# anybody remember harts?



## faceplant (Feb 1, 2010)

there was a time when i'd say every 4th or 5th ski you'd see on the hill was a hart
then one day, you looked around and.....they disappeared...not a one to be seen any where....gonzo 
wth   :-?  
what happened?
nowadays you see them on tv in the aerials
or mebbe the bump events
but it seems like they made a decision somewhere along the way to go niche
website still offers all mountains, etc....
but you never see them on the hill any more


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## marcus1 (Feb 1, 2010)

I remember them, they were huge back in the day. I still see them but not as much. I guess they were like Puma sneakers.......big then and not so big now.


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## ski_resort_observer (Feb 1, 2010)

My Hart Mercury's were my first metal ski in circa 1966. I remember them being a dark mustard color.


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## Masskier (Feb 1, 2010)

I remember them, back in1977 I drove cross country with a buddy, he had a pair of Hart comps.  We were partying at Vail on New Years eve, when we came out from the bar, someone had stolen them, right off the rack on the car.  He was really bumed


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## mondeo (Feb 1, 2010)

Hmm, I seem to have seen a pair of Harts recently...

My understanding is they basically went out of business for a while (10 years or so?) and then someone else bought the brand to bring it back. Just a couple years in, focusing on bump skis at the moment, probably because that's the last place they were big.

I have seen some of the freestyle skis around, but for park users the name doesn't have any recognition. They're just another new company for a large number of skiers.


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## SkiDork (Feb 1, 2010)

my 1st pair of skis were Hart Mercurys too,  White, 150s,  Had Cubco bindings on leather buckle Henke boots


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## Philpug (Feb 1, 2010)

Faintly.


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## deadheadskier (Feb 1, 2010)

Hart and Kastle should combine forces......


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## crank (Feb 1, 2010)

Philpug said:


> Faintly.



Phil hearts Harts.  At least he did in recent memory.

I myself had a pair of hart Spoilers and later, Javelins - which were way to much ski for me at the time.


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## faceplant (Feb 1, 2010)

SkiDork said:


> my 1st pair of skis were Hart Mercurys too,  White, 150s,  Had Cubco bindings on leather buckle Henke boots



cubcos...nice
wasnt there motto 'unsafe at any speed'  
wait, that was the Corvair   :smile:

ugliest bindings ever made


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## Philpug (Feb 1, 2010)

deadheadskier said:


> Hart and Kastle should combine forces......



Oh, the things I could say here...


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## marcski (Feb 2, 2010)

deadheadskier said:


> Hart and Kastle should combine forces......



Kastle made great skis back in the day...and apparently are making some pretty fun and very nice free-ride skis again.  I have heard great things but I have not been on them.


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## SkiDork (Feb 2, 2010)

faceplant said:


> cubcos...nice
> wasnt there motto 'unsafe at any speed'
> wait, that was the Corvair   :smile:
> 
> ugliest bindings ever made





the worst thing were those plates you had to screw into your boots


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## deadheadskier (Feb 2, 2010)

Philpug said:


> Oh, the things I could say here...



my suggestion was purely based on two companies that used to be quite popular, went out of business, but have come back with some well respected new products that while apparently excellent; are flying under the radar.


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## Trekchick (Feb 2, 2010)

marcski said:


> Kastle made great skis back in the day...and apparently are making some pretty fun and very nice free-ride skis again.  I have heard great things but I have not been on them.


That's a huge understatement.


My two primary "go to" skis are Hart Beats and Kastle FX84's.
Love my Hart Beats for front side groomers, but the Kastles are my WOW factor ski, seriously!

Check out my user review here


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## JD (Feb 2, 2010)

Hart freestyles were my first ski...


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## legalskier (Feb 2, 2010)

I remember Harts. 
Also, there were Spalding Squadras, Kneissl White Stars and Olin Mark IVs. All good skis, all gone now.


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## HD333 (Feb 2, 2010)

What ever happened to PRE?  They still make stuff?


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## marcski (Feb 2, 2010)

legalskier said:


> I remember Harts.
> Also, there were Spalding Squadras, Kneissl White Stars and Olin Mark IVs. All good skis, all gone now.



My brother had a pair of Spaldings back in the day.  They delaminated after about 7 days on the hill.


