# Mt Snow 21-22 Season



## sugarbushskier (Nov 15, 2021)

Thought I'd update this thread for the current season as Mt Snow will probably be my first area to hit this year.

Are they going to make opening day? I'm tentatively shooting for a midweek day just after Thanksgiving, perhaps the 29th or 30th, but don't know if there is going to be much open.  As long as there are a couple of options down I can live with it for day one. It looks like weather will hold once we get past this Wednesday/Thursday warm blip. How much time do they need to cover a few trails including something on the North Face?

Anyone have any first hand intel of current progress?


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## IceEidolon (Nov 15, 2021)

It depends a lot on how wide they want to spread themselves, how thin they'll leave a trail before they move on. They have the firepower to put a lot of water down fast, especially below 20 degrees. I don't know how aggressive Vail will be.


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## icecoast1 (Nov 15, 2021)

You should be fine by then.   Opening day on Friday isn't looking very promising though, unless it gets colder then the forecast shows at night this week and/or they decide to do northface only


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## IceEidolon (Nov 15, 2021)

icecoast1 said:


> You should be fine by then.   Opening day on Friday isn't looking very promising though, unless it gets colder then the forecast shows at night this week and/or they decide to do northface only


North Face doesn't have many or any fan guns. The front face does. In marginal, there's no reason not to run both since they aren't both using compressed air and Snow has basically an ocean and the pumps to move it. Now, committing full power with the old air water guns to both would be a stretch, but they should be able to do *something* on the front in any scenario.


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## icecoast1 (Nov 15, 2021)

IceEidolon said:


> North Face doesn't have many or any fan guns. The front face does. In marginal, there's no reason not to run both since they aren't both using compressed air and Snow has basically an ocean and the pumps to move it. Now, committing full power with the old air water guns to both would be a stretch, but they should be able to do *something* on the front in any scenario.




It has more to do with elevation and temperature than anything, a couple of years ago pre pandemic and pre vail take over they opened with just Free Fall on the North Face and a goat path down the main face solely for the purposes of getting people down without downloading.   They were actively telling people to stay on the north face until they were ready to call it quits for the day


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## IceEidolon (Nov 15, 2021)

In the context of post Thanksgiving skiing, though, they'll have been making snow on the front and north faces, not delaying front face progress to get north face open. Whether they get the front face for day 1 or not, it'll be in progress very shortly and opening for the 28/29 window shouldn't be an issue. Whether there are multiple runs by then is more up in the air.


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## Newpylong (Nov 15, 2021)

IceEidolon said:


> North Face doesn't have many or any fan guns. The front face does. In marginal, there's no reason not to run both since they aren't both using compressed air and Snow has basically an ocean and the pumps to move it. Now, committing full power with the old air water guns to both would be a stretch, but they should be able to do *something* on the front in any scenario.



They don't have any air hogs and haven't for nearly a decade since handing them over to Efficiency VT.

No fans on NF.  All IMP12s.


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## IceEidolon (Nov 16, 2021)

Define air hog, please - I'm including mid energy guns like the new nozzle Ratnik baby SG2, which as of maybe three years ago they did have on site but may not have been using. I can dig up pictures.


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## drjeff (Nov 16, 2021)

IceEidolon said:


> Define air hog, please - I'm including mid energy guns like the new nozzle Ratnik baby SG2, which as of maybe three years ago they did have on site but may not have been using. I can dig up pictures.



Mount Snow switched out if not all, then basically all of the Rat's they got via the efficiency VT grant just a year or 2 after they got them in favor of either the HKD Impulses or some Snowlogic DV4's.  The rat's.  while using less air than the older guns they replaced, still used more air than the HKD's and Snow Logics', so I guess the Rats were more of a "mid E" gun whereas the HKD's and Snow Logic's are "low E" guns with respect to how much air they need to get the desired product.

There may still be a dual Rat in/around/mounted to the Summit pumphouse building area. I know there was one in the past (although what defines the past vs present certainly gets a little foggier over the years in the memory     )


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## IceEidolon (Nov 16, 2021)

I have pictures of multiple portable Ratniks after 2017 back in their ops area. I'm not claiming they are regularly used, but there's still at least a large handful of 'em that made it through to the Vail purchase. I'm aware of the Great Snowgun Roundup that rendered many species of snowguns functionally extinct - these were the survivors.

Regardless, North Face and Main Face should both be able to run at minimum one route TTB without running out of air or water.


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## FBGM (Nov 16, 2021)

Let’s be real. They probably don’t have staff to make snow right now. And old Peaks put in all those fans with no coms and no auto. Idiots.


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## drjeff (Nov 16, 2021)

IceEidolon said:


> I have pictures of multiple portable Ratniks after 2017 back in their ops area. I'm not claiming they are regularly used, but there's still at least a large handful of 'em that made it through to the Vail purchase. I'm aware of the Great Snowgun Roundup that rendered many species of snowguns functionally extinct - these were the survivors.
> 
> Regardless, North Face and Main Face should both be able to run at minimum one route TTB without running out of air or water.



Since air is more of the limting factor over water most of the time in the early season push to open, they haven't had any issues with the low e guns they have on the typical early season opening routes that use them (Long John from the Summit down to the top of Carinthia, Cascade down to basically the top of Canyon Quad, River Run as well as either Freefall or Chute on the Northface), so as long as they have the staff to run them, once Mother nature gets a bit more cooperative with some extended, good wet bulb temps, I wouldn't suspect that this year would be any different in what they can cover of their air/water terrain


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## IceEidolon (Nov 16, 2021)

FBGM said:


> Let’s be real. They probably don’t have staff to make snow right now. And old Peaks put in all those fans with no coms and no auto. Idiots.


Huge price difference between auto and manual, and there's a dead zone where you can spend millions automating and still need a full size crew to handle North/South face plus monitoring on the main face. Given the choice between automating 1/3 the area or getting fully into modern manual equipment and incrementally swapping that for autos later, especially when you're able to pass surplus manual equipment to other properties you own? Yeah, I'd pick full coverage too.

That said, auto guns are definitely the way to go eventually. It's just that the jump from old tech up to modern manual gear is huge and the gains from automating aren't as big - especially when you aren't having trouble hiring multiple big shifts of snowmakers.


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## Newpylong (Nov 16, 2021)

IceEidolon said:


> Define air hog, please - I'm including mid energy guns like the new nozzle Ratnik baby SG2, which as of maybe three years ago they did have on site but may not have been using. I can dig up pictures.


I do not include Ratnik's current (Mid-E) offerings or a baby snow giant with upgraded nozzles as neither are really air hogs.

The majority of them along with the SR7s were largely gone by 2014 with the efficiency VT program. A few could have been kept as a layaway plan for a bit for sure. We did that too and we still busted them out  Options are good.


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## Newpylong (Nov 16, 2021)

IceEidolon said:


> Huge price difference between auto and manual, and there's a dead zone where you can spend millions automating and still need a full size crew to handle North/South face plus monitoring on the main face. Given the choice between automating 1/3 the area or getting fully into modern manual equipment and incrementally swapping that for autos later, especially when you're able to pass surplus manual equipment to other properties you own? Yeah, I'd pick full coverage too.
> 
> That said, auto guns are definitely the way to go eventually. It's just that the jump from old tech up to modern manual gear is huge and the gains from automating aren't as big - especially when you aren't having trouble hiring multiple big shifts of snowmakers.



This x 2. Several areas have decided to hop on the automated bandwagon just to go back to manual. The equipment sits there unused. 

The way to go is to modernize your entire footprint as best as possible with top of the line manual (passing the older equipment down to lower priority terrain, or other mountains), and possibly automating the acreage that is resurfaced consistently. 

If you have modern fixed equipment, decent hose, and good hydrants, two guys walking a trail is a hell of a lot cheaper.


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## FBGM (Nov 16, 2021)

IceEidolon said:


> Huge price difference between auto and manual, and there's a dead zone where you can spend millions automating and still need a full size crew to handle North/South face plus monitoring on the main face. Given the choice between automating 1/3 the area or getting fully into modern manual equipment and incrementally swapping that for autos later, especially when you're able to pass surplus manual equipment to other properties you own? Yeah, I'd pick full coverage too.
> 
> That said, auto guns are definitely the way to go eventually. It's just that the jump from old tech up to modern manual gear is huge and the gains from automating aren't as big - especially when you aren't having trouble hiring multiple big shifts of snowmakers.


They should have at least ran conduit to everything during install to think ahead. No idea why they didn’t. I’m guessing money or just no one there to think next step. 

I’ve installed many. But always full auto with Coms and systems already in place. It’s all been new construction with big budgets.


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## IceEidolon (Nov 16, 2021)

3x - 14x the air for the same water as a V3 or an Impulse is still pretty inefficient, for the Ratnik. 

An area's first auto trail is a huge step up - even a couple auto fans capable of remote start for an unload or a pain point free up a pair of guys to go do something useful. A whole trail means you can do something with your pumps while your manual crew gets sleds in place elsewhere or whatever needs done. You can tap off any surplus and do useful work with it. Huge benefits.

When you're more than half automated with a couple big trails left, though, you're paying about full price for automation maintenance, and staffing enough to have a crew big enough to run a big manual plan. Worst of both worlds. 

For incremental retrofit on existing power, why not use radio comms? Especially if you're going SMI where every gun is fine running in local auto? I know hardwired is easier to set up and maintain, but preinstalling that much conduit is pretty darn pricy.

Automation will eventually pay for itself, but the time horizon for that repayment on any individual gun is potentially 20+ years out at current power prices. The repayment on swapping to new manual guns from a Ratnik sled system is a lot shorter.


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## drjeff (Nov 16, 2021)

IceEidolon said:


> 3x - 14x the air for the same water as a V3 or an Impulse is still pretty inefficient, for the Ratnik.
> 
> An area's first auto trail is a huge step up - even a couple auto fans capable of remote start for an unload or a pain point free up a pair of guys to go do something useful. A whole trail means you can do something with your pumps while your manual crew gets sleds in place elsewhere or whatever needs done. You can tap off any surplus and do useful work with it. Huge benefits.
> 
> ...



I'll be curious to see how/when/what Vail decides to do with the 250ish or so Polecats that Peak installed heading on 11?12? seasons ago (I can't remember off the top of my head) if/when they need replacing. 

I know that a few seasons ago there was some loose talk about automating a few of the core trails, however that was also about the time that Peak was looking at some cash flow issues with bulk loan repayments due and a season before that wasn't stellar volume wise....


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## IceEidolon (Nov 16, 2021)

There are plenty of OG Polecats still in service that are 25 years old or more. No reason Vail needs to rush a replacement. However, all major fan gun competitors could easily accommodate a 10-per-year or 20 per year incremental replacement plan. Power is already there, they just need a hydrant actuator or a small shelter and valve, plus whatever foundation the new fan calls for and a base station and control software the first year. Add the replaced guns to another resort or salvage them for parts.

Edited to add: there were some (blasphemy) TAs added at Hunter under Vail, and many auto Super Polecats under Peaks done to replace Highlands and manual Polecats that followed about what I laid out - get most of the mountain covered with modern guns, then automate the spots that need the most/fastest snowmaking first.


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## Newpylong (Nov 16, 2021)

IceEidolon said:


> 3x - 14x the air for the same water as a V3 or an Impulse is still pretty inefficient, for the Ratnik.
> 
> An area's first auto trail is a huge step up - even a couple auto fans capable of remote start for an unload or a pain point free up a pair of guys to go do something useful. A whole trail means you can do something with your pumps while your manual crew gets sleds in place elsewhere or whatever needs done. You can tap off any surplus and do useful work with it. Huge benefits.
> 
> ...



Yes but like all things it's not black or white. They may convert the same amount of water in a 15 degree wet bulb, but not 20+. You would need to look at the flow chart for each model to see where the scales tip. In aggregate the Low-E obviously wins.

Then you have some areas who have to use them due to poor water pressure up top.


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## IceEidolon (Nov 17, 2021)

There's niche circumstances - low water pressure, a need for a certain trail right this second/absolutely first thing, or very infrequent snowmaking, that tip the scales towards modern Ratnik Baby SG2s. In most cases, I'd rather have more guns flowing more total water on more area than a quarter of the guns flowing a third of the water onto one trail - even in marginal weather.


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## Newpylong (Nov 17, 2021)

Yes, you've said that numerous times and nearly every snowmaking manager would agree including myself (if I still was in the industry). I sold nearly all of our old hogs to other mountains save a small assortment for spot use. Along with them went our diesel compressor for a 60% reduction in air. It is logical and where the snowmaking industry is at.


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## IceEidolon (Nov 18, 2021)

I have yet to work for a mountain that was on board with that philosophy, so you're getting the frustration of years of break room debates.


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## urungus (Nov 18, 2021)

Any guesses on when the opening date will be ?  Even Thanksgiving is starting to look iffy, here is the current mid-mountain forecast from the usually over-optimistic snow-forecast.com


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## IceEidolon (Nov 18, 2021)

A couple overnight windows and one around the clock chance should get at least something open if there are staff to run the guns. I expect everyone at Snow will be very motivated to have something for the Thanksgiving holiday.


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## ThatGuy (Nov 18, 2021)

Hoping I can at least ski one day in November.


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## Newpylong (Nov 18, 2021)

If they get the temps for a good 36 hours they'll clobber it. Looking iffy though.


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## drjeff (Nov 18, 2021)

Newpylong said:


> If they get the temps for a good 36 hours they'll clobber it. Looking iffy though.


Definitely looking like one of those forecasts where if somehow the temps trend just a few degrees cooler, it may be all they need.


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## slatham (Nov 18, 2021)

We're going into an fairly extreme negative AO and NAO pattern next week. This is typically a cold and potentially stormy pattern for the NE. However, the operational models have been all over the place with the Sunday-Tuesday storm, including the Euro a few days ago having an extreme freak storm. This might be one of those times to focus on the pattern and not what the deterministic models are spitting out every 6 hours. We'll see.....

One things for sure, its go time tomorrow night for all elevations.


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## icecoast1 (Nov 18, 2021)

urungus said:


> Any guesses on when the opening date will be ?  Even Thanksgiving is starting to look iffy, here is the current mid-mountain forecast from the usually over-optimistic snow-forecast.com
> 
> View attachment 52215


Depends on which forecast comes to fruition, could be wednesday or thursday if things trend colder, but i'm sure vail is in no rush


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## KustyTheKlown (Nov 18, 2021)

opensnow started their new england narrative reports for the year, and they're calling for some bullish numbers in the next 10 days. I'm skeptical.


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## ThatGuy (Nov 18, 2021)

Just finished changing my oil and putting on the snow tires…hope it dumps but I’ve learned not to get hopes up.


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## Pez (Nov 20, 2021)

I've got one more weekend of yardwork, so the opening day getting pushed off isn't a big deal. I'd rather wait till they get some natural anyway.


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## ericfromMA/NH/VT (Nov 20, 2021)

IceEidolon said:


> A couple overnight windows and one around the clock chance should get at least something open if there are staff to run the guns. I expect everyone at Snow will be very motivated to have something for the Thanksgiving holiday.


On thier instagram people are pissed they arent open because they have "thanksgiving week trips planned" and  "I cant cancell my hotel", demanding refunds, etc...

IDK but if you book a week long thanksgiving week ski trip at a southern NE resort, IMO youre an idiot.

but Mt snow sucks because weather lol


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## drjeff (Nov 20, 2021)

Mother Nature needs to start getting her act together and help the snowmakers out, especially on the lower 1/3rd of the mountain!

Taken this afternoon


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## RichT (Nov 21, 2021)

ericfromMA/NH/VT said:


> On thier instagram people are pissed they arent open because they have "thanksgiving week trips planned" and  "I cant cancell my hotel", demanding refunds, etc...
> 
> IDK but if you book a week long thanksgiving week ski trip at a southern NE resort, IMO youre an idiot.
> 
> but Mt snow sucks because weather lol


Anytime before mid December..............you're an idiot!


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## drjeff (Nov 21, 2021)

RichT said:


> Anytime before mid December..............you're an idiot!


I have definitely noticed with the surge in sales of Epic Passes that the amount of complaining about weather related items (amongst other things ) that no ski area has any control over, has increased.

It's almost like many of the Epic newbies, who likely don't live, or spend much time in the mountains and/or seem to struggle with the basic concept that you need COLD air to make snow, seem to think that there's this imaginary switch that ski resorts flip on about the 1st week of November, and all of the sudden ski areas go to full mid winter conditions and operations....

I almost got the feeling in the Mount Snow region yesterday that more than a few Epic newbies had shown up thinking that their original targeted opening date of November 19th happened, and were shocked to see them not open and the down low areas were just patches of unconnected snow that finally were able to be made by the snowmakers in the previous 24-36hrs when temps finally let them run down to the base.

On the flipside, the lack of lifts spinning sure looked like it was a big plus for business at the Snow Republic Brewery as their parking lot was filled with cars parked out along the side of route 100 as well as I was heading back to CT about 3PM!


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## urungus (Nov 21, 2021)

@drjeff is it your opinion that Vail is just as aggressive at snowmaking as Peaks was ?  I only go to Mt Snow a couple times a year, and realize Mother Nature hasn’t been cooperating, but it still doesn’t seem to me like Vail is making the same effort


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## Mum skier (Nov 21, 2021)

ericfromMA/NH/VT said:


> On thier instagram people are pissed they arent open because they have "thanksgiving week trips planned" and  "I cant cancell my hotel", demanding refunds, etc...
> 
> IDK but if you book a week long thanksgiving week ski trip at a southern NE resort, IMO youre an idiot.
> 
> but Mt snow sucks because weather lol


I am wondering how many non pass holders will have booked accommodation (for any Vail resort) for the Christmas/New Year period to find that tickets are being limited.  That is if they really are being limited.  Are there still people who just show up at the ticket window to buy a full price day ticket and would not realize.


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## drjeff (Nov 21, 2021)

urungus said:


> @drjeff is it your opinion that Vail is just as aggressive at snowmaking as Peaks was ?  I only go to Mt Snow a couple times a year, and realize Mother Nature hasn’t been cooperating, but it still doesn’t seem to me like Vail is making the same effort


To get things open, yes, just as aggressive as Peak was (the weather this year has way too often had the wet bulb temp a couple of degrees to the warm unfortunately, especially on the lower say 1/3rd of the mountain) and some pictures I saw yesterday from someone who hiked over to the Northface sure had it seeming like if they wanted to upload/download and just open freefall that if they're not already there production wise, they're really close right now.

What seemed to happen last season, and who knows if it was fully planned or COVID related, is that they didn't turn the guns on as much in late January/early February when they had GOOD temps to really augment the base depths that last foot or so like I recall they did under Peak on numerous trails. I will be curious to see what goes on this year, especially if mother nature is feeling cooperative temps wise as we near the traditional end of the snowmaking season somewhere around President's week.

Right now, based on what I saw yesterday, mother nature needs to give the snowmakers a solid 36-48hrs of GOOD temps down low, without taking much away if it's not a continuous run, to get them open based on the roughly 24hr run of production they had a few days ago


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## RichT (Nov 21, 2021)

drjeff said:


> I have definitely noticed with the surge in sales of Epic Passes that the amount of complaining about weather related items (amongst other things ) that no ski area has any control over, has increased.
> 
> It's almost like many of the Epic newbies, who likely don't live, or spend much time in the mountains and/or seem to struggle with the basic concept that you need COLD air to make snow, seem to think that there's this imaginary switch that ski resorts flip on about the 1st week of November, and all of the sudden ski areas go to full mid winter conditions and operations....
> 
> ...


I hear ya, I was at Hunter yesterday to start putting my equipment in my locker and when I came out there was a girl with her boots on and carrying skis walking towards the lift! There wasn't even any snow anywhere at the base of the Mtn.


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## jimmywilson69 (Nov 21, 2021)

That is ridiculous... how could you not know they weren't open?


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## slatham (Nov 21, 2021)

Snowmaking power will come to bear Monday late afternoon through Wednesday. All elevations. Lets see if they can pull it off. 

Wednesday night will be interesting. Looks like an inversion situation - haven't looked at soundings but 850mb and 925mb temps >0C, while surface temps get to -2 or -3C. If it pans out and you're ultra aggressive......

Something Friday (not sure I'd label it a "Storm watch" but rather a keep your eye on it). Colder next weekend.

Oh and don't rule out some high elevation snow tonight. Real close call.


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## drjeff (Nov 21, 2021)

jimmywilson69 said:


> That is ridiculous... how could you not know they weren't open?



I seriously think that Vail's data driven approach on most everything managed to identify and entice to buy an Epic pass, a subset of the skiing/riding population who have an incredibily limited and niave concept of how it all happens! Almost guarentee that they'll be more sightings of folks with their ski boots on the wrong feet this year!


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## ctdubl07 (Nov 22, 2021)

Peaks/Vail approach is about as close to pure conjecture as possible. It's been what, 2 seasons with significant uncertainty due to Covid plus we're talking about an area that could more dependent on weather than almost anything else in their portfolio. I'm sure they have the same philosophy, put the snow down when it's needed and when it's possible. 

I did see guns shutdown around 8am Sat at base of sweet16 after apparently blowing most of night so they are trying to extend things lower to link core areas. Many forget these whales have to drain and then be spread before their of value. Putting them out their earlier last week would have been a pure waste. It's going to take time and the continued coop of nature. 

What I was disappointed at was the lack of services (zero) open at base. No Grind, Bootworks or Grand Summit Sports. I would have liked to drop all of our gear to have it ready for next wknd or grab some sweatshirts for kids. But that pushes me to a local shop so maybe better anyway.


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## FBGM (Nov 22, 2021)

Temps look good for future. I’m only a few hours from first turn on. Hope to be able to push through the day tomorrow. Good Tuesday night. Wed/Thursday break then next 5+ days are a go!


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## tumbler (Nov 22, 2021)

FBGM said:


> Temps look good for future. I’m only a few hours from first turn on. Hope to be able to push through the day tomorrow. Good Tuesday night. Wed/Thursday break then next 5+ days are a go!


Maybe I missed it, but what mountain are you running now?  I recall you saying it was small.


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## FBGM (Nov 22, 2021)

Private resort, not on the map. 



But we on! Night one. 14 hr day. Been a while since that. It’s chilly. Back at it in AM. Good temp run coming up. Those with big and real systems should be looking decent this time next week.


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## jimmywilson69 (Nov 22, 2021)

Is that an old school highland fan you got there?


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## jaytrem (Nov 22, 2021)

FBGM said:


> Private resort, not on the map.
> 
> View attachment 52227
> 
> But we on! Night one. 14 hr day. Been a while since that. It’s chilly. Back at it in AM. Good temp run coming up. Those with big and real systems should be looking decent this time next week.


Ahh, Yellowstone Club no doubt.


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## Newpylong (Nov 23, 2021)

jimmywilson69 said:


> Is that an old school highland fan you got there?


Sure is, didn't know anyone still used those things lol.


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## jimmywilson69 (Nov 23, 2021)

Roundtop in Dillsburg, PA has 2 trails with them still.  the one trail is augmented with Impulses in between the permanent fan towers.  The other trail has Ratniks in between the permanent fan towers.

They work pretty decently if the conditions are right and the air water mixture is watched.


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## IceEidolon (Nov 23, 2021)

I think Canaan still has a couple trailers, and there are a bunch up in the Midwest.


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## FBGM (Nov 23, 2021)

Those old girls kill it. I fixed one today and just fired it up. Thing impressed me. Might not put that in the dumpster next year. Hold onto that even with new stuff coming in.


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## Mum skier (Nov 23, 2021)

Looks like plenty of accommodation available at Mt Snow for this weekend.  I don’t like Mt Snow much but looking like this might be the only Epic based option to ensure I can tick off a day in November.


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## spiderpig (Nov 23, 2021)

Mum skier said:


> Looks like plenty of accommodation available at Mt Snow for this weekend.  I don’t like Mt Snow much but looking like this might be the only Epic based option to ensure I can tick off a day in November.


Stowe and Mount Snow are both opening Friday. Since Okemo hasn't announced, I would assume not. Maybe Saturday.


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## meff (Nov 23, 2021)

So this will be our first winter at Mt. Snow, have skied it a few times in the past but have a seasonal rental this year.  One question for regulars, best shop for a tune/hot wax, yeah I know I could do it myself, been there done that not great at it.


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## IceEidolon (Nov 24, 2021)

FBGM said:


> Those old girls kill it. I fixed one today and just fired it up. Thing impressed me. Might not put that in the dumpster next year. Hold onto that even with new stuff coming in.


They aren't exactly kW/gal kings, but with the right tips and temps a Highland can hang with a TF10 for GPM.


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## drjeff (Nov 24, 2021)

meff said:


> So this will be our first winter at Mt. Snow, have skied it a few times in the past but have a seasonal rental this year.  One question for regulars, best shop for a tune/hot wax, yeah I know I could do it myself, been there done that not great at it.



First Trax is my go to shop up at Mount Snow without question


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## Newpylong (Nov 24, 2021)

IceEidolon said:


> They aren't exactly kW/gal kings, but with the right tips and temps a Highland can hang with a TF10 for GPM.



By the right temps you mean at the North Pole! I've seen a TF10 with a 2" hose do a hair over 200 GPM in a 12 degree wet bulb. Never seen a Highland come even close to that.. Once you get into more reasonable temps they fall flat.. They belong in the boneyard with the Hedco Cubs (which I learned on) or converted to Polecats.


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## jimmywilson69 (Nov 24, 2021)

Yeah we rarely get that cold in aouthcentral PA which is why they still use then but also why they've been augmented with the ratniks and the HKD impulse


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## MikeW (Nov 24, 2021)

For a tune-World Class, across the street from 7-11


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## drjeff (Nov 24, 2021)

Paid parking doesn't start until 12/18


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## ThatGuy (Nov 24, 2021)

drjeff said:


> Paid parking doesn't start until 12/18


Thanks for the info, glad to hear that.


