Recent post on VFTT via pumpelly showed no snow but some ice but not treacherous to speople used to snow & ice. Pure summer hikers may find it unsettling, if for anything the fact that all this summer weather down low still does not equal summer on the hills.
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4K-itis
- Thread starter Stephen
- Start date
A couple years ago I did Monadnock on May 1 via the Pumpelly Trail. It was warm (nay, hot) on the ridges, but every time the trail dove into a spot of trees there was a foot of snow and ice. Wonderful moments of a/c. No special gear needed though the gaiters were appreciated.
Bad News for non-snow 4's
Good news, Morgan & Percival south of Whites are fun & virtually snow free
Bad news, It's going to be a while for 4K's based on Saturday Trip up Kinsmans. Snow on Lonesome Lake was significant (10-12inches) but easy well below the hut I'd guess around 2300 or 2400 feet
On Fishin Jimmy wet, snow & ie increasing the higher you get near Kinsman JCT I'd say close to 2 feet from area above view & across KRT, some trail markers were about hip or waist high. These usually are around eye level on the trees. Saturday's rain started as snow & went from sleet & freezing rain to rain, I would not be surprised if they get some snow at higher elevations this week either.
Unless things change a lot, I'd guess that you won't get up a 4K peak without snow until after Mother's Day. Whiteface might be first but doing loop over Rollins Trail will be snowbound longer.
Sorry folks,
don't kill the messenger, flaming I guess would be ok
Good news, Morgan & Percival south of Whites are fun & virtually snow free
Bad news, It's going to be a while for 4K's based on Saturday Trip up Kinsmans. Snow on Lonesome Lake was significant (10-12inches) but easy well below the hut I'd guess around 2300 or 2400 feet
On Fishin Jimmy wet, snow & ie increasing the higher you get near Kinsman JCT I'd say close to 2 feet from area above view & across KRT, some trail markers were about hip or waist high. These usually are around eye level on the trees. Saturday's rain started as snow & went from sleet & freezing rain to rain, I would not be surprised if they get some snow at higher elevations this week either.
Unless things change a lot, I'd guess that you won't get up a 4K peak without snow until after Mother's Day. Whiteface might be first but doing loop over Rollins Trail will be snowbound longer.
Sorry folks,
don't kill the messenger, flaming I guess would be ok
SilentCal
Well-known member
Looks like we may have some mucky trails for the Flags Weekend. Oh well....
zowi420
Well-known member
I am going to hike from the Flume in FNSP to the Willey house in Crawford notch, via the AT, next week, before the bugs get too bad. I was allowing two days, but everyone says three. It is about 29 miles? Has anyone done this recently?
MtnMagic
Well-known member
I not only haven't done your proposed route recently, I haven't it all. Please post your trip report after you've completed it. Looking forward to reading/doing it!
Piecing things together in my head (without the benefit of a White Mountain Guide at the moment), I would say you're looking at typically 6 hours of hiking from Galehead to Zealand alone. So if you're going to try to get from Garfield Ridge all the way to Crawford Notch, that'll be between 10 and 12 hours, in ideal conditions.
The Flume all the way to Garfield Ridge is also a considerably long way with even more ups and downs and of course a lot of exposure. The trail from Lafayette to Garfield Ridge (and on as far as Galehead) is very rough.
So while in theory an extremely strong, fit hiker packing very lightly could do it in two days in perfect conditions, I do not believe this is the time of year for it. You will not be able to pack lightly and there will be places where there is still a significant amount of snow on the ground (generally between 3000' and treeline right now). Plus, you won't be able to enjoy any of it; you'll have to keep moving, and fairly quickly.
Take the extra day. The problem is that there aren't places to stay to break this trip up nicely - the ideal stops are just after you start (Liberty Springs) and just before the end (Ethan Pond).
So my recommendation is this ... start late and just go as far as Liberty Springs campsite. Next morning enjoy the ridge on your way to Garfield Ridge. Then get an early start on the third day and go as far as you can. The trail is perfectly flat from Zealand all the way to Ethan Pond, so you can make good time. If darkness catches you, stop at Ethan Pond Shelter and it's a quick trip (couple hours?) out from there first thing in the morning.
The Flume all the way to Garfield Ridge is also a considerably long way with even more ups and downs and of course a lot of exposure. The trail from Lafayette to Garfield Ridge (and on as far as Galehead) is very rough.
