population instead of being locked up in institutions. If you ban guns, a mentally ill person can still make a bomb out of household chemicals using an internet recipe and kill hundreds. What am I supposed to vote for? To institutionalize anybody who might remotely be capable of doing something like this? I don't think so.



This is exactly the kind of thinking that perpetuates this nightmare from one mass shoothing to another. Yeah, Geoff, tell one of these parents whose child's brains got splattered on the wall that it's OK because the tree of liberty needed to be watered with the blood of their kid.  
What kind of freedom is this when we have to live under the terror of a gun? 
People should read this: http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/newsdesk/2012/12/newtown-and-the-madness-of-guns.html


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## deadheadskier (Dec 16, 2012)

I'm not a gun owner.  I'm also not sure stricter gun control will prevent psychopaths like Adam Lanza from doing the unthinkable.

Look at Norway's gun laws



> To own a gun in Norway, one must document a use for the gun. By far the most common grounds for civilian ownership are hunting and sports shooting, in that order. Other needs can include special guard duties or self defence, but the first is rare unless the person shows identification confirming that he or she is a trained guard or member of a law-enforcement agency and the second is practically never accepted as a reason for gun ownership.




FAR stricter than the US.

Yet, Anders Breivik found a way to shoot and kill 69 people, most of them teenagers.  Keep in mind he also killed 8 others with a bomb constructed of fertilizer and fuel oil.  

What law would've stopped such a monster?


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## jack97 (Dec 16, 2012)

deadheadskier said:


> I'm not a gun owner. I'm also not sure stricter gun control will prevent psychopaths like Adam Lanza from doing the unthinkable.
> 
> Look at Norway's gun laws
> 
> ...




Yes, a law by itself would not stop a monster. However keep this in mind, Norway only had one mass shooting in recent times, we had 8 so far in 2012, btw, changing the threshold of the number killed can make the number smaller however it makes no difference to the victims and the people who lost love ones. Below is a 30 year time line of mass shootings in the US;

http://www.alternet.org/61-30-years-timeline-mass-shootings-america




This a complex issue which cover several topics and without going into opinions, I'll try to point out some more facts;

Weapons tech has increased significantly since our founding fathers wrote the Constitution which gives us the right to bear arm. Currently, the rifles and hand guns are far more powerful and effective for killing than the "arms" available to people back when the second amendment was written. 

Due to budget cuts in the 80s, MA state mental hospital had to close. 

Mental health coverage is limited among health insurance providers and that's assuming you do have insurance. Paying out of pocket is an expensive option.


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## marcski (Dec 16, 2012)

It might not have prevented this but it would have been a lot more difficult if his mother didn't keep guns at home.  And a semi-automatic rifle?  What is the purpose of having a weapon like that.  They don't call it a semi-automatic PROTECTION rifle.  It's an assault weapon.  I'm not a hunter but I'd imagine an automatic weapon takes the challenge out of it.  And.....she kept the guns in her home when she knew her son was off?  

Gun control will not prevent all tragedies but don't kid yourself....it would certainly curb some of the violence.  Countries with strict gun control laws just don't have as many shootings the we do here in the USA.


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## Nick (Dec 16, 2012)

Do you guys remember this from a few years ago? 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beslan_school_hostage_crisis


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## Scruffy (Dec 16, 2012)

My heart is saddened as everyone's is.

This gunman may have been a particularly odd person from the reports so far, but in all these mass shooting cases it seems there is a loner, or someone who was teased and bullied.  With the violence lust in our society, and easy access to weapons ( be it guns or home made bombs from instruction on the web ) this nation needs to take seriously the issue of teaching our children assimilation and socialization skills, including how to handle rejection, from the earliest age. I believe this needs to be a top priority for schools, equal to learning the core curricula. Not one single kid should grow up alone or bullied. The media and entertainment segment needs to take some responsibility too, it is sickening how dripped in guns, violence, revenge, etc .. our entertainment is. And we feed our kids these images and messages every day.


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## jack97 (Dec 16, 2012)

Nick said:


> Do you guys remember this from a few years ago?
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beslan_school_hostage_crisis



That was a carefully organize plan by a separatist terrorist group from Chechen. They used the same approach by some extremist Palestinian groups where children or teenagers were specifically targeted. In Israel, these forms of terror have anger the population to point of share hatred. 

btw, what's the point?


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## jack97 (Dec 16, 2012)

Scruffy said:


> The media and entertainment segment needs to take some responsibility too, it is sickening how dripped in guns, violence, revenge, etc .. our entertainment is. And we feed our kids these images and messages every day.



in Japan, the media is just as and in some subject matters more violent. The have a storied past of total warfare where relatives and friends of the defeated share the same fate. Yet they do not commit as many crimes as in the US.