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## ctdubl07 (Nov 24, 2021)

drjeff said:


> First Trax is my go to shop up at Mount Snow without question


I prefer the Grind at the base. You might pay a little more but convenience of leaving them and picking up before you walk the 100 yards to the lift, cannot be discounted……especially with kids. (Its also like a free night of locker storage) My feeling is that the quality is on par with anything you’ll get in town and if you’ve got a board, I’m not sure FT is best shop to deal with those having “serrated” edges.
I just drop off and head up to The Tap Room……


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## drjeff (Nov 24, 2021)

ctdubl07 said:


> I prefer the Grind at the base. You might pay a little more but convenience of leaving them and picking up before you walk the 100 yards to the lift, cannot be discounted……especially with kids. (Its also like a free night of locker storage) My feeling is that the quality is on par with anything you’ll get in town and if you’ve got a board, I’m not sure FT is best shop to deal with those having “serrated” edges.
> I just drop off and head up to The Tap Room……



BTW way, the Taproom is scheduled to open the weekend of the 11th per a group text of my Taproom friends where one of the bartenders is included in the group!


----------



## snoseek (Nov 24, 2021)

Any guesses as to what kind of terrain theyll be skiing about Tuesday into Wednesday next week? A couple of T2B routes and maybe a north face run?


----------



## jaytrem (Nov 24, 2021)

snoseek said:


> Any guesses as to what kind of terrain theyll be skiing about Tuesday into Wednesday next week? A couple of T2B routes and maybe a north face run?


My guess...

Freefall on North Face along with River Run (nit much of a trail).

Long Johh beginner trail top to bottom

Cascade/Canyon

1 Carinthia off Heavy Metal

Maybe under the Carinthia quad (good chance I think ).

Possibly Ridge

Possibly Snowdance


----------



## ctdubl07 (Nov 25, 2021)

drjeff said:


> BTW way, the Taproom is scheduled to open the weekend of the 11th per a group text of my Taproom friends where one of the bartenders is included in the group!


Great news Doc…..been nostalgic for the Saturdays when Pete ignores my drink orders. I do hope they bring the SnowBarn back online with live music.


----------



## urungus (Nov 25, 2021)

jaytrem said:


> My guess...
> 
> Freefall on North Face along with River Run (nit much of a trail).
> 
> ...


They have announced Freefall, River Run, Cascade / Canton for opening day tomorrow.  I expect Long John & The Gulch to follow quickly

Update: The Gulch will be open tomorrow but only for hiking (no lift service) and will not be connected to the main face


----------



## machski (Nov 26, 2021)

Interesting, Snow will be going with Doppelmyer for both new lifts next summer.


----------



## Newpylong (Nov 26, 2021)

That is surprising given their installed base, but honestly Dopp is doing a better job in the East lately and I think their recent contracts show it.



			https://anrweb.vt.gov/PubDocs/ANR/Planning/2W0359-65/Application%20Documents/001%20MtSnowLiftReplacementsflat_2021-11-16.pdf
		


Think the Seasons double gets a new lease on life as a quick hop to get over to the main face?


----------



## ss20 (Nov 26, 2021)

Newpylong said:


> That is surprising given their installed base, but honestly Dopp is doing a better job in the East lately and I think their recent contracts show it.
> 
> 
> 
> https://anrweb.vt.gov/PubDocs/ANR/Planning/2W0359-65/Application%20Documents/001%20MtSnowLiftReplacementsflat_2021-11-16.pdf



I too found this news surprising as Mount Snow has been exclusively Poma the past 30 years.

There's no Dopp office in the NE like Poma, correct?


----------



## FBGM (Nov 26, 2021)

Poma is junk. Vail deals with Dopp for a lot of stuff. That bluebird Poma at Snow is junk and problematic.


----------



## crystalmountainskier (Nov 26, 2021)

ss20 said:


> There's no Dopp office in the NE like Poma, correct?


Doppelmayr has a small office in Ballston Spa, NY. The former head of ORDA is a Doppelmayr sales rep. Dopp also has a construction crew based in West Virginia. And their main North American manufacturing site is not too far from Vermont in St. Jerome, Quebec.


----------



## urungus (Nov 26, 2021)

urungus said:


> They have announced Freefall, River Run, Cascade / Canton for opening day tomorrow.  I expect Long John & The Gulch to follow quickly
> 
> Update: The Gulch will be open tomorrow but only for hiking (no lift service) and will not be connected to the main face


Long John is now showing as open


----------



## Mum skier (Nov 27, 2021)

urungus said:


> Long John is now showing as open


Skied today, windy and cold with the guns blowing, but allowed us to achieve the start the season in November objective. conditions were not bad, though runs felt a bit crowded, by 2.00pm Challenger was ski on and by 3.00pm the Bluebird was close to ski on. One main run down the middle, Long John, and one of the runs down the north face open (don‘t know the names).  They also opened the beginner chair which was good a people were hiking up that slope to use it.  
Should be a bit warmer tomorrow.  Worth the drive to get the season started.


----------



## ThatGuy (Nov 27, 2021)

Mum skier said:


> Skied today, windy and cold with the guns blowing, but allowed us to achieve the start the season in November objective. conditions were not bad, though runs felt a bit crowded, by 2.00pm Challenger was ski on and by 3.00pm the Bluebird was close to ski on. One main run down the middle, Long John, and one of the runs down the north face open (don‘t know the names).  They also opened the beginner chair which was good a people were hiking up that slope to use it.
> Should be a bit warmer tomorrow.  Worth the drive to get the season started.


Glad to hear it wasn’t too packed there. The main run down is Cascade/Canyon and the North Face run is Free Fall with River Run as the connector fyi.


----------



## drjeff (Nov 27, 2021)

Tough to say how much natural fell overnight with all the wind blowing it around last night and all day today. Easily got 6", although with the wind dispersion factor, I could believe that 8-12"+ as well. Went from looking like late Fall to looking and feeling like Winter in 24hrs! 

They have also started snowmaking on Ridge, Snowdance and Chute, as well as were making snow on Canyon, parts of Long John, Cascade, Deer Run, Coopers Junction, The Gulch and the Carinthia base area.

Hopefully they'll get Gulch open and either Heavy Metal or Nitro spinning for the park crowd in the next day or so.

Had a couple of separate rides on the Bluebird today with folks up from Virginia and Maryland!


----------



## drjeff (Nov 27, 2021)

The lights of the fanguns doing their thing tonight


----------



## skiur (Nov 28, 2021)

I know that compared to everything else in snow making the lights are basically nothing, but they really seem like a waste of electricity.  Does look cool though.


----------



## ctdubl07 (Nov 28, 2021)

I wonder if theres any value to the lights for work at night? 

The Gulch has had continuous production laid down as well as the the width of base area of Carinthia. I do not see mass production elsewhere yet on Carinthia (like U/L Fools Gold/Nitro) Imagine that will start this week so they can get top to bottom and then start the feature whales.

Looks like they could open Heavy Metal today and have Gulch fully ready if they wanted but crazy the amount of kids hiking up lower Gulch just to hit a few rails and tubes. My kids love C but are more interested in hot lapping the NF and few trails on the front side this weekend. 

Im still trying to motivate to go for a few rides....or might just go hike with the dog again.


----------



## Newpylong (Nov 28, 2021)

skiur said:


> I know that compared to everything else in snow making the lights are basically nothing, but they really seem like a waste of electricity.  Does look cool though.



Literally you're talking about 50 watts per gun, and they aren't for looks. Because fans have such a long throw and variable plume with wind they are useful to see where the snow is going.


----------



## ctdubl07 (Nov 28, 2021)

Correction, fans on Lower Fools Gold just activated....


----------



## drjeff (Nov 28, 2021)

It almosts seems like they're putting enough down on Gulch to open it with a decent sized park from its initial rope drop day, rather than the more traditional roll out which was get it open with something small, then keep making it bigger with more snowmaking time. I guess that time will tell....


----------



## sugarbushskier (Nov 29, 2021)

According to their report, it sounds like they're keeping the Gulch area closed for the week to work on building out some features, so can I assume that nothing will be running/open at Carinthia this week?  Heading out either tomorrow or Wednesday for day 1 and trying to decide between Stratton & Mt Snow based upon open terrain.

Any chance that MS will get any additional terrain open by then such as Chute, Ridge or Sundance? I understand it's early season and I should be thankful for what we've got, but I do get bored lapping the same few trails.  Stratton is one of my least favorite mountains and a bit longer drive, but I'd ski it if it offers a bit more vertical and terrain than MS.

I have both Epic & Ikon so both are already sunk costs.

Thanks in advance.


----------



## Newpylong (Nov 29, 2021)

Freefall doesn't look ready.


----------



## drjeff (Nov 29, 2021)

Newpylong said:


> View attachment 52281
> 
> Freefall doesn't look ready.


Well they don't call VT the Green Mountain State for nothing!  

Would be nice if the IT Dept could get all the cams up and working again


----------



## Skier52 (Nov 29, 2021)

Anyone know why the MS trail and lift report lists everything as closed?


----------



## icecoast1 (Nov 29, 2021)

drjeff said:


> Well they don't call VT the Green Mountain State for nothing!



Maybe leaving freefall as a ski it natural trail is vails new strategy for saving money?   Who isn't up for some good grass skiing anyway?


----------



## urungus (Nov 29, 2021)

Skier52 said:


> Anyone know why the MS trail and lift report lists everything as closed?


Most likely you were checking before they opened at 9am, if you check now you should see the open lifts and trails


----------



## Skier52 (Nov 29, 2021)

urungus said:


> Most likely you were checking before they opened at 9am, if you check now you should see the open lifts and trails


Yes, that appears to be the case.  But it makes no sense as people would like to see what is open before they make the trip.


----------



## urungus (Nov 29, 2021)

Skier52 said:


> Yes, that appears to be the case.  But it makes no sense as people would like to see what is open before they make the trip.


If you look in the written portion at the very bottom, they often describe white trails will be open


----------



## urungus (Nov 29, 2021)

Had a nice first day at Mount Snow on Sunday afternoon.

Saw this “Jerry of the day” candidate in a “Natural Light” snowsuit and tiny backpack.

The wife suggested he must be getting paid to be a human billboard, because no self respecting person would go out like that otherwise.  I thought he was a lover of “Natty”, one of those kooks you see on the slopes in Batman outfits, etc.   Meaning rather than getting paid, he was shelling out $250 of his own money at https://www.shopbeergear.com/products/natural-light-retro-ski-snowsuit

What do you think ?


----------



## snoseek (Nov 29, 2021)

^^^^^pure awesome!


----------



## jimmywilson69 (Nov 29, 2021)

respect the send!


----------



## JimG. (Nov 29, 2021)

Looks like an MS regular.


----------



## ThatGuy (Nov 29, 2021)

First day of the season today, decent for late November. Also got bitched at by some Jerry about how we have to “follow rules” because I walked over the rope to the lift.


----------



## ThatGuy (Dec 1, 2021)

Hopefully they get Carinthia open asap, today was like a snowboarder slalom course. No snowmaking going on but some nice whales are built up on Lodge.


----------



## drjeff (Dec 1, 2021)

ThatGuy said:


> Hopefully they get Carinthia open asap, today was like a snowboarder slalom course. No snowmaking going on but some nice whales are built up on Lodge.
> View attachment 52306
> View attachment 52307


Per an email that went out this afternoon to athletes and parents of athletes from the Mount Snow training center, Gulch, and I would presume that means lift(s) at Carinthia are currently scheduled to open and a built out park on Friday.

Should be a nice bump in open trails and acreage and lifts for the weekend based on the work the snowmakers have done since sometime late Friday night/early Saturday AM


----------



## meff (Dec 1, 2021)

Hopefully the weather tomorrow is kind to the mountain, a few more routes down and I imagine a decrease in crowds should make a for a decent weekend.


----------



## ThatGuy (Dec 6, 2021)

Bluebird is going down for windhold, watched a girl slide out at the terminal and almost become a paraplegic.


----------



## chuckstah (Dec 6, 2021)

ThatGuy said:


> Bluebird is going down for windhold, watched a girl slide out at the terminal and almost become a paraplegic.


I'm at Sunapee today.  I keep thinking every  run is the last one it's so windy at the top. And there's only about 10 people here.  skiing is quite good though.


----------



## ThatGuy (Dec 6, 2021)

chuckstah said:


> I'm at Sunapee today.  I keep thinking every  run is the last one it's so windy at the top. And there's only about 10 people here.  skiing is quite good though.


Skiing is pretty decent here but theres only about twenty feet of visibility in some spots.


----------



## ThatGuy (Dec 6, 2021)




----------



## machski (Dec 6, 2021)

chuckstah said:


> I'm at Sunapee today.  I keep thinking every  run is the last one it's so windy at the top. And there's only about 10 people here.  skiing is quite good though.


Yup, wasn't too bad on the 1 1/3 of a run.  Great coverage and depth and they are close to adding Upper BlastOff and Chipmunk.  Wind do d keep it increasing til I punched out at 1pm.


----------



## chuckstah (Dec 6, 2021)

machski said:


> Yup, wasn't too bad on the 1 1/3 of a run.  Great coverage and depth and they are close to adding Upper BlastOff and Chipmunk.  Wind do d keep it increasing til I punched out at 1pm.


They finally went on wind hold at 3. I missed what was to be my last run, probably for the best. I guess that was your car I saw in the lot with a tell tale  license plate


----------



## machski (Dec 7, 2021)

chuckstah said:


> They finally went on wind hold at 3. I missed what was to be my last run, probably for the best. I guess that was your car I saw in the lot with a tell tale  license plate


Yes sir.  I need to look around a bit more at who is skiing.  Yesterday was a surgical strike day to get out, get a bunch of vert in and head out to do other stuff so I was single mind focused.


----------



## Pez (Dec 8, 2021)

What's the paid parking situation ?  Weekdays too?


----------



## drjeff (Dec 8, 2021)

Pez said:


> What's the paid parking situation ?  Weekdays too?


Paid parking doesn't start until Saturday the 18th.  All parking is free until then. Paid parking will involve roughly 50% of the parking lots (the original map that a certain online group posted was inaccurate with some of the outer lots listed as pay that will be free).  Free lots, primarily around the main base lodge outer and lower lots will be available on the weekends. There will be free shuttles running from the outer, free lots to the base lodges.

The paid parking situation, which is done via a downloadable app similar to what many mass transit commuters use when they park their vehicles in lots and take the train/subway to work, will have you pre paying for your parking for that day, and apparently there will be someone checking that the license plates parked in the paid lots did in fact pre-pay. Not sure of what the mechanism to deal with those parking in paid spots that didn't pay that day will be.

The lots very near the main base lodge and also the snow side lot at Carinthia will be paid every day ($30 on the weekends and $15 mid week non Holiday). The other paid lots around the main base area, Sundance Lodge area, and the non slopeside lot at Carinthia are $15 a day weekends only, and free mid week, Non Holiday. After 1PM, everyday, all parking spaces will be free, regardless of the lot, and if they were paid spots earlier that day. 

It will be interesting to see how this all comes together the next few weeks, especially through the Christmas Week crowds


----------



## RichT (Dec 8, 2021)

drjeff said:


> Paid parking doesn't start until Saturday the 18th.  All parking is free until then. Paid parking will involve roughly 50% of the parking lots (the original map that a certain online group posted was inaccurate with some of the outer lots listed as pay that will be free).  Free lots, primarily around the main base lodge outer and lower lots will be available on the weekends. There will be free shuttles running from the outer, free lots to the base lodges.
> 
> The paid parking situation, which is done via a downloadable app similar to what many mass transit commuters use when they park their vehicles in lots and take the train/subway to work, will have you pre paying for your parking for that day, and apparently there will be someone checking that the license plates parked in the paid lots did in fact pre-pay. Not sure of what the mechanism to deal with those parking in paid spots that didn't pay that day will be.
> 
> ...


If there really are "crowds" anymore at any "FAIL" resorts!


----------



## drjeff (Dec 8, 2021)

RichT said:


> If there really are "crowds" anymore at any "FAIL" resorts!


Anecdotally, while I have certainly seen plenty of familar faces at Mount Snow the past 2 weekends that they've been open, there are also plenty of folks, whom it fairly easy to tell are relatively new to Mount Snow (wouldn't surpise me if they were new Epic Pass owners), as well as over the Holiday periods, there are so many that just ski/ride a few times a year that will show up regardless of a parking fee and booked their trip months ago.

There are ways for regulars to work around the paid parking, and while these changes are mainly from the folks out in CO, there are tons of really great people who work for the mountain, who are busting their butts and working around the higher up managerial decisions that likley aren't from the crew at Mount Snow, to let folks enjoy the sport we all love. And we should all take a moment to thank them at the resort, because its the crew at the resort that delivers the experience, sometimes inspite of directives from higher level management, and both this season and last season the folks you see at the resorts out there working so we all can enjoy the sport, have been through a lot, and we should try and be more appreciative of them and get that they are the face of the company and aren;t always responsible for coprorate decisions


----------



## urungus (Dec 8, 2021)

drjeff said:


> Paid parking will involve roughly 50% of the parking lots (the original map that a certain online group posted was inaccurate with some of the outer lots listed as pay that will be free).


Is an updated parking map available ?


----------



## Skier52 (Dec 8, 2021)

What are conditions like today (12/8)?


----------



## drjeff (Dec 8, 2021)

urungus said:


> Is an updated parking map available ?


I can't find a direct link on the webiste.

Basically, on the weekends, at the main base lodge area, the outer lots you first get to on both your right and left as you come down the main access road are free, as well as the lower lots down by Snow Lake being free.  The lot behind the main base lodge is the $30 premium spaces ($15 mid week), and the lots on either side of the mountain ops bulding are the $15 spaces and free midweek.

Sundance lot is $15 on the weekend and free during the week.

Carinthia has the lot immediately adjacent to the snow as $30 parking on the weekend ($15 midweek) and the other Carinthia lot out behind the base lodge is $15 on the weekends.

And free shuttle will be running on a regular basis from the outer lots around the main base lodge to the main base lodge bus port area


----------



## urungus (Dec 8, 2021)

Thanks drjeff, appreciate your insider knowledge as always


----------



## Newpylong (Dec 8, 2021)

RichT said:


> If there really are "crowds" anymore at any "FAIL" resorts!



Of course there will be crowds. Cheap passes and a dependably mediocre product done by the book. That's what they do...


----------



## Cobbold (Dec 8, 2021)

drjeff said:


> Paid parking doesn't start until Saturday the 18th.  All parking is free until then. Paid parking will involve roughly 50% of the parking lots (the original map that a certain online group posted was inaccurate with some of the outer lots listed as pay that will be free).  Free lots, primarily around the main base lodge outer and lower lots will be available on the weekends. There will be free shuttles running from the outer, free lots to the base lodges.
> 
> The paid parking situation, which is done via a downloadable app similar to what many mass transit commuters use when they park their vehicles in lots and take the train/subway to work, will have you pre paying for your parking for that day, and apparently there will be someone checking that the license plates parked in the paid lots did in fact pre-pay. Not sure of what the mechanism to deal with those parking in paid spots that didn't pay that day will be.
> 
> ...


My guess if you are a pass holder parking in a paid lot but not paying, you will get an email, asking that you pay or your epic pass privileges will be suspended


----------



## ThatGuy (Dec 8, 2021)

Cobbold said:


> My guess if you are a pass holder parking in a paid lot but not paying, you will get an email, asking that you pay or your epic pass privileges will be suspended


I’ll let you know because I’m parking in lot A midweek and definitely not going to pay, so we’ll see what happens. If it’s an issue at  least lot B isn’t much farther.


----------



## skiur (Dec 8, 2021)

Cobbold said:


> My guess if you are a pass holder parking in a paid lot but not paying, you will get an email, asking that you pay or your epic pass privileges will be suspended



How would they know if you were a passholder?  My licence plate# isn't linked to my pass, does epic require it?


----------



## ThatGuy (Dec 8, 2021)

skiur said:


> How would they know if you were a passholder?  My licence plate# isn't linked to my pass, does epic require it?


They don’t require that.


----------



## ctdubl07 (Dec 8, 2021)

drjeff said:


> Anecdotally, while I have certainly seen plenty of familar faces at Mount Snow the past 2 weekends that they've been open, there are also plenty of folks, whom it fairly easy to tell are relatively new to Mount Snow (wouldn't surpise me if they were new Epic Pass owners), as well as over the Holiday periods, there are so many that just ski/ride a few times a year that will show up regardless of a parking fee and booked their trip months ago.
> 
> There are ways for regulars to work around the paid parking, and while these changes are mainly from the folks out in CO, there are tons of really great people who work for the mountain, who are busting their butts and working around the higher up managerial decisions that likley aren't from the crew at Mount Snow, to let folks enjoy the sport we all love. And we should all take a moment to thank them at the resort, because its the crew at the resort that delivers the experience, sometimes inspite of directives from higher level management, and both this season and last season the folks you see at the resorts out there working so we all can enjoy the sport, have been through a lot, and we should try and be more appreciative of them and get that they are the face of the company and aren;t always responsible for coporate decisions


Well said Doc although asking that of some folks who post on this thread is likely a losing battle....i suspect they'd also complain about to much alchohol in a drink and getting extra vanilla icecream with their apple pie.

Im hopeful this new policy encourages some carpooling from the younger folks, especially those who come in and out of Carinthia, and look less at is as revenue grab.


----------



## urungus (Dec 8, 2021)

ctdubl07 said:


> i suspect they'd also complain about to much alchohol in a drink and getting extra vanilla icecream with their apple pie.


Having to pay for formerly free parking, is like getting too much alcohol in a drink ?!?


----------



## ThatGuy (Dec 8, 2021)

ctdubl07 said:


> Well said Doc although asking that of some folks who post on this thread is likely a losing battle....i suspect they'd also complain about to much alchohol in a drink and getting extra vanilla icecream with their apple pie.
> 
> Im hopeful this new policy encourages some carpooling from the younger folks, especially those who come in and out of Carinthia, and look less at is as revenue grab.


What a terrible analogy. Also I never park at Carinthia but having the entire lot paid on weekends is a terrible idea for multiple reasons. 

Can you enlighten me on how this is anything but a revenue grab?


----------



## Cobbold (Dec 8, 2021)

skiur said:


> How would they know if you were a passholder?  My licence plate# isn't linked to my pass, does epic require it?


Good point, forgot I ever suggested it


----------



## NYDB (Dec 8, 2021)

ThatGuy said:


> What a terrible analogy. Also I never park at Carinthia but having the entire lot paid on weekends is a terrible idea for multiple reasons.
> 
> Can you enlighten me on how this is anything but a revenue grab?


you don't like alcohol in your ice cream?


----------



## drjeff (Dec 8, 2021)

NY DirtBag said:


> you don't like alcohol in your ice cream?


The adult milkshakes they make (or atleast used to make) in 1900 Burger will convince anyone with any skepticism of the booze + ice combo that it works!


----------



## sugarbushskier (Dec 8, 2021)

Heading up to Mt Snow tomorrow and plan to park at Carinthia lot.  Is the Heavy Metal chair a reliable 9AM start? I thought I read somewhere that it sometimes runs late (understand if there's icing etc.), but I think the weather tonight into tomorrow is pretty tame.

Local insights appreciated.


----------



## Pez (Dec 8, 2021)

Thanks for the info Doc!

I already have my sunday parking plan.

Skied at mount snow today.  conditions were OK.  cascade was pretty icy and torn up by the time i skied it.  did a handful of laps on long john, and called it a day.

in pretty rough shape right now and my legs were jelly after the first run.  still great to be out there and get ready for when it's good.

"that's why we practice in this sh#t"


----------



## jaytrem (Dec 8, 2021)

sugarbushskier said:


> Heading up to Mt Snow tomorrow and plan to park at Carinthia lot.  Is the Heavy Metal chair a reliable 9AM start? I thought I read somewhere that it sometimes runs late (understand if there's icing etc.), but I think the weather tonight into tomorrow is pretty tame.
> 
> Local insights appreciated.


MS has never been great at getting things going after a storm (compared to Stratton).  Not sure if they will be better or worse with Vail running things.  That being said, I don't think there will be enough of a mess to delay things tomorrow.  I'd feel pretty confident that Heavy Metal will start on time.  I started there on Sat and Sun and both days they were ready just about on time.  I think it opened a few minutes late on Sun while waiting for a mechanic to finish his ride down.


----------



## drjeff (Dec 8, 2021)

The 3 bartenders in the Station Taproom posted a group photo of them up there tonight after doing some pre-opening stocking and prep work with the caption of "see you soon!" 

Can't freaking wait! I was literally sitting in a bar stool in the Taproom on March 14th 2020 when the email from Vail Resorts came out announcing that they would be shutting down immediately due to COVID

It will feel so good to be back up there with my ski friends again


----------



## ThatGuy (Dec 9, 2021)

Don’t know if the 6” displayed on the website are accurate but the little refresh of snow was much needed.


----------



## ctdubl07 (Dec 9, 2021)

drjeff said:


> The 3 bartenders in the Station Taproom posted a group photo of them up there tonight after doing some pre-opening stocking and prep work with the caption of "see you soon!"
> 
> Can't freaking wait! I was literally sitting in a bar stool in the Taproom on March 14th 2020 when the email from Vail Resorts came out announcing that they would be shutting down immediately due to COVID
> 
> ...





drjeff said:


> The 3 bartenders in the Station Taproom posted a group photo of them up there tonight after doing some pre-opening stocking and prep work with the caption of "see you soon!"
> 
> Can't freaking wait! I was literally sitting in a bar stool in the Taproom on March 14th 2020 when the email from Vail Resorts came out announcing that they would be shutting down immediately due to COVID
> 
> It will feel so good to be back up there with my ski friends again


Here here! I’ll see you and Pete next weekend. (Sat looks sh*t) 
Were also psyched to see music scheduled back at the SnowBarn. Hopefully they’ll bring back an 70s/80s night party like years ago. 

If Heavy Metal is then only scheduled Corinthia option and it’s not been weather challenged, its starting times are pretty dependable


----------



## GregoryIsaacs (Dec 16, 2021)

Surprised to see that there's been no update from Vail re paid parking starting this sat. Wonder if they realize the impending tsunami of bad PR they are about to receive.....


----------



## icecoast1 (Dec 16, 2021)

GregoryIsaacs said:


> Surprised to see that there's been no update from Vail re paid parking starting this sat. Wonder if they realize the impending tsunami of bad PR they are about to receive.....