So while in theory an extremely strong, fit hiker packing very lightly could do it in two days in perfect conditions, I do not believe this is the time of year for it. You will not be able to pack lightly and there will be places where there is still a significant amount of snow on the ground (generally between 3000' and treeline right now). Plus, you won't be able to enjoy any of it; you'll have to keep moving, and fairly quickly.
Take the extra day. The problem is that there aren't places to stay to break this trip up nicely - the ideal stops are just after you start (Liberty Springs) and just before the end (Ethan Pond).
So my recommendation is this ... start late and just go as far as Liberty Springs campsite. Next morning enjoy the ridge on your way to Garfield Ridge. Then get an early start on the third day and go as far as you can. The trail is perfectly flat from Zealand all the way to Ethan Pond, so you can make good time. If darkness catches you, stop at Ethan Pond Shelter and it's a quick trip (couple hours?) out from there first thing in the morning.
blacknblue
Well-known member
I agree with MichaelJ. It's feasible in two days if you want in the summertime, but with the snow conditions, it would be almost impossible right now. I would also suggest taking an evening to scoot up to Liberty Springs, then hitting the ridge the following morning; early mornings on Franc Ridge are phenomenal! From Lafayette to Galehead Hut is deceptively rugged--the trail maps won't do it justice as it's constant up and down over big, wet boulders (covered in snow right now). From Galehead, once you grunt up South Twin, it's fairly smooth sailing all the way to Crawford Notch, although, with fine views overlooking Zealand Notch and around Ethan Pond. Guyot Shelter, .7 miles from the AT is a great place to crash for the night, too, albeit adding 1.4 miles to your hike.
Let us know how it goes, whichever way you do it!
Let us know how it goes, whichever way you do it!
zowi420
Well-known member
It is going to rain here all weekend, all this warm rain will put a good dent in whatever snow is left in the woods. Looks like I'll shoot for May 6-8. I'm bringing my well-behaved dog, which makes huts and shelters out of the question! I just throw my tarp down well off the trail. I am a very light traveller. Thanx for all your responses!
Where is "here" that it is going to rain all weekend?
As of this Morning they received 19.4 inches of snow on Mt. Washington. Last Saturday afternoon across the street from your starting point, the woods were full of snow below Lonesome Lake Hut.
Will you be bringing crampons & snowshoes? I did 98% of your trip several years ago Memorial Day weekend. Are you going up Flume Slide or all white blaze? I would expect barring some very unseasonably warm weather you will find snow below Liberty Spring Campsite. Between Liberty Spring junction with F-Ridge & Little Haystack, that did not receive the travel that Liberty Spring or the higher Franconia's received, you will find significant snow here.
From Little Haystack to Skookumchuck Trail this will be the easiest part until you get near Zealand Hut, After that you descend on a section of the Garfield Ridge trail that saw very little winter use. (we were somewhat fortunate it was so cold when my friend & I did it the feet of snow we were on was solid) This ridge is also notorious for blowdowns. The trail should be well packed from the top of Garfield to Garfield campsite, then it's mor PUD's & lightly traveled trail until you get to Gale River trail.
Most snow on this trip will very likely be found on the Twinway bewteen South Twin & Guyot as this 2.2 miles of trail never drops below 4380 feet & most of it runs in fir trees which keep much of the sun off of it. After some bare rock on Guyot, you're back on another wooded ridge, this one will be a mix of snowy & muddy getting better as you descend Zealcliff. after that mud should be the order of teh day.
Doable in two nights? Probably if you make good time, can enjoy the views while you walk & start early. The first day you could make camp somewhere near Garfield as the couple of miles above treeline should have the best footing above 3,000 feet. The next day with an early start you could get near Zealand Falls. Day three is a mostly muddy walk out to 302.
Making the trip without snowshoes & crampons (or at least snowshoes with an aggressive cleat as some spots on Garfield Ridge will be steep & snow or ice covered) is taking more of a gamble then I would take. If you get cold weather so the snowpack is frozen, you'd be okay (except where it's icy) while warm days makes leaving extra clothing at home appealing but snowshoes more vital & black flies more likely.
You would have to be just about a machine to posthole the 1.7 wooded miles of F-Ridge, the miles of Garfield Ridge & a few Twinway miles in two nights. (if you are it still wouldn't be fun)
As of this Morning they received 19.4 inches of snow on Mt. Washington. Last Saturday afternoon across the street from your starting point, the woods were full of snow below Lonesome Lake Hut.