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## JimG. (Feb 2, 2010)

I had a pair of Hart mogul skis back in the early 90's.

Great ski.

I am currently looking into buying a new pair of Hart F17's. Another nice mogul ski.


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## jaywbigred (Feb 2, 2010)

My Mom still has her old Harts, which I picked out for her, in the garage. My first "cap" ski was by Kastle, following a traditional pair with a fluorescent bottom from Dynamic. Its like every company I chose was cursed. 

I saw a girl on the lift at Mt. Snow this weekend who had Yamaha skis. Can't say that I ever really put my finger on them as a snow ski brand before.


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## WakeboardMom (Feb 2, 2010)

legalskier said:


> I remember Harts.
> Also, there were Spalding Squadras, Kneissl White Stars and Olin Mark IVs. All good skis, all gone now.



Head Masters.

Not sure who here would be old enough to remember those.


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## deadheadskier (Feb 2, 2010)

jaywbigred said:


> following a traditional pair with a fluorescent bottom from Dynamic. Its like every company I chose was cursed.
> .



Dynamic VR27 was one of the best skis I ever owned.....the old Black and Gold ones.  Had them when I was a freshman in High School.

I bought some of their last production models in the mid-90s....fluorescent tops, bottoms, everything.  Still got them and they will eventually be made into a chair.

I recall Dynamic made a small come back a few years back, but didn't do well.


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## Philpug (Feb 2, 2010)

Unfortunately I don't have time to add to this thread, but needless to say..it would be a lot.


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## SkiDork (Feb 2, 2010)

Philpug said:


> Unfortunately I don't have time to add to this thread, but needless to say..it would be a lot.



When you get some time, it would be great to hear what you have.


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## ski_resort_observer (Feb 2, 2010)

deadheadskier said:


> Dynamic VR27 was one of the best skis I ever owned.....the old Black and Gold ones.  Had them when I was a freshman in High School.
> 
> I bought some of their last production models in the mid-90s....fluorescent tops, bottoms, everything.  Still got them and they will eventually be made into a chair.
> 
> I recall Dynamic made a small come back a few years back, but didn't do well.



Those were great skis DHS! I got these for free from a college buddy when he moved back to Florida. Circa 1985 model. 200cm  I skied on them for around 15 years. Don't know why I keep my old skis....these have been where you see them now for years.


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## skimawk (Feb 2, 2010)

JD said:


> Hart freestyles were my first ski...



My most favorite skis when I was younger.  Had Look Nevada bindings with leather run away strap.

Check out www.hartskis.com  A few dealers in New England

I am working at a major Colorado resort and see a few instructors on the new Hart skis.


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## Philpug (Feb 2, 2010)

skimawk said:


> My most favorite skis when I was younger.  Had Look Nevada bindings with leather run away strap.
> 
> Check out www.hartskis.com  A few dealers in New England
> 
> I am working at a major Colorado resort and see a few instructors on the new Hart skis.



Bob Barnes at Keystone is sporting them along with Jerry Berg at Vail.


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## mondeo (Feb 2, 2010)

I just wish I had known of the Hart durability issues before I bought mine.


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## deadheadskier (Feb 2, 2010)

mondeo said:


> I just wish I had known of the Hart durability issues before I bought mine.



You've broken Cabrawlers and Twisters in less than a calender year and you didn't bother to research the durability of your F17s?????  :???:


That is VERY unengineerlike.


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## powhunter (Feb 2, 2010)

deadheadskier said:


> You've broken Cabrawlers and Twisters in less than a calender year and you didn't bother to research the durability of your F17s?????  :???:
> 
> 
> That is VERY unengineerlike.




Wow I thought he was a rocket scientist


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## deadheadskier (Feb 2, 2010)

powhunter said:


> Wow I thought he was a rocket scientist



:lol:


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## MR. evil (Feb 2, 2010)

mondeo said:


> I just wish I had known of the Hart durability issues before I bought mine.



If you want to unload those peices of junk I will take them off your hands.....cheaply of course.


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## mondeo (Feb 2, 2010)

deadheadskier said:


> You've broken Cabrawlers and Twisters in less than a calender year and you didn't bother to research the durability of your F17s?????  :???:
> 
> 
> That is VERY unengineerlike.