They probably don't have the staff to actually enforce it


----------



## sugarbushskier (Dec 16, 2021)

Was at MS yesterday and a large portable digital display on the entrance to the upper right parking lot at Carinthia very clearly stating paid parking begins on December 18th.

Booted up in the Carinthia Lodge lower level (after showing my vaccination card on my phone) and the few folks there were complaining about the parking fees and how it will be managed.  Going to be interesting.....

BTW, after showing I was "eligible" to enter the lodge and heading downstairs to boot up and store my bag in the cubbies, you were NOT allowed to go back up the stairs to exit.  You had to exit the lower level through the doors to the outside and walk back up to get your skis.  Reasoning according to the couple of Vail employees I spoke to was staffing.


----------



## drjeff (Dec 16, 2021)

sugarbushskier said:


> Was at MS yesterday and a large portable digital display on the entrance to the upper right parking lot at Carinthia very clearly stating paid parking begins on December 18th.
> 
> Booted up in the Carinthia Lodge lower level (after showing my vaccination card on my phone) and the few folks there were complaining about the parking fees and how it will be managed.  Going to be interesting.....
> 
> BTW, after showing I was "eligible" to enter the lodge and heading downstairs to boot up and store my bag in the cubbies, you were NOT allowed to go back up the stairs to exit.  You had to exit the lower level through the doors to the outside and walk back up to get your skis.  Reasoning according to the couple of Vail employees I spoke to was staffing.



As I understand it with respect to the Carinthia lodge. the downstairs area where the ski shop, lockers, some of the restrooms etc are, is being treated as a separate space than the upstairs where the Cafeteria, and some other restrooms are. Much like in the main base lodge the area where the bathrooms, ski shop and bag check is located is accessed via a separate entrance than the cafeteria is accessed.

Does it make any logical sense? Nope.  Is it a policy that they're using that they feel will address any COVID contact issues that as a company they may be worried about? Likely.


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## Newpylong (Dec 16, 2021)

I don't get how anyone is dealing with all of these convoluted policies. Paid parking, lodge changes, vaccine requirements for specific services, specific entrances, etc and so on.

I am glad where I ski you just park and can go into the lodge if need be and do your thing with no BS. Also even though I only get to Killington a handful of times a year now, it's still relatively straight forward there now. 

Vail has literally taken the fun out of it by making you think so much for something that is supposed to be about relaxing and not really thinking.


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## RichT (Dec 16, 2021)

drjeff said:


> As I understand it with respect to the Carinthia lodge. the downstairs area where the ski shop, lockers, some of the restrooms etc are, is being treated as a separate space than the upstairs where the Cafeteria, and some other restrooms are. Much like in the main base lodge the area where the bathrooms, ski shop and bag check is located is accessed via a separate entrance than the cafeteria is accessed.
> 
> Does it make any logical sense? Nope.  Is it a policy that they're using that they feel will address any COVID contact issues that as a company they may be worried about? Likely.


Hunter's the same way.............when they have enough staff to check that is.


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## drjeff (Dec 16, 2021)

RichT said:


> Hunter's the same way.............when they have enough staff to check that is.


Pretty much it that way at all Vail Resorts, since their planning was done a while ago, and it seems like they want consistency across all of their properties rather then go with different things in different geographic areas.

Doesn't make a bunch of sense overall, unless you look at it strictly from a potential legal liability issue taken to the extreme


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## icecoast1 (Dec 16, 2021)

Newpylong said:


> I don't get how anyone is dealing with all of these convoluted policies. Paid parking, lodge changes, vaccine requirements for specific services, specific entrances, etc and so on.
> 
> I am glad where I ski you just park and can go into the lodge if need be and do your thing with no BS. Also even though I only get to Killington a handful of times a year now, it's still relatively straight forward there now.
> 
> Vail has literally taken the fun out of it by making you think so much for something that is supposed to be about relaxing and not really thinking.


Add on the cost cutting and skimpy snowmaking and i'm not sure why you'd even want to go to a vail property.  But there are masses of people that like the wal mart experience


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## Vince (Dec 16, 2021)

Vail is Walmart. Ikon is Target.

I booted up at my car at Okemo did not deal with the lodge but I believe you go in one entrance and show proof of vaccination and exit a different door.


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## Geoff (Dec 17, 2021)

It’s 9:02.  I’m booted up in the Carinthia lot with the trunk of my rental car touching the “snow”.   It’s like early April in a lean snow year.


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## urungus (Dec 19, 2021)

So how did the first day of paid parking go ?


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## drjeff (Dec 19, 2021)

urungus said:


> So how did the first day of paid parking go ?


Way more cars in the free lots than the paid lots from what I saw.

Overall wasn't a crowded day though. 

My wife and I, and a bunch of friends of ours with parking passes (they actually sold them to past parking pass holders and other regulars in the know) were happy with day 1 of the roughly 50% paid parking situation


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## ctdubl07 (Dec 19, 2021)

Over at Carinthia, the $30 lot which is directly in front of slopes was at about 50% while the $15 lot (facing towards ticket window) was nearly full but not to the point where people are jamming themselves up on banks like a holiday weekend.

As i look at my window, there are about 2 rows queing up now.


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## cdskier (Dec 19, 2021)

I'm curious exactly how this works (I couldn't find details on Mt Snow's website other than you need to pay for the parking via an app). Do they check as you enter the lot whether you've paid for parking? Or do they go through the lots throughout the day and check license plates or something like that of the cars that are parked in the premium lots?


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## drjeff (Dec 19, 2021)

cdskier said:


> I'm curious exactly how this works (I couldn't find details on Mt Snow's website other than you need to pay for the parking via an app). Do they check as you enter the lot whether you've paid for parking? Or do they go through the lots throughout the day and check license plates or something like that of the cars that are parked in the premium lots?


A combo thus far of parking lot attendants informing people when they park, then they apparently also check the plates during the day. A violation results in a ticket for twice the fee for the day in that lot. Apparently after 3 violations of the same plate, the vehicle will be towed


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## Geoff (Dec 19, 2021)

drjeff said:


> Way more cars in the free lots than the paid lots from what I saw.
> 
> Overall wasn't a crowded day though.
> 
> My wife and I, and a bunch of friends of ours with parking passes (they actually sold them to past parking pass holders and other regulars in the know) were happy with day 1 of the roughly 50% paid parking situation


I had the Killington weekend/holiday season parking pass since they started doing it after the K1 gondola went in.  20+ years going back to the late 1990s.  In my opinion, midweek pay parking is just going to annoy the customers since so few will be used.


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## Geoff (Dec 19, 2021)

drjeff said:


> A combo thus far of parking lot attendants informing people when they park, then they apparently also check the plates during the day. A violation results in a ticket for twice the fee for the day in that lot. Apparently after 3 violations of the same plate, the vehicle will be towed


So a midweek day trip in a Hertz rental car is “get out of jail free”.   It’s not like a “ticket” is from the town.


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## cdskier (Dec 19, 2021)

Geoff said:


> So a midweek day trip in a Hertz rental car is “get out of jail free”.   It’s not like a “ticket” is from the town.


Yea...I'm kind of curious how they force people to pay the tickets. Sure they can tow cars, but I don't know that they'd have any way to find out who the owner of a given car is to follow-up if the ticket isn't paid. As for the rental idea, you're paying for the rental car, so I'm not really sure this gains you anything financially other than sticking it to Vail.


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## Geoff (Dec 19, 2021)

cdskier said:


> Yea...I'm kind of curious how they force people to pay the tickets. Sure they can tow cars, but I don't know that they'd have any way to find out who the owner of a given car is to follow-up if the ticket isn't paid. As for the rental idea, you're paying for the rental car, so I'm not really sure this gains you anything financially other than sticking it to Vail.


I’ve been renting cars at Hertz Local Edition for day trips.  I found a $29 rate for a “full size” car.  Friday was an Altima so full size is poetic license.  From West Portugal, Mount Snow is 350+ miles round trip so I’d rather use rental cars than pile up miles on mine.  I think it’s unlikely that Mount Snow would chase Hertz to find out who rented some Altima and neglected to pay a parking lot fee.


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## Smellytele (Dec 19, 2021)

cdskier said:


> Yea...I'm kind of curious how they force people to pay the tickets. Sure they can tow cars, but I don't know that they'd have any way to find out who the owner of a given car is to follow-up if the ticket isn't paid. As for the rental idea, you're paying for the rental car, so I'm not really sure this gains you anything financially other than sticking it to Vail.


I was thinking if they don't tow you until after the 3rd offense the once or twice a year folks can just blow it off.


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## slatham (Dec 19, 2021)

Hearing from an unnamed (controversial) source that free parking ran out at 10, and people had to pay to park? I can't even fathom getting there at 10 (late for me, not for most) and told pay up or go home (or to Okemo, the nearest EPIC option)?So the whole paid parking thing to me is troublesome enough, but fine, you want more revenue, and people are willing to pay to be close. Fine. But to have such limited free parking as to fill up by 10am is beyond comprehension. 

I hope this isn't so.


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## meff (Dec 19, 2021)

When we left Seasons just after noontime we saw a decent number of open spots in E.  Probably won't be the case as more of the mountain opens and conditions improve.


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## ThatGuy (Dec 19, 2021)

slatham said:


> Hearing from an unnamed (controversial) source that free parking ran out at 10, and people had to pay to park? I can't even fathom getting there at 10 (late for me, not for most) and told pay up or go home (or to Okemo, the nearest EPIC option)?So the whole paid parking thing to me is troublesome enough, but fine, you want more revenue, and people are willing to pay to be close. Fine. But to have such limited free parking as to fill up by 10am is beyond comprehension.
> 
> I hope this isn't so.


If I’m thinking of the same source, the people defending it in the comments are hilarious. Its one thing for Lot A and the front rows of B and C to be paid, but when ~70% of the entire parking area is paid thats insane. Weekdays being paid at all is egregious.
Doesn’t really even effect me personally because I ski weekday afternoons there but the precedent it sets bothers me.


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## cdskier (Dec 19, 2021)

ThatGuy said:


> If I’m thinking of the same source, the people defending it in the comments are hilarious. Its one thing for Lot A and the front rows of B and C to be paid, but when ~70% of the entire parking area is paid thats insane. Weekdays being paid at all is egregious.
> Doesn’t really even effect me personally because I ski weekday afternoons there but the precedent it sets bothers me.


I think we're all thinking of the same source. And it is mind-boggling that anyone would defend Vail on this practice (although most posts defending the practice seemed to be coming from the same person over and over). Like you said, a small percentage of parking being premium is one thing...but when it is a rather substantial amount of your lots that are pay to park it is ridiculous. Vail on one hand preaches about how their new Epic pass prices are designed to allow "Epic for everyone", then they go and charge a rather substantial amount to park at one of their biggest resorts in the northeast. That $15/$30 a day will add up quickly for someone that skis a lot on weekends.

This also doesn't impact me directly as I don't ski at Mt Snow, but it also just bothers me in general due to the precedent it sets. I'm a big proponent of hopefully seeing this plan crash and burn.


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## drjeff (Dec 20, 2021)

slatham said:


> Hearing from an unnamed (controversial) source that free parking ran out at 10, and people had to pay to park? I can't even fathom getting there at 10 (late for me, not for most) and told pay up or go home (or to Okemo, the nearest EPIC option)?So the whole paid parking thing to me is troublesome enough, but fine, you want more revenue, and people are willing to pay to be close. Fine. But to have such limited free parking as to fill up by 10am is beyond comprehension.
> 
> I hope this isn't so.


Free parking on the North Entrance outer lots may likely have been totally filled by 10 today. Based on what the free lots down by Snow Lake looked like, they never ran out of all the free parking spaces. 

The new system will take some getting used to. It is what it is. I liked the old system better


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## urungus (Dec 20, 2021)

Got to Mt Snow a little before noon on Sunday, lot D and terraces were full, found one of the very last free spots in lot E, right across the road from Snow Lake.  Waited 15 min at the shuttle stop, gave up and trudged over to the covered bridge, where I had seen people riding the conveyor, but was waved off by an attendant who said they were closed.  Guys next to me confirmed the conveyor had been taking people up earlier in the day.  So walked the rest of the way up the hill to the lifts.

To avoid bluebird crowds, took Canyon Express/River Run to North Face, where they had both lifts running and both were ski on all day.  The icy conditions probably had something to do with it.  Chute in particular was wind scoured and trecherous.

Ski-on at Sunbrook too.  Thanks Walt / Coud 9 better than North face.  But Bear Trap was also pretty  icy.  And no music from the speakers on Bear Trap, is that some new anti-fun Vail policy ?

Best snow of day was found at Carinthia, only The Gulch had any features so the other runs were deserted and had not been scraped off.  Milky Way connector back down to Sunbrook was also very nice.

Guy was holding up the line at the outdoor waffle cabin arguing with cashier about not getting epic pass dining discount.  Which according to my calculations would have been a savings of $1.30 on his waffle.

Returning to main base area from top of Heavy Metal lift, there Is almost immediately a short pitch on  Long John, that was sheer boilerplate at the top, and pretty moguly at the bottom, and was causing alot of carnage.

Speaking of Long John… On way home I always get a Slurpee at the Dover 7-11, there was some Jerry (not a townie) in there shouting numbers into his phone, he was dressed only in skin-tight long john underwear, the back of his long john bottoms sagging halfway down his boxers.


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## NYDB (Dec 20, 2021)

^it sounds like you got the full Mt. Snow experience.  You didn't see a fight? 

It's still early season I guess.


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## JimG. (Dec 20, 2021)

Geoff said:


> I’ve been renting cars at Hertz Local Edition for day trips.  I found a $29 rate for a “full size” car.  Friday was an Altima so full size is poetic license.  From West Portugal, Mount Snow is 350+ miles round trip so I’d rather use rental cars than pile up miles on mine.  I think it’s unlikely that Mount Snow would chase Hertz to find out who rented some Altima and neglected to pay a parking lot fee.


Brilliant strategy I like it.


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## Geoff (Dec 20, 2021)

JimG. said:


> Brilliant strategy I like it.


Brilliant except my ride to the ski resort is at least 2 1/2 hours.


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## JimG. (Dec 20, 2021)

Geoff said:


> Brilliant except my ride to the ski resort is at least 2 1/2 hours.


That's fairly average for the places I ski. I'm known to daytrip K which is about 350 round trip.


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## Geoff (Dec 21, 2021)

JimG. said:


> That's fairly average for the places I ski. I'm known to daytrip K which is about 350 round trip.


Killington is 440 miles round trip for me.  I did that a number of times to turn the heat on or attend the annual condo meeting in June.   3 hours 40 minutes including a gas stop is the light traffic drive time at 75 mph.


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## skimagic (Jan 16, 2022)

I have a VT 4pass to use and was going to head to mount snow Tuesday although it looks a bit windy. I haven't been there during big wind in quite a while, how wind prone is the canyon lift?


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## drjeff (Jan 16, 2022)

skimagic said:


> I have a VT 4pass to use and was going to head to mount snow Tuesday although it looks a bit windy. I haven't been there during big wind in quite a while, how wind prone is the canyon lift?


If the winds are out of the NW, that is the direction most often responsible for wind holds on Canyon.

As an aside, the Ego Alley lift was shut down around noon today due to an issue with a couple of sheaves on one of the towers at the top of Yardsale.

Mechanics were up on the tower soon after they got the lift cleared. It didn't operate the rest of the day, and not sure of its status for tomorrow. Given that that lift is often one of the few base area lifts that is able to run on big wind days, the combo of the remaining MLK Weekend crowds, a good snow storm, and likely wind holds could make tomorrow challenging crowd wise.

On the plus, there were more cars heading South on the roads and highways this evening than I would of expected as I drove back to CT. And I know that many of my friends who typically would of stayed up through MLK Day, but have work obligations they HAVE to be home for 1st thing Tuesday AM chose to leave before the storm arrives, as travel tomorrow sure seems like it will be tough for a good chunk of the day


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## ctdubl07 (Jan 17, 2022)

A great day all around. Nitro, HMatal and Ego were running from the start. I think Outpost came on around 10 followed by Canyon around 11 (which caused a crazy bottleneck in TNF until Challenger started) and then the BlueBird soon after. Much quicker than i expected from folks comments. We hammered all the woods we could find, all the front side natural trails (Ledge, Uncles, Hop, Shootout, skier left BearTrap) and maybe poached Iron Run to the pipe headwall a few times We went wire to wire and the crowds were FAR smaller than Id have ever had expected but I agree, we were leaving the bar last night and the outbound travel was crazy heavy like Id never seen. It did get a little sticky later in day but still great. Interesting that they spent end of the day setting up the corrals for the GS lift and ran it for awhile...maybe its get the nod tomorrow while the clean the bubble? Have fun.  Your going to have a great day Tuesday. Still plenty of snow in the woods. Never should have picked Friday to play hookie....tomorrows is the day but Mom says we cant miss anymore school.. ..


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## Newpylong (Jan 17, 2022)

Iron Run is one of my favorites anywhere. That run is just peaceful.


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## jaytrem (Jan 17, 2022)

ctdubl07 said:


> I think Outpost came on around 10 followed by Canyon around 11 (which caused a crazy bottleneck in TNF until Challenger started) and then the BlueBird soon after.



Outpost was open from the start, just had to trek over from Ego.  Went right over to it first thing.  Was super quiet over there for our first 4 runs, then crowds slowly built up.


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## nh2maboarder (Jan 31, 2022)

Does anyone have recommendations on easier blue trails at Mount Snow?


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## pinion247 (Jan 31, 2022)

nh2maboarder said:


> Does anyone have recommendations on easier blue trails at Mount Snow?



IMO everything off of Canyons Quad and the Sundance triple. Many of those would be greens at some other New England mountains, and have a steady easy pitch to them.

Sources used: My wife who only ever wants to ski Blues. Those two are here favorite areas. Added bonus that Sundance area is often forgotten by crowds.


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## ThatGuy (Jan 31, 2022)

pinion247 said:


> IMO everything off of Canyons Quad and the Sundance triple. Many of those would be greens at some other New England mountains, and have a steady easy pitch to them.
> 
> Sources used: My wife who only ever wants to ski Blues. Those two are here favorite areas. Added bonus that Sundance area is often forgotten by crowds.


Do you mean Sunbrook? Lots of easy blues over there.


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## pinion247 (Jan 31, 2022)

ThatGuy said:


> Do you mean Sunbrook? Lots of easy blues over there.



I like the Sunbrook blues but the lift length/speed and post-AM crowds over there the past few visits have me hating it. Could be just bad timing. Sundance area is untapped chill IMO... the new quad should bring alot more people into that area next year.


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## ss20 (Jan 31, 2022)

ThatGuy said:


> Do you mean Sunbrook? Lots of easy blues over there.



That was my thought as well.  The stuff off Sundance is on the tougher end of the blue spectrum for Mount Snow, and much of it ungroomed.  Ridge, while wide and has snowmaking, has some very steep rolls.


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## pinion247 (Jan 31, 2022)

ss20 said:


> That was my thought as well.  The stuff off Sundance is on the tougher end of the blue spectrum for Mount Snow, and much of it ungroomed.  Ridge, while wide and has snowmaking, has some very steep rolls.


I was thinking skiers left off Sundance, but still that might be the same with the rolls. My wife hates steeps and loves that area, so can't be too hard  Point taken though, the original questions was "easier blues at Mount Snow".


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## nh2maboarder (Jan 31, 2022)

Thanks for all the responses! We will be there Friday and Sat, so hopefully crowds wont be too bad in the Sunbrook area on Friday at least!


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## Tonyr (Jan 31, 2022)

Skied Mount Snow for the first time today and was pleasantly surprised. The infrastructure is great and it's going to get even better next year with the new lift upgrades. The terrain is on the mellow side but we found a handful of really fun tree runs on and off the map. I'd definitely go back, it was a nice way to finish up what was a freezing cold weekend of skiing otherwise....


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## skiur (Feb 1, 2022)

Mt snow isn't a bad place to visit midweek once or twice a year.  I couldn't do weekends their and would get bored after a couple days, but when conditions are good it ain't so bad.


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## drjeff (Feb 1, 2022)

skiur said:


> Mt snow isn't a bad place to visit midweek once or twice a year.  I couldn't do weekends their and would get bored after a couple days, but when conditions are good it ain't so bad.



For us regulars, it's not always about the terrain, it often is as much about the people who are also regulars at the mountain. There really is a strong, great community of people there, as is the case at just about every mountains regulars,

You appreciate the "good" days and then on the so/so days, you also apprecaite the friendship with others who love the sport you do as much.

If later this week can deliver a decent storm, Mount Snow should be able to get into the very good category, as most everywhere (maybe Ripcord until they make some snow on it) has some good base snow down on it, now we just need some "frosting" on top of it!


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## chuckstah (Feb 1, 2022)

drjeff said:


> For us regulars, it's not always about the terrain, it often is as much about the people who are also regulars at the mountain. There really is a strong, great community of people there, as is the case at just about every mountains regulars,
> 
> You appreciate the "good" days and then on the so/so days, you also apprecaite the friendship with others who love the sport you do as much.
> 
> If later this week can deliver a decent storm, Mount Snow should be able to get into the very good category, as most everywhere (maybe Ripcord until they make some snow on it) has some good base snow down on it, now we just need some "frosting" on top of it!


They were pounding Ripcord yesterday, though not open yet.


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## drjeff (Feb 1, 2022)

chuckstah said:


> They were pounding Ripcord yesterday, though not open yet.


Yup, just saw a post on FB from a friend from this morning where you can see the whale building actively going on on Ripcord as well as Beartrap and a few other locations. Snowmakers back at it!


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## Geoff (Feb 1, 2022)

drjeff said:


> For us regulars, it's not always about the terrain, it often is as much about the people who are also regulars at the mountain. There really is a strong, great community of people there, as is the case at just about every mountains regulars,
> 
> You appreciate the "good" days and then on the so/so days, you also apprecaite the friendship with others who love the sport you do as much.
> 
> If later this week can deliver a decent storm, Mount Snow should be able to get into the very good category, as most everywhere (maybe Ripcord until they make some snow on it) has some good base snow down on it, now we just need some "frosting" on top of it!


I could have written this about my almost 40 years at Killington.  It’s nice to know a big pile of people.  There’s always someone to ski with.  Lots of lifelong friends.  In each other’s weddings.   Godparents.  I took a hard look at changing mountains several times but it’s tough to give up the roots.  It’s really strange not being there this winter.


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## slatham (Feb 5, 2022)

Whats the story with Mt Snow not having most of the fixed grip lifts running? I understand the issues with the detachable, but one of the good things about Mt Snow historically with winds and ice is there are many fixed grips that can run. Sundance, Ego, Sunbrook, North Face x2. The icing stopped 24+ hours ago now.


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## icecoast1 (Feb 5, 2022)

slatham said:


> Whats the story with Mt Snow not having most of the fixed grip lifts running? I understand the issues with the detachable, but one of the good things about Mt Snow historically with winds and ice is there are many fixed grips that can run. Sundance, Ego, Sunbrook, North Face x2. The icing stopped 24+ hours ago now.


staffing issues,  vail unwilling to pay overtime to existing staff to work 24/7 to get lifts open?  Also wouldn't be surprised if they are prioritizing the detachables now since the bulk of the epic clientele prefer them


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## IceEidolon (Feb 5, 2022)

Enough ice will stop a fixed grip also, and if everything is down they might as well prioritize the highest capacity lifts.


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## KustyTheKlown (Feb 5, 2022)

A friend texted me a nightmare video from mount snow. One of the wildest lift lines I’ve ever seen. Lots of people turned up to ski dust on ice? lol


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## ThatGuy (Feb 5, 2022)

KustyTheKlown said:


> A friend texted me a nightmare video from mount snow. One of the wildest lift lines I’ve ever seen. Lots of people turned up to ski dust on ice? lol


Saw that on the Mt Snow passholders group, looked insane. Anyone there today that can chime in?


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## nh2maboarder (Feb 6, 2022)

ThatGuy said:


> Saw that on the Mt Snow passholders group, looked insane. Anyone there today that can chime in?


Back in October I booked a group vaca for 10 at Mt. Snow thu-sat night. Bluebird today had the longest line I’ve ever seen in my life. We showed up and immediately turned around and left. There were people waiting in line for the canyon lift and it wasn’t even open cause of ice. We thought about going to Okemo but figured it couldn’t be much better, and it would’ve been an hour drive for the 10 of us. Just went to a brewery instead.


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## slatham (Feb 6, 2022)

The pics I saw from Bromley were incredible - solid 1" looked like it could be 2" of ice. They still have only 3 lower Mountian fixed grips and "hope" to have HSQ at some point today (Sunday). Stratton still has 3 high speed lifts and the Gondi down.

I knew from hearing from the Magic crew there was a lot of ice at the summit but I guess the higher you went the worse it got. 

Okemo seemed to do OK as they were on northern edge of icing and got more snow. Further north powder day.

SoVT just can't win this winter. Snow is either just north or just south/east.


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## icecoast1 (Feb 6, 2022)

ThatGuy said:


> Saw that on the Mt Snow passholders group, looked insane. Anyone there today that can chime in?


Nothing open but the bluebird and a couple of fixed grips that only go up part way on a weekend, not really sure why anybody would be surprised.  I'm no vail guy but after it was broadcast all over social media that they got a huge ice storm and lifts weren't going to be spinning, anybody that would still choose to show up on a Saturday at Mount Snow in those conditions really cant complain.


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## nh2maboarder (Feb 6, 2022)

icecoast1 said:


> Nothing open but the bluebird and a couple of fixed grips that only go up part way on a weekend, not really sure why anybody would be surprised.  I'm no vail guy but after it was broadcast all over social media that they got a huge ice storm and lifts weren't going to be spinning, anybody that would still choose to show up on a Saturday at Mount Snow in those conditions really cant complain.


Yeah agreed, only reason we showed up is cause we were staying 10 minutes away and just didn’t feel up to driving.