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## gmcunni (Dec 16, 2012)

learned this morning that our town will host the kids from Sandy Hook Elementary in one of our school buildings so they can start getting back to some sense of normalcy.


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## Scruffy (Dec 16, 2012)

jack97 said:


> in Japan, the media is just as and in some subject matters more violent. The have a storied past of total warfare where relatives and friends of the defeated share the same fate. Yet they do not commit as many crimes as in the US.



Ok, then what is Japan doing differently that their kids can view violence and not make it an option for their reality?


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## Nick (Dec 16, 2012)

jack97 said:


> That was a carefully organize plan by a separatist terrorist group from Chechen. They used the same approach by some extremist Palestinian groups where children or teenagers were specifically targeted. In Israel, these forms of terror have anger the population to point of share hatred.
> 
> btw, what's the point?



The point of that? Nothing other than that that was the only mass incident I could recall that involved kids and it was also horrific.


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## Nick (Dec 16, 2012)

gmcunni said:


> learned this morning that our town will host the kids from Sandy Hook Elementary in one of our school buildings so they can start getting back to some sense of normalcy.



That's nice .... I wonder what normalcy means now for those kids .... how the heck does a 6 year old even begin to process this ?


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## Nick (Dec 16, 2012)

PS Guys - let's keep the conversation in this thread to Sandy Hook and the victims specifically. This isn't the place for a debate on guns. Take it elsewhere.


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## legalskier (Dec 20, 2012)

Spread the word.


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## ScottySkis (Dec 20, 2012)

legalskier said:


> Spread the word.



+10000000000000000000000000000000000.


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## witch hobble (Dec 21, 2012)

Well.....with apologies to you responsible gun owners out there.....NRA's contribution was not meaningful, was not a conversation, was off the charts tone-deaf.

An arms race?  In elementary schools?


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## dmc (Dec 21, 2012)

My band is doing this on Saturday.
Bands are encouraged to stop playing at 10pm for a moment of silence..
After we will break into Ripple followed by SoulShine... 



> *Nationwide Musicians' Moment of Silence*
> 
> As our nation continues to mourn the senseless violence that claimed so many innocent lives in Newtown, Connecticut last Friday, musicians around the country will unite in a moment of memorial silence. As representatives of our communities and of the wider community of musicians, performers will join in a minute of silence at all live musical performances Saturday, December 22, 2012 to honor the memories of those killed.
> 
> All musicians are asked to observe one minute of silence at every musical performance in the USA at 10:00 PM Saturday, December 22nd, 2012 in whatever time zone in the USA they are performing. Broadway and show communities nationwide could also observe one minute of silence prior to Saturday evening's shows.


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## snoseek (Dec 21, 2012)

dmc said:


> My band is doing this on Saturday.
> Bands are encouraged to stop playing at 10pm for a moment of silence..
> After we will break into Ripple followed by SoulShine...




that's awesome!!! Good song selection also, ripple is sort of a tear jerker on its own, beautiful song


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## bigbog (Dec 24, 2012)

witch hobble said:


> Well.....with apologies to you responsible gun owners out there.....NRA's contribution was not meaningful, was not a conversation, was off the charts tone-deaf.
> 
> An arms race?  In elementary schools?



Yeah, the NRA's leaders are real works of doubletalk.....but then, so aren't some of our elected(and paid for) fearless leaders...y/n?
Agree about the part of immature minds owning, who are lacking in confidence.....often snap with revenge with the greatest item of power = a gun....but an adult being threatened by grade schoolers when out of sight for most of the time?  I get sick of the political posturing of our elected when they attempt to be THE Architect of THE definitive answer....like how about All Of The Above...?
The mother & father's irresponsibility as parents(married or not) is unreal....and I'm not through ruling out the ex in playing a part of the kid shooting the mother.  When kids are vulnerable, with a lack of self-esteem + chemical imbalance, their minds can be twisted by a hostile ex....just sayin', no evidence right now.  Build up his self-esteem by taking out of school..y/n?? AND introduce him to firearms!...?????(Whew...NOT the way to go..imho).
Apologize for all the edits along the way tonight...


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## FRITOLAYGUY (Dec 25, 2012)

Its not guns, its not video games,  i think it all starts at home..   I laugh everytime i hear someone say ohhhh were gonna change the laws yada yada umm guess what criminals dont follow laws so hows that gonna help again?


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