I was only about 10 hours away from being a year separated between breaks. But everything I had heard about the F17s before I bought them was that they were built stronger, more durable, etc. Then I buy them, and it's like a switch, 4 different people tell me about them breaking.

They do break, and DMC will be very mad at me for my trying to put a ski company out of business.


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## Boardguy (Feb 2, 2010)

WakeboardMom said:


> Head Masters.
> 
> Not sure who here would be old enough to remember those.



Me - got a pair in the attic. They were my second pair of skis. After went on to a pair of Head 720s.


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## powhunter (Feb 2, 2010)

mondeo said:


> I was only about 10 hours away from being a year separated between breaks. But everything I had heard about the F17s before I bought them was that they were built stronger, more durable, etc. Then I buy them, and it's like a switch, 4 different people tell me about them breaking.
> 
> They do break, and DMC will be very mad at me for my trying to put a ski company out of business.




Akisan2 from the mogul boarf FD his up when we were out at hood last summer, and those bumps were real soft...I was going the F17 route myself but went with the twisters after all the good stuff I heard


steveo


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## mondeo (Feb 2, 2010)

I am hoping it's due to them being handmade, and variation in the process. People think handmade=better, but in a lot of cases it just means inconsistency.


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## x10003q (Feb 3, 2010)

jaywbigred said:


> My Mom still has her old Harts, which I picked out for her, in the garage. My first "cap" ski was by Kastle, following a traditional pair with a fluorescent bottom from Dynamic. Its like every company I chose was cursed.
> 
> I saw a girl on the lift at Mt. Snow this weekend who had Yamaha skis. Can't say that I ever really put my finger on them as a snow ski brand before.



I had a pair of Yamaha Paramounts in the mid 1970s mounted with red Look Nevadas. The Paramounts were Yamaha's racing series. I think Yamaha was a pool supplier for the USST and I remember some team members used Yamahas (maybe Suzy Corrock?)


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## x10003q (Feb 3, 2010)

deadheadskier said:


> Dynamic VR27 was one of the best skis I ever owned.....the old Black and Gold ones.  Had them when I was a freshman in High School.
> 
> I bought some of their last production models in the mid-90s....fluorescent tops, bottoms, everything.  Still got them and they will eventually be made into a chair.
> 
> I recall Dynamic made a small come back a few years back, but didn't do well.



I still have my salmon colored 1986 VR27 210 Geant mounted with pink Geze racing bindings. These skiis were awesome. They were only happy when theu were going over 40mph.:grin:


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## SKIQUATTRO (Feb 3, 2010)

noticed alot of hats at Smuggs, even most of the patrollers were donning hats....


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## Rushski (Feb 3, 2010)

Hart Gremlins were THE rental equipment in the early 80s.  And yes, they usually had those horrendous plate bindings.


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## SkiDork (Feb 3, 2010)

Rushski said:


> Hart Gremlins were THE rental equipment in the early 80s.  And yes, they usually had those horrendous plate bindings.



Spademans or Cubcos?


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## 180 (Feb 3, 2010)

I have mixed feelings.  My son spencer has broken 2 pair of F17jr this year.  The company claims they are not competition mogul skis, but they replaced the first pair no problem.  They say he is too good and strong and they want me to upgrade to the adult.  That's a lot of dough for a 10 year to run through the rocks on.

On the other hand, I have a pair of Classic F17 175 and they are great.  fast turning and great edge hold, even at high speed.  If you can get a good price, pick them up.


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## SkiDork (Feb 3, 2010)

180 said:


> I have mixed feelings.  My son spencer has broken 2 pair of F17jr this year.  The company claims they are not competition mogul skis, but they replaced the first pair no problem.  They say he is too good and strong and they want me to upgrade to the adult.  That's a lot of dough for a 10 year to run through the rocks on.
> 
> On the other hand, I have a pair of Classic F17 175 and they are great.  fast turning and great edge hold, even at high speed.  If you can get a good price, pick them up.




Al - definitely check the Rossi Phantoms like I posted on mogulskiing.  Iceman pounded on those and they held up.


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## 180 (Feb 3, 2010)

Thanks for the heads up, searching for them now.