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## FBGM (Feb 6, 2022)

Looks Epic


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## KustyTheKlown (Feb 6, 2022)

the schadenfraude is delicious til you realize theyre gonna flood ikon and Indy next year


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## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Feb 6, 2022)

Good day to be at Stowe


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## icecoast1 (Feb 6, 2022)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> Good day to be at Stowe


Good day to be at a non epic area far enough north to have missed the ice storm


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## abc (Feb 6, 2022)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> Good day to be at Stowe





icecoast1 said:


> Good day to be at a non epic area far enough north to have missed the ice storm



Good day on cross country skis


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## Corwin (Feb 7, 2022)

nh2maboarder said:


> Back in October I booked a group vaca for 10 at Mt. Snow thu-sat night. Bluebird today had the longest line I’ve ever seen in my life. We showed up and immediately turned around and left. There were people waiting in line for the canyon lift and it wasn’t even open cause of ice. We thought about going to Okemo but figured it couldn’t be much better, and it would’ve been an hour drive for the 10 of us. Just went to a brewery instead.


I was at Mount Snow on Friday morning after driving up the night before. The precipitation was supposed to switch from freezing rain to snow overnight but it never happened. I finally bailed on Mount Snow around 11am and drove to Okemo (wishing I had done so sooner). On the drive north, it switched from freezing rain to snow. Conditions were great at Okemo on Friday, and even better on Saturday.


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## nh2maboarder (Feb 7, 2022)

Corwin said:


> I was at Mount Snow on Friday morning after driving up the night before. The precipitation was supposed to switch from freezing rain to snow overnight but it never happened. I finally bailed on Mount Snow around 11am and drove to Okemo (wishing I had done so sooner). On the drive north, it switched from freezing rain to snow. Conditions were great at Okemo on Friday, and even better on Saturday.


Yeah I should clarify. Friday morning we thought about going to Okemo. I would have done it if it was just me and my wife, but we were worried about driving since the ice was insane and never switched over to snow until Friday afternoon, so we didn't end up going to Okemo on Friday. On Saturday, we (stupidly) thought more lifts would be open at Mt Snow, and by the time we realized that it was gonna be another dud, we thought about driving to Okemo but we would've gotten there at like maybe 10:30 and figured we should just bag it.


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## kevinm55 (Feb 7, 2022)

KustyTheKlown said:


> the schadenfraude is delicious til you realize theyre gonna flood ikon and Indy next year


Krusty - bingo, I had that exact discussion while at Stratton last weekend…I fear the amount of converts to IKON for next season is going to be tremendous with obviously painful results in terms of crowds.


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## drjeff (Feb 19, 2022)

What a difference a few hours, and an over performing snow squall makes!

Really firm and slick in places until about 10. If it didn't get groomed, it looked glacial.

Then it started snowing about 10. And kept snowing until about 1, with about 6" falling. Then another squall went through just before 2, dropping another inch!

Sure it's firm underneath, but I definitely won't complain about a surprise 7" or so powder day! And mtn ops is still making a bunch of snow! Ridge, Plummet, Thanks Walt, and what looks like from my condo, Fool's Gold still getting hammered by the guns.

Crowds were what I would describe as a typical weekend from what I experienced today


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## slatham (Feb 19, 2022)

drjeff said:


> What a difference a few hours, and an over performing snow squall makes!
> 
> Really firm and slick in places until about 10. If it didn't get groomed, it looked glacial.
> 
> ...


Thats great to hear. I was impressed when I saw the report of all 20 lifts running. And guns went on yesterday by like 10am? Vail may suck but from afar looks like Mt Snow rocked it for ultimate Presidents weekend recover.


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## TyWebb (Feb 19, 2022)

@slatham - Yea I read online that they've been blowing tons of snow yesterday and today to try to recoup


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## drjeff (Feb 19, 2022)

TyWebb said:


> I read online that they've also been blowing tons of snow yesterday and today to try to recoup


The whales from phase 1 of their recovery effort are BIG! Phase 2 going on now.. Ridge, Plummet, Thanks Walt and either Nitro or Fools Gold (tough to tell from the angle my back deck provides).

Their snowmaking system is cranking right now. And mother nature feeling a bit generous today didn't hurt things either!


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## Pez (Feb 21, 2022)

So far I've only been to snow once int he early season.  what's the paid parking situation like? How are they charging? is there a booth? 

Anyone going to give me grief if I park at the snow barn and walk?


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## RichT (Feb 21, 2022)

Should of been doing that ALL season. They're trying to make everyone forget about Dec/Jan. Kinda like politicians on an election year!


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## MikeDeJ (Mar 1, 2022)

Hearing Mt snow will fire up the guns on Carinthia ( Nitro, fools, Inferno and gulch) tonight thru Saturday and bury it.  Looking to extend the season thru 4/24??

Also hear a rumor with no confirmation that with the new lifts going in they are planning to close the main base and Main Mtn March 18th or so??  I really cant believe this as that is early even for lift projects.  With the snowmaking happeing on the Carinthia face I guessed we would finish the season over on that side but mid/late march would be rough with limited terrain and 2 charilifts for a month plus.  Did anyone else hear this??


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## drjeff (Mar 1, 2022)

MikeDeJ said:


> Hearing Mt snow will fire up the guns on Carinthia ( Nitro, fools, Inferno and gulch) tonight thru Saturday and bury it.  Looking to extend the season thru 4/24??
> 
> Also hear a rumor with no confirmation that with the new lifts going in they are planning to close the main base and Main Mtn March 18th or so??  I really cant believe this as that is early even for lift projects.  With the snowmaking happeing on the Carinthia face I guessed we would finish the season over on that side but mid/late march would be rough with limited terrain and 2 charilifts for a month plus.  Did anyone else hear this??



Haven't heard that one yet.

When the installed the Bluebird 11 Summers ago, they did cut and drop the old towers of the Summit Local and drag them down over snow, with a cat, to an area infront of the Sundance Lodge until they were finally hauled away on flatbed trailers later in the Spring.

They did close over at Carinthia last year, as well as a couple of other years in the past, so that wouldn't be unprecedented.

They have made a bunch of snow lately on main face, and Northface trails that in all likelihood wouldn't be used to drag the old towers over on their way to a base area staging zone.

In reality they could take down the haul rope and towers in Sunbrook while the main and Northfaces are open. They'd need to close off Long John, Ridge and Southbowl and Cooper's Junction for a day when they drop the haul rope on Tumbleweed, and Ridge, Southbowl and Cooper's Junction when they drop the haul rope on Sundance.

Tower transport to the base likely could be done after operating hours.

Given that March 19/20 weekend is often the last weekend for Sunbrook in many years, if they started their 1st, and strategically did a bunch of the other lift deconstruction on midweek days, I could see the main and Northfaces operating into April.

I know for a fact that they do have events scheduled for the general main base area the last weekend in March.

Guess we'll find out in a few weeks! And if the snowmakers start hammering Carinthia trails the next few days, who knows how that plays into it??


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## machski (Mar 1, 2022)

drjeff said:


> Haven't heard that one yet.
> 
> When the installed the Bluebird 11 Summers ago, they did cut and drop the old towers of the Summit Local and drag them down over snow, with a cat, to an area infront of the Sundance Lodge until they were finally hauled away on flatbed trailers later in the Spring.
> 
> ...


Are they even going to go with new towers on Sunbrook?  I mean, it's a FGQ now, they very well could reuse the towers as that terrain profile isn't some crazy, steep line.  SR did this with the North Peak Express, half the towers are the Triple's with new top tube mount points from Dopp.  Killington did this with Skye Peak Express, with a few towers at the top getting extensions to increase the height profile to accommodate the detach summit terminal.


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## drjeff (Mar 1, 2022)

machski said:


> Are they even going to go with new towers on Sunbrook?  I mean, it's a FGQ now, they very well could reuse the towers as that terrain profile isn't some crazy, steep line.  SR did this with the North Peak Express, half the towers are the Triple's with new top tube mount points from Dopp.  Killington did this with Skye Peak Express, with a few towers at the top getting extensions to increase the height profile to accommodate the detach summit terminal.



Guessing that they will be brand new towers as the original Sunbrook lift is a 30+ year old CTEC and the new lift will be a Doppelmayr and even though they're now under the same corporate umbrella, if you go out through the expected life span of a lift, then you'd be looking at towers and footings that would likely be 60+ years old

Plus if I remember corerctly, new towers were specified in the Act 60 documents that were filed for the lift


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## MikeDeJ (Mar 1, 2022)

drjeff said:


> Haven't heard that one yet.
> 
> When the installed the Bluebird 11 Summers ago, they did cut and drop the old towers of the Summit Local and drag them down over snow, with a cat, to an area infront of the Sundance Lodge until they were finally hauled away on flatbed trailers later in the Spring.
> 
> ...


I was there for the bluebird install and agree with you maybe just a midweek (or a few days during the week) shut down, then the 18th makes sense.


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## MikeDeJ (Mar 1, 2022)

drjeff said:


> Guessing that they will be brand new towers as the original Sunbrook lift is a 30+ year old CTEC and the new lift will be a Doppelmayr and even though they're now under the same corporate umbrella, if you go out through the expected life span of a lift, then you'd be looking at towers and footings that would likely be 60+ years old
> 
> Plus if I remember corerctly, new towers were specified in the Act 60 documents that were filed for the lift


I also think those towers are a mortar in tower, not a bolt on (concrete base).  No way they are using those, plus I have to believe they are going to do something different at the unload.  Lower the approach so they dont need that huge ramp and lower the chairs so less wind holds?  Both lift projects should really move people to under skied areas. 

 Next to add capacity to the carinthia area lifts and remodel/rebuild the Sundance lodge?  Adding a lift at Sundance is great but the base area is tough and really not much parking?  So people will ride but still go to main to eat, park etc...


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## jaytrem (Mar 1, 2022)

The base of Sunbrook will be over near the bottom of beartrap, so it will run up a slightly different line.  Would be shocked if they moved the old towers.


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## Newpylong (Mar 2, 2022)

They must not have liked what they saw with the towers, because they have could reused the majority and redone the top and bottom approaches to the terminals and kept the rest.

Has there been any indication of the snowmaking being expanded in the Upper Sundance area? Having a 6 pack dumping that many skiers out onto essentially Long John (with Ridge a short way downhill) is going to be something I want a webcam to enjoy.


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## MikeDeJ (Mar 2, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> They must not have liked what they saw with the towers, because they have could reused the majority and redone the top and bottom approaches to the terminals and kept the rest.
> 
> Has there been any indication of the snowmaking being expanded in the Upper Sundance area? Having a 6 pack dumping that many skiers out onto essentially Long John (with Ridge a short way downhill) is going to be something I want a webcam to enjoy.


Under Peak there was talk of adding snowmaking on Shootout and Hop.  Never heard anything about Uncles.  I have not heard anything since Vail, but it only makes sense.  Im thinking they may even blast and /or widen Shootout and make it an easy Blue?? With the NFS permission.


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## slatham (Mar 2, 2022)

The talk from Peak around West Lake justification and upside was Cleary 100% snowmaking. Whether Vail follows through is a good question. Personally I think there are some trails that should be left alone, Uncles and Jaws being top of my list......


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## jaytrem (Mar 2, 2022)

I'd be shocked if they didn't do Hop and Shootout soon.  But I agree, leave Uncles natural, and don't ever widen (it's been in some plans).


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## drjeff (Mar 2, 2022)

jaytrem said:


> I'd be shocked if they didn't do Hop and Shootout soon.  But I agree, leave Uncles natural, and don't ever widen (it's been in some plans).



Hop, Shootout, the short top part of high traverse that goes from the top of the Sundance lift over to Southbowl on the main face, and then shooting star, big dipper, moonbeam and moonwalk in Sunbrook should be no brainers to add snowmaking to with these new lifts


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## jaytrem (Mar 2, 2022)

Yeah, with the new Sundance lift, Shooting star should be one of the top priorities.  Keep people from trying to get to Milky Way to access Sunbroook.  

The more I think I about it, the more I don't want a high speed on the North Face.  Should be even less crowded next year with the 2 new chairs keeping even more people occupied.


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## drjeff (Mar 2, 2022)

jaytrem said:


> Yeah, with the new Sundance lift, Shooting star should be one of the top priorities.  Keep people from trying to get to Milky Way to access Sunbroook.
> 
> The more I think I about it, the more I don't want a high speed on the North Face.  Should be even less crowded next year with the 2 new chairs keeping even more people occupied.



Honestly I hope when it's time to replace the lifts on the Northface that a highspeed is the last thing they consider!

It's not a long ride as it is, and much better for wind and de-icing purposes to keep things fixed grip on the Northface IMHO!


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## ThatGuy (Mar 2, 2022)

Uncles doesn’t need snowmaking or widening its one of the few trails on the Main Face with character. Also with the new six pack and Sunbrooks new high speed as well, the lower half of Long John is going to be an even bigger disaster than it already is. Huge chokepoint at the knuckle past Carinthia. They really have to prioritize having both High and Low Traverse open to spread people out.


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## drjeff (Mar 2, 2022)

ThatGuy said:


> Uncles doesn’t need snowmaking or widening its one of the few trails on the Main Face with character. Also with the new six pack and Sunbrooks new high speed as well, the lower half of Long John is going to be an even bigger disaster than it already is. Huge chokepoint at the knuckle past Carinthia. They really have to prioritize having both High and Low Traverse open to spread people out.



Actually they have started to address the Long John issue, in signage atleast, already.  What they did this season is just before the Carinthia corner, what used to be known as Deer Run go its name switched to Long John and that part of Long John from Carinthia corner on down to the top of Heavy Metal is now Deer Run.  That way they try and keep the beginners on Long John and send the park crowd looking to get from the top of Carinthia on down to Gulch without having to deal with the flat at the bottom of Mineshaft on Deer Run.  Does it work any better???  Honestly not sure if I have noticed that much of a difference with keeping beginners off that section of now Deer Run.  And next season, with likely more people lapping Sunbrook, and maybe not wanting to "climb out" of Sunbrook back over to the Main Face, the Beartrap lift will likely get more use which inturn will likely feed more people onto what is now Deer Run......

I am quite curious to see what the new lifts will do to traffic flow and volumes of people at certain lifts next season....


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## ThatGuy (Mar 2, 2022)

That Beartrap exit is where I think the chokepoint will be accentuated. Haven’t even noticed the trail names being switched there but if they make it more obvious that should help a little. As for traffic patterns I foresee Sunbrook getting a lot more use, and the new 6-Pack being utilized heavily also because of that. Probably going to be significantly less people venturing over to the North Face, especially on colder days.


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## ThatGuy (Mar 2, 2022)

Regardless, snowmaking needs to be expanded on Sunbrook if the skier traffic is going to increase.


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## Newpylong (Mar 2, 2022)

I agree with what you guys have mentioned.

Shooting Star is an absolute must to get folks over to Sunbrook. I imagine it will actually absorb a large percentage of downhill traffic because it's what you will see when you will get off the lift.

Next in priority in my mind would be Shootout and Hop simultaneously. Yes Shootout will likely need to have some width added for the lift anyway, which will lend itself well to snowmaking coverage. They are going to be critical to absorb the balance of the traffic that doesn't go down to Sunbrook or bang a left.

High Traverse should get snowmaking (I bet the race folks could potentially lap the new lift vs the summit lifts for South Bowl events not starting from the top). However I do not think it needs its own infrastructure as the trail is so short you could  make a couple good piles at the top and push them down.

On Sunbrook proper I think Big Dipper is a high priority. Moonwalk and Moonbeam would be nice to haves, but not a necessity. The last pitch of Little Dipper needs to be widened if they do nothing with Moonbeam. I was actually very suprised when they installed snowmaking it was installed on current Little Dipper and not current Moonbeam - it's far wider and ends right at the lift.

I do not think Uncles or any naturals on the North Face should be touched, including either NF lift. They provide perfect redundancy and are shortish rides.

The only other move that could be a worthy possibility is snowmaking on (lower) Overbrook. It's already plenty wide and not a big loss to man made.


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## icecoast1 (Mar 2, 2022)

ThatGuy said:


> Uncles doesn’t need snowmaking or widening its one of the few trails on the Main Face with character. Also with the new six pack and Sunbrooks new high speed as well, the lower half of Long John is going to be an even bigger disaster than it already is. Huge chokepoint at the knuckle past Carinthia. They really have to prioritize having both High and Low Traverse open to spread people out.


The permitting process would probably be difficult to impossible, but it's too bad they couldn't extend the new lift all the way to the top so it would be a true summit lift


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## jaytrem (Mar 2, 2022)

drjeff said:


> It's not a long ride as it is, and much better for wind and de-icing purposes to keep things fixed grip on the Northface IMHO!


At least the new lifts have parking rails.  Such a no brainer to out them in.  Might be able to keep up with Stratton a little better.


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## Newpylong (Mar 2, 2022)

icecoast1 said:


> The permitting process would probably be difficult to impossible, but it's too bad they couldn't extend the new lift all the way to the top so it would be a true summit lift



The advantage is it actually doesn't go to the top. There is already a HSS, HSQ, FGQ (soon to be HSQ), and two triples unloading at the summit. Drawing numbers away from the main base and summit are the goals.


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## drjeff (Mar 2, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> The advantage is it actually doesn't go to the top. There is already a HSS, HSQ, FGQ (soon to be HSQ), and two triples unloading at the summit. Drawing numbers away from the main base and summit are the goals.


Exactly!

The new Sundance 6 will *hopefully* keep some of the volume of folks currently ridng the Bluebird and Grand Summit who lap trails like Ridge, Long John and when open, Shootout, Hop, Uncles, etc,, out of the main base area lifts and get them onto the new Sundance HSS.  Since in reality, if you're lapping that side of the main face, the new Sundance lift will get them almost all the vertical that the Bluebird and Grand Summit do.  I am curious to see how this will affect traffic volume on the main face, as I have felt for a LONG time that a highspeed Sundace lift, even if they didn't extend it all the way down to the Sundance Lodge, would really help take some pressure off of the main base area lifts, especially once folks realize how much terrain that lift will serve on that side of the main face


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## icecoast1 (Mar 2, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> The advantage is it actually doesn't go to the top. There is already a HSS, HSQ, FGQ (soon to be HSQ), and two triples unloading at the summit. Drawing numbers away from the main base and summit are the goals.


It's going to be dropping people into the worst congested area of the mountain.  Adding snowmaking to some more trails will help but I can't imagine this helps the long John crowding issue


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## drjeff (Mar 2, 2022)

icecoast1 said:


> It's going to be dropping people into the worst congested area of the mountain.  Adding snowmaking to some more trails will help but I can't imagine this helps the long John crowding issue



I believe the point of the new Sundance lift was to never alieviate the crowd volume on Long John, but to more take some of the crowd volume off of The Bluebird, The Grand Summit Express and Canyon Express base area lifts.

As for Long John, it may actually end up creating a new issue at the top of the New Sundance 6 if/when the connector over to Sunbrook staright across Long John there, Shooting Star, is open and folks getting off the new lift, wanting to head straight into Sunbrook,, are crossing over Long John to get there


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## MikeDeJ (Mar 2, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> The advantage is it actually doesn't go to the top. There is already a HSS, HSQ, FGQ (soon to be HSQ), and two triples unloading at the summit. Drawing numbers away from the main base and summit are the goals.


It certainly is going to make Sunbrook a place to take a few runs.  Now it is one run down and the beartrap lift out!!  I hope they dont touch uncles either but I think the trees between Ridge and Uncles will see more traffic.  

I agree leave the North face lift as fixed grips.  After a few laps my knees dont mind the break, less wind holds etc..   I also agree the on busy days the North face may see less traffic.

I too cant wait to see how the traffic flows.  Being able to flow from the base of Sundance to Sunbrook and not go to the main base will take the pressure off the main base.


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## meff (Mar 3, 2022)

Anyone happen to know what brands the demo center at Mt. Snow has?


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## Atomic (Mar 17, 2022)

Ski-on bluebird bliss yesterday on the North Face. Super-soft corn/mashed potatoes with usual late-season grabby wet areas down low as you approach the lift. First two pics are looking up and down Chute, which was definitely run of the day. Coverage hanging in there pretty much all over the mountain but obviously looks like it will go fast given the forecast. Other shot is Ripcord which was closed but looked doable, although not by me in any case...


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## Zand (Mar 17, 2022)

Hah...I knew while skiing Castlerock yesterday that if Vail owned Sugarbush, it would've been closed yesterday. Looks like absolutely nothing is wrong with Ripcord.


Vail execs would be in the fetal position if they knew people were skiing this.


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## Kevin Schultz (Mar 19, 2022)

drjeff said:


> Actually they have started to address the Long John issue, in signage atleast, already.  What they did this season is just before the Carinthia corner, what used to be known as Deer Run go its name switched to Long John and that part of Long John from Carinthia corner on down to the top of Heavy Metal is now Deer Run.  That way they try and keep the beginners on Long John and send the park crowd looking to get from the top of Carinthia on down to Gulch without having to deal with the flat at the bottom of Mineshaft on Deer Run.  Does it work any better???  Honestly not sure if I have noticed that much of a difference with keeping beginners off that section of now Deer Run.  And next season, with likely more people lapping Sunbrook, and maybe not wanting to "climb out" of Sunbrook back over to the Main Face, the Beartrap lift will likely get more use which inturn will likely feed more people onto what is now Deer Run......
> 
> I am quite curious to see what the new lifts will do to traffic flow and volumes of people at certain lifts next season....


Have they ever considered grading the bottom of Mineshaft so that it's downhill the whole way from the top of Nitro to Inferno / Gulch? For skiers it's not that bad but most snowboarders can't make it without unstrapping which is what pushes them to Deer Run (ex-Long John).


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## doublediamond (Mar 20, 2022)

Not sure if that’s possible. You have a giant snowmaking reservoir right there.


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## Zand (Mar 20, 2022)

Just start tucking when you get off the Nitro Quad and don't stop or turn!


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## drjeff (Mar 21, 2022)

Heard from a VERY reliable source over the weekend that this Summer in addition to the new lifts for Sundance and Sunbrook, they will be reusing some of the triple chairs and upgrading Heavy Metal to a triple to help get a bit more capacity out of the Carinthia base area


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## ss20 (Mar 21, 2022)

drjeff said:


> Heard from a VERY reliable source over the weekend that this Summer in addition to the new lifts for Sundance and Sunbrook, they will be reusing some of the triple chairs and upgrading Heavy Metal to a triple to help get a bit more capacity out of the Carinthia base area



I always thought Sunbrook should be moved to Heavy Metal to increase capacity in Carinthia once it got ripped out.  This is certainly good too!


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## drjeff (Mar 21, 2022)

ss20 said:


> I always thought Sunbrook should be moved to Heavy Metal to increase capacity in Carinthia once it got ripped out.  This is certainly good too!


Apparently it was going to be a much bigger process, with a bunch more tree clearing needed, to upgrade it to a Quad


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## Newpylong (Mar 22, 2022)

Yes as soon as those crossarms go out in length... more trees.


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## Pez (Mar 22, 2022)

how is the snow holding up?


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## ThatGuy (Mar 22, 2022)

Pez said:


> how is the snow holding up?


Not good, was there yesterday. Will probably be Carinthia only after this weekend.


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## drjeff (Mar 22, 2022)

ThatGuy said:


> Not good, was there yesterday. Will probably be Carinthia only after this weekend.



They're going to do their best to hold the main face trails together through the April 2/3 weekend when they're having the Winter Brewfest on Saturday the 2nd. 

That is a much "easier" event to run for a host of reasons from the added available area, more restrooms, easier to control access points, a stage for the band, etc over at the main base area vs at Carinthia in they want it ski/ride in/out.

Going to need Mother Nature to cooperate a bit though. Cascade to Canyon should be in play then unless the weather goes on a 3-4 day in a row 60+ degrees run


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## Pez (Mar 22, 2022)

I guess reggae fest Saturday will end up being my last day of the season there.  didn't really get my money's worth out of the epic ne pass this winter.


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## njdiver85 (Mar 22, 2022)

drjeff said:


> Going to need Mother Nature to cooperate a bit though.



Seems they have good temps to make snow tonight, but sounds like they have no plans to do so.  I think Vail needs to cooperate a little as well, LOL.


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## drjeff (Mar 23, 2022)

njdiver85 said:


> Seems they have good temps to make snow tonight, but sounds like they have no plans to do so.  I think Vail needs to cooperate a little as well, LOL.



Pretty sure they just want to get the Main Face through the April 2/3 Weekend (and looking at the 10 day forecast, unless it deviates much warmer, they should have the snow to do that) and then my hunch is the Main Face becomes an active construction site with the demo and hauling down the hill of parts of the lifts coming down ahead of the new lifts to whatever parking lot they're choosing to put them in until they get hauled away.

Carinthia has a solid amount of snow on the likely Nitro, Fool's Gold, Deer Run and Gulch options they likely are looking at in their attempt at April 24th. Factor in that they will have snow from Mineshaft, Inferno, Grommet, what's in the half pipe area, and parts of Long John to farm from if needed, and they do have a fair amount of snow to utilize in the attempt for April 24th.

Again, if mother nature in a couple weeks throws a week of 60-70 degree temps at the mountain, doubt April 24th happens. Right now, if mother nature is relatively "normal" over the next month, I give them a 60/40 shot at making April 24th at Carinthia


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## drjeff (Mar 28, 2022)

Happened to be in the right place at the right time this morning to catch the mountain ops crew taking the 1st chair off of the Sundance Triple haul rope mid morning today!

Snow was firm and fast, and it was mid winter cold and breezy. Glad to just ride the Bluebird today to get out of the breeze on the way up the hill!


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## pinion247 (Apr 4, 2022)

Well, they managed to keep the Main and North Faces open this past weekend. Brew Fest was hopping on Saturday and got some light snow yesterday.


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## Smellytele (Apr 4, 2022)

pinion247 said:


> View attachment 53960View attachment 53959View attachment 53961View attachment 53962Well, they managed to keep the Main and North Faces open this past weekend. Brew Fest was hopping on Saturday and got some light snow yesterday.


I just pre cook the onions and peppers and just warm them up on-site. Less time cooking more time sking


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## pinion247 (Apr 4, 2022)

Smellytele said:


> I just pre cook the onions and peppers and just warm them up on-site. Less time cooking more time sking


Heard, and agreed - that's my preferred way as well. This was for a group of 20+, lots of kids... so cooking this way mostly for show. Also allowed the parents time to mosey on through the Beer Festival and start on drinks with lunch. Skied post lunch until 3p and then used up the rest of the drink tickets. Not a bad day, not a bad experience.