Will you be bringing crampons & snowshoes? I did 98% of your trip several years ago Memorial Day weekend. Are you going up Flume Slide or all white blaze? I would expect barring some very unseasonably warm weather you will find snow below Liberty Spring Campsite. Between Liberty Spring junction with F-Ridge & Little Haystack, that did not receive the travel that Liberty Spring or the higher Franconia's received, you will find significant snow here.
From Little Haystack to Skookumchuck Trail this will be the easiest part until you get near Zealand Hut, After that you descend on a section of the Garfield Ridge trail that saw very little winter use. (we were somewhat fortunate it was so cold when my friend & I did it the feet of snow we were on was solid) This ridge is also notorious for blowdowns. The trail should be well packed from the top of Garfield to Garfield campsite, then it's mor PUD's & lightly traveled trail until you get to Gale River trail.
Most snow on this trip will very likely be found on the Twinway bewteen South Twin & Guyot as this 2.2 miles of trail never drops below 4380 feet & most of it runs in fir trees which keep much of the sun off of it. After some bare rock on Guyot, you're back on another wooded ridge, this one will be a mix of snowy & muddy getting better as you descend Zealcliff. after that mud should be the order of teh day.
Doable in two nights? Probably if you make good time, can enjoy the views while you walk & start early. The first day you could make camp somewhere near Garfield as the couple of miles above treeline should have the best footing above 3,000 feet. The next day with an early start you could get near Zealand Falls. Day three is a mostly muddy walk out to 302.
Making the trip without snowshoes & crampons (or at least snowshoes with an aggressive cleat as some spots on Garfield Ridge will be steep & snow or ice covered) is taking more of a gamble then I would take. If you get cold weather so the snowpack is frozen, you'd be okay (except where it's icy) while warm days makes leaving extra clothing at home appealing but snowshoes more vital & black flies more likely.
You would have to be just about a machine to posthole the 1.7 wooded miles of F-Ridge, the miles of Garfield Ridge & a few Twinway miles in two nights. (if you are it still wouldn't be fun)
MARI
Active member
4 K -itis
Hey, I too have been bitten by the 4K bug, and I want to get out this weekend. Magic, do you need crampons or snow shoes to get up Tuckermans this time of year? Maybe I'll do some warming up on the southern hills like Cardigan or Welch and Dickey... Tomorrow is a day off, what should I do? Monadnock? Has anyone been over to Chocurua? :-?
Hey, I too have been bitten by the 4K bug, and I want to get out this weekend. Magic, do you need crampons or snow shoes to get up Tuckermans this time of year? Maybe I'll do some warming up on the southern hills like Cardigan or Welch and Dickey... Tomorrow is a day off, what should I do? Monadnock? Has anyone been over to Chocurua? :-?
MtnMagic
Well-known member
Hi!
Between the cat being driven up and the rain/snow, it would be wise to bring a traction device, be it snowshoes or crampons, just in case. Usually it is bare bootable this time of year. Tucks should be spectacular to visit this weekend. Enjoy the show!
Between the cat being driven up and the rain/snow, it would be wise to bring a traction device, be it snowshoes or crampons, just in case. Usually it is bare bootable this time of year. Tucks should be spectacular to visit this weekend. Enjoy the show!
If I hadn't hurt my back a few days ago I'd be out there this weekend, too.
Here's hoping it's better quickly. Two weekends from now I have a 50 mile bike ride (you know you want to sponsor me with a donation to the Brain Tumor Society!) and then the hiking season starts in earnest. 8)
Here's hoping it's better quickly. Two weekends from now I have a 50 mile bike ride (you know you want to sponsor me with a donation to the Brain Tumor Society!) and then the hiking season starts in earnest. 8)
MtnMagic
Well-known member
It snowed up to 7" in the higher elevations last night. The Presis and Franconia Ridge have that beautiful brilliant white look against the blue sky!
Don't be fooled by rain and 60* temperatures. There is certainly a lot of winter weather left in the mountains with snow depths up to 3' and not just in Tuckerman's Ravine.
Don't be fooled by rain and 60* temperatures. There is certainly a lot of winter weather left in the mountains with snow depths up to 3' and not just in Tuckerman's Ravine.
Waaah!!! I hate having a hurt back!
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