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## SkiDork (Feb 3, 2010)

180 said:


> Thanks for the heads up, searching for them now.



I put a link up on mogulskiing.


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## Madroch (Feb 3, 2010)

Hart Rabbits- first pair-- 150 I think


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## legalskier (Feb 3, 2010)

deadheadskier said:


> Dynamic VR27 was one of the best skis I ever owned.....the old Black and Gold ones.  Had them when I was a freshman in High School.



Dynamic seemed to be big with racers back then. Dynamic skis, Look bindings and Lange boots were a popular combination. 
I heard that Dynamic morphed into Dynastar at some point, so I researched it, and came up with this:

_I noticed the first pair of skis related to Dynastar in 1963 in the window of Alson Sports in Morzine, France. It was then branded “Starflex” and the model name was “Compound RG5,” the top was black phenol with clear resin sidewalls showing the fiberglass weaving. The product was made by a company called “Les Plastiques Synthétiques.” These, aside from the “Fiberglass Jean Vuarnet” by Rossignol, were the first non-traditional wood or metal skis that I had ever seen. At the same time, Dynamic skis, which only made wood skis turned to Les Plastiques Synthétiques to design and develop its first torsion-box fiberglass ski for the 1964 Olympic Winter Games and the product that came out of that collaboration was no other than the now famous Dynamic VR7. For those sticklers with details, the “RG5” moniker meant “resin-glass, five years of development” while “VR7” almost meant the same in French with “verre-résine,” but this time the development time had somehow been bumped to seven years…What’s more astonishing is that* the Sallanches manufacturer wanted to create a legacy out of its collaborative work with Dynamic by subsequently changing its name from Starflex to Dynastar, a contraction between Dynamic and Starflex*; it even stuck with the same lettering style...._ 


So there you have it. He throws in a tidbit about Kerma poles too:

_Claude Joseph, the French distributor of Marker bindings, who at some point had his fingers into Starflex, named his line of ski poles Kerma, just by turning the Mar-ker name around! _

http://skis-dynastar.blogspot.com/2009/02/beginning.html


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## Black Phantom (Feb 3, 2010)

SKIQUATTRO said:


> noticed alot of hats at Smuggs, even most of the patrollers were donning hats....



I prefer hats myself.


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## Brownsville Brooklyn (Feb 3, 2010)

*yep....orange in 1994 or so....*

the guy at peak performace, not fred, still remembers them....


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## JimG. (Feb 3, 2010)

180 said:


> I have mixed feelings.  My son spencer has broken 2 pair of F17jr this year.  The company claims they are not competition mogul skis, but they replaced the first pair no problem.  They say he is too good and strong and they want me to upgrade to the adult.  That's a lot of dough for a 10 year to run through the rocks on.
> 
> On the other hand, I have a pair of Classic F17 175 and they are great.  fast turning and great edge hold, even at high speed.  If you can get a good price, pick them up.



Heh...I figured those were Spencer's or Shea's skis when I saw them in Keith's shop.

He gave me the same speech about the kids versus adult versions.

Then he offered me the proform price on the stock he has gathering dust, exactly what you paid.

I just wish he had a pair of 180's for me, but I still might settle for the 175's.


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## mikestaple (Feb 4, 2010)

I flipped open the local weekly paper yesterday and saw that local kid Mike (Mark?) Mosley had made the Olympics mogul team.  In this hands - a pair of Hart skis.

So there are out there and apparently will be used in the Olympics.


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## SkiDork (Feb 4, 2010)

mikestaple said:


> I flipped open the local weekly paper yesterday and saw that local kid Mike (Mark?) Mosley had made the Olympics mogul team.  In this hands - a pair of Hart skis.
> 
> So there are out there and apparently will be used in the Olympics.



Michael Morse







http://www.usskiteam.com/freestyle/athletes/athlete?athleteId=1116

He's actually the oldest on the team


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## Trekchick (Feb 4, 2010)

Julie at Hart is posting in a thread on EpicSki, with some pretty interesting .........well, you be the judge.

I know some of you are members there.  Now is the time to ask if you wanna ask.
http://www.epicski.com/forum/thread/91506/hart-phoenix-any-one-on-this


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## lion833 (Feb 4, 2010)

Black Phantom said:


> I prefer hats myself.



can't agree more.