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## drjeff (Apr 4, 2022)

Heavy equipment, and more than just snowcats, out on Sweet Sixteen and Long John this morning plowing out the snow to get the work road up the mountain to the lift construction sites built


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## drjeff (Apr 4, 2022)

drjeff said:


> Heavy equipment, and more than just snowcats, out on Sweet Sixteen and Long John this morning plowing out the snow to get the work road up the mountain to the lift construction sites built


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## urungus (Apr 5, 2022)

Mount Snow Operations@MountSnowOps
Monday, 4/4 we are consolidating operations at Carinthia.  We hoped to maintain operation on the Main Mountain but Mother Nature had an impact.   Thursday’s rain and a forecast for nearly 2" of rain this week, will not leave a product we feel is acceptable


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## Newpylong (Apr 5, 2022)

Jeff are they auctioning off the chairs? Keeping a couple spares for BT maybe...?


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## drjeff (Apr 5, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> Jeff are they auctioning off the chairs? Keeping a couple spares for BT maybe...?


Rumor is that there will be an auction/sale of chairs forthcoming.  Not sure how many, or which chairs, or when it will/might happen though right now....


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## Newpylong (Apr 5, 2022)

A nice YAN double would be cool to have, lighter to move/hang!


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## cdskier (Apr 5, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> A nice YAN double would be cool to have, lighter to move/hang!



I never truly grasped how heavy chairs from a lift were until I bought a chair from Sugarbush's old Valley House double!


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## drjeff (Apr 5, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> A nice YAN double would be cool to have, lighter to move/hang!



I want a double as well.. I already have one of the old Grand Summit Express Quad chairs, and one of the Summit Local Triple chairs.  Need a double to add to my collection!


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## Newpylong (Apr 5, 2022)

That would be a great hat trick.


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## drjeff (Apr 5, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> That would be a great hat trick.



It would be "Yan"- tastic!


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## chuckstah (Apr 20, 2022)

I planned on Jay today with a leftover Indy day, but ended up at Snow after being scared away from the longer drive by wind fears. Decent day on the whopping 2 open runs, plus some poaching opportunities. 3-4 inches freshened it up to winter conditions for the am.  Definitely not enough pitch for spring turns.


----------



## Newpylong (Jun 15, 2022)

Snowmaking will be installed on Hop and Shooting Star this off season Friend was there reviewing the work pre-bid.


----------



## ctdubl07 (Jun 15, 2022)

Love it. Keep the Smaking expansion going. Logical to pipe a few of "the naturals" in preparation of the new 6 pack dumping people at the top of this terrain off of LJ. Just like they piped more of Sunbrook ahead of the always known to be needed HSQ


----------



## drjeff (Jun 15, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> Snowmaking will be installed on Hop and Shooting Star this off season Friend was there reviewing the work pre-bid.



And the connector from the top of the new 6 pack over to South Bowl below the top pitch is going to be getting some love as well as I understand it. Whether that's using existing pipes now and pushing snow down that maybe 100 yard or so portion of High Traverse or if it gets a bit of pipe of it's own was still TBD last I heard.

Chairlift auction for chairs from the old Sunbrook Quad and Sundance triples goes live on Friday and finishes on Saturday


----------



## drjeff (Jun 15, 2022)

ctdubl07 said:


> Love it. Keep the Smaking expansion going. Logical to pipe a few of "the naturals" in preparation of the new 6 pack dumping people at the top of this terrain off of LJ. Just like they piped more of Sunbrook ahead of the always known to be needed HSQ


Further snowmaking expansion in Sunbrook in particular is penciled in for likely the '23-'24 season

With Tracy Bartels, the recently promoted now former GM back on CO at the corporate office heading up what is essentaily Vail's capital projects planning division now, as she told many regulars, she certainly has an idea of what Mount Snow needs capital projects wise in the coming years, so that could bode well for continued investment and enhancements. Time will tell


----------



## Newpylong (Jun 15, 2022)

drjeff said:


> And the connector from the top of the new 6 pack over to South Bowl below the top pitch is going to be getting some love as well as I understand it. Whether that's using existing pipes now and pushing snow down that maybe 100 yard or so portion of High Traverse or if it gets a bit of pipe of it's own was still TBD last I heard.
> 
> Chairlift auction for chairs from the old Sunbrook Quad and Sundance triples goes live on Friday and finishes on Saturday



High Traverse gets a short line too this year, forgot to mention that.


----------



## skimagic (Jun 15, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> Snowmaking will be installed on Hop and Shooting Star this off season Friend was there reviewing the work pre-bid.


So the mid Hop drop becomes a permanent ice sheet?  or would  regrading take place and bore this oldie up?


----------



## ss20 (Jun 15, 2022)

skimagic said:


> So the mid Hop drop becomes a permanent ice sheet?  or would  regrading take place and bore this oldie up?



Good times on that section.... boy howdy!

I will miss skiing the natural trails at Mount Snow.  Don't know if Vail has the same philosophy but Peaks wanted to get to 100% coverage- like, real 100%.  Uncle's, Challenger, Olympic, One More Time, Iron Run- some of my favorite trails anywhere.


----------



## Newpylong (Jun 16, 2022)

Peaks may have said they want to get to 100% for advertisement purposes but they never in reality would have installed infrastructure on the narrower trails, and neither will Vail.


----------



## jaytrem (Jun 16, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> Peaks may have said they want to get to 100% for advertisement purposes but they never in reality would have installed infrastructure on the narrower trails, and neither will Vail.


I just hope the narrow trails don't get wider.  Some of the old plans had Uncles being widened, that would suck.  At least when they did the new Sunbrook snowmaking they kept things narrow.  So that's a good sign.


----------



## drjeff (Jun 16, 2022)

jaytrem said:


> I just hope the narrow trails don't get wider.  Some of the old plans had Uncles being widened, that would suck.  At least when they did the new Sunbrook snowmaking they kept things narrow.  So that's a good sign.



Little Dipper over in Sunbrook is going to be "a Little bit wider Dipper" this coming season from what I have heard


----------



## jaytrem (Jun 16, 2022)

drjeff said:


> Little Dipper over in Sunbrook is going to be "a Little bit wider Dipper" this coming season from what I have heard


Not surprised considering where they put the pipes.  Hopefully just a little.


----------



## Newpylong (Jun 16, 2022)

jaytrem said:


> I just hope the narrow trails don't get wider.  Some of the old plans had Uncles being widened, that would suck.  At least when they did the new Sunbrook snowmaking they kept things narrow.  So that's a good sign.



IMHO the regulatory hurdles of doing so and the ROI would not be be worth the investment.


----------



## Newpylong (Jun 16, 2022)

jaytrem said:


> Not surprised considering where they put the pipes.  Hopefully just a little.



I would think just enough so they can effectively cover the trail without putting the snow into the trees like what happens in its current state. But I would expect the far side to get more thinning than the pipe side. It is best practice to place the pipes inside the wood line on new installs for skier safety. Plus, you typically have the pipes on the side that prevailing winds originate from, so the snow travels away from the equipment.


----------



## drjeff (Jun 16, 2022)

jaytrem said:


> Not surprised considering where they put the pipes.  Hopefully just a little.


An average width of 60ft is the number I heard, whereas now it's got an average width of around 30ft.

With the added traffic that part of the mountain will get now, for safety sake, especially until Big Dipper gets some snowmaking to provide a 3rd reliably covered route down in Sunbrook, this is a needed move


----------



## jaytrem (Jun 16, 2022)

drjeff said:


> An average width of 60ft is the number I heard, whereas now it's got an average width of around 30ft.
> 
> With the added traffic that part of the mountain will get now, for safety sake, especially until Big Dipper gets some snowmaking to provide a 3rd reliably covered route down in Sunbrook, this is a needed move


That sucks.  Was so cool back there before the chair went in.  Felt like you were in the middle of nowhere.  Guess it's turning even more into "just another pod".


----------



## ss20 (Jun 16, 2022)

jaytrem said:


> That sucks.  Was so cool back there before the chair went in.  Felt like you were in the middle of nowhere.  Guess it's turning even more into "just another pod".



Even after the quad went it was still the quietest area out of Snow, Okemo, Stratton


----------



## slatham (Jun 16, 2022)

They should widen Jaws, put snowmaking on it, and groom it every night........

That is if they never want to see me again (which some might favor )


----------



## jaytrem (Jun 16, 2022)

slatham said:


> They should widen Jaws, put snowmaking on it, and groom it every night........
> 
> That is if they never want to see me again (which some might favor )


I'm still pissed that Plummet screwed up the top. They need to plant some trees and return it to it's former glory.


----------



## SLyardsale (Sep 16, 2022)

Sundance Express bottom terminal 09/16/2022

On schedule ?  Behind schedule ?


----------



## drjeff (Sep 16, 2022)

SLyardsale said:


> View attachment 54783
> 
> Sundance Express bottom terminal 09/16/2022
> 
> On schedule ?  Behind schedule ?



On schedule. Towers to be flown for both new lifts(weather permitting) this coming week.

All the concrete is poured and cured, now things go together relatively quickly as I understand it all the parts are on site. 

Rumor is they want the new Sundance Express spinning on opening day!


----------



## ThatGuy (Sep 16, 2022)

Any info on Sunbrook?


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## drjeff (Sep 16, 2022)

ThatGuy said:


> Any info on Sunbrook?


On schedule too from what I hear 

After next week, the towers may be inplace before the terminals, but the Dopp crew has all of the parts on site


----------



## jimmywilson69 (Sep 17, 2022)

Not mt snow related but a basin was pouring concrete yesterday so I'd say they are behind schedule


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## SLyardsale (Sep 17, 2022)

9/17/22 Sundance top terminal


new pipe on Shooting Star


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## slatham (Sep 18, 2022)

jimmywilson69 said:


> Not mt snow related but a basin was pouring concrete yesterday so I'd say they are behind schedule



Not necessarily. Much later start at 10,000'+ in Rockies. That said, much later end too. Since no news on issues I'd say they have a plan to sprint to the finish.

Edit: Per Al's Blog today  "The last of the *Lenawee Express* major concrete work is complete. The forms have been stripped. The back fill will continue. Take note of just how huge this piece of concrete is. Once the lift is completed, skiers will only see the top one or two feet of concrete. So much of the lift construction are these foundations and most people never see them."


----------



## urungus (Sep 18, 2022)

slatham said:


> Not necessarily. Much later start at 10,000'+ in Rockies. That said, much later end too. Since no news on issues I'd say they have a plan to sprint to the finish.
> 
> Edit: Per Al's Blog today  "The last of the *Lenawee Express* major concrete work is complete. The forms have been stripped. The back fill will continue. Take note of just how huge this piece of concrete is. Once the lift is completed, skiers will only see the top one or two feet of concrete. So much of the lift construction are these foundations and most people never see them."


Wow, that is impressive work at A basin, here’s the link with photos http://arapahoebasin.blogspot.com/


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## bigbob (Sep 19, 2022)

slatham said:


> Not necessarily. Much later start at 10,000'+ in Rockies. That said, much later end too. Since no news on issues I'd say they have a plan to sprint to the finish.
> 
> Edit: Per Al's Blog today  "The last of the *Lenawee Express* major concrete work is complete. The forms have been stripped. The back fill will continue. Take note of just how huge this piece of concrete is. Once the lift is completed, skiers will only see the top one or two feet of concrete. So much of the lift construction are these foundations and most people never see them."


Is this a 2 season install or supposed to be up and running for this coming season?


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## jaytrem (Sep 19, 2022)

bigbob said:


> Is this a 2 season install or supposed to be up and running for this coming season?


This season.  Things should move along quickly now that the concrete is done.  They can use Pali to Beavers if it's not ready before the snow is.


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## Newpylong (Sep 19, 2022)

SLyardsale said:


> 9/17/22 Sundance top terminal
> View attachment 54789
> 
> new pipe on Shooting Star
> View attachment 54790


Are they still working on Shooting Star? Hope that's not the final resting spot for that pipe.


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## drjeff (Sep 21, 2022)

Per their social media feeds, the chopper is on site today and towers are being flown. Not sure if this is a 1 or 2 day chopper event to get them flown for both lifts.

I know that spools of what sure looked like haul rope and the both the quad and 6 packs chairs were on site Labor Day weekend. Things are moving along


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## SLyardsale (Oct 9, 2022)

drjeff said:


> On schedule too from what I hear
> 
> After next week, the towers may be inplace before the terminals, but the Dopp crew has all of the parts on site


per Snow GM, Sundance Express by Thanksgiving, Sunbrook Express by mid December.  Also, Sundance Lodge open 7 days a week.


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## urungus (Oct 9, 2022)

The new 6-pack and having the Sundance lodge open every day could actually relieve some of the pressure on the main base area.  You can even get to North Face from the top of the new lift.


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## Newpylong (Oct 9, 2022)

Definitely will relieve. That will be great having that base open 7 days. When I was a passholder that's where I always started my day in the mid 2000s.


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## doublediamond (Oct 9, 2022)

To get to North Face you’d have to take High Traverse crossing the entire main face. I’ve never seen the entirety of High Traverse open. Often between South Bowl and Lodge it’s roped off in numerous locations.


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## raisingarizona (Oct 9, 2022)

doublediamond said:


> To get to North Face you’d have to take High Traverse crossing the entire main face. I’ve never seen the entirety of High Traverse open. Often between South Bowl and Lodge it’s roped off in numerous locations.


A traverse that cuts across all of the main frontside trails could be dangerous I'd imagine.


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## jaytrem (Oct 9, 2022)

doublediamond said:


> To get to North Face you’d have to take High Traverse crossing the entire main face. I’ve never seen the entirety of High Traverse open. Often between South Bowl and Lodge it’s roped off in numerous locations.


I think it at one time it was more usable.  Been a LONG time since I've done it.  There might even be pipes in the way now by the bubble and maybe a bit overgrown between the quad and the bubble?  But still, it's probably less strenuous than Ego to the NF.  Will be interesting to see how the new Sundance does in the wind.


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## drjeff (Oct 9, 2022)

jaytrem said:


> I think it at one time it was more usable.  Been a LONG time since I've done it.  There might even be pipes in the way now by the bubble and maybe a bit overgrown between the quad and the bubble?  But still, it's probably less strenuous than Ego to the NF.  Will be interesting to see how the new Sundance does in the wind.


Still skiable all the way across. With the 1st piece of High Traverse from the top of the new Subdance Express down to South Bowl getting snowmaking this year, that will help. You do have to cross over air and water pipes on the Bluebird side of Southbowl to make it over, so that is an logistical issue, even if the b-net for race training isn't up on that side of Southbowl. 

Probably easier, and certainly less physical effort, to access the Northface from the Subdance Lodge by riding BOTH the new lifts this season!


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## Newpylong (Oct 9, 2022)

Yep, with snowmaking on Shooting Star that's a pretty quick way over by avoiding the Main Face entirely.

If I was running that hill I definitely wouldn't want High Traverse open all the way across the front now.


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## jaytrem (Oct 9, 2022)

drjeff said:


> Probably easier, and certainly less physical effort, to access the Northface from the Subdance Lodge by riding BOTH the new lifts this season!



Until you get the bottom of Sunbrook and see the new giant lift line.  Then the quickest way might be Sundance->Beartrap->Sundance->NF.  

High Traverse can become very useful if Sundance can run when the summit is closed.  I don't picture it getting much traffic going past South Bowl on a normal day though.  Might not matter much if it's open or closed.


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## SLyardsale (Oct 9, 2022)

using high traverse across southbowl might be way safer than crossing long john onto shooting star.  first t-bone on long john will happen on the first day that new lift operates.


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## drjeff (Oct 9, 2022)

SLyardsale said:


> using high traverse across southbowl might be way safer than crossing long john onto shooting star.  first t-bone on long john will happen on the first day that new lift operates.


Agree.

That's going to be an issue for sure, and likely one that will involve a bunch of ambassadors/patrol and possibly some speed control net/fencing sets there this season


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## ctdubl07 (Oct 10, 2022)

SLyardsale said:


> per Snow SM....Also, Sundance Lodge open 7 days a week.


Bigger question now is whether Coops will get a refresh and be open??....that place is a key hide-out


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## Vter (Oct 10, 2022)

drjeff said:


> Agree.
> 
> That's going to be an issue for sure, and likely one that will involve a bunch of ambassadors/patrol and possibly some speed control net/fencing sets there this season


BlaHaha !!! You folks crack me up. Just Ski Man…T-bone, cops, arrests  ??? 
It’s a tame hill, man…it’s fuk’n Mt. Snow ! I don’t see evac’s because your afraid to cross a cat-walk life style. My God, aren’t you the same people who want to shut down speeders from the chairlifts ! You couldn’t pay me to ride a chair, ski with you or buy me a beer…Dr BlaHaha ! I love my life & you ?


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## Newpylong (Oct 10, 2022)

That was a lot to take in.


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## SLyardsale (Oct 10, 2022)

Vter said:


> BlaHaha !!! You folks crack me up. Just Ski Man…T-bone, cops, arrests  ???
> It’s a tame hill, man…it’s fuk’n Mt. Snow ! I don’t see evac’s because your afraid to cross a cat-walk life style. My God, aren’t you the same people who want to shut down speeders from the chairlifts ! You couldn’t pay me to ride a chair, ski with you or buy me a beer…Dr BlaHaha ! I love my life & you ?


some valid points, but I'd bet u'd take the free beer


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## ThatGuy (Oct 11, 2022)

Vter said:


> BlaHaha !!! You folks crack me up. Just Ski Man…T-bone, cops, arrests  ???
> It’s a tame hill, man…it’s fuk’n Mt. Snow ! I don’t see evac’s because your afraid to cross a cat-walk life style.


The terrain might be tame but the clientele is another story.









						VIDEO: Woman Assaults 13 Year Old Boy @ Mt. Snow, Vermont
					

Wish I had more background information on this assault on the slopes of Mount Snow in Vermont but accordingly to second hand reporting on Reddit, the woman had allegedly gotten out of her skis to f…



					unofficialnetworks.com


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## NYDB (Oct 11, 2022)




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## jaytrem (Oct 11, 2022)

ThatGuy said:


> The terrain might be tame but the clientele is another story.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I always loved the "I'm a female" line after she shoves the kid and doesn't think he should fight back.

In all my years at MS I don't recall ever seeing a fight, couple arguments here and there.  I did witness an assault at Snoqualmie that looked like it was going to end up with an arrest.  Cops were definitely waiting at the bottom.  Rule #1 if you going to assault somebody, make sure you have a get away plan.  Doing it at a backside lift is probably not a good idea.


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## jimmywilson69 (Oct 11, 2022)

The other thing some of these folks don't think about is 1) tons of people filming when shit like this goes down 2) these resorts have cameras everywhere that you don't see.  

There was an incident at Roundtop where my buddy had his school group and the leaders and kids got called to the security office and they had footage of said incident and I would've never though that they had cameras in that location.


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## IceEidolon (Oct 11, 2022)

Wisp has cameras for basically the whole mountain, they're all networked back to the snowmaking control room and I'd assume Security too.


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## jaytrem (Oct 11, 2022)

IceEidolon said:


> Wisp has cameras for basically the whole mountain, they're all networked back to the snowmaking control room and I'd assume Security too.


Probably a good idea.  I didn't see any fights when I was there, But there was obviously a LOT of alcohol consumption going on.  Saturday night and boatloads of college age kids.  Everyone seemed to be having a good time, but I could picture things getting crazy real fast. Hopefully more beer goggles than beer muscles.


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## GregoryIsaacs (Oct 11, 2022)

I'm starting to get think  the Sunbrook lift isnt going to be open in time. 

Just dont see how any work can get done once the people start showing up en-masse once they open. 

The issue wont be as bad given the new Sundance 6 and the fact that the old quad seldom ran anyways/wasnt a core lift.


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## slatham (Oct 11, 2022)

GregoryIsaacs said:


> I'm starting to get think  the Sunbrook lift isnt going to be open in time.
> 
> Just dont see how any work can get done once the people start showing up en-masse once they open.
> 
> The issue wont be as bad given the new Sundance 6 and the fact that the old quad seldom ran anyways/wasnt a core lift.


Haven’t heard much about Sunbrook, other then Dr Jeff a few/several weeks ago commenting that both lifts were proceeding on schedule. Is there new info/insight?


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## GregoryIsaacs (Oct 11, 2022)

No, just conjecture. Hoping they don't get some serious early season snow


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## drjeff (Oct 11, 2022)

The new GM, who spoke at my condo assocaition's annual meeting this past Sunday. commented that right now, barring any unforseen issues, the new Sundance lift will be ready for Thanksgiving Weekend with the new Sunbrook lift ready by early/mid December.

Top and bottom terminal assembly for Sunbrook is really ramping up now that the top and bottom terminals of Sundance are essentailly done.  Com line pulling, haul rope pulling and splicing and then the hanging of the chairs isn't that lengthy of a process in the big scheme of things, then just testing and inspection


----------



## SkiNewEngland.net (Oct 16, 2022)

https://www.newenglandskiindustry.com/viewstory.php?storyid=995


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## drjeff (Oct 17, 2022)

SkiNewEngland.net said:


> https://www.newenglandskiindustry.com/viewstory.php?storyid=995




Hadn't seen the bottom terminal location of Sunbrook yet.... That is much closer to the bottom terminal of Bear Trap for sure....

Also saw some pics from friends social media yesterday that the haul rope for the Sundance lift has been pulled onto the towers


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## Newpylong (Oct 17, 2022)

Those Dopp terminals are hot.


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## drjeff (Oct 17, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> Those Dopp terminals are hot.


If there was a way to get the Dopp terminal, with the wood underside that L-P does, that would be the ultimate style combo in my eyes!


----------



## ctdubl07 (Oct 17, 2022)

A couple of comments: firstly I forgot the old H-Metal double is now rechaired with triple seaters, a nice lift project side bonus that will pay off on those wind hold days when it is the only lift running.

Yes, DrJ certainly looks like the new Sunbrook base is kicked over enough that it removes the pole hazards the old lift created towards the bottom of the trail. 
I wonder how close to the old top station location the new one sits? 

Will be interesting to see how much of the lift line got cleaned out due to machinery traffic.....it can be a fun poach now and again with good snow.

Another bonus of these new lifts is that both of the old lifts had top terminals with steep off load ramps which suck for boarders and novice skiers...should speed things up.


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## drjeff (Oct 17, 2022)

ctdubl07 said:


> A couple of comments: firstly I forgot the old H-Metal double is now rechaired with triple seaters, a nice lift project side bonus that will pay off on those wind hold days when it is the only lift running.
> 
> Yes, DrJ certainly looks like the new Sunbrook base is kicked over enough that it removes the pole hazards the old lift created towards the bottom of the trail.
> I wonder how close to the old top station location the new one sits?
> ...


From having hiked over to it a couple of times this off season, including after the concrete was poured for the terminal, the top terminal is essentially in the exact place it was before, and if anything, once the final grading is done, it won't be quite the drop down the ramp the old quad had


----------



## Newpylong (Oct 17, 2022)

Got pics of the the Heavy Metal Triple? Always liked escaping Nitro on that.


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## drjeff (Oct 17, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> Got pics of the the Heavy Metal Triple? Always liked escaping Nitro on that.




Here's one that one of the patrollers, who owns the local, and very good I will say, Nemesis Photo studio, put up late last week with the triple chairs up on the haul rope


----------



## Newpylong (Oct 17, 2022)

It is like it meant to be. The Yan doubles always looked weird to me. The triples on the other hand...   Are those chairs from Tumbleweed and/or Sundance?


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## drjeff (Oct 17, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> It is like it meant to be. The Yan doubles always looked weird to me. The triples on the other hand...   Are those chairs from Tumbleweed and/or Sundance?



Honestly not sure which of the fomer lifts those triples came from


----------



## urungus (Oct 17, 2022)

That’s cool about the Heavy Metal upgrade, it has been overlooked because of the publicity surrounding the two new chairlifts.  But this should definitely help out in the early season when Heavy Metal is the only chair running at Carinthia.


----------



## jaytrem (Oct 17, 2022)

drjeff said:


> Honestly not sure which of the fomer lifts those triples came from


Looks like at least the "comfort bars" are from Sundance.  Pretty sure Tumbleweed had springs (unless I have that backwards).


----------



## drjeff (Oct 17, 2022)

jaytrem said:


> Looks like at least the "comfort bars" are from Sundance.  Pretty sure Tumbleweed had springs (unless I have that backwards).




I am trying to remember which one's were on each lift.  Thinking back about it, they might be from Tumbleweed, as the last day I skied there last April, as they were starting to take the chairs off of Sundance, all the chairs were already off of Tumbleweed, and there were a bunch of triple chairs already stacked up next the the base of Heavy Metal near the top of the Grommet Carpet lift.  Memory might be a little fuzzy on that though


----------



## Newpylong (Oct 17, 2022)

At 2250 in length, they would need more chairs than just from Tumbleweed to fill out HM at 3200 in length. So some from both maybe? Or all from Sundance... Sundance's chairs definitely would have less hours right?


----------



## jaytrem (Oct 17, 2022)

Tumbleweed had the springs.   I checked the liftblog pics.


----------



## Newpylong (Oct 18, 2022)

So good chance the carriers are from Sundance? Definitely enough consecutively numbered chairs off that lift lol.


----------



## jaytrem (Oct 18, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> So good chance the carriers are from Sundance? Definitely enough consecutively numbered chairs off that lift lol.


Yeah, and like you said, a lot less hours.  Probably ran less than a 10th of Tumbleweed's hours, maybe even a 20th.  Out of curiosity. I'd love to know the numbers.


----------



## drjeff (Oct 18, 2022)

Guessing they renumbered many, of them, since in the online auction they had for the chairs from Tumbleweed and Sundance, people could request specific numbers if they wanted, or just get a randm numbered chair.  And I know for a fact that both #50 (the "golden chair") sold as well as both #1's and a slew of other numbers that had sentimental value to folks.

And I would say that Jaytrem's estimate of 1/20th the hours on the Sundance chairs over Tumbleweed's chairs may even be on the low side of things


----------



## jaytrem (Oct 18, 2022)

drjeff said:


> And I would say that Jaytrem's estimate of 1/20th the hours on the Sundance chairs over Tumbleweed's chairs may even be on the low side of things


Well it did run almost as much as Tumbleweed/Beaver until they shortened it.  That was about a third of it's life.  But even back then Beaver did open/close earlier/later in the year.  Since the change Tumbleweed would be about 120 day a year a about 8 hours a day, and Sundance around 25 days about 5 hours per day.  That's only around 7 to 8 times as much since the shortening.


----------



## drjeff (Oct 18, 2022)

jaytrem said:


> Well it did run almost as much as Tumbleweed/Beaver until they shortened it.  That was about a third of it's life.  But even back then Beaver did open/close earlier/later in the year.  Since the change Tumbleweed would be about 120 day a year a about 8 hours a day, and Sundance around 25 days about 5 hours per day.  That's only around 7 to 8 times as much since the shortening.



Yup, and crazy to think that's it's been probably 20 years or so since the Beaver shortening into Tumbleweed happened


----------



## jaytrem (Oct 18, 2022)

drjeff said:


> Yup, and crazy to think that's it's been probably 20 years or so since the Beaver shortening into Tumbleweed happened


Indeed!!!  Time flies!!!


----------



## Newpylong (Oct 18, 2022)

Makes sense about renumbering - I zoomed in on the photo and the stencils look they've been recently reapplied.

Good to know pieces from both (actually three if you count Beaver) of those lifts live on though.

I'm not a lift nut by any means but are the cross arms long enough to accommodate a quad? There's a ton of YAN 4 person chairs sitting in the bushes at the bottom of the old Devil's Fiddle that maybe K would part with. That lift certainly doesn't appear to be going anywhere as a package deal lol. They probably have the Skye Peak chairs somewhere as well. Heavy Metal would need a new motor, gearbox and drive at minimum though. Big project... I know Peaks previously mentioned looking at going from a double to a quad there. The fact that were able to go to a triple is a testament to how sized the existing motor was from YAN.


----------



## ctdubl07 (Oct 18, 2022)

drjeff said:


> Guessing they renumbered many, of them, since in the online auction they had for the chairs from Tumbleweed and Sundance, people could request specific numbers if they wanted, or just get a randm numbered chair.  And I know for a fact that both #50 (the "golden chair") sold as well as both #1's and a slew of other numbers that had sentimental value to folks.
> 
> And I would say that Jaytrem's estimate of 1/20th the hours on the Sundance chairs over Tumbleweed's chairs may even be on the low side of things


I can back that fact up by DrJ as its sitting in our garage up there....havent been to VT since April so no idea how "golden" it really is but I'll post a picture when live.


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## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Nov 2, 2022)

Will be interesting to see how many chairs are on the lift replacing Sundance/Tumbleweed. I don't recall the exact number but I believe Sundance already had more chairs than any other lift I have ridden in recent years. This could well be a new record, at least for the NE.


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## drjeff (Nov 2, 2022)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> Will be interesting to see how many chairs are on the lift replacing Sundance/Tumbleweed. I don't recall the exact number but I believe Sundance already had more chairs than any other lift I have ridden in recent years. This could well be a new record, at least for the NE.



The old Sundance triple had 250ish chairs if I remember correctly.

Since the new lift will be a highspeed lift, which comes with greater spacing between the chairs, there won't be that many on it.

If you go based  on the Grand Summit which has about 170/180 chairs on it, and the Bluebird which has 102 chairs on it, depending on what they choose to set the target capacity at for the new Sundance lift, that range of 100 to 150+ is probably how many will be on the lift.

And just eyeballing the chairs that (atleast as of last Friday) were still in the lower parking lot down by Snow Lake that are for the Sundance lift (the chairs for the Sunbrook lift look to be staged in the Carinthia parking lot), I would guess that there will be closer to 100 chairs than 150 chairs on the new Sundance lift


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## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Nov 2, 2022)

Thanks - hadn't realized this was a high speed lift. That changes things. My recollection was that Sundance was a bit under 230 - whatever it was, it was just a few chairs more than the double at Stowe - and it was the longest of the places we have recently skied in the NE (the Epic and Indy places in VT/NY/MA/PA and the Epic ones in NH). So the double at Stowe will now be the most chairs.


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## Newpylong (Nov 2, 2022)

I can't imagine it being more than a 100 carriers if the Bluebird has 102 on it, and is what, 200 feet longer x each side?


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## chrisw (Nov 4, 2022)

If LiftBlog's data for Sundance is accurate -- 3000 pph capacity for 6-pack = 7.2s chair interval, so 120' chair spacing at 1000fpm.  13,830' total line length, divided by 120' chair spacing = 115 chairs.

So, in summary, @Newpylong you are correct.


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## drjeff (Nov 4, 2022)

Loading of the chairs onto the Sundance 6 has begun


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## Newpylong (Nov 4, 2022)

Did they yank Seasons too or does it live another year?


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## drjeff (Nov 5, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> Did they yank Seasons too or does it live another year?



Seasons is still there, and word on the street is they will be running much more often this year and the Sundance Lodge will be open 7 days a week as well.

Also, not sure exactly what type of guns they installed on Hop, but they're going to be atleast semi automated


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## Newpylong (Nov 5, 2022)

I'm sure it's Klik. HKD left everyone else by the wayside. Keep in mind "semi automated" is really Klik Manual. The hoses are permanently connected and drain automatically. Single levers instead of hydrants. Someone still has to turn them on by hand.


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## SLyardsale (Nov 11, 2022)

Chairs on the rail for Sundance


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## drjeff (Nov 11, 2022)

Pretty sure both lifts, baring unforseen events, will be completed and certified by December 16th (Sundance should be ready for Thanksgiving and Sunbrook by the 16th of December).. The 16th of December is when their head of Mountain Ops (close to emeritus status now), Dave Moulton, is retiring after a LONG career in the industry, and he has openly said that finishing BOTH of these lifts is what he wants as the culmination on his career, before he spends more time as a "regular" skier, husband, father, grandfather, sailor, and firefighter/first responder, and will let me buy him a drink or 2 since he won't have his name tag on anymore!

Got to see that base terminal in person a week ago before all the parking rails and only 3 chairs were there, and while I think I still like the wood planking on the newer Leitner/poma terminals better, the Dopp terminals are easy on the eyes to a mtn ops geek/efficianado for sure as well.

Can't wait to ride that lift hopefully in less than 2 weeks if mother nature, the Mount Snow mtn ops crews, the Dopp crew, and the VT tramway board inspectors get to do their thing!


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## Newpylong (Nov 12, 2022)

SLyardsale said:


> View attachment 55022
> 
> Chairs on the rail for Sundance


Beautiful thing, and good to see someone finally just put in a rail again and not a second lodge for the chairs lol. Though I suppose space and lack of bubbles came into that decision.


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## ctdubl07 (Nov 12, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> Beautiful thing, and good to see someone finally just put in a rail again and not a second lodge for the chairs lol. Though I suppose space and lack of bubbles came into that decision.


As a lift structure novice (don’t flame me) I’m curious, is the rack finished or does it get some type of yet to be installed covering to protect them?


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## drjeff (Nov 12, 2022)

ctdubl07 said:


> As a lift structure novice (don’t flame me) I’m curious, is the rack finished or does it get some type of yet to be installed covering to protect them?



As I understand it, there will be some type of cover, but just over the top section of the rails/superstructure to keep the grip area of the chair covered and protected from precipitation (especially if there may be an icing situation overnight) so that they won't have to de-ice the grips when opening up the chair. I do not believe that the entire chair will be covered when the final housing is installed on the rail assembly


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## machski (Nov 12, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> Beautiful thing, and good to see someone finally just put in a rail again and not a second lodge for the chairs lol. Though I suppose space and lack of bubbles came into that decision.


True, but for the bubble chairs, you want them warrantied you have to fully house them.  Or no warranty is my understanding.  Same with Cabins on gondi's


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## IceEidolon (Nov 12, 2022)

It seems like most places that can take their chairs offline want to fully protect them, and the places that are okay with parking chairs exposed to the elements are fine leaving them on the rope. Which kind of makes sense - a compromise is more expensive than the cheap option and less effective than the expensive option.


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## drjeff (Nov 12, 2022)

machski said:


> True, but for the bubble chairs, you want them warrantied you have to fully house them.  Or no warranty is my understanding.  Same with Cabins on gondi's


Granted the Bluebird at Mount Snow is now going into it's 11th (maybe 12th?) season of operation, but from what I see 1st hand now, the bubbles spend WAY more nights out on the haul rope year round now than they used to back in it's 1st few years of operation.

If they anticipate an icing event, or are planning on making snow on the upper portion of Lodge where the HKD tower guns are close to the lift, then they park them in the barn for the night, otherwise, even in the off season they tend to be out on the haul rope these days


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## machski (Nov 12, 2022)

drjeff said:


> Granted the Bluebird at Mount Snow is now going into it's 11th (maybe 12th?) season of operation, but from what I see 1st hand now, the bubbles spend WAY more nights out on the haul rope year round now than they used to back in it's 1st few years of operation.
> 
> If they anticipate an icing event, or are planning on making snow on the upper portion of Lodge where the HKD tower guns are close to the lift, then they park them in the barn for the night, otherwise, even in the off season they tend to be out on the haul rope these days


Yeah, I'm betting the bubble warranty doesn't extend beyond first 10 years, if even that long.  Not sure on the L-P set-up, I'm guessing pulling the chairs off and back on isn't fully automated like it is on Dopp's D-Line systems.  Which makes that deal a bit more labor intensive if manual or semi-manual.


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## drjeff (Nov 12, 2022)

chrisw said:


> If LiftBlog's data for Sundance is accurate -- 3000 pph capacity for 6-pack = 7.2s chair interval, so 120' chair spacing at 1000fpm.  13,830' total line length, divided by 120' chair spacing = 115 chairs.
> 
> So, in summary, @Newpylong you are correct.


Just read a post from part of the crew that loaded all of the Sundance chairs onto the parking rails. 

The number of chairs on the Sundance 6 is.... 121.

They should start actually moving up and down the mountain on the haul rope for testing and inspection very soon!


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## Newpylong (Nov 12, 2022)

Guess I was wrong. So more capacity than Bluebird right?


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## drjeff (Nov 12, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> Guess I was wrong. So more capacity than Bluebird right?


Sounds like it. A few hundred feet shorter of a lift with roughly 20 more carriers on the haul rope. Guessing the Sundance Express will have less than the 9 second between carriers loading time that the Bluebird has.


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## SLyardsale (Nov 12, 2022)

One thing Mt Snow has is a well connected lift system.  Sundance now connects really well to Sunbrook with new snow making on Shooting Star.  Canyon connects well to northface. Nitro connects well to the base. Its what they needed to spread it out.


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## Newpylong (Nov 13, 2022)

Yeah perhaps the thought process was Bluebird has Canyon and GSE nearby while this is pretty much it out of Sundance. With added snowmaking to High Traverse, Hop and Shooting Star they want it to really move people out of that base. I'm guessing out out of the 3 base areas Sundance will still be the least likely utilized making this a great lap option.


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## ctdubl07 (Nov 14, 2022)

I think I have this logistically correct....when I hiked past the top of the new Sundance lift last week on way to summit, it looks like offload will occur after a 90 degree rotation (vs straight off like old lift) which then points you toward the top of Shooting Star.
If so that means you'd cut straight across Long John....now thats going to take some traffic control but it really does encourage you to dump right down into Sunbrook.


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## Newpylong (Nov 14, 2022)

Don't think they had a choice on that given the topography of the unload area.


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## urungus (Nov 14, 2022)

ctdubl07 said:


> I think I have this logistically correct....when I hiked past the top of the new Sundance lift last week on way to summit, it looks like offload will occur after a 90 degree rotation (vs straight off like old lift) which then points you toward the top of Shooting Star.
> If so that means you'd cut straight across Long John....now thats going to take some traffic control but it really does encourage you to dump right down into Sunbrook.


They need a Killington style tunnel under Long John


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## urungus (Nov 16, 2022)

Any chance Mt Snow will be able to open this weekend ?  I don’t see any official updated announcement yet, but they only selling tickets for dates starting Nov 25


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## drjeff (Nov 16, 2022)

urungus said:


> Any chance Mt Snow will be able to open this weekend ?  I don’t see any official updated announcement yet, but they only selling tickets for dates starting Nov 25


Was hoping to hear about a Saturday opening today... no such luck it seems. Temps just too marginal down at the base to get enough product down prior to the inch or 2 of wet, gloppy snow they got today to let them feel confident enough to make the call right now to get them open for this weekend.  I've always hoped that one day they'd add another bunch of fan guns to decrease the spacing between them on say the lower 300 vertical feet or so of the core early season routes to the base area as when they're running the fans in marginal temps it becomes a lot of surface area to cover when not a ton of product is being quickly produced.

Maybe they'll get some GOOD production down low from when they fire up again through say mid day Friday and make a short notice call? Time will tell.

If they hold off until the 25th, the opening day roll out could be more than normal if the weather stays close to forecast


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## Vter (Nov 16, 2022)

OMG ! What has happened to this sport


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## Vter (Nov 16, 2022)

Vter said:


> OMG ! What has happened to this sport


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## FBGM (Nov 16, 2022)

drjeff said:


> Was hoping to hear about a Saturday opening today... no such luck it seems. Temps just too marginal down at the base to get enough product down prior to the inch or 2 of wet, gloppy snow they got today to let them feel confident enough to make the call right now to get them open for this weekend.  I've always hoped that one day they'd add another bunch of fan guns to decrease the spacing between them on say the lower 300 vertical feet or so of the core early season routes to the base area as when they're running the fans in marginal temps it becomes a lot of surface area to cover when not a ton of product is being quickly produced.
> 
> Maybe they'll get some GOOD production down low from when they fire up again through say mid day Friday and make a short notice call? Time will tell.
> 
> If they hold off until the 25th, the opening day roll out could be more than normal if the weather stays close to forecast


Your new GM started in the ski biz 30+ years ago as a snowmaker. You might have a chance


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## drjeff (Nov 16, 2022)

FBGM said:


> Your new GM started in the ski biz 30+ years ago as a snowmaker. You might have a chance


Not questioning Brian S's resolve and commitment to kicking off his 1st season as a GM at all. 

Just need mother nature to over perform a bit over the next 48hrs or so, as she underperformed down low earlier this week. 

A couple of angles of Canyon I saw some of my friends post up on their social media feeds certainly made it seem like they will need a GOOD run of closer to 48hrs or more rather than say 24hrs to get enough down to be able to play "connect the piles" to get open for the weekend.  

Now if they wanted to download via Canyon or The Bluebird, the upper elevation terrain looks on the webcams to have enough snow already to push out and get open.

Now for purely selfish reasons I hope they can get open for SATURDAY since on Sunday I am going to the Patriots - Jets game and I'd love to be able to kick my ski season off this weekend not next weekend!


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## Newpylong (Nov 17, 2022)

The run at lower elevations was far more marginal than expected. I was at Ragged yesterday and 24 hrs of runtime at the base barely covered the grass.


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## drjeff (Nov 17, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> The run at lower elevations was far more marginal than expected. I was at Ragged yesterday and 24 hrs of runtime at the base barely covered the grass.



Even this morning from their webcams, looks like they weren't able to run down at the base last night, whereas they fired back up high up around dinner time last night.  Just a few degrees of wetbulb to the bad side down low this week thus far.  Not like the crews don't want to make snow, just that mother nature isn't overly cooperative at some elevations these last few days.  Can't do anything about that


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## urungus (Nov 17, 2022)

From Facebook:
While the temperatures have been packing some warm punches, Brian and team aren’t on the ropes quite yet. With a bit of fresh snow today and our continued efforts to make snow whenever temps allow, we’re confident Opening Day is near, but it’s still too early to call it. Our goal is to provide you with the best possible guest experience once you step foot on Mount Snow. It may not be time yet, but we’re so close! Check back in Friday morning.


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## drjeff (Nov 17, 2022)

urungus said:


> From Facebook:
> While the temperatures have been packing some warm punches, Brian and team aren’t on the ropes quite yet. With a bit of fresh snow today and our continued efforts to make snow whenever temps allow, we’re confident Opening Day is near, but it’s still too early to call it. Our goal is to provide you with the best possible guest experience once you step foot on Mount Snow. It may not be time yet, but we’re so close! Check back in Friday morning.



Yup, saw that posted up yesterday evening.

My hunch is that IF you start to see the main base and carinthia webcams showing signs of snow being made at somepoint this morning, and then you start to see some whales build, especially on the main base area cam where you can see the fans on lower ex and where the throw from them is landing, then Saturday becomes an option, unless they want to open with downloading via either the Bluebird or Canyon.

Otherwise, I wouldn't be surpiised if they choose to hold off until around Thanksgiving and allow them to get more coverage, possibly even more terrain, and enough snow on Gulch to get some park features built


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## slatham (Nov 17, 2022)

Doubtful snowmaking at base until this evening. Big question is do temps hold cold enough during the day tomorrow and Saturday at base? Sunday looks good. Nighttime looks good until mid next week.


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## urungus (Nov 17, 2022)

I just picked up a new pair of boots at Nicks (he and George are great) and stopped by the Mount Snow base area to see what’s going on, they are making snow down low


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## SLyardsale (Nov 17, 2022)

urungus said:


> I just picked up a new pair of boots at Nicks (he and George are great) and stopped by the Mount Snow base area to see what’s going on, they are making snow down low


Both are top notch boot fitters.  New boots in our group happened this past Sunday at Nick's place.


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## urungus (Nov 18, 2022)

Update promised for this morning has not appeared on Facebook, I foolishly allowed myself to get my hopes up for an opening this weekend but it’s getting awfully late to make an announcement


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## drjeff (Nov 18, 2022)

urungus said:


> Update promised for this morning has not appeared on Facebook, I foolishly allowed myself to get my hopes up for an opening this weekend but it’s getting awfully late to make an announcement



I'd bet on a Sunday opening being announced soon


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## slatham (Nov 18, 2022)

Not sure what Canyon looks like, but the Summit Quad base cam shows lots of work needed there. But I guess with the cold they could hit Sunday if they wanted to.


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## drjeff (Nov 18, 2022)

And the Sunday opening is confirmed


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## urungus (Nov 18, 2022)

The moment we’ve all been waiting for …
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





… lifts at Mount Snow start spinning Sunday, November 20 from 9am-4pm – just two days away! Join us for a free breakfast sammie and our first chair banner break.
Start planning your first run with terrain open on River Run, Freefall, and Cascade down to Canyon. This plan is to open with the Bluebird Express, Discovery Shuttle, and Challenger Triple. Check the Snow & Weather Report Opening Day for up to date trail and lift info.
Grab your gear and get ready for first tracks this Sunday!


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## ThatGuy (Nov 18, 2022)

They going to open Sunday then close till Thanksgiving? Hoping I can get some midweek turns in.


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## ctdubl07 (Nov 18, 2022)

Interesting their post doesn't note LJ as open even though they've been blowing on it


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## urungus (Nov 18, 2022)

Does “Cascade down to Canyon” mean that Canyon itself will NOT be open, and downloading on Bluebird will be required ?


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## ctdubl07 (Nov 18, 2022)

No, the Canyon trail is essentially the last 2/3 of the run from the top. Cascade dumps into Canyon which runs down the Main face to the base where the BB lift is....better stated, yes you will be able to ski/ride top to bottom


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## drjeff (Nov 18, 2022)

ThatGuy said:


> They going to open Sunday then close till Thanksgiving? Hoping I can get some midweek turns in.



Once they open, they're open. Will be daily from Sunday through sometime in April


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## Newpylong (Nov 18, 2022)

ctdubl07 said:


> Interesting their post doesn't note LJ as open even though they've been blowing on it


Likely because it won't be open. Probably gonna be hard enough getting enough down on Canyon to the base for Sunday. Bet the bottom will be "sporty."


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## drjeff (Nov 19, 2022)

Bunch of social media posts from my friends up at the mountain today of the new Sundance Express testing with chairs on the haul rope as well as active snowmaking on Cooper's junction down to the base of the new lift and even a night shot of fan gun lights all lit on Ridge!

Wishing I was up there in person to see it and hit opening day tomorrow, but alas I will be in Gillette Stadium with my wife and many friends watching likely my last in person Patriots game of the season tomorrow. 

Got my 103rd round of golf in this year today since my ski season ended last April. Time to put the clubs away until Spring and get my ski season going!


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## urungus (Nov 20, 2022)

Nobody here today … a bit windy but otherwise great


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## FBGM (Nov 20, 2022)

drjeff said:


> Bunch of social media posts from my friends up at the mountain today of the new Sundance Express testing with chairs on the haul rope as well as active snowmaking on Cooper's junction down to the base of the new lift and even a night shot of fan gun lights all lit on Ridge!
> 
> Wishing I was up there in person to see it and hit opening day tomorrow, but alas I will be in Gillette Stadium with my wife and many friends watching likely my last in person Patriots game of the season tomorrow.
> 
> Got my 103rd round of golf in this year today since my ski season ended last April. Time to put the clubs away until Spring and get my ski season going!


Life seems rough


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## chuckstah (Nov 22, 2022)

First day out this season, fun day on limited terrain. A bunch of laps on Freefall were fun. Top of Cascade usual skied off mess even though no one was there. Lots of stuff opening tomorrow, wish I could've waited a day but all good


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## ThatGuy (Nov 22, 2022)

chuckstah said:


> Lots of stuff opening tomorrow, wish I could've waited a day but all good


You know what’s opening tomorrow?


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## ctdubl07 (Nov 22, 2022)

It's basically all beginner/access stuff.  To me, beyond Ridge, it's of little interest.


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## drjeff (Nov 22, 2022)

Ridge, Chute, Long John, Gulch and a few associated connector trail segments.

The newly converted to a triple Heavy Metal lift opens tomorrow. Fingers crossed that the new Sundance Six pack carries its first folks up the hill in the next few days as well...


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## chuckstah (Nov 22, 2022)

ctdubl07 said:


> It's basically all beginner/access stuff.  To me, beyond Ridge, it's of little interest.


Chute and gulch really open the mountain up. Ridge adds a great cruiser, and a ttb begginer run to connect everything is a win. Chute was great today on whales, a bit firm in spots, so I was told


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## urungus (Nov 23, 2022)

Heavy Metal still showing as a double chair …


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## Newpylong (Nov 23, 2022)

So does the website's trail map.

All I gotta say is I can't wait to see the pictures and videos of the 2.5 new lifts


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## drjeff (Nov 23, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> So does the website's trail map.
> 
> All I gotta say is I can't wait to see the pictures and videos of the 2.5 new lifts


I *might* know someone who knows something...


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## sugarbushskier (Nov 23, 2022)

With only the Heavy metal lift running out of Carinthia, can I assume you can boot up in the lodge?  

Also, is the ticket window there open as I'm still waiting on my Epic Pass and may need the ticket window, assuming it's open at Carinthia, to print it for me.


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## slatham (Nov 24, 2022)

urungus said:


> View attachment 55145
> 
> Heavy Metal still showing as a double chair …



Waiting for some marketing intern in Bloomfield to update now that the marketing committee has met and approved the design change which a consultant spent all summer and $50k designing........


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## drjeff (Nov 24, 2022)

sugarbushskier said:


> With only the Heavy metal lift running out of Carinthia, can I assume you can boot up in the lodge?
> 
> Also, is the ticket window there open as I'm still waiting on my Epic Pass and may need the ticket window, assuming it's open at Carinthia, to print it for me.


Since the cafeteria in the Carinthia lodge is open and serving food, I would presume that the ticket window is open as well


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## drjeff (Nov 25, 2022)

Little damp this morning. No crowds. Soft hero snow with good coverage (a couple of here and there pieces of rock along the flats of Long John worked the way up through the machine groomer that are easily avoidable).  Having Hop with snowmaking and open Thanksgiving weekend is a great thing!

The visual appearance of where Ridge/Somerset Road and Coopers Junction meet without the top terminal of Tumbleweed no not there will take a few runs by it to get used to that "new" view. 

Good vibe around the mountain today


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## urungus (Nov 26, 2022)

Anyone know when new Sundance Express lift is scheduled to open ?


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## drjeff (Nov 26, 2022)

urungus said:


> Anyone know when new Sundance Express lift is scheduled to open ?


The haul rope, without carriers (chairs) on it was spinning for the few hours I was out on the hill from 8 until a little after noon today and skied by it every so often.

Heard rumors of anywhere in the next week up until mid December as the opening timeframe while skiing and socializing with folks who should have an idea. With Sunbrook consistently being mentioned as by Christmas...

All I know is the roughly 70 million gallons of water they apparently pumped up the hill and through the snowmaking system in the last 10 or so days has a bunch of acres open (more than most Thanksgiving Weekends in the close to 40 years I have been a Mount Snow skier and closing in on 20 years that I have owned a 2nd home here) that wouldn't of been open in almost any other previous season.


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## ThatGuy (Nov 26, 2022)

Snowmakers outdoing themselves this season, love skiing Hop and Ridge early.
Hoping Sunbrook is done by Christmas because I love that side of the mountain. Having to do the Beartrap loop can be a slog, especially on a busy day.


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## drjeff (Nov 26, 2022)

ThatGuy said:


> Snowmakers outdoing themselves this season, love skiing Hop and Ridge early.
> Hoping Sunbrook is done by Christmas because I love that side of the mountain. Having to do the Beartrap loop can be a slog, especially on a busy day.


Snowmaking on Hop was a great addition for sure!


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## Newpylong (Nov 26, 2022)

That's gotta be weird to be on Hop on manmade forget this early! Get any pictures?

They isn't add any to Shootout did they?


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## drjeff (Nov 27, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> That's gotta be weird to be on Hop on manmade forget this early! Get any pictures?
> 
> They isn't add any to Shootout did they?


Nothing (yet) on Shootout except for a number of big, shiny new Dopp towers!

A number of my circle of ski friends seem to quickly be going from some skepticism about adding snowmaking to "classic" trails that didn't have it before to "this actually is a good idea" with each November lap they're getting on Hop this weekend!