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## Philpug (Feb 4, 2010)

That IS Michael Morse, real nice guy.


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## Philpug (Feb 4, 2010)

Trekchick said:


> Julie at Hart is posting in a thread on EpicSki, with some pretty interesting .........well, you be the judge.
> 
> I know some of you are members there.  Now is the time to ask if you wanna ask.
> http://www.epicski.com/forum/thread/91506/hart-phoenix-any-one-on-this



Now is your chance!


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## Brownsville Brooklyn (Feb 4, 2010)

SkiDork said:


> Michael Moore /QUOTE]


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## faceplant (Feb 4, 2010)

Trekchick said:


> Julie at Hart is posting in a thread on EpicSki, with some pretty interesting .........well, you be the judge.
> 
> I know some of you are members there.  Now is the time to ask if you wanna ask.
> http://www.epicski.com/forum/thread/91506/hart-phoenix-any-one-on-this



just read thru it....thanks for the tip TC
sure answers alot of questions i had
a ski company bought out by a food company?!
no wonder there 40% market share went poof, what a waste
now there's '*h*art' USA and also '*H*art' Japan....thats whacky 
but if it means a good old ski company can make a come back i'm all for it
good luck 'hart'...........


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## mondeo (Feb 4, 2010)

faceplant said:


> just read thru it....thanks for the tip TC
> sure answers alot of questions i had
> a ski company bought out by a food company?!
> no wonder there 40% market share went poof, what a waste
> ...


Didn't realize that about the Hart Japan...which makes the F17s, a very common ski for WCers. That explains that.


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## Trekchick (Feb 5, 2010)

Mondeo, glad you seized the chance to put your concern out there.

I think Philpug posted about the two different versions of competition bump skis that Hart is producing(he'll correct me if I'm wrong, because he likes to do that )

There is the Original F17 that has been talked about the past few years then there is the one that has the Patrick Denean influence in design.
I had a chance to see the PD influenced bump ski and its really nice, not that I'm going to buy one, but it was nice to see it first hand.


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## Philpug (Feb 5, 2010)

Hart is producing 4 different F17's. 

*Junior *which comes from Head, IMHO, it is not enough ski quality and performance wise for it's application as a mogul ski. These I have been hearing have been breaking a lot. 

*F17 (148-168cm)* a Blossom ski, I forget the exact dim's but a but more shape that most bumpers want.

*F17 (175-191)* Another Blossom ski, but is a rebadged GS ski with layers of Titanal, this si shte ski that Michael Morse is skiing and won the US Nationals on.

*F17 WC* Patrick designed this ski and it mirrors the Dynastar Twister in dimensions but this ski is made by Blossom too, similar to the other Blossom skis in quality but no metal.


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## SkiDork (Feb 5, 2010)

interesting Phil.  Question:  Who/What is Blossom?


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## Philpug (Feb 5, 2010)

SkiDork said:


> interesting Phil.  Question:  Who/What is Blossom?



Blossom is an Italian manufacturer that works out of the old Spaulding factory. The were making Nordicas race skis along with currently making skis for Hart, Vist, Spoilt and even some from PMGEar.


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## SIKSKIER (Feb 5, 2010)

Don't forget about the honecomb sandwich Hexels.I had a pair of Hexelerators.They weigh about as much as my ski poles.:x


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## bosrocker51 (Feb 7, 2010)

I saw an antique pair of Hart Javelins at Stratton last year (2/09). The skis were in great shape for such an old pair of skis. I commented on them to the guy who had them...

I had a pair of old Harts w a SN of 1004. I think they were the 4th pair they made for the market. Those skis had a very very very slow base on them, maybe fiberglass. It wasn't PTex. It also would NOT hold wax at all. 

I used to ski on a pair of 165cm Hart Performers with Geze plate bindings when I was a ski patroller.


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## 180 (Feb 7, 2010)

I have the 175 Harts.  Had some trouble in the ice bumps today.  Went back out on my 1080 moguls.  Much happier.  The Harts are more all around ski than the 1080s.  Just  my $.02.  

Up to today I was really happy on the Harts.  Might be my sore knees.


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