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## Newpylong (Nov 27, 2022)

Eh I don't think anything they added it to so far were "Classic" and any loss. You could have sailed the USS Nimitz down Little Dipper, Upper Titanium, Hop and Shooting Star. Uncles, Iron Run, Jaws etc now that's another story but I don't see them every installing it there.


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## ThatGuy (Nov 27, 2022)

If they put guns on Uncles thats when I riot.


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## drjeff (Nov 27, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> Eh I don't think anything they added it to so far were "Classic" and any loss. You could have sailed the USS Nimitz down Little Dipper, Upper Titanium, Hop and Shooting Star. Uncles, Iron Run, Jaws etc now that's another story but I don't see them every installing it there.



Top of Hop all Kliked up and with good coverage this morning


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## slatham (Nov 27, 2022)

Hop is a great addition to snowmaking list. Are those automatic klicks, or manual?

Uncles and Jaws should stay natural IMHO.

Glad to hear a good start. Not a big Vail fan but I have a lot of great history and fondness for Mt Snow.


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## Newpylong (Nov 27, 2022)

Those are "manual" but some people call then semi auto. Still gotta manually operate them but they draw water and air and drain the hydrant/hoses for you.

The ex-ski racer in me sees that as a great option for training. Good consistent pitch and length.

I've done a GS on Timbers before there was a timing shack at the bottom. It was a pretty steep course. They still do that or is it all on Ego and South Bowl?


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## drjeff (Nov 27, 2022)

slatham said:


> Hop is a great addition to snowmaking list. Are those automatic klicks, or manual?
> 
> Uncles and Jaws should stay natural IMHO.
> 
> Glad to hear a good start. Not a big Vail fan but I have a lot of great history and fondness for Mt Snow.


The semi automated Kilks as I understand. The air lines are permanently hooked up and the ops guys have to hook up the water line and pull the lever to get the gun running as it was explained to me.

And while I do enjoy the character of a twisty, undulating old school natural snow trail, if mother nature keeps getting a bit more challenging for natural snow only terrain, I am all for adding snowmaking, then say laying down a base early in the season, and then let mother nature do her thing the rest of the season with minimal help from the mtn ops folks.  I'd much rather have more days per season with a trail open and a bit of help from the mtn ops folks than limited days per season with a trail open.

And Newpylong, I know for sure that the race team has inquired about getting to set on Hop in a few weeks once they get some more acres open!


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## skimagic (Nov 27, 2022)

Is the snowmaking base decent enough to survive the rain and warm temps?


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## urungus (Nov 27, 2022)

skimagic said:


> Is the snowmaking base decent enough to survive the rain and warm temps?



Top of Hop has great coverage but further down there are a few rough spots already this afternoon before the r**n


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## jaytrem (Nov 27, 2022)

They put down a base on Jaws for a number of years when Plummet was cut.  Guess that's not as easy anymore with the pipe moved to the other side,would have to use Ripcord's.  I'm not complaining.  Would rather wait for the natural.


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## drjeff (Nov 27, 2022)

urungus said:


> Top of Hop has great coverage but further down there are a few rough spots already this afternoon before the r**n
> 
> View attachment 55169
> 
> ...


The new HKD's layed the product down. The much further spaced apart fan guns on the bottom flats of Ridge and the air/water ground Snow Logics on the lower section of Link put down much more of a window dressing than the HKD's did.

Rumor circulating around is that they're going to be more aggressive with firing the system up during the *hopefully* few evening opportunities they may get this week to keep what's open open, and then continue laying down snow on trails like Snowdance that they started at the end of the pre Thanksgiving cold. 

Need mother nature to get cooperative with some decent wet bulb numbers again soon


----------



## sugarbushskier (Nov 28, 2022)

Trying to get a November day in to begin the season, but wondering if anyone has information on today's conditions and whether it's worth heading up tomorrow or not.  Is Hop still open? Can I park at Carinthia and use Heavy Metal to access the main mountain?  Report says so, but also heard that Hop was getting thin before last night's rain and if they close Carinthia access I'll have to park at main mountain. Of course tomorrow's report won't be available until I'm more than halfway there so have to commit one way or the other tonight.

I know if I don't get out tomorrow the rain on Wednesday and Saturday will further decimate the thin cover so it would be another week to 10 days before I'd venture out.  Have Epic so essentially no cost to ski, but 2.5 hour drive will be the tougher part.

Any firsthand info is appreciated.


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## ThatGuy (Nov 28, 2022)

I would expect to still be able to access the main mountain from Carinthia tomorrow. You use Long John from Heavy Metal.


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## amf (Nov 29, 2022)

drjeff said:


> The new HKD's layed the product down. The much further spaced apart fan guns on the bottom flats of Ridge and the air/water ground Snow Logics on the lower section of Link put down much more of a window dressing than the HKD's did.


Interesting you said that. I was there Thanksgiving day for the first time since Mt Snow became part of Vail, and was hugely impressed with the quantity of product they layed down in a relatively short period of time. However, I was also impressed (not in a good way) by what I considered to be the poor quality of the product. All the trees in the vicinity of the new guns were coated in ice, and the surface of the trails had the scratchy hardpack feel of eastern skiing at its best, with lots of death cookies left by the groomers. Lower down, in the realm of the fan guns, conditions were better. Definitely not what I had come to expect in the pre-Vail days. Made me wonder if they hadn't learned how to dial in the system or lacked experienced operators.


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## Newpylong (Nov 29, 2022)

That is the telltale sign of pushing prior to waiting for the piles to dry out. Sometimes ya gotta do what you gotta do to get the trail open. In general Low-E equipment will make a wetter product than a fan gun, and there likely were barely any piles down low to begin with when they pushed.


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## urungus (Dec 2, 2022)

North Face was empty today.  They did a good job of resurfacing after Wednesdays weather.  Unfortunately won’t last.


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## drjeff (Dec 2, 2022)

Word around town this evening is that the VT Tramway board issued the Sundance Express its official VT license plate certifying it for operation today. Plan apparently is to get it spinning later next week after the next couple of liquid events pass and they can make snow down by its base ahead of Sundance Lodge opening next weekend for the season. 

Sunbrook express is apparently on schedule to be certified and open just prior to Christmas Weekend.

Got my warm weather wax on the skis and plenty of goretex articles of clothing good to go for tomorrow...


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## ctdubl07 (Dec 3, 2022)

Cool to see Sundance lift spinning all day loaded with chairs...just need some snow.
This weather was not kind to trails....


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## ctdubl07 (Dec 4, 2022)

Guns blowing on primary Carinthia trails since around 7:30am this morning. 
Also blowing around base of new Sundance lift...


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## SLyardsale (Dec 4, 2022)

multiple skiers in the woods off Cascade today.  not much production from the base area guns.  interesting day.


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## sugarbushskier (Dec 4, 2022)

Heading up tomorrow.  Were they resurfacing any trails?  Was there last week and Hop was thin but very skiable.  How was it today?


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## drjeff (Dec 4, 2022)

sugarbushskier said:


> Heading up tomorrow.  Were they resurfacing any trails?  Was there last week and Hop was thin but very skiable.  How was it today?


They were resurfacing a bunch of trails on the main face. 

Working on expansion mode as well with Snowdance, N.E. Time, Nitro, Inferno and Cooper Junction under the guns. 

Tomorrow should be better than today with some more grooming and more time for some of Saturday's rain to drain out a bit.


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## sugarbushskier (Dec 4, 2022)

Thanks for the updates.  Sounds like they're doing what they can without mother nature cooperating.  

Was surprised how good it was last Tuesday for my first day out as my expectations were low, so expect the same tomorrow. Still seems like MS has the best early season options out there.


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## Newpylong (Dec 4, 2022)

That snowmaking system drops the .


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## SLyardsale (Dec 4, 2022)

they had guns on everywhere today.  the lower elevation ones were not doing much.  from what i can see, they want nitro express open.  they were making snow on inferno - the whole route - and lower fools gold, so i would assume upper fools too to get in place before nitro, the trail , with gulch already on that kinda makes sense and i think they did that last year as well. while on heavy metal i could see nothing sticking on inferno. up higher, little john was full on.  also high traverse from the new lift onto southbowl but nothing beyond that connection.  i suspect they want to siphon people off that side when they ride the new lift - they don't want them all on LJ, hop and ridge - but they'll need to connect high traverse to cascade - or start on lodge/southbowl proper soon instead.   they were also full on on snow dance.  they tried to make snow in marginal temps. after the front came thru it was dry, but it was 31/32(f) at the base for most of the afternoon.  right now 25(f) at 10pm.


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## ss20 (Dec 4, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> That snowmaking system drops the .



I can't recall another mountain that completely flipped a switch in snowmaking fire power in 1-2 seasons like Mount Snow did once West Lake came on board!  Usually (as you know) it's years of projects before you notice a substantial difference.


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## drjeff (Dec 5, 2022)

ss20 said:


> I can't recall another mountain that completely flipped a switch in snowmaking fire power in 1-2 seasons like Mount Snow did once West Lake came on board!  Usually (as you know) it's years of projects before you notice a substantial difference.



The thing you have to remember about the snowmaking system at Mount Snow, is that when they brought West Lake online a few seasons ago, it wasn't just plugging the new reservoir into the existing system, they essentially built an entirely new, and greatly enhanced, pumping system, air system, various valve stations, miles of supply pipe, new guns, etc, etc. 

And they keep making enhancements to it as well.

Was wild to see how many significant trails they had simultaneously lit up yesterday, so many more than they used to be able to do pre West Lake


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## FBGM (Dec 5, 2022)

I think the big difference is Peak Resorts didn’t know how to run their system correct. Vail and the current management know much better then the scrubs that used to be there


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## Newpylong (Dec 5, 2022)

They have the best setup period. Essentially one massive 24" feed from the bottom of Carinthia to Roy's (boosted) to the top and then umbrella from there. Then the smaller system for Carinthia. Essentially 9,000 GPM right to the top of the hill to send where they want.


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## ctdubl07 (Dec 5, 2022)

Before all the guns started firing, I heard a snowcat rumble over to Carinthia the other morning and park next to LP gas tanks. Maybe posting up to start some work soon..


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## urungus (Dec 5, 2022)

North Face icy AF today.  Hop was full of huge whales, very fun.  Best snow was on Long John and The Gulch, both recently resurfaced and skied great.   Cascade/Canyon packed down pretty firm.  Diid not make it to top of Ridge.  No sign of activity on Sundance lift.


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## ThatGuy (Dec 5, 2022)

Needed ice skates for Cascade but Long John was great. Love the look of the new Sundance terminal, very sleek.


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## drjeff (Dec 5, 2022)

The snowpack took a BUNCH of water on Saturday for sure! As in I had a small stream running through the parking lot about 3 Saturday afternoon when I went to put my boot bag in my car amount of rain!

Fingers crossed I'll get my first ride on the new Sundance Express this weekend.  The chairs were running FAST as they were testing it over the weekend!


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## Newpylong (Dec 5, 2022)

That terminal with Poma's wood would be hot. Think someone else mentioned that before.


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## drjeff (Dec 5, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> That terminal with Poma's wood would be hot. Think someone else mentioned that before.


Guilty!


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## sugarbushskier (Dec 5, 2022)

Snow surfaces today were far better than I ever imagined.  I had low expectations after the rain, but almost all main face runs were resurfaced with enough mm snow to make conditions enjoyable.  The more the snow got skied in, the better the traction.

Both North Face trails were very very scratchy, especially Chute, but skiable.


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## icecoast1 (Dec 6, 2022)

FBGM said:


> I think the big difference is Peak Resorts didn’t know how to run their system correct. Vail and the current management know much better then the scrubs that used to be there



Not sure vail knows how to run their east coast resorts either.  The people on the ground actually running the system likely figured out how to best use it.  Purely coincidence that it happened with Vail


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## Newpylong (Dec 6, 2022)

His hard on against the Boyds is clouding his vision.

The people on the ground under Peak knew how to use it just fine, they built it. There were many evenings with 300 guns running at once. I am sure Dr Jeff can corroborate that snowmaking was quite impressive post West Lake under their ownership.


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## icecoast1 (Dec 6, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> His hard on against the Boyds is clouding his vision.
> 
> The people on the ground under Peak knew how to use it just fine, they built it. There were many evenings with 300 guns running at once. I am sure Dr Jeff can corroborate that snowmaking was quite impressive post West Lake under their ownership.



The difference pre/post west lake was certainly noticeable to me early on in the Peak days.  If anything, they seemed a bit more aggressive with it than Vail has been so far


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## drjeff (Dec 6, 2022)

icecoast1 said:


> The difference pre/post west lake was certainly noticeable to me early on in the Peak days.  If anything, they seemed a bit more aggressive with it than Vail has been so far


Not sure if it's a case of being more aggressive with one owner or the other or the case of having a couple of seasons of efficiency data and knowledge of how to efficiently make the most amount of snow at specific costs that they have learned.

Both under Peak and now Vail, they have had that system cranking


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## FBGM (Dec 6, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> His hard on against the Boyds is clouding his vision.
> 
> The people on the ground under Peak knew how to use it just fine, they built it. There were many evenings with 300 guns running at once. I am sure Dr Jeff can corroborate that snowmaking was quite impressive post West Lake under their ownership.


Yeah them and their homies can all eat a bag of dicks


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## SLyardsale (Dec 8, 2022)

maybe tomorrow


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## Newpylong (Dec 8, 2022)

Now thats a lift. I forgot how close the south side of the hotel is. Could that be an easier shlep for some people staying there than going to the Main Base?


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## chuckstah (Dec 8, 2022)

The lift looks great. It was running off and on all day at various speeds.  They were pushing snow around the base terminal, but it's pretty barren near the summit terminal. Probably not tomorrow, but soon. If the crowd is anything like today (maybe a couple hundred) they won't need the capacity.


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## SLyardsale (Dec 8, 2022)

chuckstah said:


> Probably not tomorrow, but soon. If the crowd is anything like today (maybe a couple hundred) they won't need the capacity.


ever heard of a soft opening? tomorrow works better than saturday . come saturday, they will have resurfaced coopers once already


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## chuckstah (Dec 8, 2022)

SLyardsale said:


> ever heard of a soft opening? tomorrow works better than saturday . come saturday, they will have resurfaced coopers once already


Yes, I have. Could happen if they make, find enough snow for the unload. But I'd think Saturday.


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## drjeff (Dec 9, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> Now thats a lift. I forgot how close the south side of the hotel is. Could that be an easier shlep for some people staying there than going to the Main Base?


 Probably depends on which side of the Grand Summit one's room is on. The reality is the ski check for guests of the hotel is in the middle of the building slope side. It likely is a little less labor intensive to get to the new Sundance lift than over to the main base area lifts. Time will tell


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## shadyjay (Dec 9, 2022)

Why do they still insist on numbering their lifts?  To top it off, its based off a numbering system that included Haystack's lifts, so with those out of the picture (for the past 10+ years), the #s don't make sense.


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## drjeff (Dec 9, 2022)

shadyjay said:


> Why do they still insist on numbering their lifts?  To top it off, its based off a numbering system that included Haystack's lifts, so with those out of the picture (for the past 10+ years), the #s don't make sense.


Ultimately the lift numbering is what the mountain uses via radio when response to a lift for maintenance or patrol is needed.  And with some of Mount Snow's lifts (Sunbrook and Sundance in particular) sounding very similar, let alone if there;'s a call to patrol for someone on say the Snowdance trail, there's much less likely a chance that the place to respond to won't be confused, especially when some of those responding may be outside in the wind with a hemlet on when the call is made, if they call out say lift 7 (Sundance) or Lift 19 (Sunbrook) or a patrol sled to the Snowdance trail.

Ultimately the general public refers to most lifts by it's verbal name, some of the regulars will refer to a lift by either it's regular or numeric names, and the ops folks refer to the lift, especially when on the mountain's radio channel, by it's numeric name


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## urungus (Dec 9, 2022)

shadyjay said:


> Why do they still insist on numbering their lifts?  To top it off, its based off a numbering system that included Haystack's lifts, so with those out of the picture (for the past 10+ years), the #s don't make sense.


Doesn’t every mountain do this ?


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## SLyardsale (Dec 9, 2022)

sundance express didnt open to the general public today.  it did open to patrol and cheers went out when patrol passed over head on lower ridge.  the top unload was fine - looked like they wanted a better product on coopers = so as chuckstah said - saturday
resurface efforts on every open section except freefall, hop and river run


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## Newpylong (Dec 9, 2022)

urungus said:


> Doesn’t every mountain do this ?


Only a few.


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## drjeff (Dec 9, 2022)

lots of fan guns lit up this evening


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## jaytrem (Dec 9, 2022)

What time do the lifts open tomorrow?  Not sure I trust anybody at Vail to update properly.


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## drjeff (Dec 9, 2022)

jaytrem said:


> What time do the lifts open tomorrow?  Not sure I trust anybody at Vail to update properly.


8AM they spin on weekends and holidays, 9AM during the week.

Unlike when Peak used to vary the opening/closing time depending on the time of the year, Vail keeps it the same all season long


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## jaytrem (Dec 9, 2022)

Thanks, now what time does Sundance open???


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## drjeff (Dec 9, 2022)

jaytrem said:


> Thanks, now what time does Sundance open???


Presuming tomorrow is its official debut day, I would guess it would spin at 8, just like the other major base area lifts do


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## SLyardsale (Dec 9, 2022)

jaytrem said:


> Thanks, now what time does Sundance open???





drjeff said:


> Presuming tomorrow is its official debut day, I would guess it would spin at 8, just like the other major base area lifts do


wont there be some fanfare involved?  john q public isnt getting 1st chair. nothing from vail on insta as of now


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## shadyjay (Dec 9, 2022)

drjeff said:


> Ultimately the lift numbering is what the mountain uses via radio when response to a lift for maintenance or patrol is needed.  And with some of Mount Snow's lifts (Sunbrook and Sundance in particular) sounding very similar, let alone if there;'s a call to patrol for someone on say the Snowdance trail, there's much less likely a chance that the place to respond to won't be confused, especially when some of those responding may be outside in the wind with a hemlet on when the call is made, if they call out say lift 7 (Sundance) or Lift 19 (Sunbrook) or a patrol sled to the Snowdance trail.


You're right... that makes perfect sense.  They do have a few lifts that sound alike.  
Maybe its just the fact that the numbering sequence is off (due to Haystack) that drives me nuts.  Then again, if you change the numbers around, everyone's gotta learn the new numbers.  It can be done... just a learning curve.  (Something all of us in SNE are going through on the highways in the past year and for the next few).


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## jaytrem (Dec 10, 2022)

Haystack lifts were all in the 20s.  So the only thing they messed up was the Discovery Center.  Most of the lifts are numbered in the order they were built (or the lift that replaced the original).  When they bought Carinthia the 1, 2, 3 numbers were no longer in use.  Those were old chain drive lifts.  So they used the low numbers for the 3 of them.


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## drjeff (Dec 10, 2022)

Sundance official opening at 9 on Sunday


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## jaytrem (Dec 10, 2022)

Sunbrook was spinning today with no chairs.  Guess it's close to being ready.

Excellent day out there today.  This was my latest first (outdoor) day in ages.  Didn't expect to have 4 day weekend in mid Nov and not even Killington open.  Was excellent disc golf weather though, 70+ degrees in Bennington.

Mount Snow is blowing (aka making) crazy amounts of snow now.  When we finished today I think it was more than I've ever seen at one time.


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## urungus (Dec 10, 2022)

Will Sundance Base Lodge (and its ticket office - have a vip pass to redeem) be open tomorrow ?


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## jaytrem (Dec 10, 2022)

urungus said:


> Will Sundance Base Lodge (and its ticket office - have a vip pass to redeem) be open tomorrow ?


Probably not, especially since the lift is opening an hour late.  Easy close up parking (currently free) at Carinthia is my pick for this weekend.


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## drjeff (Dec 10, 2022)

jaytrem said:


> Sunbrook was spinning today with no chairs.  Guess it's close to being ready.
> 
> Excellent day out there today.  This was my latest first (outdoor) day in ages.  Didn't expect to have 4 day weekend in mid Nov and not even Killington open.  Was excellent disc golf weather though, 70+ degrees in Bennington.
> 
> Mount Snow is blowing (aka making) crazy amounts of snow now.  When we finished today I think it was more than I've ever seen at one time.


Chairs were being assembled for Sunbrook this week. 

Read online via social media from a very reliable source, that as long as the weather cooperates, Sunbrook will be tested, certified, and spinning with people on it a few days before Christmas.

Also heard via a patroller my wife and I rode up the Bluebird with this morning and were talking about the new Sundance lift with, per a lift mechanic, if you are seated in the seat closest to the Grand Summit Hotel when you load, you want to be quick getting off the lift and give a good push, as the unload is a little flat and the chair might catch you as it finishes going around the bullwheel


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## urungus (Dec 11, 2022)

drjeff said:


> if you are seated in the seat closest to the Grand Summit Hotel when you load, you want to be quick getting off the lift and give a good push, as the unload is a little flat and the chair might catch you as it finishes going around the bullwheel


ha ha, that has happened to me twice on the Challenger chair, got a nice bruise on the hip each time.


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## urungus (Dec 11, 2022)

I got Chair #5 !!


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## urungus (Dec 11, 2022)

From Mt Snow Facebook


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## Smellytele (Dec 11, 2022)

No dr Jeff on the first chair?


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## MikeDeJ (Dec 11, 2022)

urungus said:


> I got Chair #5 !!
> 
> View attachment 55247
> 
> ...


I was right behind you on chair 6!!!   Nice chair will be interesting to see how it flows on a Saturday.


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## drjeff (Dec 11, 2022)

Smellytele said:


> No dr Jeff on the first chair?


Unfortunately I was up at the Okemo Mountain School today taking my US ski and snowboard association Alpine Officials certification exam...

My wife was kind enough to get one of the magnets for our refrigerator, and both she and my son were impressed with the new lift! 

I'll get my 1st ride on it next weekend


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## jaytrem (Dec 11, 2022)

MikeDeJ said:


> I was right behind you on chair 6!!!   Nice chair will be interesting to see how it flows on a Saturday.


I was a few chairs behind you.  Cookies were quite good!  We're already making good use of the chair.  They shut off the guns on Hop around 2, so we lapped that for 5 or 6 straight.  Lots of fun on the whales!  The bubble line was super short all day, so there was almost nobody riding Sundance.  Most of the time when we were at the base there wasn't anybody else headed for it.  Will be interesting to see how crowded it gets on busy days.  I suspect it won't cut down the bubble line much at all, but might make the quad line a bit shorter.


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## skimagic (Dec 14, 2022)

I checked out the new Sundance chair yesterday.  It was having some issues with a delayed start, then loading every other chair, and sometimes, every third chair. It also ran slow at times.  The offload is small but not much could be done there.
During busy times there will be an issue with collision avoidance where long john cuta across the end of canyon on its way to the main base, which Sundance lift users will have to ford to get the lift.  A light crowd was there yesterday but a cutover swarm of high speed boarders almost hit me there.

other lifts with issues were challenger, it would not start for a bit- someone mentioned that happened Monday also.  And the summit quad, that kept stopping, and if you were lucky, you were in a snowgun blast .  Tons of guns were firing all over the main mountain. things are looking up!


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## drjeff (Dec 14, 2022)

Snowdance opened today. Should be getting Nitro (and the Nitro quad)  and Mineshaft and possibly Inferno in the next day or 2, Lodge should be opening soon (which means they'll spin the Bluebird again once they're done making snow on the upper section of Lodge) and a whaled up Plummet should be seeing a rope drop as well very soon.

If the 10 day forecast holds remotely true, should be heading into the busy Christmas Week with the vast majority of snowmaking terrain open and most, if not all lifts spinning.  This basic goal of the West Lake snowmaking upgrade a few years ago, which was to have all of the snowmaking terrain open for Christmas Week seems like is working as planned


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## GregoryIsaacs (Dec 14, 2022)

Maybe we'll get some natural terrain open too! What a turnaround for the valley. They will need every lift spinning to keep up with the hordes that are likely to come. Guess we'll find out about the new lifts on peak days sooner rather than later!


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## ThatGuy (Dec 14, 2022)

Long John is going to be a shooting gallery.


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## drjeff (Dec 14, 2022)

ThatGuy said:


> Long John is going to be a shooting gallery.



Been that way for the 40 years or so I have been skiing Mount Snow.

Not sure how the topography (and the US Forest Service) could ever allow that to change, even though it now is a little better on the mid section from basically the top of Ridge down to Carinthia corner after they widened it 5ish years ago now


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## Newpylong (Dec 14, 2022)

ThatGuy said:


> Long John is going to be a shooting gallery.



My first "big" mountain was Mount Snow in 1988 or so. After a quick trip up the Yankee Clipper, Long John still resembled Storrow Drive back then. Nothings changed.


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## SLyardsale (Dec 14, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> My first "big" mountain was Mount Snow in 1988 or so. After a quick trip up the Yankee Clipper, Long John still resembled Storrow Drive back then. Nothings changed.


when they do early access on saturdays at 7:30am, a strategy is to ski long john first - it's about the only time you can navigate it non stop from top to bottom on a weekend


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## connersw (Dec 15, 2022)

Never skied Mount Snow before. Will be skiing Hunter Fri and debating heading up for Sat. 

What are the chances more terrain opens on the North Face considering what it looked like pre-storm and historical precedent? How crowded is that area typically on weekends?


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## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Dec 15, 2022)

connersw said:


> Never skied Mount Snow before. Will be skiing Hunter Fri and debating heading up for Sat.
> 
> What are the chances more terrain opens on the North Face considering what it looked like pre-storm and historical precedent? How crowded is that area typically on weekends?


North face will be least crowded area but I have seen weekends with 15 min lines over there and this could well be one of those weekends with people itching to get out and a well publicized storm.


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## drjeff (Dec 15, 2022)

connersw said:


> Never skied Mount Snow before. Will be skiing Hunter Fri and debating heading up for Sat.
> 
> What are the chances more terrain opens on the North Face considering what it looked like pre-storm and historical precedent? How crowded is that area typically on weekends?


Plummet is almost certain to open (they've been making snow on it the last few days. I believe that Fallen Timbers is in the same scenario).  Whether or not they drop the rope on some of the natural snow terrain on the Northface will depend on just how much snow falls and what the wind does with it.

Winds on Saturday as the storm pulls away will likley be an issue with some lifts (not an uncommon thing at Mount Snow as a Nor'easter pulls away) if they gust as are predicted by some meterologists


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## ThatGuy (Dec 15, 2022)

I’ll pop over there Monday once the riff-raff is gone, hoping for a greatly expanded trail count.


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## drjeff (Dec 15, 2022)

ThatGuy said:


> I’ll pop over there Monday once the riff-raff is gone, hoping for a greatly expanded trail count.



Guessing by Monday if this storm delivers as they're expecting, with the exception of the Sunbrook area (apparently that won't be opening for another week if the new lift construction and testing goes as they hope due to the presence of the constrcution crew and some equipment in the base terminal area in particluar) most of the rest of the mountain, short of maybe Ripcord and a few select snwmaking trails where they may have active equipment deployed across the trail, could very well be in play.

Heck, a few of my friends who live full time in the Mount Snow area and are on the hill most days, have mentioned in a group text we have that even if this storm ends up a total dud (not looking that way) that with all the trails they've been making snow on this week, that this weekend would have probably double the acreage open compared to last weekend


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## GregoryIsaacs (Dec 19, 2022)

Any word on the Sunbrook Quad? Were now a week away from go-time and I haven't heard anything about a potential opening date yet. Anyone see movement over the weekend? Hope the storm didn't delay things.

Fingers crossed so we can see if these new improvements will help solve the crowding issues.


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## drjeff (Dec 19, 2022)

GregoryIsaacs said:


> Any word on the Sunbrook Quad? Were now a week away from go-time and I haven't heard anything about a potential opening date yet. Anyone see movement over the weekend? Hope the storm didn't delay things.
> 
> Fingers crossed so we can see if these new improvements will help solve the crowding issues.


I 100% saw it moving yesterday. Heard numerous people, who are in the loop, say that load testing and final inspection will be happening early this week, and it should be good to carry people late week. Now if only mother nature would cooperate late week so the mtn ops folks can get the snazzy, big cow bell that Doppylmayr gives to the resort when they finish installing a new lift, and not need rain gear at that ceremony!


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## Smellytele (Dec 19, 2022)

Can the title change to just Mt Snow removing "21-22 season"


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## skimagic (Dec 19, 2022)

Sundance lift kept shutting  down first hour or so after opening. i any insight as to  what the issue is ?


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## urungus (Dec 20, 2022)

Nice conditions today.  Started off with my favorite route down the main face, linking up all 3 black trails
Lodge / Ledge / Somerset Rd / Pat’s Pitch / Sap Bucket / Yard Sale



Entrance to Ledge:


Looking back up at the biggest Ledge, getting scraped off, I often struggle with this part, too old to send it…


Looking down Ledge:


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## urungus (Dec 20, 2022)

A few shots from the Northface:

Olympic:


Olympic:


Challenger:


Challenger:


Plummet:


Jaws:


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## Kevin Schultz (Dec 20, 2022)

Nice pics. Makes me glad I changed my plans to get up there one day this week before the warmup / freeze coming this week. 

Any word on the Sunbrook lift opening date? Haven't seen anything in a while.


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## drjeff (Dec 20, 2022)

Kevin Schultz said:


> Nice pics. Makes me glad I changed my plans to get up there one day this week before the warmup / freeze coming this week.
> 
> Any word on the Sunbrook lift opening date? Haven't seen anything in a while.


The end of this week is what word on the hill was this past weekend.  Not sure how the stinker that Mother Nature is going to throw their way on Friday will play into the exact day


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## Vince (Dec 21, 2022)

Also skied Weds. Great conditions especially on the non groomed. Found some good bumps and loose powder on the North Face. Good size crowd for a weekday and an impressive blitzkrieg of snow guns everywhere.
If your on the fence for Thursday....GO


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## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Dec 22, 2022)

How bad.do folks expect crowds to be Monday?
Between hitting Snow that day and going to West to avoid Epic lines.


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## jaytrem (Dec 22, 2022)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> How bad.do folks expect crowds to be Monday?
> Between hitting Snow that day and going to West to avoid Epic lines.


If past years of weekend Xmas and New Years, crowds start out smaller earlier in the week and ramp up as we get closer to New Years.

Where are you thinking for West?


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## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Dec 22, 2022)

jaytrem said:


> If past years of weekend Xmas and New Years, crowds start out smaller earlier in the week and ramp up as we get closer to New Years.
> 
> Where are you thinking for West?


I'm thinking about West Mt in Queensbury NY which is on IndyPass


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## drjeff (Dec 22, 2022)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> How bad.do folks expect crowds to be Monday?
> Between hitting Snow that day and going to West to avoid Epic lines.



The 26th usually isn't too crazy, historically what I would call a "light weekend crowd".  The 27th is when the full on crowds tend to show up most years and stick around through the 30th, when a fair amount of the masses start their trek back to the flatlands for their New Years Eve parties


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## ThatGuy (Dec 22, 2022)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> I'm thinking about West Mt in Queensbury NY which is on IndyPass


The only reason I’d go West over Snow is if they miraculously get significant snowfall this weekend. Even with a larger crowd Mt Snow will have the terrain and infrastructure to mitigate that.


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## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Dec 22, 2022)

ThatGuy said:


> The only reason I’d go West over Snow is if they miraculously get significant snowfall this weekend. Even with a larger crowd Mt Snow will have the terrain and infrastructure to mitigate that.


Thanks. I've just been concerned based on horror stories from recent past Xmas breaks at Snow.

Doing Okemo on 25th when lines should be fine


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## ThatGuy (Dec 22, 2022)

If you avoid Bluebird you’ll be fine. Sundance/GSE and Outpost/Challenger will be your best bets to avoid lines. Sunbrook may even be open by then.


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## NYDB (Dec 22, 2022)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> Thanks. I've just been concerned based on horror stories from recent past Xmas breaks at Snow.


be sure to post pics / videos of the fights.


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## jaytrem (Dec 22, 2022)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> I'm thinking about West Mt in Queensbury NY which is on IndyPass


Ahhh, that West, I was thinking you meant flying somewhere.  We're thinking about hitting West on my way to MS.  Haven't been there in ages and like you said, it's on the Indy.  We'll wait to see how conditions are looking.


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## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Dec 23, 2022)

As West is opening with only the South peak, I will definitely do Mt Snow on Mon.

As it is not real apparent on their site can someone remind me what the new parking fee is


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## ThatGuy (Dec 23, 2022)

I believe its $15 for lower lots, $30 for prime lots and lots D and E are free.


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## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Dec 23, 2022)

ThatGuy said:


> I believe its $15 for lower lots, $30 for prime lots and lots D and E are free.


Thanks - beats the $40 at Stowe


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## urungus (Dec 23, 2022)

ThatGuy said:


> I believe its $15 for lower lots, $30 for prime lots and lots D and E are free.



Lots B and C, Sundance and Lower Carinthia are free on non-holiday weekdays.  Also all lots are free after 1pm.
More info:  
	

	







						Directions By Bus, Train, or Shuttle | Mount Snow Ski Resort
					






					www.mountsnow.com


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## drjeff (Dec 24, 2022)

9AM Monday the 26th.. The new Sunbrook HSQ opens! The Sunbrook pod itself opens at 8:45 that morning


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## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Dec 24, 2022)

drjeff said:


> 9AM Monday the 26th.. The new Sunbrook HSQ opens! The Sunbrook pod itself opens at 8:45 that morning


Nice - will plan to be there for that. 
Hitting Okemo tomorrow.


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## ctdubl07 (Dec 26, 2022)

Grabbed a brownie and a ride to top. Still cold as hell but much faster! Appreciate the design element of the woody control cabins. Lots of guns firing everywhere.


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## jaytrem (Dec 26, 2022)

The brownie cookie combos are as sweet as the new lift!   Eating them now.   Ridge trees are skiing well.  Will have to check out some others.  No lines at Sundance....


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## jaytrem (Dec 26, 2022)

Ski2LiveLive2Ski said:


> Nice - will plan to be there for that.
> Hitting Okemo tomorrow.


We might head up there tomorrow for a change of pace also. Berkshire East also a possibility this week with Indy.


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## drjeff (Dec 26, 2022)

Got 2 laps on it already. 1st lap we did the full "tour de new stuff" Sundance lift down the new snowmaking on shooting star and then up the new Sunbrook lift.

Like the faster ride! Much less of a drop off than the previous top ramp too.

Tons of snowmaking going on all over the mtn too!


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## jaytrem (Dec 26, 2022)

Both new lifts are a bust, no lines at either one today.  Looks like no parking rail at Sunbrook for now. They did have that on the plans.  That's okay, with all the delays on new lifts, it's nice that ours are up and running.

Great day, trees skied much better than expected.  No lines except for the bubble.


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## ThatGuy (Dec 27, 2022)

dantaebatesss3 on TikTok
					

skier on skier crime #ski #fyp #snowboarding




					www.tiktok.com


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## MidnightJester (Dec 27, 2022)

ThatGuy said:


> dantaebatesss3 on TikTok
> 
> 
> skier on skier crime #ski #fyp #snowboarding
> ...


Its been removed already I think lol


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## ThatGuy (Dec 27, 2022)

It has been removed lol


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## drjeff (Dec 27, 2022)

Noticed yesterday in a few places that it appeared that they are evaluating some SMI Grizzly low E stick guns adjacent to some of their standard go to air/water guns, the  HKD Impluse.  In particluar near the bottom of Beartrap 

Will be curious to see if they start to add more of those into their fleet over time or not.  Regardless of what guns were hooked into the system yesterday, the SMI Grizzly, The HKD Impulse, the Snow Logic DV4 or the fan guns, the whales being made were BIG!  Heck, a couple of the whales down near the finish shack on Charlie's Chase were easily taller than the roofline of the finish shack!


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## jaytrem (Dec 27, 2022)

Roller Coaster whales are also crazy big.  I figured they wouldn't open it like that.  Unfortunately I was correct, they were knocking them down this afternoon.


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## Newpylong (Dec 27, 2022)

The Grizzlies are good. Not as good as the Impulse but at a grand cheaper per head sometimes close enough works...I think you'll start to see more of them.


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## ThatGuy (Dec 27, 2022)

MidnightJester said:


> Its been removed already I think lol


New link


__
		https://www.reddit.com/r/PublicFreakout/comments/zwmkly


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## urungus (Dec 27, 2022)

ThatGuy said:


> New link
> 
> 
> __
> https://www.reddit.com/r/PublicFreakout/comments/zwmkly


100% fault of the filmer, ran into the guy from behind and in a slow zone no less, not sure why the filmer would post this evidence of their guilt ?!?


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## jaytrem (Dec 27, 2022)

urungus said:


> 100% fault of the filmer, ran into the guy from behind and in a slow zone no less, not sure why the filmer would post this evidence of their guilt ?!?


Yup, no doubt on that one.  Both were going pretty fast for a slow zone.  Ski the trees, they're safer!


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## ThatGuy (Dec 27, 2022)

Yeah guy filming is an idiot. Also those are some nice trees at that part of Long John.


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## urungus (Dec 27, 2022)

I love how towards the end of the video, they each scream at the other about how they have an Epic Pass so therefore they are an expert


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## cdskier (Dec 27, 2022)

I don't understand the filming guy trying to say he didn't see the guy he hit. The guy he hit was skiing a pretty consistent (albeit very wide) line. Love how he tries to claim crashing into another person is a normal part of skiing...


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## IceEidolon (Dec 28, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> The Grizzlies are good. Not as good as the Impulse but at a grand cheaper per head sometimes close enough works...I think you'll start to see more of them.


Especially for smaller places who aren't gonna go Klik anyway or wouldn't be buying the R5 stick...

Not that this would apply to Snow, they can get what they want. The question for them is do they want the air savings in cold weather + taller towers + slight performance edge + parts commonality badly enough? 15% off is a fairly enticing deal.


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## DanConnor (Dec 28, 2022)

cdskier said:


> I don't understand the filming guy trying to say he didn't see the guy he hit. The guy he hit was skiing a pretty consistent (albeit very wide) line. Love how he tries to claim crashing into another person is a normal part of skiing...


Yep, the other guy was literally in the view during entire video... Just gotta put a blame on someone else I guess(reminded me of an idiot who would shoot too close to me at the local range while I was practicing with my new P365 9mm luger from https://gritrsports.com/shooting/firearms/pistols/9mm-luger/ . Got a few burns from his shells ejecting over the barrier...)


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## jaytrem (Dec 28, 2022)

DanConnor said:


> Yep, the other guy was literally in the view during entire video... Just gotta put a blame on someone else I guess


He did seem to give up on blaming the other guy pretty quickly.  Guess he realized that wasn't gonna fly.  Guy in front was kinda douchy skiing.  Edge to edge GS turns on Long John?  It's allowed, but you're just looking to get hit.


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## Smellytele (Dec 28, 2022)

They're both to blame they chose to ski at Mount Snow.


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## Newpylong (Dec 28, 2022)

Plenty of good skiing there.


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## Smellytele (Dec 28, 2022)

Newpylong said:


> Plenty of good skiing there.


There is more about places than the actual skiing...

I can have fun there just like any ski area but would I choose to go there over some where else with all things considered?


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## Kevin Schultz (Dec 28, 2022)

Smellytele said:


> There is more about places than the actual skiing...
> 
> I can have fun there just like any ski area but would I choose to go there over some where else with all things considered?


Drive time. Mount Snow, Stratton, Okemo and Magic are the limit of what I can do for a weekend trip from NYC with two kids under 5.

When I lived further north I had a season pass to Sugarbush and that was obviously better skiing, but it's just not in the cards these days. Among those 4 options Mount Snow was the best option for us, though a big part of it was the relative price of houses at Stratton and Mount Snow at the time. If I were just choosing Epic vs Ikon and staying in hotels / AirBnB, I'd choose Ikon and ski Stratton after the last few years. 

So often when talking about where to ski people ignore the off the hill factors.


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## drjeff (Dec 28, 2022)

Kevin Schultz said:


> Drive time. Mount Snow, Stratton, Okemo and Magic are the limit of what I can do for a weekend trip from NYC with two kids under 5.
> 
> When I lived further north I had a season pass to Sugarbush and that was obviously better skiing, but it's just not in the cards these days. Among those 4 options Mount Snow was the best option for us, though a big part of it was the relative price of houses at Stratton and Mount Snow at the time. If I were just choosing Epic vs Ikon and staying in hotels / AirBnB, I'd choose Ikon and ski Stratton after the last few years.
> 
> So often when talking about where to ski people ignore the off the hill factors.


Agree 100%, especially if you have young kids in the mix and drive time is a factor.

Plus you often find out that there are plenty of other like minded parents, doing the same thing for the same reasons, and then you become friends with those parents and your kids become friends with their kids and other families kids to that are just as much into the ski culture/skiing way of life all Winter as you are, and you have a great community of families that make the overall "weekend warrior" skiing experience that many of us in the East in particular do, even better.

Honestly, even after owning our condo at Mount Snow for over 15 years now, if my wife and I ever decide to sell it, leaving the community of great, like minded skiing friends and families up there, would easily be the part that we'd miss the most. And most of that network of friends that we have met up there we met through 1 of 2 main ways, either our kids involvement in various kids programs (the way we've met most of our ski family friends) or at our favorite base lodge bar (often waiting for our kids ski programs to finish up for the day and you find out your sitting next to parents doing the same thing  )


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## Ski2LiveLive2Ski (Dec 28, 2022)

Kevin Schultz said:


> Drive time. Mount Snow, Stratton, Okemo and Magic are the limit of what I can do for a weekend trip from NYC with two kids under 5.
> 
> When I lived further north I had a season pass to Sugarbush and that was obviously better skiing, but it's just not in the cards these days. Among those 4 options Mount Snow was the best option for us, though a big part of it was the relative price of houses at Stratton and Mount Snow at the time. If I were just choosing Epic vs Ikon and staying in hotels / AirBnB, I'd choose Ikon and ski Stratton after the last few years.
> 
> So often when talking about where to ski people ignore the off the hill factors.


Bromley would also be closer than at least 3 of those. And arguably the sweetest spot geographically as being by Bromley you are 15 minutes from Stratton and Magic and 45 from Okemo while Mount Snow is more of an outlier.


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## jaytrem (Dec 28, 2022)

I've been here about 50 years.  It's home and I do love it here.  I skied trees and bumps all day.  Lift lines are easily avoidable.  Shared a lunch table a Sundance with some nice strangers, just like yesterday.  Rode lifts with more friendly strangers.  Staff has been great.  Ran into a couple old friends.  Great day!


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## Sandman30 (Dec 28, 2022)

For anyone who has been there this week, what are early thoughts on conditions for Monday? Day tripping due to blackout dates. Looks like tough weather Saturday to Sunday, but maybe they can pull through?


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## jaytrem (Dec 28, 2022)

Sandman30 said:


> For anyone who has been there this week, what are early thoughts on conditions for Monday? Day tripping due to blackout dates. Looks like tough weather Saturday to Sunday, but maybe they can pull through?


Surfaces might be a little firm, hard to tell at this point.  Plenty of coverage though.  I suspect it will be a bit quieter that day.  Crowd's have been building all week.  Lines not bad at all except for Bluebird.  I don't get it, half of chairs had the bubble up today???  New Sunbrook chair so far seems to be able to handle all the skier coming down to it.  Did a number of runs on it during prime time today and it was basically ski on.  Not sure if it stayed that way all day though.


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## MidnightJester (Dec 29, 2022)

Mount Snow Opens Two New Chairlifts
					

Over the past couple of weeks, Mount Snow in Vermont has opened their two major Epic Lift Upgrades. The first grand opening was for the new Sundance Express on December 11th. The six-pack high-spee…




					unofficialnetworks.com


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## drjeff (Dec 29, 2022)

MidnightJester said:


> Mount Snow Opens Two New Chairlifts
> 
> 
> Over the past couple of weeks, Mount Snow in Vermont has opened their two major Epic Lift Upgrades. The first grand opening was for the new Sundance Express on December 11th. The six-pack high-spee…
> ...


I get a kick out the the Sunbrook Quad 1st chair through the banner photo as it's my wife and my very good friends boys who are the 2 on the chair closest to the base terminal concrete support pylon!


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## SLyardsale (Jan 2, 2023)

with holiday commitments, today was the 1st day I skied the two new lifts sundance & sunbrook in combo.  with both of them running, you can avoid the main base for an extended period.  you can lap sundance with ridge, hop, southbowl and with natural uncles and shoot out. you can lap all the options at sunbrook without the long slog back up or the one way route using bear trap.  your group can now easily split up - some can ski north face and then re-unite at the top of sunbrook.   one new lift at either location would have been nice.  both lifts in combination change the whole way you can ski the place.  having an option for a beer at sundance lodge is a nice addition too.


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## SLyardsale (Jan 6, 2023)

A glimmer of winter in the morning melted away in the afternoon. Still ugly here.  Could you sink your edge in? Yes.  That is the highlight.

Sundance exp


Sunbrook


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## ctdubl07 (Saturday at 8:23 AM)

Hiked up this morning at 6, slightly foggy, no wind, mid twenties and some decent groomed snow. Sadly some random turds popped up and ground in here and there. Looks like about 3 inches fell. Can't tell if they topped up overnight or not. Rode quickly down Inferno and looks like they killed the jumps to farm snow.


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## SLyardsale (Saturday at 6:37 PM)

1/7/2023. rotd was beartrap.


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## drjeff (Saturday at 10:31 PM)

ctdubl07 said:


> Hiked up this morning at 6, slightly foggy, no wind, mid twenties and some decent groomed snow. Sadly some random turds popped up and ground in here and there. Looks like about 3 inches fell. Can't tell if they topped up overnight or not. Rode quickly down Inferno and looks like they killed the jumps to farm snow.


Inferno hasn't been built up this season, and now won't be for the near future, if at all this season.

Jumps on Gulch were knocked down today, and are under a heavy fan gun assault for the foreseeable future to get it ready (if mother nature feels cooperative enough) to host the USASA Futures Tour freestyle/freeride comp in less than 2 weeks.

The sound of fan guns humming away for the 1st time since before Christmas is filling the air right now. Hopefully that will continue for multiple days!


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## ctdubl07 (Sunday at 8:27 AM)

ctdubl07 said:


> Hiked up this morning at 6, slightly foggy, no wind, mid twenties and some decent groomed snow. Sadly some random turds popped up and ground in here and there. Looks like about 3 inches fell. Can't tell if they topped up overnight or not. Rode quickly down Inferno and looks like they killed the jumps to farm snow.


I meant Nitro.....they killed some jumps/features to farm the snow.
Some primary blues have guns still blowing this morning.


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## SLyardsale (Sunday at 4:16 PM)

1/8/2023 rotd was beartrap

edit - no music still - Vail Sucks!

proof


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## Smellytele (Sunday at 5:12 PM)

SLyardsale said:


> 1/8/2023 rotd was beartrap
> 
> edit - no music still - Vail Sucks!
> 
> ...


What is that proof of? How homogenous Mt Snow is?


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## Newpylong (Sunday at 5:38 PM)

Broomfield doesn't give two sh*ts if there's music or not on a trail at Mount Snow, that's a local management issue. Not that it really matters, it's just a flat groomer like everything else now. If and when it fills in with nice soft bumps, then it's time to take issue with it. Bumps on Beartrap listening to Guns N Roses is a right of passage lol.


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## SLyardsale (Sunday at 5:38 PM)

Smellytele said:


> What is that proof of? How homogenous Mt Snow is?


yes, pretty much (currently)


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## ThatGuy (Sunday at 6:00 PM)

How much vert is Beartrap, ~300-500?
That lift’ll give your legs bruises if you don’t pay attention.


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## ctdubl07 (Monday at 1:18 PM)

ThatGuy said:


> That lift’ll give your legs bruises if you don’t pay attention.


Yeah and the off load for a boarder is no fun either

They had sculpted some bumps the weekend prior but clearly farmed them out this past week.
Even under Peaks music was inconsistent...I think there down to like 4 towers with speakers...what I wouldnt give for a little "Panama"


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## ThatGuy (Monday at 1:52 PM)

Half those speakers are blown anyway.
I always have an airpod in so no tower music is no issue.


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## GregoryIsaacs (Monday at 2:19 PM)

Bear trap is a sleeper spot for a powder day. I can recall doing ~15 consecutive  laps on it once after a foot of fresh. It felt like a personal powder playground with the ability to ski right onto the lift for as long as your legs could handle it. 

Also got caught on the lift during a blackout circa ~05... Love that spot!


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## drjeff (Monday at 4:51 PM)

ctdubl07 said:


> Yeah and the off load for a boarder is no fun either
> 
> They had sculpted some bumps the weekend prior but clearly farmed them out this past week.
> Even under Peaks music was inconsistent...I think there down to like 4 towers with speakers...what I wouldnt give for a little "Panama"



Don't think they farmed out the bumps the freestyle comp team sculpted in the week prior, as they flattened them after they finally froze up solid after a week of warm and wet and multiple days (hopefully) ahead of below freezing temps.  Atleast that's what one of the head bump coaches told me on Saturday. Lots of snow on Beartrap where the throw of the guns reached during the pre Christmas cold snap


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## urungus (Monday at 5:04 PM)

drjeff said:


> Don't think they farmed out the bumps the freestyle comp team sculpted in the week prior, as they flattened them after they finally froze up solid after a week of warm and wet and multiple days (hopefully) ahead of below freezing temps.  Atleast that's what one of the head bump coaches told me on Saturday. Lots of snow on Beartrap where the throw of the guns reached during the pre Christmas cold snap


@drjeff any idea why they seem to have stopped playing music on Beartrap ?


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## jaytrem (Monday at 5:44 PM)

drjeff said:


> Don't think they farmed out the bumps the freestyle comp team sculpted in the week prior, as they flattened them after they finally froze up solid after a week of warm and wet and multiple days (hopefully) ahead of below freezing temps.  Atleast that's what one of the head bump coaches told me on Saturday. Lots of snow on Beartrap where the throw of the guns reached during the pre Christmas cold snap


Those bumps lines were pretty nice, my kids and did our part to form them.  Shame they didn't last, but hopefully be back soon.  A touch more zippery would be nice.


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## SLyardsale (Monday at 6:19 PM)

1/9/2023 rotd was beartrap



I'm kidding of course.  They are trying to expand terrain for MLK weekend.  Not much else is the focus.  Carinthia has had more attention than most other places up to now.  Of all the pods, Carinthia has the most top (of Nitro Express) to bottom options in fools gold, nitro, mineshaft to prospector/inferno/longjohn.  More or less sucks all over.


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## Newpylong (Monday at 8:27 PM)

I can't remember any owner since ASC who covered that entire trail. They'd start on the far side and pull the equipment in. The only way to cover left of the lift now is to burn diesel and no one seems willing.


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## drjeff (Tuesday at 7:02 AM)

Newpylong said:


> I can't remember any owner since ASC who covered that entire trail. They'd start on the far side and pull the equipment in. The only way to cover left of the lift now is to burn diesel and no one seems willing.



If figured if they were ever going to do that again, and I wish they would, this might of been the year with the delayed (based on typical opening timeframe due to the construction finishing up on the Sunbrook Quad) it happened. 

Mother nature also hasn't helped with the warm temps she threw at them mid December. So when they got the temps, the time constraint "luxury" of a couple of extra days bringing in portable ground air/water guns and hoses to get a line of guns set up roughly at the lift towers likely wasn't there. And now that it's open for the season, guessing all subsequent snowmaking runs on it will be from the fixed towers along skiers/riders right


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## SLyardsale (Wednesday at 6:47 PM)

1/11/2023 rotd was skiing the whales on tin lizzy


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## ctdubl07 (Yesterday at 1:05 PM)

Gotta make sure those holiday wknd renters can get home!!


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## SLyardsale (Yesterday at 6:56 PM)

1/12/2023 nice morning followed by a quick frozen shit sandwich situation approx 12:30.  coming up, a new long weekend opportunity for posting slope side assault videos..
rotd was beartrap but my iphone4 was ice covered by the time i got over there.  plummet instead


----------

